2elijah said:

Timmy84 said:

Right. I still don't even think of his muses whenever I hear songs that were "inspired" by them because the listener can always attribute Prince's love songs to their own romances. That's the beauty of music.

True, as when you're listening to one of his love ballads, I would think most may relate the lyrics to a previous or current relationship. I'm sure most songs are 'inspired' by something or someone.

That's true with most musical artists anyway. Bobby Womack, Smokey Robinson, Stevie, Marvin, Todd Rundgren, Mary J. Blige, Madonna, Janet Jackson, Eric Clapton, etc., have all done it too.

Timmy84 said:

2elijah said:

I was reading yours and OF4s posts on this topic, and wasn't sure if you two were seeing eye to eye. I know Of4s is a Prince historian, by the threads he's created in the past/currently in this forum.. so Timmy I figured you just didn't have a dog in this fight against his knowledge of Prince's music career including the former associate band members, but it's okay, Timmy.. I still think you're cool though.

[Edited 1/17/12 11:30am]

Nah it ain't like I got anything against OF4S. I just think sometimes he does give too much credit to people Prince worked with. Don't get me wrong, they added their contributions in helping him out but at the end it's his product, yanno? Also judging from your own posts, most didn't sound like you were "playing" with him.

I really don't know what you're talking about

I don't know how you're judging how much credit I'm giving to someone seriously

And please do tell me where this is all happening where I'm doing this.

Just because I might be talking about people Prince brought into his life to gleam from doesn't mean I'm giving too much credit to anyone.

I for one have never said that Prince wouldn't be anything if it wasn't for 1 2 3 4

I don't know anything about your life and where you've been on your life journey

But I do understand good and bad influence from people. Being social creatures, the creative process can decrease or increase according to who we gleam from. Inspirations whether it's from someone elses career, things we read or believe are a big part of that too.

I can also say I believe there were people who brought an element and influence into Prince life that didn't help his career or image

Timmy84 said:

2elijah said:

I was reading yours and OF4s posts on this topic, and wasn't sure if you two were seeing eye to eye. I know Of4s is a Prince historian, by the threads he's created in the past/currently in this forum.. so Timmy I figured you just didn't have a dog in this fight against his knowledge of Prince's music career including the former associate band members, but it's okay, Timmy.. I still think you're cool though.

[Edited 1/17/12 11:30am]

Nah it ain't like I got anything against OF4S. I just think sometimes he does give too much credit to people Prince worked with. Don't get me wrong, they added their contributions in helping him out but at the end it's his product, yanno? Also judging from your own posts, most didn't sound like you were "playing" with him.

@ bolded part. Ok Timmy you got me back. I think from threads in the past from many orgers, not saying OF4s is doing that, but I find that some Prince fans, do give W&L way too much credit for Prince's music career, as though, they were the main reason he became a famous musician. I credit his music skills/talent as a performer, his role in the movie Purple Rain, and his continued motivation to perform live and releasing new music over the years, as the reason for his success as a musician. I'm not saying there weren't band members who weren't part of his music career and that their contributions are being dismissed, but in order for him to be successful he had to be the one to have that motivation and perseverance in the first place to make it happen, and continue for so long.

He could have given up after years ago, and stopped his career during the Purple Rain era, but he didn't. He stayed focused on his music, changed band members, made some personal changes in his own life spiritually, took risks with his music, and basically made it known through his music, and change of band members, various styles of music, that he was not going to be 'pigeon-holed' into one form of music or labeled as one-type of musician, based on his music output over the years, and quite frankly...he's always pretty much made that clear, just by the music he presents to fans. I think it's many fans trying to 'lock' him into one box and era, and depending on him to fill a personal void they can't seem to fill themselves.

[Edited 1/17/12 12:12pm]

2elijah said:

Timmy84 said:

Nah it ain't like I got anything against OF4S. I just think sometimes he does give too much credit to people Prince worked with. Don't get me wrong, they added their contributions in helping him out but at the end it's his product, yanno? Also judging from your own posts, most didn't sound like you were "playing" with him.

@ bolded part. Ok Timmy you got me back. I think from threads in the past from many orgers, not saying OF4s is doing that, but I find that some Prince fans, do give W&L way too much credit for Prince's music career, as though, they were the main reason he became a famous musician. I credit his music skills/talent as a performer, his role in the movie Purple Rain, and his continued motivation to perform live and releasing new music over the years, as the reason for his success as a musician. I'm not saying there weren't band members who weren't part of his music career and that their contributions are being dismissed, but in order for him to be successful he had to be the one to have that motivation and perseverance in the first place to make it happen, and continue for so long.

He could have given up after years ago, and stopped his career during the Purple Rain era, but he didn't. He stayed focused on his music, changed band members, made some personal changes in his own life spiritually, took risks with his music, and basically made it known through his music, and change of band members, various styles of music, that he was not going to be 'pigeon-holed' into one form of music or labeled as one-type of musician, based on his music output over the years, and quite frankly...he's always pretty much made that clear, just by the music he presents to fans. I think it's many fans trying to 'lock' him into one box and era, and depending on him to fill a personal void they can't seem to fill themselves.

[Edited 1/17/12 12:12pm]

Yeah it's just evolution to me. I admire the fact he never stayed with one thing for so long. Back then, I can probably expect people to get turned off by his changes. By the time I knew who he was, he was already transitioning away from the Revolution or just about to (the Parade era). And yes it's really all Prince at the end of the day. Not taking anything away from people who were part of his bands especially those in the "Rebels" and The Revolution but I compare it to what Eric Clapton, Todd Rundgren and Trent Reznor went through. The Purple Rain era is the one era where folks have tried to figure out "what would happen if..." and I think fate had dealt its cards right but it shouldn't be the only era to define how Prince became successful since judging from his pre-PR eras, he was on his way up anyways.

OldFriends4Sale said:

ladygirl99 said:

Whatever they called it, lol, but the point is Susannah being engaged with Prince and he wrote songs about her is not unique influence, she was a list of women who he wrote songs about very original (in my sarcastic voice) .

I think her relationship at the time with Prince was unique, the same way Maytes was.

She was the only one in that time period who he moved into her house, so any of the other knew she was a 'main squeeze' as far as that goes. She decorated his home and underemphasizing her role in his life doesn't need to be done to prove your point that Prince is the center ring leader of everything that happened career wise.

Like I said if you choose to make Susannah contribution bigger than what they are, its to each of their own. I personally think other than being medicore background singer and average songwriter and lets add who actually decorated Prince's house, all which is nice but not the wow factor as far as music and singing skills, why is she factor again? LOL.

OldFriends4Sale said:

ladygirl99 said:

lol I really could care less about what went down between Prince and Susannah but all I am saying with the Wendy/Melvoin and Coleman connection some fans exaggerated Susannah contributions that thats my opinion. Susannah was not the only woman he made songs even at the time they were dating, he also wrote songs for his jumpoffs as was reported who he dated while seeing Susannah. And also Susannah is average at best she didnt bring a whole lot of other than writing a few lyrical songs and singing background. She doesnt impressed me music wise or has a wow fact like her sister and Lisa or Jill Jones. To me Sheila E is a badass bitch and also played a more vital role in his life than even Susannah from my observations. She was engaged to him as well and co lead several his songs and performed and collaborate with him. Not only Sheila and Prince were connected before Susannah came to the picture but continues to work with long after he and Susannah broke up even into the 2010s but some fans still insist Susannah is the love of his life but yet snubbed or ignore Sheila E importance who is very greater than Susannah. But if fans want to make like Susannah was the love of his life and overstated her contributions to each of their own.

You're blowing this up, I've never read a bunch of stuff from fans exaggerating Susannahs contributions. What contributions are you talking about?

Susannah was the one he made a lot of songs mostly about durin that time, Don't underempasize her place in Prince life at the time either

What made her average? She doesn't have to impress you. I know people who say the same about Sade's voice doesn't mean Sade is average

I don't think Sheila is a bitch, but she is badder than the wicked witch

Sheila E was a protege so from the outside it would seem she played a vital role. We are dealing wth 2 different types of influences. Morris Day played a vital role as well.

Sheila E was never engaged to Prince. And Sheila E didn't start working with Prince until the PR era same time Susannah came into Prince's life.

I've never said she was the love of his life, and honestly I've never ready anyone say that either, your making that up. And I've never read anyone snub or ignore Sheila E's importance in Prince's life. I personally have made thread based on the Prince/Sheila E connection and enjoy reading other's thread that have beenmade. Your exaggerating a lot of what you've said sorry. Way to much generalizing

First of all are you on her payroll or something? Why you are riding Susannah so hard lol she prolly doesnt even know you exist. That is kinda creepy. Susannah is a big girl she doesnt need fans ride on her LOL. I don't care if she impress me or not since I am not a big fdeluxe fan nor Susannah fan, as a musician she continues to pursue for a living her job is to indeed impress her fans who are the ones why buying Fdeluxe concert tickets and songs. But with the impress part, I stated my opinion, either take it or leave it. Its all about taste. I don't dislike Susannah. She was even nice enough to direct me to fdeluxe facebook fan when I was try to get on her official facebook just to show my support with Gaslight album, well at the time it didnt have a title. That was 3 years ago not sure if she now accepting fans on her facebook page again.

Second of all Sheila was not just Prince's protege. It was reported Prince and Andre even were fighting in a jokingly way for which one who want to married Sheila. He almost wifed her and Sheila E even confirmed this herself. So who I am going to believe you who is just a fan and never had connections with Prince or Sheila who met Prince even before I was born and still is part of his life? No rocket science answer on this one. Sheila and Prince had stay in touch over the years before they worked together in 1984. And also Prince is the reason why Sheila E decided to go solo as she prefers to do background music work. Just please stick to know your expertise with Melvoins and Colemans okay? When I said Sheila is a badass bitch that is out of endearment.

I am not making this up on the fans. How can you determined my experience that you dont even know me? But I can let you know briefly I had been on org since 1996 (even though using the same user name for ladygirl99 for last several years) back in purple and black days likely longer than you and I was on Housequake (I even talked to Lisa Coleman on there and yes she did post on Housequake and I talked to Wendy back in the late 90s through email briefly about my appreciated of how she/Lisa score Soul Food and that Master P flick) so I know what I am talking about when fans said over the years Susannah was the love of his life, that all the love, thats their opinion, eh, but thats not a fact, if you for being a moderator, not sure how long Ben keep past posts archieved, then the org search button is available. Just because I dont kiss W&L, Susannah, and Prince and others blindly doesn't like everything they produce it doesnt make me less of a fan of theirs. I am not a fanbot thank you!

Timmy84 said:

2elijah said:

@ bolded part. Ok Timmy you got me back. I think from threads in the past from many orgers, not saying OF4s is doing that, but I find that some Prince fans, do give W&L way too much credit for Prince's music career, as though, they were the main reason he became a famous musician. I credit his music skills/talent as a performer, his role in the movie Purple Rain, and his continued motivation to perform live and releasing new music over the years, as the reason for his success as a musician. I'm not saying there weren't band members who weren't part of his music career and that their contributions are being dismissed, but in order for him to be successful he had to be the one to have that motivation and perseverance in the first place to make it happen, and continue for so long.

He could have given up after years ago, and stopped his career during the Purple Rain era, but he didn't. He stayed focused on his music, changed band members, made some personal changes in his own life spiritually, took risks with his music, and basically made it known through his music, and change of band members, various styles of music, that he was not going to be 'pigeon-holed' into one form of music or labeled as one-type of musician, based on his music output over the years, and quite frankly...he's always pretty much made that clear, just by the music he presents to fans. I think it's many fans trying to 'lock' him into one box and era, and depending on him to fill a personal void they can't seem to fill themselves.

[Edited 1/17/12 12:12pm]

Yeah it's just evolution to me. I admire the fact he never stayed with one thing for so long. Back then, I can probably expect people to get turned off by his changes. By the time I knew who he was, he was already transitioning away from the Revolution or just about to (the Parade era). And yes it's really all Prince at the end of the day. Not taking anything away from people who were part of his bands especially those in the "Rebels" and The Revolution but I compare it to what Eric Clapton, Todd Rundgren and Trent Reznor went through. The Purple Rain era is the one era where folks have tried to figure out "what would happen if..." and I think fate had dealt its cards right but it shouldn't be the only era to define how Prince became successful since judging from his pre-PR eras, he was on his way up anyways.

Absolutely agree with you on the bolded part. I think most of the fingers can be pointed at the "Purple Rain' movie. Especially seeing it was his first movie, When new fans see it today, it's not unusual they would remember the names of the musicians in his band who were in that movie, and the interactions between W&L's characters in that movie. I believe that is why some fans have this idea or belief that W&L and those band members in the PR movie, and post-PR movie, were somehow to be his permanent and only deserving members of his band, which apparently was not Prince's plan, as he chose to move on with his music career.

I don't believe that nonsense, that he needs W&L's inspiration to survive as a musician, especially when he was surviving without them before they joined his band, and is after without them. Not to mention the fact that he had so many well-known, established and famous musicians/artists to draw inspiration and influence from. If anything, at the end of the day, W&L's association with Prince in the past, as his former bandmembers, helped their careers as musicians, and I'm quite sure they are aware and appreciative of that, but they're still not Prince and their names do not define who he is as a musician.

(Hey Timmy...I'll be back later to check out this thread...time for a popcorn break. Behave until I return.....mm'kay bro? )

[Edited 1/17/12 13:58pm]

can't believe this shit is 6 pages long, lol

JoeTyler said:

can't believe this shit is 6 pages long, lol

I can this is coming from someone who had seen this same merry go around shit since 1996 with these type of debates.

ladygirl99 said:

JoeTyler said:

can't believe this shit is 6 pages long, lol

I can this is coming from someone who had seen this same merry go around shit since 1996 with these type of debates.

since 1996 ???

rdhull said:

..did you know that Prince was once onstage with Michael Jackson and James Brown?

doesnt get it .. is this a sarcastic joke u said this to me too

ladygirl99 said:

JoeTyler said:

can't believe this shit is 6 pages long, lol

I can this is coming from someone who had seen this same merry go around shit since 1996 with these type of debates.

lol and it still sucked you right in didn't it

I too said I wasn't going to get into it, and it just sucks u right in

JoeTyler said:

ladygirl99 said:

I can this is coming from someone who had seen this same merry go around shit since 1996 with these type of debates.

since 1996 ???

I think that I should flipped that 6 into 9 as Prince org became public around 1999 so that is when i joined and yes even then people were debating Prince vs Wendy and Lisa and his music suck without them, and Susannah was his true love. And also alt.prince google group this around time after Wendy claimed she and Lisa wrote Purple Rain aand later slightly backtrack in future interviews after Prince jabbed them off his defunct website. And on alt.prince music google groups went some warzone for nearly a month, after W&L made that claimed, lol, it was better than a soap opera, ya know Prince vs W&L fans went at it hard, thought it was going to be real WW3, I think it still have some older posts perserved not sure.

Yeah nothing havent change since Prince org use to be black and purple days when it comes to these debates. That was sort of my point

ladygirl99 said:

JoeTyler said:

since 1996 ???

I think that I should flipped that 6 into 9 as Prince org became public around 1999 so that is when i joined and yes even then people were debating Prince vs Wendy and Lisa and his music suck without them, and Susannah was his true love. And also alt.prince google group this around time after Wendy claimed she and Lisa wrote Purple Rain aand later slightly backtrack in future interviews after Prince jabbed them off his defunct website. And on alt.prince music google groups went some warzone for nearly a month, after W&L made that claimed, lol, it was better than a soap opera, ya know Prince vs W&L fans went at it hard, thought it was going to be real WW3, I think it still have some older posts perserved not sure.

Yeah nothing havent change since Prince org use to be black and purple days when it comes to these debates. That was sort of my point

I think Prince is like Sly Stone in that he realized having a MIXED band of black/white/boy/girl would be key to his crossover appeal.That's why he always kept white girls in his band.

The same thing applied to the Jimi Hendrix Experience and Lenny Kravitz.

The 80's all black group Living Color faded fast because audience's don't generally accept all black ROCK bands.

Prince being of mixed race also helped his popularity.

Record companies know that Black artist that don't really look "BLACK" will have more crossover appeal.

Just look at Mariah,Beyonce,Leona Lewis and Rhianna.

It's also true that WHITE artist that sing "BLACK" music will be more succesful.

Just look at Elvis and Justin Bieber.

I hate to bring "race" into this discussion but it has a lot to do with why some bands are successful and other's aren't.

alexandernevamind said:

Yes Prince is talented but come on, we all know he couldn't have written the music to Purple Rain without Wendy and Lisa and a cast of other people.

Only bad thing for them is that he refuses to give anybody else credit but himself and most of them couldn't afford to sue him afterwards.("Kiss" was written by a group called Mazarati).

A lot of people in the music business use their starpower to get people to work for them for little or nothing.These people are usually new to the business and are just really excited to be working with the star.

Pretty soon though, reality kicks in and they realize they've been used.When they start asking for what's owed them, they usually get fired.

Prince is at the age where he could really make some great music by collabing with other artist.I would love to hear him on a record with Santana, Herbie Hancock,Stevie,Alicia Keys,Estelle,Miguel,

Adele,Beyonce,Neyo,Chris Brown.I'd actually start buying his music again.

He might get on stage with these artist but why can't he make a record with them? Is it a money issue? Is he afraid of being upstaged? Why has his music sucked in the last 10 years?

I love Prince but I think it's time somebody called him out on this.

Google Gabi Wilson, she's the future of music.

...Bullshittttt.

He was already doing really good work for a newbie - on his own - in his first few albums - long before either Lisa or Wendy or any of the other people he collaborated with, came along.

And I'm not saying this to slag off Lisa and Wendy. In fact I've always kinda adored Wendy and found her slightly dazzling, but the truth is, Prince had talent, period and was doing good work on his own before, during, and after.

jon1967 said:

rdhull said:

..did you know that Prince was once onstage with Michael Jackson and James Brown?

doesnt get it .. is this a sarcastic joke u said this to me too

Yes, it's a joke.

so

alexandernevamind said:

ladygirl99 said:

I think that I should flipped that 6 into 9 as Prince org became public around 1999 so that is when i joined and yes even then people were debating Prince vs Wendy and Lisa and his music suck without them, and Susannah was his true love. And also alt.prince google group this around time after Wendy claimed she and Lisa wrote Purple Rain aand later slightly backtrack in future interviews after Prince jabbed them off his defunct website. And on alt.prince music google groups went some warzone for nearly a month, after W&L made that claimed, lol, it was better than a soap opera, ya know Prince vs W&L fans went at it hard, thought it was going to be real WW3, I think it still have some older posts perserved not sure.

Yeah nothing havent change since Prince org use to be black and purple days when it comes to these debates. That was sort of my point

I think Prince is like Sly Stone in that he realized having a MIXED band of black/white/boy/girl would be key to his crossover appeal.That's why he always kept white girls in his band.

The same thing applied to the Jimi Hendrix Experience and Lenny Kravitz.

The 80's all black group Living Color faded fast because audience's don't generally accept all black ROCK bands.

Prince being of mixed race also helped his popularity.

Record companies know that Black artist that don't really look "BLACK" will have more crossover appeal.

Just look at Mariah,Beyonce,Leona Lewis and Rhianna.

It's also true that WHITE artist that sing "BLACK" music will be more succesful.

Just look at Elvis and Justin Bieber.

I hate to bring "race" into this discussion but it has a lot to do with why some bands are successful and other's aren't.

Oh course race has a lot to do with it. Their being white was a HUGE reason for their popularity! White sells - simply because there are more white people buying and its what they can relate to. If W&L were black, PR may have just been dubbed a "black film" with reasonable but not mega success and their contributions to his music gone largely unnoticed.

"cufflinks like these cost money...if we can't be nothin' else, we may as well be frank."

Dren5 said:

alexandernevamind said:

Yes Prince is talented but come on, we all know he couldn't have written the music to Purple Rain without Wendy and Lisa and a cast of other people.

Only bad thing for them is that he refuses to give anybody else credit but himself and most of them couldn't afford to sue him afterwards.("Kiss" was written by a group called Mazarati).

A lot of people in the music business use their starpower to get people to work for them for little or nothing.These people are usually new to the business and are just really excited to be working with the star.

Pretty soon though, reality kicks in and they realize they've been used.When they start asking for what's owed them, they usually get fired.

Prince is at the age where he could really make some great music by collabing with other artist.I would love to hear him on a record with Santana, Herbie Hancock,Stevie,Alicia Keys,Estelle,Miguel,

Adele,Beyonce,Neyo,Chris Brown.I'd actually start buying his music again.

He might get on stage with these artist but why can't he make a record with them? Is it a money issue? Is he afraid of being upstaged? Why has his music sucked in the last 10 years?

I love Prince but I think it's time somebody called him out on this.

Google Gabi Wilson, she's the future of music.

...Bullshittttt.

He was already doing really good work for a newbie - on his own - in his first few albums - long before either Lisa or Wendy or any of the other people he collaborated with, came along.

And I'm not saying this to slag off Lisa and Wendy. In fact I've always kinda adored Wendy and found her slightly dazzling, but the truth is, Prince had talent, period and was doing good work on his own before, during, and after.

It's true, the 1st 2 albums and alot of the unreleased 1976-77 recordings are some of my favs

But it wasn't until he started pulling from Dez Dr Fink Andr etc the Rebels project and that kind of experimentation with all his band members that he opened into other musical expression with Dirty Mind going into New Wave and Dez being a hard rocker pushing Prince to amp up the ax in the live shows that Prince opened more. Lisa also replacing Gayle, and from my understand Lisa was 'nasty' lol and her reletionship with Prince and her musical background just turned things up.

What would the 3rd studio album be like if he didn't open to the Rebels music and just stayed inthe studio and jam session by himself...

OldFriends4Sale said:

Dren5 said:

...Bullshittttt.

He was already doing really good work for a newbie - on his own - in his first few albums - long before either Lisa or Wendy or any of the other people he collaborated with, came along.

And I'm not saying this to slag off Lisa and Wendy. In fact I've always kinda adored Wendy and found her slightly dazzling, but the truth is, Prince had talent, period and was doing good work on his own before, during, and after.

It's true, the 1st 2 albums and alot of the unreleased 1976-77 recordings are some of my favs

But it wasn't until he started pulling from Dez Dr Fink Andr etc the Rebels project and that kind of experimentation with all his band members that he opened into other musical expression with Dirty Mind going into New Wave and Dez being a hard rocker pushing Prince to amp up the ax in the live shows that Prince opened more. Lisa also replacing Gayle, and from my understand Lisa was 'nasty' lol and her reletionship with Prince and her musical background just turned things up.

What would the 3rd studio album be like if he didn't open to the Rebels music and just stayed inthe studio and jam session by himself...

...What makes you assume that if he never met any of them, he'd have just stagnated?

alexandernevamind said:

ladygirl99 said:

I think that I should flipped that 6 into 9 as Prince org became public around 1999 so that is when i joined and yes even then people were debating Prince vs Wendy and Lisa and his music suck without them, and Susannah was his true love. And also alt.prince google group this around time after Wendy claimed she and Lisa wrote Purple Rain aand later slightly backtrack in future interviews after Prince jabbed them off his defunct website. And on alt.prince music google groups went some warzone for nearly a month, after W&L made that claimed, lol, it was better than a soap opera, ya know Prince vs W&L fans went at it hard, thought it was going to be real WW3, I think it still have some older posts perserved not sure.

Yeah nothing havent change since Prince org use to be black and purple days when it comes to these debates. That was sort of my point

I think Prince is like Sly Stone in that he realized having a MIXED band of black/white/boy/girl would be key to his crossover appeal.That's why he always kept white girls in his band.

The same thing applied to the Jimi Hendrix Experience and Lenny Kravitz.

The 80's all black group Living Color faded fast because audience's don't generally accept all black ROCK bands.

Prince being of mixed race also helped his popularity.

Record companies know that Black artist that don't really look "BLACK" will have more crossover appeal.

Just look at Mariah,Beyonce,Leona Lewis and Rhianna.

It's also true that WHITE artist that sing "BLACK" music will be more succesful.

Just look at Elvis and Justin Bieber.

I hate to bring "race" into this discussion but it has a lot to do with why some bands are successful and other's aren't.

Prince is not of 'mixed race though. He can of course 'pass' for mixed race or several ethnicities, as many other actors/musicians/artists of color. Both Prince's parents were Black. The producers/directors of "Purple Rain" I'm sure were quite aware who and what his parents were, , but it seems their main interest was to draw in a 'crossover/mixed' audience, by having the actors who played Prince' parents in the movie, to portray a 'mixed couple'. Same reason I believe W&L were given more of a role, than the other band members in the movie, to make their characters somehow 'relevant' to the audience the movie producers/directors wanted to give a reason attract to the movie, although Prince was the 'main' character and star of the movie.

It was 'simply' a way of drawing a larger audience, and for Prince it was an advantage to draw in in a 'wider, mixed fan base'. He was smart, why cater to only one demographic, when you can be bigger and draw in fans from many demographics. He was never a musician who limited his capabilities or his fan base. Rock music was introduced by many, Black musicians in the early 20s/30s/40s/50s, who played blues rock/rockabilly, gospel rock, etc., until many black musicians in the 60s/70s gravitated towards R&B and Funk, whereas, more White musicians/artists played rock heavily in the 60s/70s.

This is why during the 60s, Jimi Hendrix's name stood out, because most black musicians/artists gravitated to R&B/funk at that time, and Jimi went 'rock'. From what I understand he did play with James Brown early in his career, before he focused more on the 'rock' style. You can easily hear a lot of blues rock influence from earlier, Black musicians in Jimi's music/guitar playing. It was almost like Black musicians abandoned the early rock styles of their predecessors, like Chuck Berry and moved on to various genres of music. Prior to that, I heard Jimi played in James Brown's earlier bands. Prince was smart to take this to his advantage as well, during the mid to late 70s, but he was not just doing one form of music, he was doing various styles, which is why it was hard for the industry to pigeon-hole him into one category, even if it was Black radio stations who were pretty much first, to play his music from his early albums.

Today, it's easier for musicians/performers to crossover, and they don't even have to change their style of music to do it. Music has basically crossed over on its own. Berry Gordy did the same with motown groups, i.e, Diana Ross, The Tempations back in the day. Once Berry was able to get this groups to obtaina major, African-American fan base, they branched out to a crossover audience. It was all about making money. This is nothing new today, whether one is light or dark skin. If the people like the sound of your music, they will buy it.

[Edited 1/18/12 7:45am]

OldFriends4Sale said:

angel345 said:

Do you recall Sheila E.'s song and video "Sister Fate"? It was based on that rumor. I remembered it, back in the day I also recall her saying in one of her interviews that Prince at one time asked her to marry him, but she turned him down

I think the whole 'marry me' thing wasn't serious it was sorta right after they meet.

He and Andre had some kind of man bet on who could get her to date them first or something like that.

I also read some things about how Prince(obviously) wasn't serious about Sheila E that way and there was something I read about it being because she wasn't as 'pretty' or something

the Belle of St Mark

Sister Fate

One Day I"m Gonna Make U Mine

are 3 about her relationship with Prince

It would have been cool and helpful if Sheila had an appearance in Purple Rain

She sounded serious, and she turned him down because she wasn't ready for marriage, according to her.

ladygirl99 said:

OldFriends4Sale said:

You're blowing this up, I've never read a bunch of stuff from fans exaggerating Susannahs contributions. What contributions are you talking about?

Susannah was the one he made a lot of songs mostly about durin that time, Don't underempasize her place in Prince life at the time either

What made her average? She doesn't have to impress you. I know people who say the same about Sade's voice doesn't mean Sade is average

I don't think Sheila is a bitch, but she is badder than the wicked witch

Sheila E was a protege so from the outside it would seem she played a vital role. We are dealing wth 2 different types of influences. Morris Day played a vital role as well.

Sheila E was never engaged to Prince. And Sheila E didn't start working with Prince until the PR era same time Susannah came into Prince's life.

I've never said she was the love of his life, and honestly I've never ready anyone say that either, your making that up. And I've never read anyone snub or ignore Sheila E's importance in Prince's life. I personally have made thread based on the Prince/Sheila E connection and enjoy reading other's thread that have beenmade. Your exaggerating a lot of what you've said sorry. Way to much generalizing

First of all are you on her payroll or something? Why you are riding Susannah so hard lol she prolly doesnt even know you exist. That is kinda creepy. Susannah is a big girl she doesnt need fans ride on her LOL. I don't care if she impress me or not since I am not a big fdeluxe fan nor Susannah fan, as a musician she continues to pursue for a living her job is to indeed impress her fans who are the ones why buying Fdeluxe concert tickets and songs. But with the impress part, I stated my opinion, either take it or leave it. Its all about taste. I don't dislike Susannah. She was even nice enough to direct me to fdeluxe facebook fan when I was try to get on her official facebook just to show my support with Gaslight album, well at the time it didnt have a title. That was 3 years ago not sure if she now accepting fans on her facebook page again.

Second of all Sheila was not just Prince's protege. It was reported Prince and Andre even were fighting in a jokingly way for which one who want to married Sheila. He almost wifed her and Sheila E even confirmed this herself. So who I am going to believe you who is just a fan and never had connections with Prince or Sheila who met Prince even before I was born and still is part of his life? No rocket science answer on this one. Sheila and Prince had stay in touch over the years before they worked together in 1984. And also Prince is the reason why Sheila E decided to go solo as she prefers to do background music work. Just please stick to know your expertise with Melvoins and Colemans okay? When I said Sheila is a badass bitch that is out of endearment.

I am not making this up on the fans. How can you determined my experience that you dont even know me? But I can let you know briefly I had been on org since 1996 (even though using the same user name for ladygirl99 for last several years) back in purple and black days likely longer than you and I was on Housequake (I even talked to Lisa Coleman on there and yes she did post on Housequake and I talked to Wendy back in the late 90s through email briefly about my appreciated of how she/Lisa score Soul Food and that Master P flick) so I know what I am talking about when fans said over the years Susannah was the love of his life, that all the love, thats their opinion, eh, but thats not a fact, if you for being a moderator, not sure how long Ben keep past posts archieved, then the org search button is available. Just because I dont kiss W&L, Susannah, and Prince and others blindly doesn't like everything they produce it doesnt make me less of a fan of theirs. I am not a fanbot thank you!

She sure did and I always thought that Shiela E and Vanity were the two baddest chicks in the game.

ladygirl99 said:

JoeTyler said:

since 1996 ???

I think that I should flipped that 6 into 9 as Prince org became public around 1999 so that is when i joined and yes even then people were debating Prince vs Wendy and Lisa and his music suck without them, and Susannah was his true love. And also alt.prince google group this around time after Wendy claimed she and Lisa wrote Purple Rain aand later slightly backtrack in future interviews after Prince jabbed them off his defunct website. And on alt.prince music google groups went some warzone for nearly a month, after W&L made that claimed, lol, it was better than a soap opera, ya know Prince vs W&L fans went at it hard, thought it was going to be real WW3, I think it still have some older posts perserved not sure.

Yeah nothing havent change since Prince org use to be black and purple days when it comes to these debates. That was sort of my point

Agree, you will always see these type of threads pop up. I think you, me, Timmy and OF4s, although some, slight disagreements on the topic, pretty much still kept it together yesterday.

[Edited 1/18/12 8:07am]

angel345 said:

ladygirl99 said:

First of all are you on her payroll or something? Why you are riding Susannah so hard lol she prolly doesnt even know you exist. That is kinda creepy. Susannah is a big girl she doesnt need fans ride on her LOL. I don't care if she impress me or not since I am not a big fdeluxe fan nor Susannah fan, as a musician she continues to pursue for a living her job is to indeed impress her fans who are the ones why buying Fdeluxe concert tickets and songs. But with the impress part, I stated my opinion, either take it or leave it. Its all about taste. I don't dislike Susannah. She was even nice enough to direct me to fdeluxe facebook fan when I was try to get on her official facebook just to show my support with Gaslight album, well at the time it didnt have a title. That was 3 years ago not sure if she now accepting fans on her facebook page again.

Second of all Sheila was not just Prince's protege. It was reported Prince and Andre even were fighting in a jokingly way for which one who want to married Sheila. He almost wifed her and Sheila E even confirmed this herself. So who I am going to believe you who is just a fan and never had connections with Prince or Sheila who met Prince even before I was born and still is part of his life? No rocket science answer on this one. Sheila and Prince had stay in touch over the years before they worked together in 1984. And also Prince is the reason why Sheila E decided to go solo as she prefers to do background music work. Just please stick to know your expertise with Melvoins and Colemans okay? When I said Sheila is a badass bitch that is out of endearment.

I am not making this up on the fans. How can you determined my experience that you dont even know me? But I can let you know briefly I had been on org since 1996 (even though using the same user name for ladygirl99 for last several years) back in purple and black days likely longer than you and I was on Housequake (I even talked to Lisa Coleman on there and yes she did post on Housequake and I talked to Wendy back in the late 90s through email briefly about my appreciated of how she/Lisa score Soul Food and that Master P flick) so I know what I am talking about when fans said over the years Susannah was the love of his life, that all the love, thats their opinion, eh, but thats not a fact, if you for being a moderator, not sure how long Ben keep past posts archieved, then the org search button is available. Just because I dont kiss W&L, Susannah, and Prince and others blindly doesn't like everything they produce it doesnt make me less of a fan of theirs. I am not a fanbot thank you!

She sure did and I always thought that Shiela E and Vanity were the two baddest chicks in the game.

Yes they were

Dren5 said:

OldFriends4Sale said:

It's true, the 1st 2 albums and alot of the unreleased 1976-77 recordings are some of my favs

But it wasn't until he started pulling from Dez Dr Fink Andr etc the Rebels project and that kind of experimentation with all his band members that he opened into other musical expression with Dirty Mind going into New Wave and Dez being a hard rocker pushing Prince to amp up the ax in the live shows that Prince opened more. Lisa also replacing Gayle, and from my understand Lisa was 'nasty' lol and her reletionship with Prince and her musical background just turned things up.

What would the 3rd studio album be like if he didn't open to the Rebels music and just stayed inthe studio and jam session by himself...

...What makes you assume that if he never met any of them, he'd have just stagnated?

Where did I say that? LOL

He almost married her ? whoa cool

ladygirl99 said:

OldFriends4Sale said:

You're blowing this up, I've never read a bunch of stuff from fans exaggerating Susannahs contributions. What contributions are you talking about?

Susannah was the one he made a lot of songs mostly about durin that time, Don't underempasize her place in Prince life at the time either

What made her average? She doesn't have to impress you. I know people who say the same about Sade's voice doesn't mean Sade is average

I don't think Sheila is a bitch, but she is badder than the wicked witch

Sheila E was a protege so from the outside it would seem she played a vital role. We are dealing wth 2 different types of influences. Morris Day played a vital role as well.

Sheila E was never engaged to Prince. And Sheila E didn't start working with Prince until the PR era same time Susannah came into Prince's life.

I've never said she was the love of his life, and honestly I've never ready anyone say that either, your making that up. And I've never read anyone snub or ignore Sheila E's importance in Prince's life. I personally have made thread based on the Prince/Sheila E connection and enjoy reading other's thread that have beenmade. Your exaggerating a lot of what you've said sorry. Way to much generalizing

First of all are you on her payroll or something? Why you are riding Susannah so hard lol she prolly doesnt even know you exist. That is kinda creepy. Susannah is a big girl she doesnt need fans ride on her LOL. I don't care if she impress me or not since I am not a big fdeluxe fan nor Susannah fan, as a musician she continues to pursue for a living her job is to indeed impress her fans who are the ones why buying Fdeluxe concert tickets and songs. But with the impress part, I stated my opinion, either take it or leave it. Its all about taste. I don't dislike Susannah. She was even nice enough to direct me to fdeluxe facebook fan when I was try to get on her official facebook just to show my support with Gaslight album, well at the time it didnt have a title. That was 3 years ago not sure if she now accepting fans on her facebook page again.

Second of all Sheila was not just Prince's protege. It was reported Prince and Andre even were fighting in a jokingly way for which one who want to married Sheila. He almost wifed her and Sheila E even confirmed this herself. So who I am going to believe you who is just a fan and never had connections with Prince or Sheila who met Prince even before I was born and still is part of his life? No rocket science answer on this one. Sheila and Prince had stay in touch over the years before they worked together in 1984. And also Prince is the reason why Sheila E decided to go solo as she prefers to do background music work. Just please stick to know your expertise with Melvoins and Colemans okay? When I said Sheila is a badass bitch that is out of endearment.

I am not making this up on the fans. How can you determined my experience that you dont even know me? But I can let you know briefly I had been on org since 1996 (even though using the same user name for ladygirl99 for last several years) back in purple and black days likely longer than you and I was on Housequake (I even talked to Lisa Coleman on there and yes she did post on Housequake and I talked to Wendy back in the late 90s through email briefly about my appreciated of how she/Lisa score Soul Food and that Master P flick) so I know what I am talking about when fans said over the years Susannah was the love of his life, that all the love, thats their opinion, eh, but thats not a fact, if you for being a moderator, not sure how long Ben keep past posts archieved, then the org search button is available. Just because I dont kiss W&L, Susannah, and Prince and others blindly doesn't like everything they produce it doesnt make me less of a fan of theirs. I am not a fanbot thank you!

Are u on Prince's payroll ? Duh

Please I know all about the Prince Sheila stuff, and when it came down to 1983-1988 She was on Prince's payroll 1st and foremost. But they were long time friends of sorts. It's hard to see them in a real relationship. They probably were friends with benefits though.

Prince didn't almost wife her at all. Prince and Andre met her at a show with her Father/Family and they jokingly had a bet

When did he officially date her though? When he was dating Susan Moonsie or Vanity, right after came Susannah, then he kept Anna Fantastic in his bed till she turned 18. According to Sheila they didn't hang out for a few years until 1983 and they met n 1978

2elijah said:

ladygirl99 said:

I think that I should flipped that 6 into 9 as Prince org became public around 1999 so that is when i joined and yes even then people were debating Prince vs Wendy and Lisa and his music suck without them, and Susannah was his true love. And also alt.prince google group this around time after Wendy claimed she and Lisa wrote Purple Rain aand later slightly backtrack in future interviews after Prince jabbed them off his defunct website. And on alt.prince music google groups went some warzone for nearly a month, after W&L made that claimed, lol, it was better than a soap opera, ya know Prince vs W&L fans went at it hard, thought it was going to be real WW3, I think it still have some older posts perserved not sure.

Yeah nothing havent change since Prince org use to be black and purple days when it comes to these debates. That was sort of my point

Agree, you will always see these type of threads pop up. I think you, me, Timmy and OF4s, although some, slight disagreements on the topic, pretty much still kept it together yesterday.

Hate 2 admit it at times, but it's kinda fun lol

jon1967 said:

He almost married her ? whoa cool

I'm definately looking for it, maybe in Prince's utopia of Erotic City, but I can't see when it was that he almost married Sheila E

he should ask her theyre perfect