BklynBabe said:

musicjunky318 said:

This is a flop I don't care what excuse some people use. And beaten by Glee & Twighlight is just embarassing when you're coming off a 4 year break with a new full-fledged studio album. But it was expected after her singles underperformed.

She'll fail to find a 'miracle' a la Rihanna with 'Rude Boy' and it will struggle to reach 700k.

Back to the drawing board.

...the ballad will always save her....

ie. I Turn To You, Beautiful, Hurt.....

I just saw her Storyteller, and I do believe that ballad will save her.

It won't. When "Lift Me Up" was released there was little response, and no one's interested in ballads at the moment. Nothing else is single-worthy. She'll probably end up treating this album the same way Mariah treats Glitter.

uPtoWnNY said:

purplesweat said:

Just for the record - Britney's Blackout sold more on the first day than Bionic has so far and that album had zero promo and a star going crazy.

That performance was horrific, the nail in the coffin was that god awful scream she does halfway through.

Her rendition of the National Anthem at last night's Laker game was horrific too.

oh I thought she'd come a long way from previous horrific anthems....I was actually a bit more underwhelmed by Monica's rendition.

at least she is not doing that awful "ha" noise she used to make all the time. That shit used to irritate me to no end, all that beautiful singing and then "ha".

Her problem is she wants to be edgy....but her voice is made for soul. Just like Mariah Carey. They want to sing these hoochie coochie songs and wear dental floss and be Madonna when they have real voices and don't need to show tits and crotch to have careers. If she would just learn to be herself. She definitely lacks a lot of confidence, which is so sad to see.

uPtoWnNY said:

Her rendition of the National Anthem at last night's Laker game was horrific too.

Aryll said:

BklynBabe said:

...the ballad will always save her....

ie. I Turn To You, Beautiful, Hurt.....

I just saw her Storyteller, and I do believe that ballad will save her.

It won't. When "Lift Me Up" was released there was little response, and no one's interested in ballads at the moment. Nothing else is single-worthy. She'll probably end up treating this album the same way Mariah treats Glitter.

when was "Lift Me Up" released?

badujunkie said:

why anyone is surprised is beyond me. the jig has been up for awhile now on XXXtina. it was plain bad luck to have stolen from a virtual unknown in 2008 who became the biggest pop star since madonna. and then she's not even on the record! a duet btwn xtina and gaga would have been huge. the bitch went out of her way to work with every other 'innovative' female artist, save janelle monae, but not gaga. sad, really. plus look where her contemporaries are. she came out in 99. i don't see j.lo or ashanti blowing up the charts. people want to make out that shes big as britney, but she never was. album sales, ticket sales...just in sheer numbers.

Actually, you're wrong. Christina has stated several times that the reasons she worked with the people she did was because she 'looked up to them.'

Christina doesn't look up to Gaga, so why in the hell would she work with her? Gaga is a newbie, who came out of nowhere. Christina, who has been around for nearly 2 decades in one form or another, isn't going to work with someone who's only been around for a year.

This is what I don't get. Christina doesn't work with Britney, because she didn't like the comparisons. She worked with Sia, Tricky, Ladytron, and all that because she grew up listening to that type of music. This is probably her most personal album, in terms of the music SHE likes, because she threw all the influences that she loved growing up on this album.

Yes, it's not selling. That is probably because everyone is sick of hearing this type of music. I'm curious to find out how Sia's new album sells; I've heard it, and it's solid, however since everyone is sick of old stuff, she might end up with a flop as well.

Americans don't know good music anymore. This album is number 1 in the UK, it was the second best selling album of Christina's in the United Kingdom. In America, it's flopping...but what isn't flopping? Miley Cyrus? Given the choice, I'd rather listen to Christina's new album than Miley's new album.

Another artist that is legendary, that I respect, and who hasn't had good sales in quite a few years...Ozzy Osbourne. His new album Scream is his best since Ozzmosis. Do I expect it to be a groundbreaking smash? Hell no. People don't buy albums anymore, even the fans of the artists.

Christina's record co. needs to wake up, and realize they're not in 1999 anymore. Sales have been declining steadily over the years due to filesharing. And this album leaked almost a month before release. I'm actually not surprised it's flopping...it's her best since Stripped, but since Lady Caca has everyone 'shocked' with stupid videos like her new one (which I can't even pronounce)...again, America has no taste.

I'm expecting Christina to go ahead with a massive UK tour, and skip America. Americans have deserted her with this album.

midiscover said:

Aryll said:

It won't. When "Lift Me Up" was released there was little response, and no one's interested in ballads at the moment. Nothing else is single-worthy. She'll probably end up treating this album the same way Mariah treats Glitter.

when was "Lift Me Up" released?

Not as a single, but it was made available around the time of the Haiti telethon. It was one of the first songs we heard from the album.

shipoffools said:

badujunkie said:

why anyone is surprised is beyond me. the jig has been up for awhile now on XXXtina. it was plain bad luck to have stolen from a virtual unknown in 2008 who became the biggest pop star since madonna. and then she's not even on the record! a duet btwn xtina and gaga would have been huge. the bitch went out of her way to work with every other 'innovative' female artist, save janelle monae, but not gaga. sad, really. plus look where her contemporaries are. she came out in 99. i don't see j.lo or ashanti blowing up the charts. people want to make out that shes big as britney, but she never was. album sales, ticket sales...just in sheer numbers.

Actually, you're wrong. Christina has stated several times that the reasons she worked with the people she did was because she 'looked up to them.'

Christina doesn't look up to Gaga, so why in the hell would she work with her? Gaga is a newbie, who came out of nowhere. Christina, who has been around for nearly 2 decades in one form or another, isn't going to work with someone who's only been around for a year.

This is what I don't get. Christina doesn't work with Britney, because she didn't like the comparisons. She worked with Sia, Tricky, Ladytron, and all that because she grew up listening to that type of music. This is probably her most personal album, in terms of the music SHE likes, because she threw all the influences that she loved growing up on this album.

Yes, it's not selling. That is probably because everyone is sick of hearing this type of music. I'm curious to find out how Sia's new album sells; I've heard it, and it's solid, however since everyone is sick of old stuff, she might end up with a flop as well.

Americans don't know good music anymore. This album is number 1 in the UK, it was the second best selling album of Christina's in the United Kingdom. In America, it's flopping...but what isn't flopping? Miley Cyrus? Given the choice, I'd rather listen to Christina's new album than Miley's new album.

Another artist that is legendary, that I respect, and who hasn't had good sales in quite a few years...Ozzy Osbourne. His new album Scream is his best since Ozzmosis. Do I expect it to be a groundbreaking smash? Hell no. People don't buy albums anymore, even the fans of the artists.

Christina's record co. needs to wake up, and realize they're not in 1999 anymore. Sales have been declining steadily over the years due to filesharing. And this album leaked almost a month before release. I'm actually not surprised it's flopping...it's her best since Stripped, but since Lady Caca has everyone 'shocked' with stupid videos like her new one (which I can't even pronounce)...again, America has no taste.

I'm expecting Christina to go ahead with a massive UK tour, and skip America. Americans have deserted her with this album.

Sia hasn't been around that long, so how did she grow up listening to her?

If she was aiming for a similar sound to those artists, why is Desnudate on the album? Why did she choose something as tuneless and generic as Not Myself Tonight? Didn't she say she grew up with the old time classics which is how Back To Basics came to be? When do we get to hear HER not her version of some other era gone by?

You're right that quality isn't exactly the reason people are buying records these days but you'd think an artist with 11 years behind her would be able to make people want to buy her record? Is she the voice of her generation or not? Why isn't her generation supporting her?

She's not just flopping in the US, either. She's not setting any charts on fire, except maybe the UK but for some reason she backed out of promoting the album there which is just pathetic IMO and shows how confident she really isn't about the album and how it will perform.

[Edited 6/18/10 23:13pm]

purplesweat said:

shipoffools said:

Actually, you're wrong. Christina has stated several times that the reasons she worked with the people she did was because she 'looked up to them.'

Christina doesn't look up to Gaga, so why in the hell would she work with her? Gaga is a newbie, who came out of nowhere. Christina, who has been around for nearly 2 decades in one form or another, isn't going to work with someone who's only been around for a year.

This is what I don't get. Christina doesn't work with Britney, because she didn't like the comparisons. She worked with Sia, Tricky, Ladytron, and all that because she grew up listening to that type of music. This is probably her most personal album, in terms of the music SHE likes, because she threw all the influences that she loved growing up on this album.

Yes, it's not selling. That is probably because everyone is sick of hearing this type of music. I'm curious to find out how Sia's new album sells; I've heard it, and it's solid, however since everyone is sick of old stuff, she might end up with a flop as well.

Americans don't know good music anymore. This album is number 1 in the UK, it was the second best selling album of Christina's in the United Kingdom. In America, it's flopping...but what isn't flopping? Miley Cyrus? Given the choice, I'd rather listen to Christina's new album than Miley's new album.

Another artist that is legendary, that I respect, and who hasn't had good sales in quite a few years...Ozzy Osbourne. His new album Scream is his best since Ozzmosis. Do I expect it to be a groundbreaking smash? Hell no. People don't buy albums anymore, even the fans of the artists.

Christina's record co. needs to wake up, and realize they're not in 1999 anymore. Sales have been declining steadily over the years due to filesharing. And this album leaked almost a month before release. I'm actually not surprised it's flopping...it's her best since Stripped, but since Lady Caca has everyone 'shocked' with stupid videos like her new one (which I can't even pronounce)...again, America has no taste.

I'm expecting Christina to go ahead with a massive UK tour, and skip America. Americans have deserted her with this album.

Sia hasn't been around that long, so how did she grow up listening to her?

If she was aiming for a similar sound to those artists, why is Desnudate on the album? Why did she choose something as tuneless and generic as Not Myself Tonight? Didn't she say she grew up with the old time classics which is how Back To Basics came to be? When do we get to hear HER not her version of some other era gone by?

You're right that quality isn't exactly the reason people are buying records these days but you'd think an artist with 11 years behind her would be able to make people want to buy her record? Is she the voice of her generation or not? Why isn't her generation supporting her?

She's not just flopping in the US, either. She's not setting any charts on fire, except maybe the UK but for some reason she backed out of promoting the album there which is just pathetic IMO and shows how confident she really isn't about the album and how it will perform.

[Edited 6/18/10 23:13pm]

Bionic may have been #1 in the UK, but sold only 24k, making it one of the lowest-selling #1's in history there. It's certainly not going to come anywhere close to the 525k that B2B sold or the 1.9 million that Stripped sold - not sure why he said it was the "second best selling album of Christina's in the United Kingdom", because that sure as fuck isn't true.

And "America has no taste" when it comes to Lady GaGa? Hello, she's sold 10 million copies of The Fame worldwide, only 3 million of those coming from the US. America has no taste or appetite for Christina Aguilera and clearly neither does the rest of the world. That much is fact.

Also, *DEAD* @ someone speculating if Sia's album is going to flop. She's a fucking INDIE artist. If she sells 25k it's a success. Does shipofffools even know who Sia is?

One of my friends works at Air Canada Centre and the bitch had only sold about 400 tickets out of an 18k setup when that shit was cancelled. That is fucking brutal - no matter what she says, it is NOT being rescheduled. She should have been able to sell decently off her catalogue alone - you know, since she's been around "nearly 2 decades in one form or another" (I can only assume Mickey Mouse Club auditions is a "form"?).

[Edited 6/18/10 23:49pm]

VoicesCarry said:

One of my friends works at Air Canada Centre and the bitch had only sold about 400 tickets out of an 18k setup when that shit was cancelled. That is fucking brutal

holy crap that's bad

Aryll said:

midiscover said:

when was "Lift Me Up" released?

Not as a single, but it was made available around the time of the Haiti telethon. It was one of the first songs we heard from the album.

Oh.

She needs to act like this album never happened.

purplesweat said:

shipoffools said:

Actually, you're wrong. Christina has stated several times that the reasons she worked with the people she did was because she 'looked up to them.'

Christina doesn't look up to Gaga, so why in the hell would she work with her? Gaga is a newbie, who came out of nowhere. Christina, who has been around for nearly 2 decades in one form or another, isn't going to work with someone who's only been around for a year.

This is what I don't get. Christina doesn't work with Britney, because she didn't like the comparisons. She worked with Sia, Tricky, Ladytron, and all that because she grew up listening to that type of music. This is probably her most personal album, in terms of the music SHE likes, because she threw all the influences that she loved growing up on this album.

Yes, it's not selling. That is probably because everyone is sick of hearing this type of music. I'm curious to find out how Sia's new album sells; I've heard it, and it's solid, however since everyone is sick of old stuff, she might end up with a flop as well.

Americans don't know good music anymore. This album is number 1 in the UK, it was the second best selling album of Christina's in the United Kingdom. In America, it's flopping...but what isn't flopping? Miley Cyrus? Given the choice, I'd rather listen to Christina's new album than Miley's new album.

Another artist that is legendary, that I respect, and who hasn't had good sales in quite a few years...Ozzy Osbourne. His new album Scream is his best since Ozzmosis. Do I expect it to be a groundbreaking smash? Hell no. People don't buy albums anymore, even the fans of the artists.

Christina's record co. needs to wake up, and realize they're not in 1999 anymore. Sales have been declining steadily over the years due to filesharing. And this album leaked almost a month before release. I'm actually not surprised it's flopping...it's her best since Stripped, but since Lady Caca has everyone 'shocked' with stupid videos like her new one (which I can't even pronounce)...again, America has no taste.

I'm expecting Christina to go ahead with a massive UK tour, and skip America. Americans have deserted her with this album.

Sia hasn't been around that long, so how did she grow up listening to her?

If she was aiming for a similar sound to those artists, why is Desnudate on the album? Why did she choose something as tuneless and generic as Not Myself Tonight? Didn't she say she grew up with the old time classics which is how Back To Basics came to be? When do we get to hear HER not her version of some other era gone by?

You're right that quality isn't exactly the reason people are buying records these days but you'd think an artist with 11 years behind her would be able to make people want to buy her record? Is she the voice of her generation or not? Why isn't her generation supporting her?

She's not just flopping in the US, either. She's not setting any charts on fire, except maybe the UK but for some reason she backed out of promoting the album there which is just pathetic IMO and shows how confident she really isn't about the album and how it will perform.

[Edited 6/18/10 23:13pm]

Did you even read what I wrote?

What I said was that this was her most personal album, because it's the kind of music she grew up listening to. Yes, she grew up listening to Billie Holiday, but she also grew up with Tricky, Elastica, and Nine Inch Nails. This was her attempt at making an album that reflected that.

My god, did you even look at the albums she 'recommended' on Itunes, as personal favorites? There was like 2 soul albums, and most of the stuff was rock. That's her favorite music, like it or not like it.

Yes, Christina has a great soulful voice, but she's said before that she's not content to just sit down and sing ballad after ballad. She wants to get up and do what her heroes did. Okay, maybe it's hard jumping from rock song to pop song to electronic track to ballad, which is probably why this album is flopping, but that doesn't make the album bad.

If you want the most personal album for Christina, try Stripped. THAT was her most personal album, in terms of her as a person. As far as most personal in terms of her influences, Bionic is it.

And when you have a record company that basically drops the ball and doesn't put out another single, after the first one flops, you're bound to have bad record sales. Genesis broke up for that very reason, because Calling All Stations flopped. And so did Van Halen.

This actually has me worried, because I want to see Christina put out at least 2 or 3 more studio albums before she retires, and I don't want her record co. to drop her over something as stupid as this. Not to mention that it's her record co's fault that she's flopping, because I hear lots of singles on the new album. "My Girls" is a hot track, so is "Monday Morning," "Glam," "Elastic Love," "I Hate Boys"...this album has so much potential, and it's just being ignored because Sony/RCA can't get it together!

I personally think Christina, regardless of what happens with this album, should go independent with the next album. Get a bunch of people, like Linda Perry, together, and put out a solid 5th album, sometime in 2013-2014. Screw the record company, since they're screwing her.

Oh, and to the fweed that said that I didn't know anything about Sia...I don't. I bought all her albums recently, because Christina worked with her and I liked what I heard. I had never heard anything by Sia before I heard "You Lost Me"...and then went and bought all her albums on Itunes.

It must get hard for Prince fans to always be hating. I mean, all that hate must really make you a miserable person. Have you ever tried smiling, for once?

shipoffools said:

purplesweat said:

Sia hasn't been around that long, so how did she grow up listening to her?

If she was aiming for a similar sound to those artists, why is Desnudate on the album? Why did she choose something as tuneless and generic as Not Myself Tonight? Didn't she say she grew up with the old time classics which is how Back To Basics came to be? When do we get to hear HER not her version of some other era gone by?

You're right that quality isn't exactly the reason people are buying records these days but you'd think an artist with 11 years behind her would be able to make people want to buy her record? Is she the voice of her generation or not? Why isn't her generation supporting her?

She's not just flopping in the US, either. She's not setting any charts on fire, except maybe the UK but for some reason she backed out of promoting the album there which is just pathetic IMO and shows how confident she really isn't about the album and how it will perform.

[Edited 6/18/10 23:13pm]

Did you even read what I wrote?

What I said was that this was her most personal album, because it's the kind of music she grew up listening to. Yes, she grew up listening to Billie Holiday, but she also grew up with Tricky, Elastica, and Nine Inch Nails. This was her attempt at making an album that reflected that.

My god, did you even look at the albums she 'recommended' on Itunes, as personal favorites? There was like 2 soul albums, and most of the stuff was rock. That's her favorite music, like it or not like it.

Yes, Christina has a great soulful voice, but she's said before that she's not content to just sit down and sing ballad after ballad. She wants to get up and do what her heroes did. Okay, maybe it's hard jumping from rock song to pop song to electronic track to ballad, which is probably why this album is flopping, but that doesn't make the album bad.

If you want the most personal album for Christina, try Stripped. THAT was her most personal album, in terms of her as a person. As far as most personal in terms of her influences, Bionic is it.

And when you have a record company that basically drops the ball and doesn't put out another single, after the first one flops, you're bound to have bad record sales. Genesis broke up for that very reason, because Calling All Stations flopped. And so did Van Halen.

This actually has me worried, because I want to see Christina put out at least 2 or 3 more studio albums before she retires, and I don't want her record co. to drop her over something as stupid as this. Not to mention that it's her record co's fault that she's flopping, because I hear lots of singles on the new album. "My Girls" is a hot track, so is "Monday Morning," "Glam," "Elastic Love," "I Hate Boys"...this album has so much potential, and it's just being ignored because Sony/RCA can't get it together!

I personally think Christina, regardless of what happens with this album, should go independent with the next album. Get a bunch of people, like Linda Perry, together, and put out a solid 5th album, sometime in 2013-2014. Screw the record company, since they're screwing her.

Although RCA has made questionable decisions for many artists, I can see it from their position. There is nothing single-worthy on the record, so why RCA waste money and time promoting, filming a video, etc? Better to cut their losses at this point. They tried to float a second single by sending WooHoo to Rhythmic but that went nowhere.

shipoffools said:

Oh, and to the fweed that said that I didn't know anything about Sia...I don't. I bought all her albums recently, because Christina worked with her and I liked what I heard. I had never heard anything by Sia before I heard "You Lost Me"...and then went and bought all her albums on Itunes.

It must get hard for Prince fans to always be hating. I mean, all that hate must really make you a miserable person. Have you ever tried smiling, for once?

Glad you admitted it. Because, clearly, if you had, you'd know that she's an indie artist who isn't declared a "flop" when she doesn't have a Top 10 debut on the Billboard 200.

If you dislike prince.org that much, perhaps you should just stop coming here. You've declared more than once that "this is my last post on this board", etc. so either follow through on your promise or stop bitching about Prince fans and this board. Most of us in Music: Non-Prince are NOT here for Prince!

[Edited 6/19/10 16:23pm]

shipoffools, I hope you're not a Christina stan. Stripped would be her most personal album out of all that she's released. Bionic just seems like she's trying to go back to that with the current trend included in the mix.

Everything afterwards of what you said seems like excuses to me. Even Britney and Beyonce are still able to go platinum and they started around the same time she did, and Sia's an indie artist. Bionic isn't selling because it's lackluster, and her singles haven't gone anywhere. Nothing else is single-worthy, so don't put it on the record label. She sold under 200k worldwide, most of that being in the U.S. iirc (in the U.K. she sold somewhere around 25k). The world isn't feeling this album. This isn't her best era.

Also, Lady GaGa does pretty decent WW.

But in reality who cares if she gets dropped? If you are an artist this shouldnt fucking worry you. If you are sitting back and wondering and worrying like that you are NOT an artist, if you are making decisions because you think that is what people WANT then again, you are not an artist but a mere a puppet to the system. In this day and age with all but one label about to freaking crumble the last thing anyone should be thinking about is getting Dropped.....worry about how u are going to press your own cds and distribute yourself. The days of Billboard and soundscan and their relevance are OVER, the public wants shitty songs in abundance for a buck, and the older artists sell full albums to their loyal base. So for someone like Xtina she is in the middle, she does have respect in certain corners from real singers, but doing the things she has done with her image make her seem too much like a Madonna of the day, and we have enough of them already. You see its all been done, and no matter HOW you spin it, nothing anyone is doing is original especially in the POP/RB field, that fucking ship sailed about 20 years ago. So i think when people stop buying into the BULLSHIT because that is all is at this point, and the "shock" videos, (Which are tired from every artist) and the dumb ass scandals and comments from todays artists who try to make you think they are relevant, they arent. So i dont buy into anyones bull at this point when they talk about "artistic decisions" its all crap, no one in the mainstream is making "artistic decisions" they are doing what a group of PR people for them are saying they should do, plain and motherfucking simple. So when we get past the point and stop believing this new generation of artist, are artistic and original when they arent, we can move on from needless talk of sales at a time when the only thing that sells is some british chick singing opera a blind guy singing opera, a country singer, the current disney kid, and the flava of the month artist, oh yeah if the Eagles have a record to put out, after that no one sells.

And also of note, i saw that people were mentioning Britney and Beyonce, and thats it simply. Beyonce is known for her vocals, so as much as people despise her on the org, she aint going anywhere because she has crossed over and everyone of every race is in her fanbase and NOT many have that, plus she very rarely comes off as "slutty" in image. As for Britney, we know what she does, and she isnt a singer, she is a pop star and that name is known worldwide, so if you fucking hate her too, its going to be a long life of hate because she isnt going anywhere either, people want whatever she does no matter what. So xtina falls in this trap of wanting to go both places and you cant, Madonna had things down with re-inventing herself constantly, and its been done, but Madonna couldnt sing for the most part, you never were like "damn those vocals" gotta hear her. So Artists now need to re-focus since everything has been done, and no matter you try you are copying someone who is also copying someone

[Edited 6/19/10 17:39pm]

Bionic has some good songs Bird of Prey, I am, Stronger than Ever, but they get lost among the rest of the crap on the album. She needs the right producer and editor for her to make a coherent album. Christina although I don't really consider myself a fan is on a higher level than a lot of pop tarts out there.

Everyone says Madonna can't sing and is only about reinvention and marketing because that's what the media feeds them. But although she's not a belter, Madonna actually has a very expressive emotional appealing voice. She can sing! Can anyone seriously listen to Like A Prayer or Live to Tell and say she can't sing? Get real.

People criticize pop/R&B singers for being formulaic but rock now is just as bad. Nickelback anyone?

Everyone is going on about art, but these people need to make a living too to keep doing what they love. You have to find a balance between art and doing what you love and what the public wants. You go too far in either direction and you have a disaster. Why can't you be commercial and accessible and still have talent and write good songs. I don't see why not.

As far as Beyonce, I can't see how anyone can say she doesn't play the sexy or slutty card. Of course, she does. Have you seen her videos or shows? I don't have a problem with artists being sexual since that is a part of life and people are attracted to that as long as that is not all they have to offer and they also have talent and good music.

This album is as good as Back To Basics, which means, its completely average. After Stripped I was so excited about Christina as an artist and thought she would keep the quality up, so I bought Back To Basics without even hearing clips or anything. Needless to say it was a major dissapointment and I made sure to listen to Bionic when it leaked before I would even think about buying it this time. I tend to think this is the case for alot of people judging from other forums I've read, hence the low sales. And it's nothing to do with Christinas change of style, there are moments of brilliance on both the newer cds (Welcome and a few others on the second disc, I Am and a couple other ballads), its the lack of song quality and probably her tired image thats the problem.

One of my friends works at Air Canada Centre and the bitch had only sold about 400 tickets out of an 18k setup when that shit was cancelled. That is fucking brutal - no matter what she says, it is NOT being rescheduled. She should have been able to sell decently off her catalogue alone - you know, since she's been around "nearly 2 decades in one form or another" (I can only assume Mickey Mouse Club auditions is a "form"?).

Jesus. I think lack of promotion is a big part of it, if you don't go on the internet a lot chances are you barely know about this album.

And when you have a record company that basically drops the ball and doesn't put out another single, after the first one flops, you're bound to have bad record sales. Genesis broke up for that very reason, because Calling All Stations flopped. And so did Van Halen.

I don't know the ~rules~ of labels, but if I were her, I'd go ahead and put snippets of all my songs on my website, get chatting to my fans on Twitter/Facebook/Myspace, and I would NEVER cancel out on any promotion like she has with the UK (the album went #1 there, why did she shy away?!)

Bionic has some good songs Bird of Prey, I am, Stronger than Ever, but they get lost among the rest of the crap on the album. She needs the right producer and editor for her to make a coherent album. Christina although I don't really consider myself a fan is on a higher level than a lot of pop tarts out there.

The main problem is all of those songs are great yet only one of them is actually ON the album.

As far as Beyonce, I can't see how anyone can say she doesn't play the sexy or slutty card. Of course, she does. Have you seen her videos or shows? I don't have a problem with artists being sexual since that is a part of life and people are attracted to that as long as that is not all they have to offer and they also have talent and good music.

Beyonce did the sexy/slutty stuff with her first album, a little bit with her 2nd but I didn't really think Sasha Fierce era was overly sexual at all. Video Phone was probably the only video/song.

Beyonce always does something a little bit more unique than anyone else - when has Christina kick started a pop culture phenomenon like Single Ladies? That's like the 3rd dance Beyonce's done that's become as iconic as her. Crazy in Love was the same, it had the dance and it had the old school feel.

StillDirrty said:

I feel bad that she's flopping. I downloaded it but I'm not buying. I don't really like it and it's not electronic or futuristic like she promised it would be. It sounds like Stripped only the songs aren't as good.

Same here. As much as I want to, I can't see buying it, unless it's under $10 - for the Deluxe.

It seems more an experiment in aural fixations than having any lyrical substance, or decent song structure. If that's "futuristic", well then, I've seen the future and it will be....a bomb.

shipoffools said:

Americans don't know good music anymore.

And they did back in 1999, when the likes of Ricky Martin, Backstreet Boys and Creed were selling huge numbers?

If anything, I'd say the state of popular music is much better now than it was then.

Moonbeam said:

shipoffools said:

Americans don't know good music anymore.

And they did back in 1999, when the likes of Ricky Martin, Backstreet Boys and Creed were selling huge numbers?

If anything, I'd say the state of popular music is much better now than it was then.

I'm with ya on that one, Moonbeam. It's definitely a bullshit statement to say American's don't know good music. A lot of European music is fast paced dance music which is numbing to the ear after a while. Oh, what's that? There's more to Euro music than that? Well, the same goes for American music artists.

Let's also not forget that, in the late 90's, groups like Nsync started over in Europe and grew to huge popularity before they came back to the US to build an audience. So that says what about who?

Popular music, like any genre of music, movies, and other media, goes in waves. Ebb and tide. Up and down. When grunge came around in the 90's, it was an answer to a lot of hair bands that were still dominant at the time (if they hadn't drank themselves into oblivion yet). That emo rock stayed around for a long while. But you have to credit groups like BSB, Nsync, and the like for providing an answer, and, relief from grunge music. THe same thing happened 20 years earlier when disco took over, then punk and new wave counteracted that in the early 80's.

There's a place and time for everything in music, whether it's Nsync, or Pearl Jam. Sure there are also constants like Aerosmith, Prince, Madonna, etc, but even some of those long-standing artists change their sounds a bit and try new things.

So who's to say who knows good music, and who doesn't? It's really all relative to the listener, isn't it? Some folks here love stuff other people can't fathom buying and listening to. Let's not assume everyone on this side of the pond is from a ship of fools.

ernestsewell said:

Moonbeam said:

And they did back in 1999, when the likes of Ricky Martin, Backstreet Boys and Creed were selling huge numbers?

If anything, I'd say the state of popular music is much better now than it was then.

I'm with ya on that one, Moonbeam. It's definitely a bullshit statement to say American's don't know good music. A lot of European music is fast paced dance music which is numbing to the ear after a while. Oh, what's that? There's more to Euro music than that? Well, the same goes for American music artists.

Let's also not forget that, in the late 90's, groups like Nsync started over in Europe and grew to huge popularity before they came back to the US to build an audience. So that says what about who?

Popular music, like any genre of music, movies, and other media, goes in waves. Ebb and tide. Up and down. When grunge came around in the 90's, it was an answer to a lot of hair bands that were still dominant at the time (if they hadn't drank themselves into oblivion yet). That emo rock stayed around for a long while. But you have to credit groups like BSB, Nsync, and the like for providing an answer, and, relief from grunge music. THe same thing happened 20 years earlier when disco took over, then punk and new wave counteracted that in the early 80's.

There's a place and time for everything in music, whether it's Nsync, or Pearl Jam. Sure there are also constants like Aerosmith, Prince, Madonna, etc, but even some of those long-standing artists change their sounds a bit and try new things.

So who's to say who knows good music, and who doesn't? It's really all relative to the listener, isn't it? Some folks here love stuff other people can't fathom buying and listening to. Let's not assume everyone on this side of the pond is from a ship of fools.

I think its more that America doesnt have the focus on music that it had, it has merged into one medium, i mean we dont even sell music here anymore, in the UK they still sell cd singles in abundance, also in the UK and other corners there is more respect for the elders and young ones too, there is a mix, do you think Tina Turner could chart a single here and get Beyonce play without selling her soul to the devil and sound like everyone else? no she could do whatever she wants in the euro market, america is too quick to throwaway things now because the focus is on what the kids want, and the kids dont know shit, they never did, they are the worst demographic to follow especially for music because 95% of them dont even buy it.

But like u said its the listeners call, i just feel that the focus on music is gone in this country for the most part.

[Edited 6/20/10 17:59pm]

Why did America stop selling music?

They must still sell some, cuz MJ CDs were going out of stock last June.

The UK sells CD singles because there are a few collectors remaining, they only make up for 2% of total singles sales and from what I know, it's usually done by one retailer where you can order them online. America is still selling some CDs, judging by the numbers of Sade and now Drake, but the question is more about "stopped buying"...

And yes, the good vs bad music thing is all subjective, NMT didn't catch on with the "target audience" of current radio stations/iTunes buyers simply because it had nothing that set it apart from the rest of pop princess singles plus it wasn't as catchy as a Katy Perry track for example. And that's why nobody bothered to check out the album, it's not like America collectively snubbed Bionic for it's 15 tracks, it's just that neither NMT, not the barrage of promo Xtina did raised interest.

I think "tuneless" is the best description for NMT I've seen so far. There's no real hook or tune, it's just a bunch of sounds and a lot of unnecessary runs/big notes from Xtina. It even sounds hollow and empty. It's quite insulting that her label thought that's the kind of sound the general public will just lap up today, when it's actually her ballads now getting most of the hype.

Do you guys just hate Bionic because you were expecting a Iamamiwhoami kind of album? Yet why do you compare her to Britney and Rihanna and GaGa?

besides the videos, are you really considering their music as daring?

Have you heard the album? really? seriously? or are you judging it from the NMT video only?

Because damn, Prince released some ugly videos, but still his music speaks volumes right?

Not comparing the two, they could not be more further apart from each other.

I am glad if Bionic does not sell, for finally Christina might enter a different level which is the one shared by M.I.A. or Santogold or other singers/musicians who have an opinion and do not take safe choices.

Now, if you consider 'you lost me' - 'elastic love' - 'bionic' - 'lift me up' - 'monday morning' - 'bobblehead' as stupid, lame, ugly, bomb pop dance music, I guess I have an extremely bad taste.

Yes, I've heard the whole album, been listening to it for about 2 weeks now.

I like Elastic Love, I Am, You Lost Me, Desnudate, Monday Morning and Birds of Prey. The last two do not appear on the original album.

Elastic Love is the only one that really fits the sound she said she was going for. Even then, it's still nowhere near on the same level as something like Pokerface or Bad Romance.

Let's just face it, Gaga, Kylie and Britney handle the dancefloor pop, Bey merges R&B with pop and Christina should stick to the ballads (aka where the real singing comes in).

I don't think anyone called those artists daring, they're just good at what they do because it's what they've always done.

Christina went off the planet with this one which is why Bionic is so disjointed and jarring, I mean, really, acoustic ballads on the album you said The Prodigy inspired you to make? LOL.

Because damn, Prince released some ugly videos, but still his music speaks volumes right?

You don't actually think NMT speaks any kind of volume except "mute", right?

Nor songs that features lyrics like "All the boys think it's cake when they taste my *woohoo*" or "I make myself so much wetter...I take myself to be my lawfully wedded bitch".

We're not dealing with a musical genius here (like we were with Prince) we're dealing with an overrated pop star who just happens to posses a voice that goes beyond her limited talent.

dejacopis said:

Do you guys just hate Bionic because you were expecting a Iamamiwhoami kind of album? Yet why do you compare her to Britney and Rihanna and GaGa?

besides the videos, are you really considering their music as daring?

Have you heard the album? really? seriously? or are you judging it from the NMT video only?

Because damn, Prince released some ugly videos, but still his music speaks volumes right?

Not comparing the two, they could not be more further apart from each other.

I am glad if Bionic does not sell, for finally Christina might enter a different level which is the one shared by M.I.A. or Santogold or other singers/musicians who have an opinion and do not take safe choices.

Now, if you consider 'you lost me' - 'elastic love' - 'bionic' - 'lift me up' - 'monday morning' - 'bobblehead' as stupid, lame, ugly, bomb pop dance music, I guess I have an extremely bad taste.

The only thing that sets her apart from those other girls is her voice. The other girls are more talented than her in every other area, and these days its all about the total package. Christinas music is no more daring then theres. I've heard the album, the deluxe and all, as I think most people on this thread have, and its just not that great. I think what really wrecked it was the hype surrounding it. If she hadnt of talked non stop about who was involved and how much she was pushing the envelope or whatever I dont think people would have been as dissapointed, so yes I do think the Iamamiwhoami expectation had something to do with it.

Its really just an average pop album that could have been pretty good if it had of been cut down a bit. So those are its two major faults I think, the hype/wait/expectations/fact that she think shes so above her peers and a visonary when shes clearly not, and the amount of filler.

"I will not disappoint."