What strikes me as very odd is that according to the report, Prince didn't have his own doctor (Schulenberg was Kirk's doctor). Surely someone of his status should have his own physician who knows him inside out? It seems that either he was mistrustful of his details getting out, or more likely, he wasn't taking good enough care of himself. I do believe this probably would have been prevented if he had someone insist they look after him, but that said he also pushed people away and would probably fire someone for contradicting him.

I still can't get over the fact these files and transcripts have been released....it seems so weird that all the 'suspects' can read what others had said about them to the police, what happened to interviewee confidentiality?! How will people react to each other now, knowing what has been said about them by a supposed 'friend' to the police?!

Usually these kind of things are blocked for say 50/70 years until the risk of offence or reprisals has gone. It's intetesting to read of course but it seems somewhat negligent, not to mention tactless.

[Edited 4/23/18 9:08am]

PennyPurple said:

PennyPurple said:

There is still much diversion going on, but the truth is out there and it will come out.

it could be one pill. Fentany has a very low volume to its potentcy.

bondno9 said:

fortuneandserendipity said:

Is the amount of fentanyl alleged to have been in his bloodstream now on public record, does anyone know?

Reports had it at 67.8 micrograms per liter ... liver was 450 micrograms per kilogram. I'm still trying to figure out how many pills does that equate to? That's an exceedingly high amount in his system especially if no fentanyl was found in his blood the eve prior from visit with Dr. S

[Edited 4/23/18 8:22am]

TheFreakerFantastic said:

bondno9 said:

Andif he did come out and admit having issues .. how do you think people would have treated him? With compassion? or disdain? You admit being "pissed" off ... how do you think he would have received that type of attitude on a larger scale from fans? Probably as a form of judgment.

Good point. Probably a mixed reaction, just like it is now.

ThatWhiteDude said:

Just went on Twitter and there are some people going after Kirk Johnson 😁

Good, hopefully they'll start saying stuff to the rest too.

rogifan said:

I think it’s disgusting that this stuff is out there. I don’t care how interesting it is to read. Are people not allowed privacy anymore? I get why investigators need to know things when they’re investigating if a crime was committed. But who else needs to know he had hip replacement surgery in 2010 or that he was medicating himself to deal with pain? It’s nobody’s business. It’s like when autopsy reports or divorce proceedings of famous people come out and are plastered all over the tabloids. There is no public good being served. Is it just that people feel better about themselves when they can read about other people’s troubles?

Nope, it's all public records. If you keep insisting that you are having trouble with it being public and our discussing it on this forum, then maybe you need to stop reading this thread. Just saying...

disch said:

ha yes Prince emailed his assistant to have the cook use a different cooking oil because prince was concerned about "adrenal gland fatigue" as the cause of his health concerns -- but, what, he didn't connect those concerns to his terminal cancer/AIDS diagnosis?

Bodhitheblackdog said:

Disch: Some here may have "posited" he was deathly ill but there's not a lick of information in this report that supports that. There's no record of doctors visits (or even a regular doctor) other than the few Dr S visits, no prescribed medications other than the Dr S stuff, nothing. And this deathy illness apparently whizzed right by the doctors in Moline and Dr S, who made no mention of it (and of course Prince apparently didn't mention this supposed terminal illness to Dr S either, even though Prince was voluntarily visiting him to get relief from his various complaints, and that might be pertinent info. Prince did disclose his hip surgery and even his wisdom-teeth removal to him).

The PERFECT refutation of the illness theory in a nutshell!!!!!

[Edited 4/23/18 7:37am]

After reading some of the investigation documents, it's a sure thing that Prince had a Rx drug issue and that's what killed him. I see no evidence of there being any other illness. There were reports of him being severely anemic at the time of his death, and some where saying that it was sure sign of cancer or AIDS, but Dr. S told investigators that the only problem on his blood work was a very slight anemia that was not enough to do anything about. So let's just accept the fact that Prince died from drug addiction.

precioux said:

“But sometimes enablers don’t care about you at all..they want you to be so dependent on them that you always keep them around.” - perfect defenition oh KJ. Maybe we should’ve LISTENED to prizefight (order on here that was in the immediate circle at one time,but lasted maybe a week before getting bullied off) Prizefight told it like it was -but certain ones here couldn’t handle it...NOW, everything prizefight said has come to fruition in

Thanks for reminding me of prizefight precioux.

But prizefight wasnt bullied off off this site...in fact prizefight was a strong person, and could hold their own.

Prizefight told me he/she was leaving because the org wasnt ready to hear the truth.

PennyPurple said:

Purplebflogirl said:

Mumio said:

ISaidLifeIsJustAGame said:

precioux said:

“But sometimes enablers don’t care about you at all..they want you to be so dependent on them that you always keep them around.” - perfect defenition oh KJ. Maybe we should’ve LISTENED to prizefight (order on here that was in the immediate circle at one time,but lasted maybe a week before getting bullied off) Prizefight told it like it was -but certain ones here couldn’t handle it...NOW, everything prizefight said has come to fruition in

Thanks for reminding me of prizefight precioux.

But prizefight wasnt bullied off off this site...in fact prizefight was a strong person, and could hold their own.

Prizefight told me he/she was leaving because the org wasnt ready to hear the truth.

WOW!!! I just read the input by Prizefight ...this thread Part 3 pages 40 ish...They knew exactly what was going on and surmises that P died of neglect

Bodhitheblackdog said:

PennyPurple said:

80tomato said:

ISaidLifeIsJustAGame said:

Thanks for reminding me of prizefight precioux.

But prizefight wasnt bullied off off this site...in fact prizefight was a strong person, and could hold their own.

Prizefight told me he/she was leaving because the org wasnt ready to hear the truth.

WOW!!! I just read the input by Prizefight ...this thread Part 3 pages 40 ish...They knew exactly what was going on and surmises that P died of neglect

How do you access part 3 of this thread?

MMJas ,I actually put the name Prizefight in the Google custom search box on the top of this page and a bunch of threads came up with the word prizefight ...the one where they respond is from June 27 2017 ?

paulludvig said:

PennyPurple said:

He didn't have any other health problem, it was simply addiction. The only pain he mentioned to the Drs. was pain in his hands and possibly arm, paperwork showed he was having a slight back problem and was working with a chiro.

Now I'm not saying the addiction didn't start with his hip when he had surgery. You also notice him walking in and out of Dr. S office the night before, there was no limp, and no cane.

No cancer, no leukemia, no AIDS, no hepititis. Mulefunk might have to rewrite his book.

There was no pain because he was on pain killers. Without them there would be pain.

Uh-NO.

Strawberrylova123 said:

Bodhitheblackdog said:

precioux said:

“But sometimes enablers don’t care about you at all..they want you to be so dependent on them that you always keep them around.” - perfect defenition oh KJ. Maybe we should’ve LISTENED to prizefight (orger on here that was in the immediate circle at one time,but lasted maybe a week before getting bullied off) Prizefight told it like it was -but certain ones here couldn’t handle it...NOW, everything prizefight said has come to fruition in

THANK YOU for mentioning prizefight, Precioux...I have saved her posts and recently read them again, and you are SO right...EVERYONE in the 'inner circle' knew...don't forget, she was bullied off this site (LR, are you feeling my wrath?) BECAUSE SHE WAS TELLING THE TRUTH.

yep, that's exactly what I stated...glad you remember prizefight. There's another one on here that had a hand in getting her bullied off and till this day posts here...

Article: Prince really had no true friends at all..........

.

http://www.chicagotribune...story.html

.

Some of us have many other categories of friends as well. And Prince had a fourth type — enablers. That’s not unusual for entertainers or anyone, for that matter, who has an addiction.

.

Sometimes enablers think they are doing right by you when they are, in fact, pushing you further down a destructive path. But sometimes, enablers don’t care about you at all. They want you to be so dependent on them that you always keep them around.

.

It is possible that Prince had too many of this type of friend in his life.

MMJas said:

80tomato said:

WOW!!! I just read the input by Prizefight ...this thread Part 3 pages 40 ish...They knew exactly what was going on and surmises that P died of neglect

How do you access part 3 of this thread?

it's the Death Investigation thread, part 3.

.

Here I think:

http://forum.prince.org/msg/7/442566?&pg=39

.

Just been to look at it - spooky. Prizefight really seems to have known what was going on.

.

Also I've been hunting for an old W&L interview (might even have been with the Org) - I think around 2009? - where they talk about him being in pain, and having heard that he was "managing it with pills" cos he didn't want surgery. It seemed so innocuous at the time.

[Edited 4/23/18 10:34am]

disch said:

Doing well enough after his appointment the evening before to be OK for 12 hours or so until they had the intervention the next day. Dr S DID say that he seemed OK by the time he left his office on April 20. Not OK like "cured of his addiction," but under having things under control for the time being. That's because Dr S treated him during the appointment.

-

I know you feel that Andrew is a major villain in this story, but based on the documents, he just isn't. He did nothing to enable Prince's addiction, and there's nothing about what he did or said that implies that he wasn't truly there to help.

cloveringold85 said:

.

Prince was not doing fine!! Dr. S. and Dr. K both said he wasn't doing fine.

.

I'm too tired to go over this again.

.

To the bolded & highlighted: I never said Andrew was not trying to help, but here's the real problem......HE COULD NOT HELP PRINCE, because he could not administer any drug to him--he is NOT a doctor...., if there was an emergency -- he would have to Call 911......(and, that's exactly what happened).

.

I'm not trying to be rude, but this is the God's honest truth!!

.

Anyone who has read the Investigation Report and still thinks that Dr. Schulenberg, Dr. Kornfeld, Andrew Kornfeld, and Kirk are still innocent of any wrongdoing, clearly do not have a real grip on the magnitude of Prince's death. That is my opinion.

.

I'm not a crime expert, but I think lying to investigators is not a crime. All I can say about those who were involved -- May the Lord have mercy on their souls.

.

And, there are other's who were in his circle who were enablers too!

80tomato said:

MMJas ,I actually put the name Prizefight in the Google custom search box on the top of this page and a bunch of threads came up with the word prizefight ...the one where they respond is from June 27 2017 ?

That was the thread in which I said Prince was a functioning addict and Laura nearly bit my head of, i think.

*

Prizefight said, and i quote: "He had a withdrawal in 2010 after surgery. He wrote a song about it. Because he was on meds for so long the withdrawal was gradual paranoia etc. Prince being more extra Prince. Its when he started riding his bike everywhere. Behaviour like that. Withdrawal doesn't always look the same for people who use until the the body starts reacting (vomiting shakes pain etc) thats usually a normal course. Endorphins have been overtaxed so then the nervous system takes a dip and your whole system goes nuts. He wasn't going through withdrawals in my opinion he was overdosing and had no idea. I'm sure he nor those around him told the doctors exactly what he was on because the either didnt know the pills were mislabelled or they knew. I'm not sure. Definitely don't trust anyone."

*

Remember the incident with the percocet withdrawal symptoms running around PP naked complaining he was hot, right after his hip surgery, in 2010, which was mentioned in the report?

*

She also said:

"Just from looking at pictures I would guestimate other issues (either same hip or the other one) started manifesting as of 2012/13 on. Someone I know assisted him after surgery. Then other people came in and did not take care of him or monitor him. As far as I know, he passed away due to enablers, accidental drug purchase or on purpose? and non-care. There was obviously no one there to tell him to rest and eat. He kept going, probably because he felt scared. There was something wrong at least a year prior. If he was taking fentanyl and no percocet which he was used to, then that started a different host of problems. If you look at him 2010-12, he's in good form. Pay attention to his skin and under eyes and cane usage. After 2012 you can see changes and not just from ageing."

"He treated people poorly so that made people less sympathetic towards his pill use."

"To say something when the plane goes down is TOO LATE. To not keep him in the hospital is TOO LATE. And I know many people here would say "Well if I was there..." The fact is probably not. He did allow these people in, for a reason. Very few would have stood up. I know of only two and they were dismissed."

"

My point is this - is it your job to do something illegal for anyone? No. Do we have a responsibility to each other as humans to do the right thing? I guess that depends on your moral compass and belief systems. But in the regular world, I guess, no, right? Everyman for himself.

Prince set it up that way. And if someone didn't do his bidding someone else would. So, in that respect you are correct. Would you rather do the right thing and not have a paycheck or be a willing enabler?

Prince could also be manipulated and handled. Very few people did that. Theres more to say on the subject but it would be a moot point at this time."

"I agree with all that you've said except yes the inner circle knew it was bad. Severe. As early as ten years ago".

it is illegal to prescribe meds in another person's name. Its been done for years with him.

Coming down the first time from opiod use after the surgery is what prompted "The Breakdown""

"Please allow me to clarify. He was a complicated man he wasn't a saint and he wasn't all Sinner. But he wasn't a person that should be placed on a pedestal as someone who didn't do wrong. He did plenty wrong. But he was also full of light and generosity. It was sometimes given to the wrong people. We are all nuanced individuals and he was great and terrible. Don't discount the good stuff but don't overlook what reality was. He was also an addict. Due to pain but still an addict."

I wonder who Prizefight is...

[Edited 4/23/18 10:45am]

Rebeljuice said:

I think Prince thought the OD on the plane was due to him mixing his pills. He told JH as much. I think he took a fentanyl laced pill and one of those Tylenol/Codeine pills that he declared to the docs in Moline. It took 4mg of narcan to revive him. That is a lot. If he was convinced the OD was due to the mixing (afterall, the fentanyl pill was labeled as a more innocent Vicodin), he may well have thought the "Vicodin" pills were safe on their own. Hence why he reached for them again.


As his fans we have always thought Prince to be clean living and above the temptations of drugs, alchohol, cigarettes and even meat. We have all been proud of our favourite artist's clean living and often used to mention it when in discussion with non fans. So many greats have died of drug over doses and we were proud that our Prince was not like that. This is why the last two years have been tough. This is also why so many of us have come up with conspiracy theories and alternative realities to try and explain what seems inexplicable. Prince was an habitual drug user? Impossible!

Well, the facts are in. There was no underlying illness. There was no conspiracy for murder. This was not a new problem that started a year or two before his death. Prince was addicted to opioids for a long time and his denial combined with his need for utter secrecy meant that there was no help for him until it was too late. Our clean living Prince wasn't as clean as we thought and in a way that really pisses me off.

I have no doubt it all started with pain. But as someone pointed out in this thread, it seemed that pain was no longer at the forefront of the problem. Prince was simply addicted and needed his drugs to prevent the chaos of withdrawals. I don't think it was about obtaining a high. Opioids are not like heroin or extacy or acid. There isn't really a high as such. But when you get to the stage where you need to take the pills in order to function normally, then you know there is a problem. Without the pills all hell breaks loose. With them life can almost feel normal. Not entirely normal mind you because there are side affects and consequences - constipation, sleeplessness, paranoia, groginess etc. But those side affects are a lot more palitable than withdrawals. And when you think you are in control and in denial about the extent of the problem, there is no reason to seek help.

Maybe someone will grow some balls and tell the truth behind it all one day. Or maybe there isn't anyone to tell the truth behind it all because no one actually knows the full extent of his problems - just how Prince wanted it. And that is what pisses me off. Prince painted a clean living image of himself and put everything at risk to keep that persona alive, even when the walls were crumbling down around him. He would rather be a hypocrite and lie than hold his hand up and say "ok, I got a few issues. im gonna go away for a while, get well and come back even stronger". But he didn't.

After two years of speculation and guess work to try and make Prince, the persona, fit into this drug narrative, we end up back where we started. The only real story here is the one that came out the day he died - Prince died of a drug overdose. And that is all there is to it because if you are addicted to any kind of drug, there is a very good chance that drug will kill you in the end, especially if you deny there is a problem and refuse help from anyone. The hows and whys dont really matter anymore. An investigation took place and there was nothing to find except a deeply secretive drug user who had trouble facing up to his problems. Prince was an addict that lost the fight. It's as simple as that.

Agree !

ThatWhiteDude said:

http://www.chicagotribune...story.html Prince's "friends" were enablers

.

Sorry, WhiteDude: I posted that article before I saw your post.