RepoMan said:

In Brown v. Board of Education, in overturning Plessy v. Ferguson (the separate-but-equal doctrine resulting in the legal sanctioning of segregation) the Supreme Court considered scientific evidence introduced by the plaintiff. Among the evidence: when presented with a black doll and a white doll, black children invariably preferred the white doll because they considered the black doll -- which favored them -- to be "bad." Black folk have been lampooned for their kinky hair, facial features, skin tone, and lips for centuries. American history is rife laws and traditions where whites abd blacks have classified people on the basis of their skin tone, hair texture, etc.

It's fairly obvious that self-image has been a huge issue in the black community from day one.

This is why Calhoun and others are saying that these cosmetic changes can imply more than the average body/image issues that non-black women may have. You can't necessarily conclude one way or the other for any given individual, but that's true.

RepoMan said:

Look man, if she'd just gotten her boobs done I wouldn't really give a shit. Do your boobs, dye your hair - whatever...

BUT... when you do the combo of lightening your skin, chiseling away @ your nose, wearing colored contacts & being blonde??? Do you not see that pointing in a direction as far away from Black as possible? Are the things that Kim & MJ have done to themselves normal to you????

And don't think I don't know that some Black people are born with those traits - damn near White skin & blue eyes, but there's usually some other genes floating around to bring that about... which brings it all back to the notion of White is right.

I don't know why this shit is so difficult for some of you muthas

missfee said:

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I hope you are joking. !!!! If you looked up white woman in the dictionary that picture would be right there.

Rinluv said:

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You were thinking wrong. P is a light skin black man who get a shade or two darker when he gets out in the sun.

Kim is a nut who went from being a pretty dark-skinned black woman to looking like a white freak to be accepted by society.

It kills me how MJ gets greif for what he did to himself and Kim gets a pass.

They are both sick.

I don't normally like to say things like this but honestly, that bird's hangin'!

CalhounSq said:

If she just got her boobs done you wouldn't give a shit, but now you care, because...? How does anything she does to her own body reflect on you?

One day Kim's a blonde, the other day a brunette, then she has black hair and sometimes it's even fuckin' BLUE. I've seen her with dark brown eyes, light brown, grey, green and blue. Lil Kim never looks the same two days in a row. Look at her website (www.lilkim.com), you can see two recent pics of her. One with blonde/light brown hair and one with black. In one she has really light skin and the other with a skin color closer to her natural color. If the pic of her with the black hair and darker skin color would have been on the cover of Blender you wouldn't have come up with ridiculous theories on how she hates her African appearance. Then again, maybe you would have been trippin' because she has straight hair. Who the fuck knows. Seems like some people always find something to bitch about.

As far as if I think what she's doing is normal? No, not exactly, but I didn't think it was normal when she was performing with barely any clothes on either or was that portraying black people as you like to see it? Does this look like any kind of role model to you?


Click on the picture for a bigger (not suitable for work) picture.

These people make millions of dollars because they have something that makes them stand out. I don't expect them to do a lot of things that are "normal". A celebrity is not "normal" per definition.

RepoMan said:

RepoMan said:

Out of all these people, you make the most sense. I certainly am not going to fucking apologize for being blonde with blue eyes. This whole thing is so fucking retarded. She looks BETTER to me. Don't agree with me? TOUGH SHIT.

SassyBritches said:

first off, this thread is still goin?!?!!

ok and thats a good point that i NEVER thought of. maybe she felt she was born in2 the wrong race, like gender confused people feel they were born in2 the wrong gender, but in a way that makes no sense to me cuz how can you FEEL white? i understand how i boy could feel like he wants to be a girl and vice versa, but how can u FEEL u shoulda been white? the only way THAT makes sense to me is that she felt she needed to have the euro look in order to fit in and be excepted, which still makes no sense cuz she has been accepted already. i guess we'll never know, but i will say one thing, the biggest issue here is the skin thing, its like, if a girl wants to be a boy some people might be up in arms about it but its not as serious as a black wanting to be a white. yes women have been discriminated against thru out history, but if u were a white woman u had it better than a black woman. blacks, however, no matter the gender have always seemed to have it bad one way or another, and with her lightening her skin its a bit of a fuck u to all the people who fought 4 our rights, and fought to show us that we are human and beautiful. in the end the BIGGEST problem here is the skin/race thing, how she seemed to go from darker girl, to lighter girl, and the skin coupled with the nose job and the hair, and even to some extent the lips, makes it seem like she wants to be, or atleast look white.

gemini13 said:

Nobody's asking you to apologize for WHO YOU ARE - I assume you were born that way right? It'd be different if you went out & bought it along w/ multiple surgeries like Kim did. God, this is so easy people...



THAT says a lot

RepoMan said:

I never said white people never crossed that line. The only reason I brought Pam Anderson into this is because of the quote where Kim wanted to be Pam Anderson, whom as I pointed out, has her own issues.

Common sense would tell you the difference between making some minor "enhancements" as opposed to completely altering your looks, or deconstruction. Again it's the lesser of two evils. Kim has crossed the line and then some. Changing your hair styles and colors, even wearing different colored contacts is one thing but when you get into the nose and lip jobs.... If you can't see that Kim and MJ have changed themselves to the point they'd be unrecognizable had we not seen the transition or been told who they are ,then we've really got nothing to discuss.

whodknee said:

If you compare Lil Kim to MJ than you must be on crack. Kim still looks like Kim. If you feel there's nothing to discuss then feel free go to sit in the corner and just shut up.

uPtoWnNY said:
Well how many white girls do you see nappin' their hair and permanemtly darkening their skin(and I don't mean tanning)? They're very happy with being white. Many blacks have a poor self-image. They'll destroy their looks to attain the American standard of beauty(light skin, blonds hair, blue eyes). At some point in their lives, they got the idea black isn't beautiful. To me, they are a discrace. Some of you will never understand.

Well,If they're soooo happy to be white then, why even bother tanning at all?? That to me seems like the worst thing a white person trying to preserve their whiteness could do and yet, they risk skin cancer and premature wrinkles in doing so. I know white girls who religiously tan and get as dark as (and some of them even darker than) me. I know its not permanent but it may as well be because you NEVER EVER see them without dark skin and it's a billion dollar business.

Some white women also get collagen to make their lips larger (and larger lips are definitely not a natural white feature).

She's looking extra dark and I've seen other pics of her like this too. She also has implants.



Is this nappy enough?



Fake blue eyes, fake hair color, fake hair in general and btw she also has a tan.


I know white girls who get relaxers (just like black women) on their kinky/frizzy hair and SO MANY white women wear hair extensions and get their noses done. So, how do you explain that? Black women who do those things in your opinion are trying to be white so, are white women just trying to be whiter or what?
But, of course white women CAN'T possibly have body image issues just like every other woman on the planet because after all they are white.

gemini13 said:

Of course she looks better to you, because she's more white-looking in that photo. It's not what I would call beautiful. Kim was a beautiful black woman who f-d herself up. And like Calhoun said, your being white isn't the issue here. What we're trying to get through to you is some blacks have bought into the negative sh!t associated with their color. They have a poor self-image, and do whatever they can to become what's considered "normal"(white-looking). I've yet to meet a white person unhappy with being white. I guess you have to live it to understand, Calhoun.

VanitySixx said:

C'mon, you consider that dark???

uPtoWnNY said:

So you're unhappy being black? How does that have anything to do with Lil Kim? Stop projecting your own issues on her.

uPtoWnNY said:

who christina? she looks darker in that picture then prince or alicia keys and her hair looks nappier then either of theirs too
[Edited 9/24/05 7:08am]

Bootylicious must be dying for a segue to talk about her fat ass.

I'm gonna save this one to my hard drive before it goes to Heaven.

laurarichardson said:

Here are two recent pics of her. Lil Kim is still black, MJ isn't. That's the difference.

RepoMan said:

mj has vitiligo. thats the difference. lil kim intentionally lightened her skin



[Edited 9/24/05 8:03am]

hellomoto said:

VanitySixx said:

ok see, u haven't even been listening have u?
the BIGGEST problem here is that she LIGHTENED her skin, for a BLACK person to do that is HIGHLY offensive to many, given our history.
white people haven't been told dark is right, dark is beautiful, this is what u should be.
however blacks have been told light is better and white is right, so there4 many blacks tend to have a color complex.
this whole tanning thing IMO has NOTHING to do with wanting to be of another race, it has more to do with the latest fad. tanning right now is a fad, the HOT thing to do, just like rockin a jerri in the 80's was a fad, and being a blonde was a fad. and when this fad comes to pass and another one comes along, many of the women who tan will jump off the bandwagon and onto the next big thing.

hellomoto said:

finally someone brought that up. i didnt want to mention it w/o the pics, thanx hellomoto and by the way repoman, yes ur right kim is still black, but so is mj. things can happen or be done to your skin, but not ur dna. both are still black even if they dont look it

Prospect said:

she'd play you like a sucka... er uhm sucker...


she makes martha look like a farm animal

Moonwalkbjrain said:

In fact the complex of some is so big that when they see another black person like Lil Kim who has had some cosmetic enhancements, they project their own insecurities onto them.



Neither do having a nose job, breast implants and wearing a wig.

Moonwalkbjrain said
ok see, u haven't even been listening have u?
the BIGGEST problem here is that she LIGHTENED her skin, for a BLACK person to do that is HIGHLY offensive to many, given our history.
white people haven't been told dark is right, dark is beautiful, this is what u should be.
however blacks have been told light is better and white is right, so there4 many blacks tend to have a color complex.
this whole tanning thing IMO has NOTHING to do with wanting to be of another race, it has more to do with the latest fad. tanning right now is a fad, the HOT thing to do, just like rockin a jerri in the 80's was a fad, and being a blonde was a fad. and when this fad comes to pass and another one comes along, many of the women who tan will jump off the bandwagon and onto the next big thing.[/quote]

Yeah, I have been listening.

First of all litte kim did NOT lighten her skin. Her skin is lighter in photos but, if you see her on tv she is STILL dark.

Secondly, whites have been tanning forever, tanning salons have been around forever it is not a fad.

I've personally heard white people complain about having white "pasty" skin and NEEDING a tan. I've heard white people refer to others as "pasty" and saying they NEED a tan. I've had white people tell me that I have a nice complexion and am lucky because I don't have to tan. I've had white people put their arms next to mine to compare color and brag about how tan they are so alot of them definitely believe that having color is better. I do doubt, however that they want to be black just as much as I doubt that a black person (or a Mexican person or an Indian person or a Puerto Rican person...)who has dark skin and wishes they could lighten their skin some wants to be white. You can find a person of almost ANY race who has skin color issues and it doesn't mean they want to change their race they just want to change their skin tone wether thats making it lighter (which I've never even heard is possible) or tanning to make it darker.

it clear that some don't understand the issues of images in the black community to understand why some take this issue to heart. Its not just simply about Lil Kim but there's a history behind all of this. From only lightened women dancing at the cotton club, to the "paper bad test", etc. to having to actually verbalize "Say it loud, I'm black and I'm proud".


There is an issue.

Rhondab said:

The black community? Damn, no one gave me a membership when I was born. How can I join?

RepoMan said:

[flame snipped. - anx]