TrevorAyer said:

ThirdStrike said:

TrevorAyer said:

I'd be surprised if wb even has a legal right to release anything beyond the remaster. Clearly most of it is bootleg sourced and not approved by prince. Wb probebly assumes noone will care or notice with all the legal mess. Prince would not release bootleg sourced material. No way

When I hear "bootleg sourced", I have to smile at its irony. I mean, think about it. Bootlegs themselves have to come from a source, right? And if you're sourcing from a bootleg, arent you really sourcing from the source itself?! Now pass that joint...

.

If really they have sourced stuff from b00tlegs, which is yet to be determined, then that would be highly unprofessional.

Nothing to smile about.

WB has access to the source so why not work with them?

I still hear nothing about any work on the vault contents.

Listing them.

Restoring them.

Copying them.

So how important is that vault?

.

I can draw a parallel to the yet unresolved Fukushima disaster.

I hear nothing about international actions, funding to stop this nuclear mishap.

Despite what peopel say this disaster is bigger than Chernobyl.

Apparantly people do not care or do not recognise the still present threat to the world as a whole from this site alone.

So how important is a nuclear-safe Fukushima site?

jillybean said:

stesa said:

This question may have been asked before,

but does anyone know why Our Destiny and Roadhouse Garden are one and the same track?

They certainly aren't one song,

they don't even sound like they were meant to be on the same album; Our Destiny really sounds like a Possessed kind of Purple Rain-ish track,

Roadhouse Garden, we all know, belongs somewhere later, after ATWIAD ...

Were they meant to be put together on a later album? ...

I have no idea if this helps, but from PrinceVault.com:

"Although tracked separately in the studio [Roadhouse Garden] seems to have purposively conjoined with Our Destiny. This is the case for the live version and the two songs (using the same four-on-the-floor bass drumbeat) were also mixed together segueing into one another in the studio rendition."

Hey, thanks a lot jillybean!

ThirdStrike said:

TrevorAyer said:

I'd be surprised if wb even has a legal right to release anything beyond the remaster. Clearly most of it is bootleg sourced and not approved by prince. Wb probebly assumes noone will care or notice with all the legal mess. Prince would not release bootleg sourced material. No way

When I hear "bootleg sourced", I have to smile at its irony. I mean, think about it. Bootlegs themselves have to come from a source, right? And if you're sourcing from a bootleg, arent you really sourcing from the source itself?! Now pass that joint...

Gut not the original source. That's the rub. S the term we regularly use is okay. And we know what it means. Bootlegged source means it will never be og source, aka oristine, primo, perfect, because it isnt from the orignal recording etc.

rdhull said:

ThirdStrike said:

rdhull said:

Gut not the original source. That's the rub. S the term we regularly use is okay. And we know what it means. Bootlegged source means it will never be og source, aka oristine, primo, perfect, because it isnt from the orignal recording etc.

Understood. At the same time though, there's nothing that would ever convince me that the estate would need to source an officially released track from one that is anything other then original. I'll never believe it. Makes no sense to me to even have to...

Um, if the original is lost, stolen, damaged or destroyed... there's 4 reasons. This is not a rare thing even for official releases.

In this case, if WB have access to a 2nd generation source and do not have access to the master then they would be sourcing from "other than original".

ThirdStrike said:

rdhull said:

Gut not the original source. That's the rub. S the term we regularly use is okay. And we know what it means. Bootlegged source means it will never be og source, aka oristine, primo, perfect, because it isnt from the orignal recording etc.

Understood. At the same time though, there's nothing that would ever convince me that the estate would need to source an officially released track from one that is anything other then original. I'll never believe it. Makes no sense to me to even have to...

Maybe that because you lack the technical knowledge to make such an assessment?

bluegangsta said:

ThirdStrike said:

rdhull said: Understood. At the same time though, there's nothing that would ever convince me that the estate would need to source an officially released track from one that is anything other then original. I'll never believe it. Makes no sense to me to even have to...

Maybe that because you lack the technical knowledge to make such an assessment?

.
I can absolutely imagine that 'Our Destiny' is not sourced from the original master. But as I've noted this before, another possibility is that the original mastertape is damaged, or that it was transferred using a tape machine that wasn't properly cleaned (although I'd like to rule that out, I cannot...) – and someone had tried to improve on it and ended up over-compensating for the lack of top-end.

I was just listening to 'The Dance' from 'The Chocolate Invasion' (I find this version of the song superior to the one on '3121') and this track shows very similar artefacts (a constantly fluctuating top-end) to 'Our Destiny'. And as 'The Chocolate Invasion' was obviously a release approved and compiled by Prince, we can safely assume he has used the original mastertapes. So is this an indication of the bad shape some of those tapes are in? Or possibly of the carelessness of a sound engineer who transferred the tapes to digital? Either way, it's quite disturbing.

this talk of damaged tapes seems to be based on conjecture and a few 2nd or 3rd or greater hand reports that a few times a tape was damaged. these tapes can and do last for decades even if just on a shelf... I would put very little stock in these stories.

As to some issues with sound quality? Really? have you listened to 1999 or SOTT?

and remember Prince himself has said that many of them are not really finished. and the mixes maybe not final.

OnlyNDaUsa said:

this talk of damaged tapes seems to be based on conjecture and a few 2nd or 3rd or greater hand reports that a few times a tape was damaged. these tapes can and do last for decades even if just on a shelf... I would put very little stock in these stories.

As to some issues with sound quality? Really? have you listened to 1999 or SOTT?

and remember Prince himself has said that many of them are not really finished. and the mixes maybe not final.

.
You seem to forget that there can be many different kinds of issues with sound quality and some of us here are able to differentiate between the side-effects of a poor mix or overload during tracking or a damaged tape or poor dynamics compression or poor quality file encoding etc, etc.

The sound issues with 'Our Destiny' (and TCI version of 'The Dance', for example) are typical of issues that can arise when working with analog tapes. Whether it's the original master tape that's damaged, or perhaps the tape recorder (usually a Studer A80) used for digitising the tape wasn't cleaned properly (unlikely), or whether a low quality copy was used as a source – I don't know. These can be debated. The fact that the problem (a fluctuating loss of high end) is related to analog tape, cannot.

The issues with 1999 and SOTT are totally unrelated to the above. The issues with some of the mixes are yet another bunch of different, distinguishable problems.

Damn I hoped for another released track. I guess we'll have to wait until the release

Back to the picture disc and vinyl in general.

1.) is the 2015 180g remaster just the digital on analog or is it mastered properly for vinyl?

2.) Do we know if the picture disc is also remaster or for reasons i will never understnd... not?!

rob1965 said:

Pre-ordered the PR Expanded Deluxe edition today. Due for delivery on June 23rd.
June 7th would've been a better date

Nearly another month.

morningsong said:

morningsong said:

Silvertongue7 said:

Just 23 days. And if you order it in Amazon it will probably be available to download a couple of days earlier. And it might leak before that. Also, tomorrow would be a great date to release a new track... Maybe Velvet Kitty Kat?

Preferably not another leaked track...

mcmk785new said:

Marco81 said:

jstar69 said:

Marco81 said:

They probably got pissed off by people's reaction to the sound quality on Our Destiny / Roadhouse Garden, so I guess they want to avoid any more bad comments that could harm sales, just my 2 cents, I could be completely wrong... [Edited 6/1/17 14:42pm]

Wouldn't surprise me .....

WB1: we're gonna make a lot of money on these prince albums and outtakes in the future

WB2: yes we are, damn we've got a little goldmine here. money in the bank is what i say.

WB3: yo guys, have you seen what the org says about the cymbals on "our destiny?"

WB1, WB2, WB3:

IstenSzek said:

jstar69 said:

Marco81 said: Wouldn't surprise me .....

WB1: we're gonna make a lot of money on these prince albums and outtakes in the future

WB2: yes we are, damn we've got a little goldmine here. money in the bank is what i say.

WB3: yo guys, have you seen what the org says about the cymbals on "our destiny?"

WB1, WB2, WB3:

This is perfect! Perfect!

IstenSzek said:

jstar69 said:

Marco81 said: Wouldn't surprise me .....

WB1: we're gonna make a lot of money on these prince albums and outtakes in the future

WB2: yes we are, damn we've got a little goldmine here. money in the bank is what i say.

WB3: yo guys, have you seen what the org says about the cymbals on "our destiny?"

WB1, WB2, WB3:

genius. genius.

IstenSzek said:

WB1: we're gonna make a lot of money on these prince albums and outtakes in the future

WB2: yes we are, damn we've got a little goldmine here. money in the bank is what i say.

WB3: yo guys, have you seen what the org says about the cymbals on "our destiny?"

WB1, WB2, WB3:

good one

IstenSzek said:

jstar69 said:

Marco81 said: Wouldn't surprise me .....

WB1: we're gonna make a lot of money on these prince albums and outtakes in the future

WB2: yes we are, damn we've got a little goldmine here. money in the bank is what i say.

WB3: yo guys, have you seen what the org says about the cymbals on "our destiny?"

WB1, WB2, WB3:

dude, marry me

This'll be my playlist!

Let's Go Crazy" (special dance mix)

Take Me With U

The Beautiful Ones

Computer Blue ("Hallway Speech" version)

Darling Nikki

When Doves Cry

Purple Rain

I Would Die 4 U (extended version)

Baby I'm a Star

God (Love Theme from Purple Rain)

Erotic City ("Make Love Not War Erotic City Come Alive")

17 Days

The Dance Electric

Love And Sex

Another Lonely Christmas" (extended version)

Electric Intercourse" (studio)

Our Destiny/Roadhouse Garden

Possessed" (1983 version)

Wonderful Ass

Velvet Kitty Cat

Katrina's Paper Dolls

We Can F@$&

Father's Song

I'm psyched, haven't heard atleast half of these songs

[Edited 6/3/17 6:06am]

TheGloved1 said:

MiceElfAgin said:

OnlyNDaUsa said:

this talk of damaged tapes seems to be based on conjecture and a few 2nd or 3rd or greater hand reports that a few times a tape was damaged. these tapes can and do last for decades even if just on a shelf... I would put very little stock in these stories.

As to some issues with sound quality? Really? have you listened to 1999 or SOTT?

and remember Prince himself has said that many of them are not really finished. and the mixes maybe not final.

.
You seem to forget that there can be many different kinds of issues with sound quality and some of us here are able to differentiate between the side-effects of a poor mix or overload during tracking or a damaged tape or poor dynamics compression or poor quality file encoding etc, etc.

The sound issues with 'Our Destiny' (and TCI version of 'The Dance', for example) are typical of issues that can arise when working with analog tapes. Whether it's the original master tape that's damaged, or perhaps the tape recorder (usually a Studer A80) used for digitising the tape wasn't cleaned properly (unlikely), or whether a low quality copy was used as a source – I don't know. These can be debated. The fact that the problem (a fluctuating loss of high end) is related to analog tape, cannot.

The issues with 1999 and SOTT are totally unrelated to the above. The issues with some of the mixes are yet another bunch of different, distinguishable problems.

Could it be the byproduct of a phaser / flanger artefact leaking?
Given the speed at which he was working/recording/mixing, it is possible they didn't have the time to care about "details" (Susan Rogers said so on several occasions) and make über-pristine mixes (I would hate it, it's the home studio approach that give this organic/analog feel to most of Prince's eighties work).

As for 1999 / SOTT, I don't know what you guys are talking about. Unless you refer to the CD masterings, which are notoriously atrocious, I don't know what's wrong with their sound quality.

Prince never intended to sound as clean and clinical as Bruce Swedien, at least not before the 90's.
Don't confuse intentional mixing/artistic options (1999 the album is clearly intended to sound this murky, SOTT is intended to sound "arte povera") with technical mistakes.

[Edited 6/4/17 2:15am]