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Reply #330 posted 05/01/18 3:28pm

cloveringold85

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1Sasha said:

I have a friend whose 22-year-old son has been using since he was 13-14. He has been in rehab multiple times, been jailed for offenses committed while he was using ... He can stay clean for about six weeks on his own (or while in jail) then he is right back to it. Heroin has been his drug of choice. His parents are at a loss - they have tried everything and nothing has worked beyond those six weeks. Their hearts are breaking because they are afraid one day he will die from using.

.

That's awful, and so heartbreaking because as a parent, you feel powerless. All you can do is love them and show you care and try to lead them in the right direction--the rest is up to them.

.

One of my husband's former boss lost his young son to prescription drugs. The weird thing about it was the parents didn't really seem that upset about it; it's like they just accepted he was gone, and that's it.

.

Everyone deals with loss differently.

"With love, honor, and respect for every living thing in the universe, separation ceases, and we all become one being, singing one song." - Prince Roger Nelson (1958-2016)
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Reply #331 posted 05/01/18 3:32pm

cloveringold85

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80tomato said:

cloveringold85 said:

.

I agree. I also think that Prince did not know those Vicodin pills were laced with Fentanyl. Seems like he was concerned for his health, which prompted him to get in touch with Dr. Schulenberg on the 7th, so obviously something was worrying him.

didn't Kurt Cobain od in Rome and was saved and then a few weeks later went to a rehab clinic to get clean but then left and committed suicide...my point being maybe he ,Prince, was concerned for his health , or maybe he was just pleasing those around him

.

I haven't followed Kurt Cobain's story very closely, but he seemed to have a strong desire to leave this earth. I think he was in a lot of emotional pain, and didn't care if drugs killed him. Courtney Love wasn't exactly a good person for him to be around, but they say birds of a feather flock together. Those two were like the modern-day Sid & Nancy.

"With love, honor, and respect for every living thing in the universe, separation ceases, and we all become one being, singing one song." - Prince Roger Nelson (1958-2016)
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Reply #332 posted 05/01/18 4:25pm

Bodhitheblackd
og

80tomato said:

cloveringold85 said:

.

I agree. I also think that Prince did not know those Vicodin pills were laced with Fentanyl. Seems like he was concerned for his health, which prompted him to get in touch with Dr. Schulenberg on the 7th, so obviously something was worrying him.

didn't Kurt Cobain od in Rome and was saved and then a few weeks later went to a rehab clinic to get clean but then left and committed suicide...my point being maybe he ,Prince, was concerned for his health , or maybe he was just pleasing those around him

Personally, I NEVER thought of Prince as having a 'people pleaser' personality...he was a 24/7 control freak my-way-or-the-highway dude for 40 years plus...even an OD (or more than one) will not change personality traits and habits ingrained that deep.

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Reply #333 posted 05/01/18 4:40pm

purplerabbitho
le

I feel you oversimplify Prince a bit too much in order to support your narrative of a tragic hero akin to Macbeth..A dude who had the world, shit on people and then suffered the consequences. This is an oversimplification of the man in my opinion. Just like saying that no one gave two shits about his health, he had no friendships, and his last years were absolute misery with no good times. There was a lot of pain in his life, his friendships were complicated and conditional and somewhat limited, he was compartmentalized like no one I have ever seen, and he could be rather stubborn and difficult but he still had good times, was busting his ass to "please" his fans, could be generous and funny, and had bonding memorable moments with people. He is not some Shakespearean tragic hero stereotype as no celebrity who dies tragically is. . This new information about his last days adds more complicated layers and more tragedy but it doesn't eradicate all of the good things said about him or the good things he accomplished at the end of his life. It hopefully just makes us more weary about some of his associates (and their myriads of motives) and some of the negative trappings of fame and denial. He is not the first famous person to die from drugs and enablers. He won't be the last. But unlike some of these other folks who openly consumed drugs with their enablers, prince kept everyone away when he popped his pills, kept working until the end and compartmentalized his relationships and isolated himself at times to keep people in his life a bit unaware of the extent and method of his usage. He is not even a rocknroll stereotype.

Bodhitheblackdog said:

80tomato said:

didn't Kurt Cobain od in Rome and was saved and then a few weeks later went to a rehab clinic to get clean but then left and committed suicide...my point being maybe he ,Prince, was concerned for his health , or maybe he was just pleasing those around him

Personally, I NEVER thought of Prince as having a 'people pleaser' personality...he was a 24/7 control freak my-way-or-the-highway dude for 40 years plus...even an OD (or more than one) will not change personality traits and habits ingrained that deep.

[Edited 5/1/18 16:55pm]

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Reply #334 posted 05/01/18 4:52pm

petalthecat

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cloveringold85 said:

tmo1965 said:

This is the part that just does not add up for me. I guess denial is a strong form of self deception. Although there were signs that something was wrong with his health more than 1.5 years before he died, Prince did not start to get really sick from the pills until about 2 weeks before his death. The fact that the pills were in Aleve and Bayer bottles tells me that he was full aware that they were illegally obtained (not necessarily counterfeit) and that he was trying to hide his drug use from others - who would think twice if you saw someone taking an Aleve.

Kirk also knew that they were counterfeit pills and were the cause of Prince's recent illness because Kirk took it upon himself to doctor shop for Prince to get him some legitimate pills from Dr. S and the dentist. However, he may not have shared his concern with Prince, who continued to take the counterfeit pills. In my opinion, this implies that Kirk was the source of the counterfeit pills.

.

Good points!

.

The fact that Prince did not get into trouble until 2-weeks before he passed, tells us that he may have had a new dealer/source to get the pills. When he overdosed in Moline, he probably had no idea the pills were laced with Fentanyl, and so he took another on the 20th. He was blaming the 2 Narcan shots for his symptoms, and not the pills.

It does seem he did have a few close shaves that were covered up though. Didn't Kirk say in the hospital in Moline " We can't keep doing this"

[Edited 5/1/18 16:52pm] The last sentence is mine. No idea why it does that

[Edited 5/1/18 16:53pm]

There's always a rainbow 🌈 , at the end of every rain ☔️
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Reply #335 posted 05/01/18 4:56pm

kmama07

PeteSilas said:

last night i watched the whitney houston docu "can I be me" and it was pretty much a cliche of the burned out star who supports a leeching entourage, and dies too soon. Very sad, several times, when they spoke about how she supported people, how she had to keep going, I thought of Prince. the saddest part was when a professional bodyguard wrote his report on Whitney, detailing all the drugs she was doing, he reported his findings to the management and he got fired right there, sad as hell.


Ya. That's f***ed up. I'm sure it happens all the time.
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Reply #336 posted 05/01/18 5:05pm

cloveringold85

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petalthecat said:

cloveringold85 said:

.

Good points!

.

The fact that Prince did not get into trouble until 2-weeks before he passed, tells us that he may have had a new dealer/source to get the pills. When he overdosed in Moline, he probably had no idea the pills were laced with Fentanyl, and so he took another on the 20th. He was blaming the 2 Narcan shots for his symptoms, and not the pills.

It does seem he did have a few close shaves that were covered up though. Didn't Kirk say in the hospital in Moline " We can't keep doing this"

[Edited 5/1/18 16:52pm] The last sentence is mine. No idea why it does that

[Edited 5/1/18 16:53pm]

.

Yes, Kirk did say something like that. But then when questioned, he acts as though he didn't know Prince was taking pills or having pain. When he said "Pisses me off that Prince hid it so well."....I mean, come on!! rolleyes

.

The investigators even said a lot of his statements were conflicting. Just can't trust anyone like that, imo.

"With love, honor, and respect for every living thing in the universe, separation ceases, and we all become one being, singing one song." - Prince Roger Nelson (1958-2016)
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Reply #337 posted 05/01/18 5:13pm

PennyPurple

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CNN had this article today. It's almost as if it was written for Prince. sad

"Almost all of the increases in overdose deaths are attributed to illicitly manufactured fentanyl, not pharmaceutical fentanyl that has been misused or diverted. And we know that because the number of prescriptions for pharmaceutical fentanyl has remained relatively stable over the past decade, whereas seizures of illicitly manufactured fentanyl has skyrocketed," LaSalle said.

"So it really is due to illicitly manufactured fentanyl that is entering the market and that is essentially being mixed with heroin so that you have an adulterated product that people aren't aware of, so their risk of overdose increases substantially," she added.

This is the first time synthetic opioids have surpassed prescription opioids -- such as oxycodone and hydrocodone -- and heroin as the primary cause of opioid overdose-related deaths, according to the report.
-----------------------------

In 2016, when 46% of opioid overdose-related deaths involved synthetic opioids and 40% involved prescription drugs, 37% involved heroin, according to the report.


The synthetic drugs are primarily made outside of the country, according to LaSalle.
"Illicitly manufactured fentanyl is almost exclusively made in China," she said. "It's then shipped, broadly speaking, to Mexico, where it's added to the heroin supply before it enters the United States as a cost-saving measure."

After entering the United States, synthetic opioids often end up in places like the Midwest and Northeast, where the white powder form of the drug can easily be mixed with the white powder form of heroin or cocaine.

"In those parts of the country, you have a white powder heroin that you can mix fentanyl into pretty easily," LaSalle said. "Whereas on the West Coast, you have a black tar heroin, which is very difficult to mix the white powder into. So you just don't see the same distribution of fentanyl on the West Coast as in these other places."
------------------

"Initially when synthetic opioids showed up in the US, it was largely mixed with heroin. But now we're seeing it mixed with cocaine, methamphetamines and other substances of abuse. And in the last couple of years we've seen this proliferation of counterfeit tablets that are made to look like commonly abused prescription drugs," Jones said.

"And that's particularly concerning because people who are not regularly exposed to opioids are going to be at an increased risk of the respiratory depressant effects of opioids because they have no tolerance."
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Reply #338 posted 05/01/18 5:21pm

tmo1965

petalthecat said:

cloveringold85 said:

.

Good points!

.

The fact that Prince did not get into trouble until 2-weeks before he passed, tells us that he may have had a new dealer/source to get the pills. When he overdosed in Moline, he probably had no idea the pills were laced with Fentanyl, and so he took another on the 20th. He was blaming the 2 Narcan shots for his symptoms, and not the pills.

It does seem he did have a few close shaves that were covered up though. Didn't Kirk say in the hospital in Moline " We can't keep doing this"

[Edited 5/1/18 16:52pm] The last sentence is mine. No idea why it does that

[Edited 5/1/18 16:53pm]

Yes Kirk did say that. I know of the one in 2013 where Prince was taken to the hospital. It's listed on the Carver County Prince Investigation site. Maybe there were other incidents that perhaps they didn't call 911, but took him to the hospital instead.

My 1st impression with Kirk's comment was that he may have been saying this in front of Judith because he was trying to make her think that he just then realized that Prince had a problem.

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Reply #339 posted 05/01/18 6:15pm

purplerabbitho
le

maybe we need some context here, how do we know he didn't mean that he hid it well THIS TIME. MAYBE THE COPS JUST DON'T KNOW HOW SECRETIVE AND COMPARTMENTALIZED OF A MAN P WAS, SO THE CONTRADICTIONS ARE NOT TYPICAL TO THEM

cloveringold85 said:

petalthecat said:

[Edited 5/1/18 16:52pm] The last sentence is mine. No idea why it does that

[Edited 5/1/18 16:53pm]

.

Yes, Kirk did say something like that. But then when questioned, he acts as though he didn't know Prince was taking pills or having pain. When he said "Pisses me off that Prince hid it so well."....I mean, come on!! rolleyes

.

The investigators even said a lot of his statements were conflicting. Just can't trust anyone like that, imo.

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Reply #340 posted 05/01/18 8:13pm

ISaidLifeIsJus
tAGame

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The audio on the taped interviews are painful to the ears.


Im beginning to think they did it on purpose so we wouldnt listen.


Aye, Aye, Aye.

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Reply #341 posted 05/01/18 9:27pm

Janie

Addiction is a horrible disease. On CNN Sunday night they showed where opiates actually change your brain. The people who were on the show had used medical marijuana to get off the opiates and it worked. Of course several were still against it being used. I had a brother who killed himself due to opiates. Something needs to be done to fight this epedemic. My brother had been to rehab. Sadly accidental or not people are dying. I choose to remember the good about Prince and his music. It was his choice to get help or not. You cannot make a 57 year old man do anything they dont want to do. I pray he is at peace now.

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Reply #342 posted 05/01/18 9:35pm

PurpleDiamonds
1

poppys said:



jtfolden said:






In Moline Prince admitted there was "something else" in the Bayer bottle when Kirk said all he had taked was percocet. They DID take a pill to identify it but they did so by appearance only. They did not test the ingredients in it.



Also, ALL the counterfeit pills Prince had were actually lidocaine. *Some* of them were laced with Fentenyl. There is no real evidence at all that Prince knew they were anything at all but what he expected.

If you read all the interviews you also know that Prince was in denial that the meds were the issue. In Moline he insisted he was just "dreaming" and would have come out of it ok and he stated the Narcan is what messed him up...(also, see Prince's comments about "knowing his own body" and how it reacts to the meds in defense). To Dr S it wasn't the pills making him vomit, it was bad soup, etc...

So, if it seems like people were dragging their feet to get him help, a lot of it is likely because he was dragging his to admit he had a problem. It's not like anyone could force him to do anything and it probably took moving mountains to even get him to take a blood test.



Also he was complaining of tingling and numbness. Lidocaine can cause numbness and the dosage was all off anyway, since it was used to cut the Fentanyl.

The source of the pills was not found. Apparently no one else died from that batch - that they could find. That makes me think he got the pills overseas from a person. If they were on the web, more people probably would have died that they could track. The counterfeits were mixed with the legits, so maybe he topped off his supply recently, before Moline. Drug users have a terrible fear of running out, same as alcoholics.


IMO...Prince had no idea there were bad fentanyl pills and someone else gave him those pills - he had no idea why he felt sick and was trying to figure out the cause...even going to the dr for tests, Fluids etc Then when he came home that night he had taken the meds which seems like he was given those laced pills on purpose.
There was even a text shown from Kirks phone asking how to take the prescriptions he just got...that to me does not fit someone who is addicted to meds...he seemed cautious not careless.
[Edited 5/1/18 21:43pm]
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Reply #343 posted 05/01/18 9:42pm

XxAxX

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sigh i thought i'd be able to do it but honestly i haven't been able to review the entire file. sad i guess i was overconfident going into this. it really pains me.

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Reply #344 posted 05/01/18 9:58pm

PeteSilas

XxAxX said:

sigh i thought i'd be able to do it but honestly i haven't been able to review the entire file. sad i guess i was overconfident going into this. it really pains me.

why not? me neither but i'll get to it, it's a lot of stuff and much of it's dull and boring but it's a must read for me.

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Reply #345 posted 05/01/18 10:16pm

PurpleDiamonds
1

XxAxX said:

sigh i thought i'd be able to do it but honestly i haven't been able to review the entire file. sad i guess i was overconfident going into this. it really pains me.


With you on this...tears still fall at times. I have only read what others have posted on here.
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Reply #346 posted 05/01/18 11:59pm

nuthinbuttamuf
fin

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Apologies for repeating any content. I used search on this thread and all other parts and cannot find what I am looking for.

But there is talk of the investigation transcripts from Sheila and Kiran... i cannot see them in the Carver County downloads. Can anyone point me in the right direction?

----------

AND I GOTTA ALOTTA BUTTA 2 GO!
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Reply #347 posted 05/02/18 1:31am

TheEnglishGent

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cloveringold85 said:

80tomato said:

didn't Kurt Cobain od in Rome and was saved and then a few weeks later went to a rehab clinic to get clean but then left and committed suicide...my point being maybe he ,Prince, was concerned for his health , or maybe he was just pleasing those around him

.

I haven't followed Kurt Cobain's story very closely, but he seemed to have a strong desire to leave this earth. I think he was in a lot of emotional pain, and didn't care if drugs killed him. Courtney Love wasn't exactly a good person for him to be around, but they say birds of a feather flock together. Those two were like the modern-day Sid & Nancy.


Modern day? You want to feel old? Kurt Cobain died 24 years ago, in 1994. Sid Vicious died in 1979, so there were 15 years between Sid dying and Kurt dying. We are 9 years further from Kurt Cobains death than Kurt Cobain's death was from Sid Vicious'.

Time flies!

RIP sad
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Reply #348 posted 05/02/18 2:24am

nicolette

nuthinbuttamuffin said:


Apologies for repeating any content. I used search on this thread and all other parts and cannot find what I am looking for.



But there is talk of the investigation transcripts from Sheila and Kiran... i cannot see them in the Carver County downloads. Can anyone point me in the right direction?







Some transcripts of the interviews can only be found in the investigation reports (there’s two of those), you can find them in #5
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Reply #349 posted 05/02/18 2:42am

OperatingTheta
n

XxAxX said:

sigh i thought i'd be able to do it but honestly i haven't been able to review the entire file. sad i guess i was overconfident going into this. it really pains me.



I wasn't able to either and I'm not sure it's necessarily healthy, at least for me. I think I've just decided to remember and reconnect with the music now, and all its given to me and meant to me throughout my life.
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Reply #350 posted 05/02/18 2:48am

purplethunder3
121

avatar

OperatingThetan said:

XxAxX said:

sigh i thought i'd be able to do it but honestly i haven't been able to review the entire file. sad i guess i was overconfident going into this. it really pains me.

I wasn't able to either and I'm not sure it's necessarily healthy, at least for me. I think I've just decided to remember and reconnect with the music now, and all its given to me and meant to me throughout my life.

yeahthat

"Music gives a soul to the universe, wings to the mind, flight to the imagination and life to everything." --Plato
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Reply #351 posted 05/02/18 2:49am

Lovejunky

Sympathetic Article...

MINNEAPOLIS — After Prince had to be revived from a drug overdose a week before his death, one friend told the musical superstar that he needed to stop taking painkillers. But Prince said he couldn’t — his hands hurt so much that if he quit, he’d have to stop performing.

“This piano tour I think was getting to his hands,” singer Judith Hill told investigators, according to a transcript of her interview.

Washington Post

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Reply #352 posted 05/02/18 2:51am

MMJas

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nuthinbuttamuffin said:

Apologies for repeating any content. I used search on this thread and all other parts and cannot find what I am looking for.

But there is talk of the investigation transcripts from Sheila and Kiran... i cannot see them in the Carver County downloads. Can anyone point me in the right direction?

I don't think there are any transcripts for those two.

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Reply #353 posted 05/02/18 2:53am

MMJas

avatar

Anyone read Apples IG post?

https://www.instagram.com/p/BiQL3yuBJrA/?hl=pt&taken-by=apollonia_kotero

"Prince was guiding me to write my memoirs. He signed with Barnes & Noble, Chris Jackson. Prince asked me to STOP telling my stories to the press (2014) because they were priceless (I’m quoting him) I have his email reminding me of this🤣Prince explained his literary deal to me . I was shocked 😳 he was actually going to write his biography!?! He said my memoirs would be released within a year after his were released. He was going to “handle” my deal for my bio. I was actually terrified of the exposure this would bring. He reassured me YOU , our friends would appreciate it. He only got as far as 50 pages💔 Looks like it may be released for the Holidays. I asked him to be kind to me in his book 😝 He just responded: Da da daaaa!!! 😂 Oh man , first time speaking my truth about this particular subject. It’s time 🙏🏽💜☔️👑 It’s time for me to follow “all” of his instructions and plans. I have not out of respect because I felt it was too soon and my mourning process has been incredibly difficult 💔"

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Reply #354 posted 05/02/18 4:30am

PennyPurple

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MMJas said:

Anyone read Apples IG post?

https://www.instagram.com/p/BiQL3yuBJrA/?hl=pt&taken-by=apollonia_kotero

"Prince was guiding me to write my memoirs. He signed with Barnes & Noble, Chris Jackson. Prince asked me to STOP telling my stories to the press (2014) because they were priceless (I’m quoting him) I have his email reminding me of this🤣Prince explained his literary deal to me . I was shocked 😳 he was actually going to write his biography!?! He said my memoirs would be released within a year after his were released. He was going to “handle” my deal for my bio. I was actually terrified of the exposure this would bring. He reassured me YOU , our friends would appreciate it. He only got as far as 50 pages💔 Looks like it may be released for the Holidays. I asked him to be kind to me in his book 😝 He just responded: Da da daaaa!!! 😂 Oh man , first time speaking my truth about this particular subject. It’s time 🙏🏽💜☔️👑 It’s time for me to follow “all” of his instructions and plans. I have not out of respect because I felt it was too soon and my mourning process has been incredibly difficult 💔"

I'm sure she'll be putting a book out anytime now.

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Reply #355 posted 05/02/18 5:02am

Bodhitheblackd
og

PennyPurple said:

MMJas said:

Anyone read Apples IG post?

https://www.instagram.com/p/BiQL3yuBJrA/?hl=pt&taken-by=apollonia_kotero

"Prince was guiding me to write my memoirs. He signed with Barnes & Noble, Chris Jackson. Prince asked me to STOP telling my stories to the press (2014) because they were priceless (I’m quoting him) I have his email reminding me of this🤣Prince explained his literary deal to me . I was shocked 😳 he was actually going to write his biography!?! He said my memoirs would be released within a year after his were released. He was going to “handle” my deal for my bio. I was actually terrified of the exposure this would bring. He reassured me YOU , our friends would appreciate it. He only got as far as 50 pages💔 Looks like it may be released for the Holidays. I asked him to be kind to me in his book 😝 He just responded: Da da daaaa!!! 😂 Oh man , first time speaking my truth about this particular subject. It’s time 🙏🏽💜☔️👑 It’s time for me to follow “all” of his instructions and plans. I have not out of respect because I felt it was too soon and my mourning process has been incredibly difficult 💔"

I'm sure she'll be putting a book out anytime now.

Hey, Penny, WE should write a book about our experiences on Prince.Org participating in The Most Beautiful book club thread.People HAVE TO KNOW OUR TRUTH.

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Reply #356 posted 05/02/18 5:44am

tmo1965

MMJas said:

nuthinbuttamuffin said:

Apologies for repeating any content. I used search on this thread and all other parts and cannot find what I am looking for.

But there is talk of the investigation transcripts from Sheila and Kiran... i cannot see them in the Carver County downloads. Can anyone point me in the right direction?

I don't think there are any transcripts for those two.

Yes, they were in the summaries, but they did not publish the transcripts or recordings.

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Reply #357 posted 05/02/18 5:54am

PennyPurple

avatar

Bodhitheblackdog said:

PennyPurple said:

I'm sure she'll be putting a book out anytime now.

Hey, Penny, WE should write a book about our experiences on Prince.Org participating in The Most Beautiful book club thread.People HAVE TO KNOW OUR TRUTH.

lol

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Reply #358 posted 05/02/18 6:04am

tmo1965

PurpleDiamonds1 said:

poppys said:

Also he was complaining of tingling and numbness. Lidocaine can cause numbness and the dosage was all off anyway, since it was used to cut the Fentanyl.

The source of the pills was not found. Apparently no one else died from that batch - that they could find. That makes me think he got the pills overseas from a person. If they were on the web, more people probably would have died that they could track. The counterfeits were mixed with the legits, so maybe he topped off his supply recently, before Moline. Drug users have a terrible fear of running out, same as alcoholics.

IMO...Prince had no idea there were bad fentanyl pills and someone else gave him those pills - he had no idea why he felt sick and was trying to figure out the cause...even going to the dr for tests, Fluids etc Then when he came home that night he had taken the meds which seems like he was given those laced pills on purpose. There was even a text shown from Kirks phone asking how to take the prescriptions he just got...that to me does not fit someone who is addicted to meds...he seemed cautious not careless. [Edited 5/1/18 21:43pm]

When I read that text, I was under the assumption that Kirk had seen the doctor for himself also, because he said something to the effect of "am I supposed to take all 3 of these". I believe that Kirk also went a CVS pharmacy before he went Walgreens. The Walgreens trip was for Prince. Of course after reading dozens of pages of transcripts, I could have my info confused on what happened when.

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Reply #359 posted 05/02/18 6:25am

kmama07

Janie said:

Addiction is a horrible disease. On CNN Sunday night they showed where opiates actually change your brain. The people who were on the show had used medical marijuana to get off the opiates and it worked. Of course several were still against it being used. I had a brother who killed himself due to opiates. Something needs to be done to fight this epedemic. My brother had been to rehab. Sadly accidental or not people are dying. I choose to remember the good about Prince and his music. It was his choice to get help or not. You cannot make a 57 year old man do anything they dont want to do. I pray he is at peace now.


I'm so very sorry about your brother.
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Forums > Prince: Music and More > No murder charge in prince's death Investigation Discussion - Continued - Part 9