Krystalkisses said:

violetcrush said:

He loved being mysterious and hard to figure out - honest with his lyrics, but purposely cryptic so as not to divulge the subject or too much information. I'm sure he loved that everyone thought he wrote the song during the Musicology period. No secrets revealed that way

He was a master manipulator.

Yes, he was - definitely displayed some Sociopathic behavior. But, I think with regard to his songs it was more about protecting the anonymity and privacy of the subject, which I think is admirable. He was willing to share his personal feelings and experiences, but still protected those involved with him.

NotACleverName said:

Wow...this thread has meandered way off the intended topic the past 10 or so pages! I'll bring it back around with some personal insight on opioid use. I have several debilitating, painful conditions and have been using narcotic medication for over 10 years (I also take other meds to manage my health). And, notwithstanding a medical miracle, will likely be on them for the remainder of my days. So, that is proof that someone CAN use this medication long term w/o any major ill effects. Potentially, there could be some issues, as with any med, so my doctor does a complete blood panel (or whatever it's called!) every year to check for any abnormalities. PennyPurple mentioned that some here have probably unknowingly interacted with someone currently taking a narcotic. She's 100% correct as opioids do not "alter" the mind in an obvious way. They haven't compromised my ability to carry on and follow a conversation. I remember birthdays and appointments. My house and I are clean. I am employed, show up and even perform better than some coworkers. I am not a blithering idiot. I am a functioning, productive member of society. I don't share this information with many....for the obvious reasons. Even though I manage my medication (rigidly) there are some who will label me unjustly because of their prejudice toward what they deem a "drug user". I don't have the time or patience for that nor do I feel the need to explain myself. Nobody knows a person's challenges and until you have had to eliminate activities from your life because of pain/mobility issues, don't judge. While I understand Prince was not under the continued care of a doctor, which can change the outcome of the use of narcotics, I believe there are those who use non prescribed opioids unbeknownst to even their most intimate relations. And this simply boils down to the fact that there are really no obvious outward negative effects. Having said that, I would bet that he had been using on and off for a few decades; however, the last few years his use was probably daily/continuous.

Appreciate your candidness, and personal story. Your mention of successfully sustaining prescription pain meds under managed care by a Physician is a key point, I think, and very important. Without that, it seems likely the "slippery slope" to addiction and the likelihood of obtaining the meds elsewhere comes in to play. Curious as to your thoughts on Prince's addiction stemming from the recovery of his hip surgery.

[Snip - luv4u]

NotACleverName said:

Wow...this thread has meandered way off the intended topic the past 10 or so pages! I'll bring it back around with some personal insight on opioid use. I have several debilitating, painful conditions and have been using narcotic medication for over 10 years (I also take other meds to manage my health). And, notwithstanding a medical miracle, will likely be on them for the remainder of my days. So, that is proof that someone CAN use this medication long term w/o any major ill effects. Potentially, there could be some issues, as with any med, so my doctor does a complete blood panel (or whatever it's called!) every year to check for any abnormalities. PennyPurple mentioned that some here have probably unknowingly interacted with someone currently taking a narcotic. She's 100% correct as opioids do not "alter" the mind in an obvious way. They haven't compromised my ability to carry on and follow a conversation. I remember birthdays and appointments. My house and I are clean. I am employed, show up and even perform better than some coworkers. I am not a blithering idiot. I am a functioning, productive member of society. I don't share this information with many....for the obvious reasons. Even though I manage my medication (rigidly) there are some who will label me unjustly because of their prejudice toward what they deem a "drug user". I don't have the time or patience for that nor do I feel the need to explain myself. Nobody knows a person's challenges and until you have had to eliminate activities from your life because of pain/mobility issues, don't judge. While I understand Prince was not under the continued care of a doctor, which can change the outcome of the use of narcotics, I believe there are those who use non prescribed opioids unbeknownst to even their most intimate relations. And this simply boils down to the fact that there are really no obvious outward negative effects. Having said that, I would bet that he had been using on and off for a few decades; however, the last few years his use was probably daily/continuous.

Yes it has gotten way off topic.

Nobody understands that people can function in every day life while taking these meds. My husband was a firefighter and he did just fine.

I guess nobody understands the fact that people have been using these for years under a Drs care, of course you have to be monitered and take them as prescribed.

violetcrush said:

[Stay on topic snip - luv4u]

NotACleverName said:

violetcrush said:

Appreciate your candidness, and personal story. Your mention of successfully sustaining prescription pain meds under managed care by a Physician is a key point, I think, and very important. Without that, it seems likely the "slippery slope" to addiction and the likelihood of obtaining the meds elsewhere comes in to play. Curious as to your thoughts on Prince's addiction stemming from the recovery of his hip surgery.

Yes, agree re the Doctor aspect is key. However, one can be under a Doc's care and still seek out other means of procuring additional meds. I believe the absolute crux of it is the individual and how they manage their narcotics. As I mentioned above, I believe Prince used opioids for years and, for the most part, was able to manage his intake. He was using long before his hip surgery. Aamof, he got incredibly thin in 2009 (a show in Paris where he is sitting) right before his hip surgery and that indicates, to me, he was using copious amounts. However, it appears that he was able to reign in his use at various times because he had a reason or purpose to curtail it, whether it be a new romantic interest, a new protégé, new music, etc. Something that was more important or inspiring than his using. This was apparent when he began to mentor and perform with Andy....he even gained weight during that time. Unfortunately, either the pain in his hip(s)/hands became too much to bear/caused an issue when performing or he was not interested enough in something outside of his use from 2014 on is what, imo, caused his demise. What I am trying to say is that the addiction, or potential for it, was always there but it was not as prevalent, important, all consuming during those decades. Only the last few years of his life....and he simply succumbed to it.

All of this makes sense. Age and the natural aging process could have also played a role in terms of his physical ability to withstand the medication regimen. The aging body has a harder time tolerating things that it used to handle without issue. Not sure about the female relationships making a difference - maybe, but he looked to be of similar size until 2014, and then seemed to have a more rapid weight loss. I do agree that he succumbed to it. Interestingly, it does tie in with Tyka's statements regarding her conversation with him 2 years prior when he stated he had done all that he came here to do.

PennyPurple said:

NotACleverName said:

Wow...this thread has meandered way off the intended topic the past 10 or so pages! I'll bring it back around with some personal insight on opioid use. I have several debilitating, painful conditions and have been using narcotic medication for over 10 years (I also take other meds to manage my health). And, notwithstanding a medical miracle, will likely be on them for the remainder of my days. So, that is proof that someone CAN use this medication long term w/o any major ill effects. Potentially, there could be some issues, as with any med, so my doctor does a complete blood panel (or whatever it's called!) every year to check for any abnormalities. PennyPurple mentioned that some here have probably unknowingly interacted with someone currently taking a narcotic. She's 100% correct as opioids do not "alter" the mind in an obvious way. They haven't compromised my ability to carry on and follow a conversation. I remember birthdays and appointments. My house and I are clean. I am employed, show up and even perform better than some coworkers. I am not a blithering idiot. I am a functioning, productive member of society. I don't share this information with many....for the obvious reasons. Even though I manage my medication (rigidly) there are some who will label me unjustly because of their prejudice toward what they deem a "drug user". I don't have the time or patience for that nor do I feel the need to explain myself. Nobody knows a person's challenges and until you have had to eliminate activities from your life because of pain/mobility issues, don't judge. While I understand Prince was not under the continued care of a doctor, which can change the outcome of the use of narcotics, I believe there are those who use non prescribed opioids unbeknownst to even their most intimate relations. And this simply boils down to the fact that there are really no obvious outward negative effects. Having said that, I would bet that he had been using on and off for a few decades; however, the last few years his use was probably daily/continuous.

Yes it has gotten way off topic.

Nobody understands that people can function in every day life while taking these meds. My husband was a firefighter and he did just fine.

I guess nobody understands the fact that people have been using these for years under a Drs care, of course you have to be monitered and take them as prescribed.

Totally agree with what you and NotACleverName are saying here. Many people function just fine on these meds. I think your key point is "under a Dr's care". One thing we know is that it seems that Prince was self-medicating, and not regularly seeing a Doctor. I think that is the key difference to whether or not the use of the meds takes that "slippery slope" direction. One of the major consequences of Prince needing complete control and secrecy. No doubt the fear of being exposed kept him from getting legitimate care from a licensed Doctor.

PennyPurple said:

AA1slot said:

Got a question among the speculation of whether short term or long term drug use.....Does it matter how long he took drugs? Does it make it more acceptable if he had been using for decades? I guess I don't understand what difference it makes in the length of time he used. Unless Prince was sincere in wanting help (and according to KJ, Prince did want help in getting off the pain meds), his story was likely not going to have a happy ending. Even then, it was going to be a day at a time in recovery which can be a slippery slope. Being in recovery myself for a LONG time....I have seen people after surgery have pain meds prescribed and become addicted..it only took a couple of years for them to reach a bad bottom....they had given up their jobs, families, self-respect in order to keep using and in some cases switched drugs (heroin) since ithey was easier to get. Ive seen people with both short term and long term sobriety/clean time, leave a 12-step meeting, go home and load up a needle or a gun and wham that's it, it's over. Who knew? The behavior was there before the relapse...we just didnt see it. I've heard people say before their stint in rehab, theyhad one last big hurrah with their substance of choce. No one knows what was going through Prince's head except him and what happened on 4/20-21/16. Living or working with an addict (such as the associates) and being an addict are two different things; both are hell and it takes one to know one.

Some people think that his drug problem only started after his hip surgery. Others (like me) say he's dabbled on and off for years. It wasn't just a sudden thing. Just because he preached he was against drugs, doesn't mean he wasn't using them.

It was always about "duality"... he exuded quite a bit of religious syncretism that resembled "christian values" yet, by all outward appearances (and lyrical content in said songs) , we dare not put the two together in contrast , nor expound on such a fact, lest you be deemed "judgmental".

Was liberal in so many ways , yet, conservative in others; helped many, yet, hurt so many.

Could love you and hate you in the same instance.

Stubborn, yet very flexible with so many styles of music and range.

Never liked sampling , yet sampled; hated record labels but ended up right back in the lap of one, (albeit in a different format).

Humble and shy, yet arrogant and pompous...Thus was the erotic genius who believed that his center of gravity was keeping you guessing even unto death...and so the list goes on and on.

Isn't all the above things reasons why we were drawn to him in the first place? Oh the controversy.

Those who believe that Prince's decades of drug use had nothing to do with his untimely death , are probably the same band of fantastical followers who believe that he couldn't have possibly perform under such conditions for hours at a time.

NotACleverName said:

Wow...this thread has meandered way off the intended topic the past 10 or so pages! I'll bring it back around with some personal insight on opioid use. I have several debilitating, painful conditions and have been using narcotic medication for over 10 years (I also take other meds to manage my health). And, notwithstanding a medical miracle, will likely be on them for the remainder of my days. So, that is proof that someone CAN use this medication long term w/o any major ill effects. Potentially, there could be some issues, as with any med, so my doctor does a complete blood panel (or whatever it's called!) every year to check for any abnormalities. PennyPurple mentioned that some here have probably unknowingly interacted with someone currently taking a narcotic. She's 100% correct as opioids do not "alter" the mind in an obvious way. They haven't compromised my ability to carry on and follow a conversation. I remember birthdays and appointments. My house and I are clean. I am employed, show up and even perform better than some coworkers. I am not a blithering idiot. I am a functioning, productive member of society. I don't share this information with many....for the obvious reasons. Even though I manage my medication (rigidly) there are some who will label me unjustly because of their prejudice toward what they deem a "drug user". I don't have the time or patience for that nor do I feel the need to explain myself. Nobody knows a person's challenges and until you have had to eliminate activities from your life because of pain/mobility issues, don't judge. While I understand Prince was not under the continued care of a doctor, which can change the outcome of the use of narcotics, I believe there are those who use non prescribed opioids unbeknownst to even their most intimate relations. And this simply boils down to the fact that there are really no obvious outward negative effects. Having said that, I would bet that he had been using on and off for a few decades; however, the last few years his use was probably daily/continuous.

Thank You for your generosity is sharing this very moving and important info...yours (and Penny's) is an important perspective that is too frequently denigrated on this site (yeah, I'm talking to you LR)...Respect...

Menes said:

PennyPurple said:

Some people think that his drug problem only started after his hip surgery. Others (like me) say he's dabbled on and off for years. It wasn't just a sudden thing. Just because he preached he was against drugs, doesn't mean he wasn't using them.

It was always about "duality"... he exuded quite a bit of religious syncretism that resembled "christian values" yet, by all outward appearances (and lyrical content in said songs) , we dare not put the two together in contrast , nor expound on such a fact, lest you be deemed "judgmental".

Was liberal in so many ways , yet, conservative in others; helped many, yet, hurt so many.

Could love you and hate you in the same instance.

Stubborn, yet very flexible with so many styles of music and range.

Never liked sampling , yet sampled; hated record labels but ended up right back in the lap of one, (albeit in a different format).

Humble and shy, yet arrogant and pompous...Thus was the erotic genius who believed that his center of gravity was keeping you guessing even unto death...and so the list goes on and on.

Isn't all the above things reasons why we were drawn to him in the first place? Oh the controversy.

Those who believe that Prince's decades of drug use had nothing to do with his untimely death , are probably the same band of fantastical followers who believe that he couldn't have possibly perform under such conditions for hours at a time.

Beautiful! Menes, nailed it...as always. xoxoxo

NotACleverName, your posts have been really insightful. I've been wondering if Prince was fundamentally wounded from his childhood neglect; he was functionally an orphan. This may have led to an gnawing inner emptiness/depression which required "medication",unless he was

as you said, temporarily, newly in love, or working with a new protogee etc. He also seemed to need quite a bit of continuous stimulation, praise etc. When outside sources of nourishment would intermittently wane, drugs were "at the ready" to keep uncomfortable feelings at bay.

Just a thought.

Bodhitheblackdog said:

Menes said:

It was always about "duality"... he exuded quite a bit of religious syncretism that resembled "christian values" yet, by all outward appearances (and lyrical content in said songs) , we dare not put the two together in contrast , nor expound on such a fact, lest you be deemed "judgmental".

Was liberal in so many ways , yet, conservative in others; helped many, yet, hurt so many.

Could love you and hate you in the same instance.

Stubborn, yet very flexible with so many styles of music and range.

Never liked sampling , yet sampled; hated record labels but ended up right back in the lap of one, (albeit in a different format).

Humble and shy, yet arrogant and pompous...Thus was the erotic genius who believed that his center of gravity was keeping you guessing even unto death...and so the list goes on and on.

Isn't all the above things reasons why we were drawn to him in the first place? Oh the controversy.

Those who believe that Prince's decades of drug use had nothing to do with his untimely death , are probably the same band of fantastical followers who believe that he couldn't have possibly perform under such conditions for hours at a time.

Beautiful! Menes, nailed it...as always. xoxoxo

Darling!

When did this thread become a competing arena about the many harlots the man had? Or some other subject outside of the named thread, as in: " what happened to Elvis"? This is bullshit. Elvis has his own forum . The associates have a forum. There is a picture forum. We want the goods about the opiate usage and his death in this damn forum.So, I'm in a foul mood.

This thread is about how he died and why he died! HENCE THE PRINCE DEATH INVESTIGATION DISCUSSION - CONTINUED sign at the damn entrance of the damn door, 10 parts back! I don't want to have to read the sob stories about past drug escapades or what one thinks drugs might do to ones brain,or whether your favorite superstar/ musician/ sister /mother died of an overdose every damn day. Jimity crickets man.

If you're a recovering addict, make your own damn forum about your sobriety. You're not wired like Prince ,and you're not that important, therefore, your drug use means shit as it relates to this investigation. Stick to the facts people. THIS IS NOT ABOUT YOU.

Don't let these some-timers derail shit .This is about the death of a musical genius and things pertaining to such.

Some of these monikers appear to be knee deep in changing the narrative. I could see if they were goofing off and embellishing a few things here and there, but this is becoming a daily practice.

Menes said:

Bodhitheblackdog said:

Beautiful! Menes, nailed it...as always. xoxoxo

Darling!

When did this thread become a competing arena about the many harlots the man had? Or some other subject outside of the named thread, as in: " what happened to Elvis"? This is bullshit. Elvis has his own forum . The associates have a forum. There is a picture forum. We want the goods about the opiate usage and his death in this damn forum.So, I'm in a foul mood.

This thread is about how he died and why he died! HENCE THE PRINCE DEATH INVESTIGATION DISCUSSION - CONTINUED sign at the damn entrance of the damn door, 10 parts back! I don't want to have to read the sob stories about past drug escapades or what one thinks drugs might do to ones brain,or whether your favorite superstar/ musician/ sister /mother died of an overdose every damn day. Jimity crickets man.

If you're a recovering addict, make your own damn forum about your sobriety. You're not wired like Prince ,and you're not that important, therefore, your drug use means shit as it relates to this investigation. Stick to the facts people. THIS IS NOT ABOUT YOU.

Don't let these some-timers derail shit .This is about the death of a musical genius and things pertaining to such.

Some of these monikers appear to be knee deep in changing the narrative. I could see if they were goofing off and embellishing a few things here and there, but this is becoming a daily practice.

you noticed!!!!! let's get this puppy back in line (though I disagree re one point: personal narratives about opoid use are relevant and important...always thought-provoking)...other than that....OMG Menes, we have to stop meeting like this!!!!!!!!!

Menes said:

PennyPurple said:

Some people think that his drug problem only started after his hip surgery. Others (like me) say he's dabbled on and off for years. It wasn't just a sudden thing. Just because he preached he was against drugs, doesn't mean he wasn't using them.

It was always about "duality"... he exuded quite a bit of religious syncretism that resembled "christian values" yet, by all outward appearances (and lyrical content in said songs) , we dare not put the two together in contrast , nor expound on such a fact, lest you be deemed "judgmental".

Was liberal in so many ways , yet, conservative in others; helped many, yet, hurt so many.

Could love you and hate you in the same instance.

Stubborn, yet very flexible with so many styles of music and range.

Never liked sampling , yet sampled; hated record labels but ended up right back in the lap of one, (albeit in a different format).

Humble and shy, yet arrogant and pompous...Thus was the erotic genius who believed that his center of gravity was keeping you guessing even unto death...and so the list goes on and on.

Isn't all the above things reasons why we were drawn to him in the first place? Oh the controversy.

Those who believe that Prince's decades of drug use had nothing to do with his untimely death , are probably the same band of fantastical followers who believe that he couldn't have possibly perform under such conditions for hours at a time.

Great Post Menes! WOW. Really makes you think.

Menes said:

Bodhitheblackdog said:

Beautiful! Menes, nailed it...as always. xoxoxo

Darling!

When did this thread become a competing arena about the many harlots the man had? Or some other subject outside of the named thread, as in: " what happened to Elvis"? This is bullshit. Elvis has his own forum . The associates have a forum. There is a picture forum. We want the goods about the opiate usage and his death in this damn forum.So, I'm in a foul mood.

This thread is about how he died and why he died! HENCE THE PRINCE DEATH INVESTIGATION DISCUSSION - CONTINUED sign at the damn entrance of the damn door, 10 parts back! I don't want to have to read the sob stories about past drug escapades or what one thinks drugs might do to ones brain,or whether your favorite superstar/ musician/ sister /mother died of an overdose every damn day. Jimity crickets man.

If you're a recovering addict, make your own damn forum about your sobriety. You're not wired like Prince ,and you're not that important, therefore, your drug use means shit as it relates to this investigation. Stick to the facts people. THIS IS NOT ABOUT YOU.

Don't let these some-timers derail shit .This is about the death of a musical genius and things pertaining to such.

Some of these monikers appear to be knee deep in changing the narrative. I could see if they were goofing off and embellishing a few things here and there, but this is becoming a daily practice.

And they won't stop trying to change the narrative, when they have 618 posts and 616 of them are on this very thread of part 10, you know what they are doing.

So, anyhoo, Prince consumed something from the same batch of pills that he OD'ed from in Moline. Unless of course you think that the man ran out when he returned to PP ( in stealth mode) and purchased a new and completely foreign batch that contained one damn pill that killed him. With that much scrutiny and eyes on him, Ummmmm, no.

It was in the stash, in the house , but was never revealed by "carver county finest" for obvious reasons.

As with everything, drug addicts prefer to purchase locally and trust locals. There was an epidemic brewing in 2015 in MN but it was kept secret for fear of alerting fellow addicts and dealers that a certain variety of opiates laced with deadly fentanyl was the "real deal". "Real deal " as in death ( or closer to your higher self). It is not amongst the opiates that were found @ PP. That mega-dose ( of fentanyl) has not been a focus of any investigation related to watson 853/385 . Research .

Furthermore, I have not been able to find any DEA reports or testing that was done for the additional pills that were found @ PP. Why the secrecy about which pill was tested and how much fentanyl it contained? How unlucky is Prince to pick out one pill out of a batch of about 100 damn 853/385 that contained an enormous amount of fentanyl? Not that damn lucky because it was already all over Minnesota in 2015. Point of interest: It wasn't 853/385's that contained exorbitant kill levels of fentanyl, distributed by dealers. Nor was there a high demand by users for such . Unlucky fellow eh?

They released the opiates that were found @ PP, but notice, nothing is revealed concerning the testing for an aggregate amount of fentanyl. Yet, he died of a fentanyl overdose from an opiate pill. Which one? The 853's? We have the records of every single pill collected. Or do we?

If you are law enforcement and you release the fact that watson 853/385's were found @ PP and you unequivocally state that this was the only opiate that was found, would you really say that this is the pill that contained the fentanyl? No. The iilicit market would have been flooded immediately. There was nothing moving the 853 opiate market, yet, they revealed this as the opiate of choice for Prince which more than likely, contained the fentanyl/carfentanil.

Bodhitheblackdog said:

Menes said:

Darling!

When did this thread become a competing arena about the many harlots the man had? Or some other subject outside of the named thread, as in: " what happened to Elvis"? This is bullshit. Elvis has his own forum . The associates have a forum. There is a picture forum. We want the goods about the opiate usage and his death in this damn forum.So, I'm in a foul mood.

This thread is about how he died and why he died! HENCE THE PRINCE DEATH INVESTIGATION DISCUSSION - CONTINUED sign at the damn entrance of the damn door, 10 parts back! I don't want to have to read the sob stories about past drug escapades or what one thinks drugs might do to ones brain,or whether your favorite superstar/ musician/ sister /mother died of an overdose every damn day. Jimity crickets man.

If you're a recovering addict, make your own damn forum about your sobriety. You're not wired like Prince ,and you're not that important, therefore, your drug use means shit as it relates to this investigation. Stick to the facts people. THIS IS NOT ABOUT YOU.

Don't let these some-timers derail shit .This is about the death of a musical genius and things pertaining to such.

Some of these monikers appear to be knee deep in changing the narrative. I could see if they were goofing off and embellishing a few things here and there, but this is becoming a daily practice.

you noticed!!!!! let's get this puppy back in line (though I disagree re one point: personal narratives about opoid use are relevant and important...always thought-provoking)...other than that....OMG Menes, we have to stop meeting like this!!!!!!!!!

I can agree that opioid use is relevant and important , and always, thought provoking. I could run a scientific model on it (as it relates to the effect on the brain), but lordy, where will that take me? We will be full circle, talking about Bruce lee's death, Janis Joplin's last hit whilst aroused by a vision from her lover in Atlantis and Miles Davis' sexual encounter with a snow-bunny rabbit while on LSD.

PennyPurple said:

Menes said:

Darling!

When did this thread become a competing arena about the many harlots the man had? Or some other subject outside of the named thread, as in: " what happened to Elvis"? This is bullshit. Elvis has his own forum . The associates have a forum. There is a picture forum. We want the goods about the opiate usage and his death in this damn forum.So, I'm in a foul mood.

This thread is about how he died and why he died! HENCE THE PRINCE DEATH INVESTIGATION DISCUSSION - CONTINUED sign at the damn entrance of the damn door, 10 parts back! I don't want to have to read the sob stories about past drug escapades or what one thinks drugs might do to ones brain,or whether your favorite superstar/ musician/ sister /mother died of an overdose every damn day. Jimity crickets man.

If you're a recovering addict, make your own damn forum about your sobriety. You're not wired like Prince ,and you're not that important, therefore, your drug use means shit as it relates to this investigation. Stick to the facts people. THIS IS NOT ABOUT YOU.

Don't let these some-timers derail shit .This is about the death of a musical genius and things pertaining to such.

Some of these monikers appear to be knee deep in changing the narrative. I could see if they were goofing off and embellishing a few things here and there, but this is becoming a daily practice.

And they won't stop trying to change the narrative, when they have 618 posts and 616 of them are on this very thread of part 10, you know what they are doing.

You see how fast they disappear? Come out and chat you brood of vipers. You've been hemming and hawing all damn week and now you've gone silent? Howdy, Violet, hello, Krsytal. Greetings. Come out and reason. I'm Menes , pleased to meet you. Contribute!

Menes said:

Bodhitheblackdog said:

you noticed!!!!! let's get this puppy back in line (though I disagree re one point: personal narratives about opoid use are relevant and important...always thought-provoking)...other than that....OMG Menes, we have to stop meeting like this!!!!!!!!!

I can agree that opioid use is relevant and important , and always, thought provoking. I could run a scientific model on it (as it relates to the effect on the brain), but lordy, where will that take me? We will be full circle, talking about Bruce lee's death, Janis Joplin's last hit whilst aroused by a vision from her lover in Atlantis and Miles Davis' sexual encounter with a snow-bunny rabbit while on LSD.

Now I'm upset: the snow-bunny rabbit promised fidelity to ME!

Many of us are filled with contradictions. I have to say that Prince's duality might have been indecisiveness in disguise. In other words, he couldn't admit that he was unsure so he jumped onto an impulse, found some justification for it, held onto it for while until something more definitive changed his mind but he wasn't brave enough to just admit that he had been conflicted about it in the first place. Plus, the head and the heart don't always correspond. Sometimes, we pick the head; sometimes we pick the heart. Ideally, our choices are determined by both at the same time.

Also, I would be more inclined to beleive that Dr. D. guy (whose article I just read and even though he gets some suppositions wrong about P's later usage, he did make a lot of sense) if someone could prove that people can live and be productive and mostly on their game professionally for 30 something years while on that stuff. Maybe, Prince had really good self control--in other words, he really only took the pills for a bit of courage, to take the edge off and never for a recreational high. Perhaps, the usage intensified over the years as pain came into play and his tolerenace increased. Manuela stated that he didn't have stage fright, but I would argue that her involvement was too late in his life to know if stage fright was an earlier problem. Plus, P wasn't going out in his underwear and being hyper sexual on stage when he was older. Perhaps, his extreme peformance style was scary as hell in his earlier life but he felt that to make a mark he would have to just suck it up and do it..

Menes said:

PennyPurple said:

Some people think that his drug problem only started after his hip surgery. Others (like me) say he's dabbled on and off for years. It wasn't just a sudden thing. Just because he preached he was against drugs, doesn't mean he wasn't using them.

It was always about "duality"... he exuded quite a bit of religious syncretism that resembled "christian values" yet, by all outward appearances (and lyrical content in said songs) , we dare not put the two together in contrast , nor expound on such a fact, lest you be deemed "judgmental".

Was liberal in so many ways , yet, conservative in others; helped many, yet, hurt so many.

Could love you and hate you in the same instance.

Stubborn, yet very flexible with so many styles of music and range.

Never liked sampling , yet sampled; hated record labels but ended up right back in the lap of one, (albeit in a different format).

Humble and shy, yet arrogant and pompous...Thus was the erotic genius who believed that his center of gravity was keeping you guessing even unto death...and so the list goes on and on.

Isn't all the above things reasons why we were drawn to him in the first place? Oh the controversy.

Those who believe that Prince's decades of drug use had nothing to do with his untimely death , are probably the same band of fantastical followers who believe that he couldn't have possibly perform under such conditions for hours at a time.

[Edited 6/18/18 20:29pm]

Menes said:

PennyPurple said:

And they won't stop trying to change the narrative, when they have 618 posts and 616 of them are on this very thread of part 10, you know what they are doing.

You see how fast they disappear? Come out and chat you brood of vipers. You've been hemming and hawing all damn week and now you've gone silent? Howdy, Violet, hello, Krsytal. Greetings. Come out and reason. I'm Menes , pleased to meet you. Contribute!

How rude of me. I forgot, Strawberry ( the one who had a friend that knew it was cancer) ,and last, but not least, our CHOCOLATE wonder... the insider and curator of all things Prince and PP. Yes yes yes, Chocolate, even though (8) of your lives have been cooked by Penny, there is one remaining.

Menes said:

Menes said:

You see how fast they disappear? Come out and chat you brood of vipers. You've been hemming and hawing all damn week and now you've gone silent? Howdy, Violet, hello, Krsytal. Greetings. Come out and reason. I'm Menes , pleased to meet you. Contribute!

How rude of me. I forgot, Strawberry ( the one who had a friend that knew it was cancer) ,and last, but not least, our CHOCOLATE wonder... the insider and curator of all things Prince and PP. Yes yes yes, Chocolate, even though (8) of your lives have been cooked by Penny, there is one remaining.

PennyPurple said:

Menes said:

How rude of me. I forgot, Strawberry ( the one who had a friend that knew it was cancer) ,and last, but not least, our CHOCOLATE wonder... the insider and curator of all things Prince and PP. Yes yes yes, Chocolate, even though (8) of your lives have been cooked by Penny, there is one remaining.

purplerabbithole said:

Many of us are filled with contradictions. I have to say that Prince's duality might have been indecisiveness in disguise. In other words, he couldn't admit that he was unsure so he jumped onto an impulse, found some justification for it, held onto it for while until something more definitive changed his mind but he wasn't brave enough to just admit that he had been conflicted about it in the first place. Plus, the head and the heart don't always correspond. Sometimes, we pick the head; sometimes we pick the heart. Ideally, our choices are determined by both at the same time.

Also, I would be more inclined to beleive that Dr. D. guy (whose article I just read and even though he gets some suppositions wrong about P's later usage, he did make a lot of sense) if someone could prove that people can live and be productive and mostly on their game professionally for 30 something years while on that stuff. Maybe, Prince had really good self control--in other words, he really only took the pills for a bit of courage, to take the edge off and never for a recreational high. Perhaps, the usage intensified over the years as pain came into play and his tolerenace increased. Manuela stated that he didn't have stage fright, but I would argue that her involvement was too late in his life to know if stage fright was an earlier problem. Plus, P wasn't going out in his underwear and being hyper sexual on stage when he was older. Perhaps, his extreme peformance style was scary as hell in his earlier life but he felt that to make a mark he would have to just suck it up and do it..

Menes said:

It was always about "duality"... he exuded quite a bit of religious syncretism that resembled "christian values" yet, by all outward appearances (and lyrical content in said songs) , we dare not put the two together in contrast , nor expound on such a fact, lest you be deemed "judgmental".

Was liberal in so many ways , yet, conservative in others; helped many, yet, hurt so many.

Could love you and hate you in the same instance.

Stubborn, yet very flexible with so many styles of music and range.

Never liked sampling , yet sampled; hated record labels but ended up right back in the lap of one, (albeit in a different format).

Humble and shy, yet arrogant and pompous...Thus was the erotic genius who believed that his center of gravity was keeping you guessing even unto death...and so the list goes on and on.

Isn't all the above things reasons why we were drawn to him in the first place? Oh the controversy.

Those who believe that Prince's decades of drug use had nothing to do with his untimely death , are probably the same band of fantastical followers who believe that he couldn't have possibly perform under such conditions for hours at a time.

[Edited 6/18/18 20:29pm]

Well, he said he didnt have to do all of "that"(extreme performance) in his younger days and advised artists not to follow such a route. What does that tell you?

Bodhitheblackdog said:

PennyPurple said:

To the bat cave... how far was the elevator from anything remotely close to where the pills were found?

You see, death was quick , or so they tell us ,based upon the exorbitant amount of fentanyl in his body.... Seconds they tell me. Can you get in there, and (punch a lower floor) which means you're still conscious? Was it going up or down? Jesus , I hope I don't sound like ... that vague person. I want to consider that my thinking needs some adjusting before declaring it unworkable. April was not the beginning.

Bodhitheblackdog said:

PennyPurple said:

The silence is deafening. Lord, save me from my transgressions that I am wiling to commit this night. I feel so "dual".

It tells me he was ashamed of his performances...(which I don't think he had a reason to be.) I feel kind of sorry for him about that one. I remember Questlove being asked to stop cussing by Prince. And questlove jokingly telling P that P was the one who taught him how to cuss. Questlove descibed Prince's reaction as sad when he said that. LIke Susannah said in her interview, maybe under all the sexual mystique, P was just a boy. He was a boy, wasn't he? Damn, I can't imagine at his age having that kind of influence, desperate drive, and stress.

Menes said:

purplerabbithole said:

Many of us are filled with contradictions. I have to say that Prince's duality might have been indecisiveness in disguise. In other words, he couldn't admit that he was unsure so he jumped onto an impulse, found some justification for it, held onto it for while until something more definitive changed his mind but he wasn't brave enough to just admit that he had been conflicted about it in the first place. Plus, the head and the heart don't always correspond. Sometimes, we pick the head; sometimes we pick the heart. Ideally, our choices are determined by both at the same time.

Also, I would be more inclined to beleive that Dr. D. guy (whose article I just read and even though he gets some suppositions wrong about P's later usage, he did make a lot of sense) if someone could prove that people can live and be productive and mostly on their game professionally for 30 something years while on that stuff. Maybe, Prince had really good self control--in other words, he really only took the pills for a bit of courage, to take the edge off and never for a recreational high. Perhaps, the usage intensified over the years as pain came into play and his tolerenace increased. Manuela stated that he didn't have stage fright, but I would argue that her involvement was too late in his life to know if stage fright was an earlier problem. Plus, P wasn't going out in his underwear and being hyper sexual on stage when he was older. Perhaps, his extreme peformance style was scary as hell in his earlier life but he felt that to make a mark he would have to just suck it up and do it..

[Edited 6/18/18 20:29pm]

Well, he said he didnt have to do all of "that"(extreme performance) in his younger days and advised artists not to follow such a route. What does that tell you?

I don't know if murder conspiracy is what you believe but I don't think the fast acting nature of the pill contradicts my belief that P deliberately took a pill(s) after he got into the elevator.

Menes said:

Bodhitheblackdog said:

To the bat cave... how far was the elevator from anything remotely close to where the pills were found?

You see, death was quick , or so they tell us ,based upon the exorbitant amount of fentanyl in his body.... Seconds they tell me. Can you get in there, and (punch a lower floor) which means you're still conscious? Was it going up or down? Jesus , I hope I don't sound like ... that vague person. I want to consider that my thinking needs some adjusting before declaring it unworkable. April was not the beginning.