justalongtimefan said:

Some people just want it to be more than what it is. Prince wasn't a JUNKIE. He died from an overdose that could have been giving to him directly from his doctor. I almost died last year the same way. I had a major surgery and the pain meds slowed my breathing almost to the point where I couldn't. Doctors were telling me that it was safe and I was like HELL NO!!! Last time you guys gave that to me it was hard for me to breath and I was afraid to sleep. Prince couldn't breath, got on the elevator to try and get help. Fell a sleep and died. It's really that simple.

He didn't feel a thing trust me...

We'll always love you Prince!!! You've been like a father, uncle and a brother to all of us. Love you for that!!!

eureka, that makes a lot of sense. poor guy. but the venal will always call him a junkie no matter what and lump him in with the rest. MJ didn't even seem that lost in addiction at the time of his death, he just had a retard working for him and was messing with stuff he shouldn't have been.

PeteSilas said:

MMJas said:

Yes, this really get me as well. The whole "yet another rockstar falls prey to drugs" stance really pisses me off. Just the other day i was at the haidresser and this guy was having his hair cut and spewing all this shit about how Prince was an addict wo did recreational drugs for many years, and he was stating it with such confidence... Everyone is an expert nowadays.

all i can say is that I fucking hate drugs, just hate them, I know it's not how everyone else feels but I'd rather he died from something terminal. Now people will always be able to say the vile crap they did about Elvis and MJ when, more than likely, he was not quite like them. I wish I could strangle the fuck who started him on that shit.

Unfortunately that's how people are, there will always be some to denegrade his person and legacy no matter what. So he will either be rotulated an addict because he used drugs, an Aids victim becsuse he slept around and also was gay (so they kill two rabbits with one stone) or a cancer victim because it was either Aids related, drugs related or not even true, just a cover up for something that the gutter media and narrow people's minds find it's connected to a morally wrong behaviour. So it's a no win situation. That's probably why his family won't even bother to disclose the full autopsy (also for privacy) or comment further on the subject.

[Edited 6/11/16 3:58am]

PeteSilas said:

that's guilty behavior if there ever was guilty behavior. fucking doctors, just people but that's why they need to follow some rules.

Seems like guilty behavior if it's true. I haven't been able to find credible sources for those specifics, that's why the discussion. I would hope it matters whether the information is accurate.

PeteSilas said:

TopazGirl said:

http://customwire.ap.org/dynamic/stories/U/US_PRINCE_VIP_SYNDROME?SITE=AP&SECTION=HOME&TEMPLATE=DEFAULT

The Associated Press is reporting about the possibility of "VIP Syndrome," with mention of the two doctors we know of so far, as well as reference to the Michael Jackson case.

Marta said:

What's so morally objectionable about drug usage in the first place? It's practically as old as human kind and millions of people use drugs recreationally without any problem whatsoever, not even counting nicotine, alcohol, caffeine, etc. Granted, those people don't make headlines but the idea that in and of itself, recreational drug use is evil and morally suspect is an argument I've never been able to get behind. Some of the most accomplished and successful people in the world have used drugs recreationally at one time or another.

herb4 said:

RachB65 said:

herb4 said:

What's so morally objectionable about drug usage in the first place? It's practically as old as human kind and millions of people use drugs recreationally without any problem whatsoever, not even counting nicotine, alcohol, caffeine, etc. Granted, those people don't make headlines but the idea that in and of itself, recreational drug use is evil and morally suspect is an argument I've never been able to get behind. Some of the most accomplished and successful people in the world have used drugs recreationally at one time or another.

I hate drugs, not that I haven't ever taken an aspirin, but I still hate them. Also, I wouldn't be around anyone who uses recreationally anymore, I've tried it and their thinking is warped by their own self-loathing and whatever paranoaia the drugs bring. No denying there are uses for them, but they should be handled like the deadly thing they are.

Marta said:

herb4 said:

What's so morally objectionable about drug usage in the first place? It's practically as old as human kind and millions of people use drugs recreationally without any problem whatsoever, not even counting nicotine, alcohol, caffeine, etc. Granted, those people don't make headlines but the idea that in and of itself, recreational drug use is evil and morally suspect is an argument I've never been able to get behind. Some of the most accomplished and successful people in the world have used drugs recreationally at one time or another.

What makes it so objectionable..I think.. is that all of the drugs you've named and many others besides are taken voluntarily and kill everyday. It's frightening for those of us who don't do drugs because we'd rather no one took that risk. Some make it into very old age while doing those drugs and die of natural causes. But many die early and/or young; and what we view as unnessarily. In the case of recreational drug use, I think most non-drug users just wish no one took the chance..that's all.

Yes, but there are so many things people do every day that have a risk of death. Driving. Flying. Motorcycles. Skiing. Parasailing. Bungee Jumping. Boxing. Football. Window washing on a scaffold. The percentage of people who die early from recreational drug use overall is a small fraction of total users, just as it is with many, many other activities that have a risk of death, and many other activities that aren't considered to have a risk of death.

Has Ali's death spawned another movement to end boxing? Should it? Are boxers morally suspect? etc.

Eileen said:

Marta said:

herb4 said: What makes it so objectionable..I think.. is that all of the drugs you've named and many others besides are taken voluntarily and kill everyday. It's frightening for those of us who don't do drugs because we'd rather no one took that risk. Some make it into very old age while doing those drugs and die of natural causes. But many die early and/or young; and what we view as unnessarily. In the case of recreational drug use, I think most non-drug users just wish no one took the chance..that's all.

Yes, but there are so many things people do every day that have a risk of death. Driving. Flying. Motorcycles. Skiing. Parasailing. Bungee Jumping. Boxing. Football. Window washing on a scaffold. The percentage of people who die early from recreational drug use overall is a small fraction of total users, just as it is with many, many other activities that have a risk of death, and many other activities that aren't considered to have a risk of death.

Has Ali's death spawned another movement to end boxing? Should it? Are boxers morally suspect? etc.

just look at all the talent that was ruined, it's not just death, it's ruined lives and lives that it effects.

Ali lived a lot longer than a lot of people, the issue of his brain damage is one to consider sure, but those men need a way to make a good living, if they have the talent and accept the risks, it should be allowed. The problem with fighters, and I call myself one, is that most of them aren't very circumspect about the things that could go wrong, many of them are easy to lead and manipulate so, like anything it's a double edged sword. As we know, deaths by sports or activities, boxing doesn't even come close. But, the damage fighters take is unnavoidable, who's job is it to make a decision for these kids who can hardly think for themselves? I don't know, it's a complicated thing. Anyway, boxing is dying in this country at least, has been for awhile and if this race does evolve, eventually all violent sports will just not even be needed anymore.

PeteSilas said:

MMJas said:

Yes, this really get me as well. The whole "yet another rockstar falls prey to drugs" stance really pisses me off. Just the other day i was at the haidresser and this guy was having his hair cut and spewing all this shit about how Prince was an addict wo did recreational drugs for many years, and he was stating it with such confidence... Everyone is an expert nowadays.

all i can say is that I fucking hate drugs, just hate them, I know it's not how everyone else feels but I'd rather he died from something terminal. Now people will always be able to say the vile crap they did about Elvis and MJ when, more than likely, he was not quite like them. I wish I could strangle the fuck who started him on that shit.

.

you know, people like you with your kneejerk attitudes about drugs are part of the reason the stigma of drugs and overdosing exists, right?

h4rm0ny said:

PeteSilas said:

all i can say is that I fucking hate drugs, just hate them, I know it's not how everyone else feels but I'd rather he died from something terminal. Now people will always be able to say the vile crap they did about Elvis and MJ when, more than likely, he was not quite like them. I wish I could strangle the fuck who started him on that shit.

.

you know, people like you with your kneejerk attitudes about drugs are part of the reason the stigma of drugs and overdosing exists, right?

"people like me"? I'm not judging him, I'm saying I hate the shit. I think the shame over it may be what killed him because he knew the stuff was bad news too. Would it have made a difference to me if he went to rehab? Hell ya, I'd take him alive over dead anytime. How many people have to die before we realize that we have to think about what we're doing when we use this shit. We have to balance out the pros with the cons and make good decisions from there. I never had a drug problem, do you know why? Because I've seen too many people act stupid on them and I've lost too many heroes to them. Quite honestly, I never thought Prince would be one of them, never.

PeteSilas said:

RachB65 said:

PeteSilas said:

"people like me"? I'm not judging him, I'm saying I hate the shit. I think the shame over it may be what killed him because he knew the stuff was bad news too. Would it have made a difference to me if he went to rehab? Hell ya, I'd take him alive over dead anytime. How many people have to die before we realize that we have to think about what we're doing when we use this shit. We have to balance out the pros with the cons and make good decisions from there. I never had a drug problem, do you know why? Because I've seen too many people act stupid on them and I've lost too many heroes to them. Quite honestly, I never thought Prince would be one of them, never.

Do you have chronic or unmanageable pain? If so, how do u deal with it?

I understand that aspect and I have sympathy, believe me. I knew a navy seal and he had absolutely no choice but to pump himself full of drugs. That is to say, no choice about being a junkie, the pain was just too great. But what I mean by being circumpsect is that, for example, I told that navy seal it was partly his fault for letting himself be used in a way that left him in this shape. We have to think before we do. It's not that hard. I tell the same thing to my friends who were fighters, that it's not something to take lightly and that the stakes are high so make sure you are being handled right. And we need to think of what we're doing when we even begin to take a drug, that first cigarette, that first drink. Not everyone is cut out to where they can dabble.

Another question I have is why are we americans so obsessed with pain, I'm sure people the globe over have all kinds of aches and pains and they persist in their lives the best they can. What is it about us?

Lastly, I'm not even convinced that it was even the drugs alone that killed Prince, I'm still thinking their were other ailments that aren't being told us. He just never seemed to be a guy to end up like this. And as far as how I deal with pain? Well, i have violent, violent migraines, to the point where i've thought i was dying before. I did take codeine's but I always kept a watchful eye on how much and I'd just sit through the migraines if I thought I was taking too much. After Prince died, I threw all those pills out my car window. Ya, I know what it's like to be in such horrid pain that you dont' care if you live or die, so I do have sympathy. Prince though, always had the air of a superman, wasn't much I couldn't see him handling. This is a guy who got by on little sleep, year after year, if I tried that, and I have, I'd collapse. I couldn't see pain doing a number on him, so it's still a mystery to me.

PeteSilas said:

RachB65 said:

PeteSilas said: Do you have chronic or unmanageable pain? If so, how do u deal with it?

I understand that aspect and I have sympathy, believe me. I knew a navy seal and he had absolutely no choice but to pump himself full of drugs. That is to say, no choice about being a junkie, the pain was just too great. But what I mean by being circumpsect is that, for example, I told that navy seal it was partly his fault for letting himself be used in a way that left him in this shape. We have to think before we do. It's not that hard. I tell the same thing to my friends who were fighters, that it's not something to take lightly and that the stakes are high so make sure you are being handled right. And we need to think of what we're doing when we even begin to take a drug, that first cigarette, that first drink. Not everyone is cut out to where they can dabble.

Another question I have is why are we americans so obsessed with pain, I'm sure people the globe over have all kinds of aches and pains and they persist in their lives the best they can. What is it about us?

Lastly, I'm not even convinced that it was even the drugs alone that killed Prince, I'm still thinking their were other ailments that aren't being told us. He just never seemed to be a guy to end up like this. And as far as how I deal with pain? Well, i have violent, violent migraines, to the point where i've thought i was dying before. I did take codeine's but I always kept a watchful eye on how much and I'd just sit through the migraines if I thought I was taking too much. After Prince died, I threw all those pills out my car window. Ya, I know what it's like to be in such horrid pain that you dont' care if you live or die, so I do have sympathy. Prince though, always had the air of a superman, wasn't much I couldn't see him handling. This is a guy who got by on little sleep, year after year, if I tried that, and I have, I'd collapse. I couldn't see pain doing a number on him, so it's still a mystery to me.

Has anyone ever gave a thorough statement regarding how much hip and joint pain Prince actually had? I've never seen any statements from him and all the statements I've seen from others are general in nature.

derrick31 said:

Has anyone ever gave a thorough statement regarding how much hip and joint pain Prince actually had? I've never seen any statements from him and all the statements I've seen from others are general in nature.

No it hasn't been fully explained.

Billy Sparks said Prince didn't have a hip replacement.

I remember when I was a regular here seeing a post about Prince having hip surgery and having problems with his knee/ankle but I can't remember when that was.

muleFunk said:

derrick31 said:

Has anyone ever gave a thorough statement regarding how much hip and joint pain Prince actually had? I've never seen any statements from him and all the statements I've seen from others are general in nature.

No it hasn't been fully explained.

Billy Sparks said Prince didn't have a hip replacement.

I remember when I was a regular here seeing a post about Prince having hip surgery and having problems with his knee/ankle but I can't remember when that was.

.

You saw it here:

http://prince.org/msg/7/310635

.

The only incorrect statement in this, is that he refused because of religious beliefs. He refused because he's beaten all of the odds in his life by himself... because the show must go on. We must accept this, and not let it be a source of sadness or anger. Everything this incredible human set out to do, he did it... and well. He thought he could beat it.

Giovanni777 said:

muleFunk said:

No it hasn't been fully explained.

Billy Sparks said Prince didn't have a hip replacement.

I remember when I was a regular here seeing a post about Prince having hip surgery and having problems with his knee/ankle but I can't remember when that was.

.

You saw it here:

http://prince.org/msg/7/310635

.

The only incorrect statement in this, is that he refused because of religious beliefs. He refused because he's beaten all of the odds in his life by himself... because the show must go on. We must accept this, and not let it be a source of sadness or anger. Everything this incredible human set out to do, he did it... and well. He thought he could beat it.

WOW! I just read that whole thread and so many of you were warning us and Prince that taking those pain pills if he didn't get the surgery would have him leaving us prematurely!...and we know the rest....

justAmeda said:

Giovanni777 said:

.

You saw it here:

http://prince.org/msg/7/310635

.

The only incorrect statement in this, is that he refused because of religious beliefs. He refused because he's beaten all of the odds in his life by himself... because the show must go on. We must accept this, and not let it be a source of sadness or anger. Everything this incredible human set out to do, he did it... and well. He thought he could beat it.

WOW! I just read that whole thread and so many of you were warning us and Prince that taking those pain pills if he didn't get the surgery would have him leaving us prematurely!...and we know the rest....

Unbelievable.... Was there any discussion on how he reconciled the excessive use of opiods and being a JW? Good grief!!!

Giovanni777 said:

muleFunk said:

No it hasn't been fully explained.

Billy Sparks said Prince didn't have a hip replacement.

I remember when I was a regular here seeing a post about Prince having hip surgery and having problems with his knee/ankle but I can't remember when that was.

.

You saw it here:

http://prince.org/msg/7/310635

.

The only incorrect statement in this, is that he refused because of religious beliefs. He refused because he's beaten all of the odds in his life by himself... because the show must go on. We must accept this, and not let it be a source of sadness or anger. Everything this incredible human set out to do, he did it... and well. He thought he could beat it.

My goodness...There are some frighteningly prophetic comments on there about not wanting to see Prince being wheeled, unconscious, out of an airport on a trolley (or words to that effect).

It makes me so, so sad to read that thread...It's all played out exactly as people feared. We know (suspect) that Prince used to read these pages - did he willfully blind hiumself to the truth?

Giovanni777 said:

muleFunk said:

No it hasn't been fully explained.

Billy Sparks said Prince didn't have a hip replacement.

I remember when I was a regular here seeing a post about Prince having hip surgery and having problems with his knee/ankle but I can't remember when that was.

.

You saw it here:

http://prince.org/msg/7/310635

.

The only incorrect statement in this, is that he refused because of religious beliefs. He refused because he's beaten all of the odds in his life by himself... because the show must go on. We must accept this, and not let it be a source of sadness or anger. Everything this incredible human set out to do, he did it... and well. He thought he could beat it.

My man Gio comes through in the clutch again!

My source told me that they found some anomlies in the pre op phase that led to his decision not to go through with the surgery.

Giovanni777 said:

muleFunk said:

No it hasn't been fully explained.

Billy Sparks said Prince didn't have a hip replacement.

I remember when I was a regular here seeing a post about Prince having hip surgery and having problems with his knee/ankle but I can't remember when that was.

.

You saw it here:

http://prince.org/msg/7/310635

.

The only incorrect statement in this, is that he refused because of religious beliefs. He refused because he's beaten all of the odds in his life by himself... because the show must go on. We must accept this, and not let it be a source of sadness or anger. Everything this incredible human set out to do, he did it... and well. He thought he could beat it.

He knew that if he went through with a double hip replacement that his performing career was over.

I agree with you on that last two sentences accept and thank God he gave him to us for the time we had.

roxy831 said:

justAmeda said:

WOW! I just read that whole thread and so many of you were warning us and Prince that taking those pain pills if he didn't get the surgery would have him leaving us prematurely!...and we know the rest....

Unbelievable.... Was there any discussion on how he reconciled the excessive use of opiods and being a JW? Good grief!!!

I know, right? It's not like die hard, sanctimonious religious know it alls can be ever be hypocrites or anything. That'd be a first.

For the record, I don't think Prince was a hypocrite at all in this regard, just human. I'm just pointing out that religion and faith aren't the be all and end all their beleivers make it out to be. What's the saying? "Thank God I'm an atheist" or something like that?

RachB65 said:

What people don't understand is those things don't get you high. The buzz that you get from it is not like you are stoned. You're pain is just relieved and you may feel a sligh bit of piece of 20 or 30 mins but that's it. I'm on the now and trust me, there are things out there that can get you higher.

PeteSilas said:

I don't get the 45 year reference though.

I interpreted that to mean his entire "career" in music. Assuming he started playing seriously around the age of 12, it would mean that he was interpreting the past 45 years to have been an artificial reality ("suspended animation"), and he was progressing to a plane of existence that doesn't reference time and holds new meaning.