Other than wanting some tidbits from you, I have got nothing against you. And I annoy everyone. Not trying to. But I just think the way I do.

CatB said:

Sure. Sorry but this is BS. No matter what I said, you knew better.

SkipperLove said:

WTF are you talking about. I get on your nerves just as much. I have my own way of thinking about things. I am not singling her out. I actually want to hear from her more than most people on this site because of her personal experience.

CatB said:

Now, that is speaking for my personal experiences. I never wanted to date Prince, maybe play some ping-poing. I wanted him to be happy and healthy so I could listen to his music knowing it came from his heart. I am more inclined to defend Manuela than most. I don't hate Mayte but have some reservations about her one-sided ways.

Krystalkisses said:

CatB said:

Yes, thank you peggy. It's ridiculous. Debating just for the sake of it. I've noticed this in so many threads now, that poster went after so many of my posts, even trying to speak for my personal experiences. And this "extremely caucasian" remark about Quincy Jones' women in one of their posts still doesn't sit well with me. It made me cringe and it smells like racism.

It's probably just because you had the pleasure of knowing Prince. Alot of female Prince fans can be very nasty towards any women who got to know him and got his attention. I'm not speaking of anyone specific either but i have noticed the singling out of your posts. It is very sad. Keep your head up Cat.

CatB said:

Krystalkisses said:

CatB said:
It's probably just because you had the pleasure of knowing Prince. Alot of female Prince fans can be very nasty towards any women who got to know him and got his attention. I'm not speaking of anyone specific either but i have noticed the singling out of your posts. It is very sad. Keep your head up Cat.

Thank you, Krystal. I appreciate it. And I try, believe me. But sometimes it's really difficult and I did take a break from everything for months. But I have feelings too and all the fuckery that's going on triggers my emotions too. To me this is not just a case, to me this is about someone who had a huge impact on me, someone I have memories of in life. And all this useless debating things that none of those in question have even witnessed, all the defending of people in his life they don't even know, all this coming to me and on the one hand asking me to spill the most intimate things while on the other hand then come and attack me for either not giving them what they want or for "disrespecting" him for talking, up to the notion that they seriously think they can dictate me how, when, where and what I share. And all this time I have to listen to "you were so lucky" - while they don't even know a thing about my life or that episode of it. Believe me, that pleasure is very often a curse by now. Nothing is only black or white and Prince wasn't only sunshine too. I had to move on at some point. And now we're sitting here talking about his death, that is all a bit much. That's why I don't understand why some feel the need to make things more complicated and hurtful than they already are.

SkipperLove said:

SkipperLove said:

How well does anyone know the full truth about anyone? We can't read each others' minds. I don't know Cat or how long she knew Prince or the extent of their relationship. Other than her stating that she knew him when she was very young in Europe. But judging from what this fan (meaning myself) has read, Prince was an enigma to even people who knew him for years. It sounds like she wants answers too. So why come here on this site filled with fans with theories and no direct access to the man? I am not sure what I said to offend her. Other than being too over analytical and having some theories. THey are theories in an attempt to say "What if"..and to not have a thread about trying to understand Prince's tragedy turn into a thread that presumes that no one in last years of his life cared for him whatsoever. Do we forget that Prince and his later-day associates are/were people too who were/are just as capable of reading hurtful things on this site about themselves? I am not arguing just to argue. I am saying that most people are not just their worst traits and this includes Prince and most if not everyone else around him towards the end of his life..

Krystalkisses said:

CatB said:

Thank you, Krystal. I appreciate it. And I try, believe me. But sometimes it's really difficult and I did take a break from everything for months. But I have feelings too and all the fuckery that's going on triggers my emotions too. To me this is not just a case, to me this is about someone who had a huge impact on me, someone I have memories of in life. And all this useless debating things that none of those in question have even witnessed, all the defending of people in his life they don't even know, all this coming to me and on the one hand asking me to spill the most intimate things while on the other hand then come and attack me for either not giving them what they want or for "disrespecting" him for talking, up to the notion that they seriously think they can dictate me how, when, where and what I share. And all this time I have to listen to "you were so lucky" - while they don't even know a thing about my life or that episode of it. Believe me, that pleasure is very often a curse by now. Nothing is only black or white and Prince wasn't only sunshine too. I had to move on at some point. And now we're sitting here talking about his death, that is all a bit much. That's why I don't understand why some feel the need to make things more complicated and hurtful than they already are.

I'm sorry Cat. Sometimes people forget there are real people behind screen names. The Superstar/Fan dynamic can distort so much for some. I think his passing has brought out the worst in some of his fan base. People will believe what they want for their own reasons. But you will always have the truth.

[Edited 8/22/18 22:29pm]

Krystalkisses said:

CatB said:

Thank you, Krystal. I appreciate it. And I try, believe me. But sometimes it's really difficult and I did take a break from everything for months. But I have feelings too and all the fuckery that's going on triggers my emotions too. To me this is not just a case, to me this is about someone who had a huge impact on me, someone I have memories of in life. And all this useless debating things that none of those in question have even witnessed, all the defending of people in his life they don't even know, all this coming to me and on the one hand asking me to spill the most intimate things while on the other hand then come and attack me for either not giving them what they want or for "disrespecting" him for talking, up to the notion that they seriously think they can dictate me how, when, where and what I share. And all this time I have to listen to "you were so lucky" - while they don't even know a thing about my life or that episode of it. Believe me, that pleasure is very often a curse by now. Nothing is only black or white and Prince wasn't only sunshine too. I had to move on at some point. And now we're sitting here talking about his death, that is all a bit much. That's why I don't understand why some feel the need to make things more complicated and hurtful than they already are.

I'm sorry Cat. Sometimes people forget there are real people behind screen names. The Superstar/Fan dynamic can distort so much for some. I think his passing has brought out the worst in some of his fan base. People will believe what they want for their own reasons. But you will always have the truth.

See, I don't. That's probably one of my mistakes. I always think twice before I post or rather don't post it at all because it might rub somebody the wrong way. We all have our lives to live, we have problems and most of us have experienced loss in some way. So why don't we all give each other room to breathe.

CatB said:

SkipperLove said:

muchtoofast said:

SkipperLove said:

How well does anyone know the full truth about anyone? We can't read each others' minds. I don't know Cat or how long she knew Prince or the extent of their relationship. Other than her stating that she knew him when she was very young in Europe. But judging from what this fan (meaning myself) has read, Prince was an enigma to even people who knew him for years. It sounds like she wants answers too. So why come here on this site filled with fans with theories and no direct access to the man? I am not sure what I said to offend her. Other than being too over analytical and having some theories. THey are theories in an attempt to say "What if"..and to not have a thread about trying to understand Prince's tragedy turn into a thread that presumes that no one in last years of his life cared for him whatsoever. Do we forget that Prince and his later-day associates are/were people too who were/are just as capable of reading hurtful things on this site about themselves? I am not arguing just to argue. I am saying that most people are not just their worst traits and this includes Prince and most if not everyone else around him towards the end of his life..

[Edited 8/22/18 22:29pm]

Don’t worry about it, we are all free to leave if we get offended or hurt or feel guilty about something.

please go away

peggyon said:

I hate to sound like a broken record, but the first step to a possible resolution of what happened would be the release of the autopsy report. We have only a fraction of the results. Put it out there. My feeling is that the family and the estate are interested in one thing: making money. And lots of it. They can't bring him back, so they have moved on to protect and enlarge the bottom line. IMO the death investigation is messier than we can possibly know - and we know many things already. The main fact that people who knew Prince along the way are covering up what they knew had happened in the past years, and that the ones in his "inner" circle at the end don't seem to be telling everything they know ... They, too, appear to be protecting and enlarging their bottom lines. It's a very sad tale but it is what it is.

1Sasha said:

I hate to sound like a broken record, but the first step to a possible resolution of what happened would be the release of the autopsy report. We have only a fraction of the results. Put it out there. My feeling is that the family and the estate are interested in one thing: making money. And lots of it. They can't bring him back, so they have moved on to protect and enlarge the bottom line. IMO the death investigation is messier than we can possibly know - and we know many things already. The main fact that people who knew Prince along the way are covering up what they knew had happened in the past years, and that the ones in his "inner" circle at the end don't seem to be telling everything they know ... They, too, appear to be protecting and enlarging their bottom lines. It's a very sad tale but it is what it is.

Very true Sasha.

Something that really bothers me is when the associates fuel the flames, just like Apples and others have with their posts. They need to stop telling the fans this and maybe go to the authorities with what ever information they have.

I agree with Bodhi, they don't know anymore then the rest of us.


I've said it before and I'll say it again, they need to stop playing on Prince fans emotions. And we need to stop letting them play on our emotions. 2 years later and people like Apples are still putting this crap on social media. I say put up or shut up.

To me, it is like someone who says s/he knows a celebrity. "S/he's my friend" when in truth the celebrity probably doesn't even know who s/he is. Hey, I went to grad school with someone who is a US Senator right now. Oh, by the way, he's loaded because he co-founded a cellular company then sold it for big bucks. But I am sure he wouldn't remember me from Adam right about now. These people are just trying to hold onto the magic of fame - nothing more, nothing less, in my eyes.

I also think Prince surrounded himself with folks who may have been musically competent but lacked

"star-power" and never would have made it on their own.

It loooks like they wanted fame too by the looks of things. Riding coat-tails. It is strange to me that all of these folks are "available" to tour. Didn't they have their own fulfilling careers by now?

PennyPurple said:

Menes said:

Hiya love,

On the elouqent points made...

let's review why anyone connected to Prince would want him dead.

Tyka - This is not an option. She talks too much, was filled with envy and hate , never really had her moment( because Prince had all of it at such a young age) and is a recovering addict.

Prince knew all of this about her. He would never trust her with such a deeply held secret. She would be calling in for checks every single day if she had that information about him when he was alive.

Kirk- Though entirely connected to everything wrong about the time line, This was still his gravy train. Having him overdose in order to gain anything was/is fruitless. However , there is one corn in this bushel , which may boil down to control. It's easier to control a person like Prince if you provide the things he wants, regardless of how bad it may have turned out. This is a very strong possibility to me, (albeit not intentional). He knew the streets.

Meron- Not an option. She probably passed an ESL test just a few years ago. She's so not in this picture.

Judith. This was merely "company" A lady of the curtain providing services beyond "singing". She has no reason to revoke such "benefits".

To me, Prince went way outside of his own comfort zone to get everything just the way he wanted. Meaning, trusting those who he really didn't know as well as he did the others above.

My two centavos.

Good Points Menes & Welcome Back!

Why do you think he went way out of his comfort zone, this time? After all these years, why this time?

Hello Penny darling!

Well , Let's look at sourcing via process of elimination.

1. He does not drive. There's no way he would make a "run" to pick anything up.

2. Bodyguards, drivers, friends, or the "help" ,are not people a person like Prince would entrust with such an illicit task. This would amount to a tremendous amount of blackmail .

3. Receiving anything in the mail in such quantity ( @ PP) is equal to a dealer walking up to the front door and delivering it. No chance of that happening.

4. Placing on-line orders for off label substances requires a degree of setting up with a digital footprint when dabbling into dark web regions . From my recollection, he had someone else set up email accounts for him ( generally) so I don't think he would have gone to such extensive measures to find out how this works. Then there is payment , delivery, and receipt of goods. Way too much exposure IMO.

5. Visitors, (strange and known), would have been placed at PP within that time period and would have been identified by one of the members. If I'm not mistaken someone was always on site albeit in different areas.

6. Local contact- This is where I believe the hub is.

a. This has to be someone who is capable of accessing off label /illicit product in quantity.

b.This is a person that knew this particular "client" (Prince).

c.This is a person that was known by Prince.

d.This is a person that would have had to have access to Prince in some way in order to get him the product that kept fueling his addiction.

e. If the person is not meeting Prince in said locations, there must be a way for him to get it to Prince. There has to be a gatekeeper. It is not being delivered by stork or pigeon. The gatekeeper may have not have even known what was being picked up or delivered. However, it still remains that it had to be someone that is known by Prince, has access to Prince, and , has access to the "dealer".

f. The unique combination of chemical signature/compounds of the pill(s) tested ,indicates that no such pill was in circulation prior to Prince's death> see DEA database. Therefore, this batch is not only unique , but also a rather strange thing that none of it has showed up as a combination drug of choice on the streets.

g. Now , this should blow the gasket right off. Unawares to those who were screaming bloody murder, the information provided by the DEA ( unique chemical makeup of the pills) indicates that this was not an ordinary batch of "pills". This was not a corner pickup. There is something rather beneficial about the chemical makeup , yet, very sinister. It has the fingerprint of a conspiracy of some sort. But then , there is a bit of science that gives credence to the composition of the pill itself.

*If it wasn't so unique, it would be in the general public. Think of it as off label.

CatB said:

Krystalkisses said:

CatB said:
It's probably just because you had the pleasure of knowing Prince. Alot of female Prince fans can be very nasty towards any women who got to know him and got his attention. I'm not speaking of anyone specific either but i have noticed the singling out of your posts. It is very sad. Keep your head up Cat.

Thank you, Krystal. I appreciate it. And I try, believe me. But sometimes it's really difficult and I did take a break from everything for months. But I have feelings too and all the fuckery that's going on triggers my emotions too. To me this is not just a case, to me this is about someone who had a huge impact on me, someone I have memories of in life. And all this useless debating things that none of those in question have even witnessed, all the defending of people in his life they don't even know, all this coming to me and on the one hand asking me to spill the most intimate things while on the other hand then come and attack me for either not giving them what they want or for "disrespecting" him for talking, up to the notion that they seriously think they can dictate me how, when, where and what I share. And all this time I have to listen to "you were so lucky" - while they don't even know a thing about my life or that episode of it. Believe me, that pleasure is very often a curse by now. Nothing is only black or white and Prince wasn't only sunshine too. I had to move on at some point. And now we're sitting here talking about his death, that is all a bit much. That's why I don't understand why some feel the need to make things more complicated and hurtful than they already are.

Cat, the world is a hurtful place...please take some deep breaths and try not to internalize the fuckeree on this web site...your true feelings came through loud and clear in this post and I respect your anguish...but, perhaps, just so you don't get hurt more, or again, you should not share so much with those who might not understand the depths of your feelings...hang in there.

Interesting points to ponder. Thanks Menes.

Menes said:

PennyPurple said:

Good Points Menes & Welcome Back!

Why do you think he went way out of his comfort zone, this time? After all these years, why this time?

Hello Penny darling!

Well , Let's look at sourcing via process of elimination.

1. He does not drive. There's no way he would make a "run" to pick anything up.

2. Bodyguards, drivers, friends, or the "help" ,are not people a person like Prince would entrust with such an illicit task. This would amount to a tremendous amount of blackmail .

3. Receiving anything in the mail in such quantity ( @ PP) is equal to a dealer walking up to the front door and delivering it. No chance of that happening.

4. Placing on-line orders for off label substances requires a degree of setting up with a digital footprint when dabbling into dark web regions . From my recollection, he had someone else set up email accounts for him ( generally) so I don't think he would have gone to such extensive measures to find out how this works. Then there is payment , delivery, and receipt of goods. Way too much exposure IMO.

5. Visitors, (strange and known), would have been placed at PP within that time period and would have been identified by one of the members. If I'm not mistaken someone was always on site albeit in different areas.

6. Local contact- This is where I believe the hub is.

a. This has to be someone who is capable of accessing off label /illicit product in quantity.

b.This is a person that knew this particular "client" (Prince).

c.This is a person that was known by Prince.

d.This is a person that would have had to have access to Prince in some way in order to get him the product that kept fueling his addiction.

e. If the person is not meeting Prince in said locations, there must be a way for him to get it to Prince. There has to be a gatekeeper. It is not being delivered by stork or pigeon. The gatekeeper may have not have even known what was being picked up or delivered. However, it still remains that it had to be someone that is known by Prince, has access to Prince, and , has access to the "dealer".

f. The unique combination of chemical signature/compounds of the pill(s) tested ,indicates that no such pill was in circulation prior to Prince's death> see DEA database. Therefore, this batch is not only unique , but also a rather strange thing that none of it has showed up as a combination drug of choice on the streets.

g. Now , this should blow the gasket right off. Unawares to those who were screaming bloody murder, the information provided by the DEA ( unique chemical makeup of the pills) indicates that this was not an ordinary batch of "pills". This was not a corner pickup. There is something rather beneficial about the chemical makeup , yet, very sinister. It has the fingerprint of a conspiracy of some sort. But then , there is a bit of science that gives credence to the composition of the pill itself.

*If it wasn't so unique, it would be in the general public. Think of it as off label.

Menes said:

PennyPurple said:

Good Points Menes & Welcome Back!

Why do you think he went way out of his comfort zone, this time? After all these years, why this time?

Hello Penny darling!

Well , Let's look at sourcing via process of elimination.

1. He does not drive. There's no way he would make a "run" to pick anything up.

2. Bodyguards, drivers, friends, or the "help" ,are not people a person like Prince would entrust with such an illicit task. This would amount to a tremendous amount of blackmail .

3. Receiving anything in the mail in such quantity ( @ PP) is equal to a dealer walking up to the front door and delivering it. No chance of that happening.

4. Placing on-line orders for off label substances requires a degree of setting up with a digital footprint when dabbling into dark web regions . From my recollection, he had someone else set up email accounts for him ( generally) so I don't think he would have gone to such extensive measures to find out how this works. Then there is payment , delivery, and receipt of goods. Way too much exposure IMO.

5. Visitors, (strange and known), would have been placed at PP within that time period and would have been identified by one of the members. If I'm not mistaken someone was always on site albeit in different areas.

6. Local contact- This is where I believe the hub is.

a. This has to be someone who is capable of accessing off label /illicit product in quantity.

b.This is a person that knew this particular "client" (Prince).

c.This is a person that was known by Prince.

d.This is a person that would have had to have access to Prince in some way in order to get him the product that kept fueling his addiction.

e. If the person is not meeting Prince in said locations, there must be a way for him to get it to Prince. There has to be a gatekeeper. It is not being delivered by stork or pigeon. The gatekeeper may have not have even known what was being picked up or delivered. However, it still remains that it had to be someone that is known by Prince, has access to Prince, and , has access to the "dealer".

f. The unique combination of chemical signature/compounds of the pill(s) tested ,indicates that no such pill was in circulation prior to Prince's death> see DEA database. Therefore, this batch is not only unique , but also a rather strange thing that none of it has showed up as a combination drug of choice on the streets.

g. Now , this should blow the gasket right off. Unawares to those who were screaming bloody murder, the information provided by the DEA ( unique chemical makeup of the pills) indicates that this was not an ordinary batch of "pills". This was not a corner pickup. There is something rather beneficial about the chemical makeup , yet, very sinister. It has the fingerprint of a conspiracy of some sort. But then , there is a bit of science that gives credence to the composition of the pill itself.

*If it wasn't so unique, it would be in the general public. Think of it as off label.

On point as always, Menes.Prince was a smart guy caught in the grip of addiction and a mania for control...lather, rinse, repeat...missed you.

PennyPurple said:

Interesting points to ponder. Thanks Menes.

Menes said:

Hello Penny darling!

Well , Let's look at sourcing via process of elimination.

1. He does not drive. There's no way he would make a "run" to pick anything up.

2. Bodyguards, drivers, friends, or the "help" ,are not people a person like Prince would entrust with such an illicit task. This would amount to a tremendous amount of blackmail .

3. Receiving anything in the mail in such quantity ( @ PP) is equal to a dealer walking up to the front door and delivering it. No chance of that happening.

4. Placing on-line orders for off label substances requires a degree of setting up with a digital footprint when dabbling into dark web regions . From my recollection, he had someone else set up email accounts for him ( generally) so I don't think he would have gone to such extensive measures to find out how this works. Then there is payment , delivery, and receipt of goods. Way too much exposure IMO.

5. Visitors, (strange and known), would have been placed at PP within that time period and would have been identified by one of the members. If I'm not mistaken someone was always on site albeit in different areas.

6. Local contact- This is where I believe the hub is.

a. This has to be someone who is capable of accessing off label /illicit product in quantity.

b.This is a person that knew this particular "client" (Prince).

c.This is a person that was known by Prince.

d.This is a person that would have had to have access to Prince in some way in order to get him the product that kept fueling his addiction.

e. If the person is not meeting Prince in said locations, there must be a way for him to get it to Prince. There has to be a gatekeeper. It is not being delivered by stork or pigeon. The gatekeeper may have not have even known what was being picked up or delivered. However, it still remains that it had to be someone that is known by Prince, has access to Prince, and , has access to the "dealer".

f. The unique combination of chemical signature/compounds of the pill(s) tested ,indicates that no such pill was in circulation prior to Prince's death> see DEA database. Therefore, this batch is not only unique , but also a rather strange thing that none of it has showed up as a combination drug of choice on the streets.

g. Now , this should blow the gasket right off. Unawares to those who were screaming bloody murder, the information provided by the DEA ( unique chemical makeup of the pills) indicates that this was not an ordinary batch of "pills". This was not a corner pickup. There is something rather beneficial about the chemical makeup , yet, very sinister. It has the fingerprint of a conspiracy of some sort. But then , there is a bit of science that gives credence to the composition of the pill itself.

*If it wasn't so unique, it would be in the general public. Think of it as off label.

Wasn't it in the reports that there were more things found in the dumpster? Is Prince taking out his garbage? There must have been packaging of some sort there. I will have to look back into what, if any other evidence was recovered from the dumpster . I don't remember how they found the ecstacy ( as in pills or packaging, but I remember something about that.

Prince had very few people that were allowed intimate access . The man did not hang out, never drove, rarely was seen in public, and lastly, was obsessed with privacy. I can hardly believe that he would jeopardize everything by conducting a drug transaction with a stranger who had nothing to lose. This has to be someone "plugged in"... a professional , a seasoned vet of sorts .

As to access...

Take for instance D Lovato- easy call... hangs out with groups who party. Gets caught up, case closed.

Whitney Houston- sordid history , at times, drove to get her own supply in whatever city she laid her head. Lots of contact there.

K. Cobain- Everyone knew that the crowd he hung out with had access to "h".

T. Petty , addicted for decades, was public about it. Easy call .

Of the three that died, If I'm not mistaken ,there is one constant... combination drug toxicity.

With Prince, its fentanyl. Why just fentanyl ? For those who believe that it was just coincidence that these batches were fentanyl laced with one particular off label substance, they should ask themselves why the DEA can not find anything resembling any such combination? There is no reason to bulk up fentanyl in a pill form. A dealer is all the wise to bulk up powdered cocaine with said substances.

Point being, Prince was very disciplined and habituated in his usage. Even if one may believe he did not commit suicide, there are enough deceptive practices here that leads one to believe that he was very aware of what he was taking and why. Moline may have been accidental, but not because he did not know what he took. It is accidental because he took too much at one time. There's a fine line between taking too much( an accident), and determining to take more than you need (as in after the initial accident in Moline). The pills all had the same concentration and chemical composition. In saying that, one can determine that the pills, though illicit, could be taken as directed, and therefore, it is up to the user to determine how much to take to produce the desired effect.

Technically, I would argue that the dealer didn't kill Prince. I would also argue that although the compound in the pills induced death, it was the amount that was intentionally taken that did it. He could have just have easily ingested a dosage he was accustomed to for years and we would not have known anything about it.

Menes said:

PennyPurple said:

Interesting points to ponder. Thanks Menes.

Wasn't it in the reports that there were more things found in the dumpster? Is Prince taking out his garbage? There must have been packaging of some sort there. I will have to look back into what, if any other evidence was recovered from the dumpster . I don't remember how they found the ecstacy ( as in pills or packaging, but I remember something about that.

Prince had very few people that were allowed intimate access . The man did not hang out, never drove, rarely was seen in public, and lastly, was obsessed with privacy. I can hardly believe that he would jeopardize everything by conducting a drug transaction with a stranger who had nothing to lose. This has to be someone "plugged in"... a professional , a seasoned vet of sorts .

As to access...

Take for instance D Lovato- easy call... hangs out with groups who party. Gets caught up, case closed.

Whitney Houston- sordid history , at times, drove to get her own supply in whatever city she laid her head. Lots of contact there.

K. Cobain- Everyone knew that the crowd he hung out with had access to "h".

T. Petty , addicted for decades, was public about it. Easy call .

Of the three that died, If I'm not mistaken ,there is one constant... combination drug toxicity.

With Prince, its fentanyl. Why just fentanyl ? For those who believe that it was just coincidence that these batches were fentanyl laced with one particular off label substance, they should ask themselves why the DEA can not find anything resembling any such combination? There is no reason to bulk up fentanyl in a pill form. A dealer is all the wise to bulk up powdered cocaine with said substances.

Point being, Prince was very disciplined and habituated in his usage. Even if one may believe he did not commit suicide, there are enough deceptive practices here that leads one to believe that he was very aware of what he was taking and why. Moline may have been accidental, but not because he did not know what he took. It is accidental because he took too much at one time. There's a fine line between taking too much( an accident), and determining to take more than you need (as in after the initial accident in Moline). The pills all had the same concentration and chemical composition. In saying that, one can determine that the pills, though illicit, could be taken as directed, and therefore, it is up to the user to determine how much to take to produce the desired effect.

Technically, I would argue that the dealer didn't kill Prince. I would also argue that although the compound in the pills induced death, it was the amount that was intentionally taken that did it. He could have just have easily ingested a dosage he was accustomed to for years and we would not have known anything about it.

I believe that there was an empty bag found in the dumpster that the ecstasy was in. I'll have to look back to see if his DNA was found on it, but thinking back I don't think they found his DNA on it. I'd have to go back and have a look.

We have to remember that he did have a party there 5 days before he died.

Judith said he did drive and they would go out in the middle of the night and pick some things up.

Could the Narcan throw his system into a spiral and the dose he was used to taking was way too much after the Narcan? Even so the amount of fentanyl in those pills would have killed even the most experienced drug takers. Nobody in the US has had that much fentanyl in their system that I've heard of. ?

PennyPurple said:

Menes said:

Wasn't it in the reports that there were more things found in the dumpster? Is Prince taking out his garbage? There must have been packaging of some sort there. I will have to look back into what, if any other evidence was recovered from the dumpster . I don't remember how they found the ecstacy ( as in pills or packaging, but I remember something about that.

Prince had very few people that were allowed intimate access . The man did not hang out, never drove, rarely was seen in public, and lastly, was obsessed with privacy. I can hardly believe that he would jeopardize everything by conducting a drug transaction with a stranger who had nothing to lose. This has to be someone "plugged in"... a professional , a seasoned vet of sorts .

As to access...

Take for instance D Lovato- easy call... hangs out with groups who party. Gets caught up, case closed.

Whitney Houston- sordid history , at times, drove to get her own supply in whatever city she laid her head. Lots of contact there.

K. Cobain- Everyone knew that the crowd he hung out with had access to "h".

T. Petty , addicted for decades, was public about it. Easy call .

Of the three that died, If I'm not mistaken ,there is one constant... combination drug toxicity.

With Prince, its fentanyl. Why just fentanyl ? For those who believe that it was just coincidence that these batches were fentanyl laced with one particular off label substance, they should ask themselves why the DEA can not find anything resembling any such combination? There is no reason to bulk up fentanyl in a pill form. A dealer is all the wise to bulk up powdered cocaine with said substances.

Point being, Prince was very disciplined and habituated in his usage. Even if one may believe he did not commit suicide, there are enough deceptive practices here that leads one to believe that he was very aware of what he was taking and why. Moline may have been accidental, but not because he did not know what he took. It is accidental because he took too much at one time. There's a fine line between taking too much( an accident), and determining to take more than you need (as in after the initial accident in Moline). The pills all had the same concentration and chemical composition. In saying that, one can determine that the pills, though illicit, could be taken as directed, and therefore, it is up to the user to determine how much to take to produce the desired effect.

Technically, I would argue that the dealer didn't kill Prince. I would also argue that although the compound in the pills induced death, it was the amount that was intentionally taken that did it. He could have just have easily ingested a dosage he was accustomed to for years and we would not have known anything about it.

I believe that there was an empty bag found in the dumpster that the ecstasy was in. I'll have to look back to see if his DNA was found on it, but thinking back I don't think they found his DNA on it. I'd have to go back and have a look.

We have to remember that he did have a party there 5 days before he died.

Judith said he did drive and they would go out in the middle of the night and pick some things up.

Could the Narcan throw his system into a spiral and the dose he was used to taking was way too much after the Narcan? Even so the amount of fentanyl in those pills would have killed even the most experienced drug takers. Nobody in the US has had that much fentanyl in their system that I've heard of. ?

I think the Narcan threw him into withdrawal though he was medicating with opiates afterwards,but not enough to prevent "break-through" withdrawal symptoms.

The fentanyl dose he took on April 21 would have killed anyone. Because he took so much, it strikes me as a suicide, not a gesture.

peggyon said:

I think the Narcan threw him into withdrawal though he was medicating with opiates afterwards,but not enough to prevent "break-through" withdrawal symptoms.

The fentanyl dose he took on April 21 would have killed anyone. Because he took so much, it strikes me as a suicide, not a gesture.

But what if it was just 1 pill?

PennyPurple said:

Menes said:

Wasn't it in the reports that there were more things found in the dumpster? Is Prince taking out his garbage? There must have been packaging of some sort there. I will have to look back into what, if any other evidence was recovered from the dumpster . I don't remember how they found the ecstacy ( as in pills or packaging, but I remember something about that.

Prince had very few people that were allowed intimate access . The man did not hang out, never drove, rarely was seen in public, and lastly, was obsessed with privacy. I can hardly believe that he would jeopardize everything by conducting a drug transaction with a stranger who had nothing to lose. This has to be someone "plugged in"... a professional , a seasoned vet of sorts .

As to access...

Take for instance D Lovato- easy call... hangs out with groups who party. Gets caught up, case closed.

Whitney Houston- sordid history , at times, drove to get her own supply in whatever city she laid her head. Lots of contact there.

K. Cobain- Everyone knew that the crowd he hung out with had access to "h".

T. Petty , addicted for decades, was public about it. Easy call .

Of the three that died, If I'm not mistaken ,there is one constant... combination drug toxicity.

With Prince, its fentanyl. Why just fentanyl ? For those who believe that it was just coincidence that these batches were fentanyl laced with one particular off label substance, they should ask themselves why the DEA can not find anything resembling any such combination? There is no reason to bulk up fentanyl in a pill form. A dealer is all the wise to bulk up powdered cocaine with said substances.

Point being, Prince was very disciplined and habituated in his usage. Even if one may believe he did not commit suicide, there are enough deceptive practices here that leads one to believe that he was very aware of what he was taking and why. Moline may have been accidental, but not because he did not know what he took. It is accidental because he took too much at one time. There's a fine line between taking too much( an accident), and determining to take more than you need (as in after the initial accident in Moline). The pills all had the same concentration and chemical composition. In saying that, one can determine that the pills, though illicit, could be taken as directed, and therefore, it is up to the user to determine how much to take to produce the desired effect.

Technically, I would argue that the dealer didn't kill Prince. I would also argue that although the compound in the pills induced death, it was the amount that was intentionally taken that did it. He could have just have easily ingested a dosage he was accustomed to for years and we would not have known anything about it.

I believe that there was an empty bag found in the dumpster that the ecstasy was in. I'll have to look back to see if his DNA was found on it, but thinking back I don't think they found his DNA on it. I'd have to go back and have a look.

We have to remember that he did have a party there 5 days before he died.

Judith said he did drive and they would go out in the middle of the night and pick some things up.

Could the Narcan throw his system into a spiral and the dose he was used to taking was way too much after the Narcan? Even so the amount of fentanyl in those pills would have killed even the most experienced drug takers. Nobody in the US has had that much fentanyl in their system that I've heard of. ?

Yea, not sure about what was found and by whom in the reports. But who is taking out the trash? Strangers had access to the trash to? I didn't mean to say it was his, but I was leading into how much he would have been doing around the house. I would think that domestic help would be doing that.

If Prince drove to "pick up" , then it stand as is...local. That would mean that he certainly exercised the poorest option in concealing his usage , and rather, exposed himself to one the most common ways of getting busted with illicit substances/paraphernalia


Well if the pills were all consistent in composition, and that he was taking these same pills prior to his death, there is no way he took one pill. He would have been dead way before that date. I certainly think he was taking these pills before.

Menes said:

PennyPurple said:

Interesting points to ponder. Thanks Menes.

Wasn't it in the reports that there were more things found in the dumpster? Is Prince taking out his garbage? There must have been packaging of some sort there. I will have to look back into what, if any other evidence was recovered from the dumpster . I don't remember how they found the ecstacy ( as in pills or packaging, but I remember something about that.

Prince had very few people that were allowed intimate access . The man did not hang out, never drove, rarely was seen in public, and lastly, was obsessed with privacy. I can hardly believe that he would jeopardize everything by conducting a drug transaction with a stranger who had nothing to lose. This has to be someone "plugged in"... a professional , a seasoned vet of sorts .

As to access...

Take for instance D Lovato- easy call... hangs out with groups who party. Gets caught up, case closed.

Whitney Houston- sordid history , at times, drove to get her own supply in whatever city she laid her head. Lots of contact there.

K. Cobain- Everyone knew that the crowd he hung out with had access to "h".

T. Petty , addicted for decades, was public about it. Easy call .

Of the three that died, If I'm not mistaken ,there is one constant... combination drug toxicity.

With Prince, its fentanyl. Why just fentanyl ? For those who believe that it was just coincidence that these batches were fentanyl laced with one particular off label substance, they should ask themselves why the DEA can not find anything resembling any such combination? There is no reason to bulk up fentanyl in a pill form. A dealer is all the wise to bulk up powdered cocaine with said substances.

Point being, Prince was very disciplined and habituated in his usage. Even if one may believe he did not commit suicide, there are enough deceptive practices here that leads one to believe that he was very aware of what he was taking and why. Moline may have been accidental, but not because he did not know what he took. It is accidental because he took too much at one time. There's a fine line between taking too much( an accident), and determining to take more than you need (as in after the initial accident in Moline). The pills all had the same concentration and chemical composition. In saying that, one can determine that the pills, though illicit, could be taken as directed, and therefore, it is up to the user to determine how much to take to produce the desired effect.

Technically, I would argue that the dealer didn't kill Prince. I would also argue that although the compound in the pills induced death, it was the amount that was intentionally taken that did it. He could have just have easily ingested a dosage he was accustomed to for years and we would not have known anything about it.

correct again. ..he knew what he was doing...the only thing NOT known is how much emotional pain, shame and angst he was having to absorb after Moline. I think that being found dead in his elevator indicates it was more than he was willing or able to bear.

PennyPurple said:

peggyon said:

I think the Narcan threw him into withdrawal though he was medicating with opiates afterwards,but not enough to prevent "break-through" withdrawal symptoms.

The fentanyl dose he took on April 21 would have killed anyone. Because he took so much, it strikes me as a suicide, not a gesture.

But what if it was just 1 pill?

that is the 64,000 dollar question. Did he ever just take one pill? I wonder what he thought he was taking??

Menes said:

Yea, not sure about what was found and by whom in the reports. But who is taking out the trash? Strangers had access to the trash to? I didn't mean to say it was his, but I was leading into how much he would have been doing around the house. I would think that domestic help would be doing that.

If Prince drove to "pick up" , then it stand as is...local. That would mean that he certainly exercised the poorest option in concealing his usage , and rather, exposed himself to one the most common ways of getting busted with illicit substances/paraphernalia


Well if the pills were all consistent in composition, and that he was taking these same pills prior to his death, there is no way he took one pill. He would have been dead way before that date. I certainly think he was taking these pills before.

So it wasn't just a bad batch of pills? Custom made? Did they ever release how much was in each pill?

I still don't want to think it was suicide.

PennyPurple said:

Menes said:

Yea, not sure about what was found and by whom in the reports. But who is taking out the trash? Strangers had access to the trash to? I didn't mean to say it was his, but I was leading into how much he would have been doing around the house. I would think that domestic help would be doing that.

If Prince drove to "pick up" , then it stand as is...local. That would mean that he certainly exercised the poorest option in concealing his usage , and rather, exposed himself to one the most common ways of getting busted with illicit substances/paraphernalia


Well if the pills were all consistent in composition, and that he was taking these same pills prior to his death, there is no way he took one pill. He would have been dead way before that date. I certainly think he was taking these pills before.

So it wasn't just a bad batch of pills? Custom made? Did they ever release how much was in each pill?

I still don't want to think it was suicide.

Here's the thing, if it was a bad batch of pills , and we agree that he was feeding from the same batch ( by all accounts of what was found) don't we think he should have been dead way before that day? I mean, how lucky is this guy? What are the chances? They were a lot of pills in the batches.

I thnk we have to determine why the pills were created in the first place. Why are the pills such a "new" makeup of substances and not able to be found anywhere else prior to his death?

Why would a person who had such a life changing event choose to ingest anything resembling what caused the overdose previously, decide to partake in the same action within a short period of time? The short answer is addiction, but the real answer lies somewhere else.

To your statement...why do you not want to think it was susicide? Do you think he was aware of what he took and how much he took prior to going unconscious?