rdhull said:

TKO said:

Jay Z is greedy.

Prince, WB, and nobody else was/is though right?

Who Is Casey Rain? Musician Slams Jay-Z Over Prince Estate Claims On 4:44

My ONLY problem with the JAY-Z-Tidal/Prince deal was there were no LIVE video streams of Prince concerts...yet! Because I already KNEW damn well...they were possible. And I was NOT joining the Tidal platform for anything LESS and made that perfectly clear!

However, had Prince lived and EVERY concert he performed ANYWHERE in the world was LIVE video streamed so that I could watch them for a fee on Tidal...Prince and HOV would have been easily getting ALL of MY damn money!



And if any of you Jay-Z/Tidal haters are saying you would not have LOVED that too...you're fucking LYING!

Kanye West just left Tidal over non-payment and they're threatening to sue him. Sure makes Jay-Z's words about Prince more hollow.

http://www.tmz.com/2017/07/02/kanye-west-jay-z-tidal-money-lawsuit/

OldFriends4Sale said:

1725topp said:

*

Stop putting words into my mouth/statement to construct your straw man argument. Show me where I said that I was a Jay-Z fan. I've written on this site several times that I'm the least hip hop person I know. And, I've never purchased a Jay-Z album in my life. I am aware of some of his biggest hits, but I'm more aware of his narrative arc to improve his life. His music, for the most, doesn't move me, but I like a lot of the philanthropic work that he does. This is the point I was addressing--that the ladies you presented seemingly have a very narrow/myopic understanding of what it means to be a black person struggling against white supremacy while also struggling to become a better individual. You presented these ladies as if somehow that proves that Jay-Z is harming the community with his work, and I simply countered by asserting, again, that their notions seem to be limited and that there have always been black folks willing to minimize other black folks either to ingratiate themselves to the white power structure or simply because they don't like that other black person's notion of blackness.

*

As such, the pissing contest started when you felt a need to list their socio-political accomplishments as if that somehow justifies their narrow-minded/myopic understanding of blackness. By listing their accomplishments, you seemed to be clearly assuming/asserting that folks who see Jay-Z has having made a positive change and impact on the black community are people who could not have possibly done as much for the black community as the two ladies that you presented. These ladies may have done some work for/within the black community, but that does not mean that their notion of Jay-Z and blackness is not limited/narrow.

Ok you are not a Jay Z fan...
Titty is though.

.

that sounds funny

Strive said:

Kanye West just left Tidal over non-payment and they're threatening to sue him. Sure makes Jay-Z's words about Prince more hollow.

http://www.tmz.com/2017/07/02/kanye-west-jay-z-tidal-money-lawsuit/

Jay Z disrespected his wife and family. I would leave too.

But this is the same person yall feel has Prince best interest LMAO.

Strive said:

Kanye West just left Tidal over non-payment and they're threatening to sue him. Sure makes Jay-Z's words about Prince more hollow.

http://www.tmz.com/2017/07/02/kanye-west-jay-z-tidal-money-lawsuit/

Pretty funny that this happens after that verse come out though.

rdhull said:

OldFriends4Sale said:

Ok you are not a Jay Z fan...
Titty is though.

.

that sounds funny

I agree.

Interesting, thank you for sharing.

purplethunder3121 said:

Who Is Casey Rain? Musician Slams Jay-Z Over Prince Estate Claims On 4:44

BY DORY JACKSON @DORY_JACKSON ON 06/30/17 AT 5:54 PM

Jay-Z Will Produce Trayvon Martin Film And Documentary

00:00

00:48

Musician Casey Rain called out Jay-Z in a lengthy, since-deleted Facebook post Friday for his accusations against the Prince estate on the song "Caught Their Eyes." In his rant, Rain alleged that Jay-Z attempted to "rewrite history" with his criticisms of the estate.

The rapper has endured an ongoing legal battle with the Prince estate over the late singer's digital music catalog. Jay-Z has used his latest album 4:44, which debuted Friday, to address several issues that have plagued him, more specifically his battle with the Prince estate over the late artist's discography.

Rain is a British musician who is influenced by Prince. He also serves as a staff writer for fan community Prince.org. Rain, also known as S-Endz, doesn't have a large following on social media. His verified Twitter handle has roughly 6,000 followers, with his Instagram and Facebook profiles bringing in slightly over 2,000 each. His music falls within the electronica and pop vein.

Read: When Will Jay-Z's New Alb... Exclusive

On "Caught Their Eyes," Jay-Z blames the estate — primarily former advisor Londell McMillan — for not holding to Prince's wishes to have his digital catalog available on Tidal, the rapper's premium music streaming service. Hov offered a reported $40 million for the Prince's music collection, according to an October 2016 report from TMZ. Following Prince's death, Jay-Z went up against the estate in a Minnesota court over the deal.

"Everyone knows the Prince Estate, family, and Paisley Park is problematic. But Jay-Z throwing shots on his new album is him trying to rewrite history," Rain wrote in the Facebook post. "He can complain all he wants, but the fact is, he offered a pathetic amount of money for the vault which would have barely covered one-third of what the IRS was coming for."

Rain's rant didn't end there, as he proceeded to criticize Jay-Z's alleged decision to release what TMZ reported to be 15 of Prince's lesser-known album's illegally on Tidal.

"Furthermore, he talks about sitting down with Prince before he died but neglects to mention that he started putting bootlegs up on TIDAL Prince died as well as they had no rights for," he added. "Not down with this nonsense from Hov."

With help from R&B singer Frank Ocean taking thing the chorus, Jay-Z told his truth on "Caught Their Eyes." In it, he discussed how he "sat down with Prince, eye to eye" to discuss the Tidal deal.

"He told me his wishes before he died / Now, Londell McMillan, he must be color blind / They only see green from them purple eyes / They eyes hide, they eyes high / My eyes wide shut to all the lies / These industry n—s, they always been fishy," Jay-Z said.

He added: "This guy had 'Slave' on his face / You think he wanted the masters with his masters? / You greedy bastards sold tickets to walk through his house / I'm surprised you ain't auction off the casket / Don't big bro me, don't "Big Homie"/ I've seen pure admiration become rivals / I've been to Paris at least two times / I've seen the Eiffel, I've seen a eyeful."

Read: JAY-Z New Album: Rapper S...‘4:44’

According to Rolling Stone, Jay-Z's company Roc Nation created a petition in 2016 for the "court to enforce what they claim is an agreed-upon arrangement with Prince concerning his digital catalog." However, TMZ noted that the estate filed a separate petition regarding their desire to not have "Roc Nation to exploit any of the intellectual property assets of the Estate."

The estate wanted Prince's music to be available on multiple streaming services to increase revenue opportunities, not just serve as a Tidal-exclusive deal.

Prince died without a will in sight. Rolling Stone also noted that McMillian, a lawyer who served as the estate's advisor, realized that there was never a physical agreement made between Prince and Jay-Z over the late singer's digital collection. Likewise, the deal didn't end up falling in line with Hov's initial plan.

Nonetheless, "Caught Their Eyes" seems to provide an inside look at Jay-Z's side of the story.

Jay-Z, pictured May 2, 2013 at 'The Great Gatsby' world premiere in New York, the rapper dissed the Prince estate on his new album 4:44. Photo: Getty Images

Tittypants said:

rdhull said:

that sounds funny

I agree.

*

Me three--it is funny.

Tittypants said:

Strive said:

Kanye West just left Tidal over non-payment and they're threatening to sue him. Sure makes Jay-Z's words about Prince more hollow.

http://www.tmz.com/2017/07/02/kanye-west-jay-z-tidal-money-lawsuit/

Pretty funny that this happens after that verse come out though.

Jay had something to say about kanye too

"You gave him 20 million, he gave you 20 minutes on stage"

OOOP. Bitch spill that tea.

popgodazipa said:

Might be uncomfortable for some to believe but Prince choose to have his music on Tidal because. 1)He believed in Jay's artist friendly, middle finger to the overseer approach and 2)he wanted to support this black owned business. The struggle is real, just listen to Black Muse.

THIS

Great Points...Prince was about Principle more than Money..

even though sometimes the Principle WAS all about Money !!!!!

Basically Prince was leading the way as always . TIDAL, if properly supported can allow

Artists and Musicians to BOYCOTT the current system entirely.

That was Princes Modus Operendi..

Tittypants said:

rdhull said:

that sounds funny

I agree.

fyi
I've always loved your ID

Tittypants said:

OldFriends4Sale said:

lol so where did you get the idea that all of a sudden on a Prince.org site

that 'the hate you see for Jay-Z, about Prince, on this site is race related...'?

when outside of the 2014-2015 tidal discussion has there been a bunch of Prince+Jay Z related discussions full of hate for Jay Z that you have been seeing?

.
You asked for PrOoF.

I just directed you to a very active thread about Jay Z and his current album,

including Org members opinions on Jay Z and members I KNOW(facts) are African-American who have issue with Jay Z.

So why not check it out?

Why not post your opinion of Org members who are full of hate(or just don't care for him) there and get a real opinion? To not do so, isn't it being naive?

.

Is it that you prefer to believe something smokey based on a feeling, instead of fact, by asking org member right over in a different forum to get facts?

.

Isn't that like sitting in a room in your home listening to other people in another room talk about something you are not clear on, but instead come to a conclusion, then go into a third room of people as say 'I think the people in room 2 are saying A B C D' instead of just going into room 2 and asking?

Do you want me to ask for you?

The org does not make up earth's general population & you cannot defend any orger you don't know personally. Anybody can be anybody online, So while all the hate isn't always race related [which I never said it was], I'm willing to bet that some is. BUT not many will be willing to put out there that they're racist. How is that so hard to believe? Even if I wasn't a Jay-Z fan, if I see something fishy, I call it out. No matter what. I have love for every ethnicity. I don't discriminate.

It does actually. I mean if you said a general 'the hate you see...', then I would agree.
But you said and I quote again "The Hate You See For Jay Z, about Prince, ON THIS SITE..."

Right? So your judgement was about all members on PRINCE.ORG

.

And you did say the Hate was RACE related.

.

I mean if someone is a bigot they are a bigot, they probably wouldn't be on Prince.org anyway. So do they even matter?
.
From my deep observations about the Org. Prince fans as I've observed since Prince passed are out for blood(not all) but a lot. I mean even look at how a lot of these purple concubines are attacking each other. You have lots of people who still feel unresolved about Prince's death and a segment that think someone killed him whether it is Kirk, WB, Tyka, Londell etc and people think anyone and everyone is out for $$. The org was even accused of selling out to the Estate because of some promotional stuff being posted.

.

Again, go to the Jay Z album discussion, and ask each individual member. Betting and willing doesn't get you the info you want.

We only have the estate's and Londell's word that the albums added to Tidal after Prince's passing were unauthorised. It may have been Prince's plan to eventually add those titles. If it wasn't, where did Tidal source them from? Because some of them were rare and in great quality.

[Edited 7/3/17 5:21am]

It's also worth mentioning that the estate (or at least their representatives) also tried to claim that some of the Prince albums added to Tidal while Prince was still alive were also unauthorised. Clearly, this is false.

Strive said:

Kanye West just left Tidal over non-payment and they're threatening to sue him. Sure makes Jay-Z's words about Prince more hollow.

http://www.tmz.com/2017/07/02/kanye-west-jay-z-tidal-money-lawsuit/

No it means Kayne broke his contract as Kayne has serious mental health issues and probaly should not be making any business decisions. Who is actually taking him seriously at this point. I do not say this to make fun of stituation. I feel it was obvious that something was wrong with him and it is sad none in his team moved to get him help.

OperatingThetan said:

It's also worth mentioning that the estate (or at least their representatives) also tried to claim that some of the Prince albums added to Tidal while Prince was still alive were also unauthorised. Clearly, this is false.

Of course it is false. Did Jay-Z break into Paisley Park and still the files? Did Prince send them live material from his last tour after the break in?

Londell made these claims because he wanted to negotiate new deals to get a commission check. Like I said before Tidal is a subsidary of Aspiro if people think the parent company has no attorneys to oversee contracts they need to get out of their feelings and get in touch with reality.

No one is paying money to an artist without receivng content and Prince was not sending any content without getting some sort of payment or perhaps equity in Tidal.

I would love for someone on this board to explain how this exchange took place without Prince's involvment or knowledge? I will keep waiting. I will keep waiting to understand how Tidal can keep the files up on the site without permision. The last time I looked a court order could be used to pull material off the stie yet nothing has happend.

OldFriends4Sale said:

Tittypants said:

The org does not make up earth's general population & you cannot defend any orger you don't know personally. Anybody can be anybody online, So while all the hate isn't always race related [which I never said it was], I'm willing to bet that some is. BUT not many will be willing to put out there that they're racist. How is that so hard to believe? Even if I wasn't a Jay-Z fan, if I see something fishy, I call it out. No matter what. I have love for every ethnicity. I don't discriminate.

It does actually. I mean if you said a general 'the hate you see...', then I would agree.
But you said and I quote again "The Hate You See For Jay Z, about Prince, ON THIS SITE..."

Right? So your judgement was about all members on PRINCE.ORG

.

And you did say the Hate was RACE related.

.

I mean if someone is a bigot they are a bigot, they probably wouldn't be on Prince.org anyway. So do they even matter?
.
From my deep observations about the Org. Prince fans as I've observed since Prince passed are out for blood(not all) but a lot. I mean even look at how a lot of these purple concubines are attacking each other. You have lots of people who still feel unresolved about Prince's death and a segment that think someone killed him whether it is Kirk, WB, Tyka, Londell etc and people think anyone and everyone is out for $$. The org was even accused of selling out to the Estate because of some promotional stuff being posted.

.

Again, go to the Jay Z album discussion, and ask each individual member. Betting and willing doesn't get you the info you want.

*

Responding just to your point about a bigot more than likely not being a member of Prince.org, I would argue that the history of racism--especially racism in America--teaches us that bigotry and racism are a bit more complicated. Remember that the minstrel show was created by whites who loved black singing and dancing while at the same time these whites were maintaining slavery over black people. Additionally, prior to the 1970s, there were clubs and hotels in which African Americans performed but were not allowed to sleep, eat, or enter through the front door of these places. So, clearly, bigotry and racism have an element of schizophrenia, specifically as it relates to white supremacy, in which whites have a history of enjoying African-American entertainers while simultaneously perceiving and confining them as second-class and subhuman. Thus, the same could be said of some Prince fans who would view Prince as a "special Negro" or "not even a real Negro," especially if they are holding to the mix-raced theory of Prince. So, it would not be that unusual for bigots or racists to be members of Prince.org because, again, that's the documented schizophrenia of white supremacy. Many white people have shown the ability to enjoy black art--art created by black people--while having a negative perception of the majority of black people.

*

Taking all of this to a logical conclusion, people should then understand that when African Americans who are aware of this history and live this reality on a daily basis read much--and I do mean much--of what is posted on the Org, then it is also normal for our racist and bigotry radar to be activated. Of course, the extreme of this is the statement made by LA Guns singer Phil Lewis: "...there was Prince doing his own fucking thing. The problem is, right now — and I’m not gonna be a racist about it — but black people are all one-dimensional. We need more Princes, man. We need less fucking rappers and more people like Prince. There, I said it." Can there be anything more racist than this? Yet, these types of statements are made on the Org regularly in very coded ways, especially as Prince became more Afrocentric in his subject matter. (I remember one poster actually asked: “Why is Prince saying ‘right on’ and ‘power to the people’ in a song?” And somebody had to answer with “because he is a black man who was born in the 50s and raised through the 60s and 70s. What else would he say?”) So, I just don't think it is as simple as saying that a bigot may not be a member of Prince.org. Again, history clearly shows that many white folks have had and continue to have a very schizophrenic relationship with black folks, especially in how they are able to enjoy black art while simultaneously demeaning or minimizing black people. As such, a lot of African Americans on this site feel the sting of racism and bigotry daily on this site, but we remain only because it’s the best place to get current news about Prince, especially bootlegs. Yes, it’s true; as an often offended African American, I remain on this site because the allure of new Prince bootlegs outweighs the racism, and I have a pretty nice collection that I've been building since 1989 when I obtained my first bootleg. However, if the Prince Estate ever gets its act together and releases all the live shows as video and audio, I’m blowing this pop tart stand with the quickness. Okay, so the Org is not a “pop tart” stand, but you get the point.

OperatingThetan said:

Londell is clearly a crook who screwed up the deal and still wants his fee. Jay-Z however, gave Prince exactly what he wanted at Tidal and Prince was clearly happy. Without Tidal Prince's last two albums, plus other exclusive material would never have been released. Some fans simply have a bias against Jay-Z that Prince didn't share.

PREACH!

I'm thinking that Prince fans' problem with Jay-Z isn't with him at all. It's really about what each of you thinks Prince should or should not have been doing/singing/playing in the years leading up to his death and the provisions you wanted him to make for his catalog after he left.

How a conversation about a verse can so quickly spiral into an assessment of Jay-Z's character or TIDAL's missteps (or dragging Beyoncé into a conversation that has precisely nothing at all to do with her, a feat all of her talent's deniers have mastered with impressive accuracy) is so banal. I see it here all the time and it's always late.

...but what's really late is that despite the number of years I've been on this website, I still struggle to make a normal looking post. We're all degenerates in one way or another.

mjscarousal said:

laurarichardson said:

mjscarousal said: --It is not about siding it is about legalities. Do you really think that Prince gave Tidal music files and received no payment? Why did Prince say he wanted to put the last concert on Tidal and sent content the last week he was alive if he revived no money. Do you realize a big chunk of his catalogue we would not even have access to if it were not on Tidal. Do you not know what equity is? Do you realize the difference between and charity/non-profit and a business. Oh a people have been embellioning things in music since the blues. What is your point?

So if YOU know people embellish things in rap songs why are you choosing to believe Jay Z then? What you said makes no sense. Read what you said.

None of this has anything to do with the fact that you are choosing to side and trust Jay Z (for whatever reason). He hasn't done anything that shows that fans should completely trust his word. He has done shady things such as putting unauthorize material on TIDAL without Prince/Estate permission RIGHT after he passed away (basically taking advantage of his death) So I KNOW right there he aint shit and never will be shit.

.

I agree. Jay Z has never done anything that has impressed me. It's about the money and it's always been about the money for him. He does not care about Prince's legacy or his estate. His primary intent was to manage P's catalog and have it "exclusively" on Tidal, for financial gain. Pure greed. He did a lot of shady things, which makes people not want to trust him.

mjscarousal said:

Strive said:

Kanye West just left Tidal over non-payment and they're threatening to sue him. Sure makes Jay-Z's words about Prince more hollow.

http://www.tmz.com/2017/07/02/kanye-west-jay-z-tidal-money-lawsuit/

Jay Z disrespected his wife and family. I would leave too.

But this is the same person yall feel has Prince best interest LMAO.

.

Personally, I think all this Jay Z and Kanye stuff is being done for publicity and to stir-up controversy. It gets clicks and sells records.

cloveringold85 said:

mjscarousal said:

Jay Z disrespected his wife and family. I would leave too.

But this is the same person yall feel has Prince best interest LMAO.

.

Personally, I think all this Jay Z and Kanye stuff is being done for publicity and to stir-up controversy. It gets clicks and sells records.

I agree.Kanye is the ultimate media whore.He likes to create "feuds" with other celebrities just to keep his name in the media.

SoulAlive said:

cloveringold85 said:

.

Personally, I think all this Jay Z and Kanye stuff is being done for publicity and to stir-up controversy. It gets clicks and sells records.

I agree.Kanye is the ultimate media whore.He likes to create "feuds" with other celebrities just to keep his name in the media.

.

Truth spoken! I hate to say this, but I almost feel that these artists do these things nowadays because the music industry is so competitive and it's like some people will do anything, just to have their name in the news, and keep people talking and of course, buying their music. Everything is done for shock value now, imo.

SoulAlive said:

cloveringold85 said:

.

Personally, I think all this Jay Z and Kanye stuff is being done for publicity and to stir-up controversy. It gets clicks and sells records.

I agree.Kanye is the ultimate media whore.He likes to create "feuds" with other celebrities just to keep his name in the media.

nah, thats 50 Cent

cloveringold85 said:

mjscarousal said:

Jay Z disrespected his wife and family. I would leave too.

But this is the same person yall feel has Prince best interest LMAO.

.

Personally, I think all this Jay Z and Kanye stuff is being done for publicity and to stir-up controversy. It gets clicks and sells records.

I agree but this "feud" is not Kanye's fault. Just 2-3 weeks ago Jay Z was praising Kanye as an inspiration but on his new album Jay Z trashed Kanye and his family. Now its possible Kanye knew about the diss ahead of time but I think that Jay Z is the one that purposely chose to shade Kanye, Future and Eric benet for attention for his new album. He also talked about cheating and his marital issues for attention, so yes I agree he purposely is doing all of this for free PR and attention.The album is not even all of that.

cloveringold85 said:

mjscarousal said:

So if YOU know people embellish things in rap songs why are you choosing to believe Jay Z then? What you said makes no sense. Read what you said.

None of this has anything to do with the fact that you are choosing to side and trust Jay Z (for whatever reason). He hasn't done anything that shows that fans should completely trust his word. He has done shady things such as putting unauthorize material on TIDAL without Prince/Estate permission RIGHT after he passed away (basically taking advantage of his death) So I KNOW right there he aint shit and never will be shit.

.

I agree. Jay Z has never done anything that has impressed me. It's about the money and it's always been about the money for him. He does not care about Prince's legacy or his estate. His primary intent was to manage P's catalog and have it "exclusively" on Tidal, for financial gain. Pure greed. He did a lot of shady things, which makes people not want to trust him.

I agree 100% That is the only reason why he called Londell out and he is in his feelings. Jay Z doesn't care about Prince legacy.

what were the high quality bootlegs that showed up on tidal?

were they live shows? are they commonly circulating or was this some crazy good new shit?

i have a 90 minute jay z mixtape that i could probably sing every lyric to .. i also think he is a douche bag and a poor representative of his race and his profession as a musician .. his obsession with flaunting materialism and women as property was nothing short of disgusting .. the record industry absolutely has an agenda to promote "entertainers" that degrade hip hop culture in this manner .. jay z participated and made millions .. all media will fight and flood the market with anything but a positive portrayal of any minority culture .. it is rare and a huge challenge for a positive person like prince to "get over" on a huge scale .. he was embraced for the period of being a sexual deviant as the industry is happy to portray black men as obsessed with sex so they can call them all rapists .. once prince grew up a little and spoke out about the slave culture of the entertainment industry his ability to reach the public was vastly reduced .. even the sex obsessed nature of pr deluxe represents the only image of prince wb really wants to promote ..

I wouldn't put much stock into Kanye leaving Tidal as he has impulse control issues