XxAxX said:

I don't find any fault with Larry Graham. I think that the JW faith worked for Prince for a long time. But, and I may be wrong, I think that P. had broadened his horizons in recent years concerning his faith and belief system... I may be wrong, but I don't think so.

ksgemini63 said:

XxAxX said:

larry is a good man. i remember back in the day i resented the whole 'towel waving' thing onstage and worried about JW prohibitions on prince seeking medical treatment for his hip (that was just a rumor back in the day). to the extent that larry persuaded prince to destroy old masters of naughtier songs, i regret that. but, when i met him in person larry was nice to me. prince did what he wanted and that was that. i think larry was a good friend but even he couldn't have made prince do anything prince didn't want to do..

Except put out his cd and get taken in by a cult

I was watching a clip from some late night show with LG, P and Mayte, later LG's wife joined them, and they were talking about the Stauros thing and P was trying to explain it and then he asked Larry to eplain it to the audience. The way P looked at LG while he was talking, you could tell he really absorbed every word the man said and really adored him.

I am not a fan of organized religion, but to each his own. I don't open my door to JW's and they are here every week, knocking away. I made that mistake one time and one time only. I don't know, maybe they are on a quota system where they have to save a certain amount of souls or something.

nursev said:

Astasheiks said:

Prince got duped or should I say fooled...

[Edited 5/17/16 11:55am]

Seriously I use to like Larry especially in his one in a million days...but people are saying we shouldn't blame him...really? Prince needed guidance and Larry took advantage of that. I believe that and always will. Yes Prince made his own decisions, but Larry influenced him. He indeed fooled the hell oughtta him. What grown man packs up and moves to another state for another man that's not blood related to him? shit is foul

PREACH IT NURSE!! I said the same in another thread. If anyone wants proof of Larry using P I suggest watching the BET interview. Somewhere near the end of the show it's P, LG, and Chaka. Now, they all had new albums dropping, but LG, his greedy dumbass makes it a point to blatantly say; (Paraphrasing here) "If I sell only 100,000 copies of my new album it's considered a huge flop- a failure, I get only 14-15 cents out of it and I'm done I got a problem. But now that I'm on NPG records? I sell 100,000 with Baby Brother and I get $700,000!!!. All the while he's got this smart ass arrogant look on his face and proceeds to smack the cd down on the desk like 'Yeah, I'm bad!' YEAH LARRY U R BAD, like seriously bad. Even Tavis looks uncomfortable as all get out after LG pulled that crap. Excuse me if I'm wrong but aren't JW's supposed to be- hell required to be HUMBLE, and not care about money? Also in that interview LG compares his relationship with P to that of him and his wife's... CREEPY AF.

ACharmed1 said:

Amen.

I rue the day Prince met Larry.

He is a predator. And so is Larry's wife. She probably was also on the payroll.

The past few years I believe Prince was moving away from JW. Actually, he should have been "thrown out" of the JW congregation. He was doing many things JW do not believe in. However, I am sure he was heavily contributing to JW and they didnt want to lose their money cow.

I need a Prince intervention. Just Saying....

Junglehop said:

I can't help it, my gut tells me Larry Graham wasn't a positive influence on Prince's life. I feel he exploited vulnerabilities in Prince, and acting as a defacto father figure of sorts, he manipulated and smothered him, ultimately robbing Prince of his own personal power. I can't help feeling Larry led Prince down a path toward self destruction. Ultimately Prince was responsible for his own life but Larry poisoned the well so to speak. [Edited 5/16/16 3:33am]

I agree and have felt this way for a long time

ISaidLifeIsJustAGame said:

Amen.

I rue the day Prince met Larry.

He is a predator. And so is Larry's wife. She probably was also on the payroll.

The past few years I believe Prince was moving away from JW. Actually, he should have been "thrown out" of the JW congregation. He was doing many things JW do not believe in. However, I am sure he was heavily contributing to JW and they didnt want to lose their money cow.

I need a Prince intervention. Just Saying....

I agree with U on all that. Larry's wife...that goofy crap she pulled on stage at the Motherless Child show was just pathetic. Stumbling around the stage with a friggin' towel like she just got off a weekend bender with Ozzy & Hunter S Thompson.

Junglehop said:

rusty1 said:

Whether it is Scientology or being JW.. I find there are just to many wacky things going on with both of them. It feels like they are cult groups.. You can't curse, Celebrate holidays, No blood transfusions.. To me, i tbink it is all crazy & backwards logic. I'm a Catholic & my religion doesn't have so many weird rules And so on. Prince was depressed and turned to a cult

Don't generalize your experience to other people and their chosen paths of spirituality. You have no idea what Prince believed in the end...

To me, religion poisoned Prince ever since Lovesexy. But that is me. The fact that I haven't been as much in awe of his music or how he communicated has simply been because of my believes and worldview.

To me, long before Prince befriended Larry Graham (of course, way after they first met in 1978), Larry Graham was poisoned by religion (more specifically JW) by Tina, his wife. It changed his music and made it less fun.

To a lot of you here (and specifically in this thread), Larry Graham is the Yoko Ono in the story. To me, Tina was Larry's Yoko. But in the end, Yoko made John Lennon happy and didn't break up the Beatles. Tina didn't make Larry unhappy. Some with Larry and Prince (although they never got married, afaik)

I think to many people project who they think their idols are onto them. That almost always ends up different. It makes no sense to point at someone other than yourself for the hurt you feel because of it.

And by the way, every time I've talked to Larry, he's been a sweet and open person. He's a bit too positive for my liking, it kinda creeps me out, but he's genuine. And the connection he and Prince felt seemed real to me. It must have been nice for Prince to have a friend who's dealt with the same level of adoration and feel another connection too.

Now it's all academic anyway. Prince is dead, nothing will bring him back, why play "what if"s? Prince himself was always saying that living in the past was not his thing.

On the positive side, there is still so much Prince music to discover....

rusty1 said:

Whether it is Scientology or being JW.. I find there are just to many wacky things going on with both of them. It feels like they are cult groups.. You can't curse, Celebrate holidays, No blood transfusions.. To me, i tbink it is all crazy & backwards logic. I'm a Catholic & my religion doesn't have so many weird rules And so on. Prince was depressed and turned to a cult

james said:

I don't blame Larry (Seems like a lovely guy)... but it's what organised religion does.

It seems clear Prince needed something to hang on to after Mayte and the death of their child, and rather than drink and drugs he went the other way... maybe too far the other way!?

Didn't Prince's mother, a Jehovah's Witness, request, on her dying bed, that he also become a Jehovah's Witness?

While I am not a fan of religion and think the LG probably did influence P, I think there was someone else who influenced and enabled him and was ultimately a worse influence than LG. Most everyone has been speaking out to some degree, and even attending the awards...all but one person.

FlyOnTheWall said:

Didn't Prince's mother, a Jehovah's Witness, request, on her dying bed, that he also become a Jehovah's Witness?

No, that appears to be just another piece of org mythology. I hope that somebody will put accurate information about that in the Q&A section so that you guys won't keep getting misled.

Prince's mother was not a JW. A witness who used to post on this site regularly confirmed that several years ago. Unforturnately I can't remember if it was Sensual Melody or Uhope, but I hope that people will stop spewing that misinformation as fact. According to biographers P's family was Seventh Day Adventist when he was growing up.

Prince's mom's funeral was held at Zion Baptist Church.

http://www.legacy.com/obituaries/twincities/obituary.aspx?pid=231608



Another piece of misinformation....George Benson is actually the person who first spoke to Prince about the JW faith but in their infinite stupidity people on the org continue to blame Larry Graham.

KRTREE said:

I'm right there with you guys! What is it about him that gives me the creeps? Nice face, lovely smile but I get creeped out by the man every time, always have.

Can someone be so nice and SO spiritually evolved that it becomes suspect? I don't know but I'm just going to follow my intuition, it has never done me wrong, and walk the other way when I see him coming.

I don't even know the man and only know about him from just a few interviews. It is not his choice in religion/beliefs that creeps me out about LG, but there is just something that I cannot put my finger on about him that just makes my skin crawl! Like in a creepy family member type of way!..

I used to be sooooo mad at Larry - I think tho it's easy to scapegoat him. I can understand tho that Prince would question everything after losing 2 children. Wouldnt you question everything after that?

Here was a person who literally had almost unlimited freedom to inhabit his destiny...coming from my own catholic background which wasnt all that steep...I felt the deep shadow of guilt over Prince after his children and family fell through the cracks. He was never truly carefree and open again. But who would be?

I can see how Prince saw his prior life as sinful - it requires pride, ego, greed all the things you're taught are evil...he may have seen himself as trading a family for the devil of fame...

Also....Prince created his own universe to live in - everyone needs a guidepost as to whats appropriate and not appropriate - his extreme freedom lead him to choose extreme parameters embodied by the JW to help him balance his universe - he needed structure to help himself contain himself - because he ultimiately now elt his past was wrong somehow...

I think Larry was the father figure he needed and I'm glad now he had that as a PERSON, forget about the artist...poor Prince had God given extraordinary gifts but he paid for it....no one gets out of this life without karmic balance being extracted somehow. I can see Prince lloking to clean up his past becuase he felt it cost him his family.

I dont think he managed all the requirements of being a JW but it gave him some guideline of how to moderate himself...but if it brought him some kind of peace within himself I;m so glad for that.

It did make his later sexy songs way more subversive tho - which of course made it even hotter lololol Even the JW couldnt get rid of our sexy Prince - he just got smarter with it

[Edited 6/29/16 7:53am]

terrig said:

I used to be sooooo mad at Larry - I think tho it's easy to scapegoat him. I can understand tho that Prince would question everything after losing 2 children. Wouldnt you question everything after that?

Here was a person who literally had almost unlimited freedom to inhabit his destiny...coming from my own catholic background which wasnt all that steep...I felt the deep shadow of guilt over Prince after his children and family fell through the cracks. He was never truly carefree and open again. But who would be?

I can see how Prince saw his prior life as sinful - it requires pride, ego, greed all the things you're taught are evil...he may have seen himself as trading a family for the devil of fame...

Also....Prince created his own universe to live in - everyone needs a guidepost as to whats appropriate and not appropriate - his extreme freedom lead him to choose extreme parameters embodied by the JW to help him balance his universe - he needed structure to help himself contain himself - because he ultimiately now elt his past was wrong somehow...

I think Larry was the father figure he needed and I'm glad now he had that as a PERSON, forget about the artist...poor Prince had God given extraordinary gifts but he paid for it....no one gets out of this life without karmic balance being extracted somehow. I can see Prince lloking to clean up his past becuase he felt it cost him his family.

I dont think he managed all the requirements of being a JW but it gave him some guideline of how to moderate himself...but if it brought him some kind of peace within himself I;m so glad for that.

I did make his later sexy songs way more subversive tho - which of course made it even hotter lololol Even the JW couldnt get rid of our sexy Prince - he just got smarter with it

Good heavens, finally somebody with actual insight and understanding! Thank you so much....

I think that if people would just stop fetishizing Prince and lashing out randomly when he steps outside of their fantasy vision of him, they would be able to better accept him on a human level.

babynoz said:

terrig said:

I used to be sooooo mad at Larry - I think tho it's easy to scapegoat him. I can understand tho that Prince would question everything after losing 2 children. Wouldnt you question everything after that?

Here was a person who literally had almost unlimited freedom to inhabit his destiny...coming from my own catholic background which wasnt all that steep...I felt the deep shadow of guilt over Prince after his children and family fell through the cracks. He was never truly carefree and open again. But who would be?

I can see how Prince saw his prior life as sinful - it requires pride, ego, greed all the things you're taught are evil...he may have seen himself as trading a family for the devil of fame...

Also....Prince created his own universe to live in - everyone needs a guidepost as to whats appropriate and not appropriate - his extreme freedom lead him to choose extreme parameters embodied by the JW to help him balance his universe - he needed structure to help himself contain himself - because he ultimiately now elt his past was wrong somehow...

I think Larry was the father figure he needed and I'm glad now he had that as a PERSON, forget about the artist...poor Prince had God given extraordinary gifts but he paid for it....no one gets out of this life without karmic balance being extracted somehow. I can see Prince lloking to clean up his past becuase he felt it cost him his family.

I dont think he managed all the requirements of being a JW but it gave him some guideline of how to moderate himself...but if it brought him some kind of peace within himself I;m so glad for that.

I did make his later sexy songs way more subversive tho - which of course made it even hotter lololol Even the JW couldnt get rid of our sexy Prince - he just got smarter with it

Good heavens, finally somebody with actual insight and understanding! Thank you so much....

I think that if people would just stop fetishizing Prince and lashing out randomly when he steps outside of their fantasy vision of him, they would be able to better accept him on a human level.

life kicks us all - and changes us all. even if larry is/was the succubus we thaught he was...if Prince found comfort in that relationship, I'm glad for it - for him as man and for that little boy who could find no safe space, no adults who put his needs first.

ACharmed1 said:

nursev said:

Astasheiks said: Seriously I use to like Larry especially in his one in a million days...but people are saying we shouldn't blame him...really? Prince needed guidance and Larry took advantage of that. I believe that and always will. Yes Prince made his own decisions, but Larry influenced him. He indeed fooled the hell oughtta him. What grown man packs up and moves to another state for another man that's not blood related to him? shit is foul

PREACH IT NURSE!! I said the same in another thread. If anyone wants proof of Larry using P I suggest watching the BET interview. Somewhere near the end of the show it's P, LG, and Chaka. Now, they all had new albums dropping, but LG, his greedy dumbass makes it a point to blatantly say; (Paraphrasing here) "If I sell only 100,000 copies of my new album it's considered a huge flop- a failure, I get only 14-15 cents out of it and I'm done I got a problem. But now that I'm on NPG records? I sell 100,000 with Baby Brother and I get $700,000!!!. All the while he's got this smart ass arrogant look on his face and proceeds to smack the cd down on the desk like 'Yeah, I'm bad!' YEAH LARRY U R BAD, like seriously bad. Even Tavis looks uncomfortable as all get out after LG pulled that crap. Excuse me if I'm wrong but aren't JW's supposed to be- hell required to be HUMBLE, and not care about money? Also in that interview LG compares his relationship with P to that of him and his wife's... CREEPY AF.

terrig said:

life kicks us all - and changes us all. even if larry is/was the succubus we thaught he was...if Prince found comfort in that relationship, I'm glad for it - for him as man and for that little boy who could find no safe space, no adults who put his needs first.

....and that's why I wonder the most: WHERE WAS LARRY AT THE END? If people were that worried about P, why didn't they drop a dime on Big Brother and tell him to get his butt over to PP just for one night?

The two people, closest to P for several years, were Kirk and Larry. P depended on them but they weren't there when he really needed it.

They should have known.

[Edited 6/29/16 8:29am]

laytonian said:

terrig said:

life kicks us all - and changes us all. even if larry is/was the succubus we thaught he was...if Prince found comfort in that relationship, I'm glad for it - for him as man and for that little boy who could find no safe space, no adults who put his needs first.

....and that's why I wonder the most: WHERE WAS LARRY AT THE END? If people were that worried about P, why didn't they drop a dime on Big Brother and tell him to get his butt over to PP.

The two people, closest to P for several years, were Kirk and Larry. P depended on them but they weren't there when he really needed it.

I agree with you laytonian....all his people failed him. Its heartbreaking.

laytonian said:

laytonian said:

terrig said:

rogifan said:

terrig said:

I agree with you laytonian....all his people failed him. Its heartbreaking.

It's all too easy to be judgmental on the outside looking in. And it seems like some are looking for scapegoats and Kirk and Larry are atop the list. Sigh.

Who else would people look at? P's wife pretty much put him on blast about it and then went on to say stuff about 'yes men' and 'enablers'. So I take it as a given that when he was married to his second wife, it was going on. Who has been there during the entire time?