Vendetta1 said:

Spinlight said:

Honestly, babe, who gives a flying fuck if anyone did or didn't like Prince's androgyny. You're missing the point. The fact is that you are projecting your own beliefs onto Prince. You don't know his opinion. You have no clue if the event was actually true, if it ever even happened. None. But you sure come up in here with your religious zealot crap, intimating people should be afraid or offended by gay people.

Exactly!! And then insinuated or just blantantly stated that anyone who does not have a problem with someone of the same sex complimenting them should check their sexuality. That was an ignorant statement.

Is it also ignorant to say that "if you have a problem with the same sex complimenting you then you should check your sexuality?" Or is there a double standard?

DaphneLovesPR1NCE said:

Vendetta1 said:

We are not talking about whether androgyny is cool today. We are talking about androgyny back during Purple Rain days. If you or anyone else makes a statement like it is a fact, ya damn right i am going to call you on it. Your profile says you are 25 or so, so the fact of the matter is that you would have no fucking clue if androgyny was cool back then or not. If you stop posting opinion like it's fact, we would have nothing to say to you.

And your use of the word "retard" inly goes to further show your ignorance. That word makes people uncomfortable. maybe you ought not use it.

Again...I'm going to ask you if you're stating that EVERYONE in the 80s was cool with androgeny? That's what you're saying? Live in your dream world if you want, fool yourself if that makes you sleep at night. And my being 25 has NOTHING to do with whether I know about the 80s or not. Especially since I"m the youngest of 6 kids with my oldest sis being 40, a mother and father in their late 50s, oh and family all over the age of 40. Oh what a concept...I speak to these people about Prince and life in general. I've met PLENTY of people that dislike, even some who despise Prince. And yes some are people who were teens or adults in the 80s.

And now you're presuming to tell me what words I shouldn't use? Get over yourself ok! You have no idea what ignorance is...take a look in the mirror before you start calling names.

Where did I state everyone was cool with it? YOU are the one who stated ALOT of people were not so the onu is on YOU to prove it. And you being 25 has a whole lot to do with this conversation and the other drivel you spout on this site. The people you mention who know people or are people who had a problem with Prince dressing like a chick still does not account for ALOT of people.

AND I did NOT tell you what words you could and could not use. I just told you it makes you look ignorant. You seem to have zero problem insulting people's sensitivities but seem to think yours should be shileded for some reason.

And with that, I'm done. You twist people's words, you say totally hypocritical things and you have absolutely no idea what you are talking about.

You make Tame look tame.

DaphneLovesPR1NCE said:

Vendetta1 said:

Exactly!! And then insinuated or just blantantly stated that anyone who does not have a problem with someone of the same sex complimenting them should check their sexuality. That was an ignorant statement.

Is it also ignorant to say that "if you have a problem with the same sex complimenting you then you should check your sexuality?" Or is there a double standard?

You are the one who said it.

Spinlight said:

DaphneLovesPR1NCE said:

Is that all you can say? Please! You really shouldn't reply in such a manner, you lose credibility when you imply "everyone in the world is fine with Prince dressing like a girl.." Clearly THAT statement is a BS lie!

Um, neither I nor the person you quoted said what you've got within quotes right there. So that may be a BS lie, but it wasn't told by anyone in this thread.

OH are we being clever here? I said you implied it by saying I was lying when I said "alot of people had a problem with Prince being androgenous." And the truth of the matter is, alot of people LOVED Prince and loved how he dressed (me being 1 of them), but unfortunately, alot of people didn't. In another thread it was discussed how Prince's androgeny caused some people not to respect him or take his music seriously.

So, I'm trying to figure out how my statement is a "bs lie?" Or how that my statement needs "proof." Do I really need to prove that there are people in the world that hate Prince?

Chiquetet said:

DaphneLovesPR1NCE said:

I said a different time period when Prince grew up...which would be the 60s. I'm well aware of Prince's past behavior...but bringing that up has little to do with the situation. Its just another way to say "see I'm right and you're wrong."

What are you suggesting I think I'm right about?

Oh good.

To do so would be foolish. I know of him, what everyone else knows of him. We can all form our OPINIONS based on what we know. And if anyone expects me to become "openminded" or "realistic" aka miserable and sit around and insult Prince and his music, then no thanks, I'd rather keep my blinders on. Negativity is not pleasureable, realistic, fair, sincere, GODLY, or fan-like. As long as people are hating on Prince, its ok. As soon as someone writes something positive, then the vultures come out. Those people quick to point a finger and call someone "ignorant," "childish," "homophobic" should really take a long hard look in the mirror..

I understand what you're getting at, but I believe you CAN actually be open minded and realistic without being miserable and insulting.

I love Prince. I love his music. I am very positive towards him, as well as life in general. I usually don't feel the need to defend his actions (particularly when they're almost 20 years in the past) because whatever the reason was that he walked out of the shoot, it changes nothing for me.

If Herb did freak him out with his comment and he really did walk out and insist that the negatives be burnt, then I believe the act was immature. It changes nothing.

I have no interest in hating on Prince and would be quite happy for you to call me on it any time you thought I was.

Seeing people in a positive light is great. Keeping blinders/blinkers on so that someone only appears to be what you would want them to be is conditional. There's a big difference there.

For example, if it turned out that the real story is that Prince and Herb had slept together a few times, but had had a falling out the week before and things were a little bit awkward on the shoot, meaning that Herb's "so sexy" comment triggered Prince and he stormed out...would that still be ok? Would it affect how you see him? What you think of him?

(before anyone starts - yes, it's beyond unlikely and entirely baseless and is being used ONLY to make a point )

Great freakin' post.

Chiquetet said:

DaphneLovesPR1NCE said:

I said a different time period when Prince grew up...which would be the 60s. I'm well aware of Prince's past behavior...but bringing that up has little to do with the situation. Its just another way to say "see I'm right and you're wrong."

What are you suggesting I think I'm right about?

Oh good.

To do so would be foolish. I know of him, what everyone else knows of him. We can all form our OPINIONS based on what we know. And if anyone expects me to become "openminded" or "realistic" aka miserable and sit around and insult Prince and his music, then no thanks, I'd rather keep my blinders on. Negativity is not pleasureable, realistic, fair, sincere, GODLY, or fan-like. As long as people are hating on Prince, its ok. As soon as someone writes something positive, then the vultures come out. Those people quick to point a finger and call someone "ignorant," "childish," "homophobic" should really take a long hard look in the mirror..

I understand what you're getting at, but I believe you CAN actually be open minded and realistic without being miserable and insulting. Agreed.

I love Prince. I love his music. I am very positive towards him, as well as life in general. I usually don't feel the need to defend his actions (particularly when they're almost 20 years in the past) because whatever the reason was that he walked out of the shoot, it changes nothing for me. Changes nothing for me either, I simply stated my opinion on it, then people started calling me homophobic, which ticked me off, since I'm not and didn't even state anything close to it. And this is a discussion forum, people should discuss things, whether 2months old or 20yrs old. And people should be able to friendly discuss things w/o being insulting or calling names. And everyone should be entitled to their own opinions, whether they are in the majority or minority...

If Herb did freak him out with his comment and he really did walk out and insist that the negatives be burnt, then I believe the act was immature. It changes nothing. That's fine. I accept your opinion on that, mine just differs, I don't find it immature, I find it mature. Calling Herb out on it or getting pissy/violent of him, would have been immature IMO. Opinions differ, no big deal. Just like you and I have stated opposing opinions w/o name calling, etc. that is how things should be. You shouldn't start name calling b/c someone's opinion differs from yours..

I have no interest in hating on Prince and would be quite happy for you to call me on it any time you thought I was. Same here, I know everything isn't positive. I try to state any disdain towards Prince in a very subtle manner..but call it out on me when I'm being hateful towards him, it's not my intention.

Seeing people in a positive light is great. Keeping blinders/blinkers on so that someone only appears to be what you would want them to be is conditional. There's a big difference there. I agree. I only said about the blinders b/c I've been told I have blinders on when it comes to Prince.

For example, if it turned out that the real story is that Prince and Herb had slept together a few times, but had had a falling out the week before and things were a little bit awkward on the shoot, meaning that Herb's "so sexy" comment triggered Prince and he stormed out...would that still be ok? Would it affect how you see him? What you think of him? I would then think of it differently somewhat. Meaning the sexualization part wouldn't apply...if they had a lovers quarrel and just couldn't make it work, I'd say "Prince get the job done and leave your drama at home." If he then replied "I just can't do it, I'm feeling totally uncomfortable having my bf who I just had a fight with photograph me.." then I probably would say ok, walk off. B/C I just don't feel people should have to work anywhere where they really feel uncomfortable. But that's just me.

(before anyone starts - yes, it's beyond unlikely and entirely baseless and is being used ONLY to make a point )

DaphneLovesPR1NCE said:

And I didn't mention ANYTHING religious in my post..that's you assuming things. And we know what that makes you... Never have I said anything about people being afraid of gay people. Some people are though, that's just life. I'm not, but why are you so worried about it? WTF does it matter? And it is offensive if someone hits on you(gay or straight) and makes you feel uncomfortable. What's the problem here? If this were a women would you still be here? Cause I sure would be here, saying the same thing.

Stop thinking that EVERYONE is homophobic..it shows your insecurities.

You've brought up God, Jesus, "GODLY behavior", said things like 'answering for sins' and the like multiple times over the course of this thread... all that sounds religious to me.

Perhaps you should reread your earlier posts?

Vendetta1 said:

DaphneLovesPR1NCE said:

Is it also ignorant to say that "if you have a problem with the same sex complimenting you then you should check your sexuality?" Or is there a double standard?

You are the one who said it.

2 different statements...I didn't say both. Another orger said "if you are offended by someone of the same sex complimenting you then you should check your sexuality." To which I replied "if you aren't offended by someone of the same sex complimenting you then you should check your sexuality." Just giving back what was given...

DaphneLovesPR1NCE said:

Vendetta1 said:

You are the one who said it.

2 different statements...I didn't say both. Another orger said "if you are offended by someone of the same sex complimenting you then you should check your sexuality." To which I replied "if you aren't offended by someone of the same sex complimenting you then you should check your sexuality." Just giving back what was given...

This just may answer everybody's question...

http://www.youtube.com/wa...re=related

Vendetta1 said:

DaphneLovesPR1NCE said:

Again...I'm going to ask you if you're stating that EVERYONE in the 80s was cool with androgeny? That's what you're saying? Live in your dream world if you want, fool yourself if that makes you sleep at night. And my being 25 has NOTHING to do with whether I know about the 80s or not. Especially since I"m the youngest of 6 kids with my oldest sis being 40, a mother and father in their late 50s, oh and family all over the age of 40. Oh what a concept...I speak to these people about Prince and life in general. I've met PLENTY of people that dislike, even some who despise Prince. And yes some are people who were teens or adults in the 80s.

And now you're presuming to tell me what words I shouldn't use? Get over yourself ok! You have no idea what ignorance is...take a look in the mirror before you start calling names.

Where did I state everyone was cool with it? YOU are the one who stated ALOT of people were not so the onu is on YOU to prove it. And you being 25 has a whole lot to do with this conversation and the other drivel you spout on this site. The people you mention who know people or are people who had a problem with Prince dressing like a chick still does not account for ALOT of people.

AND I did NOT tell you what words you could and could not use. I just told you it makes you look ignorant. You seem to have zero problem insulting people's sensitivities but seem to think yours should be shileded for some reason.

And with that, I'm done. You twist people's words, you say totally hypocritical things and you have absolutely no idea what you are talking about.

You make Tame look tame.

Um, yeah, ok...I made a statement..I don't have to prove anything to you...do you have to prove anything to me? No..the nerve of you to even insinuate that I need to prove a statement to you is mind boggling! Especially since a simple goolge search would be all the proof you need. You act as if I said something that is really rare.. I didn't mention anyone I know that has a problem with Prince, I simply said that I know about things from the 80s from people that were living during that time. You need to not only read but take the time to comprehend what is being said.

I respect everyone on here that respects me. Am I the one on here calling people "homophobic?" No. Am I the one calling people "ignorant?" No You and a few others, on the contrary, are. So perhaps you should worry more about yourself and how you treat people. Do unto others as you would have them do unto you. You can expect respect when you learn to give some...

RubyButterfly said:

DaphneLovesPR1NCE said:

And I didn't mention ANYTHING religious in my post..that's you assuming things. And we know what that makes you... Never have I said anything about people being afraid of gay people. Some people are though, that's just life. I'm not, but why are you so worried about it? WTF does it matter? And it is offensive if someone hits on you(gay or straight) and makes you feel uncomfortable. What's the problem here? If this were a women would you still be here? Cause I sure would be here, saying the same thing.

Stop thinking that EVERYONE is homophobic..it shows your insecurities.

You've brought up God, Jesus, "GODLY behavior", said things like 'answering for sins' and the like multiple times over the course of this thread... all that sounds religious to me.

Perhaps you should reread your earlier posts?

Spin called me homophobic BEFORE those posts..so I hadn't mentioned anything about religion when he called me a homophobe..Nothing in my original post on this subject even remotely suggest my religious views.

kewlschool said:

DaphneLovesPR1NCE said:

2 different statements...I didn't say both. Another orger said "if you are offended by someone of the same sex complimenting you then you should check your sexuality." To which I replied "if you aren't offended by someone of the same sex complimenting you then you should check your sexuality." Just giving back what was given...

This just may answer everybody's question...

http://www.youtube.com/wa...re=related

LMAO! So funny, love that show!!

DaphneLovesPR1NCE said:

RubyButterfly said:

You've brought up God, Jesus, "GODLY behavior", said things like 'answering for sins' and the like multiple times over the course of this thread... all that sounds religious to me.

Perhaps you should reread your earlier posts?

Spin called me homophobic BEFORE those posts..so I hadn't mentioned anything about religion when he called me a homophobe..Nothing in my original post on this subject even remotely suggest my religious views.

Homophobia has nothing to do with religion.

You are homophobic regardless of your religious beliefs.

Chiquetet said:

DaphneLovesPR1NCE said:

I said a different time period when Prince grew up...which would be the 60s. I'm well aware of Prince's past behavior...but bringing that up has little to do with the situation. Its just another way to say "see I'm right and you're wrong."

What are you suggesting I think I'm right about?

Oh good.

To do so would be foolish. I know of him, what everyone else knows of him. We can all form our OPINIONS based on what we know. And if anyone expects me to become "openminded" or "realistic" aka miserable and sit around and insult Prince and his music, then no thanks, I'd rather keep my blinders on. Negativity is not pleasureable, realistic, fair, sincere, GODLY, or fan-like. As long as people are hating on Prince, its ok. As soon as someone writes something positive, then the vultures come out. Those people quick to point a finger and call someone "ignorant," "childish," "homophobic" should really take a long hard look in the mirror..

I understand what you're getting at, but I believe you CAN actually be open minded and realistic without being miserable and insulting.

I love Prince. I love his music. I am very positive towards him, as well as life in general. I usually don't feel the need to defend his actions (particularly when they're almost 20 years in the past) because whatever the reason was that he walked out of the shoot, it changes nothing for me.

If Herb did freak him out with his comment and he really did walk out and insist that the negatives be burnt, then I believe the act was immature. It changes nothing.

I have no interest in hating on Prince and would be quite happy for you to call me on it any time you thought I was.

Seeing people in a positive light is great. Keeping blinders/blinkers on so that someone only appears to be what you would want them to be is conditional. There's a big difference there.

For example, if it turned out that the real story is that Prince and Herb had slept together a few times, but had had a falling out the week before and things were a little bit awkward on the shoot, meaning that Herb's "so sexy" comment triggered Prince and he stormed out...would that still be ok? Would it affect how you see him? What you think of him?

(before anyone starts - yes, it's beyond unlikely and entirely baseless and is being used ONLY to make a point )

great post, you beat me to it. I was actually thinking the same thing...

Does Daphne REALLY love Prince? Will she love him when the truth comes out? Will she be able to handle the truth?

And don't ask me what the "truth" is.. I am still figuring that out.

prodigalfan said:

Chiquetet said:

I understand what you're getting at, but I believe you CAN actually be open minded and realistic without being miserable and insulting.

I love Prince. I love his music. I am very positive towards him, as well as life in general. I usually don't feel the need to defend his actions (particularly when they're almost 20 years in the past) because whatever the reason was that he walked out of the shoot, it changes nothing for me.

If Herb did freak him out with his comment and he really did walk out and insist that the negatives be burnt, then I believe the act was immature. It changes nothing.

I have no interest in hating on Prince and would be quite happy for you to call me on it any time you thought I was.

Seeing people in a positive light is great. Keeping blinders/blinkers on so that someone only appears to be what you would want them to be is conditional. There's a big difference there.

For example, if it turned out that the real story is that Prince and Herb had slept together a few times, but had had a falling out the week before and things were a little bit awkward on the shoot, meaning that Herb's "so sexy" comment triggered Prince and he stormed out...would that still be ok? Would it affect how you see him? What you think of him?

(before anyone starts - yes, it's beyond unlikely and entirely baseless and is being used ONLY to make a point )

great post, you beat me to it. I was actually thinking the same thing...

Does Daphne REALLY love Prince? Will she love him when the truth comes out? Will she be able to handle the truth?

And don't ask me what the "truth" is.. I am still figuring that out.

I'm pretty confident in loving him...no matter what, his music is great! I could never stop loving Prince. If I'm able to handle the truth is another story..

Ahhhh, the thread that keeps on giving.

RubyButterfly said:

Perhaps you should reread your earlier posts?

Or maybe, ya know, just, STOP!

purpledoveuk said: You have to ask why he had his feet on the piano in the first place if it wasn't to strike a sexy pose...surely not to try a new style of playing?

DaphneLovesPR1NCE said:

Vendetta1 said:

We are not talking about whether androgyny is cool today. We are talking about androgyny back during Purple Rain days. If you or anyone else makes a statement like it is a fact, ya damn right i am going to call you on it. Your profile says you are 25 or so, so the fact of the matter is that you would have no fucking clue if androgyny was cool back then or not. If you stop posting opinion like it's fact, we would have nothing to say to you.

And your use of the word "retard" inly goes to further show your ignorance. That word makes people uncomfortable. maybe you ought not use it.

Again...I'm going to ask you if you're stating that EVERYONE in the 80s was cool with androgeny? That's what you're saying? Live in your dream world if you want, fool yourself if that makes you sleep at night. And my being 25 has NOTHING to do with whether I know about the 80s or not. Especially since I"m the youngest of 6 kids with my oldest sis being 40, a mother and father in their late 50s, oh and family all over the age of 40. Oh what a concept...I speak to these people about Prince and life in general. I've met PLENTY of people that dislike, even some who despise Prince. And yes some are people who were teens or adults in the 80s.

And now you're presuming to tell me what words I shouldn't use? Get over yourself ok! You have no idea what ignorance is...take a look in the mirror before you start calling names.

Androgyny wasn't cool with everyone, i was an androgynous teenager at the time and my mom used to cry about it. I also received many threats from classmates, guys who assumed they could punk me based on my looks. There were all kinds of kids back then and yes even some straight laced kids who liked Prince, did not judge but wouldn't consider the look. Sexual Harassment, Homophobia and just plain old Rock Star bullshit are all at play here; and all of it is subjective. The truth is none of us know, what we do know is Prince at that time had a track record of bratty behaviour so lord knows what ticked him off. As for homophobia alot of people here are sensitive about some of Prince's comments directed at Wendy and Lisa in the late 90's, after he became a JW. This is valid, but your connecting his storming out of a shoot in 90/91 to comments he made 7 8 years later and drawing a conclusion. Inflection is important, maybe Ritz said it in a way that Prince found patronizing or sarcastic. To me there are two camps here that Prince can never seem to please because like us he is human; which is in itself a process of contradictory behaviour. I don't know one person who isnt a fuckin hypocrite, me included, so i cant possibly see a public figure (especially him) being any different. He wont please gay orgers because despite his commitment to effeminate presentation he can be frustratingly archaic and masculine. He wont please traditionalist orgers because they secretly wish he would make it easier on them, they hate loving him so much and defending his presentation because it goes against what they personally believe.

Is anyone surprised by this? Prince has always been a drama queen He's known to overreact to things...getting pissed for no reason at all.I heard that,when he was filming the "Raspberry Beret" video,he got mad and cussed out the the dancers.The reason? They were looking at him!

can i just interject here and throw something into the pot...

despite how infantile he can be, it aint easy being "PRINCE", all those years ago, imagine the pressure, day in day out

photoshoot after photoshoot, expectations, interviews, be here, be there, having to perform on demand whether he felt like it or not

having to accomodate so many people all the time, being surrounded by the genuine and the fake, ass-kissers who'd boost his ego then stab him in the back the next

endless critics gnawing away at his pride and artistic integrity, glowing reviews that he knew could change like the weather

constant questions about his sexuality and over-all weirdness, being beset with the inability to express himself clearly apart from in song

its enough to give anyone a roaring personality disorder within the first year of fame, let alone ten years into it when all perspective is lost

an infantile tantrum here or there might be understandable under the circumstances, too much pressure at the wrong time or test his patience too much and the purple bubble will pop in your face

i think there was a lot more going on with prince is most scenarios we hear about, than something as shallow as him getting offended for little or no reason

might seem like that on the surface, but that's only if you look at the surface of things

maybe take a little time out to consider a day in the life of "PRINCE" back then, from his point of view.

just sayin.

prodigalfan said:

^^ Great post! I forget that even though my life is mundane in comparison to celebrities... there are sometimes I just don't feel like leaving the house, sit in my PJ's all day watching bad tv and don't give a dayum. When you are celebrity promoting a project... you have to go, not only that, you can't just through a pair of jeans, tshirt and just go.... you have to go dressed to the 9's. Even if you don't feel like it, or have a "migraine" or even a fever. Not all people have that sort of work ethic, but it seems Prince for the most part was a work aholic, and perfectionist... at least until it comes to promptness. Then.... work ethics, out the window.

how many concerts has he been late for? or did he only start getting tardy when he was running to his own schedule instead of someone else's?

imagine how many times he's had a schedule stuffed under his nose with times on it. year after year of YOU HAVE TO.

enough to make me wanna throw away my watch and be as late as i damn well please lol

prodigalfan said:

^^ not sure about concerts but the after shows he is notorious for starting very very late. True enough that it may be an event that HE is running but the time advertised must have been discussed between Prince and the promoters. I am sure all these promoters through the years did not just arbitrarily pick a time without Prince's approval. If he agreed on a time and starts late... It IS late. I am not mad at him. Since I'm late all the time for everything this CP time that Prince observes endears him to me

and time is a trick remember lol

Perhaps, and I don't know, it had nothing to do with homophobia. Perhaps, just perhaps, Prince was not trying to sell sex in the shoot, and felt the photographer was missing the whole intent of the shoot. If I had to make a bet, i would bet that it gravitated more around that than anything else. This is Prince throwing the baby out with the bath water, from what I understand through the speakings of Kevin Smith, Prince is nororious for. If you don't sort get his vibe, he will dismiss you instantly. Kevin doesn't make Prince out to be a very tolerant individual when it comes to missing the mark on a project.

hollywooddove said:

Perhaps, and I don't know, it had nothing to do with homophobia. Perhaps, just perhaps, Prince was not trying to sell sex in the shoot, and felt the photographer was missing the whole intent of the shoot. If I had to make a bet, i would bet that it gravitated more around that than anything else. This is Prince throwing the baby out with the bath water, from what I understand through the speakings of Kevin Smith, Prince is nororious for. If you don't sort get his vibe, he will dismiss you instantly. Kevin doesn't make Prince out to be a very tolerant individual when it comes to missing the mark on a project.

You know, after reading the article, this is what I got from it also. He wasn't going for sexy and when Herb didn't seem to get that, he was like, "whatever, done, burn the negatives, not what I'm trying to portray." It had already been a long day, he probably just didn't want to fool with it any longer. Probably just another thing that he felt controlled by, another thing that wasn't what he wanted and yet was being "forced" to do it anyway. And there is nothing more frustrating than when you are trying to convey something and the person around you just don't understand!!

I posted the article. Like I said in an earlier post, some photos during the shoot were used as the covers for the Hits/B-Sides complilation. The article seems to be mostly made up. This supposed interchange between Prince and Herb could have only lasted mere minutes! What was going on the rest of the 8 hours??? It was just the media blowing something way out of proportion, as always. Herb Ritts later released a book called "Notorious" in 1992 of a ton of celebrity pictures he had taken, and Prince in the chain hat was one of them. He would have needed to get Prince's permission to use it, so there must have not been that much bad blood between the two.

It's offensive when somebody UGLY praises you, I'd have walked off too...than sit there posing with somebody that makes me feel uncomfortable!

Chic35 said:

It's offensive when somebody UGLY praises you, I'd have walked off too...than sit there posing with somebody that makes me feel uncomfortable!

Please, go far, far away. Forever.