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Reply #330 posted 10/25/12 8:21am

GoldDolphin

avatar

JoeTyler said:

dag said:

They're great.

thanks

I've always thought that the original Bad album could have been expanded to a double-album, one disc for the hard-dance numbers, and the second for the experimental songs & ballads

I'll def purchase this once is a bit cheaper

MJ wanted it to be a 3 disc album, but the label didnt believe in the idea.

When the power of love overcomes the love of power,the world will know peace -Jimi Hendrix
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Reply #331 posted 10/25/12 8:23am

GoldDolphin

avatar

dm3857 said:

jaimestarr79 said:

where are all of the MJ jams from his vault. What a HOAX! They don't exis

yes my friend they exist.. and there is many more than most people think.

the ones we know for sure that exist are the following:

goodness knows
sweet music
kentucky
what a lonely way to go
holiday inn
you aint gonna change nothin
goin to rio
iowa
ode to sorrow
thank you for life
rock with you (demo)
sunset driver
susie
that girl
we are the ones
got to find a way somehow
in the life of chico
startin something (early version of wbss)
under your skin
you told me your lovin
you not me
nymphette lover
slipped away
somewhere in time
when you wish upon a star
why cant i be
learned my lesson
much too soon
niteline
trouble
slapstik
the toy
who do you know
carousel
got the hots
hot street
rolling the dice
someone in the dark
stand tall
the girl is mine (demo)
bad company
buffalo bill
doing dirty
fantasy
far far away
nona
power
there must be more to life than this
victory (w/ freddy mercury)
love never felt so good
be me 4 a day
the nelson mandela song
al capone
hot fever (twymmf demo)
scared of the moon
tomboy
what you do to me
another part of me (early version)
crack kills
pyramid girl (liberian girl demo)
the price of fame
whos bad (bad demo)
black or white demo
chicago 1945
girls of another lover
groove of midnight
turning me off
color of my soul
neverland landing
throwin your life away
alright now
bottle of smoke
deep in the night
heal the world demo
if you dont love me
i have this love of me
ill be there (adult version)
monkey buisness
seven digits
stay
who is it demo
work that body
fanfare transmition
dont be messin around
a baby smiles
bad girl
do the bartman
do you know where your children are
free
give into me demo
gone to soon demo
i forgive you
in the closet demo
jam demo
little girls
little susie (early version)
Llama Lola
lonely bird
lonely man
lucy is in love with linus
make a wish
men in black
michael mckellar
serious effect
remember the time demo
she got it
stay
the love you save (adult version)
Cry (not the one written by r kelly for invincible)
Red Eye
seven bright new stars
shes not a girl
sister sue
the childrens hour
tragedy of a cheerleader
who is the girl with her hair down
why shy
someone put your hand out
california grass
dreams
fear
bass(z)oulle
face
ghost (early version)
in the back
on the line
we be ballin
angel
do you love me
thank heaven that
belong 2
do you want me
escape
fall again
i have this dream
stop the war
a place with no name
do you love me
vibrationist
tubeway
edgar allan poe
kick it
on my anger
people have to make some kind of joke
saved by the bell
seeing voices
she was lovin me
the gloved one
the way you love me
this is our time
another day
i dont live here anymore
chicago 1945 (new version/rerecorded)
get around
i dont live anymore
in the valley
make or break
maybe we can do it
shout
soldiers entrance
that kind of lover
you're a liar, brother
wonderful world of candy
all in your name
pressure
seduction
the pain
weve had enough
light the way
unknown title (charity anthem for tsunami)
from the bottom of my heart
he who makes the sky grey
you are so beautiful
whats it gonna be
im dreamin
if you dont get it
days of the broken hearted
the future
if we still love
im still the king
can you
babys fire
i will miss you
bang your head
broken chair
i am a loser
i was the loser
D.I.E.
dont make me stay
H2O
Lady of summer
Silent Spring
Children of the world
Water

this of coarse are only the ones we know exist, im sure that there are more, as there were a few tracks on bad 25 that i had never seen or heard about before.

and thats just the songs in the vault.

there is also footage of pretty much all of the tours (J5 tours,Destiny Tour,Triumph Tour,Victory Tour,Bad Tour,Dangerous Tour,HIStory Tour, etc..) Plus rehearsal footage from Bad,Dangerous,and HIStory. possibly from all the tours, but i only know Bad,Dangerous,and HIStory rehearsal footage exist for sure.

There is alternate takes and mixes for many songs.. for example there is 91 mixes/versions of billie jean that were recorded before it was released.

There is the footage of Michael in the studio recording his albums.

Footage of all of the music video rehearsals.

There is 80 hours of this is it footage.

Michael was composing an album of classical music right before he passed, many of the pieces where completed as he showed them to award winning composer David Michael Frank. David describes them as "very pretty music" "one piece had an irish quality about it.i suggested we use a celtic harp.." "the pieces song very much like film score music, with very traditional harmony, and definitely very strong melodies." "one of them was a little John Barryish, like in Out of Africa, I could hear (in my head) sweeping strings and french horns in unison."

and probably even more that im forgetting or dont even know about..

needless to say, there is a TON of material.

I cant wait to hear the classical stuff he was working on. Many ppl underrate MJ's artistry that's why nobody knows he wrote so many songs. I hope we'll get more unreleased songs before 2017.

When the power of love overcomes the love of power,the world will know peace -Jimi Hendrix
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Reply #332 posted 10/25/12 8:59am

Marrk

avatar

Despite that person talkng over it (mad ) that footage of MJ and Stevie in the studio freaked me the hell out. Seeing something new of Mike doing his thing is always a treat.

Honestly his presence was something else. I always got it when people said he had an aura or was otherwordly.

Can't wait for the Documentary.

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Reply #333 posted 10/25/12 9:52am

jaimestarr79

dm3857 said:

jaimestarr79 said:

where are all of the MJ jams from his vault. What a HOAX! They don't exis

yes my friend they exist.. and there is many more than most people think.

the ones we know for sure that exist are the following:

goodness knows
sweet music
kentucky
what a lonely way to go
holiday inn
you aint gonna change nothin
goin to rio
iowa
ode to sorrow
thank you for life
rock with you (demo)
sunset driver
susie
that girl
we are the ones
got to find a way somehow
in the life of chico
startin something (early version of wbss)
under your skin
you told me your lovin
you not me
nymphette lover
slipped away
somewhere in time
when you wish upon a star
why cant i be
learned my lesson
much too soon
niteline
trouble
slapstik
the toy
who do you know
carousel
got the hots
hot street
rolling the dice
someone in the dark
stand tall
the girl is mine (demo)
bad company
buffalo bill
doing dirty
fantasy
far far away
nona
power
there must be more to life than this
victory (w/ freddy mercury)
love never felt so good
be me 4 a day
the nelson mandela song
al capone
hot fever (twymmf demo)
scared of the moon
tomboy
what you do to me
another part of me (early version)
crack kills
pyramid girl (liberian girl demo)
the price of fame
whos bad (bad demo)
black or white demo
chicago 1945
girls of another lover
groove of midnight
turning me off
color of my soul
neverland landing
throwin your life away
alright now
bottle of smoke
deep in the night
heal the world demo
if you dont love me
i have this love of me
ill be there (adult version)
monkey buisness
seven digits
stay
who is it demo
work that body
fanfare transmition
dont be messin around
a baby smiles
bad girl
do the bartman
do you know where your children are
free
give into me demo
gone to soon demo
i forgive you
in the closet demo
jam demo
little girls
little susie (early version)
Llama Lola
lonely bird
lonely man
lucy is in love with linus
make a wish
men in black
michael mckellar
serious effect
remember the time demo
she got it
stay
the love you save (adult version)
Cry (not the one written by r kelly for invincible)
Red Eye
seven bright new stars
shes not a girl
sister sue
the childrens hour
tragedy of a cheerleader
who is the girl with her hair down
why shy
someone put your hand out
california grass
dreams
fear
bass(z)oulle
face
ghost (early version)
in the back
on the line
we be ballin
angel
do you love me
thank heaven that
belong 2
do you want me
escape
fall again
i have this dream
stop the war
a place with no name
do you love me
vibrationist
tubeway
edgar allan poe
kick it
on my anger
people have to make some kind of joke
saved by the bell
seeing voices
she was lovin me
the gloved one
the way you love me
this is our time
another day
i dont live here anymore
chicago 1945 (new version/rerecorded)
get around
i dont live anymore
in the valley
make or break
maybe we can do it
shout
soldiers entrance
that kind of lover
you're a liar, brother
wonderful world of candy
all in your name
pressure
seduction
the pain
weve had enough
light the way
unknown title (charity anthem for tsunami)
from the bottom of my heart
he who makes the sky grey
you are so beautiful
whats it gonna be
im dreamin
if you dont get it
days of the broken hearted
the future
if we still love
im still the king
can you
babys fire
i will miss you
bang your head
broken chair
i am a loser
i was the loser
D.I.E.
dont make me stay
H2O
Lady of summer
Silent Spring
Children of the world
Water

this of coarse are only the ones we know exist, im sure that there are more, as there were a few tracks on bad 25 that i had never seen or heard about before.

and thats just the songs in the vault.

there is also footage of pretty much all of the tours (J5 tours,Destiny Tour,Triumph Tour,Victory Tour,Bad Tour,Dangerous Tour,HIStory Tour, etc..) Plus rehearsal footage from Bad,Dangerous,and HIStory. possibly from all the tours, but i only know Bad,Dangerous,and HIStory rehearsal footage exist for sure.

There is alternate takes and mixes for many songs.. for example there is 91 mixes/versions of billie jean that were recorded before it was released.

There is the footage of Michael in the studio recording his albums.

Footage of all of the music video rehearsals.

There is 80 hours of this is it footage.

Michael was composing an album of classical music right before he passed, many of the pieces where completed as he showed them to award winning composer David Michael Frank. David describes them as "very pretty music" "one piece had an irish quality about it.i suggested we use a celtic harp.." "the pieces song very much like film score music, with very traditional harmony, and definitely very strong melodies." "one of them was a little John Barryish, like in Out of Africa, I could hear (in my head) sweeping strings and french horns in unison."

and probably even more that im forgetting or dont even know about..

needless to say, there is a TON of material.

seriously... How many of these songs are jams... and how many belong on the cutting room floor? which r your favorites.....and what classic MJ tracks would you compare them too?

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Reply #334 posted 10/25/12 10:28am

Marrk

avatar

jaimestarr79 said:

dm3857 said:

yes my friend they exist.. and there is many more than most people think.

the ones we know for sure that exist are the following:

goodness knows
sweet music
kentucky
what a lonely way to go
holiday inn
you aint gonna change nothin
goin to rio
iowa
ode to sorrow
thank you for life
rock with you (demo)
sunset driver
susie
that girl
we are the ones
got to find a way somehow
in the life of chico
startin something (early version of wbss)
under your skin
you told me your lovin
you not me
nymphette lover
slipped away
somewhere in time
when you wish upon a star
why cant i be
learned my lesson
much too soon
niteline
trouble
slapstik
the toy
who do you know
carousel
got the hots
hot street
rolling the dice
someone in the dark
stand tall
the girl is mine (demo)
bad company
buffalo bill
doing dirty
fantasy
far far away
nona
power
there must be more to life than this
victory (w/ freddy mercury)
love never felt so good
be me 4 a day
the nelson mandela song
al capone
hot fever (twymmf demo)
scared of the moon
tomboy
what you do to me
another part of me (early version)
crack kills
pyramid girl (liberian girl demo)
the price of fame
whos bad (bad demo)
black or white demo
chicago 1945
girls of another lover
groove of midnight
turning me off
color of my soul
neverland landing
throwin your life away
alright now
bottle of smoke
deep in the night
heal the world demo
if you dont love me
i have this love of me
ill be there (adult version)
monkey buisness
seven digits
stay
who is it demo
work that body
fanfare transmition
dont be messin around
a baby smiles
bad girl
do the bartman
do you know where your children are
free
give into me demo
gone to soon demo
i forgive you
in the closet demo
jam demo
little girls
little susie (early version)
Llama Lola
lonely bird
lonely man
lucy is in love with linus
make a wish
men in black
michael mckellar
serious effect
remember the time demo
she got it
stay
the love you save (adult version)
Cry (not the one written by r kelly for invincible)
Red Eye
seven bright new stars
shes not a girl
sister sue
the childrens hour
tragedy of a cheerleader
who is the girl with her hair down
why shy
someone put your hand out
california grass
dreams
fear
bass(z)oulle
face
ghost (early version)
in the back
on the line
we be ballin
angel
do you love me
thank heaven that
belong 2
do you want me
escape
fall again
i have this dream
stop the war
a place with no name
do you love me
vibrationist
tubeway
edgar allan poe
kick it
on my anger
people have to make some kind of joke
saved by the bell
seeing voices
she was lovin me
the gloved one
the way you love me
this is our time
another day
i dont live here anymore
chicago 1945 (new version/rerecorded)
get around
i dont live anymore
in the valley
make or break
maybe we can do it
shout
soldiers entrance
that kind of lover
you're a liar, brother
wonderful world of candy
all in your name
pressure
seduction
the pain
weve had enough
light the way
unknown title (charity anthem for tsunami)
from the bottom of my heart
he who makes the sky grey
you are so beautiful
whats it gonna be
im dreamin
if you dont get it
days of the broken hearted
the future
if we still love
im still the king
can you
babys fire
i will miss you
bang your head
broken chair
i am a loser
i was the loser
D.I.E.
dont make me stay
H2O
Lady of summer
Silent Spring
Children of the world
Water

this of coarse are only the ones we know exist, im sure that there are more, as there were a few tracks on bad 25 that i had never seen or heard about before.

and thats just the songs in the vault.

there is also footage of pretty much all of the tours (J5 tours,Destiny Tour,Triumph Tour,Victory Tour,Bad Tour,Dangerous Tour,HIStory Tour, etc..) Plus rehearsal footage from Bad,Dangerous,and HIStory. possibly from all the tours, but i only know Bad,Dangerous,and HIStory rehearsal footage exist for sure.

There is alternate takes and mixes for many songs.. for example there is 91 mixes/versions of billie jean that were recorded before it was released.

There is the footage of Michael in the studio recording his albums.

Footage of all of the music video rehearsals.

There is 80 hours of this is it footage.

Michael was composing an album of classical music right before he passed, many of the pieces where completed as he showed them to award winning composer David Michael Frank. David describes them as "very pretty music" "one piece had an irish quality about it.i suggested we use a celtic harp.." "the pieces song very much like film score music, with very traditional harmony, and definitely very strong melodies." "one of them was a little John Barryish, like in Out of Africa, I could hear (in my head) sweeping strings and french horns in unison."

and probably even more that im forgetting or dont even know about..

needless to say, there is a TON of material.

seriously... How many of these songs are jams... and how many belong on the cutting room floor? which r your favorites.....and what classic MJ tracks would you compare them too?

That's the mystery, we don't really know. I'm happy enough with what we've got so far. Motown are doing a far better job than Sony though. Beyond the contract with Sony, i'd expect some outtake/demo stuff from The Jacksons (1976 onwards) too.

This guy had a 40 year career, so i'd expect a lot of releases over the years. Just with less fanfare as time goes on.

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Reply #335 posted 10/26/12 5:37am

flyorra

avatar

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=On-N99GmHDQ&feature=related

"who need the exercise"..lol

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Reply #336 posted 10/26/12 8:19am

EmeraldSkies

avatar

flyorra said:

That was interesting,but you can definately see where Michael took it,and made it his own.

Music washes away from the soul the dust of everyday life. ~Berthold Auerbach
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Reply #337 posted 10/26/12 1:36pm

mookie

Elizabeth Taylor Tops 2012 List Of The Top-Earning Dead Celebrities

When it comes to earnings, it’s hard to beat Michael Jackson. The pop singer, who died in 2009 at the age of 50, raked in more than any living artist in the past 12 months: $145 million.

But this year that wasn’t enough to get him to the top of our list of the Top-Earning Dead Celebrities. Beating him to the No. 1 spot is his old friend Elizabeth Taylor. The estate of the glamorous actress, who was 79 when she passed away last year, earned a staggering $210 million last year.

Most of that money came from the record-breaking Christie’s auctions of the star’s jewelry, costumes and art work, which brought in $184 million. Every one of the 1,800 lots sold. The most expensive item was an 1889 Van Gogh painting that went for $16 million.

Then there’s her perfume, White Diamonds, which is one of the best selling perfumes around bringing in $75 million at retail in 2011, according to Euromonitor.

The rest of the money came from property sales and residuals from Taylor’s movies. After Cleopatra, the star smartly negotiated a 10% ownership stake in each of her films. Her estate also collects money from Around The World in 80 Days, which was produced by her husband, Michael Todd.

Full List: Top-Earning Dead Celebrities 2012

The residuals will keep Taylor on our list, but without the money from the one-time auction, it will be tough for her to beat out the King of Pop again: Jackson’s estate has too many steady revenue streams. Not only does it earn from sales of his own music, Jackson owned a 50% stake in Sony‘s ATV catalog, which includes artists like The Beatles, Taylor Swift and Lady Gaga. His estate also collects money from the successful Cirque Du Soleil show The Immortal Tour.

Jackson earned $90 million more than our third-ranked celebrity, Elvis Presley. With $55 million in earnings the king of rock n’ roll pulled in the same amount as he did in 2011. As with Jackson, Cirque Du Soleil launched a whole show around Presley’s music in 2010, Viva Elvis, at MGM’s Aria casino in Las Vegas. But with ticket sales flagging, MGM asked Cirque to bring down the curtains at summer’s end. Luckily for the king, traffic was brisk at Graceland this year, making up for the lost revenue from the show.

Our list looks at earnings between October 2011 and October 2012. We count money coming into the estate and we don’t deduct for how the estate handles it. So for example, some of the proceeds from Elizabeth Taylor’s auction went to her AIDS Foundation, but we did not subtract that contribution from her total earnings.

Peanuts creator Charles Schulz ranks fourth with $37 million. Sixty years after the comic strip debuted, Charlie Brown and the gang are as hot as ever. The Peanuts are the ninth most lucrative entertainment franchise, bringing in $2 billion a year globally at retail. The strip is about to get the big-screen treatment from Fox’s animation division Blue Sky, which produced the Ice Agemovies. That could help boost Shulz’ earnings in coming years.

“The Peanuts have been underrepresented in media,” says Steve Marotta, an analyst at C.L. King & Associates who covers Iconix, the public company that managed Peanuts. “If it’s a good movie it’s only going to enhance the brands image and drive it into other categories.”

The movie is slated for 2015.

Bob Marley rounds out the top five, with $17 million in earnings last year. The reggae star has become a diversified businessman from beyond the grave. There is now a Marley beverage company which sells Marley’s Mellow Mood, a “relaxation” drink. Then there’s the House of Marley which sells headphones, speakers and “lively up” bags.

Full List: Top-Earning Dead Celebrities 2012

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Reply #338 posted 10/26/12 7:39pm

Vanilli

avatar

One of my Facebook friends shared this....

If only....

MJ Fan 1992-Forever

My Org Family: Cinnie, bboy87, Cinnamon234, AnckSuNamun, lilgish, thekidsgirl, thesexofit, Universaluv, theSpark, littlemissG, ThreadCula, badujunkie, DANGEROUSx, Timmy84, MikeMatronik, DarlingDiana, dag, Nvncible1
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Reply #339 posted 10/26/12 8:34pm

NaughtyKitty

avatar

Vanilli said:

One of my Facebook friends shared this....

If only....

sigh If only....But I gotta give kudos to this GREAT photoshop job! thumbs up! Prince and MJ are dressed similarly, have the same kind of shades, slightly similar hair--they look like they could be brothers in this pic!

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Reply #340 posted 10/27/12 8:53am

mookie

Review: Michael Jackson triumphs in 'Bad 25'

Spike Lee in-depth look at Jackson's 1987 album, 'Bad,' moves like a great pop song, with performance clips, 'who knew?' anecdotes and A-list testimonials.

An unexpected narrative has solidified around Michael Jackson's legacy since the pop superstar died in 2009: that as much as he was a creative genius — an artist capable of pulling inspiration from the cosmos, as Jackson himself describes it in Spike Lee's new documentary "Bad 25" — his success came largely as the result of hard work.

The master is being remade as a trouper.

We saw the beginnings of this in "This Is It," the 2009 documentary-cum-concert film assembled by Kenny Ortega from footage recorded during rehearsals for Jackson's ill-fated run of shows at the O2 Arena in London.

And now the story advances in "Bad 25," which takes an in-depth look at the making of Jackson's 1987 follow-up to the world-dominating "Thriller." (It's part of a 25th-anniversary onslaught that also includes a deluxe reissue of the album.)

"This documentary celebrates the King of Pop, Michael Jackson, and the achievements of his album 'Bad,'" reads a title card at the end of the movie, and the word "achievements" seems instructive: Lee revels in the long hours and musicianly expertise required to produce hits such as "Smooth Criminal" and "Man in the Mirror."

The album's commercial triumph, in his account, simply rewarded a job well done.

"Celebrates" is another telling word. Packed with flattering performance clips and fawning testimonials from A-list admirers, Lee's two-hour film is no less worshipful than "This Is It."

The director nods to the extra-musical pursuits that threatened to destabilize Jackson's career during the extended layover between "Thriller" and "Bad." He's especially insightful on the singer's controversial acquisition in 1985 of the Beatles' songbook, which cultural critic Nelson George says unsettled people — white people, one infers — who view those songs as "sacred."

But those were distractions, Lee decides.

What elevates "Bad 25" over sizzle-reel utility Lee's his distinctive personal touch. Partly, that means Lee's ability to get celebrities in front of a camera, as he did here with Justin Bieber, Mariah Careyand Kanye West, who thanks Jackson for introducing him in "Dirty Diana" to a predatory-groupie type he's since come to know well.
In one memorable sequence, the director dissects the "Bad" video with its director, Martin Scorsese— a kind of "Behind 'Behind the Music'" moment that reflects the obsession with minutiae that animates all of Lee's work.

And with Jackson, there's never any shortage of fascinating insider anecdotes. Who knew, for example, that playwright August Wilson had been asked to write a script for the video for "The Way You Make Me Feel"? (Wilson said no.)

All those details suggest that a nearly Jacksonian level of effort went into this meticulously researched movie, which following a theatrical run in L.A. is due to air on ABC on Thanksgiving. But not unlike the singer and his producer Quincy Jones, Lee stitches them together with speed and precision.

On-screen, "Bad 25" moves in the style of a great pop song.

http://www.latimes.c...,0,492252.story

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Reply #341 posted 10/27/12 9:05pm

NaughtyKitty

avatar

Here's a really good interview with Emmanuel Lewis (aka Webster) talking about his relationship with Michael. I didnt know that MJ stayed at his house for a while when he was recuperating from the Pepsi accident.

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Reply #342 posted 10/28/12 1:57pm

HAPPYPERSON

Keep on with the force, don’t stop. Don’t stop until you get enough of the 104th most acclaimed album of all time. Michael Jackson returns to the Great List with his 1979 breakthrough.
cover art

Michael Jackson

Off the Wall

(Epic; US: Aug 1979; UK: Aug 1979)

Mendelsohn: You know what I like about Michael Jackson’s Off the Wall, Klinger? The album cover. Michael Jackson, the young man, looks so happy to just be making music. And that joy translates throughout the entire record. I like that. In fact, I like this record much more than I thought I would. After our controversial trip through Thriller, and me saying some things to enrage Michael Jackson’s legions of fanatical, fantastical fans, I was a little apprehensive about having to discuss this record, mostly because I was afraid I would end up saying something off-color and my house would get egged again. I’m going to try and avoid that pitfall this time around.

Back to the album cover. Off the Wall shows off a young Michael Jackson (sans the reconstructive surgery) wearing an exuberant smile, and the listener is met with that same exuberance on the opening track, “Don’t Stop ‘Til You Get Enough”. The up-tempo funk sets the tone for the record (and I found Jackson’s use of falsetto to be much more enjoyable than his normal singing voice). The high energy is hard to maintain throughout the album, but the tracks Jackson penned stand up much better than the stuff by Rod Temperton and the schlock Paul McCartney always turns in.


I’m glad we are talking about this record, Klinger. I knew it would only be a matter of time before we got around to another Michael Jackson album. I’m just happy we didn’t hit Bad first, I have all sorts of nasty things to say about that piece of crazy. But it seems, for the time being, I have nothing but nice things to say about Off the Wall.


Klinger: So you’re not just saying all this to keep MJ fans from showing up with torches and pitchforks again? Of course not, I can feel your sincerity in every word. And I can’t disagree with you one bit. Off the Wall teems with, yep, exuberance—the sheer joy of a preternaturally talented young man coming into his own. Jackson was 20 years old when recording started, and like a lot of 20-year-olds, he was in the process of reinventing himself. Only instead of moving into an off-campus apartment and wearing an ill-advised poncho, he set about making an artistic statement that would position him as the heir apparent of soul music. Shaking free of the shackles of his young stardom, his apparently quite mad father, and Tito (I kid! Tito not only performed the same dance moves as his brothers, but he also played guitar while he did them—props to Tito), Jackson happened upon the ideal mentor in Quincy Jones.


In the Jackson/Jones Off the Wall partnership, you hear a very deliberate attempt to create something much larger than a standard disco album. You mention “Don’t Stop ‘Til You Get Enough”. and that’s appropriate. There is a ton of stuff happening on that song, from the swoopy strings to that devious little synth bass bit that pops up occasionally in the chorus.


http://youtu.be/yURRmWtbTbo

And really all of side one stands as a funk/soul tour de force that’s by turns laid-back and gritty. My own ambivalence toward Thriller was based mainly on Jackson’s sheer ubiquity during my teenage years. But Off the Wall carries no such baggage for me—it’s just the sound of a guy bringing his incredible early promise to full fruition.


Mendelsohn: Self-preservation aside, I’m being completely upfront and honest. The uptempo funk on side one of this record is straight-up awesome. Of course, you can’t just make an album full of nothing but feel-good dance hits. You have to have a couple slow numbers and a couple of ballads. That was the only way record companies would let you make an album—you had to promise to write at least one sappy ballad for each rocking cut or vice versa. So when I hit side two of Off the Wall and stumble directly into “Girlfriend”, I immediately start to lose interest. But not before I curse Paul McCartney’s name. The one saving grace is “I Can’t Help It”. That jazzy, soulful number is sublimely beautiful and represents the passing of the soul torch from Stevie Wonder to the young Jackson

http://youtu.be/QnhWML43NI8

Do you think Stevie Wonder felt a little conflicted giving Michael Jackson, his soul heir apparent, such a great song?


Klinger: Well, I doubt even Stevie Wonder could have sensed the phenomenon that was to come, but it’s interesting that his name has come up so often in this discussion. After all, as we’ve discussed Wonder’s albums in the past, I think we were both struck by how smooth and almost jazzy they get in places. We tune in for the harder funk and end up with a sort of Latin-y swirl of laid back groove. (Or outright balladry, which on Off the Wall takes the form of “She’s Out of My Life”, and the more I listen to that song the more it reveals itself as an absolutely stunning piece of vocal work on Jackson’s part.) There’s a lot of all that here on side two—which brings us this “Girlfriend” song that you seem to loathe with every fiber of your being for some reason

http://youtu.be/l6LUPlmua6I

OK, I admit that I am occasionally guilty of over-defending Paul McCartney, and I do maintain that he’s not gotten his due—especially where his post-Beatle work is concerned. And while it’s true that “Girlfriend” is a big pink cotton candy puff of a song, I’m tempted to think that that’s a function of the general perception that existed at the time vis-a-vis the once and future King of Pop. Let’s face it, if you’re 1979-era Michael Jackson and you’ve still got some hustling to do, you’re not likely to turn down a tune from a freakin’ Beatle. And if you’re Paul McCartney, you probably still kind of think of Michael Jackson as a little kid. Besides, “Girlfriend” does provide some of the sweetness that’s really pretty central to Jackson’s image.


Mendelsohn: Yes, those are all very valid points. But that won’t stop me from hating “Girlfriend”, or bemoaning McCartney’s incessant need to write such treacle. I mean, I’m as big of a fan of Wings as the next guy, but sometimes I think Paul was writing those silly little love songs just to piss off John Lennon. And maybe, just maybe, he got a little too carried away at times.


“Girlfriend” seems so contrived when compared to the other material on side two. I can see the reasoning in trying to tap into the sweetness that was Jackson’s image as he transitioned out of childhood—it is good marketing. But there is a stark contrast between “Girlfriend” and songs like “She’s Out of My Life”, “I Can’t Help It”, and “It’s the Falling in Love”, material that is much more adult, much more in line with the direction Jackson was trying to take his career.


http://youtu.be/6DQJPL9Yuq0

That direction that swerved into overkill territory on Thriller, but for a brief second on Off the Wall, I can see an artist who had all the tools necessary to take artistic statement and commercial success to the next level, a level well beyond the reach of his contemporaries. Obviously he put himself well in front of everyone else in terms of commercial success with release of Thriller; I would question the true artistic merit of that record but we’ve already been there and it doesn’t end well.

Klinger: And who knows—maybe if we had considered Thriller as a function of Off the Wall, we might have felt differently about it and thought of it as a more natural extension of Jackson’s growth. But by the same token, you’re right that Off the Wallcomes across as a conscious move on Jackson’s part to be viewed as something more than just a child star. Really, that seems to be the dichotomy that drove Jackson throughout the rest of his career. Every time he made overtures toward expressing the darkness that was there under the surface (and given the horrors that were apparently visited upon him by his father, it’s surprising that he was able to keep any of that under wraps), he seemed to feel the need to revert back into a childlike persona. (It’s worth noting that in between Off the Wall and Thriller, one of his more notable projects involved narrating the E.T. soundtrack album.) Add in the fact that he very quickly came upon an unhealthy level of fame, and the isolation that is always a part of that, and his story becomes nearly impossible for us to fully wrap our heads around.

But when you hear Off the Wall, it’s easy to forget the complicated narrative that follows and just revel in the notion that a startlingly talented little boy could grow up and make just the sort of album you’d want him to make. That’s the beauty and the joy of this album, and in some ways it’s part of the sadness, too.


http://youtu.be/5X-Mrc2l1d0

http://www.popmatters.com...l-jackson/

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Reply #343 posted 10/28/12 4:36pm

alphastreet

I put on OTW after so long the other day after Bad (my favourite era) and was really, really into it. I hadn't listened to it in ages but I do agree that along with Destiny and Triumph which are often overlooked are so amazing, lighthearted and full of hope and promise.

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Reply #344 posted 10/28/12 8:45pm

mjscarousal

alphastreet said:

I put on OTW after so long the other day after Bad (my favourite era) and was really, really into it. I hadn't listened to it in ages but I do agree that along with Destiny and Triumph which are often overlooked are so amazing, lighthearted and full of hope and promise.

nod

For the past couple of weeks I have been listening to OTW ALOT.... I Cant Help It has been getting worn out music

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Reply #345 posted 10/29/12 10:26am

MattyJam

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IMO Invincible would've been as strong as Dangerous with this tracklisting:

1. Unbreakable

2. Hollywood Tonight

3. Invincible

4. Butterflies

5. You Rock My World

6. Heartbreaker

7. Speechless

8. Shout

9. You Are My Life

10. We've Had Enough

11. The Lost Children

12. Whatever Happens

13. Threatened

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Reply #346 posted 10/29/12 10:37am

NaughtyKitty

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NaughtyKitty said:

Here's a really good interview with Emmanuel Lewis (aka Webster) talking about his relationship with Michael. I didnt know that MJ stayed at his house for a while when he was recuperating from the Pepsi accident.

touched Love this.

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Reply #347 posted 10/29/12 10:53am

Derek1984

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MattyJam said:

IMO Invincible would've been as strong as Dangerous with this tracklisting:

1. Unbreakable

2. Hollywood Tonight

3. Invincible

4. Butterflies

5. You Rock My World

6. Heartbreaker

7. Speechless

8. Shout

9. You Are My Life

10. We've Had Enough

11. The Lost Children

12. Whatever Happens

13. Threatened

I'm sure there was something recorded better than The Lost Children.

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Reply #348 posted 10/29/12 12:00pm

alphastreet

mjscarousal said:

alphastreet said:

I put on OTW after so long the other day after Bad (my favourite era) and was really, really into it. I hadn't listened to it in ages but I do agree that along with Destiny and Triumph which are often overlooked are so amazing, lighthearted and full of hope and promise.

nod

For the past couple of weeks I have been listening to OTW ALOT.... I Cant Help It has been getting worn out music

loooove that song, and my favourite from bad 25, I'm So Blue reminds me of it in the chorus

and his vocals are awesome, not that they're not on the other albums, but singing to off the wall feels smooth to sing along to and the others are more about his signature sound

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Reply #349 posted 10/29/12 12:01pm

alphastreet

MattyJam said:

IMO Invincible would've been as strong as Dangerous with this tracklisting:

1. Unbreakable

2. Hollywood Tonight

3. Invincible

4. Butterflies

5. You Rock My World

6. Heartbreaker

7. Speechless

8. Shout

9. You Are My Life

10. We've Had Enough

11. The Lost Children

12. Whatever Happens

13. Threatened

you forgot Fall Again, that song was perfect for MJ if completed
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Reply #350 posted 10/29/12 6:21pm

dm3857

alphastreet said:

MattyJam said:

IMO Invincible would've been as strong as Dangerous with this tracklisting:

1. Unbreakable

2. Hollywood Tonight

3. Invincible

4. Butterflies

5. You Rock My World

6. Heartbreaker

7. Speechless

8. Shout

9. You Are My Life

10. We've Had Enough

11. The Lost Children

12. Whatever Happens

13. Threatened

you forgot Fall Again, that song was perfect for MJ if completed

i feel like invincible had the potential to be even greater than Dangerous. My tracklist would differ a little bit from that (not saying your list was bad) that would have been a killer album! but my tracklist would have gone something like this:

Unbreakable

Xscape

Another Day

A Place With No Name

Whatever Happens

We've Had Enough

Speechless

Shout

You Rock My World

Butterflies

Threatend

One More Chance

Fall Again

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Reply #351 posted 10/30/12 10:33am

MattyJam

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I love The Lost Children. Sure, it's not exactly what I'd call cutting edge, but it's got a lot of heart and sincerity and I'd say it's probably the song on Invincible that's the most personal to MJ, alongside Speechless.

And you can't have a version of Invincible without Heartbreaker IMO. I love everything about that song, from it's frantic energy and futuristic production to the beatboxing and the beautiful harmonies on the middle eight. You can't have a version of Invincible without Heartbreaker. I love how MJ/Rodney Jerkins were shaking things up a bit with that one, adding a few dubstep influences and wacky sound effects. Take away the corny rap and it's one of the strongest uptempos on the album, alongside YRMW.

[Edited 10/30/12 10:37am]

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Reply #352 posted 10/30/12 12:00pm

Derek1984

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Invincible would have been better with the Neptunes.

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Reply #353 posted 10/30/12 4:10pm

silverchild

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mjscarousal said:

silverchild said:

It's definitely compressed. Both this and the 2001 special edition was compressed. What sucks even more is that the powers that be chose not to include the original mixes from the original album. That's why I'm holding on tight to my old 1987 CD pressing! biggrin

Wat exactly occurs in that process? I use to have the bad casette ages ago.

[Edited 10/30/12 16:13pm]

Check me out and add me on:
www.last.fm/user/brandosoul
"Truth is, everybody is going to hurt you; you just gotta find the ones worth suffering for." -Bob Marley
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Reply #354 posted 10/30/12 4:13pm

silverchild

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Derek1984 said:

Invincible would have been better with the Neptunes.

Invincible could've been better with Jay Kay and the guys. I have been saying for the longest that Michael should've went totally left field with that album. Screw the media, critics, and fans... lol

But it was still a great album nonetheless!

[Edited 10/30/12 16:14pm]

Check me out and add me on:
www.last.fm/user/brandosoul
"Truth is, everybody is going to hurt you; you just gotta find the ones worth suffering for." -Bob Marley
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Reply #355 posted 10/30/12 5:24pm

Cloudbuster

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silverchild said:

But it was still a great album nonetheless!

thumbs up!

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Reply #356 posted 10/30/12 6:06pm

mjscarousal

Invincible was definitly underrated for sure

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Reply #357 posted 10/30/12 6:14pm

alphastreet

mjscarousal said:

Invincible was definitly underrated for sure

I loved it and put it on repeat for years, but now I'm a little indifferent to it I'm finding. Songs that have stood the test of time are:

Threatened

Heartbreaker

YRMW

Heaven Can Wait

Don't Walk Away

Cry

Butterflies

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Reply #358 posted 10/30/12 8:47pm

silverchild

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I was listening to Invincible and it struck me how unbelievably well it stands up today. The first seven cuts alone sound like they could've been made today and be relevant. It's a fresh album, for sure!

Check me out and add me on:
www.last.fm/user/brandosoul
"Truth is, everybody is going to hurt you; you just gotta find the ones worth suffering for." -Bob Marley
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Reply #359 posted 10/30/12 9:54pm

mookie

Nice to see fans on here still giving Invincible it's due. I just see so much bandwagonish nonsense when I read about it anywhere else.

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