LET'S TALK DEBARGE! The official catch-all Debarge discussion thread - Part 2

[continuation of First thread http://prince.org/msg/8/299597, which is now - luv4u]



That's right, here's your place to talk about the family Debarge, their long and illustrious careers, and their current whereabouts and whatabouts.

This thread will replace the numerous Debarge threads created in this forum, and will serve as a place for Debarge fans to get their discussion ya-yas out here on prince.org.

DO NOT CREATE ANY NEW DEBARGE-RELATED THREADS AT THIS TIME. They will be deleted with the quickness.

So without any further ado, knock yourselves out with all the Debarge fan chat you can think of...![b]

Edmonton, AB -
- "Don't speak to me until I speak to you!" ~ Judge Judy.

Duct tape solves everything ~ Francis

"hush nubbits" !

Tommy Debarge and his fellow Switch member, Phillip Ingram, brother of James

Debarge

El and Flavor Flav

One of THE greatest songs in the Debarge Canon and one of the best love songs of all time

On Soul Train

El doing this on Motown Live

Scriptgirl... I ways waiting for you to post "first".

I didn't get a chance to read the last article you posted about the DeBarges, could you put that back up again? Thanks

TD3
[Edited 4/24/09 16:32pm]

By request, the article on the anniversary of "In A Special Way"

Article on the 25th anniversary of Debarge's classic album, "In a Speical Way:

After all, this was a good-looking quintet of teen idols aimed at kids who favoured Right On and Black Beat over Rolling Stone, a pin-up ready product of the Motown machine that brought the world their predecessors The Jackson Five. While some were generous enough to acknowledge their knack for harmonising, that was often where the praise stopped. “All style, no substance,” many critics cried.

In a Special Way — and most of the DeBarge’s work for that matter — is worthy of endless examination and praise. In a perfect world, the passage of time will have opened the minds of those who so steadfastly resisted its charms back in the day and enabled them to partake in what is simply a marvelous album from start to finish. Forever and always, it will be an unforgettable listening experience.Or so they thought.

Released on September 27, 1983, on Motown’s Gordy label, In a Special Way has grown in stature over a quarter century that has seen it emerge as a touchstone for the hip hop community and a favourite among serious soul fans thanks to an array of samples and covers. DeBarge siblings El, Bunny, James, Mark and Randy reached their creative peak here, melding the churchy vein of their songwriting and the sheen of the burgeoning synth-based R&B movement into a crisp, concise musical portrait. Light and lean, the album is a logical move beyond the more straight-forward, organic tenor of the two long-players that came before it.

By the fall of 1983, the group had established itself as one of R&B’s most popular acts with a unique brand of soul the masses first tasted via Switch, a Motown band featuring their brothers Bobby and Tommy that’s best known for the 1978 classic “There’ll Never Be.” Their promising but spotty 1981 debut The DeBarges stiffed, but the group (with younger brother James added to the lineup) hit their stride the second time around with 1982’s All This Love, a spirited album of soft funk and ballads that yielded two R&B smashes in “I Like It” and the title track. A gold seller, the album raised the group’s “it” factor considerably, landing them endless coverage in the black teen press and a coveted spot in the Emmy-winning Motown 25 special alongside label mates High Inergy. All the while, they were being touted as “the next Jacksons,” an observation that often led to them being unfairly labelled as the poor man’s version of pop
music’s quintessential dynasty.

The DeBarges were similar to the Jacksons in some respects, but a comparison to fellow singing siblings the Sylvers is far more logical. Like the Sylvers — who were key figures in the development of the Los Angeles-based Solar Records sound — the DeBarges wielded a sizeable degree of creative control over their material right out of the gate, a luxury it took the Jacksons years to secure. Their early recordings were true family affairs because each member chipped in on songwriting chores and lead vocals, an approach that gives their material a certain vibrancy and spontaneity. The trend continued on In a Special Way , with their collective abilities reaching an unmatched level of strength and vigour. Melody and harmony were emphasised more than ever before thanks in large part to El’s meticulous production work and arrangements. Whether or not this was completely intentional remains a mystery: According to All Music Guide writer Jason Elias,
rumours have swirled for years that the album’s horn tracks were lost during the recording process. “In a Special Way is one of the most spare and effective albums of the ’80s,” writes Elias, who also notes its “minimalist and artful sound.” Such praise, however, was not forthcoming when the record hit the street.

“Smart-aleck critics and R&B purists have been knocking DeBarge, Motown’s promising young pop/R&B group, for singing ‘Mary Poppins’ soul,” wrote Los Angeles Times contributor Dennis Hunt in February of 1984.” He conceded that the group was closer to the fancy of The Carpenters than the ferocity of The O’Jays, but he quickly pointed out that their detractors were dead wrong. “Rather than being castigated for singing wimpy soul, the group should be applauded for attempting to expand the horizons of R&B and for mastering a new kind of soul — silky soul.”

Still, folks like pop culture scribe Michael A. Gonzales, who wrote an excellent feature on the DeBarge family for Vibe magazine in 2007, had their minds in other musical places in 1983.

“When In a Special Way was first released, I was in the middle of my own aural love affair with artists like The Clash and David Bowie, so I really didn’t think about DeBarge much. Which is kind of funny, considering a few years before I had played ‘There’ll Never Be’ over and over,” Gonzales said. “But at 20 years old I needed something gritty, and the only falsetto-singing brother I was digging at the time was Prince.”

Needless to say, falsetto singing is where the similarities between Prince and DeBarge pretty much end. Unlike Prince, DeBarge knew how to wrap their creations in a veil of subtlety, favouring lush introspection over carnal acrobatics. The LP’s highlights were the two hit singles, as “Time Will Reveal” and “Love Me In a Special Way” (which featured Stevie Wonder on harmonica) seamlessly blend the high drama of the old school with the glam of nascent synth soul. As the group’s mastermind and lead vocalist, El was able to tease a dark underpinning out of his siblings’ blends in the same way Maurice White did with The Emotions, a tactic that makes their work much more intelligent than many realise. The harmonies and melodic climaxes of the two songs are so overwhelming that it’s easy to forget the group is singing about love that is in a sense imperfect. The other ballads are equally engaging, with “Queen of My Heart” (a selection
co-produced by brother Bobby that first appeared on their debut), the dramatic “Stay With Me” and “A Dream” augmenting the album’s recurring theme of love and longing. The latter, which was penned and led by sister Bunny, has aged particularly well and was a perfect way to close the album.

Outside of all of the billowy romanticism were some solid up-tempo grooves. The group wouldn’t really get a firm grip on the dance music medium until 1985’s Rhythm of the Night, but they managed to churn out some delightful ditties: “Be My Lady” and “Need Somebody” were perfect vehicles for James’ agile tenor, while the catchy “Baby, Won’t Cha Come Quick” rides into dance-rock territory on the back of a searing guitar solo. “I Give Up on You” was the best of the lot, an El-led dancer written by James and the legendary Billy Preston that boasts a frenetic, feel-good arrangement. “The quirky pop vocals on the tracks “Be My Lady” and “I Give Up on You” remind me of the style Scritti Politti used two years later on Cupid & Psyche 85,” Gonzales said.

DeBarge would reach their commercial zenith with Rhythm of the Night, but most agree In a Special Way is the greatest testament to the group’s artistry. The album earned them their second gold certification and scored a Grammy nomination for best R&B performance by a duo or group, an award they lost to Rufus and Chaka Khan’s “Ain’t Nobody.” The album has been a constant source of inspiration to the black music community, as Tupac, Mary J. Blige, the Notorious B.I.G., Blackstreet, Tamia, Ashanti and Mariah Carey, among countless others, have all covered or sampled one of its nine cuts. It is easily one of the most sampled R&B albums of all time.

Today, interest in the DeBarge family continues to grow. Both Bunny and DeBarge matriarch Etterlene have penned memoirs, and U.S. cable network TV One will profile the family act on Unsung, a series premiering November 30 that will tell the stories of some of R&B’s most talented and underrated artists. Indeed, it seems the group may finally be getting its due.

In a Special Way — and most of the DeBarge’s work for that matter — is worthy of endless examination and praise. In a perfect world, the passage of time will have opened the minds of those who so steadfastly resisted its charms back in the day and enabled them to partake in what is simply a marvelous album from start to finish. Forever and always, it will be an unforgettable listening experience.

“Without a doubt, In a Special Way is a classic,” Gonzales said. “I just wish I had discovered it sooner.”

Others who take the time to listen to the music will surely come to the same conclusion.

—S.E. Flemming Jr
Saturday 27 September 2008

Thank you script..." for re-posting this article.

Mr. Flemmings 25 year retrospective of "In a Special Way" was very well written, thoughtful, and intelligent. The DeBarge's as a groups and as individuals could have and should have have done so much more. Piety. What might have been.

The Jackson 5 have always been the group that other family music groups have been judged by; I was glad someone finally made a connection between the DeBarges and the Sylvers. The Jackson's just had a very different vibe and as amazing as they were, harmonizing wasn't something they did or as well as the DeBarges or the Sylvers. Though I always thought the DeBarge family across the board were better individual singers than the Sylvers; their (Sylvers) voices were just a bit thin.

All This Love, needs to be re-released. For those who may not have noticed, iTunes does have El's debut solo album up. If you type in DeBarge they have the album cover of El's solo debut but with the wrong tracks from the, Rhythm of the Night Cd. You have to type in El's name to get the right music with the right music cover.
[Edited 4/8/09 14:48pm]

I admit I know next to nothing about the Sylvers and curiously, they don't seem to be much remembered today. People make the jump from the Jackson to the Debarges without ever really thinking of the Sylvers, somehow. You never hear the Sylvers music on the radio, ever.But this is not a Debarge vs The Sylvers thread.

Here is El, doing "Heart, Mind and Soul"

scriptgirl said:

Really, the only reason the Debarge legacy has been kept alive is through sampling. Also, the Vibe article and Unsung have REALLY got people talking about them again, thank goodness. Chico recently said the internet is a good thing as far as his family because it keeps their music alive and it is true. When you read comments on Debarge youtube vids, a lot of people say they only knew the song through sampling or they just found out about them through Unsung.

Forgive me for not knowing but who exactly is DeBarge? I never heard of them growing up.

From Wikipedia:
DeBarge was an American music group, whose repertoire included R&B, soul, funk, and later gospel. Active as a professional recording group between 1979 and 1989, the group was one of the few recording acts to bring success to the Motown label during the 1980s.

Background
Hailing from Detroit, Michigan and later from Grand Rapids, Michigan, the group is named for their shared surname, and included the brothers Mark (or "Marty"), James, Randy, and Eldra (or "El"), and their sister Bunny. Younger siblings Chico, Darryl, and Carol "Peaches" DeBarge are also singers (though they were not with the group), with Chico later becoming a solo star in his own right. Two older brothers, Robert Jr. (Bobby) and Tommy were members of another popular Motown group named Switch. The DeBarges signed with the Motown record label in the 1970s, and became one of their few successful acts during the 1980s.

The band had a string of R&B and pop hits in the early to mid 1980's, including "All This Love," "I Like It," "Love Me in a Special Way," and "Rhythm of the Night." Many of these hits were ballads, spreading the band's appeal into the adult contemporary market as well. However, in 1986, both El and Bunny DeBarge left for solo careers. The remaining brothers soldiered on with their older brother Bobby (who'd long since left Switch) now joining the band to release the album Bad Boys in 1987, but it didn't achieve nearly the success of previous releases. Meanwhile, El went on to have a moderately successful solo career, and Bunny would score a minor hit with "Save the Best for Me (Best of Your Lovin')" from her only solo album before being abruptly dropped by her label. Overall, DeBarge released nine Top 40 R&B singles, five top 40 pop singles, two pop top ten hits, five top ten R&B singles, two number-one R&B singles, a number-one single on the dance chart and three number-one hits on the adult contemporary chart.


[edit] History

[edit] Early years
In 1977, elder siblings Tommy DeBarge and Bobby DeBarge formed a group called Switch along with Jody Sims, Greg Williams, Phillip Ingram and Eddie Fluellen. They were discovered by Motown artist Jermaine Jackson, and signed to the Motown label that same year. Switch recorded several hits for Motown's Gordy label, including "There'll Never Be" and "I Call Your Name". Around this time managers of Switch also became aware of Bobby and Tommy's younger brothers including Randy, Marty and El, whose vocal talent was often compared to Bobby's. Including eldest sister Bunny in the mix. After an impromptu audition in front of Jermaine Jackson, who was producing Switch, the group was signed to Motown's Gordy imprint in 1979 as a quartet of Bunny, Randy, Marty and El (younger brother James would join in 1982). As "The DeBarges", they released their self-titled debut in 1981 featuring the first single, "What's Your Name." Neither the album nor the single charted, and the group was later determined to produce themselves on the next record.


[edit] Success years
Following a new lineup - now featuring James DeBarge in the fold - the newly christened quintet, DeBarge, record a mostly self-penned and produced album titled All This Love in 1982. After releasing the dance single, "Stop! Don't Tease Me", the group released the smoother "I Like It", in January 1983. Featuring lead vocals from Randy and El, the song raced up to number two on the Billboard R&B singles chart while also crossing over to pop radio eventually peaking at number 31 on the Billboard Hot 100. A second single, the sole El DeBarge composition, "All This Love", became an even bigger hit reaching number one on the R&B chart and peaking at number 17 on the pop chart and also becoming the group's first number-one hit on the Billboard AC chart. Its success helped its parent album reached gold status. DeBarge made their first live appearance on Motown 25, where they performed a number with fellow Motown band High Inergy.

In 1983, the group quickly issued a third album, In a Special Way, which would end up becoming a memorable album for R&B music lovers due to El's smooth vocals and songwriting approach. The album yielded the hits "Time Will Reveal" (another R&B number one) and "Love Me in a Special Way" (which featured a rare harmonica solo from Stevie Wonder) and matched the success of its predecessor going gold. Following the album's release, the group went on the road in 1984 as Luther Vandross' opening act but according to an article about the DeBarge family on VIBE magazine, James DeBarge recounts how the group used to get mobbed everywhere they went and that's what made them realized how famous they had become. Following a successful touring year, in 1985, the group issued the Rhythm of the Night, including the "title track", originally featured on the Motown film, The Last Dragon, which granted the group their biggest pop success reaching number three on the Billboard Hot 100 becoming their biggest-selling and most successful single to date. Another hit, "Who's Holding Donna Now", also went to the pop top ten helping the album to also hit gold status.

By now, Motown was building El DeBarge as the focal point of the group and some singles were released under the moniker, DeBarge featuring El DeBarge, bringing back memories of when Motown CEO Berry Gordy had changed the names of some of his famous Motown groups including The Supremes, changing their name to Diana Ross and the Supremes to reflect the rising star of its lead singer. Etterlene "Mama" DeBarge, the group's mother, said that Motown had El "believing he would be a superstar" saying later that the label "didn't realize (Gordy) was dividing a family and not a group". After the releases of "The Heart Is Not So Smart" and "You Wear It Well", which they performed on The Facts of Life tv show, El DeBarge promptly left DeBarge to become a solo artist, prompting Bunny DeBarge to follow him out of the group. While El achieved substantial solo success with the singles "Who's Johnny" and "Love Always", he didn't become the solo star Motown had hoped, Bunny only released one solo album and retired from show business after that to deal with a substance abuse problem.

The Miami Vice TV Show Episode "Bought and Paid For" (1985) also featured DeBarge (although not all members) singing their two songs "You Wear It Well" and "Rhythm of the Night".


[edit] Decline
Following the exits of El and Bunny, DeBarge struggled to find a hit. Leaving Motown for Striped Horse Records in 1987, they recruited older brother Bobby, who had been mentoring the group following his split from Switch in 1981, as a member releasing their final album, Bad Boys. Featuring the singles "(Bad Boys) Dance All Night" and "I Got You Babe", with James and Bobby taking lead on the respective songs, the album tanked due to little promotion. Following a tour and an appearance on the Punky Brewster show, Bobby and younger brother Chico DeBarge, then riding high off the success of his single, "Talk to Me", was arrested in Grand Rapids, Michigan for drug trafficking serving five years in prison in Milan. The conviction promptly ended DeBarge's career as they disbanded shortly thereafter in 1989 leaving the rest of the members to deal with their substance abuse problems. James, who had made headlines for marrying singer Janet Jackson of the famous Jackson family in 1984, had long struggled with drug and alcohol abuse and later successfully completed rehab in the mid-1990s. Randy, Marty and elder brother Tommy also recovered from drug abuse but suffered consequences as Tommy now reportedly suffers from kidney dialysis, Randy has an incurable unknown disease, and Marty suffers from chronic debilitation in his legs. After Bunny became sober, she became a born-again Christian. El continued a modestly successful solo career recording vocals for the 1990 Quincy Jones hit, "Secret Garden", and Fourplay's 1991 cover of Marvin Gaye's "After the Dance". In 1994, Bobby and Chico were released from prison after serving their five-year sentences. During the prison intake process, Bobby found out he had AIDS which he contracted through heroin use. In 1995, Bobby DeBarge died from complications of the disease at the age of 39. Bobby's death reportedly devastated El, who his mother said, wasn't the same after his brother's death.


[edit] Recent years
In 1998, the DeBarge brothers - El, Marty, Randy and James - reunited for several shows including Sinbad's Summer Jam concert in Aruba where they performed "I Like It" and "All This Love". Around this time, records released by DeBarge were being played again due to hip-hop singers and rap acts sampling the group. The band's album track, "Stay With Me", was first sampled in 1994 by The Notorious B.I.G., who used the ending instrumental of El playing piano for his remix of the single, "One More Chance". The same instrumental loop was used in Big L's "MVP" and Ashanti's "Foolish". More recently, Mariah Carey used samples from this song for "I'll Be Lovin' U Long Time", track included in her latest album "E=MC²". "Time Will Reveal" is often covered by R&B groups such as Blackstreet, who interpolated the song into a gospel ballad, "The Lord Is Real (Time Will Reveal)", while Boyz II Men did an a cappella version of the song on one of their more recent albums. "Love Me In a Special Way" was covered by IMX and singer Tamia and was sampled by Ashanti and rapper AZ. "I Like It" is probably the group's most beloved single, as certain elements of the song have been either sampled or repeated (El's bridge in the song, "I like the way you comb your hair/I like the stylish clothes you wear...", has been constantly repeated over and over again) while "All This Love" was also sampled by AZ and covered by Patti LaBelle. In 2007, DeBarge was famously sampled again when Bobby's band Switch's hit, "I Call Your Name", was sampled for Rich Boy's hit, "Throw Some D's".

In the following years, Chico DeBarge emerged as a solo star with a repertoire of neo soul and hip-hop soul with hits such as "Iggin' Me", "No Guarantees" and "Soopaman Lover" while the group's youngest sibling, Darrell "Young" DeBarge released his first album, The Hunt, in 2007. While Carol "Peaches" DeBarge has no intention to try a secular solo career, she did participate in a 1991 album featuring members of her family including some of her brothers, sister Bunny and mother Etterlene titled Back on Track. As of 2008, the surviving members of DeBarge have lived quiet lives though they are still contemplating releasing albums. In November of 2007, El, Marty and James sang together during a Thanksgiving special service at the Destiny Community Church in Whittier, California. In 2008, Etterlene DeBarge released the autobiography, Other Side of the Pain, which documented her family's troubled childhoods, their rise to fame and their troubles while under the glare of the spotlight. Daughter Bunny is also planning an autobiography about her family titled The Kept Ones and is working on a gospel album.

Info about Chico's new album, via the site Singersroom:

Former "Talk To Me" singer Chico DeBarge is close to releasing the long-anticipated album "Addiction" this summer !

"Addiction," DeBarge's first release since 2003s "Free," will be released under the singer's new deal with Kedar Entertainment.

As previously reported on Singersroom, the album is confirmed to feature a collaboration with labelmate and fellow R&B singer Joe who is due to release an album this summer.

Joe, speaking with Singersroom says "I have to say ("Addiction") it’s going to be one of the best albums coming out in this decade simply because it is one of the most honest albums I have heard. He’s got a story to tell and I definitely support what he does."

A single from the Chico DeBarge's "Addiction" album will be released soon.

"Addiction" is slated for release via Kedar Entertainment June 30.

Sandino said:

El onstage with Tyrese and Ginuwine for a tribute to Patti Labelle

here is the direct link to the video.
http://www.youtube.com/wa...annel_page
[Edited 4/11/09 12:57pm]

The videos are nice.
I don't think EL was a good
choice for the Luther
tribute but he did do his
part like a true Debarge.

Actually the performance was for a tribute to Patti Labelle

scriptgirl said:

I posted the direct to the patti labelle tribute under the video

I was shocked to go to both of El's pages on myspace and it shows him as single I thought he was married? I am not sure if it is an offical myspace but, there are some very personal pics of him with friends and family pictures. Everybody thought the drug curse would end with El but sometimes the apple don't fall far from the tree. I am johnnie come late because I just saw the Unsung Debarges and it was sad... His wife monique looks like she was high on drugs herself! I didn't see not one single picture of her on either page or his relatives pages either.


Chico still look good too!

The message you are about to hear are not meant for transmission. Should ONLY be accessed in the privacy of your mind. Words are so intense so if you dare to listen.Take off your clothes and meet me between the lines.

El and Monique have had a tempestous relationship for years and from what I gather, are legally seperated. I also understand that Monique is NO ONE to fuck around with. She does not play.

scriptgirl my fav was 'love always' do you have that on youtube.

I will look and see. If that was a song El did while he was on Warners, the answer is no, since Warners has pulled all their music from youtube.

From All Hip Hop.com

Famed music producer/singer Kenneth “Babyface” Edmonds is returning to overseeing the careers of singing sensations, with the launch of his new record label Sodapop Music.



News of Sodapop’s arrival comes years after Edmonds co-founded the iconic Hip-Hop/R&B label, LaFace Records, with fellow music mogul L. A. Reid.



During its heyday in the 1990’s LaFace introduced the public to revered Atlanta rap duo Outkast as well as fellow rappers Goodie Mob, Cee-Lo Green, Dolla and Youngbloodz and Petey Pablo.



The label’s golden touch extended into R&B with the arrival of TLC, Toni Braxton and Usher as well as Ciara, Pink, Donnell Jones and Tony Rich.



Edmonds and Reid parted ways with LaFace by the end of the ‘90s as Edmonds concentrated on his music career while producing fewer LaFace artists.



Reid followed suit in 2001 after he was appointed chairman/CEO of Arista Records, which had joined with BMG Records to acquire LaFace completely in 1999.



Reid currently serves as the chairman of Island Def Jam Music Group Edmonds hopes to repeat the success he had with LaFace at Sodapop Music, utilizing Island Def Jam's newest artist, Kristinia Debarge.



The 19-year-old entertainer, who is the daughter of DeBarge keyboardist and founding member James DeBarge, is creating a buzz for her forthcoming debut album with the release of her new song, “Goodbye.”



Edmonds played an active role in the project’s creation by writing and producing many of the tracks featured on the album, including “Goodbye.”



In the coming weeks, Kristinia DeBarge will shoot a video for the single in Los Angeles.



The singer’s debut album is slated to hit stores in the summer.

I'm so confused. In part 1 of this forum, someone had posted the interview El did with Donnie Simpson and he said a thank you to four very special people in his life at the time. Someone had said that he didn't mention 2 other children that was born around the time of his interview. He had a set of twins around this time? I'm really confused because it looks like the kids he had with Monique are all around the same age or year or two apart from one another..Ol gurl was poppin them out like that!! Go ahead girl because I couldn't see myself having all those kids!!! LOL!!I know of Adris,Lil El, Joshua and Kendell. But who else is left and exactly how many times has Mr. DeBarge been married?

El has been married 3 times. His kids are Adris, El Debarge Jr, Josh and Kendall, the 5 with Monique and 2 other sons named Nicholas and Noah.

Oh Okay!!! Thanks for getting me updated. Was he married to Nicholas and Noah's mom?

The only women El has been married to are the mothers of El Debarge Jr ( who as a Soul Train dancer), his ex Tracy, the mother of Josh and Kendall and Monique. No idea who Noah and Nicholas' moms are.

I wish Kristinia all the luck. I just hope she's promoted well. And somehow they can give her the Debarge sound which will be kinda hard since El is not involved. Hopefully face can construct something similiar to what he did with El. It was Face produced but it was still reminiscent of the the old Debarge sound just updated.

I hope she is promoted well and she can sing, but I think the Debarge sound as we know it, would not be relevant. Plus, Kristinia needs her own sound.