peggyon said:

The reason I am now wary of some of those who knew Prince, is that many of them have not conducted themselves well and have made claims that seem to give them over-important roles.

There is only a need to cross-check and perform due diligence on statements that have been made by any of them, nothing more.

violetcrush said:

Right motherfunka. Ingrid's history with Prince, and the details of the night they met have been well documented in Biographies, and confirmed by various associates in his camp during that time. Not sure why or how it is so hard to believe that LoveSexy was at least partly inspired by the few months he spent with her at PP. Her poetry was deifinitely in the mix with the songs and themes for the album, and also with her own album (May 19 1992) which Prince produced for her. Apparently, Madoonna was also inspired by her poetry, as she took credit for writing Justify My Love, which resulted in Ingrid having to take legal action to get paid writer's credit.

*

All that being said, obviously Prince - as even he had stated in the LoveSexy concert tour material, and within some of the songs - was in a dark place prior to the night he took the X and met Ingrid. It is clear that she at least helped him out of this negative space, and inspired a more positive message. Prince's songs usually reflected what was specifically happening in his life at that moment, and we know she was there during that time. Clearly, the album also speaks to his feelings about and strong relationship with God, as well as, the message to his fans that a belief in and love for God will help you in your darkest times.

*

I'm always amazed by people/fans who have never met Prince or spent any time with him, and yet they insist that any information or details expressed by those who actually did have a relationship with Prince are embellishing or giving false statements. It's just absurd to me. Sorry, but I'm inclined to believe and accept their information over an anonymous fan who had nothing to do with Prince in any personal way.

Here is the path to a YT video of a 1992 interview with Ingrid. At 10:13 she is asked about the Love Sexy album, and explains how some of the songs came to be. She had also given the same host a tour of PP a few months prior to this interview. That video is on YT as well.

*

Interestingly, she speaks about the song Alphabet St and explains that the song was inspired by a silly game she and Prince were playing with the alphabet. In an online fan Q&A Prince was asked about that song, and why the letter G is missing during the reciting of the alphabet. Here's that dialog from the L4OA web site Nov 17, 1997:

*

U: On Lovesexy, on Alphabet Street, a woman’s voice can be heard in the background reciting the alphabet. But she skips the letter “G”. What’s up with that?

: She was being kissed at the time, and got flustered, EYE suppose.

violetcrush said:

peggyon said:

The reason I am now wary of some of those who knew Prince, is that many of them have not conducted themselves well and have made claims that seem to give them over-important roles.

There is only a need to cross-check and perform due diligence on statements that have been made by any of them, nothing more.

Here is the path to a YT video of a 1992 interview with Ingrid. At 10:13 she is asked about the Love Sexy album, and explains how some of the songs came to be. She had also given the same host a tour of PP a few months prior to this interview. That video is on YT as well.

*

Interestingly, she speaks about the song Alphabet St and explains that the song was inspired by a silly game she and Prince were playing with the alphabet. In an online fan Q&A Prince was asked about that song, and why the letter G is missing during the reciting of the alphabet. Here's that dialog from the L4OA web site Nov 17, 1997:

*

U: On Lovesexy, on Alphabet Street, a woman’s voice can be heard in the background reciting the alphabet. But she skips the letter “G”. What’s up with that?

: She was being kissed at the time, and got flustered, EYE suppose.

Woops....here's the YT video:

*

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1bH7UkZnkPA

peggyon said:

The reason I am now wary of some of those who knew Prince, is that many of them have not conducted themselves well and have made claims that seem to give them over-important roles.

There is only a need to cross-check and perform due diligence on statements that have been made by any of them, nothing more.

violetcrush said:

Right motherfunka. Ingrid's history with Prince, and the details of the night they met have been well documented in Biographies, and confirmed by various associates in his camp during that time. Not sure why or how it is so hard to believe that LoveSexy was at least partly inspired by the few months he spent with her at PP. Her poetry was deifinitely in the mix with the songs and themes for the album, and also with her own album (May 19 1992) which Prince produced for her. Apparently, Madoonna was also inspired by her poetry, as she took credit for writing Justify My Love, which resulted in Ingrid having to take legal action to get paid writer's credit.

*

All that being said, obviously Prince - as even he had stated in the LoveSexy concert tour material, and within some of the songs - was in a dark place prior to the night he took the X and met Ingrid. It is clear that she at least helped him out of this negative space, and inspired a more positive message. Prince's songs usually reflected what was specifically happening in his life at that moment, and we know she was there during that time. Clearly, the album also speaks to his feelings about and strong relationship with God, as well as, the message to his fans that a belief in and love for God will help you in your darkest times.

*

I'm always amazed by people/fans who have never met Prince or spent any time with him, and yet they insist that any information or details expressed by those who actually did have a relationship with Prince are embellishing or giving false statements. It's just absurd to me. Sorry, but I'm inclined to believe and accept their information over an anonymous fan who had nothing to do with Prince in any personal way.

But remember, most associates, girlfriends, etc back then were not inclined to give detailed information about their time with Prince due to fear of legal retaliation. I have no doubt this is the reason for the lack of detail or basic information from them in earlier years.

"As earthy and funky as Smith was, Ingrid Chavez was ethereal, gentle and sensitive — and admittedly, a little hard to grasp. Williams had a challenging time getting concrete answers from Chavez, who was the only woman on the panel who’d had a romantic relationship with Prince, so there was also that unspoken layer of complication.

*

Chavez said she spent what sounded like a surreal-sounding winter with Prince, holed up in Paisley Park and sending poetry back and forth to each other in written notes. Prince’s side of the poetry exchange would become Lovesexy.

*

“Lovesexy is our conversations,” she said."

*

So, from this information I do not get that Ingrid was stating she was the only inspiration for the album. What I get is that Prince's side of the poetry became the album. So, the poetry notes written by him are his thoughts and feelings which can be tied to many things going on in his mind - one of which being his conversations/relationship with Ingrid Chavez. He was in a dark place prior to meeting Ingrid, so I imagine that much of the lyrics were him working out how to overcome those issues while taking inspiration from her thoughts and ideas about life, love, religion, etc.

On another note, many of these "glimpses" have been stated/discussed with other associates, managers, assistants, etc. and they are aligned with the statements of these women. Mark Brown stated they would play non-stop for hours and hours - to the point where he figured out how to keep playing his Bass with one hand, so he could make himself a sandwich because he was starving. Wendy and Lisa have stated the band would play the same "loop" of Body Heat for 4 hours straight so Prince could practice his dance moves.

*

There is a video - I think from the late 90's or early 2000's - of Karen Krattinger, his personal assistant for many years in the 80's, reciting one of her daily "to do" lists from the PR period - "I was a workaholic. I had no life, and I think Prince appreciated that and liked that. In a way I've always described myself at that time, that I was one of his women." Reporter: "If Prince wanted something it was always, "Oh Karen....". She described what working one day for Prince meant".

*

Karen K: "I had to check on a new printer, check on a license for the Limousine, reimburse Earl for curlers, get a Pool Table with red felt for his Dad, I need to have Mr Nelson's Piano overhauled and painted, Prince wanted a 1985 GMC - I had to look into that, interview a new housekeeper, check the office supplies at his house, check with Susannah about washer repair - washing machine repair, schedule the garbage pickup at his house, check on the Mazarati rehearsal schedules, America videos for The Revolution...I had to call somebody at the management office and get something, put in the phone at the new gate - the security guard gate at his new house, get someone a gold and platinum record, call Bernadette Anderson, who is Andre's Mom and Prince's other Mom, then I had to talk to Prince about the NAACP awards. That was one day, and probably just part of it."

*

Imagine if you have a long list of things to complete, but then unexpectedly have to fly somewhere. At least in the 80's it took a bit longer to make travel arrangements, but there also were no smart phones or internet connections - no texting, no Google, no Waze. At least Ruth had the advantage of 21st century technology

[Edited 10/27/18 11:13am]

violetcrush said:

That is a really good point violetcrush. I don't most remember what life was like back in the 80s minus all the technology. Sometimes I listen to Prince songs written back in the day and I wonder how the young people would miss context due to historical significance. Just like subtle nuisances. Like "How come you don't call me" when he's like why don't you awnser your phone baby?? Like one could assume it's because she is out on a date with another guy . Like you actually had to catch someone at the perfect time like they are physically in the same room with the phone. I'm sure that would perplex people today like " Just text her!" Lol.

On a related note , I have a memory of meeting this guy once, and I don't know how Prince came up but he said he knew one of Prince's assistants back in the day and he said Prince would give her the job of tracking down a woman in a magazine that he wanted to meet. I think the guy was in awe that Prince had the power to do that but all I could think was like Omg that poor assistant...in the 80s that would be so stressful..i mean how many phone calls would that require?

Krystalkisses said:

violetcrush said:

On another note, many of these "glimpses" have been stated/discussed with other associates, managers, assistants, etc. and they are aligned with the statements of these women. Mark Brown stated they would play non-stop for hours and hours - to the point where he figured out how to keep playing his Bass with one hand, so he could make himself a sandwich because he was starving. Wendy and Lisa have stated the band would play the same "loop" of Body Heat for 4 hours straight so Prince could practice his dance moves.

*

There is a video - I think from the late 90's or early 2000's - of Karen Krattinger, his personal assistant for many years in the 80's, reciting one of her daily "to do" lists from the PR period - "I was a workaholic. I had no life, and I think Prince appreciated that and liked that. In a way I've always described myself at that time, that I was one of his women." Reporter: "If Prince wanted something it was always, "Oh Karen....". She described what working one day for Prince meant".

*

Karen K: "I had to check on a new printer, check on a license for the Limousine, reimburse Earl for curlers, get a Pool Table with red felt for his Dad, I need to have Mr Nelson's Piano overhauled and painted, Prince wanted a 1985 GMC - I had to look into that, interview a new housekeeper, check the office supplies at his house, check with Susannah about washer repair - washing machine repair, schedule the garbage pickup at his house, check on the Mazarati rehearsal schedules, America videos for The Revolution...I had to call somebody at the management office and get something, put in the phone at the new gate - the security guard gate at his new house, get someone a gold and platinum record, call Bernadette Anderson, who is Andre's Mom and Prince's other Mom, then I had to talk to Prince about the NAACP awards. That was one day, and probably just part of it."

*

Imagine if you have a long list of things to complete, but then unexpectedly have to fly somewhere. At least in the 80's it took a bit longer to make travel arrangements, but there also were no smart phones or internet connections - no texting, no Google, no Waze. At least Ruth had the advantage of 21st century technology

[Edited 10/27/18 11:13am]

That is a really good point violetcrush. I don't most remember what life was like back in the 80s minus all the technology. Sometimes I listen to Prince songs written back in the day and I wonder how the young people would miss context due to historical significance. Just like subtle nuisances. Like "How come you don't call me" when he's like why don't you awnser your phone baby?? Like one could assume it's because she is out on a date with another guy . Like you actually had to catch someone at the perfect time like they are physically in the same room with the phone. I'm sure that would perplex people today like " Just text her!" Lol. On a related note , I have a memory of meeting this guy once, and I don't know how Prince came up but he said he knew one of Prince's assistants back in the day and he said Prince would give her the job of tracking down a woman in a magazine that he wanted to meet. I think the guy was in awe that Prince had the power to do that but all I could think was like Omg that poor assistant...in the 80s that would be so stressful..i mean how many phone calls would that require?

Oh absolutely! Prince definitely had his assistants and managers locating women for him. Devin DeVasquez has confirmed that flights were arranged for her so she could attend various PR concerts around the US while Prince was having the fling with her. She told the story of the first time she was flown to a concert and Big Chick, Prince's bodyguard, picking her up in the security van. They got into a car accident on the way back to the hotel. In Alan Light's book about the filming and tour for Purple Rain Susannah was interviewed about their relationship, and she stated, "well, we lost touch for about a year while he was busy being a rock star, petulant and needy, getting any girl that he wanted". Sounds about right

*

I was a teen in the 80's and remember it well - especially in comparison to how easy things are now with advances in technology. I mean, the "call waiting" feature was HUGE back then You no longer had to deal with a busy signal when trying to reach someone at home. Faxing papers was also a major thing - no longer had to send something through the mail.

*

Karen K, Alan Leeds, and Steve Fargnoli were very very very busy people during that time

[Edited 10/27/18 12:19pm]

violetcrush said:

Yes, omg busy would be the perfect word. Sounds like if you worked for Prince you didn't get to have a life. Prince WAS your life! Haha. But I wonder if for his 21st Centry assistants if they had the advantage of superior technology yet I wonder if that just intensified the expectations and they were expected to do even more and faster! Prince always seemed to go to extremes and push the limits so I'm sure his expectations rose along with what was now possible.

Ps. I loved Devins book too btw. It actually made me see Prince in a better light actually and I think she really revealed his empathetic, sweet side.

Krystalkisses said:

violetcrush said:

Oh absolutely! Prince definitely had his assistants and managers locating women for him. Devin DeVasquez has confirmed that flights were arranged for her so she could attend various PR concerts around the US while Prince was having the fling with her. She told the story of the first time she was flown to a concert and Big Chick, Prince's bodyguard, picking her up in the security van. They got into a car accident on the way back to the hotel. In Alan Light's book about the filming and tour for Purple Rain Susannah was interviewed about their relationship, and she stated, "well, we lost touch for about a year while he was busy being a rock star, petulant and needy, getting any girl that he wanted". Sounds about right

*

I was a teen in the 80's and remember it well - especially in comparison to how easy things are now with advances in technology. I mean, the "call waiting" feature was HUGE back then You no longer had to deal with a busy signal when trying to reach someone at home. Faxing papers was also a major thing - no longer had to send something through the mail.

*

Karen K, Alan Leeds, and Steve Fargnoli were very very very busy people during that time

[Edited 10/27/18 12:19pm]

Yes, omg busy would be the perfect word. Sounds like if you worked for Prince you didn't get to have a life. Prince WAS your life! Haha. But I wonder if for his 21st Centry assistants if they had the advantage of superior technology yet I wonder if that just intensified the expectations and they were expected to do even more and faster! Prince always seemed to go to extremes and push the limits so I'm sure his expectations rose along with what was now possible. Ps. I loved Devins book too btw. It actually made me see Prince in a better light actually and I think she really revealed his empathetic, sweet side.

Good point. It would make sense that for Prince, advances in technology = higher expectations. Ruth's anecdotes on the Questlove Pandora show are great too. Very funny.

*

I didn't read DD's book. I look at her as being a "fun sexual diversion" for Prince - one of many back then - a perk of his huge success. It's nice to know that he was sweet to her, but I'm guessing that is because she didn't get emotionally close enough or spend enough time with him to see the more complicated aspects of him. I think the women who played a more serious role in his life saw both the sweet and complicated sides.

violetcrush said:

violetcrush said:

Here is the path to a YT video of a 1992 interview with Ingrid. At 10:13 she is asked about the Love Sexy album, and explains how some of the songs came to be. She had also given the same host a tour of PP a few months prior to this interview. That video is on YT as well.

*

Interestingly, she speaks about the song Alphabet St and explains that the song was inspired by a silly game she and Prince were playing with the alphabet. In an online fan Q&A Prince was asked about that song, and why the letter G is missing during the reciting of the alphabet. Here's that dialog from the L4OA web site Nov 17, 1997:

*

U: On Lovesexy, on Alphabet Street, a woman’s voice can be heard in the background reciting the alphabet. But she skips the letter “G”. What’s up with that?

: She was being kissed at the time, and got flustered, EYE suppose.

Woops....here's the YT video:

*

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1bH7UkZnkPA

Interesting interview. I hadn't seen it before. Thanks!

violetcrush said:

Very true. And in the book He told her there was a side to him that she could NEVER see. And he kept telling her she was a distraction, like them hanging out would pull him away from work and he just could not have that. But I think he was actually very sweet to her and they remained friends and she met Susannah when they were engaged and said she was very nice and truly happy for them and was kinda sad when she heard they broke up. But I actually kinda respected Prince when Devin hooked up with him after Susannah called off their engagement , the next morning he was like "I'm not gonna be your boyfriend" because she was hopeful they could be together now that he was single but he just was honest...i mean he could have just stung her along and used her for sex but he was straight with her. That was kinda surprising to me and made him seem like less of a dog to me honestly.
[Edited 10/27/18 13:12pm]

Krystalkisses said:

violetcrush said:

Good point. It would make sense that for Prince, advances in technology = higher expectations. Ruth's anecdotes on the Questlove Pandora show are great too. Very funny.

*

I didn't read DD's book. I look at her as being a "fun sexual diversion" for Prince - one of many back then - a perk of his huge success. It's nice to know that he was sweet to her, but I'm guessing that is because she didn't get emotionally close enough or spend enough time with him to see the more complicated aspects of him. I think the women who played a more serious role in his life saw both the sweet and complicated sides.

Very true. And in the book He told her there was a side to him that she could NEVER see. And he kept telling her she was a distraction, like them hanging out would pull him away from work and he just could not have that. But I think he was actually very sweet to her and they remained friends and she met Susannah when they were engaged and said she was very nice and truly happy for them and was kinda sad when she heard they broke up. But I actually kinda respected Prince when Devin hooked up with him after Susannah called off their engagement , the next morning he was like "I'm not gonna be your boyfriend" because she was hopeful they could be together now that he was single but he just was honest...i mean he could have just stung her along and used her for sex but he was straight with her. That was kinda surprising to me and made him seem like less of a dog to me honestly. [Edited 10/27/18 13:12pm]

Well....yes and no with the "dog" thing. His schtick about a "side that she could never see" no doubt was his way of stringing her along. I mean, come on! I think men are pretty straightforward when it comes to being with a woman. If they want to be with you they will move mountains to make it happen. He was feeding her a line in order to keep it casual, but I do think it's nice that he at least came up with a "reason" instead of just ditching her. He really did use her for sex though.

*

I'm guessing Susannah did not know about her fling with Prince when they met - or maybe she did, because I think he was with DD during the time that he and Susannah were not together. He also would not introduce her to Wendy and Lisa during the PR tour.

pinkcashmere23 said:

violetcrush said:

Woops....here's the YT video:

*

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1bH7UkZnkPA

Interesting interview. I hadn't seen it before. Thanks!

You're welcome pink!

violetcrush said:

I like you violetcrush. You always have interesting things to say.

Krystalkisses said:

violetcrush said:

Well....yes and no with the "dog" thing. His schtick about a "side that she could never see" no doubt was his way of stringing her along. I mean, come on! I think men are pretty straightforward when it comes to being with a woman. If they want to be with you they will move mountains to make it happen. He was feeding her a line in order to keep it casual, but I do think it's nice that he at least came up with a "reason" instead of just ditching her. He really did use her for sex though.

*

I'm guessing Susannah did not know about her fling with Prince when they met - or maybe she did, because I think he was with DD during the time that he and Susannah were not together. He also would not introduce her to Wendy and Lisa during the PR tour.

I like you violetcrush. You always have interesting things to say.

Ditto Krystalkisses

violetcrush said:

[Edited 10/27/18 14:35pm]

Krystalkisses said:

violetcrush said:

Ditto Krystalkisses

[Edited 10/27/18 14:35pm]

Awwww

Also I totally agree with u btw. If a man wants a woman he will persist. Ladies don't listen to what they say, watch what they do. ( Sorry fellas 😄) .

Violet ( you mentioned moving mountains ^^)and anyone else, who do you think he did move mountains
To be with? Was there somewhere he behaved better? He seemed to treat them all pretty much the same to me, all boiled down.

purplefam99 said:

Violet ( you mentioned moving mountains ^^)and anyone else, who do you think he did move mountains To be with? Was there somewhere he behaved better? He seemed to treat them all pretty much the same to me, all boiled down.

Hard to say, really. With Prince it's more within his songs than anything else, but there is no question that he was more serious with certain women - Susan, Vanity, Susannah, Kim B, Mayte and Manuela. He was never monogamous (many men can separate love and sex and he clearly could), so if you take that piece out of the equation, then you have to look at the songs, and the time he spent with them. Yes, it seems he had a similar m/o with all of them, but no doubt there were those that, in his mind, were important or more special to him.

*

I think with Susannah, the fact that he spent over two months in LA trying to convince her to come back to MN after she left says a lot. I think the songs for her say a lot. I think he wanted her back for a long time. They planned the Galpin Rd house together, she decorated the interior, and she lived there with him for awhile after it was built. The songs speak volumes - Empty Room, Forever In My Life, NC2U, IIWYG, Adore, Crystal Ball, Wally, and more. The songs Come Home and 101 were also most likely about her based on when they were recorded.

*

**This is just my opinion so please don't slam me for it!!!

*

All that being said, the women left, because a relationship with him was not sustainable. Hard to be with someone who does not seem to understand the importance of monogamy in a relationship, wants complete control, and cannot show vulnerability in any way - other than in his songs.

violetcrush said:

purplefam99 said:

Violet ( you mentioned moving mountains ^^)and anyone else, who do you think he did move mountains To be with? Was there somewhere he behaved better? He seemed to treat them all pretty much the same to me, all boiled down.

Hard to say, really. With Prince it's more within his songs than anything else, but there is no question that he was more serious with certain women - Susan, Vanity, Susannah, Kim B, Mayte and Manuela. He was never monogamous (many men can separate love and sex and he clearly could), so if you take that piece out of the equation, then you have to look at the songs, and the time he spent with them. Yes, it seems he had a similar m/o with all of them, but no doubt there were those that, in his mind, were important or more special to him.

*

I think with Susannah, the fact that he spent over two months in LA trying to convince her to come back to MN after she left says a lot. I think the songs for her say a lot. I think he wanted her back for a long time. They planned the Galpin Rd house together, she decorated the interior, and she lived there with him for awhile after it was built. The songs speak volumes - Empty Room, Forever In My Life, NC2U, IIWYG, Adore, Crystal Ball, Wally, and more. The songs Come Home and 101 were also most likely about her based on when they were recorded.

*

**This is just my opinion so please don't slam me for it!!!

*

All that being said, the women left, because a relationship with him was not sustainable. Hard to be with someone who does not seem to understand the importance of monogamy in a relationship, wants complete control, and cannot show vulnerability in any way - other than in his songs.

I agree. I think that he did sincerely try from time to time,entering into a relationship with the intention of being monogamous but was unable to sustain it. That was a side of his personality that I found very perplexing because at some point,most guys grow out of the desire to jump from one woman to the next but it seems he never really did. Afer he married Manuela, he settled down for a while and he looked like a happily married man but after the divorce, he went back to his old ways of dating very young women. I guess it's different with rock stars and he never did seem to run out of options. He did write in "Cause & Effect "You can either be a superstar or grow up but not both." and in "Way Back Home" he said he never wanted a typical life so it seems marriage or even monogamy wasn't for him though at times he seemed to miss the connection and intimacy.

pinkcashmere23 said:

violetcrush said:

Hard to say, really. With Prince it's more within his songs than anything else, but there is no question that he was more serious with certain women - Susan, Vanity, Susannah, Kim B, Mayte and Manuela. He was never monogamous (many men can separate love and sex and he clearly could), so if you take that piece out of the equation, then you have to look at the songs, and the time he spent with them. Yes, it seems he had a similar m/o with all of them, but no doubt there were those that, in his mind, were important or more special to him.

*

I think with Susannah, the fact that he spent over two months in LA trying to convince her to come back to MN after she left says a lot. I think the songs for her say a lot. I think he wanted her back for a long time. They planned the Galpin Rd house together, she decorated the interior, and she lived there with him for awhile after it was built. The songs speak volumes - Empty Room, Forever In My Life, NC2U, IIWYG, Adore, Crystal Ball, Wally, and more. The songs Come Home and 101 were also most likely about her based on when they were recorded.

*

**This is just my opinion so please don't slam me for it!!!

*

All that being said, the women left, because a relationship with him was not sustainable. Hard to be with someone who does not seem to understand the importance of monogamy in a relationship, wants complete control, and cannot show vulnerability in any way - other than in his songs.

I agree. I think that he did sincerely try from time to time,entering into a relationship with the intention of being monogamous but was unable to sustain it. That was a side of his personality that I found very perplexing because at some point,most guys grow out of the desire to jump from one woman to the next but it seems he never really did. Afer he married Manuela, he settled down for a while and he looked like a happily married man but after the divorce, he went back to his old ways of dating very young women. I guess it's different with rock stars and he never did seem to run out of options. He did write in "Cause & Effect "You can either be a superstar or grow up but not both." and in "Way Back Home" he said he never wanted a typical life so it seems marriage or even monogamy wasn't for him though at times he seemed to miss the connection and intimacy.

Right, Pink. Seems he never got a handle on resisting the pretty girls who greenlighted sex. He sings about it in "What Do U Want Me To Do", which he wrote while married to Manuela:

*

*

So he was still struggling with it even while married to Manuela. I believe there were rumors of him cheating with her too. In his defense, it had to be pretty tough to avoid it when there were so many women trying to get at him. I think he needed new experiences too - just like he needed new music and styles/looks. Interestingly, his more serious relationships lasted about as long as his styles did - or about two albums. Oh wow, I might be on to something here! Let's see:

*

For You, Prince - Kim Upsher?

Dirty Mind, Controversy - Susan Moonsie

1999, Purple Rain - Vanity

ATWIAD, Parade, SOTT (because of the recording of the songs) - Susannah

LoveSexy, Batman - Anna Garcia & Kim Basinger

*

Multiple women for the next 4 - Carmen, Nona, Mayte and more...

Graffiti Bridge

Love Symbol

Come

Gold

*

Emancipation - Mayte - pregnancy/marriage

*

Rave Un 2 The Joy Fantastic - Divorce

*

The Rainbow Children - Manuela

Musicology - Manuela

*

Well, it's a bit of a pattern, but varies a bit, and includes about 5 years of him with various women.

Truth is none of us really know him or what thoughts were in his head. Let alone what song was for a specific person or not. Unless we really, really knew him personally none of us really know.

violetcrush said:

pinkcashmere23 said:

I agree. I think that he did sincerely try from time to time,entering into a relationship with the intention of being monogamous but was unable to sustain it. That was a side of his personality that I found very perplexing because at some point,most guys grow out of the desire to jump from one woman to the next but it seems he never really did. Afer he married Manuela, he settled down for a while and he looked like a happily married man but after the divorce, he went back to his old ways of dating very young women. I guess it's different with rock stars and he never did seem to run out of options. He did write in "Cause & Effect "You can either be a superstar or grow up but not both." and in "Way Back Home" he said he never wanted a typical life so it seems marriage or even monogamy wasn't for him though at times he seemed to miss the connection and intimacy.

Right, Pink. Seems he never got a handle on resisting the pretty girls who greenlighted sex. He sings about it in "What Do U Want Me To Do", which he wrote while married to Manuela:

*

I see you picked me out from the crowd
Could it be the way I play guitar?
Master of the soft, not to loud
One day, maybe I will be a star
I see you picked me out like you want something
But shame on you, baby, can't you see this ring?

What do you want me to do, girl?
What do you want me to do, babe?
What do you want me to do, girl?
What do you want me to do, babe?

I got a woman, you got a man
So we got to do what's right
I said you'd get beheaded in other lands
If I were in your arms tonight
Quit tryin' to get me under that icy plunder
Boy, oh boy, what a scare, oh

*

So he was still struggling with it even while married to Manuela. I believe there were rumors of him cheating with her too. In his defense, it had to be pretty tough to avoid it when there were so many women trying to get at him. I think he needed new experiences too - just like he needed new music and styles/looks. Interestingly, his more serious relationships lasted about as long as his styles did - or about two albums. Oh wow, I might be on to something here! Let's see:

*

For You, Prince - Kim Upsher?

Dirty Mind, Controversy - Susan Moonsie

1999, Purple Rain - Vanity

ATWIAD, Parade, SOTT (because of the recording of the songs) - Susannah

LoveSexy, Batman - Anna Garcia & Kim Basinger

*

Multiple women for the next 4 - Carmen, Nona, Mayte and more...

Graffiti Bridge

Love Symbol

Come

Gold

*

Emancipation - Mayte - pregnancy/marriage

*

Rave Un 2 The Joy Fantastic - Divorce

*

The Rainbow Children - Manuela

Musicology - Manuela

*

Well, it's a bit of a pattern, but varies a bit, and includes about 5 years of him with various women.

PennyPurple said:

Truth is none of us really know him or what thoughts were in his head. Let alone what song was for a specific person or not. Unless we really, really knew him personally none of us really know.

violetcrush said:

Right, Pink. Seems he never got a handle on resisting the pretty girls who greenlighted sex. He sings about it in "What Do U Want Me To Do", which he wrote while married to Manuela:

*

I see you picked me out from the crowd
Could it be the way I play guitar?
Master of the soft, not to loud
One day, maybe I will be a star
I see you picked me out like you want something
But shame on you, baby, can't you see this ring?

What do you want me to do, girl?
What do you want me to do, babe?
What do you want me to do, girl?
What do you want me to do, babe?

I got a woman, you got a man
So we got to do what's right
I said you'd get beheaded in other lands
If I were in your arms tonight
Quit tryin' to get me under that icy plunder
Boy, oh boy, what a scare, oh

*

So he was still struggling with it even while married to Manuela. I believe there were rumors of him cheating with her too. In his defense, it had to be pretty tough to avoid it when there were so many women trying to get at him. I think he needed new experiences too - just like he needed new music and styles/looks. Interestingly, his more serious relationships lasted about as long as his styles did - or about two albums. Oh wow, I might be on to something here! Let's s. ee:

*

For You, Prince - Kim Upsher?

Dirty Mind, Controversy - Susan Moonsie

1999, Purple Rain - Vanity

ATWIAD, Parade, SOTT (because of the recording of the songs) - Susannah

LoveSexy, Batman - Anna Garcia & Kim Basinger

*

Multiple women for the next 4 - Carmen, Nona, Mayte and more...

Graffiti Bridge

Love Symbol

Come

Gold

*

Emancipation - Mayte - pregnancy/marriage

*

Rave Un 2 The Joy Fantastic - Divorce

*

The Rainbow Children - Manuela

Musicology - Manuela

*

Well, it's a bit of a pattern, but varies a bit, and includes about 5 years of him with various women.

We do know for some though. When he was asked who Forever In My Life was written for in 1997 on the AOL fan Q&A his answer was, "Susannah. She knows" Another member of the Org posted on an older thread that in 2002 during the NPGMC soundcheck fan Q&A, when asked who he wrote Adore for he responded, "Susannah" - this was stated in Matt Thorne's Biography as well. We know Wonderful Ass was written for Vanity. Empty Room has been confirmed by everyone in the band/camp, including Susannah, for whom the song was written.

*

Prince, other than on a few occasions, did not and would not specifically state the subject of his love songs, however, in many instances it was obvious. Let's Have A Baby was obviously written for Mayte. She Loves Me 4 Me, Wedding Feast, and other songs on The Rainbow Children were obviously written for Manuela. Prince's songs were inspired by relationships and events happening in his life. It's the "I miss you, I want you back" songs that are more questionable, and everyone has their own opinions on those.

violetcrush said:

Thx for your reply violet. I guess I think except for the 2 he married I think
The rest were pretty strung along. Pretty much like Devin but for perhaps
Longer. The way he treated Susannah is the worst string along.
The way she describes it on the Toure podcast is sad to me and his treatment of her second
Rate. “ I don’t want you to be in the movie I want you to be my wife”
And then left her sequestered alone for so long ( as she describes it)
That must have felt the opposite of love. I hear you on the songs, but actions
Speak louder and to me no matter what he wrote in a song his actions
Negated the words. So for me I don’t look to the songs to verify
His his true intent. His songs to me seem to be a wish, a dream or a fantasy.
Like his songs were daydreams not reality necessarily.
[Edited 10/28/18 19:35pm]

purplefam99 said:

violetcrush said:

Hard to say, really. With Prince it's more within his songs than anything else, but there is no question that he was more serious with certain women - Susan, Vanity, Susannah, Kim B, Mayte and Manuela. He was never monogamous (many men can separate love and sex and he clearly could), so if you take that piece out of the equation, then you have to look at the songs, and the time he spent with them. Yes, it seems he had a similar m/o with all of them, but no doubt there were those that, in his mind, were important or more special to him.

*

I think with Susannah, the fact that he spent over two months in LA trying to convince her to come back to MN after she left says a lot. I think the songs for her say a lot. I think he wanted her back for a long time. They planned the Galpin Rd house together, she decorated the interior, and she lived there with him for awhile after it was built. The songs speak volumes - Empty Room, Forever In My Life, NC2U, IIWYG, Adore, Crystal Ball, Wally, and more. The songs Come Home and 101 were also most likely about her based on when they were recorded.

*

**This is just my opinion so please don't slam me for it!!!

*

All that being said, the women left, because a relationship with him was not sustainable. Hard to be with someone who does not seem to understand the importance of monogamy in a relationship, wants complete control, and cannot show vulnerability in any way - other than in his songs.

Thx for your reply violet. I guess I think except for the 2 he married I think The rest were pretty strung along. Pretty much like Devin but for perhaps Longer. The way he treated Susannah is the worst string along. The way she describes it on the Toure podcast is sad to me and his treatment of her second Rate. “ I don’t want you to be in the movie I want you to be my wife” And then left her sequestered alone for so long ( as she describes it) That must have felt the opposite of love. I hear you on the songs, but actions Speak louder and to me no matter what he wrote in a song his actions Negated the words. So for me I don’t look to the songs to verify His his true intent. His songs to me seem to be a wish, a dream or a fantasy. Like his songs were daydreams not reality necessarily. [Edited 10/28/18 19:35pm]

I hear what you're saying, but really he treated all of the women the same. I actually think Mayte got the worst of it. She was very young and he took advantage of that. He was with many women from '90-'95, and the marriage came suddenly in early '96. He did an interview with a London journalist in '95 and stated he had no plans to marry anyone. I think the marriage happened because of the pregnancy - again, just my opinion. Mayte has stated that during their relationship, including during their marriage, she could not contact him. She had to wait for him to call her. So really, his behavior never changed - married or not. When he married Manuela he was deep into the JW faith, and clearly trying to live by those beliiefs and principles. However, that didn't last long either.

*

I agree with the fact that he also tried to control Susannah, and no doubt thought she would continue to accept it, and would not leave him. However, when she did leave I think it affected him deeply and he wanted her back for a long time.

*

I also agree that actions speak louder than words, but Prince communicated his thoughts and feelings through his music more than anything else, regardless of how he acted, so we can't take that with a grain of salt. I really think he was the most honest in his songs. Being alone with his thoughts and recording those vocals, and most of the muisic by himself, allowed him to be open with his feelings - something he would not do in public.

*

If you read the lyrics to Forever In My Life, he's admitting to being a womanizer ("juggling hearts in a three ring circus, someday drive a body down to the ground") and he's saying he never expected to fall in love ("I never imagined that love would rain on me, and make me want to settle down. Baby it's true, I think I do, and I just want to tell you that I want it with you"). He's telling her how much he cares about her ("You are my future, you are my hero, when I am with you I got no past, no"). So, if you really listen to the song and the lyrics they are quite deep. Now, does that mean he would have changed his behavior in the relationship if she had moved back to MN? Probably not - at least not permanently. But I think his thoughts and words were geniune. He never wrote the more serious songs just for the heck of it. There was meaning in them for him.

violetcrush said:

I hear what you're saying, but really he treated all of the women the same. I actually think Mayte got the worst of it. She was very young and he took advantage of that. He was with many women from '90-'95, and the marriage came suddenly in early '96. He did an interview with a London journalist in '95 and stated he had no plans to marry anyone. I think the marriage happened because of the pregnancy - again, just my opinion. Mayte has stated that during their relationship, including during their marriage, she could not contact him. She had to wait for him to call her. So really, his behavior never changed - married or not. When he married Manuela he was deep into the JW faith, and clearly trying to live by those beliiefs and principles. However, that didn't last long either.

*

I agree with the fact that he also tried to control Susannah, and no doubt thought she would continue to accept it, and would not leave him. However, when she did leave I think it affected him deeply and he wanted her back for a long time.

*

I also agree that actions speak louder than words, but Prince communicated his thoughts and feelings through his music more than anything else, regardless of how he acted, so we can't take that with a grain of salt. I really think he was the most honest in his songs. Being alone with his thoughts and recording those vocals, and most of the muisic by himself, allowed him to be open with his feelings - something he would not do in public.

*

If you read the lyrics to Forever In My Life, he's admitting to being a womanizer ("juggling hearts in a three ring circus, someday drive a body down to the ground") and he's saying he never expected to fall in love ("I never imagined that love would rain on me, and make me want to settle down. Baby it's true, I think I do, and I just want to tell you that I want it with you"). He's telling her how much he cares about her ("You are my future, you are my hero, when I am with you I got no past, no"). So, if you really listen to the song and the lyrics they are quite deep. Now, does that mean he would have changed his behavior in the relationship if she had moved back to MN? Probably not - at least not permanently. But I think his thoughts and words were geniune. He never wrote the more serious songs just for the heck of it. There was meaning in them for him.

No Mayte and him did not get married because she was pregnant. She wasn't pregnant when they got married. I forgot the date he asked her to marry but I think it was Oct or Nov which was 4 months before they married. That would be a very long pregnancy. LOL So to say that was why he got married, is wrong.

Lot's of people say they will never get married, just like Prince said, and he was married twice.

He controlled ALL of them, and he liked them young.

violetcrush said:

pinkcashmere23 said:

I agree. I think that he did sincerely try from time to time,entering into a relationship with the intention of being monogamous but was unable to sustain it. That was a side of his personality that I found very perplexing because at some point,most guys grow out of the desire to jump from one woman to the next but it seems he never really did. Afer he married Manuela, he settled down for a while and he looked like a happily married man but after the divorce, he went back to his old ways of dating very young women. I guess it's different with rock stars and he never did seem to run out of options. He did write in "Cause & Effect "You can either be a superstar or grow up but not both." and in "Way Back Home" he said he never wanted a typical life so it seems marriage or even monogamy wasn't for him though at times he seemed to miss the connection and intimacy.

Right, Pink. Seems he never got a handle on resisting the pretty girls who greenlighted sex. He sings about it in "What Do U Want Me To Do", which he wrote while married to Manuela:

*

I see you picked me out from the crowd
Could it be the way I play guitar?
Master of the soft, not to loud
One day, maybe I will be a star
I see you picked me out like you want something
But shame on you, baby, can't you see this ring?

What do you want me to do, girl?
What do you want me to do, babe?
What do you want me to do, girl?
What do you want me to do, babe?

I got a woman, you got a man
So we got to do what's right
I said you'd get beheaded in other lands
If I were in your arms tonight
Quit tryin' to get me under that icy plunder
Boy, oh boy, what a scare, oh

*

So he was still struggling with it even while married to Manuela. I believe there were rumors of him cheating with her too. In his defense, it had to be pretty tough to avoid it when there were so many women trying to get at him. I think he needed new experiences too - just like he needed new music and styles/looks. Interestingly, his more serious relationships lasted about as long as his styles did - or about two albums. Oh wow, I might be on to something here! Let's see:

*

For You, Prince - Kim Upsher?

Dirty Mind, Controversy - Susan Moonsie

1999, Purple Rain - Vanity

ATWIAD, Parade, SOTT (because of the recording of the songs) - Susannah

LoveSexy, Batman - Anna Garcia & Kim Basinger

*

Multiple women for the next 4 - Carmen, Nona, Mayte and more...

Graffiti Bridge

Love Symbol

Come

Gold

*

Emancipation - Mayte - pregnancy/marriage

*

Rave Un 2 The Joy Fantastic - Divorce

*

The Rainbow Children - Manuela

Musicology - Manuela

*

Well, it's a bit of a pattern, but varies a bit, and includes about 5 years of him with various women.

Yes,I found the lyrics to "What Do U Want Me To Do" interesting since he was married to Manuela at the time. There were rumors that he was hanging out with the girls in the "Million Days" video,Liza Hernandez and Jennifer Gordon. He seemed to be in a relationship with Liza for a while and Kim Berry said that he spent six months in Panama where Liza is from. He definitely had a pattern and to me,it seemed he would usually lose interest in a relationship after about two years. It probably was very difficult to maintain one while being confronted with so many young women all of the time. He commented in an interview with Giant magazine that the Bible was meant to help men and women with their sins but in the same article he said that he admired Solomon because he had thousands of women so it seems he was struggling.

violetcrush said:

purplefam99 said:

violetcrush said: Thx for your reply violet. I guess I think except for the 2 he married I think The rest were pretty strung along. Pretty much like Devin but for perhaps Longer. The way he treated Susannah is the worst string along. The way she describes it on the Toure podcast is sad to me and his treatment of her second Rate. “ I don’t want you to be in the movie I want you to be my wife” And then left her sequestered alone for so long ( as she describes it) That must have felt the opposite of love. I hear you on the songs, but actions Speak louder and to me no matter what he wrote in a song his actions Negated the words. So for me I don’t look to the songs to verify His his true intent. His songs to me seem to be a wish, a dream or a fantasy. Like his songs were daydreams not reality necessarily. [Edited 10/28/18 19:35pm]

I hear what you're saying, but really he treated all of the women the same. I actually think Mayte got the worst of it. She was very young and he took advantage of that. He was with many women from '90-'95, and the marriage came suddenly in early '96. He did an interview with a London journalist in '95 and stated he had no plans to marry anyone. I think the marriage happened because of the pregnancy - again, just my opinion. Mayte has stated that during their relationship, including during their marriage, she could not contact him. She had to wait for him to call her. So really, his behavior never changed - married or not. When he married Manuela he was deep into the JW faith, and clearly trying to live by those beliiefs and principles. However, that didn't last long either.

*

I agree with the fact that he also tried to control Susannah, and no doubt thought she would continue to accept it, and would not leave him. However, when she did leave I think it affected him deeply and he wanted her back for a long time.

*

I also agree that actions speak louder than words, but Prince communicated his thoughts and feelings through his music more than anything else, regardless of how he acted, so we can't take that with a grain of salt. I really think he was the most honest in his songs. Being alone with his thoughts and recording those vocals, and most of the muisic by himself, allowed him to be open with his feelings - something he would not do in public.

*

If you read the lyrics to Forever In My Life, he's admitting to being a womanizer ("juggling hearts in a three ring circus, someday drive a body down to the ground") and he's saying he never expected to fall in love ("I never imagined that love would rain on me, and make me want to settle down. Baby it's true, I think I do, and I just want to tell you that I want it with you"). He's telling her how much he cares about her ("You are my future, you are my hero, when I am with you I got no past, no"). So, if you really listen to the song and the lyrics they are quite deep. Now, does that mean he would have changed his behavior in the relationship if she had moved back to MN? Probably not - at least not permanently. But I think his thoughts and words were geniune. He never wrote the more serious songs just for the heck of it. There was meaning in them for him.

yes in my reply #84 i said that i thought he treated/loved them all the same "all boiled down"

and Susannah was not an exception. i just feel like the 2 he married actually got the carrot of marriage if that is the goal for someone willing to be strung along. i feel like he treated and she (susannah) took awful treatment for him. loving and losing and writting about it was his formula

it was his magic soup pot. That was a basket of fish that kept on giving. that was too easy and

formulaic for it to be deep each and eveytime (imo) he was using the formula for all it was worth. sure he got caught up in at times i am sure falling in love with the co Star. to me kinda like

boy bands are a formula, pop music is devised by formula. he was a master at it, a genuis, a true

puppeteer. (his love of puppets). Disney had a formula, so did Prince and both were masterful at it. storytelling in a magic potion if done right. he aced marketing 101 with his concoction. he is awesome in

that regard a true business man. it was just about the music, and it was/is great music.

Curious how many times was JOhn L married, twice?? i think Prince was his father's son.

PennyPurple said:

violetcrush said:

I hear what you're saying, but really he treated all of the women the same. I actually think Mayte got the worst of it. She was very young and he took advantage of that. He was with many women from '90-'95, and the marriage came suddenly in early '96. He did an interview with a London journalist in '95 and stated he had no plans to marry anyone. I think the marriage happened because of the pregnancy - again, just my opinion. Mayte has stated that during their relationship, including during their marriage, she could not contact him. She had to wait for him to call her. So really, his behavior never changed - married or not. When he married Manuela he was deep into the JW faith, and clearly trying to live by those beliiefs and principles. However, that didn't last long either.

*

I agree with the fact that he also tried to control Susannah, and no doubt thought she would continue to accept it, and would not leave him. However, when she did leave I think it affected him deeply and he wanted her back for a long time.

*

I also agree that actions speak louder than words, but Prince communicated his thoughts and feelings through his music more than anything else, regardless of how he acted, so we can't take that with a grain of salt. I really think he was the most honest in his songs. Being alone with his thoughts and recording those vocals, and most of the muisic by himself, allowed him to be open with his feelings - something he would not do in public.

*

If you read the lyrics to Forever In My Life, he's admitting to being a womanizer ("juggling hearts in a three ring circus, someday drive a body down to the ground") and he's saying he never expected to fall in love ("I never imagined that love would rain on me, and make me want to settle down. Baby it's true, I think I do, and I just want to tell you that I want it with you"). He's telling her how much he cares about her ("You are my future, you are my hero, when I am with you I got no past, no"). So, if you really listen to the song and the lyrics they are quite deep. Now, does that mean he would have changed his behavior in the relationship if she had moved back to MN? Probably not - at least not permanently. But I think his thoughts and words were geniune. He never wrote the more serious songs just for the heck of it. There was meaning in them for him.

No Mayte and him did not get married because she was pregnant. She wasn't pregnant when they got married. I forgot the date he asked her to marry but I think it was Oct or Nov which was 4 months before they married. That would be a very long pregnancy. LOL So to say that was why he got married, is wrong.

Lot's of people say they will never get married, just like Prince said, and he was married twice.

He controlled ALL of them, and he liked them young.

penny that is also how i understand the timeline of events.^^^

violet if you have other timeline info that shows otherwise please share, thx.