CatB said:

Genesia said:

When you have an album coming out (which he did - Emancipation was released in November of 1996), you sure as hell do.

Going on Oprah is not burying yourself in work, it's putting yourself out there. He could have done it, withdrawing again and only trust the music. He could have called it off. Everyone would have understood. To sit on a show (and not even having told his wife in advance) that sells by playing on people's emotions, with eyes that tell the whole story, that's not Prince being strong. It was Prince again who had so many feelings and words inside but couldn't articulate them. The child that hopes the older ones will just see and understand and tell him it's not his fault and everything's gonna be alright.

You have no idea how show business works. He had pissed of WB and was lucking to get that deal with EMI. He needed to promote that record. I think he could have just left Mayte out of but maybe he thought it would help her to move on if she just worked with him.

laurarichardson said:

rednblue said:

I really appreciate this post. There is no lack of respect for work ethic, or lack of understanding what staying afloat can require, in your statement. I think it's kind and wise to care about harm from denial. It can ravage a person.

But we do not know he was in a state of denial because he did not make a public statement. I do not think when you prepare your child's funeral you are in a state of denial.

At the end of the day it was just not the public's business.

I agree with you on all points. Maybe it's just me, but I didn't feel like he strongly indicated whether or not his son was here on earth in the sense that he himself was.

On the other hand, I think much points to a lot of denial in Prince. I don't want to judge. I have plenty of denial and rationalizations of my own.

laurarichardson said:

CatB said:

Going on Oprah is not burying yourself in work, it's putting yourself out there. He could have done it, withdrawing again and only trust the music. He could have called it off. Everyone would have understood. To sit on a show (and not even having told his wife in advance) that sells by playing on people's emotions, with eyes that tell the whole story, that's not Prince being strong. It was Prince again who had so many feelings and words inside but couldn't articulate them. The child that hopes the older ones will just see and understand and tell him it's not his fault and everything's gonna be alright.

You have no idea how show business works. He had pissed of WB and was lucking to get that deal with EMI. He needed to promote that record. I think he could have just left Mayte out of but maybe he thought it would help her to move on if she just worked with him.

But didn't he shock people on multiple multiple occasions with cancellations or changes of mind?

rednblue said:

I can't thank you enough for your insights and your beautiful words, and I have enjoyed hearing you other threads. Thank you for the note about "bury," and I also noticed the word sweet in one of your earlier posts. If you don't know someone, and only see them on camera, it's near impossible to get a real sense and also not be fooled. Therefore, I've been hesitant to make much of it, but he sometimes projects something much like a sweetness--very subtle, but very striking at the same time (if that makes any sense). Yet it seems that he, like a lot of people, could be sweet and could also be cruel.

Do you think some of the anguish, on this and some other threads, might partly come from people (including me) having difficulty wrapping their minds around the idea of genuine sweetness and cruelty existing in the same person? When we step back, we see it's a part of human nature, perhaps some even recognize the capacity in themselves at times. But for me, at least, it's so hard to reconcile.

Anyway, having borrowed your words, I don't want to make assumptions. Just thought I'd ask if you thought this stuff might be in the mix at all when it comes to some of the difficulties on threads like this.

Thanks for your kind words. I'm often hesitant to post here, I just read most of the time as I don't know what I can or cannot say and how to find the right words. I know it's hard for many, we all still feel for Prince and April's just around the corner...

I cannot say and I would never want to make assumptions as to where some people's difficulties may come from. Heck, I'm still learning too. Also through Mayte's eyes.

It's true, sweet is a word I use a lot when I remember Prince and it's really how I perceived him. Even when he was being not his best or being defensive or whatever, there was always this sweetness about him. Yes, sweet and cruel can exist in one and the same person. Life is not only black or white, and neither are we. However, I believe that cruelty often comes from helplessness.

As for this thread, I don't know, I wish we could all come together and just celebrate life, celebrate him and be tolerant towards everyone in his life. Why judge, it's so unproductive. It never leads anywhere. But I guess it's human nature and people will be of different opinions and views. That's okay. I can just speak from my experience and I love him and wish Mayte well.

[Edited 3/16/17 10:45am]

rednblue said:

laurarichardson said:

You have no idea how show business works.

I do, and I left it for those reasons.

rednblue said:

But didn't he shock people on multiple multiple occasions with cancellations or changes of mind?

Yes. And he cancelled things for far more "unreasonable" reasons, sometimes just out of moods, than losing a baby and the personal tragedy that everyone would have understood.

I don't believe that story about the baby belonged in the public eye. I'm sorry. It's utterly tragic and heartbreaking. We all have tragic, heartbreaking things in our lives. We don't have to publicly spill them to recover from them. And not only does she seem to be playing on his horror for the baby to born sick like that, she's playing on that poor child. If she even went on an interview to discuss it, but to SELL it is what's really galling to me. Sad story, and sad way to share it. She's also implying that the gene came from HIM, and it probably did. Do you think he EVER recovered from that...being a musician and all...come on, I think the answer is obvious. No. to this.

laurarichardson said:

CatB said:

rednblue said:

Thanks for your kind words. I'm often hesitant to post here, I just read most of the time as I don't know what I can or cannot say and how to find the right words. I know it's hard for many, we all still feel for Prince and April's just around the corner...

I cannot say and I would never want to make assumptions as to where some people's difficulties may come from. Heck, I'm still learning too. Also through Mayte's eyes.

It's true, sweet is a word I use a lot when I remember Prince and it's really how I perceived him. Even when he was being not his best or being defensive or whatever, there was always this sweetness about him. Yes, sweet and cruel can exist in one and them same person. Life is not only black or white, and neither are we. However, I believe that cruelty often comes from helplessness.

As for this thread, I don't know, I wish we could all come together and just celebrate life, celebrate him and be tolerant towards everyone in his life. Why judge, it's so unproductive. It never leads anywhere. But I guess it's human nature and people will be of different opinions and views. That's okay. I can just speak from my experience and I love him and wish Mayte well.

Yes!

Not having known him, I don't want to make assumptions about Prince. But thank you for your general observation about helplessness! Only speaking of human nature in general (and sometimes even my own nature : ) ), it strikes me that humans can get in a sort of "survivalist" mode. Also, going back to my school days many years ago, "learned helplessness" was one of the descriptions that really stayed with me. It was one of the models presented for another human condition: depression. It was a description that really rang true. Depression is also often accompanied by anxiety and/or anger.

Anger and fear can make it more difficult to treat people reasonably. These things are never a simple excuse for cruelty. They are just some of the things that, along with life events, make up the full stories of people.

Back to Prince, I love your closing paragraph. I think Prince would also wish us heaven and happiness. Hopefully, that's one assumption that's OK.

I want to know ANY and ALL the info about Prince that i can get my hands on!!!

if it's coming from a source that had well documented close ties to the Private Prince..

Hell Yeah!

Bring It On!!!!

[Edited 3/16/17 10:47am]

laurarichardson said:

rednblue said:

But didn't he shock people on multiple multiple occasions with cancellations or changes of mind?

What are you talking about he had a steady stream of albums and tours up until 2010. Remarkable when you have artist taking 20 years to put out albums.

Great point! I don't mean to diminish in any way. Maybe changes of mind is better. One example would be his changing feelings on the Black Album. He could also get bored (probably being a genius made it really hard not to get bored : ) ) and sometimes ended tours early, or pulled the plug on other things.

The bottom line is that Mayte has a right to write about her own experiences just as we, the public, have a right not to read it. And that's it. No need to drag her through the dust...whether we like what she has to say or not. It's a matter of choice.

youneveransweryourphone said:

rednblue said:

MD431Madcat said:

youneveransweryourphone said:

cindyt said:

sonshine said:

laurarichardson said:

rednblue said:

Great point! I don't mean to diminish in any way. Maybe changes of mind is better. One example would be his changing feelings on the Black Album. He could also get bored (probably being a genius made it really hard not to get bored : ) ) and sometimes ended tours early, or pulled the plug on other things.

Pulling the plug or cutting a project is not the same as not getting started. I hate to say this but he was obvisously I'll when he went to Atlanta but he went and did that show he was working to the end.

Oh, man! I'm glad you mentioned Atlanta. I should have realized to make it clear I wasn't referencing Atlanta. That was the farthest thing from my mind when thinking of getting bored, etc. For what it's worth, I was thinking, in part, of the late 1980's. Atlanta was heartbreaking. It was also a stunningly beautiful gift to fans.

I wouldn't really classify the "speculation" of his wife who had a 10-year, live-in personal relationship in the same category as the speculation of a bunch of people sitting behind computer keyboards who Prince wouldn't have known from a hole in the ground. Not saying whether everything she says is true (though my feeling is, it's unlikely she wholesale invented stories, through of course she presents them through her own perspective), but I give a bit more weight to her and others similar to her than to posters on this board.

BillieBalloon said:

youneveransweryourphone said:

To me this is simple, maybe because I can relate. Mayte has held herself accountable to Prince. I think she never spoke out about him or much of this because she didn't want to disappoint him. He was clearly a "father figure" as well as her true love. Happens to women all the time. She hardly even spoke about him or the baby on the VH1 show. I thought she always remained pretty low key. Now that he's gone, I think she feels some freedom to be honest, EVEN if it paints Prince in a negative light. I personally think she needed this and she needed a large audience to feel heard. Ages 16-24 are so defining for a woman and she has clearly been affected for life. She's never had another marriage which tells me she just got screwed up through all of this. Trust me, if people cared, she'd write a book about her fame hungry, money grubbing mother after she passed too. She's undoing the hurt and I really don't think money has anything to do with it.

Now hes gone she can vent. She can speculate about the drugs she never saw him take and we can speculate on her speculation. Even if it paints him in a negative light? What happened to the love story of the century she was peddling months ago? How do you measure truth when the other person is dead?

purplethunder3121 said:

The bottom line is that Mayte has a right to write about her own experiences just as we, the public, have a right not to read it. And that's it. No need to drag her through the dust...whether we like what she has to say or not. It's a matter of choice.

That's easy for you to say because you are not Prince. Just think if your partner wrote a book about you sharing things you wish the public did not know. It also makes me wonder as I posted above, is anything sacred or can anything be talked about. Sigh. Idk

wonder505 said:

purplethunder3121 said:

The bottom line is that Mayte has a right to write about her own experiences just as we, the public, have a right not to read it. And that's it. No need to drag her through the dust...whether we like what she has to say or not. It's a matter of choice.

That's easy for you to say because you are not Prince. Just think if your partner wrote a book about you sharing things you wish the public did not know. It also makes me wonder as I posted above, is anything sacred or can anything be talked about. Sigh. Idk

I would prefer, like Prince, if she didn't write it. I was merely pointing out that she can put it out there and we can choose not to read it. And, yes, it sucks that Prince is not here to respond.

laurarichardson said:

I think he did not want to be around her because he did not want to be married in the first place. You cannot make a man settle down if they do not want to be. He was not ready for marriage when he got with her. I do not buy that he was so controlling that she could not leave as in the bootleg copy excerpts that are floating around she is saying he hynoptized her ( do you have any idea how that makes her look !) I am sorry she married a man who was dating her Nona Gaye and Carmen at the same time. If she could not see what was coming with him from that experience that is on her. I am interested in how some of the people she is dragging in the book are going to feel about her putting their personal business out in the street. Is that so she can heal? Because these people are alive and well and it will be interesting to hear what they have to say. [Edited 3/16/17 6:25am]

How would you know if he wanted to be married or not? How do you know if he was ready or not for marriage? You don't.

To have been able to hear Prince's music and appreciate his talents is absolutely amazing. He was a supremely talented human being, pure poetical genius, with lyrics and songwriting ability truly unique. Those are memories that cannot be refuted. Prince said things like 'stay with your truth', and such. We all have our paths to discover and own truths and journeys to embrace. Prince's music and the way he sought to bring the world his meesage to us changed (most) of us for the better. Books can come and go. The music lives on.

said:

BillieBalloon said:

PRINCE DID SPEAK ABOUT HIS SON ONCE, February, 1997. AND THEN HE LEFT IT OUT OF THE PUBLIC EYE.

https://www.theguardian.com/music/2016/apr/24/prince-people-hear-sex-in-my-songs-interview-1997-top-of-the-pops-magazine

His good humour is as intoxicating as it is surprising. In the past two years, he’s faced record company wrangles, falling sales, waning interest and, in October 1996, the loss of his child. Known only as Boy Gregory, the son of Prince and his wife, Mayte Garcia, lived for just a few days after being born with a skull deformity known as Pfeiffer syndrome.

“That time has been the most traumatic of my life,” Prince acknowledges, “but contrary to what has been said about me, I feel very positive. I believe God has a plan. Everything that happens, there’s a reason for it.”

But surely, what plan, what reason can there be behind the death of a few-days-old child? “There are so many ways to look at things,” he replies softly. “And I would never use the words, ‘they’re gone’. They will always come back you see,” he adds, never once dropping his gaze.

I'D PREFER BEING GIVEN THE OPPOURTUNITY TO WEED THROUGH THE FACTS VS FICTION MYSELF.

SORRY 4 THE CAPS

laurarichardson said:

MD431Madcat said:

I want to know ANY and ALL the info about Prince that i can get my hands on!!!

if it's coming from a source that had well documented close ties to the Private Prince..

Hell Yeah!

Bring It On!!!!

[Edited 3/16/17 10:47am]

--Even if some of it is bullshit.