KingSausage said:

What do you think? Are they lazy?

Absolutely not, I think it's a truly sign of love for all fans: when sampler is on, 3eyegirl is off and that's, my friend, is a gift, from a pure genious, to all of us.

terrig said:

terrig said:

THIS NEEDS ITS OWN THREAD. This is a jewel!

@ Militant can you relate?

.

whoaaaaa, that's crazy! I thought for sure people were exaggerating Prince's influence on house, but there it is, plain as day...

GetOfFunk said:

fusk said:

terrig said:

@ Militant can you relate?

.

whoaaaaa, that's crazy! I thought for sure people were exaggerating Prince's influence on house, but there it is, plain as day...

this track kills to to this day. classic. rip frankie knuckles.

TrevorAyer said:

prince needs to play 'whole' songs by 'whole' songwriters .. the sampler just shows how bad the rest of the set is cuz the sampler has all the good songs .. the medleys and shortened songs have the been the bane of prince live set since before PR .. which is sad that he is so clueless he still has not figured out that people want to hear a full song .. actually many full songs .. thats what musicians are supposed to do live ..

Hear! Hear!

That's what D'Angelo does. I listened to D play 'Untitled' from his current tour on Youtube and he was doing damn near every little bit of the song's studio version voicings throughout the whole song!

That's what I'd like to hear from P in concert.

Peace

williamb610 said:

That's what I'd like to hear from P in concert.

.

So we're here for the music.

Not for the samples.

Ive never seen a sampler set but I have heard quite a few on boots. I cant say they bring anything to the party when listened to. But I guess watching it is a different thing. When I listen to some sampler sets the timing issues can really stand out and sound amateur. Im thinking mainly about drum samples that then get overlaid by a live drummer. At times it takes a few beats for the drummer to completely beat match the sample so, although we are talking milliseconds, when the beats do not match completely it sounds like a bad dj with poor mixing skills. This is probably not an issue watching it live, but listening to a boot with headphones on, it sounds awful.

Having said that, one of my favourite live acts is Basement Jaxx and a lot of their live music is performed through samplers, triggers, synths and computers etc, along with live musicians. In their case, Felix Buxton stands behind all the techno wizardry and plays it all like an instrument. When played this way, it is more than just playing samples. He can play along to extended jams and go off in directions not dictated by any given sample. It really is incredible to watch and, most importantly sounds great too even without the visuals.

If Prince put more into the sampler sets and treated it like playing an instrument it could become something really funky. In that case, watching Prince do a one man show would be pretty awsome. And an album like AOA would be the perfect showcase for such a show.

Rebeljuice said:

I am not going to weigh in with a lengthy discussion, but I am firmly in the affirmative camp. When I come to a show I expect to hear complete songs, not bits and pieces of them.

Rebeljuice said:

Ive never seen a sampler set but I have heard quite a few on boots. I cant say they bring anything to the party when listened to. But I guess watching it is a different thing. When I listen to some sampler sets the timing issues can really stand out and sound amateur. Im thinking mainly about drum samples that then get overlaid by a live drummer. At times it takes a few beats for the drummer to completely beat match the sample so, although we are talking milliseconds, when the beats do not match completely it sounds like a bad dj with poor mixing skills. This is probably not an issue watching it live, but listening to a boot with headphones on, it sounds awful.

Having said that, one of my favourite live acts is Basement Jaxx and a lot of their live music is performed through samplers, triggers, synths and computers etc, along with live musicians. In their case, Felix Buxton stands behind all the techno wizardry and plays it all like an instrument. When played this way, it is more than just playing samples. He can play along to extended jams and go off in directions not dictated by any given sample. It really is incredible to watch and, most importantly sounds great too even without the visuals.

If Prince put more into the sampler sets and treated it like playing an instrument it could become something really funky. In that case, watching Prince do a one man show would be pretty awsome. And an album like AOA would be the perfect showcase for such a show.

Agreed!

paulludvig said:

OldFriends4Sale said:

On Youtube Check out Sheila E live @ Kiss N Grind, dr Rashida mixes Glamorous Life - Hollyrock (with live percussion & bass)

Prince can do this or at least get Rashida

My point is that he should use technology that allows him to do it all by himself. Trigger a loop and play and sing on top of it. Create new beats on the spot. Mix it up. He will not be able to do that with turn tables and he shoudn't have to rely on others.

That's simple?

I still think it would be hot to see Prince mixing turntables of his songs

OldFriends4Sale said:

paulludvig said:

My point is that he should use technology that allows him to do it all by himself. Trigger a loop and play and sing on top of it. Create new beats on the spot. Mix it up. He will not be able to do that with turn tables and he shoudn't have to rely on others.

That's simple?

I still think it would be hot to see Prince mixing turntables of his songs

The sampler keyboard is simple to use compared to turntables, thereby allowing Prince to do other things as well, like playing bass.

paulludvig said:

The sampler keyboard is simple to use compared to turntables,

.

That is the crux of the complaint against P.

Next to the lower creativity factor.

.

He should just play music. Not press stuff to trigger samples.

You know you're a Prince fan when you think the

.

'Sampler Set is The Laziest Thing Prince Has Ever Done?'

Militant said:

Objection 1 - "If I wanted to hear the songs sound like the record I would listen at home"

And if you wanted to hear the songs played live by Prince and literally any band he's ever had, you could listen to literally hundreds of bootlegs circulating. Some of them direct from the soundboard, with no crowd noise! Imagine that! But you still want to go and see Prince. Why? Maybe because it's just as much about the atmosphere and buzz, the shared appreciation, the ambience, the social aspect? And just maybe, for the majority of the audience, that includes hearing things they actually recognize, including things like When Doves Cry which are incredibly difficult to play with a live band because they were written using intricate drum machine programming, no bassline, and analog synths? Or do you want Hannah, a rock drummer to attempt to play that intricate pattern on a standard acoustic drum set and no synths because there isn't currently a keyboard player in the band? Would it even be recognisable to the audience? Probably not, thus defeating the purpose.

As skywalker mentioned, maybe the people who complain have never been to a EDM or hip-hop show, or seen bands like NIN. I saw NIN last year, they are one of my favorite bands, and just like Prince, Trent does certain tracks triggered by samples and loops and sings over the top, sometimes with another bandmember triggering stuff too. They opened the show I saw last year with "Copy of A" and "Me, I'm Not" done this way. Both minimal electronic songs. Kraftwerk does their entire show this way. If they attempted to do anything else it wouldn't be Kraftwerk. People would leave.


I think some people fail to recognise the influence that Prince had on the electronic and Detroit House scenes. Ever heard of Juan Atkins (Model 500)? He, and many other 80's electronic pioneers cite Prince as one of their main influences. I think he, and all of us who appreciate that side of Prince, would find it very bizarre if he took certain songs that were written in a minimal electronic style and attempted them in a more organic style with his rock band or his extended funk and jazz band. Doesn't make a lot of sense.

I've seen Prince 14 times. He's done that sampler set at more than half of those shows. It's never been more than 25 minutes in shows that mostly go on for the better part of 3 hours. Let's not exaggerate the situation here.

Objection 3 - "Have some more variety in the sampler set"

The songs that appear most regularly in the sampler set are the songs that make sense in the sampler set. Hot Thing, When Doves Cry, SOTT, Pop Life, Raspberry Beret, Alphabet St, Forever In My Life.

And I don't know what the last show you saw was, but I saw Prince one month ago at Koko in London and the sampler set contained portions of "U Know", "The Gold Standard" and "Darling Nikki". At Louisville the other night he had "The Ex's Face" in there. Last year when I saw him in Birmingham he had "17 Days", "The Most Beautiful Girl In The World" and "Nasty Girl" in there. Back in 2007 in London he had "Erotic City", "DMSR", "Soft & Wet" and "I Wanna Be Your Lover" in there. At other shows, "Shockadelica", "777-9311", "Partyman", "Delirious", "Irresistable Bitch", "Sexy Dancer" and "Head" have been in there.

That's 25 songs, how much variety do you want? I've never seen him play the same sampler set twice.

The thing is Militant is that Prince has played all the songs you metioned live with a band to amazing effect. All those songs can work live as proven by every tour he's done pre 2000. The sampler is indeed lazy and honestly, bullshit. Why can't he bring in two keyboardists and play them like he done on the Lovesexy tour, the parade tour or damn any tour he's done when he didn't have 3rdEyeGirl struggling to play his catalogue? Becuase it's easier to just trigger them on a keyboard. It's lazy, simple as that.

As well as it being lazy it stems from sheer necessity. He has to play those songs and simply can't because for some unknown reason he's playing with the worst band he's ever had in his career. The novelty of seeing Prince in a tradtional band line-up has long, long, long worn off. If he had a proper band behind him comprised of worldcalss session musician he could still do the rock thing and everything else he wants to do. Watching a Musiciloogy show and then a 3rdEyeGirl show straight after actually makes me want to cry.

[Edited 3/17/15 7:59am]

nosajd said:

I'm probably in the minority here, but I really like the sampler set the way it's been done more recently- with live band in there too. Much rather have stuff like Sign 'o' the Times and Hot Thing done like that than a cheesey modern ballad, over-cooked very late James Brown revuesque horns for ages or a backing singer shouting about putting your hands in the air for 20 minutes.

[Edited 3/17/15 9:44am]

The laziest thing Prince has ever done is reduce his intelligence to the extent that he is able to comfortably sing What If with a born-again protege that needs autotune and only plays the drums competently.

It's the single lowest moment of his entire career. I've supported and loved almost everything he's done for over 20 years, but if he played What If in concert I'd walk out. I refuse to be insulted.

Rebeljuice said:

Ive never seen a sampler set but I have heard quite a few on boots. I cant say they bring anything to the party when listened to. But I guess watching it is a different thing. When I listen to some sampler sets the timing issues can really stand out and sound amateur. Im thinking mainly about drum samples that then get overlaid by a live drummer. At times it takes a few beats for the drummer to completely beat match the sample so, although we are talking milliseconds, when the beats do not match completely it sounds like a bad dj with poor mixing skills. This is probably not an issue watching it live, but listening to a boot with headphones on, it sounds awful.

Having said that, one of my favourite live acts is Basement Jaxx and a lot of their live music is performed through samplers, triggers, synths and computers etc, along with live musicians. In their case, Felix Buxton stands behind all the techno wizardry and plays it all like an instrument. When played this way, it is more than just playing samples. He can play along to extended jams and go off in directions not dictated by any given sample. It really is incredible to watch and, most importantly sounds great too even without the visuals.

If Prince put more into the sampler sets and treated it like playing an instrument it could become something really funky. In that case, watching Prince do a one man show would be pretty awsome. And an album like AOA would be the perfect showcase for such a show.

That's probably because Hannah's timing is frequently out.

Sorry if I sound stupid but I'm not really fully sure as to what these sampler sets are? I've seen him live once, last year in Manchester. I only really became a hardcore fan in summer 2013.

Like, I'm really not into bootlegs either all that much, I was the type of kid that would feel extreme guilt for 5 months if I was to steal 10p sweets from a corner shop okay. Most bootlegs I've heard/seen are not in full and most are from the '80s.

From what I gather they're basically him playing/singing along to tracks everybody knows, whilst most of the backing track is pre-recorded and is triggered by a keyboard or some other device?

Prince during sampler sets just be like

To me if what I'm saying is indeed correct then I wouldn't really feel bad for it if it's only a small portion of the show. It's kind of like Prince's 'seal of guarenteed satisfaction' at his shows? Like he'll play WDC, SOTT, etc in these small portions for the less hardcore fans.

Also in regards to the Prince influencing hosue music thread, someone fucking DO ITTTT.

Fucking love me some house music, me.

It gives Dj , a futuristic,karaoke,keyboard, state of the art, purple LoveMachine, extravaganza to play with it on stage . While he takes a breather. It's a brilliant way, to satisfy both the diehards and casual fans, with both rare,new & old 2 die 4 classics, that will never grow old.

Eye wish Eye had one @ home.

LOVE IT!

It turns EVERY Arena into a club!!!!

[Edited 3/17/15 17:53pm]

terrig said:

terrig said:

THIS NEEDS ITS OWN THREAD. This is a jewel!

@ Militant can you relate?

Damn, that's a jam! Frankie was due to play a set in my city the week that he passed. I woulda gone down for sure.

terrig said:

fusk said:

.

whoaaaaa, that's crazy! I thought for sure people were exaggerating Prince's influence on house, but there it is, plain as day...

this track kills to to this day. classic. rip frankie knuckles.

.

yeah, thanks for sharing!

bluegangsta said:

The sampler set can be cool. Listen to the Monreux 2013 final show. When the band plays along with it it can be pretty mindblowing (eg; the bass on Love or the guitar on Sign O The Times).

I was at that show and I didn't enjoy the sampler set at all.

terrig said:

I'm sorry but have you guys ever seen aanyone with a longazzz face at a prince show complaining about a sampler set?

He does it

a- people LOVE IT. the corwd always goes nuts.

b- because more than likely it will SOMEONES VERY FIRST Prince concert

c- PEOPLE LOVE IT.

They really really do. I would bet most people at his shows are not us psychopaths from the org. They came out wanting to hear Purple Rain and Little Red Corvette and Kiss, and it would be crazy of him not to make those people happy. They love him for it!

I've talked to people after shows and many didn't enjoy the sampler sets

Good Post!

vinaysfunk said:

Militant said:

I fucking love the sampler set.

I will never forget being in the O2 Arena and hearing the SOTT intro drums just BOOM out across the arena and everybody collectively losing their shit.

There's a point at a Prince show where I just want to hear some god damn Linn programming and some thick, stacked, gritty Oberheims. That's what the sampler set brings to the table. When he drops the "77-9311" drums and then segues into the"Hot Thing" beat (check Sweden 2011 bootleg) and grabs the bass and jams over it, that shit is fucking incredible.

Some of that 80's drum-and-synth programming simply can't be replicated live.

Birmingham last year. First show. Sampler set. Prince ends it with "I Would Die 4 U". There's a visceral, emotional reaction sometimes when you hear a song exactly the way you've listened to it for years and years, yet the person is right there singing it in front of you. The woman standing next to me turned to me smiling and hugged me with tears streaming down her face, she was so overcome with emotion.

I think anyone who complains about it hasn't seen Kraftwerk live. Four guys standing in front of laptops triggering loops and samples and yet it's one of the best live shows I have ever seen.

It's not lazy at all. It's genius.

But you're never going to be able to appreciate it by listening to a fucking bootleg. That misses the entire point.

Militant said:

I fucking love the sampler set.

I will never forget being in the O2 Arena and hearing the SOTT intro drums just BOOM out across the arena and everybody collectively losing their shit.

.

In the mean time we're in 2015, so 2007 is about 8 years ago. Things get stale.

.

There's a point at a Prince show where I just want to hear some god damn Linn programming and some thick, stacked, gritty Oberheims. That's what the sampler set brings to the table. When he drops the "77-9311" drums and then segues into the"Hot Thing" beat (check Sweden 2011 bootleg) and grabs the bass and jams over it, that shit is fucking incredible.

.

Then get that CD and play it.

.

Some of that 80's drum-and-synth programming simply can't be replicated live.

.

W're not against sampling, we're not happy with the sampler set. Two different things.

.

Birmingham last year. First show. Sampler set. Prince ends it with "I Would Die 4 U". There's a visceral, emotional reaction sometimes when you hear a song exactly the way you've listened to it for years and years, yet the person is right there singing it in front of you.

.

Then get that CD and play it.

The person does little to me anymore, especially when they just sample and knowing all the stories explaining how severly human they are.

When the person is busy playing an actual (çlassical') instrument (guitar, drums, bass, keyboard, etc) I get more 'value', especially when the longs are just loud enough to drown out the idiots that spend whatever to continually talk during the concert.

.

The woman standing next to me turned to me smiling and hugged me with tears streaming down her face, she was so overcome with emotion.

.

I guess it goes away after time.

It is the same as exiting the Cannes aftershow in 20ten and -without discussing the show before with my tour mate (friend! you know who you are)- showing a woman that was there that the show was not too good.

She did not take it but we (mate and I) agreed.

.

I think anyone who complains about it hasn't seen Kraftwerk live. Four guys standing in front of laptops triggering loops and samples and yet it's one of the best live shows I have ever seen.

.

I guess Kraftwerk are a different form of doing sampling, they make it an art. I did not investigate the differences too thoroughly yet.

They never strap on a guitar, or a bass, though.

.

It's not lazy at all. It's genius.

.

If it is genius then it is genius in a direction we have ended to appreciate.

.

But you're never going to be able to appreciate it by listening to a fucking bootleg. That misses the entire point.

.

A fucking bootleg -excuse my french- is the only proper documentation of an event you'll get. P will never deliver, the bootleggars have to do it.

You point might be the physical presence at the show but then the physical medium (bootleg or not) has the issue, not just the bootleg.

.

Conext: I was front row stage center (end of catwalk...) in Gent twice and also in Cologne in 2011 so I was close enough to the situations you describe.

I guess I need a show where the music is key, no breaks, no pauses, no laid back stuff. 1.5 hours is plenty if you omit the hits.

Militant said:

I fucking love the sampler set.

I will never forget being in the O2 Arena and hearing the SOTT intro drums just BOOM out across the arena and everybody collectively losing their shit.

There's a point at a Prince show where I just want to hear some god damn Linn programming and some thick, stacked, gritty Oberheims. That's what the sampler set brings to the table. When he drops the "77-9311" drums and then segues into the"Hot Thing" beat (check Sweden 2011 bootleg) and grabs the bass and jams over it, that shit is fucking incredible.

Some of that 80's drum-and-synth programming simply can't be replicated live.

Birmingham last year. First show. Sampler set. Prince ends it with "I Would Die 4 U". There's a visceral, emotional reaction sometimes when you hear a song exactly the way you've listened to it for years and years, yet the person is right there singing it in front of you. The woman standing next to me turned to me smiling and hugged me with tears streaming down her face, she was so overcome with emotion.

I think anyone who complains about it hasn't seen Kraftwerk live. Four guys standing in front of laptops triggering loops and samples and yet it's one of the best live shows I have ever seen.

It's not lazy at all. It's genius.

But you're never going to be able to appreciate it by listening to a fucking bootleg. That misses the entire point.





Absolutely spot on, I was at a few of the 02 shows and was at the Birmingham show and I was one of those losing it during the set, couldn't have put it any more perfectly GENIUS.