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Thread started 11/21/11 11:42am

funkatopia

Prince versus The Original 7ven

http://funkatopia.com/fun...-rages-on/

Prince vs. The Time. I can't honestly say which side of the fence I am on with this. Prince has shown his "fear" (for lack of a batter word) of Morris Day and The Time for decades now. Prince yanking them from the opening act slot on the Controversy tours pretty much announced that he was concerned of being upstaged by them.

And now I'm reading threads here that have a lot of people agreeing that the new Original 7ven Condensate album blows away anything Prince has done in the past 3 decades. Plus his refusal to let them use their name only confirms that fear again.

Funkatopia is going to have to take a back seat on this one. Huge fans of both bands, but simply put, Prince isn't doing this type of music anymore with exception to the occassional "Get On the Boat" or "Valentina". His albums just don't have that funky cohesiveness like The Time's albums, but then again, they never have.

Controversy had its Ronnie Talk To Russia and Annie Christian, 1999 had its Something In The Water and All The Critics, Purple Rain has its Darling Nikki's and Computer Blue, etc. So to say that Prince isn't funky like he used to be is kind of a mis-statement because he's never been full on funk. He's always gone off on those types of tangents from the very beginning. He never stopped being funky. It's just that the space between the funky songs is a lot wider. Which is a shame.

The Time, however, has always been Minneapolis-funky from front to back on all of their albums with very little diversions. Anyway, not going to stop loving both bands, but the latest swipe of refusing to let The Time use the band name just doesn't seem becoming regardless of what the reasoning is. And with the band officially changing their name to The Originla 7ven means that this beef is over unless Prince starts refusing to let them perform the songs he wrote for them. I hope he's not that irresponsible.

http://funkatopia.com/fun...-rages-on/

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Reply #1 posted 11/21/11 12:04pm

Graycap23

Wake me......when you're done.

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Reply #2 posted 11/21/11 12:18pm

novabrkr

What type of twisted satisfaction do people get from writing this type of bullshit?

Prince wrote most of the songs and played most of the instruments on each of the three The Time albums that the band is known for. They weren't really anything else than a group of live musicians that Prince used as an opening act for his tours and he used Morris Day as a vocalist for some of his more straightforward funk number when he was exploring different styles of music on his own records.

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Reply #3 posted 11/21/11 12:23pm

Timmy84

Graycap23 said:

Wake me......when you're done.

Haha nice Vanity 6 reference.

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Reply #4 posted 11/21/11 1:00pm

2elijah

Seriously guys, I wish someone could actually explain how anyone could believe, one album from the now Original 7 has outdone Prince's entire, 30-year plus musiic career,and the awards he's won for his music over that period time? Don't know what some folks are smoking but whatever it is please don't pass it around. lol

The original members of 'The Time' including the music/image was an extension of Prince. So if that's the case, then Prince has outdone himself and won. Don't get me wrong, I like the 'O7' and think they deserve much credit for going out on their own, under a different name and managing to succeed in creating a nice album. Let's face it though, agree or disagree, they were a copy and an extension of Prince's creation music/and the creation of another side of Prince, as he presented them to us, with their stage appearance/performances--when they were called 'The Time', and quite frankly, as the 'Original7ven', image-wise, today they still present that very, same image Prince created. :: Running as fast as I can from bricks being thrown for having the audacity to say such a thing....how dare me. giggle ::

[Edited 11/21/11 13:33pm]

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Reply #5 posted 11/21/11 1:10pm

Mya

tumbleweed

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Reply #6 posted 11/21/11 1:15pm

dannyd5050

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I agree with the OP. I hope Condensate lights a fire under that royal ass to come up with an equally enjoyable album. nod

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Reply #7 posted 11/21/11 1:26pm

funkatopia

We agree on most points here. The Time was most indeed an extension of Prince. No argument there. And let's face it, their look and everything about them screams Prince. They wouldn't even exist without Prince. However, all of the members with exception to Jerome have proven they are successes without Prince, even though some may argue they wouldn't have had success without the jumpstart.

And no one said that this one album outdoes Prince's discography. I think the argument is that it's more cohesive than any of his recent works. The album that Prince fans have wanted from Prince. I personally think it's good that TO7 were able to prove themselves without his involvement. the denial letting them use The Time moniker may have been Prince's way of saying, "Yeah? Prove it."

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Reply #8 posted 11/21/11 1:57pm

WetDream

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funkatopia said:

We agree on most points here. The Time was most indeed an extension of Prince. No argument there. And let's face it, their look and everything about them screams Prince. They wouldn't even exist without Prince. However, all of the members with exception to Jerome have proven they are successes without Prince, even though some may argue they wouldn't have had success without the jumpstart.

And no one said that this one album outdoes Prince's discography. I think the argument is that it's more cohesive than any of his recent works. The album that Prince fans have wanted from Prince. I personally think it's good that TO7 were able to prove themselves without his involvement. the denial letting them use The Time moniker may have been Prince's way of saying, "Yeah? Prove it."

Speak for yourself. Yeah, sure i'm happy they've come out on their own and i support that idea, but Condensate is a cheesy poppy album that tries to be Prince-like in how he produced them back in the day and fails drastically and instead sees them desperately trying to re-perform with their one trick pony that Prince made for them. If Prince released this album, i'd be ashamed. This is 100% NOT what i wanna hear from Prince. There never was a battle, that was for show, Prince's show. This "better than what Prince is doing" happens anytime a Prince associate or sound-alike releases an album, they shit on Prince to fulfil their bizarre wanna-hurt-Prince fetish. They're nothing on Prince and anybody with working eyes and ears can hear/see that. Hey Yo? C'mon, mate....

[Edited 11/21/11 14:06pm]

This Post is produced, arranged, composed and performed by WetDream
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Reply #9 posted 11/21/11 2:00pm

2elijah

funkatopia said:

We agree on most points here. The Time was most indeed an extension of Prince. No argument there. And let's face it, their look and everything about them screams Prince. They wouldn't even exist without Prince. However, all of the members with exception to Jerome have proven they are successes without Prince, even though some may argue they wouldn't have had success without the jumpstart.

And no one said that this one album outdoes Prince's discography. I think the argument is that it's more cohesive than any of his recent works. The album that Prince fans have wanted from Prince. I personally think it's good that TO7 were able to prove themselves without his involvement. the denial letting them use The Time moniker may have been Prince's way of saying, "Yeah? Prove it."

I give them credit for releasing a decent album, but the test will be if they could present various types of music, other than the kind of sound, that don't become 'too familiar'. Variety is nice. The difference with Prince is that you can't label him in one category, because he plays a variety of music, so you never know what to 'expect' from him when he releases an album/cd. He also has changed his image dress-wise over the years. The O7 kept the same Princely image associated with 'The Time' that Prince apparently created, as though they were saving their extravagant suits from the 80s and took it out the closet, tried them on to see it they still fit, when "Condensate' was released.lol

If they show they could be successful without Prince, wonder if they would consider shedding the image that Prince created and made them famous for as ''The Time', because right now looking at their group pic as the 'O7', screams "I tried, but I can't let go of the Purple Magic'. Just saying, if they don't need the same name to succeed, then they don't need the same, type image to be successful. I mean even some snakes shed their old skin and grow a new one. I don't think the band members have said anything with malice, publically towards Prince, but if they should while portraying the same image/similar stage performances Prince displayed of them, as the former "Time' group, it would pretty much be a form of contradiction on their part. (Dont take that wrong, I still love the members of The Time). I'm just saying, it would be like telling someone you don't need them to succeed, but still wanting to hold on to just a little piece of them to make it. Just my two cents. (::Lawd I'm in trouble now..lol )

[Edited 11/22/11 18:57pm]

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Reply #10 posted 11/21/11 2:05pm

smoothcriminal
12

It's an alright album...kinda like Prince when he's not really trying. lol

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Reply #11 posted 11/21/11 2:05pm

smoothcriminal
12

Strawberry Lake is such a 1999 rip off.

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Reply #12 posted 11/21/11 2:27pm

SoulAlive

'Condensate' is the best album of 2011 headbang

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Reply #13 posted 11/21/11 2:48pm

Militant

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moderator

smoothcriminal12 said:

Strawberry Lake is such a 1999 rip off.

i got more of a sly stone vibe on that one.... confirmed even more so whe the lyric "hot fun in the summertime" popped up in there too lol

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Reply #14 posted 11/21/11 2:51pm

smoothcriminal
12

Militant said:

smoothcriminal12 said:

Strawberry Lake is such a 1999 rip off.

i got more of a sly stone vibe on that one.... confirmed even more so whe the lyric "hot fun in the summertime" popped up in there too lol

lol

Listen to the first 10 seconds...especially where they put the rimshot. It sounds like 1999 redux. lol

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Reply #15 posted 11/21/11 3:04pm

2elijah

smoothcriminal12 said:



Militant said:




smoothcriminal12 said:


Strawberry Lake is such a 1999 rip off.




i got more of a sly stone vibe on that one.... confirmed even more so whe the lyric "hot fun in the summertime" popped up in there too lol



lol



Listen to the first 10 seconds...especially where they put the rimshot. It sounds like 1999 redux. lol


With that being said, I think the beginning of their track 'Sick' sounds similar to 'LayDown'.
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Reply #16 posted 11/21/11 4:30pm

SoulAlive

if Prince released this album,I'd be ashamed

It's the opposite for me lol If 'Condensate' was Prince's new album,I'd be ecstatic.I'll be on here screaming "Prince is back!"

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Reply #17 posted 11/21/11 4:39pm

datdude

PUH-leez. Condensate is barely above average. cohesive, yes, but as has been said, if P wrote that ish, in all its (juvenile at 50) "Morris Day" schtick, he'd get thrashed on here and elsewhere. Glad to see the guy's back, love em! And Prince's past treatment of The Time nothwithstanding, he has nothing to fear. Now if they evolve, keep recording and come completely out of left field sonically, and especially topically, REPOST this thread then.

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Reply #18 posted 11/21/11 4:54pm

Graycap23

datdude said:

PUH-leez. Condensate is barely above average. cohesive, yes, but as has been said, if P wrote that ish, in all its (juvenile at 50) "Morris Day" schtick, he'd get thrashed on here and elsewhere. Glad to see the guy's back, love em! And Prince's past treatment of The Time nothwithstanding, he has nothing to fear. Now if they evolve, keep recording and come completely out of left field sonically, and especially topically, REPOST this thread then.

Don't come in here speaking facts and truth....... razz

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Reply #19 posted 11/21/11 5:31pm

phunkdaddy

avatar

WetDream said:

funkatopia said:

We agree on most points here. The Time was most indeed an extension of Prince. No argument there. And let's face it, their look and everything about them screams Prince. They wouldn't even exist without Prince. However, all of the members with exception to Jerome have proven they are successes without Prince, even though some may argue they wouldn't have had success without the jumpstart.

And no one said that this one album outdoes Prince's discography. I think the argument is that it's more cohesive than any of his recent works. The album that Prince fans have wanted from Prince. I personally think it's good that TO7 were able to prove themselves without his involvement. the denial letting them use The Time moniker may have been Prince's way of saying, "Yeah? Prove it."

Speak for yourself. Yeah, sure i'm happy they've come out on their own and i support that idea, but Condensate is a cheesy poppy album that tries to be Prince-like in how he produced them back in the day and fails drastically and instead sees them desperately trying to re-perform with their one trick pony that Prince made for them. If Prince released this album, i'd be ashamed. This is 100% NOT what i wanna hear from Prince. There never was a battle, that was for show, Prince's show. This "better than what Prince is doing" happens anytime a Prince associate or sound-alike releases an album, they shit on Prince to fulfil their bizarre wanna-hurt-Prince fetish. They're nothing on Prince and anybody with working eyes and ears can hear/see that. Hey Yo? C'mon, mate....

[Edited 11/21/11 14:06pm]

bored2

Don't laugh at my funk
This funk is a serious joint
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Reply #20 posted 11/21/11 7:57pm

Timmy84

datdude said:

PUH-leez. Condensate is barely above average. cohesive, yes, but as has been said, if P wrote that ish, in all its (juvenile at 50) "Morris Day" schtick, he'd get thrashed on here and elsewhere. Glad to see the guy's back, love em! And Prince's past treatment of The Time nothwithstanding, he has nothing to fear. Now if they evolve, keep recording and come completely out of left field sonically, and especially topically, REPOST this thread then.

Oh shit...

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Reply #21 posted 11/21/11 8:52pm

phunkdaddy

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Attention Everybody! lol

Prince vs. The Time – The Battle Rages On

21 Nov

The TimeBack in 1982 when The Time came into fruition, I was only 14. Everything I heard about the beef between Prince and The Time was all hearsay until recently when members of The Time discussed some of the antics in detail on a DVD documentary that’s included with their new album Condensate. There has been much talk about how Prince was gravely concerned about his own creation and that he had actually put together a supergroup that could even surpass his fame and that he did all in his power to keep them at bay – even to this day.

The start of The Time began when Prince made a fateful decision to use a song called Party Up that was written by Morris Day. He propositioned Morris and offered to either pay him for the song or help him put a band together. Morris opted for the band, which ended up being an incredibly wise decision and resulted in what the world now knew as The Time and now knows as The Original 7ven. When Prince put The Time together, he crafted a conglomerate of amazing musicians all in one place that could potentially be his undoing.

Now there are many sites dedicated to the history of how things then began to happen and the roots of where the band started, but this post is dedicated to something that raised its ugly head once again and that has led the band to rename themselves as The Original 7ven. A problem that many thought would go away after all of the years of Prince’s dominance of the music charts or as some would put it, a comfortable lead. But decades later and the ridiculousness continues and that has many scratching their heads.

Prince Backstage PassThe Time put together a new album 20 years after their last release of Pandemonium called Condensate (available now on Amazon) and Prince used his ”powers that be” to stop the band from using the name of The Time, which forced them to change the name to The Original 7ven. A strong-armed tactic by Prince to keep his “creations” as his own. Especially since Prince wouldn’t be involved in the creation of anything on this record. The Time wanted to do their own thing without Prince’s involvement and Prince acted accordingly in the equivalent of what looks downright childish. In the DVD documentary of the Condensate album, Morris Day in particular has to do everything short of biting his lip to hold back his displeasure. Even though they indicate they understand that “it’s business”, the displeasure is downright palpable in the film. At one point you can even see Morris Day fighting off the urge to go nuclear on the matter, but cooler heads prevail.

But this isn’t the first time that Prince has tried to keep The Time at bay. During Prince’s Controversy tour back in the 80′s, Prince had The Time as opening act. The reviews for The Time were beyond stellar to the point where newspapers and publications were directing more attention to The Time than the purple headliner. A fact that was not lost by Prince as he then promptly pulled The Time from the opening slot on some of the bigger venues such as the Los Angeles and Miami shows. Adding insult to injury, during the 1999/Triple Threat tour, Prince had The Time playing as Vanity 6′s back-up band behind a curtain and paying them a very minimal increase even though they were required to essentially play 2 shows each night.

Morris Day and Jesse Johnson

Photo obtained from user OldFriends4Sale from prince.org here: http://prince.org/msg/7/358840?pr

Now here we are three decades later and the battle rages on. But it appears that even though Prince has kept The Time from using the band name, the music is ultimately the deciding factor. The Original 7ven has created a full blown funk album masterpiece in true Minneapolis style that is garnering amazing reviews (including our own) which is a feat that Prince can’t seem to duplicate.

Even many Prince fans agree that the Purple One simply doesn’t have it in him to create a coherent album anymore, as the last 2 decades have been mired with hits and misses. The release of The Original 7ven’s Condensate album accentuates his shortcomings even further and his refusal to let them use their own band name highlights the issue even more.

While hardcore Prince fans (like ourselves) long for an album that recreates the grooves that we signed on for back in the 80′s, the release of Condensate is a mallet to the skull of Prince’s ego. The Time did it on their own terms and they did it big. The critics could easily be silenced if Prince could prove that he has the ability to compete. Taking the band name won’t be enough to stop The Time, because if you don’t take away their music, you’ve let them keep their weapons and have done nothing to disarm them.

Prince and Morris Day

Photo obtained from user OldFriends4Sale from prince.org here: http://prince.org/msg/7/358840?pr

If anything, this battle may put a fire under Prince to answer Condensate with his own Top 40 capable album, but for years he’s had the playing field to himself and he hasn’t managed to get it accomplished with exception of doing it through other artists like Usher, Alicia Keys and Nicki Minaj.

Additionally, Prince has done everything in his power to disarm any promotion that fans and the public release to help him including removal of all videos from Youtube and removal of all online photos. It’s in essence promotional suicide since there are no purchasable products that compete with the “offending material” that he’s been so quick to denounce. Many fans see it plainly as a refusal to let himself be promoted.

The Original 7ven, however, have utilized every opportunity to break it off and take major strides to distance themselves. And some say that the only thing Prince is distancing himself from are his fans. Let’s face it. if this were a Purple Rain sequel, the ending would look much differently than the original ended. The Original 7ven are promotional machines and they are truly winning the battle even though their identity has been stifled.

We will always be hardcore fans of both bands, but the jury is out. What is your verdict?

The Time

Photo obtained from OldFriends4Sale at http://prince.org/msg/7/364354

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Tags: 1999, alicia keys, Morris Day, Morris Day and The Time, new power generation, nicki minaj, npg, Prince, prince and npg, the original 7ven, the original seven, The Time, usher

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Don't laugh at my funk
This funk is a serious joint
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Reply #22 posted 11/21/11 9:23pm

MadamGoodnight

SoulAlive said:

if Prince released this album,I'd be ashamed

It's the opposite for me lol If 'Condensate' was Prince's new album,I'd be ecstatic.I'll be on here screaming "Prince is back!"

nod If Princey put his falsetto over that funk, yes headbang woot! nuts

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Reply #23 posted 11/22/11 12:03am

aiden3121

Militant said:

smoothcriminal12 said:

Strawberry Lake is such a 1999 rip off.

i got more of a sly stone vibe on that one.... confirmed even more so whe the lyric "hot fun in the summertime" popped up in there too lol

I agree i thought i was the only one who heard the Sly vibe on Strawberry Lake

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Reply #24 posted 11/22/11 12:09am

PDogz

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I can't hate on "Condensate", I think it's a solidly good album. It took me a while to actually sit down and pay it some serious attention, but once I did; I can honestly say I enjoyed every song. Just the same, I don't think Prince has anything to be concerned about, and I'm honestly tired of these comparisons of one artist to another. Furthermore, if Prince had nothing to do with "Condensate", I can understand why he wouldn't want "The Time" label placed upon it. People (...including myself) would only assume he had something to do with it. Plus, for the band to come up with a new name as creative as "The Original 7ven", while maintaining all their charm, even while giving their brand a face-lift for the new millennium, only makes their new material all the more appealing in my opinion. As far as I'm concerned, everyone wins.

.

[Edited 11/22/11 8:06am]

"There's Nothing That The Proper Attitude Won't Render Funkable!"

star
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Reply #25 posted 11/22/11 12:37am

purplethunder3
121

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Timmy84 said:

datdude said:

PUH-leez. Condensate is barely above average. cohesive, yes, but as has been said, if P wrote that ish, in all its (juvenile at 50) "Morris Day" schtick, he'd get thrashed on here and elsewhere. Glad to see the guy's back, love em! And Prince's past treatment of The Time nothwithstanding, he has nothing to fear. Now if they evolve, keep recording and come completely out of left field sonically, and especially topically, REPOST this thread then.

Oh shit...

"Music gives a soul to the universe, wings to the mind, flight to the imagination and life to everything." --Plato

https://youtu.be/CVwv9LZMah0
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Reply #26 posted 11/22/11 12:39am

Timmy84

purplethunder3121 said:

Timmy84 said:

Oh shit...

Haha Vivien Leigh.

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Reply #27 posted 11/22/11 6:22am

carlcranshaw

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Is Jesse wearing a Paisley shirt and holding his middle finger up to say F U Prince?

Is there a subliminal in this photo?

‎"The first time I saw the cover of Dirty Mind in the early 80s I thought, 'Is this some drag queen ripping on Freddie Prinze?'" - Some guy on The Gear Page
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Reply #28 posted 11/22/11 7:47am

Timmy84

lol

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Reply #29 posted 11/22/11 7:50am

paisleypark4

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They were at Paisley Park according to St. Pauls tweets and said it was nice to see them....so...not here for lies.
Straight Jacket Funk Affair
Album plays and love for vinyl records.
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