mookie said:

Poor Paris. Hope she gets better.

And i'm calling it now, the Jackson family are going to throw Paris under the bus just like MJ and turn her into the world's biggest brat. When it comes to their own delusions about their public image, this is when they speak up and try to protect their own crappy image.

mookie said:

Scorp said:

.

and this type of birdfeather comment is why this entire situation has turned into one great shitstorm, 10 times worse than Hurricane Sandy....this hurricane has lasted over 27 years because Michael Jackson embraced the concept of racial indifference, which has directed hate towards his family, hate towards anything or anyone who reminds the majority of his fans who he really was, and it stinks foul all the way to the crapper

what was once sunshine has turned into hubris...

to say it's alright to dislike someone, much less an 80 year old woman who aint done jack to his fans, by calling her a mother fucker and a nigger......those fans and those who share similar thoughts w/out saying the actual words should be rounded up and sent to jail. they need to be locked up because all they do is breed hate and hell on the regular....there's never anything constructive or encouraging...

Michael had all the respect in the world from 1969-1984, but that respect dissipated year after year aftrer year, and it happend swift and fast once it was obvious what he was seeking for himself and his career after he reached the very pinnacle....and he was STILL given the benefit of the doubt because of what he had accomplished and how he endeared the public when this stuff meant something..

this aint about being pro family....it's about being realistic and stop looking for scapegoats...

no, it was MICHAEL who didn't respect himself when he pushed beyond his natural being and who's the latest casualty of the madness..this girl slitting her wrists, or I should say, contemplating suicide.....

and I aint got to exaggerate nothing....I just read the same crap comments today I've witnessed over the past 2 decades....

this is absolutely, unequivically the ugliest public situation I've ever seen in my lifetime...

To be realistic, you have to be informed. And you've shown you're not that informed and you're not capable of being balanced in your views (ex. you'll attack MJ fans for crticizing katherine, but not speak up when Janet's fans viciously attack MJ and his kids). You're also pretty outdated. The fact that you expect fans to think much of Katherine and the rest of the family shows how out of touch and outdated you are. There is no fanbase outside of Janet's that thinks highly of their artist's family, so why would you even dare try preach to us about this family? Priscilla Presley has made 100's of milllion of dollars for Elvis estate and Elvis fans still hate her, but you expect MJ fans to kiss the asses of the Jacksons, who have done nothing for MJ's legacy? Or the fact that you continue to exaggerate (as if you could pull up any thread of fans calling Katherine those names) what the fans say about Katherine, while not addressing the fact this family sucks up to those that say 50x times worst things about them, than the fans ever have said about them, sums up why it is hard to take you seriously.

BTW, I can easily name who it is that crosses the line at times when it comes to criticizing this family, while also showing plenty of times fans telling this poster to knock it off and his offensive comments being deleted. So stop with all this outdated ramblings about MJ, his kids and his fans, and starting questioning this family's actions. Their funky current actions is what is driving all this loud criticism towards them, so why not address that? Forget about the mistakes MJ might have made, dwelling on that is what comes across as being used as a scapegoat and actually speak on the issue of what this family has done since MJ's passing.

[Edited 6/6/13 9:32am]

and that's the whole problem, the entire root of the flack, THEY'RE NOT HIS KIDS

Michael Jackson bought those kids cut and dry.....

the entire situation should have never been dated to begin with

and I don't care if you take me seriously or not.....the last thing I'm losing sleep over is that....

and I don't have to exaggerate and lie about nothing I've seen regarding the comments I've seen posted on this thing called the world wide web by representatives of his current fanbase.....I aint got to lie about nothing

I've seen the vile stained comments on a number of MJ forums, King of Pop Discussion, I seen it here on this forum from last year.....I've seen the comments on youtube, I've seen the comments on TMZ, I've seen the comments on the websites of many these entertainment sources/programs, and I've heard the comments over the last year on radio

I aint gotta prove one iota to you

and for anyone who calls an 80 year old woman our her name, much less a profanity laced attack, they are about some of th sorriest individuals I've ever seen

and what's crazy...this family has never, ever attack MJ's fanbase, they've been gracious even when the majority of the legion don't deserve it, and half the time, they've been trying to clean this stuff up when the fans can't see it...

on King of Pop Discussion, during 11/09, when Robin Roberts was set to interview Janet, some stan said out the box that Janet Jackson participated in the death of her brother MIchael Jackson...this cat sad that Janet was as co-conspirator....THIS GUY SAID THAT CRAP.....

this is what the hell we dealing with...all out madness, and that guy's post is still on that forum so I don't care about u thinking that I'm lying...

how in the hell can anyone's family make sense out of something that makes absolutely no sense...

as far as the public like liking the Jacksons, you're not referring to the public when this stuff meant something, you're referring to a public that was introduced to this situation once the madness went full tilt, and when the lies started flying all over the place...

you're not talking about the public from 1969-1984, whent this was legit, you're referring to a public that has grown under the realm of the pop ascension movement that has destroyed the hell out of everything.....

and if anyone think Joe Jackson was worst showbiz father in the world

they need to check the books on George Osmond, the father of the Osmonds

he brought the door, the tub, and the kitchen sink when he dealt w/his kids, he was in their grill every hour on the hour.....

He was Stonewall Jackson, General Lee, George Patton, and Norman Shwartzkoff rolled into one......he ran boot camp every day.......

[Edited 6/6/13 16:58pm]

It's heartless to not feel awful about what Katherine is going through right now, fan or not.

alphastreet said:

It's heartless to not feel awful about what Katherine is going through right now, fan or not.

very very true....

Irrationally.

Free2BMe said:

Scorp lies and manipulates things to fit HIS agenda-to bash Michael and to build up the Jackson family and Janet. His agenda and objective is cyrstal clear. This is the very reason that he was banned from the KOP board; he was there under the pretense of spewing "objectivity". There is NOTHING objective about anything that scorp posts. His disdain and scorn for Michael is apparent. Hopefully, all aware people see this person for what he is- a liar and manipulator.

u did it again....did it yet again....

you spoke w/out knowing the extent of what actually happened, which leads u to falling for the okie doke yet again

I didn't post on that forum for 2 years......I got the hell outta there when I saw all the racist rhetoric directed at this family

when I saw a guy say the jackson need to go move back in their hut in Gary for they are ghetto trash, that pissed me the f*** off because Michael lived right in that home along w/everyone else

and when I saw nothing done about that, particular from the handful of black moderators who paraded around......I no longer considered myself a member and saw that forum was no longer worthy of its own existence, and I was cool on that garbage...

so get your facts straight and your jip sheet corrected......

just for the record, I didn't say ANYTHING after that from Janury of 2010 and didn't say what I wanted to say about the hatefilled rhetoric until late summer last year, specifically 8/9/2012 so that's OVER 2 years before they heard a peep outta me......

see, when someone is trying to rag on u, u have to keep up w/dates and evidence

and I said what I had to say before I was banned, because they were called out for their ambivalance and their hatred for a family who aint done a damn thing to them

and then I went deep down in the well explaining how this entire experiencehas transpired over time and how the entertainment value regarding Michael Jackson was gone

see, this aint a black or white issue, it's a wrong or right issue...

and if this family was white, and they were subject to the same vile attacks, I would be saying the same damn thing

before you try and get favor, ask questions about what really happened before u jump the gun

what's sad about this whole thing, u don't realize how much you've been conned and manipulated

hey JANET, how u enjoying the sucker punch u delivered to the pundits, how's that billion dollar manifesto feeling.......I know you feeling great.... u won

[Edited 6/7/13 5:20am]

Scorp, you need to let go of 'they ain't his kids'... because they are his kids! Whether they are white, black, mixed, chinese or... I don't know, offspring E.T. left for Michael to raise. He raised them, he left his will to them, he loved them. He is their father, point blank. Remember Michael said back 20 years or so ago that he'd love to adopt a whole lotta kids from different countries. Imagine he did that, imagine when he died he had kids from all over the globe. They too would be in his will, they too would be considered his children... because, he would have been their father. So let go of this. It's insulting to anyone who was adopted, fostered or perhaps even brought into the world via surrogates. Do you have a problem with DONTE being in the Jackson family too? Wasn't he adopted?

Anyway, TMZ has a statment from Paris's school;

[Edited 6/7/13 8:47am]

Scorp said:

and that's the whole problem, the entire root of the flack, THEY'RE NOT HIS KIDS

Michael Jackson bought those kids cut and dry.....

the entire situation should have never been dated to begin with

and I don't care if you take me seriously or not.....the last thing I'm losing sleep over is that....

and I don't have to exaggerate and lie about nothing I've seen regarding the comments I've seen posted on this thing called the world wide web by representatives of his current fanbase.....I aint got to lie about nothing

I've seen the vile stained comments on a number of MJ forums, King of Pop Discussion, I seen it here on this forum from last year.....I've seen the comments on youtube, I've seen the comments on TMZ, I've seen the comments on the websites of many these entertainment sources/programs, and I've heard the comments over the last year on radio

I aint gotta prove one iota to you

and for anyone who calls an 80 year old woman our her name, much less a profanity laced attack, they are about some of th sorriest individuals I've ever seen

and what's crazy...this family has never, ever attack MJ's fanbase, they've been gracious even when the majority of the legion don't deserve it, and half the time, they've been trying to clean this stuff up when the fans can't see it...

on King of Pop Discussion, during 11/09, when Robin Roberts was set to interview Janet, some stan said out the box that Janet Jackson participated in the death of her brother MIchael Jackson...this cat sad that Janet was as co-conspirator....THIS GUY SAID THAT CRAP.....

this is what the hell we dealing with...all out madness, and that guy's post is still on that forum so I don't care about u thinking that I'm lying...

how in the hell can anyone's family make sense out of something that makes absolutely no sense...

as far as the public like liking the Jacksons, you're not referring to the public when this stuff meant something, you're referring to a public that was introduced to this situation once the madness went full tilt, and when the lies started flying all over the place...

you're not talking about the public from 1969-1984, whent this was legit, you're referring to a public that has grown under the realm of the pop ascension movement that has destroyed the hell out of everything.....

and if anyone think Joe Jackson was worst showbiz father in the world

they need to check the books on George Osmond, the father of the Osmonds

he brought the door, the tub, and the kitchen sink when he dealt w/his kids, he was in their grill every hour on the hour.....

He was Stonewall Jackson, General Lee, George Patton, and Norman Shwartzkoff rolled into one......he ran boot camp every day.......

[Edited 6/6/13 16:58pm]

Yeah, yeah, yeah, as usual make this all about MJ and his kids paternity and not the fact that this black family are nothing but a bunch of shameless suckups to the white tabloid media, who ownly associates with the most bottom of the barrel leeches. The fact that the "beloved" matriarch of this showbiz family can only do business with known and obvious bottom dwellers like Howard Mann and Dieter Wiesner, etc., tells us all we need to know about this family, so stop trying to oversell this family to the fans. You throw up the Osmonds, well the Osmonds unlike the Jacksons have been able to go out and do their own thing at least, instead of being these tabloid loving losers.

And for someone who doesn't care what fans like myself think, the fact that you sit up here and embellish what the fans are actually saying about this family shows you do care. I say fans like yourself do this because what else can you say? Because you sure as hell aren't going to discuss the latest leech katherine is involved with or whatever sad and emabarassing project the family is trying to launch or the latest tabloid the family is sucking up to, so you instead choose to exaggerate what the fans are saying about this family. And for the record, the over the top nasty comments you see all over the net, mostly comes from the TMZ crowd who the family plays up to instead of nostalgia fans like yourself.

And since i'm unfortunately good at predicting what's next from the family, here's another prediction: Paris goes back with the Jackons and within maybe 2 months she'll be doing interviews with Oprah and the UK tabloids . I dare any of you family lovers to tell me no way this "loving family" will allow this to happen.

PARIS JACKSON
JUDGE ORDERS INVESTIGATION
INTO ATTEMPTED SUICIDE

Read more: http://www.tmz.com#ixzz2VZ3av5lk

Judge may unseal part of Jackson abuse claim

By ANTHONY McCARTNEY, AP Entertainment Writer

Updated 1:52 pm, Thursday, June 6, 2013

LOS ANGELES (AP) — A judge said Thursday he was inclined to unseal portions of a choreographer's court filings alleging he was abused by Michael Jackson.

However, personal details and psychiatrist reports would likely not be released.

Superior Court Judge Mitchell Beckloff said he needed to address which records should remain sealed before he can deal with whether Wade Robson, a choreographer and television personality, can pursue his claim.

Robson requested on May 1 that Beckloff allow him to file a late creditor's claim against Jackson's estate nearly eight years to the day after he testified in Jackson's defense at the singer's molestation trial.

Jackson was acquitted after Robson told jurors the entertainer never touched him inappropriately. Henry Gradstein, an attorney for Robson, said a breakdown last year prompted Robson to address the abuse.

Howard Weitzman, an attorney for Jackson's estate and Thomas Messereau, the lawyer who successfully defended Jackson, have attacked Robson's credibility and noted his repeated defense of the singer.

Weitzman has called the accusations "outrageous and pathetic."

"We are confident that the court will see this for what it is" he said at the time the allegations were first made.

On Thursday, Beckloff presented attorneys with possible redactions of Robson's sworn declaration and said it should serve as a roadmap for what information can be made public.

The judge believes some of the material could be made public, even though attorneys on both sides would like the case sealed in its entirety.

Some of Robson's private and personal information, including a paragraph that detailed his allegations of abuse by Jackson, should be sealed, Beckloff said.

He also said portions of the records that deal with mental health issues also should not be released.

"There aren't a lot of redactions," Beckloff said of his suggestions.

Attorneys for Robson and Jackson's estate will review the suggestions by the judge and report back at a hearing on June 25, the fourth anniversary of Jackson's death.

Beckoff, who is overseeing the probate case involving Jackson's massive estate, said he will also handle a separate lawsuit filed by Robson against Jackson and two other defendants listed as "Doe 2" and "Doe 3" that includes allegations of abuse by the entertainer. That lawsuit also remains sealed.

Robson, 30, has worked with Britney Spears and numerous other stars. He was 22 at the time he testified, telling jurors in Jackson's criminal case that he met the pop star when he was 5 and spent the night at Jackson's Neverland Ranch more than 20 times, sleeping in the singer's bedroom on most visits.

During the trial, Robson bristled at testimony by other witnesses that they had seen Jackson molest him.

"I'm telling you nothing happened," Robson testified when a prosecutor challenged his account in 2005.

Gradstein previously issued a statement saying, "Last year, on a career trajectory that was off the charts, (Robson) collapsed under the stress and sexual trauma of what had happened to him for seven years as a child."

___

Read more: http://www.sfgate.com/ent...z2VZ3nER00

So this Judge Beckloff is handling both Wade Robson's creditor's claim against the Estate AND the guardianship of MJ's kids?

[Edited 6/7/13 13:34pm]

OfftheWall said:

Scorp, you need to let go of 'they ain't his kids'... because they are his kids! Whether they are white, black, mixed, chinese or... I don't know, offspring E.T. left for Michael to raise. He raised them, he left his will to them, he loved them. He is their father, point blank. Remember Michael said back 20 years or so ago that he'd love to adopt a whole lotta kids from different countries. Imagine he did that, imagine when he died he had kids from all over the globe. They too would be in his will, they too would be considered his children... because, he would have been their father. So let go of this. It's insulting to anyone who was adopted, fostered or perhaps even brought into the world via surrogates. Do you have a problem with DONTE being in the Jackson family too? Wasn't he adopted?

Anyway, TMZ has a statment from Paris's school;

[Edited 6/7/13 8:47am]

I have to agree with this. I personally do not believe Paris and Prince are MJ bio children, but he was legally their dad, and people like Scorp have to deal with it and stop making it the be and end all of everything.

I know one thing for sure if MJ were alive they would not have had a fraction of the exposure they have now. I doubt he will still be putting them in masks, however I doubt they would be on twiitter or facebook 24/7. Or doing interviews with Oprah and Ellen. I do not see why they are being so over exposed so unnecessarily.

Of course if MJ were alive they would still be problems but I doubt they would have been played out in public like this.

I still do not understand why Paris has 1million followers on twitter, lets face it if MJ were alive she would have had been lucky to even have a cell phone.

[Edited 6/7/13 15:17pm]

[Edited 6/7/13 15:20pm]

people always say what would be going on 'if mj was alive'. well we have no idea what they would be doing because for one they were really young when he died,i doubt he could keep them isolated as they became teens, they wouldnt be in the media because the media wouldnt care. the kids would be portrayed as little weirdos because thats how the media portrayed mike.this girl didnt attempt to kill herself because the jacksons are greedy,there is a long list of issues this child has to deal with.this is not some war between mj fans and janet or the family fans,im a big time janet fan and i feel sorry for paris,she didnt ask to be brought in this situation. mike and debbie were selfish in the way they chose to have these kids.i notice fans were overjoyed about debbie rowe coming back in her life but did any of you think how paris must feel knowing her mom didnt want her.paris goes to school,everybody know the story about debbie havin them as a 'gift' for mj, now there are new molestation claims,of course mean kids are gonna taunt her.i just think mj fans jump to blame any and everything on the jackson family .i always felt racism played a big part in the demonization of mj's relatives.

kibbles said:

OfftheWall said:Scorp, you need to let go of 'they ain't his kids'... because they are his kids! Whether they are white, black, mixed, chinese or... I don't know, offspring E.T. left for Michael to raise. He raised them, he left his will to them, he loved them. He is their father, point blank. Remember Michael said back 20 years or so ago that he'd love to adopt a whole lotta kids from different countries. Imagine he did that, imagine when he died he had kids from all over the globe. They too would be in his will, they too would be considered his children... because, he would have been their father. So let go of this. It's insulting to anyone who was adopted, fostered or perhaps even brought into the world via surrogates. Do you have a problem with DONTE being in the Jackson family too? Wasn't he adopted? Anyway, TMZ has a statment from Paris's school; [Edited 6/7/13 8:47am]NO, OF COURSE S/HE DOESN'T HAVE A PROBLEM WITH DONTE'S ADOPTION. HE'S BLACK, ISN'T HE?

you're missing one major very important factor out of htis whole equation......

and this is why I say this man evolved into becoming the greatest media manipulator of all time

the factor that is missing is that MICHAEL JACKSON said himself, when absolutely nobody forced him to, he said he fathered all 3 of those kids

he didn't say adopt but he said he FATHERED them, he said he was their biological father....

matter of fact, the majority of the public moved beyond the experience a very long time ago and was going on about their own business

he's the one who sold those pictures of that first kid to LIFE magazine when he was first born.....

he brought attention to this to gain attention

it's insulting alright...that much is true......and that's why this girl is already crying out because she's caught up in the madness tenfold

lowkey said:

people always say what would be going on 'if mj was alive'. well we have no idea what they would be doing because for one they were really young when he died,i doubt he could keep them isolated as they became teens, they wouldnt be in the media because the media wouldnt care. the kids would be portrayed as little weirdos because thats how the media portrayed mike.this girl didnt attempt to kill herself because the jacksons are greedy,there is a long list of issues this child has to deal with.this is not some war between mj fans and janet or the family fans,im a big time janet fan and i feel sorry for paris,she didnt ask to be brought in this situation. mike and debbie were selfish in the way they chose to have these kids.i notice fans were overjoyed about debbie rowe coming back in her life but did any of you think how paris must feel knowing her mom didnt want her.paris goes to school,everybody know the story about debbie havin them as a 'gift' for mj, now there are new molestation claims,of course mean kids are gonna taunt her.i just think mj fans jump to blame any and everything on the jackson family .i always felt racism played a big part in the demonization of mj's relatives.

excellent observations

Scorp said:

Free2BMe said:

I KNEW THAT I WOULD FORCE YOU TO SAY THAT YOU WERE BANNED ON THE KOP BOARD. YOU MAKE IT SEEM AS IF YOU JUST LEFT. AGAIN, YOU ARE SUCH A LIAR AND MANIPULATOR AND ANYONE WHO BELIEVES ANYTHING YOU SAY IS WEAK-MINDED. BTW,YOU REALLY DO NEED TO GET SOME PSYCHIATRIC HELP FOR YOUR OBSESSION OF MICHAEL. YOU BLAME HIM FOR EVERYTHING THAT HAPPENS AND THAT IS NOT NORMAL. GET YOURSELF CHECKED, YOU REALLY DO NEED HELP!

well look what we have hear......lollllllllllll

I'll let u have your little moral victory...lollllll

and raise your hand in triumph.....

but u lose once again as usual........

get your jip sheet right.......

I left on my own terms and said what I wanted to say in response to all the crap I witnessed on that so called forum since 6/25/2009 and when I did say it, they never saw it coming...

and the fact they never saw it coming was a beautiful moment...so in essence, the truth won out and left with the highest esteem.....so that banning meant absolutely nothing...

I left before they even thought about banning me....I was already 10 steps ahead of them

and who cares if they banned me, that forum is finished anyway.........

you think I'm missing anything reading all that crap and what goes on there......

I aint missin one single iota......

and just so you know before you try and get your rocks off again

there were plenty of people who agreed with what was said in private, but they were afraid to say so in the company of stans for fear they may get banned.....

and that's how tragic this situation is when people feel compelled to take sides about a situation that hasn't been genuine for 27 years.....

so in essence..NOBODY WINS......there is no victors in this........there is so much that has been lost....

there's absolutely nothing else coming down the pike from this entertainer ever again....it is all over...the curtain is close....THIS IS IT....

so go ahead and clap your hands if it makes you feel good, u tell me one person who has won out of all of this.....WHO IS THE WINNER.....WHO IS HOLDING THAT TROPHY....all I see is last place finishes and false starts

[Edited 6/7/13 22:48pm]

Free2BMe said:

alphastreet said:It's heartless to not feel awful about what Katherine is going through right now, fan or not. I HAVE NO DOUBT THAT KATHERINE GRIEVES FOR MICHAEL'S DEATH. HOWEVER, THIS AEG LAWSUIT IS ALL ABOUT $$$$ FOR HER AND HER GROWN KIDS. SHE IS NOT DOING IT FOR JUSTICE AND SHE IS NOT DOING IT FOR MICHAEL'S CHILDREN. SHE USED THEM FOR SYMPATHY TO GET WHAT SHE WANTS. IF SHE REALLY CARED ABOUT MICHAEL OR HIS CHILDREN, SHE WOULDN'T HAVE FILED THIS LAWSUIT.STRANGE THAT SHE WANTED NO RESTITUTION FOR THE MAN WHO MURDERED MICHAEL, CONRAD MURRAY. THIS MEANS THAT MURRAY CAN GET OUT AND BE PAID TO LIE ON MICHAEL DURING INTERVIEWS, BOOKS, ETC. AGAIN, KATHERINE WANTS FOR $$$$$ FOR HER BROKE GROWN CHILDREN. MICHAEL SUPPORTED HER AND ALL HIS SIBLINGS(EXCEPT jANET) WHEN HE WAS ALIVE AND KATHERINE STILL WANTS MONEY NOW THAT HE IS NO LONGER HERE. YOU WOULD THINK THAT HER "BILLIONAIRE" DAUGHTER WOULD GIVE HER SIBLINGS AND PARENTS SOME OF HER SO-CALLED "BILLIONS" SO THAT THEY WON'T CONTINUE LEECHING OFF OF HIS CHILDREN'S MONEY.BTW, I HAVE NEVER SEEN ANYONE ON ANY MJ FAN BOARD CALL KATHERINE JACKSON A "NIGGER". FANS DON'T LIKE WHAT SHE IS DOING BUT I HAVE NEVER READ ANY POST THAT CALLED HER THAT DEROGATORY NAME. i DON'T KNOW WHAT POSTERS ON GOSSIP BOARDS CALL HER, BUT i DO KNOW THAT NO MICHAEL JACKSON FAN CALLS HER THAT ON MJ BOARDS. AGAIN, SCORP LIES AND MANIPULATES THE TRUTH TO FIT HIS AGENDA-TO BASH MICHAEL AND TRY TO MAKE HIS FANS LOOK BAD. SCORP, HAS ISSUES AND PROJECTS THOSE ISSUES ONTO MICHAEL. WHAT A SAD PERSON, THIS PERSON, SCORP, IS.

and this lets me know what you think u know u don't know

and what u do know doesn't count........

because if you haven't seen these derogatory comments......

then either u are blind or "you're blind".....

I don't have to try and make anyone look bad

the majority of his fans do a great job of that on their own......

check out youtube for a change, pull up any clip regarding these 3 kids, or anything related to the family and the relationship to those kids in the past 3 years and see what you come across, it will be all there for u to see...

try TMZ, where some of the most detestable comments known to man have been posted about this family on its website....

try the websites for many of these prominent entertainment sources and it's spread all over the internet like stale jelly..........

and then when you are to witness the real picture of what's really being said, which had NOTHING to do w/the entertainment value but just sheer hatred...then maybe you may start waking up to the reality as to how dreadful this situation really is........

like I said, I don't have to stoop down like a pigeon and try and call someone out there name....I don't have to go bargain basement.........that aint my bag.....

all u got to do is take just ONE single day out of your timely schedule to see what I'm talking about.....it will all be there for u to see....

there are no winners in this......everyone has lost out....

[Edited 6/7/13 22:23pm]