well, if we're gonna hijack the thread a bit (talking about the quality of metal, not just about the racism of some of the well-known bands) I gotta say that both the bands and the fans DESERVE to be arrogant (aka know-it-all-assholes), BECAUSE MAKE NO MISTAKE: in the realm of "real music & real musicians" HEAVY-METAL is KING, followed closely by Jazz

the musicianship of metal is above everything, face it (at least until the mid-90s)

oh, and Motley Crue are racists (perhaps Vince is the exception), of course they are, your typical "niggers don't belong in high-school/college/the gov" scum

Ive always felt a twinge of racism regarding the 'audience' of metal. What always stood out to me was that many artists were avid listeners of rnb, rap, and what have you. It alway appeared that aspect of their influences or enjoyment was lost on the meathead type of audience who flocked to their shows and purchased their music.

Regarding the thought process of some fo the boneheads on that Metal Show, sometimes including Trunk, is that while they are want to stereotyping rap artists as women beaters and criminals etc , they overlook all of the criminal behavior, misognyny and domesticated violence perpetuated by the metal artsist as well. Including their god, Axl Rose and his history of racist comments and hitting women.

Its basically all a double standard thats always been part of the arts as wll as society. Being jailed, abusive to women, drug use etc in rock has alwaysgottena "hell yeah! " stamp of authenticity and artistic rebelliousness but when those same behaviors are exhibited by a black artists..well..you know.

rialb said:

Maybe it just stems from the fact that Heavy Metal is a very aggressive form of music that fosters fanatcal loyalty in its listeners? A large portion of the audience consists of angry young men. Until about the age of fifteen or so I was not very open to other genres of music. I was extremely opinionated and pretty much stuck to hard rock/heavy metal. When I became curious and started exploring the roots of Heavy Metal was when I started getting into other types of music (blues/jazz/R & B) but a lot of people never move beyond Heavy Metal. I know that the vast majority of people I knew in high school who dug Heavy Metal as kids never really moved on and listened to any other kind of music. Maybe too much exposure to just one genre, especially a genre that is often filled with aggression and anger, causes people to turn into assholes?

[Edited 1/6/13 7:41am]

I would say the types of music one likes doesn't really make them or break them (for the most part unless someone is listening to something on the ADL's list of hate! then they have issues). I know of an engineer for the automotives who made a ton of money early on in life. Head to toe tats and listens to the most aggressive heavy metal and actually opened a bunch of tat shops from the money engineering. I also know of others that are in med school and same thing, they like agressive music. I believe musicians just mirror real life. But the days of judging people by the way they dress, cut hair, tats, play video games. Over. Though I would agree for the most part the majority of people never become millionaires. Too much hard work and study for most.

The Metal Show is filth of the lowest level, anyway

leave Classic Metal alone, where it belongs: in the past, like the Roman Empire

JoeTyler said:

well, if we're gonna hijack the thread a bit (talking about the quality of metal, not just about the racism of some of the well-known bands) I gotta say that both the bands and the fans DESERVE to be arrogant (aka know-it-all-assholes), BECAUSE MAKE NO MISTAKE: in the realm of "real music & real musicians" HEAVY-METAL is KING, followed closely by Jazz

the musicianship of metal is above everything, face it (at least until the mid-90s)

oh, and Motley Crue are racists (perhaps Vince is the exception), of course they are, your typical "niggers don't belong in high-school/college/the gov" scum

"Martin Luther brought the Truth the color of are bloods the same" lyrics from the Crue and George Clinton in MoMayhem hiphop video. Yeah, they had moments but they are more complex than that or confused?

Shoot from the hips please

SuperFurryAnimal said:

JoeTyler said:

well, if we're gonna hijack the thread a bit (talking about the quality of metal, not just about the racism of some of the well-known bands) I gotta say that both the bands and the fans DESERVE to be arrogant (aka know-it-all-assholes), BECAUSE MAKE NO MISTAKE: in the realm of "real music & real musicians" HEAVY-METAL is KING, followed closely by Jazz

the musicianship of metal is above everything, face it (at least until the mid-90s)

oh, and Motley Crue are racists (perhaps Vince is the exception), of course they are, your typical "niggers don't belong in high-school/college/the gov" scum

"Martin Luther brought the Truth the color of are bloods the same" lyrics from the Crue and George Clinton in MoMayhem hiphop video. Yeah, they had moments but they are more complex than that or confused?

Shoot from the hips please

Thats Tommy Lee isnt it?

Nikki Sixx on the other hand..calling a security guard the n word and such....

.

[Edited 1/6/13 11:26am]

SuperFurryAnimal said:

rialb said:

Maybe it just stems from the fact that Heavy Metal is a very aggressive form of music that fosters fanatcal loyalty in its listeners? A large portion of the audience consists of angry young men. Until about the age of fifteen or so I was not very open to other genres of music. I was extremely opinionated and pretty much stuck to hard rock/heavy metal. When I became curious and started exploring the roots of Heavy Metal was when I started getting into other types of music (blues/jazz/R & B) but a lot of people never move beyond Heavy Metal. I know that the vast majority of people I knew in high school who dug Heavy Metal as kids never really moved on and listened to any other kind of music. Maybe too much exposure to just one genre, especially a genre that is often filled with aggression and anger, causes people to turn into assholes?

[Edited 1/6/13 7:41am]

I would say the types of music one likes doesn't really make them or break them (for the most part unless someone is listening to something on the ADL's list of hate! then they have issues). I know of an engineer for the automotives who made a ton of money early on in life. Head to toe tats and listens to the most aggressive heavy metal and actually opened a bunch of tat shops from the money engineering. I also know of others that are in med school and same thing, they like agressive music. I believe musicians just mirror real life. But the days of judging people by the way they dress, cut hair, tats, play video games. Over. Though I would agree for the most part the majority of people never become millionaires. Too much hard work and study for most.

Im going with what Prince said, you get the audience U deserve, if you speak or act in a way where only certain TYPES can be your audience you are going to get an audience where they all think that way, like i said i think the THINKING now is much more narrow in all music than it was, people think that because today "interracial" dating etc...are on tv and film and videos that all has changed, but truth is that things are still not OPEN meaning most peoples minds.

rdhull said:

SuperFurryAnimal said:

"Martin Luther brought the Truth the color of are bloods the same" lyrics from the Crue and George Clinton in MoMayhem hiphop video. Yeah, they had moments but they are more complex than that or confused?

Shoot from the hips please

Thats Tommy Lee isnt it?

Nikki Sixx on the other hand..calling a security guard the n word and such....

.

[Edited 1/6/13 11:26am]

Sixx's lyrics from mid 80s.

SuperFurryAnimal said:

rdhull said:

Thats Tommy Lee isnt it?

Nikki Sixx on the other hand..calling a security guard the n word and such....

.

[Edited 1/6/13 11:26am]

Sixx's lyrics from mid 80s.

I guess the 90's took the better out of him:

JoeTyler said:

SuperFurryAnimal said:

Sixx's lyrics from mid 80s.

I guess the 90's took the better out of him:

More of a reaction. The guard punch a girl a bunch of times. Though Sixx was in the wrong with the comment he issued an apology I think the next day. I believe years later he met the security guard and apologized as well. Why did this not ruin him? Do you know if the security guard ever sued? Wonder why no?

JoeTyler said:

SuperFurryAnimal said:

Sixx's lyrics from mid 80s.

I guess the 90's took the better out of him:

This si the exact scene I was talking about. Fuck him and that type of crowd. It explains 75% of the metal scene imo.

SuperFurryAnimal said:

Trunk has a point. The Hall is stretching the definition of Rock N Roll. Public Enemy deserves to be in the Rap Hall of Fame all the way. Rock N Roll music has always been about drums, guitar, bass, vocal, piano/keyboards. Yeah, they collab with Anthrax but look whos in and look whos out.

Gunsnhalen said:

It seems i have learned over the years metal heads can be incredibly stupid.. or incredibly smart.

I am a bit bothered that even in 2013 there seems to be a bit of racism that still comes up in metal. For example i am a fan of the VH1 Classic show ''That Metal Show'' and every time any kind of black person if brought up they are either ''racists'' or ''scumbags''

They freaked out Public Enemy were getting into R&R hall of fame over Deep Purple and Kiss!, and all the comments were either Public Enemy is racists, woman beaters or stupid. I am curious if they do not recall the Public Enemy & Anthrax Collab?

PE was hip-hop but they like RUN-DMC ROCKED lyke a metal band since the beginning, and have influenced and played on the same stagez as bands like Anthrax, Rage, Body Count and many otherz.

diamondpearl1 said:

SuperFurryAnimal said:

Trunk has a point. The Hall is stretching the definition of Rock N Roll. Public Enemy deserves to be in the Rap Hall of Fame all the way. Rock N Roll music has always been about drums, guitar, bass, vocal, piano/keyboards. Yeah, they collab with Anthrax but look whos in and look whos out.

PE was hip-hop but they like RUN-DMC ROCKED lyke a metal band since the beginning, and have influenced and played on the same stagez as bands like Anthrax, Rage, Body Count and many otherz.

Then they are a Rock-n-Roll band?

SuperFurryAnimal said:

diamondpearl1 said:

PE was hip-hop but they like RUN-DMC ROCKED lyke a metal band since the beginning, and have influenced and played on the same stagez as bands like Anthrax, Rage, Body Count and many otherz.

Then they are a Rock-n-Roll band?

Theyre more rock than some of the bands inducted or that are out there.

And rock n roll is all encompassing...this rock shit didnt start off with Led Zeppelin. There's doo-wop, rnb, pop, etc thats a part of the whole mish mash. Fuck the Metal Show stance on what's determined as rock. If they had their way it would be full of Skid Row, Metallica, Malmsteen, etc etc only.

rdhull said:

SuperFurryAnimal said:

Then they are a Rock-n-Roll band?

Theyre more rock than some of the bands inducted or that are out there.

And rock n roll is all encompassing...this rock shit didnt start off with Led Zeppelin. There's doo-wop, rnb, pop, etc thats a part of the whole mish mash. Fuck the Metal Show stance on what's determined as rock. If they had their way it would be full of Skid Row, Metallica, Malmsteen, etc etc only.

THIS

JoeTyler said:

well, if we're gonna hijack the thread a bit (talking about the quality of metal, not just about the racism of some of the well-known bands) I gotta say that both the bands and the fans DESERVE to be arrogant (aka know-it-all-assholes), BECAUSE MAKE NO MISTAKE: in the realm of "real music & real musicians" HEAVY-METAL is KING, followed closely by Jazz

the musicianship of metal is above everything, face it (at least until the mid-90s)

oh, and Motley Crue are racists (perhaps Vince is the exception), of course they are, your typical "niggers don't belong in high-school/college/the gov" scum

I think a lot of blues has way better playing then heavy metal & Doo-Wop

I'm a huge metal fan but to say it's the be all end all of muscianship

I have heard about Nikki Sixx and his rants... i was shocked when he was throwing around the n word since he dated Vanity for quite sometime.

[Edited 1/6/13 12:54pm]

rdhull said:

SuperFurryAnimal said:

"Martin Luther brought the Truth the color of are bloods the same" lyrics from the Crue and George Clinton in MoMayhem hiphop video. Yeah, they had moments but they are more complex than that or confused?

Shoot from the hips please

Thats Tommy Lee isnt it?

Nikki Sixx on the other hand..calling a security guard the n word and such....

.

[Edited 1/6/13 11:26am]

Sixx is the only Crue member I know that has said some racial shit. The other guys pretty much are anti-racists. Mars is neutral since no one asks him anything. But I know Vince and Tommy don't give a fuck about race. Sixx has a chip on his shoulder though.

Timmy84 said:

rdhull said:

Thats Tommy Lee isnt it?

Nikki Sixx on the other hand..calling a security guard the n word and such....

.

[Edited 1/6/13 11:26am]

Sixx is the only Crue member I know that has said some racial shit. The other guys pretty much are anti-racists. Mars is neutral since no one asks him anything. But I know Vince and Tommy don't give a fuck about race. Sixx has a chip on his shoulder though.

Tommy also has performed with many rappers & is cool with Missy Elliot & Snoop

Don't yall remember her rap group Mayhem as well?

rdhull said:

SuperFurryAnimal said:

Then they are a Rock-n-Roll band?

Theyre more rock than some of the bands inducted or that are out there.

And rock n roll is all encompassing...this rock shit didnt start off with Led Zeppelin. There's doo-wop, rnb, pop, etc thats a part of the whole mish mash. Fuck the Metal Show stance on what's determined as rock. If they had their way it would be full of Skid Row, Metallica, Malmsteen, etc etc only.

Right. Rock and roll was once just another name for R&B music (which debuted around 1948 or 1949) that had a backbeat with gospel vocals and blues lyrics, aka the "devil's music" as the hardcore Christians once called it. Rock music (classic rock, hard rock, heavy metal, etc.) is actually a subgenre of rock and roll. PE definitely had more of a rock and roll edge than their peers. I don't watch the Metal Show either for the reasoning you just gave. And the host is a dick lol

[Edited 1/6/13 12:37pm]

Gunsnhalen said:

Timmy84 said:

Sixx is the only Crue member I know that has said some racial shit. The other guys pretty much are anti-racists. Mars is neutral since no one asks him anything. But I know Vince and Tommy don't give a fuck about race. Sixx has a chip on his shoulder though.

Tommy also has performed with many rappers & is cool with Missy Elliot & Snoop

Don't yall remember her rap group Mayhem as well?

I remembered them well enough lol

Gunsnhalen said:

JoeTyler said:

well, if we're gonna hijack the thread a bit (talking about the quality of metal, not just about the racism of some of the well-known bands) I gotta say that both the bands and the fans DESERVE to be arrogant (aka know-it-all-assholes), BECAUSE MAKE NO MISTAKE: in the realm of "real music & real musicians" HEAVY-METAL is KING, followed closely by Jazz

the musicianship of metal is above everything, face it (at least until the mid-90s)

oh, and Motley Crue are racists (perhaps Vince is the exception), of course they are, your typical "niggers don't belong in high-school/college/the gov" scum

I think a lot of blues has way better playing then heavy metal & Doo-Wop

I'm a huge metal fan but to say it's the be all end all of muscianship

I know right? I dig metal but come on let's be real for a minute lol

Gunsnhalen said:

rdhull said:

Theyre more rock than some of the bands inducted or that are out there.

And rock n roll is all encompassing...this rock shit didnt start off with Led Zeppelin. There's doo-wop, rnb, pop, etc thats a part of the whole mish mash. Fuck the Metal Show stance on what's determined as rock. If they had their way it would be full of Skid Row, Metallica, Malmsteen, etc etc only.

THIS

I would say Beasties and DMC were more Rock(at times) but PE moreso Rap. They deserve credit but more for being Rap imo than Rap-Rock.

I also don't buy that stance. You never hear them complaining about Prince, Chuck Berry, BB King, P-Funk being inducted. More like pissed that certain artists are excluded, like KISS.

Timmy84 said:

Gunsnhalen said:

I think a lot of blues has way better playing then heavy metal & Doo-Wop

I'm a huge metal fan but to say it's the be all end all of muscianship

I know right? I dig metal but come on let's be real for a minute lol

But you know joe is a joker... i can't tell if he is also parodying metal heads or being serious

Clever you Mr. Tyler

Gunsnhalen said:

Timmy84 said:

I know right? I dig metal but come on let's be real for a minute lol

But you know joe is a joker... i can't tell if he is also parodying metal heads or being serious

Clever you Mr. Tyler

I think he's fucking around but who knows?

Gunsnhalen said:

.. i was shocked when he was throwing around the n word since he dated Vanity for wuite sometime.

THATS what fuckin kills me lol.

Sixx has a radio show and he 'appears' to be a cool guy at this time but when I meet him (and I will), I will ask him about his thoughts on racism and the situation up that was shown on youtube.

I mean its something when you get angry at someone for even logical reasons, but to automaticlly go to racial, ethnic, or homophobic epithets to express your anger...thats quite telling imho.

rdhull said:

Gunsnhalen said:

.. i was shocked when he was throwing around the n word since he dated Vanity for wuite sometime.

THATS what fuckin kills me lol.

Sixx has a radio show and he 'appears' to be a cool guy at this time but when I meet him (and I will), I will ask him about his thoughts on racism and the situation up that was shown on youtube.

I mean its something when you get angry at someone for even logical reasons, but to automaticlly go to racial, ethnic, or homophobic epithets to express your anger...thats quite telling imho.

I wonder if he even expounded on that... I'm gonna go on his Wikipedia page.

Gunsnhalen said:

Timmy84 said:

Sixx is the only Crue member I know that has said some racial shit. The other guys pretty much are anti-racists. Mars is neutral since no one asks him anything. But I know Vince and Tommy don't give a fuck about race. Sixx has a chip on his shoulder though.

Tommy also has performed with many rappers & is cool with Missy Elliot & Snoop

Don't yall remember her rap group Mayhem as well?

Oh, I always knew Lee and company were cool even when it was popular for folks to clown on him way back when. Ive been searching for the soundtrack to Barb Wire for over a decade to get his MOM jam and a few other artists (rock version of Word Up) songs from it.

I think this is why I was disappointed to hear Nikki act like that....because even though the Crue audience were probably ...how do I put this.....er..probably current Fox News Republican tea Partiers..I always felt the dudes were not like that.

Timmy84 said:

rdhull said:

THATS what fuckin kills me lol.

Sixx has a radio show and he 'appears' to be a cool guy at this time but when I meet him (and I will), I will ask him about his thoughts on racism and the situation up that was shown on youtube.

I mean its something when you get angry at someone for even logical reasons, but to automaticlly go to racial, ethnic, or homophobic epithets to express your anger...thats quite telling imho.

I wonder if he even expounded on that... I'm gonna go on his Wikipedia page.

He probably did..publicly..but I am going to talk to him one on one..no publicists written statement..Im just going to ask him.

These dudes freak when u talk to them sans entourage....but its man to man and more honest imo

rdhull said:

Timmy84 said:

I wonder if he even expounded on that... I'm gonna go on his Wikipedia page.

He probably did..publicly..but I am going to talk to him one on one..no publicists written statement..Im just going to ask him.

These dudes freak when u talk to them sans entourage....but its man to man and more honest imo

Cool. I just think Sixx is a weirdo...and probably really dumb.

Timmy84 said:

rdhull said:

He probably did..publicly..but I am going to talk to him one on one..no publicists written statement..Im just going to ask him.

These dudes freak when u talk to them sans entourage....but its man to man and more honest imo

Cool. I just think Sixx is a weirdo...and probably really dumb.

@ weirdo

too me he seems like he could be kind of cool