It's not just naomi campbell, or Tatiana. Brook Shields..Look at how giggly she was at the 1984 Grammy Awards. Check out how she is holding his hand tight, and when they are in the limo. She is gorgous, not a groupie and wants to be his women.

But he didn't want her. Weird....She said they were just friends in the end, because i think she got frustrated that he didn't want her like that. She gave up, and was like aiight this is my buddy ole PAL

Brooke wanted Mike in the early 80s.....He just didn't want her or Tatiana. Kinda strange

BabyBeMine said:

It's not just naomi campbell, or Tatiana. Brook Shields..Look at how giggly she was at the 1984 Grammy Awards. Check out how she is holding his hand tight, and when they are in the limo. She is gorgous, not a groupie and wants to be his women.

But he didn't want her. Weird....She said they were just friends in the end, because i think she got frustrated that he didn't want her like that. She gave up, and was like aiight this is my buddy ole PAL

Brooke wanted Mike in the early 80s.....He just didn't want her or Tatiana. Kinda strange

why is it strange? i'm just not getting why it's so strange. there's guys i hold hands with and are affectionate with, and i don't want them sexually either. it seems to me, at least according to the interviews he did with boteach, that he didn't trust most women. he thought they 'all' used their sexuality to get what they wanted.

so i get it. i don't think any women really fit his criteria. women were just temptresses. lisa marie was perfect because she was already in the business, and recognized his experiences. i think it made total sense for them to be together.

i guess i'm not seeing where you're getting at... why you feel it's so strange for a man to not have women all over the place. if a man didn't have women all over the place sexually, i'd be apt to trust him more in a physical relationship. i wouldn't want to be with someone who has been with 2,000 women . i'm exaggerating, but i hope you get my point.

i'd rather hang out with someone who values relationships in the way i feel michael did. someone who didn't sleep around.

Brooke Shields and Tatiana didn't have a history of being "out there" like that when they first met MJ. So i find it strange a young man with two very attractive women wanting him, he doesn't want them. Had he been in relationships outside of that, than you can say maybe he was with someone...ETC...MJ was in 0 relationships up until Lisa Maria. And that was after the allegations which makes it fishy.

So now in 1994 he wants to be with a women who already has twp kids in Lisa Maria....nothing wrong with that.....But Brooke and Tatiana had no kids at the time he was close to them.

It's kinda like he rushed the Lisa Marie situation. She already had a "BABY DADDY"..lol....still maried, but now MJ is like oh well with the jehovah witness thing, let's get married.

BabyBeMine said:

Brooke Shields and Tatiana didn't have a history of being "out there" like that when they first met MJ. So i find it strange a young man with two very attractive women wanting him, he doesn't want them. Had he been in relationships outside of that, than you can say maybe he was with someone...ETC...MJ was in 0 relationships up until Lisa Maria. And that was after the allegations which makes it fishy.

So now in 1994 he wants to be with a women who already has twp kids in Lisa Maria....nothing wrong with that.....But Brooke and Tatiana had no kids at the time he was close to them.

It's kinda like he rushed the Lisa Marie situation. She already had a "BABY DADDY"..lol....still maried, but now MJ is like oh well with the jehovah witness thing, let's get married.

it seems as if you are assuming that HE thinks they are attractive, because YOU think they are attractive.

sure he may think they are pretty, but perhaps he was not sexually attracted to them. again, he has openly acknowledged that his ideal was diana ross. no one really compared to her. why are you assuming because these women are beautiful, he sould want them?

michael also stated to boteach that when he married lisa marie, she promised him a baby. so in my mind, i'm thinking that he got married to have some kids (the JW/moral thing perhaps?), and that if she was not gonna give him kids he would not have married her. they got a divorce because of this very thing.

debbie rowe had his kids, and they got married when she was pregnant. i don't think- again, this is my perception- that he was thinking about anything other than having kids. i think he loved lisa marie, but he was very clear in his intent. and so was she. they seemed to fare better as friends than married.

he wanted to adopt her kids, be she stated, 'the kids already have a father.'

i don't think it's that weird that, if this was the case, he was never in a sexual/romantic relationship before lisa marie. again, WHY is this weird??!! even if he was 48 years old and never had a sexual relationship i still would not find that weird. it's only weird in the context of how we view sexuality.

perhaps he knew his days were numbered in terms of hanging out with kids after the allegations, so he fought harder to have children of his own to raise. i don't know; again, i'm not in his head.

I'm with MJJStudent... I don't see anything weird about MJ's lack of relationships. Nobody can claim to understand Michael on that level as far as his personal reasons for having or not having relationships. If you want to contextualise it with sexual psychology, what we know for a fact is that Michael was exposed to things that he shouldn't have been at such a young age. And according to some, that's not the worst of it, but I don't wanna go down that road right now.

I also do not believe at all, that Lisa Marie would ever marry somebody that she was not in love with and was not sexually involved with. That doesn't fit her personality, AT ALL.

BabyBeMine said:

It's not just naomi campbell, or Tatiana. Brook Shields..Look at how giggly she was at the 1984 Grammy Awards. Check out how she is holding his hand tight, and when they are in the limo. She is gorgous, not a groupie and wants to be his women.

But he didn't want her. Weird....She said they were just friends in the end, because i think she got frustrated that he didn't want her like that. She gave up, and was like aiight this is my buddy ole PAL

Brooke wanted Mike in the early 80s.....He just didn't want her or Tatiana. Kinda strange

Here is it again: a guy who CANNOT UNDERSTAND how a man won’t jump at once on “A CHICK” (!!!!!) if she wants him to

@BabyBeMine, excuse me, but

- you are not exactly in the age of the youthful fans with their hormons playing crazy and imagination going wild

- you are a friend of a Jackson family member (according to you) and have some inside knowledge about the goings-on of the showbusiness

So, HOW ON EARTH do you want to make conclusions about “what Brooke wanted” onhand of her facial expression DURING A PUBLIC APPEARANCE????

Let alone about what her mother wanted – what was far more essential to that timepoint... You CERTAINLY know it as “insider”, don’t you?

Let alone that you are bringing in this topic for the 100^th time – and it’s getting… tiresome

MJJstudent said:

a first-person view of the O2 announcement, 2 years ago:

around the 9 minute mark is really sad. even this person could tell something was wrong with him.

[Edited 3/6/11 2:33am]

God I can't believe it was two years ago...

I remember I rushed home from Calculus class just to catch the announcement online...

I better shut up about that before I start crying and ruin everybody's good time.

BabyBeMine said:

Brooke Shields and Tatiana didn't have a history of being "out there" like that when they first met MJ. So i find it strange a young man with two very attractive women wanting him, he doesn't want them. Had he been in relationships outside of that, than you can say maybe he was with someone...ETC...MJ was in 0 relationships up until Lisa Maria. And that was after the allegations which makes it fishy.

So now in 1994 he wants to be with a women who already has twp kids in Lisa Maria....nothing wrong with that.....But Brooke and Tatiana had no kids at the time he was close to them.

It's kinda like he rushed the Lisa Marie situation. She already had a "BABY DADDY"..lol....still maried, but now MJ is like oh well with the jehovah witness thing, let's get married.

...So you're all-knowing and you can say for sure what MJ always thought and whether he wanted this or that person?

Hell, you can't even spell "Lisa Marie" correctly.

MJJstudent said:

BabyBeMine said:

http://www.youtube.com/wa...2JX2ouhr_8

Instead of Tatiana, Brookie Shields or simply a lady sitting on his lap and chillin with him on tour, MJ chose to have Jordy Chandler. Kinda strange. I mean the kid was 13....Not 5

13 sitting on the lap of a grown man not related. What 13 year old MALE kids are still sitting on the lap of a grown man? Not black kids

i've seen it though. i've seen it in non-u.s., non-european cultures. i'm just sayin', it's not always about sexuality. for many people around the world, what michael does is not weird. which may be why he's more accepted outside of the u.s. who knows...

i think everything is according to context, and out personal preferences and perspectives... my perspective is that his public persona in relation to sexuality was most likely a reaction to the uber-masculinity of the other males in his family. perhaps that's why he maintained the high pitched voice for so many years... you never know.

and even if michael WAS gay, why does it matter? i don't think he was, but if he were, so what? i don't think that takes away from his art or intent.

[Edited 3/6/11 3:17am]

[Edited 3/6/11 3:20am]

I'm with MJJStudent on this..

a man who loves children is not considered a wierdo in other cultures. I know in the culture I was raised in it's not (i.e Traditional Egyptian). Men are kind to children, buy them candy or toys, have them sit on their laps, give them hugs or kisses, etc. It's more of a fatherly role than anything else..

Just because Michael preferred the company of children more often than women doesn't imply much about his sexuality. Michael was a very shy individual who liked women (as MJJStudent and I discussed in great detail in the last thread ) and spent a good majority of his time admiring them from afar. I think around children he didn't feel so strange and awkward. He didn't have to impress them, or keep up an act with them. He could be himself around them. Ain't nothin' wrong with that. If you want to be amongst a group of people that make you feel comfortable and at ease that's you're prerogative. I mean, I know I like other men and clearly know my sexuality, but I don't want to be around them all the time. I'm extremely shy around men when I see them I can't even look them in the eye. I also like to be around children, or animals. Does that make me strange or abnormal? No it doesn't. So why imply that MJ is strange that way?

And yes, even if Michael was a gay man, that doesn't detract from his music or his message. I personally do not think he was, neither does his family, his lady friends, his other close friends, etc.

[Edited 3/6/11 7:18am]

BabyBeMine said:

I think the topic of dissing the sexuality of other's should be a topic MJ fans should stay off, because your gonna get your feelings hurt. Stick to the music topics.

Let's break it down

1. 1988/1989 - Tatiana - The weak excuse of Michael's manager Frank Dileo kicked her off the tour. That is the weakest excuse of any musician in music history. If the artist is feelin the lady,and wants her, he will put his manager in his place. Bottom line, MJ didn't want that fine looking lady.

2. 1993 Dangerous Tour - MJ spent more time with kids than Women. Not saying he did anything inappropriate, but he wasn't chillin with Tatiana or attractive ladies. He was rolling around with Jordy Chandler, and sleeping in the same hotel rooms, and bed. I thought you liked women? Yo Jordy the day has been fun, you and your mom can stay in room 464, while me and the lady are in room 466.....Umm....Jordy Chandler's mom looked kinda NICE....But MJ wanted to be with Jordy.....Like i said, im not saying he did anything inappropriate, but the average guy is gonna be like daaaaaamn. Is that your mom?

3. Once the allegations broke...Now he is in to the ladies all of a sudden and has Lisa Marie kiss him at the 1994 MTV Music awars. Had those allegations never broke, he and Lisa never would have gotten married. It was MJ's plan to try and look straight to the world.

There is no evidence supporting MJ really being in to the ladies. Just HYPE to make him look good to the public. What was he doing before the allegations? Umm allowing Tatiana to get kicked off the tour...Why? Because he didn't like the kiss from a female, and put the blame on Frank Dileo

A artist makes all the decisions....Look Frank, the chick is HOT...She is staying on this tour. if you don't like it you can BOUNCE.....

[Edited 3/6/11 2:47am]

Didn't it come out that Michael was courting the mother? I know Joseph confirmed this and during the trial T-Mez was definitely hinting towards this. Didn't she have access to credit cards, private jets, and received multiple jewelry/gift from Michael? She spent private time with Michael also without her children even being around. It seemed like Michael was very into her and was trying to form a family with her and the kids.

Ever thought he was around the kids to get close to the mothers? lol

Isn't it possible that Michael kept his personal relationship private and dated women outsids the entertainment biz? We really dun know who he was with..to put it simply.

I think time has proven that Tatiana was an obsessed fan and got a bit too close for comfort. Such a short time together yet she's written 2 books, changed her name and even names her pets after MJ? She's worse than any of the online wackos.

BabyBeMine said:

I think the topic of dissing the sexuality of other's should be a topic MJ fans should stay off, because your gonna get your feelings hurt. Stick to the music topics.

Let's break it down

1. 1988/1989 - Tatiana - The weak excuse of Michael's manager Frank Dileo kicked her off the tour. That is the weakest excuse of any musician in music history. If the artist is feelin the lady,and wants her, he will put his manager in his place. Bottom line, MJ didn't want that fine looking lady.

2. 1993 Dangerous Tour - MJ spent more time with kids than Women. Not saying he did anything inappropriate, but he wasn't chillin with Tatiana or attractive ladies. He was rolling around with Jordy Chandler, and sleeping in the same hotel rooms, and bed. I thought you liked women? Yo Jordy the day has been fun, you and your mom can stay in room 464, while me and the lady are in room 466.....Umm....Jordy Chandler's mom looked kinda NICE....But MJ wanted to be with Jordy.....Like i said, im not saying he did anything inappropriate, but the average guy is gonna be like daaaaaamn. Is that your mom?

3. Once the allegations broke...Now he is in to the ladies all of a sudden and has Lisa Marie kiss him at the 1994 MTV Music awars. Had those allegations never broke, he and Lisa never would have gotten married. It was MJ's plan to try and look straight to the world.

There is no evidence supporting MJ really being in to the ladies. Just HYPE to make him look good to the public. What was he doing before the allegations? Umm allowing Tatiana to get kicked off the tour...Why? Because he didn't like the kiss from a female, and put the blame on Frank Dileo

A artist makes all the decisions....Look Frank, the chick is HOT...She is staying on this tour. if you don't like it you can BOUNCE.....

[Edited 3/6/11 2:47am]

Why are you here?

NOTe : Babybemine is back with her/his pathetic yet astounding trolling skills

BabyBeMine said:

Brooke Shields and Tatiana didn't have a history of being "out there" like that when they first met MJ. So i find it strange a young man with two very attractive women wanting him, he doesn't want them. Had he been in relationships outside of that, than you can say maybe he was with someone...ETC...MJ was in 0 relationships up until Lisa Maria. And that was after the allegations which makes it fishy.

So now in 1994 he wants to be with a women who already has twp kids in Lisa Maria....nothing wrong with that.....But Brooke and Tatiana had no kids at the time he was close to them.

It's kinda like he rushed the Lisa Marie situation. She already had a "BABY DADDY"..lol....still maried, but now MJ is like oh well with the jehovah witness thing, let's get married.

1- stop lying

2- Insider my ass , you are not an insider and you don't know shit about mJ or the jacksons

3- you're basically talking out of your ass...hogwash

4- you said some baseless questionable shit in the past, they were all wrong and baseless ,still talking shit till this day..

5- Your crediblity is Zero

6- log off and stop tainting your king threads....

Firstly, publically Michael was not in a serious relationship BEFORE or AFTER the allegations (if you don't count his marriages). He even has a third child that NOBODY knows the mother of. Yeah, surrogate mother he didn't know....right...and what about that story he told the first time around - someone he had a relatiohship with. Why is that so forgotten? (I remember reading a story about Mike meeting Siegried and Roy during the time the public was learning that he might have another child, that Mike came with a third child and that the only thing he told them about Blanket was that he was a "surprise". How can a child from surrogate that you paid for be a surprise?) I think it would make sense he wanted to protect the mother and not just her, but all his women. We even found out about Lisa months after their wedding and about Debbie when she was several months pregnant. It's very obvious that Mike never wanted to make these things public and forget about that kiss. Once he got finally married, should he have kept her at home and not get out? Are they truly the only celebrity couple who kissed in the public? I think that today's standard is a release of a home porn. I don't get the hype about that stupid kiss.

Secondly, Lisa Marie even Priscilla confirmed that their relatioship started BEFORE the allegations. He even expressed interest in her YEARS before, but Lisa turned him down back then. I can't see this as business cause Lisa had nothing to gain from this. I think she rather suffered from this relationship in the public eye.

Thirdly, I can understand that someone so obsessed like Tatiana might have turned him off no matter how pretty she can be.

I am with MJJStudent on this.

[Edited 3/6/11 10:43am]

Timmy84 said:

Love this.

MJJstudent said:

ViintageJunkiie said:

Damn, MJ wore that outfit OUT!

he sho did. SHAMON!

i thought that was all the same day lol

mimi07 said:

MJJstudent said:

he sho did. SHAMON!

i thought that was all the same day lol

by the way he wore it, I wouldve hoped so! But all different days

Timmy84 said:

Diana was at the top balcony getting her life from this performance!

i would have loved for him to do something intimate like this but when he became the king of pop everything had to be larger than life glitz and glamour

[Edited 3/6/11 11:22am]

Have you read the Estate's reinforced lawsuit against Melissa Johnson and Mann? After all, it was Joe and Katherine who went after/went looking for Melissa and Mann, not the contrary. It was the parents who architected the HTWF scheme and who came up with the shady deals and are now using their son to avoid having Mann sued. It was them who partnered with Vaccaro and Mann and it was them coming up with all the schemes. Greedy is no longer string enough to describre those "parents". They are activelly trying to destroy their son's estate and making scheme after scheme to milk his name and kids for all they are worth. Just read the reinforced lawsuit and you'll puke. How is it even possible that there are parents like Katherine and Joe?

MOL said:

Have you read the Estate's reinforced lawsuit against Melissa Johnson and Mann? After all, it was Joe and Katherine who went after/went looking for Melissa and Mann, not the contrary. It was the parents who architected the HTWF scheme and who came up with the shady deals and are now using their son to avoid having Mann sued. It was them who partnered with Vaccaro and Mann and it was them coming up with all the schemes. Greedy is no longer string enough to describre those "parents". They are activelly trying to destroy their son's estate and making scheme after scheme to milk his name and kids for all they are worth. Just read the reinforced lawsuit and you'll puke. How is it even possible that there are parents like Katherine and Joe?

I see Miss positivity is here

clearly this poster has an agenda

armpit said:

BabyBeMine said:

Brooke Shields and Tatiana didn't have a history of being "out there" like that when they first met MJ. So i find it strange a young man with two very attractive women wanting him, he doesn't want them. Had he been in relationships outside of that, than you can say maybe he was with someone...ETC...MJ was in 0 relationships up until Lisa Maria. And that was after the allegations which makes it fishy.

So now in 1994 he wants to be with a women who already has twp kids in Lisa Maria....nothing wrong with that.....But Brooke and Tatiana had no kids at the time he was close to them.

It's kinda like he rushed the Lisa Marie situation. She already had a "BABY DADDY"..lol....still maried, but now MJ is like oh well with the jehovah witness thing, let's get married.

...So you're all-knowing and you can say for sure what MJ always thought and whether he wanted this or that person?

Hell, you can't even spell "Lisa Marie" correctly.

Weather i spelled Lisa correctly or not it is strange to have Jordy Chandler in his room for consecutive day's instead of Jordy's mom or another female. Again im not saying he did anything inappropriate, but sending Jordy's mom off shopping with money, and he and Jordy in the hotel room every night...Little strange. It's like give mom cash so she can get the heck away from here.

seeingvoices12 said:

NOTe : Babybemine is back with her/his pathetic yet astounding trolling skills

BabyBeMine said:

Brooke Shields and Tatiana didn't have a history of being "out there" like that when they first met MJ. So i find it strange a young man with two very attractive women wanting him, he doesn't want them. Had he been in relationships outside of that, than you can say maybe he was with someone...ETC...MJ was in 0 relationships up until Lisa Maria. And that was after the allegations which makes it fishy.

So now in 1994 he wants to be with a women who already has twp kids in Lisa Maria....nothing wrong with that.....But Brooke and Tatiana had no kids at the time he was close to them.

It's kinda like he rushed the Lisa Marie situation. She already had a "BABY DADDY"..lol....still maried, but now MJ is like oh well with the jehovah witness thing, let's get married.

1- stop lying

2- Insider my ass , you are not an insider and you don't know shit about mJ or the jacksons

3- you're basically talking out of your ass...hogwash

4- you said some baseless questionable shit in the past, they were all wrong and baseless ,still talking shit till this day..

5- Your crediblity is Zero

6- log off and stop tainting your king threads....

So your saying it's not true that MJ and jordy spend a lot of time in Michaels' hotel room. Im lying about this. Prove it's a lie. MJ cried when Jordy's mom was wondering what was going on.

Again no prove of guilt, but don't sound right. Ok im done.

BabyBeMine said:

seeingvoices12 said:

NOTe : Babybemine is back with her/his pathetic yet astounding trolling skills

1- stop lying

2- Insider my ass , you are not an insider and you don't know shit about mJ or the jacksons

3- you're basically talking out of your ass...hogwash

4- you said some baseless questionable shit in the past, they were all wrong and baseless ,still talking shit till this day..

5- Your crediblity is Zero

6- log off and stop tainting your king threads....

So your saying it's not true that MJ and jordy spend a lot of time in Michaels' hotel room. Im lying about this. Prove it's a lie. MJ cried when Jordy's mom was wondering what was going on.

Again no prove of guilt, but don't sound right. Ok im done.

How do you know? Were you there?

smoothcriminal12 said:

BabyBeMine said:

So your saying it's not true that MJ and jordy spend a lot of time in Michaels' hotel room. Im lying about this. Prove it's a lie. MJ cried when Jordy's mom was wondering what was going on.

Again no prove of guilt, but don't sound right. Ok im done.

How do you know? Were you there?

BabyBeMine said:

I think the topic of dissing the sexuality of other's should be a topic MJ fans should stay off, because your gonna get your feelings hurt. Stick to the music topics.

[img:$uid]http://i.imgur.com/PGr3K.jpg[/img:$uid]

I was wondering where you went. I have to say...I miss lol'ing @ a good chunk of your posts.

BabyBeMine said:

seeingvoices12 said:

So your saying it's not true that MJ and jordy spend a lot of time in Michaels' hotel room. Im lying about this. Prove it's a lie. MJ cried when Jordy's mom was wondering what was going on.

Again no prove of guilt, but don't sound right. Ok im done.

NO, you are not lying, she testified so in the court. But this is not about you lying or not lying, it is about the STUPIDITY of your discussion habits.

Ppl. could comment however they want on your input - say, about Brooke - and you will answer to it always the same: "But look at her face on the picture!"

One could try and extensively discuss with you MJ's situation, Brooke's situation, society's peculiarities of that time and dozens of possible reasons why-why-why MJ might not have wanted Brooke - ten pages later your only answer will still be: "BUT LOOK AT HER FACE ON THE PICTURE!"

That is, until somebody here would explode and tell you to go to hell - then you'd leave - to return few months later saying: "Hey, check Brooke's face on the picture! Isn't it strange that MJ didn't want her?!"

Sorry, @BabyBeMine, I hate it to be offensive, but you'd drive anybody.

Jesus... Anyway, I am glad that something had finally convinced you on MJ's innocence of child molestation - at least, this type of discussion will be spared to me and everybody else here

smoothcriminal12 said:

BabyBeMine said:

So your saying it's not true that MJ and jordy spend a lot of time in Michaels' hotel room. Im lying about this. Prove it's a lie. MJ cried when Jordy's mom was wondering what was going on.

Again no prove of guilt, but don't sound right. Ok im done.

How do you know? Were you there?

NO, TrollyBemine is making things up....Pathetic.

Militant said:

Not to take the thread off topic, but Tony, Farrakhan has pretty much admitted his role in Malcolm's death at this point.

OFF-TOPIC: But it was NOT Farrakhan OR Elijah that gave out the direct order to kill Malcolm. There were "double agents" that were playing off both sides of the divide. The only thing Farrakhan was ever guilty of was allowing his war of words with Malcolm through the news media to go too far. Moments like THIS did not help the situation any and it definitely played on Farrakhn's guilty conscience for decades.

Even in his own autobiography, Malcolm was able to figured out just weeks before his own murder that the people that really wanted him dead were someone/something that was bigger and far more deadlier than the Nation Of Islam. I know the words "Illuminati" & "secret societies" gets thrown around a lot, but that just about sums up what Malcolm was hinting at.

BTW, did you know that Malcolm & Louis were Freemasons? Did you know that both men were fully aware about the existence of the ancient mystery schools that specialize in using symbolism, as well as hi-jack other religions (especially Christianity)? See there, there are plenty of things about Malcolm X & Louis Farrakhan that has not been told by anyone until these recent years within our modern-day information age. And yet, it's a damn shame that some critics out there that still want to find Farrakhan guilty for a murder that he never committed.

BACK ON TOPIC: I still stand by my words in the previous post that Michael & Randy did the right thing by having Farrakhan as their ally, especially when there were already some people in the media (Oprah included) that were writing Michael off as guilty until proven innocent.