IanRG said:

Get it up, get it up

I'll work u all night

LoveGalore said:

IanRG said:

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That is 1 mistake (other than spelling errors) by me freely admitted.

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Whereas you have made more errors than posts, and you cannot address any of them. Lets address the biggy - Have you found any gay men in Minneapolis in 1980 that were more of an inspiration for Prince's clothes than Glam Rockers, Funkadelic and androgynous fashions in Prince's formative years?

Get it up, get it up I'll work u all night

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Just remember they serve you dinner at 3pm.

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Obviously you still cannot provide any evidence for you fantasy because you know your fantasy is based on you lying to yourself - Prince was not gay and most men in Minneapolis in 1980 would have failed your gay check list. You know both of these to be true.

.

And yet... the man himself told Oprah that he had multiple personalities, at least one of which was female.

When asked by Oprah about gay rumors, he said, Whatever floats the boat.

And yet... when Chris Rock tried to lead him away from all that ambiguity, saying that his femininity was just an act, just him being provocative, Prince severely disappointed his questioner by saying that it was just who he was. (I forget the exact words, but I remember that sad look on Chris's straight face.)

I'll admit it's a bit surprising that all these years later, no smoking gun, as it were, was ever uncovered. But would anyone on the planet be shocked if it was? Anyone not in Australia?

(For the record, I am gay, but I really didn't think of Prince that way. It would be like fantasizing about Jesus or some other mythic creature, a wood nymph or something.)

PJMcGee said:

🎯💯

PJMcGee said:

Yeah, crazy. I have a few gay friends who've said, "Oh yes I'd definitely sleep with him." and I'm just like... What? He's not even a him, he's a force of nature or something. How do you have sex with the wind? Prince was cool af, he inspired a thousand different things in every kind of person. I think that was clearly always part of the point of that Paisley Park vibe - he was everyone and everything and therefore the gates were open to everyone.

PJMcGee said:

And yet... the man himself told Oprah that he had multiple personalities, at least one of which was female. When asked by Oprah about gay rumors, he said, Whatever floats the boat. And yet... when Chris Rock tried to lead him away from all that ambiguity, saying that his femininity was just an act, just him being provocative, Prince severely disappointed his questioner by saying that it was just who he was. (I forget the exact words, but I remember that sad look on Chris's straight face.)

I don't see what is disappointing with his answer. Prince being in touch with his feminine side was not an act (that's what he meant when he said he was being himself), now the extreme flamboyance was him being provocative hence the "a little bit of acting" comment.

Chris Rock being disappointed (I didn't look at it this way) speaks more about his internalized homophobia than anything else.

Prince"teased" his audience from the Dirty Mind/Controversy era all the way until "Under The Cherry Moon" ( those scenes with Jerome). He really seemed to get a kick out of it.

LoveGalore said:

I like how he brought it full circle with that Affirmation.

You’ve probably felt for many years in your former life
That you were separate from not only others, but even yourself
Now you can see that was never the case
You are actually everything and anything that you can think of
All of it is you

[...]

Remember there is really only one destination
And that place is you
All of it
Everything
Is you


Prince is magic.

paisleyparkgirl said:

Absolutely. He probably got teased for his fandom and wanted Prince to put it all to rest. "See, guys, it's an act! He's not gay! I'm not gay for loving him! Guys?"

Can't U just trust me?
If I was your girlfriend U could
Oh, yeah, I think so

~ Prince Rogers Nelson

paisleyparkgirl said:

PJMcGee said:

And yet... the man himself told Oprah that he had multiple personalities, at least one of which was female. When asked by Oprah about gay rumors, he said, Whatever floats the boat. And yet... when Chris Rock tried to lead him away from all that ambiguity, saying that his femininity was just an act, just him being provocative, Prince severely disappointed his questioner by saying that it was just who he was. (I forget the exact words, but I remember that sad look on Chris's straight face.)

I don't see what is disappointing with his answer. Prince being in touch with his feminine side was not an act (that's what he meant when he said he was being himself), now the extreme flamboyance was him being provocative hence the "a little bit of acting" comment.

Chris Rock being disappointed (I didn't look at it this way) speaks more about his internalized homophobia than anything else.

Prince"teased" his audience from the Dirty Mind/Controversy era all the way until "Under The Cherry Moon" ( those scenes with Jerome). He really seemed to get a kick out of it.

its both things i think.

he liked it. that was just him. but he also knew it would provoke people. and he enjoyed that.

RJOrion said:

Can't U just trust me? If I was your girlfriend U could Oh, yeah, I think so ~ Prince Rogers Nelson

Some of y'all really want to see what you see. This song is about Prince being jealous of the relationship between Wendy and Susannah. It was confirmed by them.

paisleyparkgirl said:

Yes, we know. But do you think that would ever occur to, say, Bruce Springsteen?

PJMcGee said:

I see somebody gets it

PJMcGee said:

paisleyparkgirl said:

Some of y'all really want to see what you see. This song is about Prince being jealous of the relationship between Wendy and Susannah. It was confirmed by them.

Yes, we know. But do you think that would ever occur to, say, Bruce Springsteen?

That was not his brand to begin with. He played with the Gemini thing a lot.

Ambiguity was Prince's brand. Same way he sings about his sister taking his virginity at 16 ("Sister") then years later writes about his first time at 16 with Carrie on the "Schoolyard".

paisleyparkgirl said:

Youre assuming alot, considering you have no first hand knowledge from Prince, concerning what his inspiration and motivation for writing specific songs was

paisleyparkgirl said:

Explore that thought. The Gemini thing? Ambiguity?

Ambiguity about what? What do you consider, in this context, to be the Gemini thing?

And if you say, the Gemini thing is man/woman then what configuration? Straight man/gay woman? Just so we're all clear how to understand prince's music the correct way that he intended but evidently didn't state too clearly.

LoveGalore said:

paisleyparkgirl said:

That was not his brand to begin with. He played with the Gemini thing a lot.

Ambiguity was Prince's brand. Same way he sings about his sister taking his virginity at 16 ("Sister") then years later writes about his first time at 16 with Carrie on the "Schoolyard".

Explore that thought. The Gemini thing? Ambiguity? Ambiguity about what? What do you consider, in this context, to be the Gemini thing? And if you say, the Gemini thing is man/woman then what configuration? Straight man/gay woman? Just so we're all clear how to understand prince's music the correct way that he intended but evidently didn't state too clearly.

Ambiguity, confusion, duality, light/dark, ying/yang

His whole schtick was about confusing the masses.

Now whether or not he was sexually confused himself , he did tell Chris Rock that he wasn't.

PJMcGee said:

And yet... the man himself told Oprah that he had multiple personalities, at least one of which was female. When asked by Oprah about gay rumors, he said, Whatever floats the boat. And yet... when Chris Rock tried to lead him away from all that ambiguity, saying that his femininity was just an act, just him being provocative, Prince severely disappointed his questioner by saying that it was just who he was. (I forget the exact words, but I remember that sad look on Chris's straight face.) I'll admit it's a bit surprising that all these years later, no smoking gun, as it were, was ever uncovered. But would anyone on the planet be shocked if it was? Anyone not in Australia? (For the record, I am gay, but I really didn't think of Prince that way. It would be like fantasizing about Jesus or some other mythic creature, a wood nymph or something.)

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None of this means he was gay.

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And this is the point - Being in touch with your feminine side does not make you gay. It does not mean you have sex with men. There is no reason to be surprised that there is no smoking gun if all he is is what he said he was.

RJOrion said:

Can't U just trust me? If I was your girlfriend U could Oh, yeah, I think so ~ Prince Rogers Nelson

.

This does not even deserve an answer, excet are you even a Prince fan at all if you don't understnad this song?

RJOrion said:

PJMcGee said:

Yes, we know. But do you think that would ever occur to, say, Bruce Springsteen?

I see somebody gets it

.

Backstreets:

.

"Laying here in the dark, you’re like an angel on my chest
Just another tramp of hearts crying tears of faithlessness
Remember all the movies, Terry, we’d go see
Trying to learn to walk like the heroes we thought we had to be
And after all this time, to find we’re just like all the rest
Stranded in the park and forced to confess
To hiding on the backstreets"

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Out in the Streets:

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"When I’m out in the street
I walk the way I want to walk
When I’m out in the street
I talk the way I want to talk"

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It happened to Bruce Springsteen as well - Just like Prince Springsteen also stood for LGBTQIA+ communities helping the fght against Aids, both for the victims of the disease and the way primarity gay people where treated.

LoveGalore said:

paisleyparkgirl said:

That was not his brand to begin with. He played with the Gemini thing a lot.

Ambiguity was Prince's brand. Same way he sings about his sister taking his virginity at 16 ("Sister") then years later writes about his first time at 16 with Carrie on the "Schoolyard".

Explore that thought. The Gemini thing? Ambiguity? Ambiguity about what? What do you consider, in this context, to be the Gemini thing? And if you say, the Gemini thing is man/woman then what configuration? Straight man/gay woman? Just so we're all clear how to understand prince's music the correct way that he intended but evidently didn't state too clearly.

.

There is ambiguity, but only so long as you take a sentence here and a sentence there and ignore the name he gave the woman in the song, the gendered pronoun, the bridge, the flow of the story arc, the context, and that Prince kept on saying he was not gay, but he he was open to his feminine side. There is no ambiguity in a straight man being open to his feminine side - it may have been shocking in 1980 especially in the USA, but it is 2022 now.

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That you have to do what you and RJOion did here yesterday to hope for more certainty in how you want to interpret Prince and you both had to ignore that these songs often referred to "she", "Martha" etc., or were written for others to sing (Vanity 6 or Morris Day) is just you wanting to imagine there was more uncertainty - so hopefully ... You have to imagine that it was not just Prince playing with his Gemini ambiguity, playing for his audience and living his life comfortably within his sexuality and within his sexual orientation.

paisleyparkgirl said:

LoveGalore said:

paisleyparkgirl said: Explore that thought. The Gemini thing? Ambiguity? Ambiguity about what? What do you consider, in this context, to be the Gemini thing? And if you say, the Gemini thing is man/woman then what configuration? Straight man/gay woman? Just so we're all clear how to understand prince's music the correct way that he intended but evidently didn't state too clearly.

Ambiguity, confusion, duality, light/dark, ying/yang

His whole schtick was about confusing the masses.

Now whether or not he was sexually confused himself , he did tell Chris Rock that he wasn't.

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Exactly - Except I would add that many of the masses closer to him allowed themselves to see more ambiguity than was really there - because Prince played with duality, light/dark, ying/yang and them.

IanRG said:

No one is even saying Prince is gay. You're just afraid of him being gay adjacent because of how that might make you feel about yourself and what parts of you that you see reflected in Prince and his music. Maybe if YOU were more in touch with your soul, you'd be less of an asshole about whether or not Prince was using gay culture as a tool for provocation (spoiler: he was).

LoveGalore said:

IanRG said:

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None of this means he was gay.

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And this is the point - Being in touch with your feminine side does not make you gay. It does not mean you have sex with men. There is no reason to be surprised that there is no smoking gun if all he is is what he said he was.

No one is even saying Prince is gay. You're just afraid of him being gay adjacent because of how that might make you feel about yourself and what parts of you that you see reflected in Prince and his music. Maybe if YOU were more in touch with your soul, you'd be less of an asshole about whether or not Prince was using gay culture as a tool for provocation (spoiler: he was).

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You are just repeating yourself with made-up assumptions to seek to provoke me.

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It does not work because you simply are not good enough at it.

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I have told you a number of times that I am into Prince's music. I have many artists in my collection that are LGBTQIA+ across all spectrums. I have no need to see some aspect of myself in an artist to like their music, it is about the music - It is not me who is obsessed with finding something, anything that could be gay (and now gay adjacent!!!) in Prince - many of which were things like ooh a man could seen Prince's penis, that is gay - I mean come on, it is more than 70 years since you were a school boy.

.

I note that you have moved away from your gay checklist as you could never demonstrate that Prince's clothes were more influenced by Minneapolis gay men from 1977 to 1980 than by Glam Rockers, Funkadelic/Parliament and general androgynous fashions in Prince's formative years. Prince never used gay culture, he used some influences from different communities and artisitc movements and fashions at different times in primarily USA and Europe cultures. Unlike Black culture, there was only ever at best different gay sub-cultures in 1980. It is different now.

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As ever you are wrong in your assumptions about me: Prince used his open acceptance of all forms of adult sexuality by others and its rejection by far too many people in the US culture at the time as a tool for provocation and I HAVE NEVER SAID OR BELIEVED ANYTHING DIFFERENT. You have just been too obsessed with finding some gay adjacentness in Prince to justify why you like him, so you missed pretty much every point I made.

[Edited 8/26/22 15:40pm]

Anyway, so what else is going on

LoveGalore said:

Anyway, so what else is going on

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Other people are discussing things like adults.

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They are not making up things I never said.

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They are not misrepresenting things to pretend you did not bring up things like lace panties up first.

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They are not assuming things about people they don't know and repeating them even after they have been denied.

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They are addressing what the other said rather that falling back to stereotypes, personal questions about other people's sex lives because they don't imagine that this is still the 1950s so straight men must live in fear that they could converted by a song or seeing a man comfortable with his feminine side etc.

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They don't have to deny history and facts.

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They don't fear being staight-adjacent any more than being gay-adjacent.

[Edited 8/26/22 18:02pm]

Bud, I'm not reading your posts until you figure out how to be concise. I don't need all that extra text.

LoveGalore said:

Bud, I'm not reading your posts until you figure out how to be concise. I don't need all that extra text.

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I am not writing for you - other than to show that as soon as you can't answer me, you just go back to your silly games.

IanRG said:

Well good, I'm glad we have now cleared that up!

LoveGalore said

All in your humble opinion, yes, which we can agree is at odds with academia and plenty other LGBT folks who have spent blood, sweat, and tears to build the community. Get over yourself for one moment and realize that your counter-culture feelings are not facts. You just happen to be gay, huh, ""brother""? I wonder if that would've been a defense where being gay is an indefensible state of being. You'd perhaps think twice about attempting to delegitimize gay culture, community, and relevance if there were folks out there hunting your head for who you sleep with.

FYI, I was part of the 'blood sweat and tears' while fighting for our rights over more than 5 decades.

Did you?

My feelings are not facts, and they don't need to be.

After being part of so many LGBTQAI+ groups, I realised (in my stage of life that) I don't need it any more.

Concerning your wrong assumptions of delegitimizing gay culutre;

I still support every group out there who think they need it, I do not seperate myself from these people.

What's your support?

There's just no need for me anymore to be part of any gay culture as a member.

I did my work, it's up to the youngsters now.

I moved on in life and realised that being gay for me is far less important than being human in the first place... is what I explained in full - understand it or don't.

I just don't wave flags anymore, or put being gay up front in my life.

A (short) life (we all have) is just worth so much more than just being gay (for exeample).

Identity is one thing, but loving and caring for each other is what it's all about.

-

Besides, it seems like the term "gay culture" is used more by those who are not part of it.

Often just to put some people in a box, set apart from the so-called norm.

But that's a whole other discussion that doesn't matter here.