purplefam99 said:

CatB said:

Yes, especially since none of us had ever heard he had heart palpitations (which doesn't necessarily have to mean anything, of course...). Mayte didn't know and one of the other girls from before her time was totally surprised when I mentioned it.

It is also strange that it was red wine. He never drank red wine. When he drank then port.

Judith mentions prince drinking Cognac in the report.

Judith wasn't even around in the 90's


Back to topic.

peggyon said:

Camileyun said:

kmama07 said:

paulludvig said:

kmama07 said:

I was also thinking this could be a possibility

Test taken immediately before showed he had opioids in his system, so symptoms of withdrawal not likely.

PennyPurple said:

Are we all on the same page about the vomit? That he probably vomited before he took the fentanyl laced pill(s)?

If we are, then when got at least 1 thing settled.

I believe that too, it's the only thing that sounds plausible to me.

[Edited 7/27/18 7:48am]

Kirk's concern about a stain on the carpet is one of the many things that has bugged me since I read the reports. I continue to maintain that Prince's home wasn't exactly immaculate despite having paid cleaners to take care of it. Housecleaning staff was Meron's responsibility. With all the other suspicious details that track back to Kirk, his (seemingly) sudden interest in cleaning a carpet stains so soon after Prince's death seems like a red flag to me. Would it have been incriminating in some way? I guess we'll never know now. I don't recall that any pictures of the stain were included in the reports - it was just something that was mentioned later on I believe - that an officer came upon Kirk directing a cleaning staff member to remove the stain.

Camileyun said:

Do any of the pictures taken by the LE include the area where the stain was that KJ was so concerned about?

Nola said:

Kirk's concern about a stain on the carpet is one of the many things that has bugged me since I read the reports. I continue to maintain that Prince's home wasn't exactly immaculate despite having paid cleaners to take care of it. Housecleaning staff was Meron's responsibility. With all the other suspicious details that track back to Kirk, his (seemingly) sudden interest in cleaning a carpet stains so soon after Prince's death seems like a red flag to me. Would it have been incriminating in some way? I guess we'll never know now. I don't recall that any pictures of the stain were included in the reports - it was just something that was mentioned later on I believe - that an officer came upon Kirk directing a cleaning staff member to remove the stain.

Camileyun said:

Do any of the pictures taken by the LE include the area where the stain was that KJ was so concerned about?

Do you know where the stain was located at?

I did see 1 stain on the carpet in the white bedroom with the round bed.

PennyPurple said:

Nola said:

Kirk's concern about a stain on the carpet is one of the many things that has bugged me since I read the reports. I continue to maintain that Prince's home wasn't exactly immaculate despite having paid cleaners to take care of it. Housecleaning staff was Meron's responsibility. With all the other suspicious details that track back to Kirk, his (seemingly) sudden interest in cleaning a carpet stains so soon after Prince's death seems like a red flag to me. Would it have been incriminating in some way? I guess we'll never know now. I don't recall that any pictures of the stain were included in the reports - it was just something that was mentioned later on I believe - that an officer came upon Kirk directing a cleaning staff member to remove the stain.

Do you know where the stain was located at?

I did see 1 stain on the carpet in the white bedroom with the round bed.

The stain was mentioned by Theo London on his tape. It was on the main floor. The investigator interviewer questions TL, trying to pinpoint the exact location of the stain, it was somewhere in the vicinity of the elevator.

Has it been mentioned anywhere -- what was P's reaction or was there a reaction or did he notice that someone had been through his area and removed his meds? Did KJ tell him? I'll go through Thread 11.

[Edited 7/27/18 9:31am]

precioux said:

paulludvig said:

kmama07 said: Test taken immediately before showed he had opioids in his system, so symptoms of withdrawal not likely.

exactly...the vomiting was most likely due to the damage to his GI track from his drug use, NOT a symptom of withdrawel as he clearly was NOT in full withdrawel as he had lots of drugs in his system. It's reasonable to assume the Narcan in Moline made it difficult (if not impossible) for him to calibrate and experience the maintenance high he had been operating under for who knows how long. Back to his GI tract...I still believe we need to drill down on alternaive ways he may have used to get the drugs (especially the final dose) into his system as he KNEW there was a likelihood of regurgitation and IMO he wanted that last dose to be his last dose. The ME was looking for nasal sprays, do we know if the enema bags were tested for Fent? and was there Fent. on his hands?

Bodhitheblackdog said:

precioux said:

exactly...the vomiting was most likely due to the damage to his GI track from his drug use, NOT a symptom of withdrawel as he clearly was NOT in full withdrawel as he had lots of drugs in his system. It's reasonable to assume the Narcan in Moline made it difficult (if not impossible) for him to calibrate and experience the maintenance high he had been operating under for who knows how long. Back to his GI tract...I still believe we need to drill down on alternaive ways he may have used to get the drugs (especially the final dose) into his system as he KNEW there was a likelihood of regurgitation and IMO he wanted that last dose to be his last dose. The ME was looking for nasal sprays, do we know if the enema bags were tested for Fent? and was there Fent. on his hands?

Some of the enema's were tested and came up negative for any drug. Nasal sprays and eye drops were also tested and came up negative. Can't find the results on the swabs on the hands and neck.

PennyPurple said:

Bodhitheblackdog said:

exactly...the vomiting was most likely due to the damage to his GI track from his drug use, NOT a symptom of withdrawel as he clearly was NOT in full withdrawel as he had lots of drugs in his system. It's reasonable to assume the Narcan in Moline made it difficult (if not impossible) for him to calibrate and experience the maintenance high he had been operating under for who knows how long. Back to his GI tract...I still believe we need to drill down on alternaive ways he may have used to get the drugs (especially the final dose) into his system as he KNEW there was a likelihood of regurgitation and IMO he wanted that last dose to be his last dose. The ME was looking for nasal sprays, do we know if the enema bags were tested for Fent? and was there Fent. on his hands?

Some of the enema's were tested and came up negative for any drug. Nasal sprays and eye drops were also tested and came up negative. Can't find the results on the swabs on the hands and neck.

I was fixing to reply verbatim...but add that I'm almost postitive the swab results never came back, or should I say the results were never documented.

PennyPurple said:

He apparently did not have any Fentanyl patches - many addicts suck the drug out of the patches, so if his mouth was swabbed, it would have appeared (I assume). Plus, the patches would have been found after his death.

precioux said:

PennyPurple said:

Some of the enema's were tested and came up negative for any drug. Nasal sprays and eye drops were also tested and came up negative. Can't find the results on the swabs on the hands and neck.

I was fixing to reply verbatim...but add that I'm almost postitive the swab results never came back, or should I say the results were never documented.

I'm wondering if they are in part of the documents that weren't released? I would think that those swabs would be key to an investigation.

paulludvig said:

PennyPurple said:

Some of the enema's were tested and came up negative for any drug. Nasal sprays and eye drops were also tested and came up negative. Can't find the results on the swabs on the hands and neck.

The testing of nasal spray, eye drops and such shows that the investigators were puzzled by this too.

The ME was concerned because of the level of fentanyl in the blood. She asked about eye drops, nasal spray, etc. When the results from the stomach came back, she said that the fentanyl was injested by mouth.

PennyPurple said:

This might sound nutty, but was PP ever checked for hidden spaces? I know they found a couple of spaces with notebooks IIRC, but was the place really checked - say with a sonar device or something similar - for hidden areas, where he could store things and no one would know?

No undigested pills but there was fentanyl in his stomach though, so he must have consumed it somehow. There was no evidence of struggle so it doesn't sound like anyone forced him to consume the fentanyl. Could it be patches that he sucked on and then someone got rid of the patches before the cops arrived--and they were so busy getting rid of those, they missed getting rid of the actual pills. Or maybe due to the absense of food in his stomach, his stomach digested the actual pills pretty quickly. I don't think the cops have any reason to ignore facts that look like murder, so I think we need an expert on this stuff. But I do wonder about that mysterious other bodyguard (whose supposed name escapes me). If he supplied Prince with something and then left with the evidence (and it was patches).

Also people keep talking about the enemas being testsed for fentanyl but did they state one way or the other that they had proof that P actually used the enemas. Is it possible he hadn't started using them yet?

I do think this might prove that P wasn't a long-time fentanyl user and might have gotten those Bayer, Advil bottles of mystery dope on the road. Or if he did dabble in it, he was avoiding using it most of the time except when he started using it again that last night and in Atlanta on the 16th.

paulludvig said:

PennyPurple said:

The ME was concerned because of the level of fentanyl in the blood. She asked about eye drops, nasal spray, etc. When the results from the stomach came back, she said that the fentanyl was injested by mouth.

But no undigested pills in his stomach and no trace of narcs in the vomit? It IS a little strange, isn't it?

[Edited 7/27/18 11:25am]

[Edited 7/27/18 11:30am]

Good question. Also checking the homes of others who worked for him who might have stored some of his 'dope". Meron went back to her house after the cops took her back (by her request). And then it seems she lawyered up and they never talked to her again. Could she have been keeping junk at her place?

1Sasha said:

This might sound nutty, but was PP ever checked for hidden spaces? I know they found a couple of spaces with notebooks IIRC, but was the place really checked - say with a sonar device or something similar - for hidden areas, where he could store things and no one would know?

[Edited 7/27/18 11:29am]

Did they prove it was his vomit? Could someone else had vomited when they found his corpse? Or maybe he was sick from something else as well and the vomit was older.

paulludvig said:

PennyPurple said:

The ME was concerned because of the level of fentanyl in the blood. She asked about eye drops, nasal spray, etc. When the results from the stomach came back, she said that the fentanyl was injested by mouth.

But no undigested pills in his stomach and no trace of narcs in the vomit? It IS a little strange, isn't it?

Lovejunky said:

SkipperLove said:

No undigested pills but there was fentanyl in his stomach though, so he must have consumed it somehow. There was no evidence of struggle so it doesn't sound like anyone forced him to consume the fentanyl. Could it be patches that he sucked on and then someone got rid of the patches before the cops arrived--and they were so busy getting rid of those, they missed getting rid of the actual pills. Or maybe due to the absense of food in his stomach, his stomach digested the actual pills pretty quickly. I don't think the cops have any reason to ignore facts that look like murder, so I think we need an expert on this stuff. But I do wonder about that mysterious other bodyguard (whose supposed name escapes me). If he supplied Prince with something and then left with the evidence (and it was patches).

Also people keep talking about the enemas being testsed for fentanyl but did they state one way or the other that they had proof that P actually used the enemas. Is it possible he hadn't started using them yet?

I do think this might prove that P wasn't a long-time fentanyl user and might have gotten those Bayer, Advil bottles of mystery dope on the road. Or if he did dabble in it, he was avoiding using it most of the time except when he started using it again that last night and in Atlanta on the 16th.

paulludvig said:

PennyPurple said: But no undigested pills in his stomach and no trace of narcs in the vomit? It IS a little strange, isn't it?

[Edited 7/27/18 11:25am]

[Edited 7/27/18 11:30am]

To the bold/underline. Yes, proof that P used these enemas- his DNA was found as well as a pubic har being tested and coming back as his.

SkipperLove said:

Did they prove it was his vomit? Could someone else had vomited when they found his corpse? Or maybe he was sick from something else as well and the vomit was older.

paulludvig said:

PennyPurple said: But no undigested pills in his stomach and no trace of narcs in the vomit? It IS a little strange, isn't it?

No. I don't even think it was proven that the 'wet substance' tested was in fact vomit. We are assuming this because of the vomit that was found in Prince's airway/throat.

precioux said:

Thanks. So maybe it just proves that fentanyl was not his opiate of choice most of the time.

precioux said:

SkipperLove said:

No undigested pills but there was fentanyl in his stomach though, so he must have consumed it somehow. There was no evidence of struggle so it doesn't sound like anyone forced him to consume the fentanyl. Could it be patches that he sucked on and then someone got rid of the patches before the cops arrived--and they were so busy getting rid of those, they missed getting rid of the actual pills. Or maybe due to the absense of food in his stomach, his stomach digested the actual pills pretty quickly. I don't think the cops have any reason to ignore facts that look like murder, so I think we need an expert on this stuff. But I do wonder about that mysterious other bodyguard (whose supposed name escapes me). If he supplied Prince with something and then left with the evidence (and it was patches).

Also people keep talking about the enemas being testsed for fentanyl but did they state one way or the other that they had proof that P actually used the enemas. Is it possible he hadn't started using them yet?

I do think this might prove that P wasn't a long-time fentanyl user and might have gotten those Bayer, Advil bottles of mystery dope on the road. Or if he did dabble in it, he was avoiding using it most of the time except when he started using it again that last night and in Atlanta on the 16th.

[Edited 7/27/18 11:25am]

[Edited 7/27/18 11:30am]

To the bold/underline. Yes, proof that P used these enemas- his DNA was found as well as a pubic har being tested and coming back as his.

But Narcan blocks nerve sensors and sends you into withdrawal. . He doesn't appear to have been on Fentanyl again until the 21st. . . Withdrawal is a common symptom of its usage. Fentanyl withdrawal starts about 12 to 30 hours after the last usage of fentanyl. And can last to up to four days. HE may have had opiates in his system but they may have been somewhat ineffectual due to the fact that he was withdrawing from the stronger fentanyl. Maybe that is why he turned to harder stuff the night he died, trying to get some kind of relief the other drugs weren't giving him or just trying to end it period.'

https://www.therecoveryvillage.com/fentanyl-addiction/related-topics/fentanyl-withdrawal-symptoms-duration/#gref

paulludvig said:

kmama07 said:

I was also thinking this could be a possibility

Test taken immediately before showed he had opioids in his system, so symptoms of withdrawal not likely.

[Edited 7/27/18 12:20pm]

[Edited 7/27/18 12:29pm]

Are you sure about that? If it was in his stomach, he would have had to had swallowed it.

paulludvig said:

precioux said:

No. I don't even think it was proven that the 'wet substance' tested was in fact vomit. We are assuming this because of the vomit that was found in Prince's airway/throat.

But no trace of narcotics in his airway/throat either, as far as I recall.

SkipperLove said:

The lollipops he was sucking on resemble blow pops, not these...

purplefam99 said:

SkipperLove said:

No undigested pills but there was fentanyl in his stomach though, so he must have consumed it somehow. There was no evidence of struggle so it doesn't sound like anyone forced him to consume the fentanyl. Could it be patches that he sucked on and then someone got rid of the patches before the cops arrived--and they were so busy getting rid of those, they missed getting rid of the actual pills. Or maybe due to the absense of food in his stomach, his stomach digested the actual pills pretty quickly. I don't think the cops have any reason to ignore facts that look like murder, so I think we need an expert on this stuff. But I do wonder about that mysterious other bodyguard (whose supposed name escapes me). If he supplied Prince with something and then left with the evidence (and it was patches).

Also people keep talking about the enemas being testsed for fentanyl but did they state one way or the other that they had proof that P actually used the enemas. Is it possible he hadn't started using them yet?

I do think this might prove that P wasn't a long-time fentanyl user and might have gotten those Bayer, Advil bottles of mystery dope on the road. Or if he did dabble in it, he was avoiding using it most of the time except when he started using it again that last night and in Atlanta on the 16th.

[Edited 7/27/18 11:25am]

[Edited 7/27/18 11:30am]

Could he have had lollipops, that were gotten rid of. The pops he was always sucking on in the 90’s gave me pause.