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Reply #600 posted 04/21/18 7:12pm

Strive

[Please stay on topic, do not derail the thread with something that has nothing to do with the investigation snip - luv4u]

Free the music, fire Michael Howe
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Reply #601 posted 04/21/18 7:12pm

rogifan

206Michelle said:



endiadj said:


paulludvig said:
What about those who claim he was a hardcore addict for twenty years?

That has been discussed here too.

He wasn't a hardcore user of painkillers for 20 years. Mayte said incidents involving pills were few and far between during their marriage. Mani said he used painkillers regularly during their marriage, but she didn't describe the usage as hardcore, as far as I know.


Can someone explain how anyone could be a “hardcore” user of painkillers for 20 years? You’d be dead long before 20 years.

In The Star Tribune article Sheila E. confirmed hip replacement surgery at Mayo in 2010 and said Prince was in a lot of pain before the surgery. She and a couple other associates confirmed his use of painkillers due to being in pain. But other employees they saw no evidence of addiction. Josh Welton said they weren’t around the “drug environment” and it was something Prince prohibited. Seems quite clear that physical pain lead him to start taking painkillers. A question I have though is, Kirk is the one getting all the hate but what about Sheila, or Mani or anyone else that was aware he was taking painkillers. Were they concerned that he was becoming dependent? If so did they try and do something about it?
Paisley Park is in your heart
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Reply #602 posted 04/21/18 7:15pm

PeteSilas

disch said:

yeah the investigator reports said that they were noting the enemas because constipation is a side-effect of opioid use



PennyPurple said:


Did anyone pick up on the fact they found a lot of enemas in his bathroom that were used? I bet the codene was binding him up.




Ya, just like Elvis. The bloated Elvis people saw was partially due to heavy constipation. In his case he strained at the toilet and it triggered a heart attack. He was found pants down and having crawled several feet, nearly biting his own tongue in two. No one does glamorous.
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Reply #603 posted 04/21/18 7:17pm

PennyPurple

avatar

disch said:

yeah the investigator reports said that they were noting the enemas because constipation is a side-effect of opioid use

PennyPurple said:

Did anyone pick up on the fact they found a lot of enemas in his bathroom that were used? I bet the codene was binding him up.

Yeah, it's pretty bad, they had to end up prescribing my husband shots that I had to give him for his constipation.

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Reply #604 posted 04/21/18 7:18pm

PeteSilas

[Please stay on topic, do not derail the thread with something that has nothing to do with the investigation snip - luv4u]
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Reply #605 posted 04/21/18 7:22pm

PennyPurple

avatar

rogifan said:

206Michelle said:

He wasn't a hardcore user of painkillers for 20 years. Mayte said incidents involving pills were few and far between during their marriage. Mani said he used painkillers regularly during their marriage, but she didn't describe the usage as hardcore, as far as I know.

Can someone explain how anyone could be a “hardcore” user of painkillers for 20 years? You’d be dead long before 20 years. In The Star Tribune article Sheila E. confirmed hip replacement surgery at Mayo in 2010 and said Prince was in a lot of pain before the surgery. She and a couple other associates confirmed his use of painkillers due to being in pain. But other employees they saw no evidence of addiction. Josh Welton said they weren’t around the “drug environment” and it was something Prince prohibited. Seems quite clear that physical pain lead him to start taking painkillers. A question I have though is, Kirk is the one getting all the hate but what about Sheila, or Mani or anyone else that was aware he was taking painkillers. Were they concerned that he was becoming dependent? If so did they try and do something about it?

They knew. Sheila contacted Judith and asked her to stay quiet about it, and if she needed a lawyer they would lawyer her up. Omarr stated that Mani told him after P died, that he was using pain pills when they were married. THis is what I've been trying to tell you all. sad


And again the major complaint was pain in his arm, & hands, he was seeing a chiro for sciatic pain in his leg.

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Reply #606 posted 04/21/18 7:25pm

luv4u

Moderator

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moderator

PennyPurple said:

rogifan said:

206Michelle said: Can someone explain how anyone could be a “hardcore” user of painkillers for 20 years? You’d be dead long before 20 years. In The Star Tribune article Sheila E. confirmed hip replacement surgery at Mayo in 2010 and said Prince was in a lot of pain before the surgery. She and a couple other associates confirmed his use of painkillers due to being in pain. But other employees they saw no evidence of addiction. Josh Welton said they weren’t around the “drug environment” and it was something Prince prohibited. Seems quite clear that physical pain lead him to start taking painkillers. A question I have though is, Kirk is the one getting all the hate but what about Sheila, or Mani or anyone else that was aware he was taking painkillers. Were they concerned that he was becoming dependent? If so did they try and do something about it?

They knew. Sheila contacted Judith and asked her to stay quiet about it, and if she needed a lawyer they would lawyer her up. Omarr stated that Mani told him after P died, that he was using pain pills when they were married. THis is what I've been trying to tell you all. sad


And again the major complaint was pain in his arm, & hands, he was seeing a chiro for sciatic pain in his leg.


sigh

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Reply #607 posted 04/21/18 7:26pm

rogifan

ThatWhiteDude said:

They said it was an accident, can we just let it be an accident? We won't get any more informations than the authorities.


To me the simplest answers are usually the right ones. And now that hip replacement surgery was confirmed it seems clear physical pain led him to painkillers. I still think it’s an open question as to whether there was anything else health related in the last year or two of his life, only because that’s when his appearance changed the most.
Paisley Park is in your heart
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Reply #608 posted 04/21/18 7:27pm

EnDoRpHn

PennyPurple said:

rogifan said:

206Michelle said: Can someone explain how anyone could be a “hardcore” user of painkillers for 20 years? You’d be dead long before 20 years. In The Star Tribune article Sheila E. confirmed hip replacement surgery at Mayo in 2010 and said Prince was in a lot of pain before the surgery. She and a couple other associates confirmed his use of painkillers due to being in pain. But other employees they saw no evidence of addiction. Josh Welton said they weren’t around the “drug environment” and it was something Prince prohibited. Seems quite clear that physical pain lead him to start taking painkillers. A question I have though is, Kirk is the one getting all the hate but what about Sheila, or Mani or anyone else that was aware he was taking painkillers. Were they concerned that he was becoming dependent? If so did they try and do something about it?

They knew. Sheila contacted Judith and asked her to stay quiet about it, and if she needed a lawyer they would lawyer her up. Omarr stated that Mani told him after P died, that he was using pain pills when they were married. THis is what I've been trying to tell you all. sad


And again the major complaint was pain in his arm, & hands, he was seeing a chiro for sciatic pain in his leg.

I don't agree with much Sheila has said or done, but I think her comments to Judith are part of the broader backdrop -- he surrounded himself for much of his life with people who were fiercely protective of him and his privacy. I don't think there's anything more to it than that - Sheila just didn't want his personal business getting out in a way that would be embarrassing. Obviously that tactic has failed.

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Reply #609 posted 04/21/18 7:28pm

EnDoRpHn

disch said:

yeah the investigator reports said that they were noting the enemas because constipation is a side-effect of opioid use

PennyPurple said:

Did anyone pick up on the fact they found a lot of enemas in his bathroom that were used? I bet the codene was binding him up.

There are several laxative bottles in the photos.

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Reply #610 posted 04/21/18 7:28pm

rogifan

rogifan said:

206Michelle said:



endiadj said:


paulludvig said:
What about those who claim he was a hardcore addict for twenty years?

That has been discussed here too.

He wasn't a hardcore user of painkillers for 20 years. Mayte said incidents involving pills were few and far between during their marriage. Mani said he used painkillers regularly during their marriage, but she didn't describe the usage as hardcore, as far as I know.


Can someone explain how anyone could be a “hardcore” user of painkillers for 20 years? You’d be dead long before 20 years.

In The Star Tribune article Sheila E. confirmed hip replacement surgery at Mayo in 2010 and said Prince was in a lot of pain before the surgery. She and a couple other associates confirmed his use of painkillers due to being in pain. But other employees they saw no evidence of addiction. Josh Welton said they weren’t around the “drug environment” and it was something Prince prohibited. Seems quite clear that physical pain lead him to start taking painkillers. A question I have though is, Kirk is the one getting all the hate but what about Sheila, or Mani or anyone else that was aware he was taking painkillers. Were they concerned that he was becoming dependent? If so did they try and do something about it?

Something else to add to this...Mariah Brown, who was one of his assistants in Minnesota from 2013-2015 said she never saw Prince take painkillers and was never asked to get any for him. So it might have been an open secret with some employees/associates but not with everyone.
Paisley Park is in your heart
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Reply #611 posted 04/21/18 7:31pm

PennyPurple

avatar

EnDoRpHn said:

PennyPurple said:

They knew. Sheila contacted Judith and asked her to stay quiet about it, and if she needed a lawyer they would lawyer her up. Omarr stated that Mani told him after P died, that he was using pain pills when they were married. THis is what I've been trying to tell you all. sad


And again the major complaint was pain in his arm, & hands, he was seeing a chiro for sciatic pain in his leg.

I don't agree with much Sheila has said or done, but I think her comments to Judith are part of the broader backdrop -- he surrounded himself for much of his life with people who were fiercely protective of him and his privacy. I don't think there's anything more to it than that - Sheila just didn't want his personal business getting out in a way that would be embarrassing. Obviously that tactic has failed.

Sheila didn't want his personal business getting out in the police investigation and basically told Judith not to say anything. It was a police investigation and they wanted people to lie?

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Reply #612 posted 04/21/18 7:34pm

PeteSilas

PeteSilas said:

[Please stay on topic, do not derail the thread with something that has nothing to do with the investigation snip - luv4u]

[Please stay on topic, do not derail the thread with something that has nothing to do with the investigation snip - luv4u]
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Reply #613 posted 04/21/18 7:37pm

disch

i gotta say, it's hard to know if everyone was being completely forthcoming in their statements. Some folks insisted they knew nothing, and while I don't think they're all lying, perhaps some are "forgetting" a few things.

-

I do think that people tended to move in and out of his inner circle regularly, and I can't help but think that the people who started to see/suspect too much quickly found themselves out. Perhaps the few people in his inner circle at the time of his death got there specifically becaue they didn't (yet) know what he was struggling with.

rogifan said:

rogifan said:
Can someone explain how anyone could be a “hardcore” user of painkillers for 20 years? You’d be dead long before 20 years. In The Star Tribune article Sheila E. confirmed hip replacement surgery at Mayo in 2010 and said Prince was in a lot of pain before the surgery. She and a couple other associates confirmed his use of painkillers due to being in pain. But other employees they saw no evidence of addiction. Josh Welton said they weren’t around the “drug environment” and it was something Prince prohibited. Seems quite clear that physical pain lead him to start taking painkillers. A question I have though is, Kirk is the one getting all the hate but what about Sheila, or Mani or anyone else that was aware he was taking painkillers. Were they concerned that he was becoming dependent? If so did they try and do something about it?
Something else to add to this...Mariah Brown, who was one of his assistants in Minnesota from 2013-2015 said she never saw Prince take painkillers and was never asked to get any for him. So it might have been an open secret with some employees/associates but not with everyone.

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Reply #614 posted 04/21/18 7:41pm

rogifan

PennyPurple said:



rogifan said:


206Michelle said:


He wasn't a hardcore user of painkillers for 20 years. Mayte said incidents involving pills were few and far between during their marriage. Mani said he used painkillers regularly during their marriage, but she didn't describe the usage as hardcore, as far as I know.



Can someone explain how anyone could be a “hardcore” user of painkillers for 20 years? You’d be dead long before 20 years. In The Star Tribune article Sheila E. confirmed hip replacement surgery at Mayo in 2010 and said Prince was in a lot of pain before the surgery. She and a couple other associates confirmed his use of painkillers due to being in pain. But other employees they saw no evidence of addiction. Josh Welton said they weren’t around the “drug environment” and it was something Prince prohibited. Seems quite clear that physical pain lead him to start taking painkillers. A question I have though is, Kirk is the one getting all the hate but what about Sheila, or Mani or anyone else that was aware he was taking painkillers. Were they concerned that he was becoming dependent? If so did they try and do something about it?

They knew. Sheila contacted Judith and asked her to stay quiet about it, and if she needed a lawyer they would lawyer her up. Omarr stated that Mani told him after P died, that he was using pain pills when they were married. THis is what I've been trying to tell you all. sad



And again the major complaint was pain in his arm, & hands, he was seeing a chiro for sciatic pain in his leg.


It just makes me incredibly sad...mostly just sad knowing the physical ailments and pain he was struggling with. At the Target Center concert last night I remember thinking how amazing Prince looked and sounded (the footage was from 2011). It’s just sad to know what he was going through just to be able to get up on stage and perform. sad I’m lucky to be in good health. I feel so sad for those who aren’t and are struggling with pain. It really is a hell of a way to have to live your life. sad
Paisley Park is in your heart
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Reply #615 posted 04/21/18 7:47pm

EnDoRpHn

PennyPurple said:



EnDoRpHn said:




PennyPurple said:



They knew. Sheila contacted Judith and asked her to stay quiet about it, and if she needed a lawyer they would lawyer her up. Omarr stated that Mani told him after P died, that he was using pain pills when they were married. THis is what I've been trying to tell you all. sad



And again the major complaint was pain in his arm, & hands, he was seeing a chiro for sciatic pain in his leg.



I don't agree with much Sheila has said or done, but I think her comments to Judith are part of the broader backdrop -- he surrounded himself for much of his life with people who were fiercely protective of him and his privacy. I don't think there's anything more to it than that - Sheila just didn't want his personal business getting out in a way that would be embarrassing. Obviously that tactic has failed.



Sheila didn't want his personal business getting out in the police investigation and basically told Judith not to say anything. It was a police investigation and they wanted people to lie?


She never said Sheila told her to lie. She told her not to talk. May seem shady but it’s not the same thing.
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Reply #616 posted 04/21/18 7:51pm

rogifan

disch said:

i gotta say, it's hard to know if everyone was being completely forthcoming in their statements. Some folks insisted they knew nothing, and while I don't think they're all lying, perhaps some are "forgetting" a few things.


-


I do think that people tended to move in and out of his inner circle regularly, and I can't help but think that the people who started to see/suspect too much quickly found themselves out. Perhaps the few people in his inner circle at the time of his death got there specifically becaue they didn't (yet) know what he was struggling with.


This interview with Mariah Brown was with the Associated Press shortly after his passing. She certainly didn’t sound like she was lying or hiding anything. Seems entirely possible to me that not all associates knew what was going on. Especially if they didn’t have access to his bedroom or bathroom.

Paisley Park is in your heart
#PrinceForever 💜
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Reply #617 posted 04/21/18 7:57pm

disch

yeah I guess i wasn't speaking of her specifically. More the people in the police interviews. Again, not so much lying necessarily as perhaps just blocking some thinngs out. But who knows; like I said perhaps the reason Prince let these people stay close to him was because they really didn't know anything.

rogifan said:

disch said:

i gotta say, it's hard to know if everyone was being completely forthcoming in their statements. Some folks insisted they knew nothing, and while I don't think they're all lying, perhaps some are "forgetting" a few things.

-

I do think that people tended to move in and out of his inner circle regularly, and I can't help but think that the people who started to see/suspect too much quickly found themselves out. Perhaps the few people in his inner circle at the time of his death got there specifically becaue they didn't (yet) know what he was struggling with.

This interview with Mariah Brown was with the Associated Press shortly after his passing. She certainly didn’t sound like she was lying or hiding anything. Seems entirely possible to me that not all associates knew what was going on. Especially if they didn’t have access to his bedroom or bathroom.

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Reply #618 posted 04/21/18 8:02pm

ISaidLifeIsJus
tAGame

avatar

EnDoRpHn said:

She never said Sheila told her to lie. She told her not to talk. May seem shady but it’s not the same thing.

The police didnt seem concerned by this comment.

Judith said she knew Sheila real well and she was being protective of her.

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Reply #619 posted 04/21/18 8:17pm

Lovejunky

avatar

Throughout all this the things that continues to bite hard is that Prince was in enough pain that he resorted to Pharmeceutical Drugs to manage it.

WHether it was in his Hips, hands, back or wherever

doesnt matter.

He was hurting

and THAT hurts !

“LOVE IS THE MASTERPLAN”
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Reply #620 posted 04/21/18 8:18pm

poppys

ISaidLifeIsJustAGame said:

EnDoRpHn said:

She never said Sheila told her to lie. She told her not to talk. May seem shady but it’s not the same thing.

The police didnt seem concerned by this comment.

Judith said she knew Sheila real well and she was being protective of her.

Agree. That part read to me like Sheila was looking out for Judith. Offered to help her get an attorney.

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Reply #621 posted 04/21/18 8:22pm

disch

I'm still struggling with the issue of his physical pain because it's not clear from the documentation exactly how big a role physical pain played in his life, and what the cause and effect was (muscle cramping, for example, is an effect of opioid withdrawal). When he was talking to Dr S in the last month of his life, the bigger issue definitely seemed to be the nausea and being "antsy" and anxious. The drugs that Dr S gave him were to manage those issues, not so much physical pain.

Lovejunky said:

Throughout all this the things that continues to bite hard is that Prince was in enough pain that he resorted to Pharmeceutical Drugs to manage it.

WHether it was in his Hips, hands, back or wherever

doesnt matter.

He was hurting

and THAT hurts !

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Reply #622 posted 04/21/18 8:22pm

rogifan

Lovejunky said:

Throughout all this the things that continues to bite hard is that Prince was in enough pain that he resorted to Pharmeceutical Drugs to manage it.



WHether it was in his Hips, hands, back or wherever


doesnt matter.



He was hurting


and THAT hurts !




This. sad
Paisley Park is in your heart
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Reply #623 posted 04/21/18 8:22pm

PennyPurple

avatar

Lovejunky said:

Throughout all this the things that continues to bite hard is that Prince was in enough pain that he resorted to Pharmeceutical Drugs to manage it.

WHether it was in his Hips, hands, back or wherever

doesnt matter.

He was hurting

and THAT hurts !

It sure does. sad



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Reply #624 posted 04/21/18 8:32pm

Lovejunky

avatar

disch said:

I'm still struggling with the issue of his physical pain because it's not clear from the documentation exactly how big a role physical pain played in his life, and what the cause and effect was (muscle cramping, for example, is an effect of opioid withdrawal). When he was talking to Dr S in the last month of his life, the bigger issue definitely seemed to be the nausea and being "antsy" and anxious. The drugs that Dr S gave him were to manage those issues, not so much physical pain.

Lovejunky said:

Throughout all this the things that continues to bite hard is that Prince was in enough pain that he resorted to Pharmeceutical Drugs to manage it.

WHether it was in his Hips, hands, back or wherever

doesnt matter.

He was hurting

and THAT hurts !

IF you listen to enough of the electronic files particularly the Statements and interviews

just about Every single person says they Knew he was in Pain...

and Obvioulsy he was becasue he certainly wasnt taking those opiats for SHits and Giggles

He had enough of those in his life already

“LOVE IS THE MASTERPLAN”
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Reply #625 posted 04/21/18 8:41pm

rogifan

disch said:

I'm still struggling with the issue of his physical pain because it's not clear from the documentation exactly how big a role physical pain played in his life, and what the cause and effect was (muscle cramping, for example, is an effect of opioid withdrawal). When he was talking to Dr S in the last month of his life, the bigger issue definitely seemed to be the nausea and being "antsy" and anxious. The drugs that Dr S gave him were to manage those issues, not so much physical pain.



The Star Tribune article quotes Sheila E. saying how much pain he was in and confirming hip replacement surgery at Mayo in 2010. I don’t think the last month is a good indication of whether he suffered physical pain at various point in his life.
Paisley Park is in your heart
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Reply #626 posted 04/21/18 8:46pm

disch

I read every transcripts of the interviews. People mentioned pain but the people who were in his inner circle didn't really mention that excrutiating physical pain was a dominant issue for him on a daily basis. And Prince didn't really discuss physical pain all that much even with Dr S. Not saying pain didnt come up (he discussed hand pain with Judith) but it didn't seem to dominate.

-

I definitely don't think he was taking drugs for "shits and giggles." I think he was addicted and took them to avoid withdrawal symptoms which can be crippling. That's not "shits and giggles" or "recreation" or any of those kinds of words.

Lovejunky said:

disch said:

I'm still struggling with the issue of his physical pain because it's not clear from the documentation exactly how big a role physical pain played in his life, and what the cause and effect was (muscle cramping, for example, is an effect of opioid withdrawal). When he was talking to Dr S in the last month of his life, the bigger issue definitely seemed to be the nausea and being "antsy" and anxious. The drugs that Dr S gave him were to manage those issues, not so much physical pain.

IF you listen to enough of the electronic files particularly the Statements and interviews

just about Every single person says they Knew he was in Pain...

and Obvioulsy he was becasue he certainly wasnt taking those opiats for SHits and Giggles

He had enough of those in his life already

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Reply #627 posted 04/21/18 8:50pm

206Michelle

rogifan said:

206Michelle said:



endiadj said:


paulludvig said:
What about those who claim he was a hardcore addict for twenty years?

That has been discussed here too.

He wasn't a hardcore user of painkillers for 20 years. Mayte said incidents involving pills were few and far between during their marriage. Mani said he used painkillers regularly during their marriage, but she didn't describe the usage as hardcore, as far as I know.


Can someone explain how anyone could be a “hardcore” user of painkillers for 20 years? You’d be dead long before 20 years.

In The Star Tribune article Sheila E. confirmed hip replacement surgery at Mayo in 2010 and said Prince was in a lot of pain before the surgery. She and a couple other associates confirmed his use of painkillers due to being in pain. But other employees they saw no evidence of addiction. Josh Welton said they weren’t around the “drug environment” and it was something Prince prohibited. Seems quite clear that physical pain lead him to start taking painkillers. A question I have though is, Kirk is the one getting all the hate but what about Sheila, or Mani or anyone else that was aware he was taking painkillers. Were they concerned that he was becoming dependent? If so did they try and do something about it?

I think Mani was aware of it because, I assume, she stayed with him in the same room when they toured since she was his wife. I’m guessing he may have ingested the pills often in his own room/quarters, so others would be less likely to observe the behavior.
Live 4 Love ~ Love is God, God is love, Girls and boys love God above
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Reply #628 posted 04/21/18 8:51pm

HatrinaHaterwi
tz

avatar

Lovejunky said:

disch said:

I'm still struggling with the issue of his physical pain because it's not clear from the documentation exactly how big a role physical pain played in his life, and what the cause and effect was (muscle cramping, for example, is an effect of opioid withdrawal). When he was talking to Dr S in the last month of his life, the bigger issue definitely seemed to be the nausea and being "antsy" and anxious. The drugs that Dr S gave him were to manage those issues, not so much physical pain.

IF you listen to enough of the electronic files particularly the Statements and interviews

just about Every single person says they Knew he was in Pain...

and Obvioulsy he was becasue he certainly wasnt taking those opiats for SHits and Giggles

He had enough of those in his life already


So true!

Here's what bothers ME:

Prince died of an overdose of the drug Fentanyl. Of which, it is very highly fucking likely that he never even knew he'd taken.
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Reply #629 posted 04/21/18 8:52pm

pnv

sexyisintheimagination said:

sonshine said:

Ok, does anyone else feel weird about the Prince & Judith "romantic" relationship? I know it had been reported prior to her confirming it in her statement with detectives, yet I never believed they were more than friends and musical colleagues. Idk, he just never seemed infatuated or gaga towards her like others before her. Especially after seeing her in person I just can't picture the two of them like that...
Aaaaanyway, back on Earth : I watched the live news conference late yesterday A.M. and have avoided all the news since. After reading through the previous thread I'm glad I did! I do not want to remember him that way. I've learned enough. Nothing I've learned since that day has diminished him in my heart or mind. I wish we could put this all to rest. He would be so hurt by this discussion and disclosure of information. I just want him to rest in peace if he can't be here.


I can totally see them together. Both had healing to do after Michael passed.
Men need to be needed, and mentoring was something to give him purpose.
He met her musical family and felt he belonged. It makes sense that they got close like that. Her energy reads as sincere. No offense to their relationship but it is kind Of father daughter healing emotional things.
We will all pass. I think of him as being reunited with his musical family, son, associates Denise. He created a lot of love, I like to think that I what carries us on, we are met by our own goodness. I choose to see the eternal light and not the end scene.


I believe they really connected they had the music connection and she seemed to really be driven and motivated. Did anyone notice the comment Prince made to her? "Oh man I love to sleep more I guess this means I've done all I'm suppose to do on Earth"... I was like whoa when I read it...I was thinking he was reaching out letting someone know...I think he was depress...no doubt or perhaps just reflective on life
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Forums > Prince: Music and More > No murder charge in prince's death Investigation Discussion - Continued - Part 6