kmama07 said:

PeteSilas said:

i wonder what made it so hard for him to concieve a child? He had enough women.

I could be wrong, but I was under the impression after his son was born with the genetic problems he was born with /died from, that Prince found out that could be a possibility with any child he fathered ? Can anyone confirm ? I th out there was something about this in Mayte's book?

ya, but things going wrong like that are everyday, both my siblings and most of my cousins have some kind of birth defects given alcohol and drug use in my family and it's never stopped or discouraged any of them from doing the same things. Of course that doesn't mean Prince wasn't scarred by Amir's death, we don't know. everyone is different, i watched a woman go through a miscarriage and it was like nothing even happened to her, at least on the surface. Also, didn't prince talk of children with other people? Morris Hayes mentioned him wanting to leave the second half of PR to his kids and he alluded to having kids with Mani, maybe he was impotent.

PeteSilas said:

206Michelle said:

Strive said: He loved performing, but then, once the performance was done, it was like back to reality. He could escape reality for a bit while he was on stage. . I think he was having an existential crisis. This activity, making music, that was everything to him, had become difficult for him physically because of the pain in his joints and hands. He had friends and colleagues, but there was a revolving door of these friends and colleagues. His family members appear to have been distant. I don’t know if he was still attending Kingdom Hall every Sunday with Larry, but my impression is that he had drifted away from his JW faith somewhat or was less devout than he had been 10 to 15 years earlier. He talked with people via phone, e.g. Tamron Hall, but talking on the phone is not the same as having someone physically present. Other than his doves, did he have any pets? . Imagine how he must have felt. He had his home, PP, that is a shrine to his entire career. It’s beautifully decorated. It was home. But then, he had no family with whom to share his life or his accomplishments. He was a very nurturing person. He mentored so many people, particularly women. But ultimately, they would spread their wings and explore other pastures. He stayed in touch with many of these people: Wendy, Lisa, Damaris Lewis, Shelby J., Janelle Monae. But these people all had their own lives as well. . Music was his life and he didn’t know how to retire from it. What was he going to do in its place? He had no wife or children or grandchildren. As I understand, he was looking forward to being Uncle Prince to Josh and Hannah Welton’s new baby upon the baby’s birth. He was writing his memoir. So he still had things and people for which/whom to live, but I suspect that thins people and things could not take the place of making music. . As far as I know, the only significant break he ever took from making music during his adult life was when Amiir was alive. Mayte wrote in her book that he was in total papa bear mode and was a loving husband while Amiir was alive. He spent 6 days at the hospital and went home 1 time to take a shower while Amiir was alive. He spent some days grieving Amiir’s death, but it was not clear in Mayte’s book how many days that was. . It’s unknown how he felt, later in life, about his dream of fatherhood that ended up being short-lived. But, to my knowledge, fatherhood is the only situation that gave him a level of purpose on par with the purpose that music gave him. Fatherhood is the only reason he ever stopped making music during his adult life. He talked about how wonderful fatherhood or expectant fatherhood was in numerous interviews, e.g., Oprah in 1996. So, again, I don’t know how he felt about fatherhood at the end of his life. Was he content with not having any living children or did he still yearn for it? I don’t know. But from what Judith says in the interview, he was feeling depressed and he expressed that he was having difficulty performing music and also that he felt he didn’t have much else to do with his life. I think he didn’t know what to do with himself if he couldn’t make music.

i wonder what made it so hard for him to concieve a child? He had enough women.

I have often wondered why he and Mayte or Manuella didn't adopt? He had such compassion and concern toward children. We are hearing wonderful stories of how he was very giving and always doing for those less fortunate. There are certainly many children who need loving homes, and he would have been a good dad to one (or several) of them.

PeteSilas said:

paisleylove said:

PeteSilas said:

i wonder what made it so hard for him to concieve a child? He had enough women.

I have often wondered why he and Mayte or Manuella didn't adopt? He had such compassion and concern toward children. We are hearing wonderful stories of how he was very giving and always doing for those less fortunate. There are certainly many children who need loving homes, and he would have been a good dad to one (or several) of them.

with adoption there will always be that issue of the child not really being theirs, for some that is a bigger issue than others but it's always there.

PeteSilas said:

paisleylove said:

I have often wondered why he and Mayte or Manuella didn't adopt? He had such compassion and concern toward children. We are hearing wonderful stories of how he was very giving and always doing for those less fortunate. There are certainly many children who need loving homes, and he would have been a good dad to one (or several) of them.

with adoption there will always be that issue of the child not really being theirs, for some that is a bigger issue than others but it's always there.

Sadly, that is true for some. Too bad, b/c seems he would have had a lot of love to give a child.

kmama07 said:

PeteSilas said:

paisleylove said:

kmama07 said:

PeteSilas said:

ya, but things going wrong like that are everyday, both my siblings and most of my cousins have some kind of birth defects given alcohol and drug use in my family and it's never stopped or discouraged any of them from doing the same things. Of course that doesn't mean Prince wasn't scarred by Amir's death, we don't know. everyone is different, i watched a woman go through a miscarriage and it was like nothing even happened to her, at least on the surface. Also, didn't prince talk of children with other people? Morris Hayes mentioned him wanting to leave the second half of PR to his kids and he alluded to having kids with Mani, maybe he was impotent.

Also a possibility for sure. I'll be honest, in the beginning of all this I was pretty surprised there were no valid paternity claims considering his romantic/sexual history.

I thought this at first, too, but have wondered if maybe he wasn't as "active" as portrayed - just part of an image projected over the years. Who knows!

206Michelle said:

206Michelle said:

PeteSilas said:

ya, but things going wrong like that are everyday, both my siblings and most of my cousins have some kind of birth defects given alcohol and drug use in my family and it's never stopped or discouraged any of them from doing the same things. Of course that doesn't mean Prince wasn't scarred by Amir's death, we don't know. everyone is different, i watched a woman go through a miscarriage and it was like nothing even happened to her, at least on the surface. Also, didn't prince talk of children with other people? Morris Hayes mentioned him wanting to leave the second half of PR to his kids and he alluded to having kids with Mani, maybe he was impotent.

Where does Morris Hayes mention that?

It's in a interview Morris did after P passed. He said P told him he had songs better than PR and when Morris asked him why he didnt release them he said he was saving them for his children's inheritance. Then Morris said "you dont have children." I dont think Morris mentioned what he said after that.

Strawberrylova123 said:

Uh oh . Please dont derail this thread with "why didn't he adopt or remarry or have more kids, was he impotent, really as promiscuous as reported etc." NONSENSE!! All the SHOULDA, COULDAS and WOULDAS ARE NOT going to bring him back!! No point in dwelling on it. Sounds like Kirk did all he could to help and P was reaching out to get help but sadly it was too late.

jjam said:

SoulAlive said:

I find it strange how Sinead is going around,saying all this crap when (as far as we know) she wasn't really close to Prince.They weren't friends.How could she possibly know so much about Prince's personal life? yeah,she visited his home in 1990 but isn't that the only encounter she had with him? We can't take her comments seriously.

Steve Fargnoli managed her for a good few years, so she would have been privy to a lot of personal info on Prince.

However, as I said earlier, the version of the story I heard from reputable sources is that Sinead attacked Prince, not vice versa.

oh yeah,I forgot about that.As I recall,Steve was fired by Prince in early 1989,so it's possible that he had a grudge against Prince.He could have told Sinead all those terrible things about Prince.

PeteSilas said:

ya, it definitely don't sound to me like he wanted to live if he took the same thing he took the week before. Prince was a very intelligent guy, no matter how hooked he was, i couldn't see it just totally taking away his own unique self-reflection, honesty and heart, just can't see it. I still think suicide is a very real conclusion. At any rate, the investigation have given us enough to run around in circles for at least another 2 years. good job fuckers.

Diversion. This ^^^^^^^ exactly.

1Sasha said:

The descripton of him in the elevator certainly sounds like he took the pill(s) and deliberately laid down to go ... In a place he had previously referred to in song. I think his leaving was intentional. But we don't know the whole story. Release of the autopsy report would help end the speculation, but that won't happen. Release pictures of his body? Sure - it's within the law. Release medical information - not for another 28 years per the law. That's just ridiculous. Taxpayer funds paid for the autopsy and associated activities - it should be public record.

I see messages referring again to suicide as the reason. His actions/behavior are in line with the description of drug abuse. I am providing the link below to the govenrnment's National Institute on Drug Abuse and a few paragraphs that describes addiction.

I think many people have difficulty understanding the behavior of addicts because it is just too foreign to the risks the average person would be willing to make.

https://www.drugabuse.gov/publications/drugs-brains-behavior-science-addiction/drug-abuse-addiction

"Addiction is defined as a chronic, relapsing brain disease that is characterized by compulsive drug seeking and use, despite harmful consequences.^† It is considered a brain disease because drugs change the brain—they change its structure and how it works. These brain changes can be long-lasting, and can lead to the harmful behaviors seen in people who abuse drugs.

Some people who suffer from social anxiety, stress-related disorders, and depression begin abusing drugs in an attempt to lessen feelings of distress. Stress can play a major role in beginning drug use, continuing drug abuse, or relapse in patients recovering from addiction."

SoulAlive said:

jjam said:

Steve Fargnoli managed her for a good few years, so she would have been privy to a lot of personal info on Prince.

However, as I said earlier, the version of the story I heard from reputable sources is that Sinead attacked Prince, not vice versa.

oh yeah,I forgot about that.As I recall,Steve was fired by Prince in early 1989,so it's possible that he had a grudge against Prince.He could have told Sinead all those terrible things about Prince.

anyone as crazy and unstable as sinead isn't a good source of info. Even "normal" people aren't let alone a madwoman.

and around and around we go, where we stop nobody knows....

leec1 said:

1Sasha said:

The descripton of him in the elevator certainly sounds like he took the pill(s) and deliberately laid down to go ... In a place he had previously referred to in song. I think his leaving was intentional. But we don't know the whole story. Release of the autopsy report would help end the speculation, but that won't happen. Release pictures of his body? Sure - it's within the law. Release medical information - not for another 28 years per the law. That's just ridiculous. Taxpayer funds paid for the autopsy and associated activities - it should be public record.

I see messages referring again to suicide as the reason. His actions/behavior are in line with the description of drug abuse. I am providing the link below to the govenrnment's National Institute on Drug Abuse and a few paragraphs that describes addiction.

I think many people have difficulty understanding the behavior of addicts because it is just too foreign to the risks the average person would be willing to make.

https://www.drugabuse.gov/publications/drugs-brains-behavior-science-addiction/drug-abuse-addiction

"Addiction is defined as a chronic, relapsing brain disease that is characterized by compulsive drug seeking and use, despite harmful consequences.^† It is considered a brain disease because drugs change the brain—they change its structure and how it works. These brain changes can be long-lasting, and can lead to the harmful behaviors seen in people who abuse drugs.

Some people who suffer from social anxiety, stress-related disorders, and depression begin abusing drugs in an attempt to lessen feelings of distress. Stress can play a major role in beginning drug use, continuing drug abuse, or relapse in patients recovering from addiction."

A couple questions and thoughts...

1.) why can't deleted stuff be recovered from a computer? I thought it was nearly impossible to truely get rid of stuff from a computer.

2.) Kiran Sharma said something about talking to Lambkins and her telling her about emails afrom P's assistant and Kirk's concerns over P's addiction right before his death. She seems mad but my understanding is that she was his manager overseas and no longer involved in his life after 2014. Not sure she would have much in terms of details after that point.

3.) Lampkins helped arrange for addiction specialist that her sister went to. Just a thought but maybe after being warned by the previous assistant to his addiction, she refused to arrange for Dr. FeelGoods and this is the reason P eventually turned to shadier ways to attain drugs. Thus, the reason it came as a bit of a surprise that he was using agian. Just a thought. Maybe all they deleted was emails that confirmed that P was being sneaky.

In the police documents, the police confirmed that Andrew's plane touched down in Minneapolis at 5:55am on April 21. Whatever kind of person he or his dad may be and whatever their medical philosophy, the reality is Prince was dead by 5:55am. Andrew or his dad had nothing to do with Prince taking those last fentanyl-laced pills.

cloveringold85 said:

I'm not buying Andrew Kornfeld's story either. He regularly carries drugs when traveling? Wow, that's scary!! He's not qualfied to administer ANY type of drug, yet he states in the case of an emergency, he would ask a doctor first. Now, how in the world can he possibly do that in an emergency situation? That makes no damn sense! He claims he didn't tell his father, Howard Kornfeld that he was taking the drugs with him to Paisley Park. Oh really now? We are supposed to believe that? Howard Kornfeld is a scumbag for ever sending his son Andrew to PP. He should have never been there! What a terrible thing to do to your son and put him in the middle of such an horrific situation. My God!!

paisleylove said:

kmama07 said:

PeteSilas said: Also a possibility for sure. I'll be honest, in the beginning of all this I was pretty surprised there were no valid paternity claims considering his romantic/sexual history.

I thought this at first, too, but have wondered if maybe he wasn't as "active" as portrayed - just part of an image projected over the years. Who knows!

sure, it was part image, the storys of dungeons and shit didn't come from good sources. But as with duke ellington (who i always compare Prince to and who a friend of duke's said "there was no such animal" when she described all the women making the "fatal mistake of thinking they were The One") his real woman was music. Without that, he may as well have been dead, but.., I actually don't think he would have necessarily been done without his hands, men like Prince (or beethoven who was deaf, or Quincy Jones who couldn't play his beloved trumpet anymore) don't just stop because of a handicap, they usually adapt somehow.

206Michelle said:

kmama07 said:

I could be wrong, but I was under the impression after his son was born with the genetic problems he was born with /died from, that Prince found out that could be a possibility with any child he fathered ? Can anyone confirm ? I thought there was something about this in Mayte's book?
[Edited 4/21/18 12:09pm]

Mayte discusses the characteristics of Pfeiffer Syndrome Type 2 in the book, the condition with which Amiir was born, but not the genetics. Based on reading medical literature, PS Type 2 results from a sporadic genetic mutation. PS Type 1 is the type of PS that is inherited. PS Type 1 is pretty mild and many people who have PS Type 1 can live normal lives. There is also a PS Type 3 which typically results in congenital deafness. I don’t recall how Type 3 occurs genetically. We do not know what the doctors told and Mayte though. But they did try again, and had a miscarriage. I wonder if, later in life, Prince regretted he and Mayte’s decision to remove life support from Amiir. Removing life support from their son could be the most difficult decision he ever made in his life.
.
I will post links to medical articles later, but I am away from home right now.
[Edited 4/21/18 12:34pm]

Just came across an intersting line on page 161 of the the police reports: The forensic examiner of Prince's laptop computer found "internet searches for Prince.org, twitter and Instagram accounts" among other searches for reviews of his shows.

-

The report doesn't specify when those searches occured -- but i just hope whatever he saw here didn't cause him distress in his last day

paisleylove said:

ISaidLifeIsJustAGame said:

206Michelle said:

PeteSilas said: Where does Morris Hayes mention that?

It's in a interview Morris did after P passed. He said P told him he had songs better than PR and when Morris asked him why he didnt release them he said he was saving them for his children's inheritance. Then Morris said "you dont have children." I dont think Morris mentioned what he said after that.

it sounded like Prince still wanted to try for kids in the future, the anecdote was probably sometime after mayte. Anyway, for those complaining about derailing threads, I guess kids were brought up as a thing that may have given him a reason to live. It sounds like he was tired of the rockstar life, he did it for a long time, longer than most people in that level of fame. I also found it interesting that he was throwing money away on people he'd hardly seen in 30 years. That kind of supports what Judith was saying how he was nostalgic for the old days, which is even wierder. Prince, in his prime, did not slow down for triumphs or failures, he claimed he never listened to his finished albums and it did sound absolutely believable at the time. So for him to then hearken back to "the good old days" in judith's words was out of character and maybe a further sign that he was not long for this earth.

PeteSilas said:

1Sasha said:

The descripton of him in the elevator certainly sounds like he took the pill(s) and deliberately laid down to go ... In a place he had previously referred to in song. I think his leaving was intentional. But we don't know the whole story. Release of the autopsy report would help end the speculation, but that won't happen. Release pictures of his body? Sure - it's within the law. Release medical information - not for another 28 years per the law. That's just ridiculous. Taxpayer funds paid for the autopsy and associated activities - it should be public record.

yup, we'll be going on about that for awhile, as i've been saying, the non-fans see more clearly than we do when it comes to that. I can't tell you how many posts from non-fans where they say "it looks like he just tried it once, failed, did it again and succeeded", it's us who overanalyze.

[Edited 4/21/18 12:10pm]

Yoare right about that Pete...when

iwould show non-fans videos of later Prince concerts ,they would always say that he must be on something

disch said:

Just came across an intersting line on page 161 of the the police reports: The forensic examiner of Prince's laptop computer found "internet searches for Prince.org, twitter and Instagram accounts" among other searches for reviews of his shows.

-

The report doesn't specify when those searches occured -- but i just hope whatever he saw here didn't cause him distress in his last day

we've gone over this, and though it probably didn't factor in his last days, it's well known that he was a frequent visitor here, some say he loved it, I say I hated this fucking place it was so negative. I got banned for bitching back at people talking shit about Prince so it was more acceptable tearing prince apart here than it was defending him. That said, I never thought he was obsessed with this place when he was alive, I did however find an ip address traced to chanhassen and looking at my former website, the person listened to my rendition of Little Red corvette, I always assumed it was someone on his staff who tried to keep his music off the net, I now think it may have been him. either way, they never bothered or stopped me from having his song on my site whoever it was.

purplerabbithole said:

A couple questions and thoughts...

1.) why can't deleted stuff be recovered from a computer? I thought it was nearly impossible to truely get rid of stuff from a computer.

2.) Kiran Sharma said something about talking to Lambkins and her telling her about emails afrom P's assistant and Kirk's concerns over P's addiction right before his death. She seems mad but my understanding is that she was his manager overseas and no longer involved in his life after 2014. Not sure she would have much in terms of details after that point.

3.) Lampkins helped arrange for addiction specialist that her sister went to. Just a thought but maybe after being warned by the previous assistant to his addiction, she refused to arrange for Dr. FeelGoods and this is the reason P eventually turned to shadier ways to attain drugs. Thus, the reason it came as a bit of a surprise that he was using agian. Just a thought. Maybe all they deleted was emails that confirmed that P was being sneaky.

i'm no comp expert but they find deleted kiddie porn and they caught the btk killer from an "erased" floppy disk, I always say if i did anything on the comp i wanted secret, I'd break the comp into a billion bits and burn the leftovers.

disch said:

In the police documents, the police confirmed that Andrew's plane touched down in Minneapolis at 5:55am on April 21. Whatever kind of person he or his dad may be and whatever their medical philosophy, the reality is Prince was dead by 5:55am. Andrew or his dad had nothing to do with Prince taking those last fentanyl-laced pills.

cloveringold85 said:

I'm not buying Andrew Kornfeld's story either. He regularly carries drugs when traveling? Wow, that's scary!! He's not qualfied to administer ANY type of drug, yet he states in the case of an emergency, he would ask a doctor first. Now, how in the world can he possibly do that in an emergency situation? That makes no damn sense! He claims he didn't tell his father, Howard Kornfeld that he was taking the drugs with him to Paisley Park. Oh really now? We are supposed to believe that? Howard Kornfeld is a scumbag for ever sending his son Andrew to PP. He should have never been there! What a terrible thing to do to your son and put him in the middle of such an horrific situation. My God!!

.

You seem to be missing the point I am trying to make here. I'm talking about their actions (intent) leading up to finding Prince in the elevator, not the time when Andrew arrived. I know they aren't responsible for Prince's death, because they weren't there.

.

I have read Andrew's interview with the detectives and a lot of what he said does not make sense. Even the detective indicated the same, and he questioned why Andrew was carrying those drugs and if he could not administer them, then what would be the point in having them? I shouldn't have to explain this.

Right I know he visited the org generally over the years -- what was interesting was the mention the police report. The implication to me was that the searches listed were recent, not in the distant past. Perhaps the actual evidence files (i'm just looking at the summary) have more info about the dates of various web visits

PeteSilas said:

disch said:

Just came across an intersting line on page 161 of the the police reports: The forensic examiner of Prince's laptop computer found "internet searches for Prince.org, twitter and Instagram accounts" among other searches for reviews of his shows.

-

The report doesn't specify when those searches occured -- but i just hope whatever he saw here didn't cause him distress in his last day

we've gone over this, and though it probably didn't factor in his last days, it's well known that he was a frequent visitor here, some say he loved it, I say I hated this fucking place it was so negative. I got banned for bitching back at people talking shit about Prince so it was more acceptable tearing prince apart here than it was defending him. That said, I never thought he was obsessed with this place when he was alive, I did however find an ip address traced to chanhassen and looking at my former website, the person listened to my rendition of Little Red corvette, I always assumed it was someone on his staff who tried to keep his music off the net, I now think it may have been him. either way, they never bothered or stopped me from having his song on my site whoever it was.