laurarichardson said:

PennyPurple said:

Huh? I can't follow what you're saying here but I don't have the energy to try. All of this has been beaten to death a long time ago here and we all have more or less settled on the theories that we're comfortable with.

-

On this specific issue, all I know is that there was a statement from an official in an August story that test/tests "prior to his death" didn't detect fentanyl. The official didn't specify a date or specific type of test. Unless there's been some medical info released that I misssed, we don't "know" what he had in his system in the period between the plane OD and the fatal OD.

-

And just to make it crystal clear: Saying that "we don't know" doesn't mean I'm implying he did or didn't have any particular drugs in his system at any particular time. I'm saying that, literally, we don't know -- the facts just aren't publicly available.

laurarichardson said:

(though that seems a reasonable theory, as confirmation that he was free of opioids would be recommended before starting suboxone treatment)

Jesus help me. We are going to be resoanable and take the test as confirmation. We also know he was not free of opiods so the treatment by the non-doctor was going to be a mess the next day.

disch said:

I agree that it's been discussed a lot, but it wasn't a statement from the medical examiner. The statement about negative fentanyl tests "prior to his death" came from an unnamed official cited in this August AP story. It doesn't specify that the tests were by Dr. S. or that they happened the day prior to his death (though that seems a reasonable theory, as confirmation that he was free of opioids would be recommended before starting suboxone treatment).

-

For me, that's not enough info to say that I "know" his history with fentanyl -- specifically, that fentanyl played no role in his plane OD.

[Edited 5/10/17 19:51pm]

PurpleDiamonds1 said:

PennyPurple said:

Prince died because HE, gave himself the fake pill. Prince took those pills by his own hand, they were self administered.

HE had no idea they were fake pills ... Feel the person that brought them to PP knew they were fake and laced, but Prince did not know.

I don't think anyone but the drug dealer/pusher/maker knew they were fake. Whoever obtained those pills for Prince, probably didn't know either, neither did Prince. Again, you never know what you are going to get when you buy off the streets, there could be rat poison in there for all we know. He self medicated himself.

PennyPurple said:

said:

PurpleDiamonds1 said:

We don't know he self medicated himself....just as much as we don't know who brought him those fake laced pills

According to the Autopsy report he did.

PennyPurple said:

oliviacamron said:

laurarichardson said:

///Then why is the case still open? People O.D. every day and cases are closed they do not go on for a year. No not even the ME is going to day someone forced pills down Prince's thoart but unless he had a pill making machine or lab in Paisley Park someone procured those pills for him and we still have laws against that in the U.S. I honestly do not know what your point is.

Laura, what is the matter with you? How many times have you told us, that the reason the investigation is still open is because they are looking for the dealer/pusher/maker of these drugs? I think out of your 15,000 posts you are forgetting what you've said. SMDH I think you confuse yourself.

Laura, this has been discussed a lot here over the past year. It sounds like you missed those discussions, so I'll summarize:

-

The medical examiner's manner of death ruling is medical/physical, not legal. Her determination that a death was an accident (or even a homicide) isn't the same as law enforcement's use of words like that.

-

A clear example I read: an ME would say a soldier fatally shooting an enemy soldier in combat is a homicide, meaning one person's action directly and specifically caused the other person's death. But that that wouldn't be "homicide" in the legal sense of the word, as that situation isn't illegal. Same with "accident." A non-drug example: You trip down some stairs and die of a head injury. The medical manner of death is accident, but maybe the builder violated some building code in their stair construction and could be charged with a crime.

-

You read more about manner of death definitions in this CDC medical examiner's guide.).

-

In Minnesota, a person who illegally provides drugs that another person fatally ODs on can be charged with 3rd-degree homicide. Whether the provider expected or wanted the recipient to die isn't relevant. That may be the homicide charges that end up getting filed in this case, if any do. Obviously Prince had a source he turned to supply him with his non-prescribed opioids, and that person likely committed a crime (as, frankly, did Prince. You can read all the Minnesota statutes he may have violated by possessing illegal drugs here.)

-

And finally, your assertion that we can draw certain conclusions from the length of this investigation: I don't know how long the "average" illegal-drug OD investigation takes, but I have read that it can take a long time for investigators to build a strong case against drug-dealer sources (these people are pros). And it seems likely to me that they might be investigating this case as a part of the larger opioid epidemic sweeping the area.

-

Anyway, I hope this helps catch you up on some of the information that's been shared here many times over the past year.

laurarichardson said:

>

///Then why is the case still open? People O.D. every day and cases are closed they do not go on for a year. No not even the ME is going to day someone forced pills down Prince's thoart but unless he had a pill making machine or lab in Paisley Park someone procured those pills for him and we still have laws against that in the U.S. I honestly do not know what your point is.

There is nothing else to discuss. I am moving on you should as well.

disch said:

Laura, this has been discussed a lot here over the past year. It sounds like you missed those discussions, so I'll summarize:

-

The medical examiner's manner of death ruling is medical/physical, not legal. Her determination that a death was an accident (or even a homicide) isn't the same as law enforcement's use of words like that.

-

A clear example I read: an ME would say a soldier fatally shooting an enemy soldier in combat is a homicide, meaning one person's action directly and specifically caused the other person's death. But that that wouldn't be "homicide" in the legal sense of the word, as that situation isn't illegal. Same with "accident." A non-drug example: You trip down some stairs and die of a head injury. The medical manner of death is accident, but maybe the builder violated some building code in their stair construction and could be charged with a crime.

-

You read more about manner of death definitions in this CDC medical examiner's guide.).

-

In Minnesota, a person who illegally provides drugs that another person fatally ODs on can be charged with 3rd-degree homicide. Whether the provider expected or wanted the recipient to die isn't relevant. That may be the homicide charges that end up getting filed in this case, if any do. Obviously Prince had a source he turned to supply him with his non-prescribed opioids, and that person likely committed a crime (as, frankly, did Prince. You can read all the Minnesota statutes he may have violated by possessing illegal drugs here.)

-

And finally, your assertion that we can draw certain conclusions from the length of this investigation: I don't know how long the "average" illegal-drug OD investigation takes, but I have read that it can take a long time for investigators to build a strong case against drug-dealer sources (these people are pros). And it seems likely to me that they might be investigating this case as a part of the larger opioid epidemic sweeping the area.

-

Anyway, I hope this helps catch you up on some of the information that's been shared here many times over the past year.

laurarichardson said:

///Then why is the case still open? People O.D. every day and cases are closed they do not go on for a year. No not even the ME is going to day someone forced pills down Prince's thoart but unless he had a pill making machine or lab in Paisley Park someone procured those pills for him and we still have laws against that in the U.S. I honestly do not know what your point is.

PennyPurple said:

laurarichardson said:

///Then why is the case still open? People O.D. every day and cases are closed they do not go on for a year. No not even the ME is going to day someone forced pills down Prince's thoart but unless he had a pill making machine or lab in Paisley Park someone procured those pills for him and we still have laws against that in the U.S. I honestly do not know what your point is.

Laura, what is the matter with you? How many times have you told us, that the reason the investigation is still open is because they are looking for the dealer/pusher/maker of these drugs? I think out of your 15,000 posts you are forgetting what you've said. SMDH I think you confuse yourself.

I know full well what the police are saying. I just do not believe that are telling us the whole story which I do not expect them to do while the investigation is on going.

I have never said I do not understand why the investigation is still open. You are the one who seems to be implying " he took illegal pills it is all his fault this is what happens when the addicted use street drugs" this has been your matra over and over again. We get it already.

I live in the real world and I know that when black folk get killed in this country there is not a whole lot of worry about it from the point of the authorities. There is statiscal evidence to back me up on this so it is not just emotionalism as many cases go unsolved and I suspect this case is not going to result in anyone being brought to justice.

Already an asshole travled across state line with controlled substances and has not been charged with anything. ( Breaking many Federal laws)

The principal witness and suspect has lied to the police, is not cooperative, and has not been brought in for questioning. ( The longer they let him roam around the less likely he will be charged with anything which at the bare minium could be a felony)

I hope I made myself clear. I do not need you to explain why the case is open because you only see one angle.

[Edited 5/11/17 5:17am]

zenarose said:

For a year I have stated repeatedly that the only thing we knew for certian in this case was the ME Media Release because it was from an identified source and that the ME has the athority to change her findings through a supplemental report if evidence provided shows otherwise. The way an ME determines cause and manner of death is through autopsy results, investgator's reports, and interviewing friends and family. To me it is evident that the information obtained from friends and family is not completely accurate, this is evident from search warrants stating that witnesses were inconsistent in their statements. This makes me ponder if the ME was aware of the inconsistancy of the witness statements and would she change her findings if she had this information. Don't shoot me, I'm just turning this over in my mind.

You make good points. A lot of lies have been told to the authories and more things are coming out all the time that make this more than a simple O.D. or the police just trying to find the supplier.

I am still reading the article about his Australian shows were it appears that KJ may have been functioning as the business manager. This should give anyone pause that the man handling the money may been handling the pain meds as well.

Realize locks are made for crooks because people do steal. The Patrick Cousins, Ian Boxhill and Londell McMillans of the world should make people realzie that many people are riding the purple gravy train and intend to ride out for the rest of their days.

They get to live off of his work.

[Edited 5/11/17 5:19am]

I don't think the investigation is hinging on Prince's race. I don't think race has anything to do with it. I do believe, as I have stated before, that the local authorities were in over their heads with this case, and that - due to who Prince was - state and federal agents/authorities should have been brought into the investigation on April 21. Paisley Park should have been locked down indefinitely. No traipsing through by family and friends. Locked down. Period. Exclamation Point.

1Sasha said:

I don't think the investigation is hinging on Prince's race. I don't think race has anything to do with it. I do believe, as I have stated before, that the local authorities were in over their heads with this case, and that - due to who Prince was - state and federal agents/authorities should have been brought into the investigation on April 21. Paisley Park should have been locked down indefinitely. No traipsing through by family and friends. Locked down. Period. Exclamation Point.

Race is not the only factor but it is a factor. Lots of people have a cavalier attitude toward people and situations based on race without realizing it.

The fact that Paisley Park was not shut down shows a cavalier attitude.

Even his estate the rush to appoint Londell was sloppy and continued with no oversite.

The slagging off by the courts about Patrick Cousin's thief of property. If Mr. Cousins lied on any real estate documents he should be in jail. Why has no action been taken?

Even the FBI docs. Since when can't the FBI trace a phone number?

Lackadaisical responses by the proper authorities on many issues.

Lovejunky said:

PennyPurple said:

IMO, I don't think that anybody had the intention to kill Prince. I think they thought they were trying to help him by acquiring these drugs for him. Little did they know that they were deadly. Once again when you get street drugs, you never know what you are going to get, for all anybody knows, they could be cut with rat poison, who knows what these idiots that make them put in them.

[Edited 5/9/17 19:16pm]

One thing is for sure...

WHOEVER Obtained the Laced Fentanyl will be feeling the weight of what has happened, more than anyone else...even if they are never found out..they have a LIFE sentence

If their intention was to help him...Jeepers...

I would NOT want to be them ...

can U imagine ?

I think we can make a pretty educated guess who it was. Proving it is another matter of course. I seriously doubt it was intentional. I mean, if a person believes that someone tried to poison him on the plane and it failed, what kind of a dumb ass is going to try that again in such a short time span; with all the scrutiny and publicity it generated?

laurarichardson said:

PennyPurple said:

Laura, what is the matter with you? How many times have you told us, that the reason the investigation is still open is because they are looking for the dealer/pusher/maker of these drugs? I think out of your 15,000 posts you are forgetting what you've said. SMDH I think you confuse yourself.

I know full well what the police are saying. I just do not believe that are telling us the whole story which I do not expect them to do while the investigation is on going.

I have never said I do not understand why the investigation is still open. You are the one who seems to be implying " he took illegal pills it is all his fault this is what happens when the addicted use street drugs" this has been your matra over and over again. We get it already.

I live in the real world and I know that when black folk get killed in this country there is not a whole lot of worry about it from the point of the authorities. There is statiscal evidence to back me up on this so it is not just emotionalism as many cases go unsolved and I suspect this case is not going to result in anyone being brought to justice.

Already an asshole travled across state line with controlled substances and has not been charged with anything. ( Breaking many Federal laws)

The principal witness and suspect has lied to the police, is not cooperative, and has not been brought in for questioning. ( The longer they let him roam around the less likely he will be charged with anything which at the bare minium could be a felony)

I hope I made myself clear. I do not need you to explain why the case is open because you only see one angle.

[Edited 5/11/17 5:17am]

Stop right there. See the bolded above. NEVER have I said this is what happens when the addicted use street drugs. DO NOT put words in my mouth. I said You never know what you are going to get when you get street drugs. So just STOP IT RIGHT THERE.

.

And don't bring race into it. This case has nothing to do with race.

.

Usually when people bring race or Hitler into the convo, it's because they've already lost the arguement and the only thing left is to throw those words into it.

laurarichardson said:

PennyPurple said:

According to the Autopsy report he did.

///Then why is the case still open?

To try and determine who procured the pills he OD'd on.

PennyPurple said:

laurarichardson said:

I know full well what the police are saying. I just do not believe that are telling us the whole story which I do not expect them to do while the investigation is on going.

I have never said I do not understand why the investigation is still open. You are the one who seems to be implying " he took illegal pills it is all his fault this is what happens when the addicted use street drugs" this has been your matra over and over again. We get it already.

I live in the real world and I know that when black folk get killed in this country there is not a whole lot of worry about it from the point of the authorities. There is statiscal evidence to back me up on this so it is not just emotionalism as many cases go unsolved and I suspect this case is not going to result in anyone being brought to justice.

Already an asshole travled across state line with controlled substances and has not been charged with anything. ( Breaking many Federal laws)

The principal witness and suspect has lied to the police, is not cooperative, and has not been brought in for questioning. ( The longer they let him roam around the less likely he will be charged with anything which at the bare minium could be a felony)

I hope I made myself clear. I do not need you to explain why the case is open because you only see one angle.

[Edited 5/11/17 5:17am]

Stop right there. See the bolded above. NEVER have I said this is what happens when the addicted use street drugs. DO NOT put words in my mouth. I said You never know what you are going to get when you get street drugs. So just STOP IT RIGHT THERE.

.

And don't bring race into it. This case has nothing to do with race.

.

Usually when people bring race or Hitler into the convo, it's because they've already lost the arguement and the only thing left is to throw those words into it.

If you do not think race plays a role in criminal matters in this country stop living in La La land. Plenty of stats to back up what I am saying. I have no idea what race issues have to do with Hitler and what I am discussing. Because you do not want to acknowledge something does not mean it does not exsist.

You keep telling us " You never know what you are going to get when get street drugs " WTF is that suppose to mean? Don't you think he was addicted? Don't you think he took street drugs and his solely responsible for his stituation? Do you think he did not have any hip problems? Do you think he took these drugs for grins and giggles? Because your statements come across that way to me. It is my opinion. I think you think that is all this case is about? I do not so we have to agree to disagree.

[Edited 5/11/17 6:45am]

herb4 said:

Lovejunky said:

One thing is for sure...

WHOEVER Obtained the Laced Fentanyl will be feeling the weight of what has happened, more than anyone else...even if they are never found out..they have a LIFE sentence

If their intention was to help him...Jeepers...

I would NOT want to be them ...

can U imagine ?

I think we can make a pretty educated guess who it was. Proving it is another matter of course. I seriously doubt it was intentional. I mean, if a person believes that someone tried to poison him on the plane and it failed, what kind of a dumb ass is going to try that again in such a short time span; with all the scrutiny and publicity it generated?

Does the person we suspect seem intelligent to you?

Laura, sounds like you suspect premeditated murder? is that what you mean when you say there's "more to this case" than the "average OD"?

laurarichardson said:

herb4 said:

I think we can make a pretty educated guess who it was. Proving it is another matter of course. I seriously doubt it was intentional. I mean, if a person believes that someone tried to poison him on the plane and it failed, what kind of a dumb ass is going to try that again in such a short time span; with all the scrutiny and publicity it generated?

Does the person we suspect seem intelligent to you?

Why does it seem so farfetched that the same supplier for Prince was the same supplier for the former manager of Grand Slam? Both of them died of drug overdoses. You think people in Prince's entourage weren't in touch with this guy over the years? If he had a habit, they probably knew about it and could access his dealer. Just saying. At this point, anything seems possible.

laurarichardson said:

PennyPurple said:

Stop right there. See the bolded above. NEVER have I said this is what happens when the addicted use street drugs. DO NOT put words in my mouth. I said You never know what you are going to get when you get street drugs. So just STOP IT RIGHT THERE.

.

And don't bring race into it. This case has nothing to do with race.

.

Usually when people bring race or Hitler into the convo, it's because they've already lost the arguement and the only thing left is to throw those words into it.

If you do not think race plays a role in criminal matters in this country stop living in La La land. Plenty of stats to back up what I am saying. I have no idea what race issues have to do with Hitler and what I am discussing. Because you do not want to acknowledge something does not mean it does not exsist.

You keep telling us " You never know what you are going to get when get street drugs " WTF is that suppose to mean? Don't you think he was addicted? Don't you think he took street drugs and his solely responsible for his stituation? Do you think he did not have any hip problems? Do you think he took these drugs for grins and giggles? Because your statements come across that way to me. It is my opinion. I think you think that is all this case is about? I do not so we have to agree to disagree.

[Edited 5/11/17 6:45am]

AGAIN, we are not talking about other cases, we are talking about Prince's case, and race is and was not a factor, IMO.

.

You really must not read what other posters say, or you just can't comprehend, because you sure in the hell haven't comprehended what I've been saying, you have everything so twisted about what other people have said.

laurarichardson said:

herb4 said:

I think we can make a pretty educated guess who it was. Proving it is another matter of course. I seriously doubt it was intentional. I mean, if a person believes that someone tried to poison him on the plane and it failed, what kind of a dumb ass is going to try that again in such a short time span; with all the scrutiny and publicity it generated?

Does the person we suspect seem intelligent to you?

I don't know enough about him to answer that question, honestly. But it would take a special kind of stupid to try and off your friend, your employer and your veritable gravy train TWICE, inside of 2 weeks, with a lot of press coverage and talk of getting Prince into rehab, etc. and ESPECIALLY when there's documented evidence of prescriptions in Paisley Park being written in YOUR OWN FUCKING NAME.

I mean, come on.

You know how I feel about this inside job/conspiracy bullshit in the first place but it's even worse when people really reach like this and suspend common sense for no other reason that, for some reason, they think that Prince having a drug problem is detrimental to his character, tarnishes his image and, worse, that this revelation somehow betrays the misguided faith they placed in Prince as a hero.

I remain convinced that what happened to Prince is not all that complicated nor mysterious and everything I've learned only the last year only makes it simpler to my eyes. I don't think it's at all "fishy" or confusing and it's frustrating to me because, for the most part, everything makes perfect sense.

1Sasha said:

Why does it seem so farfetched that the same supplier for Prince was the same supplier for the former manager of Grand Slam? Both of them died of drug overdoses. You think people in Prince's entourage weren't in touch with this guy over the years? If he had a habit, they probably knew about it and could access his dealer. Just saying. At this point, anything seems possible.

I found an article that said the police found no connection between the two of them but I also found some post from his family members who seemed shocked that he died from an overdose which is similar to Prince's stituation.

herb4 said:

laurarichardson said:

Does the person we suspect seem intelligent to you?

I don't know enough about him to answer that question, honestly. But it would take a special kind of stupid to try and off your friend, your employer and your veritable gravy train TWICE, inside of 2 weeks, with a lot of press coverage and talk of getting Prince into rehab, etc. and ESPECIALLY when there's documented evidence of prescriptions in Paisley Park being written in YOUR OWN FUCKING NAME.

I mean, come on.

You know how I feel about this inside job/conspiracy bullshit in the first place but it's even worse when people really reach like this and suspend common sense for no other reason that, for some reason, they think that Prince having a drug problem is detrimental to his character, tarnishes his image and, worse, that this revelation somehow betrays the misguided faith they placed in Prince as a hero.

I remain convinced that what happened to Prince is not all that complicated nor mysterious and everything I've learned only the last year only makes it simpler to my eyes. I don't think it's at all "fishy" or confusing and it's frustrating to me because, for the most part, everything makes perfect sense.

You did not look at the CBS news interview? Did you read the dumbass lies he told in the police from the search warrant? Do you realize that he has been refered to as a business manager on the last tour? Don't you think it is troublesome to have the man who is handling your money involved with drugs that killed you?

He was also VP of LFOA which we are now finding out had property stolen from it under his watch.

He disappeared and went on vacation right after the death and spent time on a cell phone while his best friend was found in a state of rigor motis. It appears his home, person or car were not searched. He has never been taken in for questioning.

Everything does not have to be a conspiracy and sometimes people hide in plain sight.

That statement seems pretty clear to me: A buyer can't be certain the actual chemical composition of street drugs. The drugs might look like, say, Percocet but actually contain fentanyl.

-

Seems pretty straightforward...

laurarichardson said:

You keep telling us " You never know what you are going to get when get street drugs " WTF is that suppose to mean?