laurarichardson said:

Mumio said:

BillieBalloon said:

Neal Karlen, journalist and friend CONFIRMED Prince had hip surgery around 2010. The pain was real, there's no projection

So, in spite of what was said that Prince wasn't seeing any doctors, he apparently did so. Would you know if this surgery was done in the US? Why doesn't anyone think he may have been receiving health care outside of the US to maintain his privacy? After all, he had access to a plane and he did have the Turks/Caicos home. He could have very easily had a physician elsewhere. It's not uncommon for celebrities to have care provided in other countries.

Billy Sparks stated that the procedure was done abroad.

PennyPurple said:

babynoz said:

Mumio said:

So, in spite of what was said that Prince wasn't seeing any doctors, he apparently did so. Would you know if this surgery was done in the US? Why doesn't anyone think he may have been receiving health care outside of the US to maintain his privacy? After all, he had access to a plane and he did have the Turks/Caicos home. He could have very easily had a physician elsewhere. It's not uncommon for celebrities to have care provided in other countries.

Billy Sparks stated that the procedure was done abroad.

Well there you go then. He could have been seeing a doctor all along and we just don't know about it because it wasn't here in the US.

My question is,

Prince waited outside a pharmacy waiting for a prescription that Kirk was picking up. Then ends up accidentally taking a mislabeled drug?

If he already had that mislabeled drug lying around, why be so jumpy waiting for a prescription?

I guess it's possible that the prescription was for something else other than the script that he was addicted to.

Sad that the release of the documents raises more questions. I was hoping it put everything to rest.

Mumio said:

HatrinaHaterwitz said:

I'm not saying Kirk is or isn't responsible because I still don't know what the hell happened yet. But to answer your question of why would the rest of the pills have been left? I'd say for the plausibility of making it look like Prince was just another pill popping junkie super star that OD'd.

Hi Hatrina, good to see you. Except that we are also being told that Prince went to great lengths to hide this addiction for many years. The person who packed for him said he'd never seen anything. Associates, etc...claim never to have seen anything. P leaving pills all over the place like that doesn't fit at all. Kirk would know that of course.

[Edited 4/17/17 17:36pm]

It's good to see you too!

I agree with you there, which is why I'm not convinced Kirk is responsible. Could have been a recently jilted lover that knew about Kirk and the pills and saw that as an opportunity and took it.

[Edited 4/17/17 17:49pm]

PennyPurple said:

Tresha68 said:

Ondansetron Hydrochloride. Is used after chemotherapy and radiation for nasauea. laurarichardson said:

I do not believe it states that in the search warrent. Please see the info from one of the search warrants. Highlight some things people on this board need to take note of.

Your affiant, Detective Tyler Stahn, is a licensed peace officer with the State of Minnesota and has been employed by the Carver County Sheriff’s Office since July 2010. Detective Stahn is currently assigned to the Investigations Division. As part of Detective Stahn’s assignment, he has learned the following: On April 14, 2016, Your Affiant is aware that Prince Rogers Nelson DOB 06/07/1978 travelled to Atlanta, GA for a concert. Among those travelling with Prince during this trip was Kirk Anthony Johnson DOB 9/22/ 1964. Prince boarded a flight on April 15, 2016 to return to Minneapolis. While en route to Minneapolis, Prince suffered a medical emergency and the flight had to make an emergency landing in Moline, IL. The Doctor who treated Prince documented Prince as suffereing from an opiate overdose, however, Prince refused treatment at the hospital. Johnson told hospital staff Prince may have taken Percocet.

May have taken it so this is the reason this got out to the media.

Prince was released from the hospital later that morning. On April 21, 2016 at approximately 0945hrs, Carver County Sheriff Deputies were dispatched to a medical at Paisley Park, 7801 Audubon Road in the city of Chanhassen, where a person was found not breathing. At approximately 0948hrs, Deputies arrived on scene and located the victim identified as Prince. Prince was found unresponsive and was pronounced dead at the scene. Your Affiant learned that Prince recently had a history of going through withdrawals, which were believed to be the result of the abuse of prescription medication.

Notice the word recent. Maybe as recent as January or within the last year.

Through this investigation, Investigators discovered controlled substances in Prince’s residence. Autopsy results have shown that Prince died as the result of an accidental overdose via the use of an opiate drug known as Fentynal. A Prescription Monitoring Warrant was issued as a part of this investigation. The results of that search warrant have shown that Prince was not prescribed any of the controlled substances located in the residence. Your Affiant has learned through this investigation that Kirk Johnson was known to have contacted a Minnesota doctor, Dr. Schulenberg, to help Prince with regards to hip pain. Dr. Schulenberg met with Prince and prescribed him Clonidine, Hydroxyzine Pamoate and Diazepam.

Who writes these types of Rx for hip pain? Anxiety meds and high blood pressure and maybe seizure med.

On 4/20/2016, Johnson went to Walgreen’s in Minnetonka, located at 4950 Co Rd 101, and picked up Prince’s prescription medication. Johnson told Investigators this was the first time he had ever done something like that for Prince. During a search warrant executed at Paisley Park on 4/21/2016 (the day Prince was found deceased), a suitcase was found in Prince’s bedroom next to his bed. Among the items inside that suitcase were prescription pill bottles in the name of Johnson. A closer examination of those pill bottles revealed that not all the pills inside the containers were the pills listed on the prescription. One of the pill bottles, a Vitamin D bottle, was found to contain the controlled substance Ondanselron Hydrochloride. A second prescription bottle, said to contain Ondansetron, was found to contain the controlled substance Acetarninophen/oxycodone hydrochloride. The date those medications were prescribed to Johnson, according to the pill bottles, was 4/7/2016. The medications were prescribed by Dr. Schulenberg. Johnson told Investigators he was unaware Prince was addicted to pain medication.

Realize the doctor is suppose to be seeing for withdrawal has prescribed him a powerful pain killer that can make your stomach upset but is also giving him something for upset stomach.

and giving him drugs that do not interact well oxycodone.

To make sure oxycodone is safe for you, tell your doctor if you have:

• any type of breathing problem or lung disease;

• a history of head injury, brain tumor, or seizures;

• a history of drug abuse, alcohol addiction, or mental illness;

• urination problems;

• liver or kidney disease;

• Addison's disease or other adrenal gland disorder;r

• problems with your gallbladder, pancreas, or thyroid; or

• if you use a sedative like Valium (diazepam, alprazolam, lorazepam, Ativan, Klonopin, Restoril, Tranxene, Versed, Xanax, and others).

Your Affiant is aware that Johnson was Prince’s bodyguard and close personal friend. Your Affiant is aware that Johnson has been working with/for Prince since the 1980’s. Your Affiant is aware that Johnson was one of the few people who had unrestricted access to Paisley Park. Your Affiant is aware there was a sizable amount of narcotic medications located inside Paisley Park. The narcotic medications recovered inside Paisley Park were not located in just one area, but rather, were located in various pill containers throughout the residence. Many of those areas where the pills were located would COPIES TO: COURT 0 PROS.ATTY 0 PEACE OFFICER Application 1—3 be places Prince would frequent, such as his bedroom and wardrobe/laundry room. Your Affiant is aware that many of the narcotic medications were stored in containers that did not signify they were narcotic medications; for example, narcotic medications were located inside over-the-counter vitamin bottles. Based on the above described information, Your Affiant finds it reasonable that Johnson would have had knowledge of Prince’s abuse of prescription/narcotic medication.

I really think Kirk is just not that bright as to think the police would believe him and not follow up on his comments.

If all these pills were in the bedroom, laundry room and closet / wardrobe I could see Kirk not going into those rooms, but what about a cleaning person. certainly P didn't vacuum himself, lol.

this whole thing is sad all the way around. So much sad from all directions and people. Sad and disturbing.

rogifan said:

206Michelle said:

The information today points strongly in the direction of Prince having opioid addiction/abuse. Again, addiction is not a character flaw; it is a disease. It requires treatment.

.

Also, it's clear that Kirk knew what was going on because the prescriptions were in his name.

But there isn't really new information. My understanding is most of this was already known because people saw search warrant information before it was sealed or stuff leaked to the media. And I think pretty much everyone suspected Kirk knew what was going on and was probably involved in some way.

But at least it's not suspicion anymore that he was abusing opioids. So much of the arguments and poo slinging on this website come from people having suspicions or speculating, or reading too much between the lines. So it's nice to actually have some strong evidence to indicate what actually happened. Otherwise, fans on this site and the tabloids (e.g. Daily Mail) can spin all kinds of crazy stories about Prince.

disch said:

I'm sorry to hear about your pain. That sounds really tough.

-

As for P, what I'm saying is what I said: We don't have facts, one way or the other, about the role that chronic pain played in his life at the end of his life. To me, having had previous surgery doesn't necessarily prove that he was incapacitated by chronic pain 6 years later. I mean, the purpose of surgery is to alleviate the pain (and I certainly know that surgery isn't always succesful in that; my point is, we don't have facts about what the outcome of his surgery was).

-

That's not the same as saying chronic pain was not an issue for him, and that certainly doesn't minimize the affect that chronic pain has on many other people. That's basically the extent of what I'm getting at on this, and I've pretty extensively shared my other related thoughts in previous posts.

babynoz said:

If you have never dealt with chronic pain issues then be thankful but you can't know what it's like if it hasn't happened to you.

I have lower back pain daily from an injury I sustained in 2007. Last year this time I could barely get out of bed.

I'm really crestfallen at the way people are minimizing chronic pain sufferers legitimate challenges. There are times that I've sat on the bed and literally cried because I was so tired of being in pain, but afraid to take meds because I don't want to become dependent.

I am in some degree of pain every single day and have to decide every morning if I can get along without meds that day. Most days Excedrin suffices but I have percs for the worst days.

As I have already pointed out. Prince has scarring consistent with having a hip procedure done according to the ME, so I can't imagine what kind of proof you are looking for? I don't know what else to say except that there is even less basis to say that he was medicating for any other reason.

What are you getting at and on what basis do you present an alternative scenario???

[Edited 4/17/17 17:25pm]

Perhaps if you did some reading on the success rate of hip replacement/maintenance procedures you'd understand better what he was likely dealing with.

Again, since it's a given that proof isn't forthcoming via medical records that none of us will be privy to, on what basis do you have doubts and what is your alternative theory for what led to the addiction if it wasn't pain?

PennyPurple said:

GimmeThat said:

PennyPurple said:

I think Judith was a little too old for him. She's in her 30's after all.

That is EXACTLY what I thought when I read that she was 31!

Genesia said:

luv4u said:

Is Kirk going to be used as the 'scapegoat' ???

Is nailing him or anyone involved for that matter going to bring Prince back?

He isn't a scapegoat if he committed a crime. (Please note the use of "if.")

The investigation is ongoing so we'll all have to see where it leads.

LOVESYMBOLNUMBER2 said:

Did anyone ever hear any details about why the original Atlanta show was canceled? I know they said flu, but more than likely it was drug related, so how many times did he have to have a near death experience before someone helped him? It just seem pretty clear that the moline incident was not the first red flag for his people and family. Three weeks between the original atlanta show and the day he dies seems like one person could have done one damn thing in that amount of time.

Prince had an iron will about certain things (e.g. his privacy, having commercial and creative control of his music). It's becoming more obvious to me that other people knew he had a problem. Maybe some of these people tried to help him get help and he refused the help.

.

I wonder how much certain friends or family who were in contact with him close to the time of his death knew or did not know about his addiction? The people who come to mind are Damaris Lewis, Tamron Hall, Shelby J, and Tyka. Both Shelby J and Tyka have shared that he knew his days were numbered.

Did Kirk live at Paisley Park?

Hmm sounds like we're just on a different page here. That's OK. I don't know how else to explain that we don't have any factual info about the role chronic pain played in his life at the end of his life. (If you have factual info, please share!) Saying that we don't have the facts is not the same thing as saying it didn't play a role.

-

As for what led to his addiction: I think what you're asking is why he took that first opioid pill? I think I've already said what I think a few times in this thread. Physical pain is definitely a possible reason; it seems likely, given what we know about his past. Or it's possible it was another reason, like something emotional. (I know it's very important for some people to identify why he first opioids, because it's a moral issue for them, but it's just not really a moral thing for me.)

-

The most pressing issue for me isn't why his relationship with opioids started; it's where it ended.

-

And again, sorry about the pain you're dealing with

babynoz said:

disch said:

I'm sorry to hear about your pain. That sounds really tough.

-

As for P, what I'm saying is what I said: We don't have facts, one way or the other, about the role that chronic pain played in his life at the end of his life. To me, having had previous surgery doesn't necessarily prove that he was incapacitated by chronic pain 6 years later. I mean, the purpose of surgery is to alleviate the pain (and I certainly know that surgery isn't always succesful in that; my point is, we don't have facts about what the outcome of his surgery was).

-

That's not the same as saying chronic pain was not an issue for him, and that certainly doesn't minimize the affect that chronic pain has on many other people. That's basically the extent of what I'm getting at on this, and I've pretty extensively shared my other related thoughts in previous posts.

[Edited 4/17/17 17:25pm]

Perhaps if you did some reading on the success rate of hip replacement/maintenance procedures you'd understand better what he was likely dealing with.

Again, since it's a given that proof isn't forthcoming via medical records that none of us will be privy to, on what basis do you have doubts and what is your alternative theory for what led to the addiction if it wasn't pain?

Ingela said:

206Michelle said:

GimmeThat said:

PennyPurple said:

I think Judith was a little too old for him. She's in her 30's after all.

That is EXACTLY what I thought when I read that she was 31!

I see her parents every Saturday in Los Angeles playing (on bass and keys) in a church band. Once I was tempted to ask how Judith's faring, but I chose not to pry.

206Michelle said:

LOVESYMBOLNUMBER2 said:

Did anyone ever hear any details about why the original Atlanta show was canceled? I know they said flu, but more than likely it was drug related, so how many times did he have to have a near death experience before someone helped him? It just seem pretty clear that the moline incident was not the first red flag for his people and family. Three weeks between the original atlanta show and the day he dies seems like one person could have done one damn thing in that amount of time.

Prince had an iron will about certain things (e.g. his privacy, having commercial and creative control of his music). It's becoming more obvious to me that other people knew he had a problem. Maybe some of these people tried to help him get help and he refused the help.

.

I wonder how much certain friends or family who were in contact with him close to the time of his death knew or did not know about his addiction? The people who come to mind are Damaris Lewis, Tamron Hall, Shelby J, and Tyka. Both Shelby J and Tyka have shared that he knew his days were numbered.

[Edited 4/17/17 18:09pm]

disch said:

I think at the end of his life, the thing that was killing him (and did kill him) was his opioid addiction. I don't believe he died of joint pain.

-

In other words, his physical addiction to opioids had driven him to do various less-than-ideal things such as acquire black-market drugs and get a doctor to prescribe drugs in his friend's name. So it's hard to say what role hip pain played in the final stage of a situation where clearly lies and deception were sadly going on.

-

No, why did he take that first opioid pill, whenever that was? Who knows? It certainly might have been physical pain. But whatever the reason for that initial exposure, by the end it had taken a different, tragic turn into addiction.

-

And the whole "recreational use" thing is something I have trouble with. For some reason, some people are comfortable with with the idea of illicit use of opioids to self-medicate physical pain, but are repelled by illicit opioids to self-medicate emotional pain, which gets dumped into the "recreational use" bucket. But that's a debate that's happened many times here and not really part of this.

babynoz said:

The whole point is: We have no idea the veracity of the "hip pain" statement. The evidence is strong, however, that he was addicted to opioids and was struggling with that addiction and the suffereing that withdrawal was causing.



I'm confused. Are you implying that Prince was became addicted as a recreational user and not due to legitimate pain issues?

EMOTIONAL pain can be every bit as tormenting and crazy-making as physical pain...maybe moreso.

Mumio said:

Anyone questioned for even one minute if there were pills found all over PP and the notion that Kirk is responsible for what happened to P, then why would someone who has had open access to PP for YEARS not have gone around and cleaned up all the pill evidence before the police arrived? He bought bad shit for P, planted it in pill bottles, and then just LEFT it all there so the cops would find it and look at him????

Sorry but nope, not buying that bs for one minute. If he was that devious, the evidence wouldn't have been left there

co sign Mumio...

Additionally...Wouldnt the snap lock bags and envelopes containing the unsubscribes substances have been fingerprinted ( ? )

If Kirk had anything to do with them at all he would have been positively incriminated by now !

Also....Do we really believe that Prince left pills scattered all over the place..He had cleaning staff.....I dont buy that he was so Loopy as some have suggested, that he randomly left them here and there...? The man was meticulous ...leaving pills lying around at the risk that they would be discovered does not match the Profile of someone who was as attentive to the smallest details as Prince was....

PennyPurple said:

Strawberrylova123 said:

can someone please explain why would prince need a pulse device and a blood pressure cuff.

I don't think it's unusual, he was 57. I'm only 54 and have those in my house, because my hubby has high blood pressure. It comes with age and high blood pressure.

I agree. My mom is a nurse and she always kept a stethoscope and blood pressure cuff in a drawer at home when I was a kid...I think she still does.

DD55 said:

206Michelle said:

Prince had an iron will about certain things (e.g. his privacy, having commercial and creative control of his music). It's becoming more obvious to me that other people knew he had a problem. Maybe some of these people tried to help him get help and he refused the help.

.

I wonder how much certain friends or family who were in contact with him close to the time of his death knew or did not know about his addiction? The people who come to mind are Damaris Lewis, Tamron Hall, Shelby J, and Tyka. Both Shelby J and Tyka have shared that he knew his days were numbered.

Sorry to come across nasty, but where was Larry F%$king Graham??? Or was he the one who got P hooked. P spent 15 years trying to bring to life L’s dead career at the expense of his own. why? Sorry….. had to say that. Mods, delete as necessary.

edit typo

[Edited 4/17/17 18:09pm]

Purplebflogirl said:

IMHO from what they know..there is enough to arrest Kirk.. And strip Dr.S of his license..As he admitted to writing the prescription in Kirk's name to protect Prince's privacy. I know Prince financially supported many people..and again IMHO if they really loved him they should of called Dr Kornfeld long ago.. Prince might of been extremely mad at them,may of cut them off financially but...He would probably be alive..

Lovejunky said:

I once had an older friend have me go to her house while she was in the hospital.

She told me all the places she had hid her prescription narcotic drugs. She wanted me to hold them for her until she got out of the hospital. She was afraid her son would look for them and take them from her.

She hid them in her bedroom, dressing room/closet, inside the pockets of specific clothing items.

I asked no questions and did as I was told.

Life is strange. Too strange for me sometimes. I learned long ago not to ask too many questions. All they do is make things stranger.

[Edited 4/17/17 18:19pm]

Off to do something more positive...