cra1g0s said:

I was wondering why there was little word on the investigation a few weeks ago but what else is there to really say..?

We already know that Prince died of a Fentanyl overdose and we also know that opioid abuse is a real problem in the US and Fentanyl (as a synthetic opioid) is the cause of many more drug related deaths in society, but Prince's death was one of many. It makes me sad as a fan, especially watching his live performances on YT, or thinking back to when I saw him in concert. I wish it could be different but it is the way it is.

The illegal trade in opioids and cross-contamination with just a few grammes of Fentanyl is the unfortunate danger and risk you take if you decide to acquire these types of meds illegally. Do we need to find the supplier, I guess so. It's illegal activity that is affecting many people so the trade in these drugs should be stopped, but will it ever be? As long as there are people who want drugs then there will be a market. I'm sure the police want to conclude the investigation at some point but Prince's death isn't going to stop this infortunately

Prince was given a warning on that flight, he didn't heed it and wasn't able to, being in the grip of opioid addiction. Lenny Kravitz had mentioned previously that he knew something was going on but there are just glimpses of the truth that we're being given. It doesn't even matter that people aren't coming out and saying, look, this is how it was. It's not going to bring Prince back and I can actually understand that his friends and ex-bandmates want to protect the privacy that Prince had during his lifetime.

None of this matters though, Prince's death wasn't murder, there's no conspiracy but Prince's access to drugs and his functioning addiction (because this is what it was) led him down a dangerous road and seemingly contaminated meds was the cause.

It sucks (big time) but that's what we are left with and for once I really just think we should focus on the incredible music and legacy we were left with. Prince's death will not define him or his legacy, thankfully - his music will do that.

Great post.

The New York Times has a piece on Prince's death online today. I apologize for not knowing how to post the link. Basically, it says what we have all been saying, and what we know. The investigators have nothing, nobody seems to know anything, and the six siblings are split into two factions and are still fighting each other.

fortuneandserendipity said:

^^

https://qz.com Pills thought to have killed Prince (pills supposedly discontinued in 2013)

I know this may go in circles, but here goes:

If P was not aware that these pills were made of a cocktail and thought they were true "pharmacueticals", BUT was getting them illegally, one would think that anyone would do a quick search of the stamp to see what had been purchased, hence the knowledge that these pills were not valid/expired. OTOH, my father is a retired pharmacist, I've inquired as to why someone would create a pill with the incorrect stamp supposing to be a milder opiate. His answer was that possibly (if the stamp was intentional, and P knew about it), that in the event anyone was caught travelling with these illicit pills, the charge would not be as severe(?) Not sure how true the AP article is, but it states the number of pills found at PP as well as the supposed fact that these pills were in Moline with him as well. If that's the case, why no trouble with the law (carrying opiates without an Rx, regardless)

dustoff said:

In today's NY Times:

https://www.nytimes.com/2017/04/07/arts/music/princes-death-one-year-later-unsolved-mysteries.html

"Prince's Death: One Year Later, Unsolved Mysteries"

Hold the phone...there's a quote in this article that states "Even though Prince's final dose and exit was illicit" Dr Johnson says "the reason he needed it was because of the years of prescrptions that got him on that path."

Was this a guess on the Dr.'s part?! Or is he aware of prescriptions that were given to Prince prior to the 12 months before his death?

double post

[Edited 4/7/17 9:39am]

precioux said:

dustoff said:

In today's NY Times:

https://www.nytimes.com/2017/04/07/arts/music/princes-death-one-year-later-unsolved-mysteries.html

"Prince's Death: One Year Later, Unsolved Mysteries"

Hold the phone...there's a quote in this article that states "Even though Prince's final dose and exit was illicit" Dr Johnson says "the reason he needed it was because of the years of prescrptions that got him on that path."

Was this a guess on the Dr.'s part?! Or is he aware of prescriptions that were given to Prince prior to the 12 months before his death?

Bingo! I noticed the exact same thing. Who is Dr Johnson and how does he know this?

precioux said:

fortuneandserendipity said:

^^

https://qz.com Pills thought to have killed Prince (pills supposedly discontinued in 2013)

I know this may go in circles, but here goes:

If P was not aware that these pills were made of a cocktail and thought they were true "pharmacueticals", BUT was getting them illegally, one would think that anyone would do a quick search of the stamp to see what had been purchased, hence the knowledge that these pills were not valid/expired. OTOH, my father is a retired pharmacist, I've inquired as to why someone would create a pill with the incorrect stamp supposing to be a milder opiate. His answer was that possibly (if the stamp was intentional, and P knew about it), that in the event anyone was caught travelling with these illicit pills, the charge would not be as severe(?) Not sure how true the AP article is, but it states the number of pills found at PP as well as the supposed fact that these pills were in Moline with him as well. If that's the case, why no trouble with the law (carrying opiates without an Rx, regardless)

It has been discussed numerous times how was he able to fly around with a big bag of pills and never get caught. Even when you fly private bags are checked. Chris Gatither even said on CNN that he packed Prince's bags until the week he had off and that there was never any drugs in his bags.

How is a person abusing these drugs but know one is noticing? I do not mean taking a normal dosage I mean abusing them to the point of being gravely ill?

If he really thought he was taking the real expired pills I would think he was managing them fine until this bad batch got in to his supply. Would that not explain why he told the promotor his stomach was hurting in Atlanta, the chefs said his stomacth was hurting, and Adrian said he told him he was still feeling bad and wanted to check with his doctor before booking more shows?

It just does not sound like the sort of thing that would go on if he knew he was taking Fentenyl.

DD55 said:

precioux said:

Hold the phone...there's a quote in this article that states "Even though Prince's final dose and exit was illicit" Dr Johnson says "the reason he needed it was because of the years of prescrptions that got him on that path."

Was this a guess on the Dr.'s part?! Or is he aware of prescriptions that were given to Prince prior to the 12 months before his death?

Bingo! I noticed the exact same thing. Who is Dr Johnson and how does he know this?

Well I know the investigators would have discovered by this time if he had an Rx in the past.

laurarichardson said:

precioux said:

I know this may go in circles, but here goes:

If P was not aware that these pills were made of a cocktail and thought they were true "pharmacueticals", BUT was getting them illegally, one would think that anyone would do a quick search of the stamp to see what had been purchased, hence the knowledge that these pills were not valid/expired. OTOH, my father is a retired pharmacist, I've inquired as to why someone would create a pill with the incorrect stamp supposing to be a milder opiate. His answer was that possibly (if the stamp was intentional, and P knew about it), that in the event anyone was caught travelling with these illicit pills, the charge would not be as severe(?) Not sure how true the AP article is, but it states the number of pills found at PP as well as the supposed fact that these pills were in Moline with him as well. If that's the case, why no trouble with the law (carrying opiates without an Rx, regardless)

It has been discussed numerous times how was he able to fly around with a big bag of pills and never get caught. Even when you fly private bags are checked. Chris Gatither even said on CNN that he packed Prince's bags until the week he had off and that there was never any drugs in his bags.

How is a person abusing these drugs but know one is noticing? I do not mean taking a normal dosage I mean abusing them to the point of being gravely ill?

If he really thought he was taking the real expired pills I would think he was managing them fine until this bad batch got in to his supply. Would that not explain why he told the promotor his stomach was hurting in Atlanta, the chefs said his stomacth was hurting, and Adrian said he told him he was still feeling bad and wanted to check with his doctor before booking more shows?

It just does not sound like the sort of thing that would go on if he knew he was taking Fentenyl.

Explains the bottles they were found in. That's kind of obvious, unfortunately. Easier not trying to spin it.

It's ashame, because a doctor wouldn't have known what to look for unless he saw the actual pills, then he would have been able to identify if they were counterfeit. I doubt a regular non-medical person could spot the fake, most people don't inspect their pills that closely. And a wealthy person? I'm sure there was a degree of assumption, that wealth equaled access.

morningsong said:

dustoff said:

In today's NY Times:

https://www.nytimes.com/2017/04/07/arts/music/princes-death-one-year-later-unsolved-mysteries.html

"Prince's Death: One Year Later, Unsolved Mysteries"

Wow they sure phoned this article in. Expect the NY times to do a little better. It's like, "Well we have to run a death anniversary story, let's just cut and paste and call it a day".

morningsong said:

laurarichardson said:

It has been discussed numerous times how was he able to fly around with a big bag of pills and never get caught. Even when you fly private bags are checked. Chris Gatither even said on CNN that he packed Prince's bags until the week he had off and that there was never any drugs in his bags.

How is a person abusing these drugs but know one is noticing? I do not mean taking a normal dosage I mean abusing them to the point of being gravely ill?

If he really thought he was taking the real expired pills I would think he was managing them fine until this bad batch got in to his supply. Would that not explain why he told the promotor his stomach was hurting in Atlanta, the chefs said his stomacth was hurting, and Adrian said he told him he was still feeling bad and wanted to check with his doctor before booking more shows?

It just does not sound like the sort of thing that would go on if he knew he was taking Fentenyl.

Explains the bottles they were found in. That's kind of obvious, unfortunately. Easier not trying to spin it.

It's ashame, because a doctor wouldn't have known what to look for unless he saw the actual pills, then he would have been able to identify if they were counterfeit. I doubt a regular non-medical person could spot the fake, most people don't inspect their pills that closely. And a wealthy person? I'm sure there was a degree of assumption, that wealth equaled access.

Does she think they're going to examine his vitamin c, aspirin bottles? Just not gonna happen.

morningsong said:

laurarichardson said:

It has been discussed numerous times how was he able to fly around with a big bag of pills and never get caught. Even when you fly private bags are checked. Chris Gatither even said on CNN that he packed Prince's bags until the week he had off and that there was never any drugs in his bags.

How is a person abusing these drugs but know one is noticing? I do not mean taking a normal dosage I mean abusing them to the point of being gravely ill?

If he really thought he was taking the real expired pills I would think he was managing them fine until this bad batch got in to his supply. Would that not explain why he told the promotor his stomach was hurting in Atlanta, the chefs said his stomacth was hurting, and Adrian said he told him he was still feeling bad and wanted to check with his doctor before booking more shows?

It just does not sound like the sort of thing that would go on if he knew he was taking Fentenyl.

Explains the bottles they were found in. That's kind of obvious, unfortunately. Easier not trying to spin it.

It's ashame, because a doctor wouldn't have known what to look for unless he saw the actual pills, then he would have been able to identify if they were counterfeit. I doubt a regular non-medical person could spot the fake, most people don't inspect their pills that closely. And a wealthy person? I'm sure there was a degree of assumption, that wealth equaled access.

Chances are, he wouldn't. By all accounts, the counterfeit pills in Prince's possession had the exact markings of a legit opioid. No doctor would have known just by looking at them that they weren't as billed. A pharmacist - maybe. But it probably would have taken an actual test to determine what they were.

Genesia said:

morningsong said:

Explains the bottles they were found in. That's kind of obvious, unfortunately. Easier not trying to spin it.

It's ashame, because a doctor wouldn't have known what to look for unless he saw the actual pills, then he would have been able to identify if they were counterfeit. I doubt a regular non-medical person could spot the fake, most people don't inspect their pills that closely. And a wealthy person? I'm sure there was a degree of assumption, that wealth equaled access.

Chances are, he wouldn't. By all accounts, the counterfeit pills in Prince's possession had the exact markings of a legit opioid. No doctor would have known just by looking at them that they weren't as billed. A pharmacist - maybe. But it probably would have taken an actual test to determine what they were.

The odds are better that a doctor would detect the printing difference as opposed to the average non-medical person. Of course there's not guarantee but maybe he'd been armed with enough informations to dig further and maybe test sooner. This is all assuming that the doctor never saw the actual pills and was just told Prince was just taking hydrocodone and trying to treat that. I've never taken actual prescriptions or bottles of pills to doctor's appointments, I just write down on some form what I'm taking.

morningsong said:

Genesia said:

Chances are, he wouldn't. By all accounts, the counterfeit pills in Prince's possession had the exact markings of a legit opioid. No doctor would have known just by looking at them that they weren't as billed. A pharmacist - maybe. But it probably would have taken an actual test to determine what they were.

The odds are better that a doctor would detect the printing difference as opposed to the average non-medical person. Of course there's not guarantee but maybe he'd been armed with enough informations to dig further and maybe test sooner. This is all assuming that the doctor never saw the actual pills and was just told Prince was just taking hydrocodone and trying to treat that. I've never taken actual prescriptions or bottles of pills to doctor's appointments, I just write down on some form what I'm taking.

No offense, but I think you give doctors way too much credit.

Genesia said:

morningsong said:

The odds are better that a doctor would detect the printing difference as opposed to the average non-medical person. Of course there's not guarantee but maybe he'd been armed with enough informations to dig further and maybe test sooner. This is all assuming that the doctor never saw the actual pills and was just told Prince was just taking hydrocodone and trying to treat that. I've never taken actual prescriptions or bottles of pills to doctor's appointments, I just write down on some form what I'm taking.

No offense, but I think you give doctors way too much credit.

Wishful thinking then.

morningsong said:

PurpleDiamonds1 said:

morningsong said:

If Prince knew he was taking any drugs he would not have gone to see Dr S for him to tell him he is taking a drug... He was found the same day he was to get his test results back. That is why Dr S said he was at at PP on the 21st.

Just thinking. He went to Dr S a couple of times in the months preceding death. It's possible that even if the Dr was treating him as best he could, he didn't have enough information to know what he was treating. Like treating a migraine when someone actually has a nail in their head all the medicine in the world won't help until the nail's removed. T'is all I'm speculating. I think people need to conclude Prince was quite use to not revealing things to people. Nobody can help if they have no idea what they're dealing with.

morningsong said:

laurarichardson said:

morningsong said:

Just thinking. He went to Dr S a couple of times in the months preceding death. It's possible that even if the Dr was treating him as best he could, he didn't have enough information to know what he was treating. Like treating a migraine when someone actually has a nail in their head all the medicine in the world won't help until the nail's removed. T'is all I'm speculating. I think people need to conclude Prince was quite use to not revealing things to people. Nobody can help if they have no idea what they're dealing with.

---Dr.S wrote RXs for him no doctor is going to write Rxs without examining you or giving you test. Test results do not lie. Prince had 65k in medical expenses on his inventory report. The medical expenses were generated from something. [Edited 4/7/17 14:12pm]

Yes, a doctor can run test on what he thinks he's looking for but they don't run every single test known to medical-kind everytime someone goes for a visit and say they're sick, even if they are rich.

My bring up the pills was just me speculating that the Dr might have had a better chance at spotting the fake and have some idea what was making Prince sick in the first place. Like he was being exposed to substances his body wasn't use to and didn't need, as opposed to being sick from withdrawal only. Or being treated for withdrawal for one thing when he's actually withdrawing from something else.


We don't know how old those medical expenses are, we don't know if there are other doctors involved, there's a lot we have no answers on.

[Edited 4/7/17 14:38pm]

morningsong said:

morningsong said:

laurarichardson said:

morningsong said:

Yes, a doctor can run test on what he thinks he's looking for but they don't run every single test known to medical-kind everytime someone goes for a visit and say they're sick, even if they are rich.

My bring up the pills was just me speculating that the Dr might have had a better chance at spotting the fake and have some idea what was making Prince sick in the first place. Like he was being exposed to substances his body wasn't use to and didn't need, as opposed to being sick from withdrawal only. Or being treated for withdrawal for one thing when he's actually withdrawing for something else.


We don't know how old those medical expenses are, we don't know if there are other doctors involved, there's a lot we have no answers on.

He wrote Rx's for him which had to be based off some diagnosis. I come in to doctor's office saying I think I have cancer but no doctor is going to write me Rxs for any cancer drug without examing me and running test first no matter who I am or what I say. I am not getting cancer drugs without a exam. Prince went to that doctor for some reason and the inventory sheet is for tax purpose and whatever expenses he had up to when he died. He did not spend 65k on illegal drugs and it got on the inventory sheet.

We don't know what Rxs they could have been, they could have been for diarrhea or rash for all we know, due to respect and mostly confidentiality that information has not been released. There's no single magical withdrawal pill that a Dr can prescribe that'll fix every single possible substance withdrawal known to man. We still don't know if the Dr even knew the full story on what Prince was putting in his mouth, Prince didn't tell people things and we are working on the idea that Prince himself didn't know so how could he relay anything factual to that particular Dr.?

PurpleDiamonds1 said:

morningsong said:

laurarichardson said:

morningsong said:

We don't know what Rxs they could have been, they could have been for diarrhea or rash for all we know, due to respect and mostly confidentiality that information has not been released. There's no single magical withdrawal pill that a Dr can prescribe that'll fix every single possible substance withdrawal known to man. We still don't know if the Dr even knew the full story on what Prince was putting in his mouth, Prince didn't tell people things and we are working on the idea that Prince himself didn't know so how could he relay anything factual to that particular Dr.?

--You win 65k for the runs.

You yourself even stated there was no itemized list on what the 65K was for. I'm not a medical person so I can't even begin to list in vivid detail every single possible prescription that could cost a large sum of money that Prince could have been prescribed. But I've been reading articles since day 1 and I have a pretty good memory of what I've read and if I don't I have many of the articles stored somewhere.

We are all really just grasping a straws here.

I'd like to know if all of the Watson 385 pills contained lethal doses of Fentanyl.