anyone sucesfully been able to explain some the seemingly unacceptable lyrics and philosophy in TRC?

You all know the list.

Serious responses only. Dont want to hear "I dont care about the lyrics or what they really mean. I'm all about that music."

Could you expand what you mean by unacceptable or philosphical lyrics?


I'll begin with Prince was a new Jehovah's Witness, so there was that in it.

[Edited 5/9/16 12:21pm]

It tells a story, doesn't it. Fictional stories don't have to be morally right in order to be interesting.

I dont care about the lyrics or what they really mean. I'm all about that music.

I was one of Jehovah's Witnesses back when this CD came out. Some of the lyrics IIRC wern't exactly in line with the faith. It was an odd album. I just couldn't get into it...and based on the insane prices people are offering for the CD for I probably never will.

paulludvig said:

It tells a story, doesn't it. Fictional stories don't have to be morally right in order to be interesting.

This.

I have to admit this era of Prince I pretty much know nothing about, what was the unacceptable lyrics and such?

homesquid said:

I was one of Jehovah's Witnesses back when this CD came out. Some of the lyrics IIRC wern't exactly in line with the faith. It was an odd album. I just couldn't get into it...and based on the insane prices people are offering for the CD for I probably never will.

Unbelieveable! This was the album that brought me to the org. I have since given it away. Now, people are selling it for $200!

I still have it on mp3, but I have to be honest, I haven't listened to it in a while.

For me this era is up there with the very best. TRC is (my opinion of course) just as good as any of his classic albums, and musicially just sensational. Listen to the last 4 tracks in a row: She Loves Me 4 Me, Family Name, The Everlasting Now, Last December. What a run of music!

And there was the Xenophobia celebration and the ONA Tour...

An unfairly maligned era. I'm really curious as to what music is in the vault from this time (and I hope there's a lot!)

weirdozmedia said:

I actually donated my copy. I was so excited when I got it, but then I listened to it SEVERAL

times and just couldn't 'get into it' - i couldn't dance to it, sing to it or feel Prince from it. I would pass it up to listen to other music of his. I kept it for many years but then I thought someone else might enjoy it more than me.

meagemini2 said:

GirlBrother said:

weirdozmedia said:

I have to admit this era of Prince I pretty much know nothing about, what was the unacceptable lyrics and such?

There's a lyric about black mixing with white being acceptable on a piano keyboard, but not in the real world. There's another song where the lyric infers that all present-day white people should face an uprising by people of colour, for their enslaving of Africans a couple of centuries ago. And the lyric continues, "Goddam Catholics, Protestants, Jews"... or something like that. There's more - just Google the album's lyrics. And on top of the crazy lyrics, it all sounds creepy as fuck. His voice is super slowed down in parts, like Darth Vader in a K-Hole. It's unpleasant.

What the f---?! So I guess he turned his back on that whole "black, white, Puerto Rican everybody just a freakin'" utopia, or was this supposed to be some type of Spooky Electric character spouting nonsense?

It might be best that I just continue pretending this album doesn't exist, lol.

weirdozmedia said:

GirlBrother said:

weirdozmedia said: There's a lyric about black mixing with white being acceptable on a piano keyboard, but not in the real world. There's another song where the lyric infers that all present-day white people should face an uprising by people of colour, for their enslaving of Africans a couple of centuries ago. And the lyric continues, "Goddam Catholics, Protestants, Jews"... or something like that. There's more - just Google the album's lyrics. And on top of the crazy lyrics, it all sounds creepy as fuck. His voice is super slowed down in parts, like Darth Vader in a K-Hole. It's unpleasant.

What the f---?! So I guess he turned his back on that whole "black, white, Puerto Rican everybody just a freakin'" utopia, or was this supposed to be some type of Spooky Electric character spouting nonsense?

It might be best that I just continue pretending this album doesn't exist, lol.

I seriously don't recall that being there. There is a bit of a Martin Luther King speech though - "Jews and Gentiles, Protestants and Catholics, will be able to join hands and sing in the words of the old Negro spiritual, 'Free at last..."

weirdozmedia said:

weirdozmedia said:

GirlBrother said:

weirdozmedia said: There's a lyric about black mixing with white being acceptable on a piano keyboard, but not in the real world. There's another song where the lyric infers that all present-day white people should face an uprising by people of colour, for their enslaving of Africans a couple of centuries ago. And the lyric continues, "Goddam Catholics, Protestants, Jews"... or something like that. There's more - just Google the album's lyrics. And on top of the crazy lyrics, it all sounds creepy as fuck. His voice is super slowed down in parts, like Darth Vader in a K-Hole. It's unpleasant.

What the f---?! So I guess he turned his back on that whole "black, white, Puerto Rican everybody just a freakin'" utopia, or was this supposed to be some type of Spooky Electric character spouting nonsense?

It might be best that I just continue pretending this album doesn't exist, lol.

Man, GirlBrother's description doesn't really do it justice. And the "catholics, protestants, jews" line is the MLK " I have a dream" speech sample! In my opinion its up there with his best. The music is truly interesting, quite far out at times even for Prince, some incredibly musicianship.

If you havent given it a chance, go back to it. Its not Prince pop, it's Prince feeling passionate.

I love this fucking record. I hadn't listened to it for many years, and recently played during a road trip back to Minne. It's absolutely brilliant. It hits me in the same place that albums like Lovesexy and Parade hit me. Totally free.

I got to hear this at a listening session at The Rainbow Children celebration, back in 2001. They gave us lyric books, briefly introduced it, and we heard it front to back in Prince's game room.

Since we had lyric books, there was a lot of focus on the lryics, and I didn't love them at the time. I thought much of it was divisive, which in my heart felt wrong, as my view of religion and spirituality are that they should always be inclusive. I felt very conflicted that Prince was writing lryics about being "banished" for not blindly following a specific translation of the Bible, and saying things in concerts like, "If you don't know Jesus Christ, I ain't got nothin' to say to ya."

Lyrics aside, I was absolutely blown away by the music, and I really felt it was something special and new that Prince had stumbled upon. Inspired! But those lyics.

After the album played, Prince came in, and we got to chat with him about the album, and many other things, for four hours. It was exilharating, at first, to be in the same room as my hero, and even getting a few questions in to get "my moment." But when Larry came in, and the conversation turned to God, I started to find both of them slightly repellent.

They started playing little games like, "Is it better to be a leader or a follower? If you think it's better to be a leader, go to this side of the room. If you think it's better to be leader, you're wrong. The Bible says it's better to be a follower." In one of the NPGMC Ahdio shows that followed, this discussion was referenced as the "Tornado Divide...how many of you were scared when you found yourself opposite the right side?" More division, and now fear mongering.

Larry told a story, when someone asked about being gay. He mentioned how he used to be a cokehead, and that one day he really had to take a look at himself in the mirror, and examine. He likened someone being gay to him being a cokehead. I was feeling sick.

Then, a young woman raised her hand, and mentioned she was a Muslim. She said she took offense to some of the comments being made, especially the bit about "If you don't know Jesus...I ain't got nothin' to say to ya." Prince offered to take her personally into a private studio to play the album to her, and explain it. She declined and looked a little creeped out by invitation. Prince was very direct and seemed anxious to prove.

I left the room feeling like Prince wasn't the man I thought he was, and that he and Larry were trying really hard to convert us to JW's. And I wondered, "If you are so convinced that what you believe is the truth, why do you need to impose your beliefs on other people?" Can you not just feel confident with the belief, and know it in your heart? It's like people who have a disagreement with someone, and feel the need to tell the story to a hundred different people in an effort to get them on their side of the disagreement. If you know you're right, why do you need everyone else to agree with you?

Prince eased up on the proselytizing, as the years passed. But this album was a definite departure for him, in ways both good and bad.

lameless said:

homesquid said:

I was one of Jehovah's Witnesses back when this CD came out. Some of the lyrics IIRC wern't exactly in line with the faith. It was an odd album. I just couldn't get into it...and based on the insane prices people are offering for the CD for I probably never will.

Unbelieveable! This was the album that brought me to the org. I have since given it away. Now, people are selling it for $200!

I still have it on mp3, but I have to be honest, I haven't listened to it in a while.

You still with the Org? If so you need to shun me, an alleged "apostate".

leecaldon said:

SchlomoThaHomo said:

I love this fucking record. I hadn't listened to it for many years, and recently played during a road trip back to Minne. It's absolutely brilliant. It hits me in the same place that albums like Lovesexy and Parade hit me. Totally free.

I got to hear this at a listening session at The Rainbow Children celebration, back in 2001. They gave us lyric books, briefly introduced it, and we heard it front to back in Prince's game room.

Since we had lyric books, there was a lot of focus on the lryics, and I didn't love them at the time. I thought much of it was divisive, which in my heart felt wrong, as my view of religion and spirituality are that they should always be inclusive. I felt very conflicted that Prince was writing lryics about being "banished" for not blindly following a specific translation of the Bible, and saying things in concerts like, "If you don't know Jesus Christ, I ain't got nothin' to say to ya."

Lyrics aside, I was absolutely blown away by the music, and I really felt it was something special and new that Prince had stumbled upon. Inspired! But those lyics.

After the album played, Prince came in, and we got to chat with him about the album, and many other things, for four hours. It was exilharating, at first, to be in the same room as my hero, and even getting a few questions in to get "my moment." But when Larry came in, and the conversation turned to God, I started to find both of them slightly repellent.

They started playing little games like, "Is it better to be a leader or a follower? If you think it's better to be a leader, go to this side of the room. If you think it's better to be leader, you're wrong. The Bible says it's better to be a follower." In one of the NPGMC Ahdio shows that followed, this discussion was referenced as the "Tornado Divide...how many of you were scared when you found yourself opposite the right side?" More division, and now fear mongering.

Larry told a story, when someone asked about being gay. He mentioned how he used to be a cokehead, and that one day he really had to take a look at himself in the mirror, and examine. He likened someone being gay to him being a cokehead. I was feeling sick.

Then, a young woman raised her hand, and mentioned she was a Muslim. She said she took offense to some of the comments being made, especially the bit about "If you don't know Jesus...I ain't got nothin' to say to ya." Prince offered to take her personally into a private studio to play the album to her, and explain it. She declined and looked a little creeped out by invitation. Prince was very direct and seemed anxious to prove.

I left the room feeling like Prince wasn't the man I thought he was, and that he and Larry were trying really hard to convert us to JW's. And I wondered, "If you are so convinced that what you believe is the truth, why do you need to impose your beliefs on other people?" Can you not just feel confident with the belief, and know it in your heart? It's like people who have a disagreement with someone, and feel the need to tell the story to a hundred different people in an effort to get them on their side of the disagreement. If you know you're right, why do you need everyone else to agree with you?

Prince eased up on the proselytizing, as the years passed. But this album was a definite departure for him, in ways both good and bad.

While slavish devotion to any particular interpretation of a Holy Book rarely does anyone any favours, the passion and intensity needed to behave like that can and does sometimes produce great art. Gospel music hits you, whether you're a believer or not, because you can feel the passion in the voices. This is Prince's gospel album.

leecaldon said:

weirdozmedia said:

What the f---?! So I guess he turned his back on that whole "black, white, Puerto Rican everybody just a freakin'" utopia, or was this supposed to be some type of Spooky Electric character spouting nonsense?

It might be best that I just continue pretending this album doesn't exist, lol.

I seriously don't recall that being there. There is a bit of a Martin Luther King speech though - "Jews and Gentiles, Protestants and Catholics, will be able to join hands and sing in the words of the old Negro spiritual, 'Free at last..."

That's exactly what it said.

GirlBrother said:

GirlBrother said:

leecaldon said:

I seriously don't recall that being there. There is a bit of a Martin Luther King speech though - "Jews and Gentiles, Protestants and Catholics, will be able to join hands and sing in the words of the old Negro spiritual, 'Free at last..."

I just had to Google the lyrics...

God damned, white men, Jews and Gentiles, Protestants and Catholics We'll be able to join hands in the words of the old Negro spiritual Free at last, free at last, thank God Almighty, we are free at last

I think after the previous verses, it's clear that the "we'll" in "we'll be able to join hands" are the people of colour, excluding the "God damned, white men, Jews and Gentiles, Protestants and Catholics". I don't even see it as being ambiguous.

No. it's a direct lift from this speech. You've got the quote wrong.

"And when this happens, and when we allow freedom ring, when we let it ring from every village and every hamlet, from every state and every city, we will be able to speed up that day when all of God's children, black men and white men, Jews and Gentiles, Protestants and Catholics, will be able to join hands and sing in the words of the old Negro spiritual:

Free at last! Free at last!

Thank God Almighty, we are free at last"

I was at one of these sessions myself. Might have been a different one as I dont recall Larry coming out but I do recall some people being upset. One girl was in near tears for the "Holocause Aside" line.

Its a bittersweet memory of the one time I got close to him and tarnished by my interpretation of the lyrics. Much of it is in obtuse "code" so perhaps the "its a mirror" thing might work for him but what I'm looking for is the alternative interpretation of those lyrics.

Who are the "other people" when he says "other people's news"?

Does he really think women are subservient to men who then are subserviant to god?(Muse to the Pharoah)

"Holocaust aside?" seriously? comparative atrocities.

All the jewish names in Family Name. Was that in solidatiry or something else?

Then there is this "it cannot be assimilate" thing and black and white and that but not that..>WTF?

Yes it all seems to be incongrous to the MLK quote and the premise "The Rainbow Children" but serious question...does this still include everyone??? what if you are jewish, musilim and really do believe Jesus was really just another nice guy. What if you white as white can be?

SchlomoThaHomo said:

I love this fucking record. I hadn't listened to it for many years, and recently played during a road trip back to Minne. It's absolutely brilliant. It hits me in the same place that albums like Lovesexy and Parade hit me. Totally free.

I got to hear this at a listening session at The Rainbow Children celebration, back in 2001. They gave us lyric books, briefly introduced it, and we heard it front to back in Prince's game room.

Since we had lyric books, there was a lot of focus on the lryics, and I didn't love them at the time. I thought much of it was divisive, which in my heart felt wrong, as my view of religion and spirituality are that they should always be inclusive. I felt very conflicted that Prince was writing lryics about being "banished" for not blindly following a specific translation of the Bible, and saying things in concerts like, "If you don't know Jesus Christ, I ain't got nothin' to say to ya."

Lyrics aside, I was absolutely blown away by the music, and I really felt it was something special and new that Prince had stumbled upon. Inspired! But those lyics.

After the album played, Prince came in, and we got to chat with him about the album, and many other things, for four hours. It was exilharating, at first, to be in the same room as my hero, and even getting a few questions in to get "my moment." But when Larry came in, and the conversation turned to God, I started to find both of them slightly repellent.

They started playing little games like, "Is it better to be a leader or a follower? If you think it's better to be a leader, go to this side of the room. If you think it's better to be leader, you're wrong. The Bible says it's better to be a follower." In one of the NPGMC Ahdio shows that followed, this discussion was referenced as the "Tornado Divide...how many of you were scared when you found yourself opposite the right side?" More division, and now fear mongering.

Larry told a story, when someone asked about being gay. He mentioned how he used to be a cokehead, and that one day he really had to take a look at himself in the mirror, and examine. He likened someone being gay to him being a cokehead. I was feeling sick.

Then, a young woman raised her hand, and mentioned she was a Muslim. She said she took offense to some of the comments being made, especially the bit about "If you don't know Jesus...I ain't got nothin' to say to ya." Prince offered to take her personally into a private studio to play the album to her, and explain it. She declined and looked a little creeped out by invitation. Prince was very direct and seemed anxious to prove.

I left the room feeling like Prince wasn't the man I thought he was, and that he and Larry were trying really hard to convert us to JW's. And I wondered, "If you are so convinced that what you believe is the truth, why do you need to impose your beliefs on other people?" Can you not just feel confident with the belief, and know it in your heart? It's like people who have a disagreement with someone, and feel the need to tell the story to a hundred different people in an effort to get them on their side of the disagreement. If you know you're right, why do you need everyone else to agree with you?

Prince eased up on the proselytizing, as the years passed. But this album was a definite departure for him, in ways both good and bad.

funkyfine said:

SchlomoThaHomo said:

I love this fucking record. I hadn't listened to it for many years, and recently played during a road trip back to Minne. It's absolutely brilliant. It hits me in the same place that albums like Lovesexy and Parade hit me. Totally free.

I got to hear this at a listening session at The Rainbow Children celebration, back in 2001. They gave us lyric books, briefly introduced it, and we heard it front to back in Prince's game room.

Since we had lyric books, there was a lot of focus on the lryics, and I didn't love them at the time. I thought much of it was divisive, which in my heart felt wrong, as my view of religion and spirituality are that they should always be inclusive. I felt very conflicted that Prince was writing lryics about being "banished" for not blindly following a specific translation of the Bible, and saying things in concerts like, "If you don't know Jesus Christ, I ain't got nothin' to say to ya."

Lyrics aside, I was absolutely blown away by the music, and I really felt it was something special and new that Prince had stumbled upon. Inspired! But those lyics.

After the album played, Prince came in, and we got to chat with him about the album, and many other things, for four hours. It was exilharating, at first, to be in the same room as my hero, and even getting a few questions in to get "my moment." But when Larry came in, and the conversation turned to God, I started to find both of them slightly repellent.

They started playing little games like, "Is it better to be a leader or a follower? If you think it's better to be a leader, go to this side of the room. If you think it's better to be leader, you're wrong. The Bible says it's better to be a follower." In one of the NPGMC Ahdio shows that followed, this discussion was referenced as the "Tornado Divide...how many of you were scared when you found yourself opposite the right side?" More division, and now fear mongering.

Larry told a story, when someone asked about being gay. He mentioned how he used to be a cokehead, and that one day he really had to take a look at himself in the mirror, and examine. He likened someone being gay to him being a cokehead. I was feeling sick.

Then, a young woman raised her hand, and mentioned she was a Muslim. She said she took offense to some of the comments being made, especially the bit about "If you don't know Jesus...I ain't got nothin' to say to ya." Prince offered to take her personally into a private studio to play the album to her, and explain it. She declined and looked a little creeped out by invitation. Prince was very direct and seemed anxious to prove.

I left the room feeling like Prince wasn't the man I thought he was, and that he and Larry were trying really hard to convert us to JW's. And I wondered, "If you are so convinced that what you believe is the truth, why do you need to impose your beliefs on other people?" Can you not just feel confident with the belief, and know it in your heart? It's like people who have a disagreement with someone, and feel the need to tell the story to a hundred different people in an effort to get them on their side of the disagreement. If you know you're right, why do you need everyone else to agree with you?

Prince eased up on the proselytizing, as the years passed. But this album was a definite departure for him, in ways both good and bad.

While slavish devotion to any particular interpretation of a Holy Book rarely does anyone any favours, the passion and intensity needed to behave like that can and does sometimes produce great art. Gospel music hits you, whether you're a believer or not, because you can feel the passion in the voices. This is Prince's gospel album.

Pretty much.

emesem said:

anyone sucesfully been able to explain some the seemingly unacceptable lyrics and philosophy in TRC?

You all know the list.

Serious responses only. Dont want to hear "I dont care about the lyrics or what they really mean. I'm all about that music."

I think it's a masterpiece, his last real one.his last really great work.

The lyrics are certainly as enigmatic as anything he's written, but the band and the performances and the production are incredible.

funkyfine said: