Prince knows he can't rely on taking a percentage of sales anymore. His only route is to take an up-front fee and run for it. He would rather let some other numpty (read label) take the hit on low sales... Unfortunately, there aint many numpties left to fall for that one anymore. | |
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For those of you who followed his twitter rants for the past 2 hours last night... It was very embrassing. All of them have been deleted since now.
But you can see he is having trouble finding distribution for PHASE 2. | |
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I was wondering about this back in 2011, after '20ten'. Excellent discussion with some old school orgers: http://prince.org/msg/7/352683
"He's a musician's musician..." | |
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Prince has an unhealthy relationship with the majors. He bitches about them constantly but he keeps going back to them for deals that he expects to be profitable to both parties but are usually doomed from the beginning. I think it went well with Newpower Soul, Musicology and 3121, but every other attempt has ended in drama or disappointment IIRC. + my point is that if majors are "slave owners" as P used to say dramatically, once a former slave is free he doesn't make business with people who own slaves, there's a moral inconsistency here. . On the other hand I don't remember Prince complaining about the small labels that released TRC , NEWS, certain stand-alone singles, or Kobalt who offers a different business model than traditional labels, neither have I heard those complain about him. The expectations were reasonable on both sides and everybody was happy. . We know by experience that Prince isn't always, well... good at dealing directly with customers (CB, NPGMC, Lotusflow3r.com) so maybe being self-distributed isn't the best model for him. Maybe he can just 1. Open a no-subscription online shop and hire professionals to make sure we receive the things we order before the stores do, that they're not VHS TV recordings like The Beautiful Experience tape in 2001 and so on. I'm pretty sure that it's not so difficult to hire reliable staff and to just deliver the music for them to handle. And if physical releases and mailing the stuff is really so hard to deal with, then he can just have an online download store with everything in Flac and there should be no drama: we get what we buy, he gets our money, everyone's happy. 2. Work only with indie labels or alternative "you produce and we just print, distribute and promote" labels such as Kobalt or LiveNation, who are used to that business model, for a "big" album project every once in a while. 3. Keep working with Tidal as long as they get along. . But it's pretty obvious to me that Prince shouldn't even try to go anywhere near WB, Sony or Universal anymore (who I still think are still very much willing to work with him in general, though probably under certain conditions, but are probably very careful with him), and that he should give-up on asking for advances: just pay for producing your music, own it, get whatever money you make from real sales, with the distributor (if any) taking a reasonable percentage on the sales. It's fair and square. . This whole drama with the majors has to end, or be limited to a very few exceptional releases if at some point P feels he has an album he really wants to push (and if he really pushes it indeed). It's been the same circus for 20 years, it's time to move on. And very honestly I think a great winner in this would be... US fans. Because then the music would be released without so many complications. . Of course I'm not in Prince's shoes and maybe he could oppose me very solid arguments explaining why he still wants to work with majors, but I really don't see what's in it for him anymore. A COMPREHENSIVE PRINCE DISCOGRAPHY (work in progress ^^): https://sites.google.com/...scography/ | |
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great post! totally agree!!
it's sad almost 20 years after being "freed" from his conctract, he still shows a lot of animosity and bitterness to "labels" and the way he distributes and what his share should be... it will never change, no many how many different proposals or options there are to distribute music. Prince always thinks he deserves the whole pie. | |
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i caught most of it before i went to bed. it made me cringe so hard i got cramps in my face
etc etc etc. AFTER he's already watched it go down in flames (without promoting it, again), perhaps he'd be better off asking his fans what they actually want from him. which they've been telling him for the better part of 2 decades now. but he won't play. he knows exactly what it is and dangles us that carrot whenever he wants something from us, yet doesn't deliver. decent mp3 files, with the option of getting a hard copy for some of those projects, like say, a decent remaster or vault series. kept it to 1 site since the beginning, 1 site, about the music. whenever he did a high profile gig like the superbowl, boom, look up prince online and be directed to that store. preview clips and interest. instead, he was nowhere to be found, or had a site so weird and without content that of those projects with their corresponding videos, singles, mixes, photo's and info. see it, click it, buy it bruce springsteen has been doing for a while now. that and who would not buy the stuff he released (instead of illegally download it now or just
and true love lives on lollipops and crisps | |
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We don’t mourn artists because we knew them. We mourn them because they helped us know ourselves. | |
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It's all starting to come together now...
-2010 4 year hiatus... Most likely he couldn't get his 3EG album distributed with KOBALT.
-2014 resigns with WB in order to get his masters back.
-2014 no promised PR reissue, claims everything was done and sent to WB, we should "pickett" for it's release."
-2014 releases AOA and PLECTRUM ELECTRUM. Plectrum commercially flops.
-2015 signs with TIDAL, releases HITnRUN PHASE 1, off the charts in the second week under 7,000 copies sold.
-2015 releases PHASE 2 on TIDAL, claims WB/TIDAL will not distribute PHASE 2 for a phsyical release due to "numbers"
... | |
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I don't follow Prince on twitter, but I would LOVE to know what trainwreck tweets did he tweet? | |
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It's not my duty as a customer to set-up my baker's store and oven, nor to hire his employees. My part is to buy his products. His part is to make them and sell them. It's not that complicated. I want to BUY Prince's music (I download some stuff illegally but I actually bought EVERYTHING he's released on his own online stores/sites since the first day of NPGMC, and was a paying member member of EVERY paying website). . I can't be that complicated to create a website, hire a few people, put music online in Flac or hi-def video, and put a safe credit card system in place. OK you need to pay the employees and the server, but if the online store was really full of music to purchase and regularly updated with new material, I think it should be profitable. Others have done it so there has to be a way, no? I'm not saying it's that easy and that I could do it overnight, but I would assume Prince's team has the capacity to organize this and that he has the financial capacity to invest in the project before it's online. And if he really won't do that again, there's Tidal, Bandcamp, iTunes and countless other services where the whole system is in place, so just give 'em the goods and cash in. . Prince wanted to break the business model of the music industry 20 years ago. OK he didn't anticipate streaming sites and illegal filesharing and that's not what he wanted, but still the business model has been broken and new business models can and must be created. Why stick to the old system after 20 years of saying it's wrong? Free the music. . Again I'll give Prince that it's easy for me to say from my living room, that I'm not in his shoes and aware of every aspect of the game. But still, what to do then? Continue to jump from newspapers to record store chains to paying websites to pay-per-download website to small labels to majors to Kobalt/LiveNation to Tidal to streaming sites to free streams on Youtube? Obviously it's not satisfying for either Prince nor his audience. So what? Retire and quit releasing those wonderful albums that, despite what the trolls say, dozens of thousands of people enjoy and whose lives are enlightened by P's music? That would be defeat and P's always been someone to face adversity, so no, I hope not. I know the music industry is facing a severe crisis, but there has to be a satisfactory way to do things. A COMPREHENSIVE PRINCE DISCOGRAPHY (work in progress ^^): https://sites.google.com/...scography/ | |
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A COMPREHENSIVE PRINCE DISCOGRAPHY (work in progress ^^): https://sites.google.com/...scography/ | |
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I just done Prince and HUGE favor, and gave him some great free advise on his twitter. He would be an fool of the HIGHEST order not to take my wise words of wisdom, and run with it. My advise is more than he deserves, but he's just so damn pitiful these days, I felt sorry for him. What advise did I give him? check out my twitter "Waterfaster2012" to find out. I don't feel like typing it again. | |
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I need to help this man. I'm going to create a business plan for a small business that fixes everything for him and send to him (patent it first) and hope he doesn't ruin it. | |
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and true love lives on lollipops and crisps | |
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asking his fans advice on how to distribute PHASE 2. How they should cell the cd's from the fans to the fans | |
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Beyond that conversation What was really sad was me picturing him sitting at his computer all alone on paisley park just needing a friend/someone to talk to. minor keys and drugs don't make a rollerskate jam | |
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Lol, you know he's surrounded by his lackees all the time. Probably wasn't even him typing. | |
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i missed the tweets, but even if it was embarassing, so what? it isn't like we all have never mis-spoken ourselves or gone off on some tangent. prince is a person like the rest of us, imperfect, but still trying. we all feck ep. no one should shame him for that. . in addition the entire arts world has changed. book sales are not what they used to be, CD sales are not what they used to be. online sales of literary and musical works is a brave new world and it's tricky to navigate. files can be stolen and shared in the blink of an eye, traditional copyright law cannot protect against this kind of piracy. . some kind of UBER style arrangement between artist and fan is not inconceivable. it almost even makes sense. but imo the resulting complete loss and voluntary surrender of control over published works makes this maybe not so great. maybe the UBER concept could be tweaked through a system of encrypted checks and balances to guarantee distribution is achieved accurately and honestly. . i think a distribution model whereby prince retains total control of his work would suit him best. he can decide how generous he wants to be about sharing after setting up a vault-like website. maybe even called 'The Vault'. . imo, ideally people would buy directly from prince's website, CD's files (saved on flashdrives? chips that are mailed to consumers? downloads?). i'll go on a shopping spree if prince ever decides to consolidate and offer for sales his: music, artwork, clothing designs, recipes, autobiography, photographs, poetry. i'd love to see his other creative work. . i can imagine a world where we each have our own websites and artwork for sale, eliminating the need for the involvement of corporate giants. we could even use our own currency, but that's another fantasy. . anyway, i'm glad prince is talking to people about his concerns on twitter even if the conversation seems awkward from our point of view. it's our fault if us fans feel prince has to be perfect one hundred percent of the time. no one is that. he should be permitted to just be .. a guy at times. . my 2c
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Stop the Prince Apologists ™ | |
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I don't understand half of the tweets, twats, and twittering that goes on with Prince3eg, but, oh well... Let the birds keep chirping... Someone will figure it out. "Music gives a soul to the universe, wings to the mind, flight to the imagination and life to everything." --Plato
https://youtu.be/CVwv9LZMah0 | |
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Recipes?
What? Like a cookbook? | |
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. well, i admit i'm conjecturing. but i would guess he dabbles in a lot of different things. perfume, for example. remember gett wild? i liked it. i still have the box, bottle and a teensy bit of the scent.. . i'd love to see him take a year off to write a 3D concept book. he could make it ANYthing he wanted, poems, pictures, scratch 'n sniffs he could have weird textile pages (silk? flower petal?) and pop-ups pages (prince strumming his guitar?) and pages that play music when you turn them...his newest CD could even be included. . crystal and gold pages with pop out jewelry (earrings? necklace?) for the fan who turns the page, inside the book could be a digital version of his book, a plug n play game? or just a flash of a video? an interactive offering that fans could experience on their computers at home. the sky ain't the limit for prince, the stars are. . actually, because of prince's cult status i think his fans and detractors would buy any type of book he puts out and a book in 3D (multi faceted concepts bound together in a 'book style' box set thingy) would be really difficult to pirate. . perhaps when he finishes his tour, instead of trying to follow the old format with music publishing houses, he could bust into a new venture with book publishers. i think every single publishing house on the planet would be really, really interested in publishing a book by prince. i'm pretty sure he could find a publisher. . or he could write a screenplay, i bet by now he has a few new ideas, and is much much more seasoned than he was for cherry moon and purple rain. imo, he's got a ton of options, if he comes at the distribution issue sideways, instead of head-on. but then again, i don't really know him so... this is all speculation and imagination so, take it for what it's worth
[Edited 1/6/16 15:32pm] | |
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This is in response to a thread
My art book: http://www.lulu.com/spotl...ecomicskid
VIDEO WORK: http://sharadkantpatel.com MUSIC: https://soundcloud.com/ufoclub1977 | |
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Asking the fans isn't a fair question without establishing some parameters, such as: Don't hate your neighbors. Hate the media that tells you to hate your neighbors. | |
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djThunderfunk said: Asking the fans isn't a fair question without establishing some parameters, such as: I completely agree with your not-so-humble opinion.. | |
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Do u think it really has to do with the low sales that WB and TIDAL doesn't want to distribute PHASE 2? | |
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Because I don't think there's much of a story to be told by Prince in another live action movie like Purple Rain, Under the Cherry Moon, or Graffiti Bridge, plus an animated movie would be better at... deifying him for lack of a better word and reaching 90s kids (like myself) due to nostalgia and the largest amount of other people. Think Disney-Goofy Movie style animation (without dog people) with an iconic, charismatic character like Prince performing to classic songs (with live footage thrown in) in animation in a movie about his iconic 37 year career. I can see it now... it solidifies his place as a legend in pop culture in the present in the same way the MJ and Madonna are seen. Another live action Prince movie would flop, because most people don't know what Purple Rain is anymore, but everyone remembers those animated (non-digitized/non-claymation) Disney classics and if he could get Disney to do something like that and hype it up, then it'd be the perfect time to release re-masters and unrelease Vault material while pullling in record cash for himself. [Edited 1/6/16 17:25pm] [Edited 1/6/16 17:26pm] | |
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That would be really cool, actually!
PRINCE!!! DO THIS!!! | |
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I love Princes music, there is no doubt he is one of the worlds most innovative and defining artists of the last.....lets say 100 years. He is up there with some very big names in regards to having a long lasting and prominent impact on the music scene.
That said, I do also think that in many ways, Prince is his own worst enemy in regards to trying to help his career thrive. When any 2 entities enter into a business arrangement, there has to be a mutual benefit for it to work. In the case of a major label entering into a distribution deal with NPG Records, they need to be making a buck out of it. And to be quite frank, I don't see how they could be based on the sales totals of the last few albums Prince has released.
Sadly, Prince has at times made a habit of "flooding" the market with new material. Even as a committed Prince fan, I still have trouble keeping up with what he is doing. One minute he is releasing an album through a newpaper in the UK, the next hes resigned with WB Records, then the next is "exclusive" on Tidal (only to find a week later its being released on iTunes and physically through record stores). Then in the case of the single release of "Stare" it was initially released as an exclusive on Spotify. My point is, if a committed fan like me can't keep up, what hope does he have of reaching out to the wider music buying audience.
One of the biggest problems that Prince has is his lack of exposure online. He needs a Vevo account, he needs to upload all his old music videos and maybe some selected live performance videos up to Vevo and have them watchable on YouTube. Sure, he might not make any money out of it, but its all about marketing and exposure. The kids and teenagers coming up today who have a keen interest in music will discover Prince and his legacy and may possibly be inspired by it. As it stands, alot of people under 30 these days don't even know who Prince is. This is really sad. The same demographic know who Bowie is, they know who Elton John is, they know who The Beatles are, but the legacy of Prince has faded away and to many people he is merely that dude who had a couple of hits in the 80s.
Following on from this, when Prince does release a new album, its generally met with little in the way of promotion. Occasionally he will pop up on a talk show (e.g. Arsenio Hall) but there is no online campaign, no music videos on Vevo, just nothing...and before you have time to absorb one album, next thing you know, another has just dropped.
As much as it pains me to say this, but if Prince is having trouble getting a suitable deal to distribute Phase 2, he quite likely only has himself to blame. The guy is so fixated on "how much he's getting paid" that the other party in the deal almost ivevitably is going to end up stung in the deal. There are only so many times you can screw people over before your reputation gets around. There is a very likely a widespread belief in the music industry now that Prince is one of the greatest artists we have ever seen, but he is a poison chalice when it comes to entering into a business deal with. And an ever growing number of record labels will be keen to keep their distance any time Prince comes knocking on their door with a new album in hand. | |
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