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Reply #30 posted 12/30/15 2:31pm

Scarfo

laurarichardson said:

Scarfo said:

The word is out among major record labels regarding Prince's childish antics. How can anyone possibly do business with an man who don't honor the terms he signed/aggreed apon? Not to mention why bother releasing an album that's more than likely will flop? Prince's albums flop regularly now. Prince's fanbase has gotten smaller and smaller due to his constant attacking of them (stop and desist orders, and threats of lawsuits), and the quality of his music has dramaticly plummeted. Prince does the tidal streaming service now, because he don't have an choice. No one wants him. Again, Prince has no one to blame but himself. Damn shame.

[Edited 12/30/15 10:34am]

//// Everybody music is flopping with the exception of Taylor Swift and Adele. Name me all the other late 50 somethings that are selling millions? You can't because none are doing so well right now but one thing for sure Prince has managed to survive the whole time he has been fighting with the music industry. He is not living on a crate in the streets.

...and Rhianna...and Eminem...and Beyonce....and Nicki Minaj... (artists who's albums don't flop)

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Reply #31 posted 01/02/16 3:34pm

laurarichardso
n

Scarfo said:



laurarichardson said:


Scarfo said:

The word is out among major record labels regarding Prince's childish antics. How can anyone possibly do business with an man who don't honor the terms he signed/aggreed apon? Not to mention why bother releasing an album that's more than likely will flop? Prince's albums flop regularly now. Prince's fanbase has gotten smaller and smaller due to his constant attacking of them (stop and desist orders, and threats of lawsuits), and the quality of his music has dramaticly plummeted. Prince does the tidal streaming service now, because he don't have an choice. No one wants him. Again, Prince has no one to blame but himself. Damn shame.


[Edited 12/30/15 10:34am]



//// Everybody music is flopping with the exception of Taylor Swift and Adele. Name me all the other late 50 somethings that are selling millions? You can't because none are doing so well right now but one thing for sure Prince has managed to survive the whole time he has been fighting with the music industry. He is not living on a crate in the streets.

...and Rhianna...and Eminem...and Beyonce....and Nicki Minaj... (artists who's albums don't flop)


---- None of these artist are selling 10 and 20 million units like the 1980s Record sales are at an time low. Prince is not on a major label and very artist his age get radio play. All of the artist you name are young and they are going to be in Prince's shoe in about ten years but they will not own their masters and be able to put out their own music
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Reply #32 posted 01/03/16 6:57am

databank

avatar

feeluupp said:

This is not a Prince is over and done thread... But a question I hope gets some good general input, and discussion...

After Lotusflow3r/MPLSOUND which was sold exclusively at TARGET in the U.S. It seems after that Prince had some "speculated" trouble finding a deal with releasing or distributing his upcoming albums. 20Ten was released through magazine and newspaper outlets throughout Europe including Rolling Stone magazine in Germany, Courrier International in France, the Daily Mirror and Record in the U.K. and Ireland, as well as the Het Niewsblad in Belgium, with no official 20Ten release in the U.S. and other countries...

It seems that was a sign of Prince finding it hard to get a major disribution deal in the U.S. and as a result he opted to do an independent distrubition making deals with various news outlets in Europe.

As 20Ten and 2010 passed... It would be four years, the longest Prince has gone without releasing an album, since the eventual release of AOA and Plectrum Electrum in 2014.

During 2010 - 2014 he toured, recorded music as usual, but what transpired to the point that Prince could not get a distributed release during that period. We all know a 3EG album was rumoured for release maybe as early as late 2012. We know that he their was a supposed signing with KOBALT to deliever new music but nothing fell through...

On the George Lopez show in 2011 he stated he was taking a "break" from recording or working on any new projects...

In the summer of 2014 we read from various news outlets that Prince has re-signed with WB with the biggest speculation and rumor of him resigining to the company that he publically fueded with was to own the rights of his masters, in exchange for another "speculated" re release/re-issue of Purple Rain for it's 30th Anniversary.

A few months later no Purple Rain reissue is released, but two Prince albums (AOA and Plectrum Electrum) instead.

As a promotion push for the AOA album was overall minimal at best, with many indictations that WB tried it's harderest to promote the album booking an apperance of Prince on SNL, many billboards, several previews on YouTube of the clip as well as "official" videos for AnotherLove and Marz basically rehashed from the SNL performances... AOA commercially showed a very minimally average commercial showing with over 200,000 copies sold world wide. Plectrum on the other hand was a commercial flop, and after 4 long years of no new album officially released, a lot of the visibility with the lack of strong social media, streaming following, Plectrum became his one of his lowest selling albums behind N.E.W.S and HitnRun: Phase 1, all selling under a dismal 50,000 copies.

... With the high speculation of Prince having trouble getting a new album distributed untill 2014, and then releasing 2 WB albums, with one having a terrible commercial showing... Prince released HitnRun: Phase 1 on TIDAL then a phsyical release amongst NPG Records/ Roc Nation with another very low commercial showing, making it become his lowest selling CD ever.

Here comes the surprise release of PHASE 2 just days before Prince tweets that he gave it to WB a while ago and they are holding on to it, and we should pickket for it's release... He releases PHASE 2 to streaming, then a week later allows for digital purchase only at TIDAL.COM, iTUNES, AMAZON, etc...

I happen to have this feeling that between the Purple Rain remaster as Prince said in his tweets that was also sent to WB a while ago, that Prince made a deal with TIDAL to release more music faster, digitally, on a streaming site, so he can release what he wants when he wants. The details of the TIDAL deal are not 100% clear to us fans, but it appears that it is harder for Prince to distribute his music with major labels in a phsyical form... At least there has been much tension since it took him so long to get a release since 20Ten.

What will the future hold? I honestly feel he lost all commercial appeal, lower than probably any "legacy" act from the 60,s, 70s, and 80's who are still alive of course...

My question is... what will the future hold when it comes to releasing albums with major labels... It seems we are uncertain now while still waiting for the HitnRun Phase 2 physical release, and the uncertaintity with his resigining with WB saying he will only issue remasters with the "price is right" then why sign back with WB to get them back in the first place?

The fact he gave Phase 2 for WB to release and they wouldn't yet then releases it through TIDAL after stating WB was "holding on to it" Do you think we will ever see Prince release an album with a major label again? Or do you think the WB deal is pretty much dead for Prince not promising the remasters? Lastly do you think there is any clause in the contract that makes it ok for Prince to release an album through TIDAL even when we know he intended PHASE 2 to be a WB release as hinted from his tweets?

[Edited 12/29/15 13:28pm]

The speculation that Prince can't hold a deal with a major and that the Target/newspaper deals were because he had no other choice have one single origin: Bart. And then other people jumped on it and the next thing you know there was a "high speculation". There wasn't ever a fact, nor a statement by anyone "in the know" to suggest this was, in fact, the case. Similarly in 2014 Prince obviously dumped Kobalt for WB, and got a single song deal with Sony at the same time, and the next thing you know (Bart again) Prince has been dumped by Kobalt and is rejected by every major on earth lol People make all sorts of stories on the org and those stories soon become some sort of "facts". beware of that.

I do not believe Prince has ever had any issue getting a deal with a major.

I don't know what's going on with WB but it's clearly a new open war. I don't expect anything to go well between those two parties, ever. Prince will give them shit until he gets his masters back entirely, i.e. without an exclusivity clause. WB probably gives him some shit in return and we're back to 1994...

Now as for Prince issuing albums on majors, I'd rather not have him do that at all. I'd rather have him release albums on small indie labels or all by himself. It's in our best interest that Prince does that because then sales don't matter so much anymore, and there's no issue with saturating the market: Prince can do what some other indie artists do, i.e. release 6 albums a year on small labels, more on his own website, sell 10,000 to 50,000 copies of each and be happy with it.

Prince makes his dough with his estate, various royalties and live shows. He doesn't need to release albums to make a living anymore. So sales don't really matter anymore: if he wants to release the music he records, he can and he will. If he won't, he won't.

A COMPREHENSIVE PRINCE DISCOGRAPHY (work in progress ^^): https://sites.google.com/...iscog/home
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Reply #33 posted 01/03/16 7:19am

Aerogram

avatar

databank said:

feeluupp said:

This is not a Prince is over and done thread... But a question I hope gets some good general input, and discussion...

After Lotusflow3r/MPLSOUND which was sold exclusively at TARGET in the U.S. It seems after that Prince had some "speculated" trouble finding a deal with releasing or distributing his upcoming albums. 20Ten was released through magazine and newspaper outlets throughout Europe including Rolling Stone magazine in Germany, Courrier International in France, the Daily Mirror and Record in the U.K. and Ireland, as well as the Het Niewsblad in Belgium, with no official 20Ten release in the U.S. and other countries...

It seems that was a sign of Prince finding it hard to get a major disribution deal in the U.S. and as a result he opted to do an independent distrubition making deals with various news outlets in Europe.

As 20Ten and 2010 passed... It would be four years, the longest Prince has gone without releasing an album, since the eventual release of AOA and Plectrum Electrum in 2014.

During 2010 - 2014 he toured, recorded music as usual, but what transpired to the point that Prince could not get a distributed release during that period. We all know a 3EG album was rumoured for release maybe as early as late 2012. We know that he their was a supposed signing with KOBALT to deliever new music but nothing fell through...

On the George Lopez show in 2011 he stated he was taking a "break" from recording or working on any new projects...

In the summer of 2014 we read from various news outlets that Prince has re-signed with WB with the biggest speculation and rumor of him resigining to the company that he publically fueded with was to own the rights of his masters, in exchange for another "speculated" re release/re-issue of Purple Rain for it's 30th Anniversary.

A few months later no Purple Rain reissue is released, but two Prince albums (AOA and Plectrum Electrum) instead.

As a promotion push for the AOA album was overall minimal at best, with many indictations that WB tried it's harderest to promote the album booking an apperance of Prince on SNL, many billboards, several previews on YouTube of the clip as well as "official" videos for AnotherLove and Marz basically rehashed from the SNL performances... AOA commercially showed a very minimally average commercial showing with over 200,000 copies sold world wide. Plectrum on the other hand was a commercial flop, and after 4 long years of no new album officially released, a lot of the visibility with the lack of strong social media, streaming following, Plectrum became his one of his lowest selling albums behind N.E.W.S and HitnRun: Phase 1, all selling under a dismal 50,000 copies.

... With the high speculation of Prince having trouble getting a new album distributed untill 2014, and then releasing 2 WB albums, with one having a terrible commercial showing... Prince released HitnRun: Phase 1 on TIDAL then a phsyical release amongst NPG Records/ Roc Nation with another very low commercial showing, making it become his lowest selling CD ever.

Here comes the surprise release of PHASE 2 just days before Prince tweets that he gave it to WB a while ago and they are holding on to it, and we should pickket for it's release... He releases PHASE 2 to streaming, then a week later allows for digital purchase only at TIDAL.COM, iTUNES, AMAZON, etc...

I happen to have this feeling that between the Purple Rain remaster as Prince said in his tweets that was also sent to WB a while ago, that Prince made a deal with TIDAL to release more music faster, digitally, on a streaming site, so he can release what he wants when he wants. The details of the TIDAL deal are not 100% clear to us fans, but it appears that it is harder for Prince to distribute his music with major labels in a phsyical form... At least there has been much tension since it took him so long to get a release since 20Ten.

What will the future hold? I honestly feel he lost all commercial appeal, lower than probably any "legacy" act from the 60,s, 70s, and 80's who are still alive of course...

My question is... what will the future hold when it comes to releasing albums with major labels... It seems we are uncertain now while still waiting for the HitnRun Phase 2 physical release, and the uncertaintity with his resigining with WB saying he will only issue remasters with the "price is right" then why sign back with WB to get them back in the first place?

The fact he gave Phase 2 for WB to release and they wouldn't yet then releases it through TIDAL after stating WB was "holding on to it" Do you think we will ever see Prince release an album with a major label again? Or do you think the WB deal is pretty much dead for Prince not promising the remasters? Lastly do you think there is any clause in the contract that makes it ok for Prince to release an album through TIDAL even when we know he intended PHASE 2 to be a WB release as hinted from his tweets?

[Edited 12/29/15 13:28pm]

The speculation that Prince can't hold a deal with a major and that the Target/newspaper deals were because he had no other choice have one single origin: Bart. And then other people jumped on it and the next thing you know there was a "high speculation". There wasn't ever a fact, nor a statement by anyone "in the know" to suggest this was, in fact, the case. Similarly in 2014 Prince obviously dumped Kobalt for WB, and got a single song deal with Sony at the same time, and the next thing you know (Bart again) Prince has been dumped by Kobalt and is rejected by every major on earth lol People make all sorts of stories on the org and those stories soon become some sort of "facts". beware of that.

I do not believe Prince has ever had any issue getting a deal with a major.

I don't know what's going on with WB but it's clearly a new open war. I don't expect anything to go well between those two parties, ever. Prince will give them shit until he gets his masters back entirely, i.e. without an exclusivity clause. WB probably gives him some shit in return and we're back to 1994...

Now as for Prince issuing albums on majors, I'd rather not have him do that at all. I'd rather have him release albums on small indie labels or all by himself. It's in our best interest that Prince does that because then sales don't matter so much anymore, and there's no issue with saturating the market: Prince can do what some other indie artists do, i.e. release 6 albums a year on small labels, more on his own website, sell 10,000 to 50,000 copies of each and be happy with it.

Prince makes his dough with his estate, various royalties and live shows. He doesn't need to release albums to make a living anymore. So sales don't really matter anymore: if he wants to release the music he records, he can and he will. If he won't, he won't.

Excellent, the dire rumours are created all the time. I remember the ONA tour and how that was a sign it would all be over soon, then 2004 came along. Also the rumour he couldn't get a deal with a major anymore was alive for years, then poof -- the unthinkable, a deal with WB.

I see Prince and WB resolving their differences sooner than later simply because WB won't want to be known as the label that is fighting this guy who gets more legendary every year, and Prince perhaps putting some water in his wine. It's the last major non-remastered catalog. But that's just my opinion.

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Reply #34 posted 01/03/16 8:11am

novabrkr

laurarichardson said:

Scarfo said:

...and Rhianna...and Eminem...and Beyonce....and Nicki Minaj... (artists who's albums don't flop)

---- None of these artist are selling 10 and 20 million units like the 1980s Record sales are at an time low. Prince is not on a major label and very artist his age get radio play. All of the artist you name are young and they are going to be in Prince's shoe in about ten years but they will not own their masters and be able to put out their own music


Eminem is 43 now. lol

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Reply #35 posted 01/03/16 8:14am

misiu

i still believe, thats its not so easy for prince to get a record deal. He is selling almost nothing these days ( anyway, who cares that u are a legend, when no one is buys your product..)

Was it in 2000, when a major label told him, that his music sucks. Prince delivered at the time the high quality album "high"...(Was it LA Raid, who said that? I dont remember)....

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Reply #36 posted 01/03/16 8:47am

Pentacle

misiu said:

Prince delivered at the time the high quality album "high"...


That is a joke, right?

But maybe it's also becoming more legendary with every passing year...

Stop the Prince Apologists ™
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Reply #37 posted 01/03/16 9:28am

misiu

Pentacle said:

misiu said:

Prince delivered at the time the high quality album "high"...


That is a joke, right?

But maybe it's also becoming more legendary with every passing year..

yes, just a joke.

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Reply #38 posted 01/03/16 11:24am

Pentacle

misiu said:

Pentacle said:


That is a joke, right?

But maybe it's also becoming more legendary with every passing year..

yes, just a joke.

razz

Stop the Prince Apologists ™
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Reply #39 posted 01/03/16 3:44pm

Se7en

avatar

Interesting read, and even a few years ago I might've agreed with a lot of your concerns about record deals.

I too like physical CDs, but times are changing. An "album" doesn't mean a shiny plastic disc anymore. Downloads are the future, and Prince can implement those on his own very quickly.
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Reply #40 posted 01/03/16 4:24pm

Aerogram

avatar

Se7en said:

Interesting read, and even a few years ago I might've agreed with a lot of your concerns about record deals. I too like physical CDs, but times are changing. An "album" doesn't mean a shiny plastic disc anymore. Downloads are the future, and Prince can implement those on his own very quickly.

Agreed. Some of the issues people have not only with distribution but with Prince himself show the aging demographics of the Org. Some of us are stuck in the past, with assumptions based on traditions (and a catalog that began almost 40 years ago).

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Reply #41 posted 01/04/16 4:05am

databank

avatar

Aerogram said:

Se7en said:

Interesting read, and even a few years ago I might've agreed with a lot of your concerns about record deals. I too like physical CDs, but times are changing. An "album" doesn't mean a shiny plastic disc anymore. Downloads are the future, and Prince can implement those on his own very quickly.

Agreed. Some of the issues people have not only with distribution but with Prince himself show the aging demographics of the Org. Some of us are stuck in the past, with assumptions based on traditions (and a catalog that began almost 40 years ago).

Indeed, it's not just the physical vs. digital thing but the whole economic model (release an album a year on a major, promote it, release 4 singles, make 4 videos, tour it around the globe for a year, sell millions of copies, then either be thanked by your major or release the next album) people have in mind is pretty irrelevant for an artist the age Prince in the context of the music industry in 2016.

A COMPREHENSIVE PRINCE DISCOGRAPHY (work in progress ^^): https://sites.google.com/...iscog/home
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Reply #42 posted 01/04/16 8:09am

djThunderfunk

avatar

Both sides of the physical vs digital debate seem to miss the point that both formats have their place and an artist of Prince's stature should be able to capitalize on the habits of both types of customers.

Obviously physical sales continue to dwindle as the digital options increase, but this does not indicate that physical formats are obsolete. For an artist whose fanbase consists largely of older fans who grew up purchasing and collecting CDs & vinyl it is particularly unwise to ignore physical formats. Why not try to sell a copy to the older audience and or those that for various reasons prefer a tangible object?



CDs are cheap and easy to manufacture. Independant artists manage it. Small boutique labels flourish when they cater to fans. Artists with much less clout that Prince find it profitable to release super deluxe reissues and collections to their fans. The trick seems to be having an accurate prediction of how many will sell and keeping the print runs in line with sales predictions.

Catering to this niche audience will not prevent also catering to the ever emerging digital only audience. In fact, if quality and print runs are smartly managed it's an excellent way to augment sales. An artist of Prince's stature should be able to maximize sales potential by providing both, no?

REEFER MADNESS!
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Reply #43 posted 01/05/16 8:36am

Strive

My take on the situation:

Prince will keep bouncing around from label to label to distribution platform to distribution platform because the thing he wants doesn't exist.

He wants a prestigious record company that will pay him a large amount of money upfront to recieve an album that already completed and make it work on a large scale while being handcuffed by his restrictions. He also wants a smaller venue where he gets paid to release tiny nuggets but only the hardest of hardcore fans get to listen.


Some company pays him money so they can brag about having an artist of his caliber in their stable. He burns them with no promotion or publicly calls them out or is generally unwilling to play the game. Rinse, wash, repeat. For as long as Prince is around.

After he's gone, we'll probably see a Jimi Hendrix style raiding of the Vault by some giant corporation. Endless special editions and boxsets. Tons of different takes. Different takes edited together and presented as a new song. Prince remixed with other artists. Paisley Park tour of old associates. Documentaries and concert films. Licensing for every possible thing that wants to use his music.

They'll exploit him for decades. (Which he probably realizes, which explains most of his weird control issues)

Free the music, fire Michael Howe
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Reply #44 posted 01/05/16 9:44am

databank

avatar

djThunderfunk said:

Both sides of the physical vs digital debate seem to miss the point that both formats have their place and an artist of Prince's stature should be able to capitalize on the habits of both types of customers.

Obviously physical sales continue to dwindle as the digital options increase, but this does not indicate that physical formats are obsolete. For an artist whose fanbase consists largely of older fans who grew up purchasing and collecting CDs & vinyl it is particularly unwise to ignore physical formats. Why not try to sell a copy to the older audience and or those that for various reasons prefer a tangible object?



CDs are cheap and easy to manufacture. Independant artists manage it. Small boutique labels flourish when they cater to fans. Artists with much less clout that Prince find it profitable to release super deluxe reissues and collections to their fans. The trick seems to be having an accurate prediction of how many will sell and keeping the print runs in line with sales predictions.

Catering to this niche audience will not prevent also catering to the ever emerging digital only audience. In fact, if quality and print runs are smartly managed it's an excellent way to augment sales. An artist of Prince's stature should be able to maximize sales potential by providing both, no?

As long as there's a market for physical release Prince should indeed take advantage of it.

.

Buckethead has been releasing more than one album a week (I'm not shitting u, check Wikipedia!) over the past 2 or 3 years and I'm not sure but I think each exists in physical, though I doubt any was is issued in more than a few hundred copies.

.

The issue here I think is more than lots of fans do not realize that an artist can...

1. exist

2. have a career

3. be able to release albums

4. be able to sell those albums

5. be able to make a profit from those albums

... without a major label backing them.

.

Of course Prince's lifestyle involves financial needs higher than Buckethead's, but already makes that dough through other channels (with live shows for example), and he could even release a "big" album on a major every 4 or 5 years or so just to maintain his presence in the mainstream. This couldn not possibly prevent him from releasing as much material as he wants, physical and/or digital, through small labels and/or his oan website, if he so wanted. The albums are being recorded anyway (not to mention the infinite amount of past vault tracks and live recordings), and recording an album is usually the most expansive part of its creation, so since the albums are there, sales cannot possibly be an obstacle for release, not in 2016. But this is something certain people do not seem able (or willing) to accept. Prince could release an album a week. He just doesn't want to.

[Edited 1/5/16 9:44am]

A COMPREHENSIVE PRINCE DISCOGRAPHY (work in progress ^^): https://sites.google.com/...iscog/home
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Reply #45 posted 01/05/16 10:50am

Scarfo

laurarichardson said:

Scarfo said:

...and Rhianna...and Eminem...and Beyonce....and Nicki Minaj... (artists who's albums don't flop)

---- None of these artist are selling 10 and 20 million units like the 1980s Record sales are at an time low. Prince is not on a major label and very artist his age get radio play. All of the artist you name are young and they are going to be in Prince's shoe in about ten years but they will not own their masters and be able to put out their own music

so...you need to sell 10 - 20 million albums for your album not to be a flop? lol, I swear some of the things I read here.... XD

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Reply #46 posted 01/05/16 2:51pm

feeluupp

avatar

... Well...

Prince just tweeted:

NPG RECORDS HITNRUN PHASE 2 DISTRIBUTION... LET'S DISCUSS?

Seems PHASE 2 has been ready for a while to get a phsyical release, he is asking fans on twitter for "distribution advice"... So seems like he is indeed having a little trouble trying to get PHASE 2 a phsyical release.

Realistically it will be released, but I think it's meeting some apprehension from other distribution companies due to the very very low sales of Plectrum and Phase 1.

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Reply #47 posted 01/05/16 2:57pm

warning2all

feeluupp said:

... Well...



Prince just tweeted:




NPG RECORDS HITNRUN PHASE 2 DISTRIBUTION... LET'S DISCUSS?





Seems PHASE 2 has been ready for a while to get a phsyical release, he is asking fans on twitter for "distribution advice"... So seems like he is indeed having a little trouble trying to get PHASE 2 a phsyical release.



Realistically it will be released, but I think it's meeting some apprehension from other distribution companies due to the very very low sales of Plectrum and Phase 1.




Well, now we know WB's response to Prince's "olive branch".

And, more where their relationship is at.


This "Hitnrun" series of releases has some challenges ahead, apart from Tidal.
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Reply #48 posted 01/05/16 3:02pm

feeluupp

avatar

warning2all said:

feeluupp said:

... Well...

Prince just tweeted:

NPG RECORDS HITNRUN PHASE 2 DISTRIBUTION... LET'S DISCUSS?

Seems PHASE 2 has been ready for a while to get a phsyical release, he is asking fans on twitter for "distribution advice"... So seems like he is indeed having a little trouble trying to get PHASE 2 a phsyical release.

Realistically it will be released, but I think it's meeting some apprehension from other distribution companies due to the very very low sales of Plectrum and Phase 1.

Well, now we know WB's response to Prince's "olive branch". And, more where their relationship is at. This "Hitnrun" series of releases has some challenges ahead, apart from Tidal.

Jay-Z's ROC NATION helped distribute PHASE 1 with NPG RECORDS... I wonder why they are not helping to distribute PHASE 2... Could it be to the lack of sales? If ROC NATION/TIDAL won't help distribute a physical copy of PHASE 2 why would PRINCE be tweeting about phase 2 distribution and asking advice from his fans as well as agreeing to a "grass roots distribution" replying to one of the fans tweet.

So in terms of speculation because there are no facts yet...

WB doesn't seem interested in distributing PHASE 2 even though PRINCE did tweet saying he gave them a copy and they were holding on to it, as they didn't distribute PHASE 1 either...

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Reply #49 posted 01/05/16 3:06pm

feeluupp

avatar

Now he just tweeted:

an app like Uber. You find people in your area who can sell CD? A one man wreckastow. Lol.

Market saturation, 4 albums in less than 2 years, with little to no promotion, upfront sum for PRINCE but do the record company actually profit at all from the low sales, lack of streaming since PRINCE is only on one relatively "small" streaming platform, with very little social media, youtube visibility...

Strange... Maybe he really is having a hard time finding distribution for PHASE 2 after all...

[Edited 1/5/16 15:07pm]

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Reply #50 posted 01/05/16 3:09pm

Thizz

feeluupp said:

This is not a Prince is over and done thread... But a question I hope gets some good general input, and discussion...

After Lotusflow3r/MPLSOUND which was sold exclusively at TARGET in the U.S. It seems after that Prince had some "speculated" trouble finding a deal with releasing or distributing his upcoming albums. 20Ten was released through magazine and newspaper outlets throughout Europe including Rolling Stone magazine in Germany, Courrier International in France, the Daily Mirror and Record in the U.K. and Ireland, as well as the Het Niewsblad in Belgium, with no official 20Ten release in the U.S. and other countries...

It seems that was a sign of Prince finding it hard to get a major disribution deal in the U.S. and as a result he opted to do an independent distrubition making deals with various news outlets in Europe.

As 20Ten and 2010 passed... It would be four years, the longest Prince has gone without releasing an album, since the eventual release of AOA and Plectrum Electrum in 2014.

During 2010 - 2014 he toured, recorded music as usual, but what transpired to the point that Prince could not get a distributed release during that period. We all know a 3EG album was rumoured for release maybe as early as late 2012. We know that he their was a supposed signing with KOBALT to deliever new music but nothing fell through...

On the George Lopez show in 2011 he stated he was taking a "break" from recording or working on any new projects...

In the summer of 2014 we read from various news outlets that Prince has re-signed with WB with the biggest speculation and rumor of him resigining to the company that he publically fueded with was to own the rights of his masters, in exchange for another "speculated" re release/re-issue of Purple Rain for it's 30th Anniversary.

A few months later no Purple Rain reissue is released, but two Prince albums (AOA and Plectrum Electrum) instead.

As a promotion push for the AOA album was overall minimal at best, with many indictations that WB tried it's harderest to promote the album booking an apperance of Prince on SNL, many billboards, several previews on YouTube of the clip as well as "official" videos for AnotherLove and Marz basically rehashed from the SNL performances... AOA commercially showed a very minimally average commercial showing with over 200,000 copies sold world wide. Plectrum on the other hand was a commercial flop, and after 4 long years of no new album officially released, a lot of the visibility with the lack of strong social media, streaming following, Plectrum became his one of his lowest selling albums behind N.E.W.S and HitnRun: Phase 1, all selling under a dismal 50,000 copies.

... With the high speculation of Prince having trouble getting a new album distributed untill 2014, and then releasing 2 WB albums, with one having a terrible commercial showing... Prince released HitnRun: Phase 1 on TIDAL then a phsyical release amongst NPG Records/ Roc Nation with another very low commercial showing, making it become his lowest selling CD ever.

Here comes the surprise release of PHASE 2 just days before Prince tweets that he gave it to WB a while ago and they are holding on to it, and we should pickket for it's release... He releases PHASE 2 to streaming, then a week later allows for digital purchase only at TIDAL.COM, iTUNES, AMAZON, etc...

I happen to have this feeling that between the Purple Rain remaster as Prince said in his tweets that was also sent to WB a while ago, that Prince made a deal with TIDAL to release more music faster, digitally, on a streaming site, so he can release what he wants when he wants. The details of the TIDAL deal are not 100% clear to us fans, but it appears that it is harder for Prince to distribute his music with major labels in a phsyical form... At least there has been much tension since it took him so long to get a release since 20Ten.

What will the future hold? I honestly feel he lost all commercial appeal, lower than probably any "legacy" act from the 60,s, 70s, and 80's who are still alive of course...

My question is... what will the future hold when it comes to releasing albums with major labels... It seems we are uncertain now while still waiting for the HitnRun Phase 2 physical release, and the uncertaintity with his resigining with WB saying he will only issue remasters with the "price is right" then why sign back with WB to get them back in the first place?

The fact he gave Phase 2 for WB to release and they wouldn't yet then releases it through TIDAL after stating WB was "holding on to it" Do you think we will ever see Prince release an album with a major label again? Or do you think the WB deal is pretty much dead for Prince not promising the remasters? Lastly do you think there is any clause in the contract that makes it ok for Prince to release an album through TIDAL even when we know he intended PHASE 2 to be a WB release as hinted from his tweets?

[Edited 12/29/15 13:28pm]

He's talking about alternative distirbution methods right now on Twitter. I think a rapper/fan mentioned it first and he liked the idea

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Reply #51 posted 01/05/16 3:11pm

feeluupp

avatar

Thizz said:

feeluupp said:

This is not a Prince is over and done thread... But a question I hope gets some good general input, and discussion...

After Lotusflow3r/MPLSOUND which was sold exclusively at TARGET in the U.S. It seems after that Prince had some "speculated" trouble finding a deal with releasing or distributing his upcoming albums. 20Ten was released through magazine and newspaper outlets throughout Europe including Rolling Stone magazine in Germany, Courrier International in France, the Daily Mirror and Record in the U.K. and Ireland, as well as the Het Niewsblad in Belgium, with no official 20Ten release in the U.S. and other countries...

It seems that was a sign of Prince finding it hard to get a major disribution deal in the U.S. and as a result he opted to do an independent distrubition making deals with various news outlets in Europe.

As 20Ten and 2010 passed... It would be four years, the longest Prince has gone without releasing an album, since the eventual release of AOA and Plectrum Electrum in 2014.

During 2010 - 2014 he toured, recorded music as usual, but what transpired to the point that Prince could not get a distributed release during that period. We all know a 3EG album was rumoured for release maybe as early as late 2012. We know that he their was a supposed signing with KOBALT to deliever new music but nothing fell through...

On the George Lopez show in 2011 he stated he was taking a "break" from recording or working on any new projects...

In the summer of 2014 we read from various news outlets that Prince has re-signed with WB with the biggest speculation and rumor of him resigining to the company that he publically fueded with was to own the rights of his masters, in exchange for another "speculated" re release/re-issue of Purple Rain for it's 30th Anniversary.

A few months later no Purple Rain reissue is released, but two Prince albums (AOA and Plectrum Electrum) instead.

As a promotion push for the AOA album was overall minimal at best, with many indictations that WB tried it's harderest to promote the album booking an apperance of Prince on SNL, many billboards, several previews on YouTube of the clip as well as "official" videos for AnotherLove and Marz basically rehashed from the SNL performances... AOA commercially showed a very minimally average commercial showing with over 200,000 copies sold world wide. Plectrum on the other hand was a commercial flop, and after 4 long years of no new album officially released, a lot of the visibility with the lack of strong social media, streaming following, Plectrum became his one of his lowest selling albums behind N.E.W.S and HitnRun: Phase 1, all selling under a dismal 50,000 copies.

... With the high speculation of Prince having trouble getting a new album distributed untill 2014, and then releasing 2 WB albums, with one having a terrible commercial showing... Prince released HitnRun: Phase 1 on TIDAL then a phsyical release amongst NPG Records/ Roc Nation with another very low commercial showing, making it become his lowest selling CD ever.

Here comes the surprise release of PHASE 2 just days before Prince tweets that he gave it to WB a while ago and they are holding on to it, and we should pickket for it's release... He releases PHASE 2 to streaming, then a week later allows for digital purchase only at TIDAL.COM, iTUNES, AMAZON, etc...

I happen to have this feeling that between the Purple Rain remaster as Prince said in his tweets that was also sent to WB a while ago, that Prince made a deal with TIDAL to release more music faster, digitally, on a streaming site, so he can release what he wants when he wants. The details of the TIDAL deal are not 100% clear to us fans, but it appears that it is harder for Prince to distribute his music with major labels in a phsyical form... At least there has been much tension since it took him so long to get a release since 20Ten.

What will the future hold? I honestly feel he lost all commercial appeal, lower than probably any "legacy" act from the 60,s, 70s, and 80's who are still alive of course...

My question is... what will the future hold when it comes to releasing albums with major labels... It seems we are uncertain now while still waiting for the HitnRun Phase 2 physical release, and the uncertaintity with his resigining with WB saying he will only issue remasters with the "price is right" then why sign back with WB to get them back in the first place?

The fact he gave Phase 2 for WB to release and they wouldn't yet then releases it through TIDAL after stating WB was "holding on to it" Do you think we will ever see Prince release an album with a major label again? Or do you think the WB deal is pretty much dead for Prince not promising the remasters? Lastly do you think there is any clause in the contract that makes it ok for Prince to release an album through TIDAL even when we know he intended PHASE 2 to be a WB release as hinted from his tweets?

[Edited 12/29/15 13:28pm]

He's talking about alternative distirbution methods right now on Twitter. I think a rapper/fan mentioned it first and he liked the idea

... yes... my latest posts was discussing that as well...

like i speculated... it seems he is having a hard time finding someone distribute phase 2.

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Reply #52 posted 01/05/16 3:29pm

feeluupp

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WOULD ANYBODY HERE LIKE 2 BYPASS THE NORMAL PLACES CDS R BOUGHT AND SOLD AND BUY THEM DIRECT FROM EACH OTHER?

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Reply #53 posted 01/05/16 3:52pm

feeluupp

avatar

wow...

someone asked on twitter, why can't it be distributed like phase 1... and prince joked, because of the numbers, 100 sold... eek

Pantal why can't it be distributed the same way as phase one? BECAUSE OF THE NUMBERS. NUMBER ONE: ONE HUNDRED SOLD. LOL

now he's talking about the musicology sales:

2004: 50,000 MUSICOLOGY CDS SOLD IN ONE NIGHT. NO MIDDLE MAN.

[Edited 1/5/16 15:53pm]

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Reply #54 posted 01/05/16 4:10pm

tatocorcu

Everything has to be difficult wih this guy...
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Reply #55 posted 01/05/16 4:19pm

EroticDreamer

tatocorcu said:

Everything has to be difficult wih this guy...

Yep, yet somehow thousands of other artists have their CD's on sale @ Amazon.

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Reply #56 posted 01/05/16 4:30pm

IstenSzek

avatar

feeluupp said:

2004: 50,000 MUSICOLOGY CDS SOLD IN ONE NIGHT. NO MIDDLE MAN.

isn't this 50,000 concert tickets sold, with a free cd thrown in?

anyway, what's stopping him from doing that again?

oh, wait.... lol



and true love lives on lollipops and crisps
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Reply #57 posted 01/05/16 4:36pm

funksterr

I'll buy a cd, direct from Prince, but he's got to autograph it and include a muffin.

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Reply #58 posted 01/05/16 4:41pm

warning2all

Fool!

This "Hitnrun Phase 2" distribution problem wouldn't even BE an issue right now, If he had just played along with a big "Purple Rain Remaster", because the press and promotion would have have helped the brand name "Prince" immeasurably.

His stubbornness and narcissism have created this situation. Now he can't get anyone to do business with him. Karma is a bitch
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Reply #59 posted 01/05/16 4:46pm

feeluupp

avatar

Aerogram said:

databank said:

The speculation that Prince can't hold a deal with a major and that the Target/newspaper deals were because he had no other choice have one single origin: Bart. And then other people jumped on it and the next thing you know there was a "high speculation". There wasn't ever a fact, nor a statement by anyone "in the know" to suggest this was, in fact, the case. Similarly in 2014 Prince obviously dumped Kobalt for WB, and got a single song deal with Sony at the same time, and the next thing you know (Bart again) Prince has been dumped by Kobalt and is rejected by every major on earth lol People make all sorts of stories on the org and those stories soon become some sort of "facts". beware of that.

I do not believe Prince has ever had any issue getting a deal with a major.

I don't know what's going on with WB but it's clearly a new open war. I don't expect anything to go well between those two parties, ever. Prince will give them shit until he gets his masters back entirely, i.e. without an exclusivity clause. WB probably gives him some shit in return and we're back to 1994...

Now as for Prince issuing albums on majors, I'd rather not have him do that at all. I'd rather have him release albums on small indie labels or all by himself. It's in our best interest that Prince does that because then sales don't matter so much anymore, and there's no issue with saturating the market: Prince can do what some other indie artists do, i.e. release 6 albums a year on small labels, more on his own website, sell 10,000 to 50,000 copies of each and be happy with it.

Prince makes his dough with his estate, various royalties and live shows. He doesn't need to release albums to make a living anymore. So sales don't really matter anymore: if he wants to release the music he records, he can and he will. If he won't, he won't.

Excellent, the dire rumours are created all the time. I remember the ONA tour and how that was a sign it would all be over soon, then 2004 came along. Also the rumour he couldn't get a deal with a major anymore was alive for years, then poof -- the unthinkable, a deal with WB.

I see Prince and WB resolving their differences sooner than later simply because WB won't want to be known as the label that is fighting this guy who gets more legendary every year, and Prince perhaps putting some water in his wine. It's the last major non-remastered catalog. But that's just my opinion.

no rumours anymore... when prince is going on twitter asked for opinions on ways to distribute phase 2... there's something wrong... he can't get a major label to distribute phase 2. lol

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