dandeeland said:

Timmy84 said:

Oh Lord.

The Monkees were absolutely HUGE and for a longer period than Prince was Huge. Prince had Purple Rain and then he really sank pretty quick. And do you really think Prince is bigger than Garth Brooks? REALLY? OOOOOKKKKKKAAAAAAAAAYYYYYYYYY. Garth Brooks has sold 128 millions albums. Prince has sold 80 million. BIG difference and Garth doesnt have as many releases either. You can check out the list here. The sales tell the truth

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_best-selling_music_artists

The Monkeys - Not on the list

Garth Brooks - Not on the list

http://stereogum.com/495331/vh1-100-greatest-artists-of-all-time/list/

1993 said:

dandeeland said:

The Monkees were absolutely HUGE and for a longer period than Prince was Huge. Prince had Purple Rain and then he really sank pretty quick. And do you really think Prince is bigger than Garth Brooks? REALLY? OOOOOKKKKKKAAAAAAAAAYYYYYYYYY. Garth Brooks has sold 128 millions albums. Prince has sold 80 million. BIG difference and Garth doesnt have as many releases either. You can check out the list here. The sales tell the truth

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_best-selling_music_artists

The Monkeys - Not on the list

Garth Brooks - Not on the list

http://stereogum.com/495331/vh1-100-greatest-artists-of-all-time/list/

Yeah there's a difference between "greatest" and "best-selling". I like the Monkees' music but COME ON!

The Monkeys? A made for TV group who wasn't allowed to write their own songs or play the instruments ahead of prince? Who's next, the cast of Glee?

[Edited 5/25/11 16:53pm]

alandail said:

The Monkeys? A made for TV group who wasn't allowed to write their own songs or play the instruments ahead of prince? Who's next, the cast of Glee?

[Edited 5/25/11 16:53pm]

alandail

[Edited 5/25/11 17:43pm]

well neil diamond wrote "i'm a believer" so he should probably on that list too

Timmy84 said:

OldFriends4Sale said:

Because everyone has a place, If you look at many of their statements about being in the band many said from Bobby Z in 1977 to Wendy in 1985 This is my place... I don't want to be out front.

But if you look at W&L they are very successful with a lot of the work they do weither it's sessions work or movie/tv scores...

Even though Sheila E was very visible during her Glam LIfe-Sheila E years, she really stood out when she played/plays drums behind someone.

Prince said something similar to Jesse Johnson (not knowing his real intentions) he told Jesse in so many words, he was not meant to be a frontman, but Morris was.

It's similar with many other singers and musicians, some people with spectacular voice, just can't seem to make it big or be the huge 'frontman' success they hope for. Because everyone is not meant to be in that spot. Some people totally shine singing/playing/dancing back up.

Yeah but I was just wondering hypothetically, the way some hype them you think their role would be much bigger than what some claim. Prince was always the king of the castle anyway.

hhhhdmt said:

jackson35 said:

quincy jones is an artist and a producer.please learn how to read a liner note. quincy jones plays more than one instrument. you do not known enough about prince to make these arguments. please read some articles on his bandmates. please study other people music before you compare them to prince.

please do your research before trying to school me. Please stop making nonsense up like wendy playing the solo on when doves cry ( a balant lie) and prince's father writing "most" of the music on parade and purple rain (another balant lie). I know prince's band members and their contributions perfectly fine and even they would laugh at your posts. i know plenty about prince's music, more than you ever will, and i dont make up things either.

When did i say quincy is not an artist or that he doesnt play more than one instrument? All i was saying was that as a musician/artist, prince is more talented.

[Edited 5/24/11 22:57pm]

IF YOU KNOWN ANYTHING ABOUT QUINCY JONES'S CATALOG, YOU WOULD NOT SAY THAT PRINCE'S CATALOG IS MORE VARIED. PRINCE HAS NEVER DISPUTED ANY CLAIMS THAT ANY OF HIS FORMER BAND MATES HAS MADE ABOUT CONTRIBUTING TO HIS MUSIC. SO HOW WOULD YOU KNOWN THAT THEY DIDN'T PLAY A BIGGER PART THEN WHAT HE GAVE THEM CREDIT FOR?

Bowie's prolific output in the seventies aside, I agree.

But yeah Bowie is right up there with his work in the '70s... but who was close to Prince in the '80s though?

I don't know about any artist in history, but I do agree that this period was the creative peak of his career and after that, it was hit and miss.

TrevorAyer said:

hhhhdmt said:

i simply cannot respond to such nonense anymore. Sure you can just look at ya go go go! Prince is a GREAT guitarist, good enough to be among the top 100 or atleast among the top 500. He does not play like a session guitarist for god sakes, you are beyond clueless. There are not thousands of guitarists like him, there are thousands who wish they could play like him ok then why have other guitarists onstage when he was in his prime .. if ur gonna claim he is the best of any artist in history and back it up by saying its cuz he can play all the instruments it better be because he is great on those instruments because tons of people can just play them fine. compare prince to any song by hendrix and listen to what a great guitar player sounds like .. prince has those moments rarely .. page, hendrix, santana etc .. had those moments non stop.

Prince is not an ok songwriter, he is an excellent songwriter. his friends did not help him be the great artist he is, he would be the great artist without his so called friends who receive way way more credit than they deserve. Why id is prince that wrote big hits for others, why not his band mates? Prince has his moments for sure, mostly with the help of others, sometimes on his own. Prince can write cheesy pop, what made prince music brilliant was the influence that took it beyond cheesy pop. which is now gone and all that is left is cheesy pop.

You made a claim about those multi instrumentalist, please PROVE IT. You are refusing to do so because you know you are wrong. ok well can we agree that anybody that can play guitar can probably play bass too? so then there is piano .. i've seen dylan play piano and guitar on stage .. joni plays piano and guitar .. i've seen niel young play piano and guitar .. its not that hard .. just look on u tube there is your proof blah blah .. can't u pick something more valid to argue

He is that great and he would be that great without the so called geniuses he was surrounded by. You have given zero evidence for the absurd claim that most of his best songs were co written by others (they were not) and you keep repeating the claim simply out of your bitterness towards his recent output. no bitterness .. callin it like it is

I dont think i've ever read so much nonsense. Thousands of guitarists like him? a session guitarist? what a joke, he can certainly compare to any of the guitarist you listed although admittedly there are some better players than him. Its funny how eric clapton, steve vai and other great guitarist have called him a great player, yet you simply dismiss him as a boring session player. i'm not so sure clapton called him a great" player" but he did say he that purple rain was his favorite song .. and that was recorded by ahem ... drum roll please .. prince AND THE REVOLUTION .. i dont think u get that guitarists even really good ones are a dime a dozen these days .. prince simply does not do much that is truly exciting on guitar .. his drum machine is far more exciting to be honest .. his genius is in his simplicity but is often displayed more in his bass and keyboard and drum programming .. technically he is right up there but there is not much spark .. yes a few rare occasions but not by the truck loads like the truly great guitarists out there.

Like i said, clueless. Clueless beyond words. eye disagree no need for name calling now

And no prince is not a classical jazz player or anything. thats for sure have u heard kamasutra omg ... However he does several genres well. He does did pop, yes rock/hardrock,meh funk sometimes, soul and r&b, psychedellia extremely well. And he did disco well too with "i wanna be your lover".what? He does do several genres extremely well, however no one (including prince) is a master of all genres. he does not fail to do these genres, he does them well. every artist dabbles in numerous genres but you can't claim to be the best of all time if you fail at most of them and don't top the ones ur best at

An average beatles or zep record covers more ground than prince's whole catalogue can? Prove it, ofcourse this is yet another absurd statement i can only suggest you listen to their music and draw your own conclusions .. as i did

All prince records sound the same? So 3121 sounds the same as Lotus3flower? love symbol sounds the same as the gold experience? Lovesexy sounds the same as the black album? Purple rain sounds the same as atwiad? Comical, just comical um yes .. ever since WB ended its been cookie cutter on repeat, very minimal production changes, far from anything natural sounding, all tin can simple and mediocre songs about the same ole same ole .. all the psychadelic and crazy cool jamming is gone as is the poetry and decent unembarassing lyrics and it all sounds lifeless .. to pristine no spark no taking a chance .. things changed a lot more back when people were influencing him

I have no patience to argue with you anymore. None whatsoever. really ur sure seem like ur STILL arguing to me You are a troll of the highest order who obviously has zero musical knowledge keep dreamin yo!. Keep trolling, prince will always be regarded as a great musician by critics and fans, while the so called geniuses in his band will fade away. They would themselves be laughing at your posts. PRINCE IS A GREAT GENIUS one of MANY!

the purple rain solo was played by prince, not the revolution. He played the solo. Yes he is a great guitarist and to claim that there are thousands of guitarist as good as him shows zero musical knowledge. Several great guitarist have called him a great guitaritst. By the way, many rock fans who are not prince fans think he is a great guitarist especially after the rock and roll hall of fame performance and the snl performance.

No i dont agree that anyone that can play guitar can play bass too. they are different instruments. There are plenty of pro guitarists who can play guitar at a pro level but not the bass at a pro level

"Mostly with the help of others". You have NO evidence for this. Nonewhatsoever. And yes you are bitter, you are not "calling it as it is", you are making it up.

Its not hard to be a multi instrumentalist on his level? Really, then maybe you should try. You simply refuse to provide names for all the so called artists that are just as competent as prince is on various instruments. Thats because most people are not anywhere near that level. You are engaging in guesswork instead of being able to back up your opinions.

Based on what has he failed at "most genres"? He has not, he does several genres extremely well.

I ask you again, why only whine about prince? Why not the other artists on your list, most of him who are far past their peak and nowhere near as good as they used to be? Is that because of their so called "genius band mates too".

I am sorry but you have been owned on this thread numerous times. You claiming that most of his stuff was co written with his band is a balant lie. You claiming that he is a boring session guitarist is another laughable post. Considering how many non prince fans think of him as a great guitarist, its absurd to call him a session player. You fail to provide names for the "many" MI's that are on his level other than engaging in guesswork. You keep attacking him for not being able to match his peak output, yet not the other artists on that list. You said "every prince album sounds the same". How does 3121 sound the same as Lotus3flower? It does not, and it proves that either you are lying or you have never listened to those albums

Heres a newsflash: Most artisits are at their peak in their 20's. After that they slow down and put out good music less frequently. Ask any musician on that list. This has nothing to do with his bandmembers, considering they did not co write most of his songs and they would tell you that themselves. They were not the ones writing hits for chaka khan, sinead o connor, sheena easton, the bangles etc because they could not.

pennylover said:

Timmy84 said:

Yeah but I was just wondering hypothetically, the way some hype them you think their role would be much bigger than what some claim. Prince was always the king of the castle anyway.

lol actually he was the little prince who took the throne and wouldn't listen 2 his advisors and council... 1980's Paisley Park could have been huge

TrevorAyer said:

Timmy84 said:

I wonder if The Revolution members were that great (they were all good), how come they didn't do anything REAL significant after leaving Prince? And I don't think a simple "Prince won't let 'em" statement would be accurate.

[Edited 5/25/11 11:35am]

same reason that prince didn't do anything significant .. they all did their best work when they were together .. prince just got to ride it out longer cuz he was the most famousest

have 2 agree

[Edited 5/25/11 19:37pm]

OldFriends4Sale said:

TrevorAyer said:

same reason that prince didn't do anything significant .. they all did their best work when they were together .. prince just got to ride it out longer cuz he was the most famousest

have 2 agree

[Edited 5/25/11 19:37pm]

prince was the one writing most of the material so he was not "riding" anything, and some of his best work came after the revolution left.

the output 1978-1988 is superior to any artists output - even The Beatles did not record brilliant songs for that long.

ThreadBare said:

Umm, what do you people have against session guitarists and musicians? It's not equal to uninspired work. Some of the tunes you count among your favorites used session players and singers. A lot of giants cut their teeth doing studio work.

I don't get that either. It doesn't make Prince any less great if he was just that. People are PRESSED.

As I said earlier, I'm not sure how you rank that decade (i guess we're talking 79-88 to make it 10 years) ahead of the beatles. The one argument for Prince here is the beatles were two dominant artists instead of one. One other person I thought of who at least has to be considered is Barry Gibb from 75-84. During that time he had 8 number one songs (out of 10 top 10 singles) as the bee gees, 3 number 1 songs out of 6 top 10 hits for his brother andy, and number 1 songs for Frankie Valli (Grease), Kenny Rogers and Dolly Parton, Barbara Streisand, Yvonne Elliman as well as top 10 songs for Samantha Sang, Barbara Streisand and Dionne Warwick.

That's 15 number 1 songs written and produced (and in most cases performed) by Barry Gibb in 10 years.

At the end of that 10 year stretch he had the #1 selling album of all time (until thriller), a record setting string of 6 consecutive #1 songs (i.e. one of his songs only left the top spot to be replaced by another of his songs) and six consecutive bee gees singles hit number 1 - also a record for a producer/singer/songwriter. At one point 5 of the top 10 songs (including 4 of the top 5) were his, both records.

For the year 1978, 7 of the top 20 songs for the year were his, including 4 of the top 6. Certainly the best 1 year peak by any artist ever.

I actually agree, as he was the only artist to last a full decade of brilliance. Seriously in the world of popular music artists, many come close, but Prince had the most consistency. Look at Michael, you can't pin him to a decade as he had only 3 albums in a selected decade (But him I would say 1979 -1989 as Dangerous was a good album, but his music declines after that,), Madonna (Yes a great body of work from First album to Like a Prayer, but thats 6 years (1983-1989) , as 1990s Dick Tracy was tragic and so was 1992's Erotica, both a real fall from Like a Prayer - although Vogue and Justify my love are great, but they promoted a greatest hits collection - albeit a brilliant one).

Even Bowie, his brilliance starts with 1970's "The man who sold the world" and ends with 1980's "Scary monsters and supercreeps", excluding a dreadful two live albums (David Live 1974 and Stage 1978), a recorded version of "Peter and the Wolf" he could compete with Prince as he lasted the full 10 years. Stevie Wonder again the pop of Motown lead to 5 brilliant albums from Talking Book to Songs in the key of Life (1972-1976), and Hotter than July (1980) was good rather than great. Many agree that Secret Life of plants (1979) was weaker than the previous five albums (Some on the other hand think its genius - still look at its chart run compared to his other albums), still its 5 years - 1972 to 1977 (After Sir Duke topped the chart). Many top artists can claim a great 5 year run, but not a decade with out a bad album, self indulgent album or flawed masterpiece, or worse yet no activity for like 5 or more years. Some of the artists are Diana Ross (1970 -1976), Eagles (1973-1978), Pearl Jam 1989 -1994 etc. Elton John was on fire from 1970 to 76 when homophobic americans destroyed his career and his music became more self indulgent and less fun. Even the Beatles only lasted 7 years, but they are the greatest 7 year stint ever. This thread would be different if it was labelled "Greatest Five year stint by a group" the Beatles 1965-1970 would stand out, followed by the Rolling Stones 1968 - 1972.

But Prince could claim a decade as maybe his first two albums are hardly masterpieces, but they were at least decent and showed symptoms of the great talent emerging, only 2 years in, we get Dirty Mind a true masterpiece, Controversy - not as good, but still innovative with several tracks, then all the albums from 1999 to Lovesexy are all masterpieces and albums that seem to evolve from each other, all add a new dimension to his sound. Of course there are debates about this, such as people as myself who feel ATWIAD was letting the side down a bit, but many others see it as innovative as it marked a shift from the pop rock of Purple Rain, towards the more jazzy funk and soul of Parade and Sign. The other debate of course is Lovesexy, some think its his last great album, others think its less great and the start of his decline (Meaning it added nothing new, but it did, the positivity and fun it espouses). Really too, his first decade is his best as he was the trend setter, that started with Dirty Mind (Although For You and Prince, were based on the trends, the lyrics and concept of singer/songwriter was a novelty, and Prince's more adventurous lyric in the melody), and the trend setter image culminated with Sign o the Times, MANY fans and non fans hail this album as his masterpiece and peak and interestingly comes in the 9th year of his golden decade. After 1988 he still makes the occasional amazing album or song, but he steps of his podium as trend setter and becomes a trend follower, and his music is less white and international sounding and degenerates into dull and unremarkable versions of styles like Rap, Hip Hop and some weak funk with only the occasional good ballad and great sounding rock song.

So yes I agree, the Decade 1978 - 1988 by Prince is the greatest ever by a musical artist in pop music history (Music history must go to Mozart between 1775 and 1785) and Art to Leonardo Da Vinci (1494 - 1504). Very Close second is David Bowie 1970 -1980.

alandail said:

As I said earlier, I'm not sure how you rank that decade (i guess we're talking 79-88 to make it 10 years) ahead of the beatles. The one argument for Prince here is the beatles were two dominant artists instead of one. One other person I thought of who at least has to be considered is Barry Gibb from 75-84. During that time he had 8 number one songs (out of 10 top 10 singles) as the bee gees, 3 number 1 songs out of 6 top 10 hits for his brother andy, and number 1 songs for Frankie Valli (Grease), Kenny Rogers and Dolly Parton, Barbara Streisand, Yvonne Elliman as well as top 10 songs for Samantha Sang, Barbara Streisand and Dionne Warwick.

That's 15 number 1 songs written and produced (and in most cases performed) by Barry Gibb in 10 years.

At the end of that 10 year stretch he had the #1 selling album of all time (until thriller), a record setting string of 6 consecutive #1 songs (i.e. one of his songs only left the top spot to be replaced by another of his songs) and six consecutive bee gees singles hit number 1 - also a record for a producer/singer/songwriter. At one point 5 of the top 10 songs (including 4 of the top 5) were his, both records.

For the year 1978, 7 of the top 20 songs for the year were his, including 4 of the top 6. Certainly the best 1 year peak by any artist ever.

i'm glad you mentioned the bee gees and barry gibb. They are so underrated because of the disco backlash. I'm happy there are others who recogonise their talent, so overlooked.

I dont think they were great simply because they had hits (although ofcourse its a good thing) but even more impressive were their melody making skills.

i also think its kinda unfair to compare a band with a solo artist, usually within a band there are two good songwriters, while solo artist is just one guy. Perhaps a better question would be "great decade by a solo artist in history". I can understand if people want to rank some musicians ahead of prince (after all music is subjective and there are other geniuses besides prince). But as far as solo artists are concerned, i think his best work is probably among the ten best or so.

alandail said:

As I said earlier, I'm not sure how you rank that decade (i guess we're talking 79-88 to make it 10 years) ahead of the beatles. The one argument for Prince here is the beatles were two dominant artists instead of one. One other person I thought of who at least has to be considered is Barry Gibb from 75-84. During that time he had 8 number one songs (out of 10 top 10 singles) as the bee gees, 3 number 1 songs out of 6 top 10 hits for his brother andy, and number 1 songs for Frankie Valli (Grease), Kenny Rogers and Dolly Parton, Barbara Streisand, Yvonne Elliman as well as top 10 songs for Samantha Sang, Barbara Streisand and Dionne Warwick.

That's 15 number 1 songs written and produced (and in most cases performed) by Barry Gibb in 10 years.

At the end of that 10 year stretch he had the #1 selling album of all time (until thriller), a record setting string of 6 consecutive #1 songs (i.e. one of his songs only left the top spot to be replaced by another of his songs) and six consecutive bee gees singles hit number 1 - also a record for a producer/singer/songwriter. At one point 5 of the top 10 songs (including 4 of the top 5) were his, both records.

For the year 1978, 7 of the top 20 songs for the year were his, including 4 of the top 6. Certainly the best 1 year peak by any artist ever.

Charts are different from musical output (though the Bee Gees were no slouches).

prince was only great, as in could compete with the quality of other greats between 83 and 88 .. everything else was hit or miss just like a lot of other musicians .. prince does not have a great "decade" he has a "good" decade with a great 5 years in the middle .. prince "great" work was with and was credited to prince and the revolution .. not as a solo artist .. he gets no points as a solo artist because he only made half masterpieces as a solo artist, with the exception of sign which was a collaboration that prince chose to erase the recorded contributions and un-credit the compositional contributions of his former band. even if he wrote every note himself it is only 1 album that is great by prince as a solo artist, everything else he did as a solo artist had huge quality gaps .. numerous other artists put out a better run of records .. and if we are talkin beatles don't forget the amazing solo records of john lennon

If you don't think he's that great, why even come here? Obviously you don't like him. I mean if that's all you gonna do is compare other people to him just to prove a point. Maybe you just need to be on the non-Prince side of the board then. Just a recommendation.

[Edited 5/27/11 11:47am]

hhhhdmt said:

OldFriends4Sale said:

have 2 agree

prince was the one writing most of the material so he was not "riding" anything, and some of his best work came after the revolution left.

lol collaboration during the 1980-1986 years was the reason the output was so huge,

ideas and stories, real life situations and fantasy ... stuff comes from many different people in his camp... lyrics, lyrical line, instrument parts and melodies, Prince was the sun and the band/proteges were planets reflecting off him

And I don't think your going to win an arguement that some of his best work came after the 1986 years. Please don't count SOTT album or Eye No, or Joy in Repetition or most of the good music from GB cause all that came prior to 1987

Prince has written some good stuff like I Hate U, and the Rainbow Children album omg LOVE IT, but a lot of the other stuff in comparison to the 1978-1988 years naw

TrevorAyer said:

prince was only great, as in could compete with the quality of other greats between 83 and 88 .. everything else was hit or miss just like a lot of other musicians .. prince does not have a great "decade" he has a "good" decade with a great 5 years in the middle .. prince "great" work was with and was credited to prince and the revolution .. not as a solo artist .. he gets no points as a solo artist because he only made half masterpieces as a solo artist, with the exception of sign which was a collaboration that prince chose to erase the recorded contributions and un-credit the compositional contributions of his former band. even if he wrote every note himself it is only 1 album that is great by prince as a solo artist, everything else he did as a solo artist had huge quality gaps .. numerous other artists put out a better run of records .. and if we are talkin beatles don't forget the amazing solo records of john lennon

what uncredited work on sott? You mean carole davis, sussanah melvoin, dr fink and eric leeds who were all credited? Yes prince does get plenty of points as a solo artist.

Where in sign did prince choose to erase the recording contributions? Which ones? 13 of the 16 songs were entirely his compositions. You have zero evidence for this, thanks for making more nonsense up.

Oh and he did have an amazing decade. Dirty Mind, Controversy and 1999 are all great records.

OldFriends4Sale said:

hhhhdmt said:

prince was the one writing most of the material so he was not "riding" anything, and some of his best work came after the revolution left.

lol collaboration during the 1980-1986 years was the reason the output was so huge,

ideas and stories, real life situations and fantasy ... stuff comes from many different people in his camp... lyrics, lyrical line, instrument parts and melodies, Prince was the sun and the band/proteges were planets reflecting off him

And I don't think your going to win an arguement that some of his best work came after the 1986 years. Please don't count SOTT album or Eye No, or Joy in Repetition or most of the good music from GB cause all that came prior to 1987

Prince has written some good stuff like I Hate U, and the Rainbow Children album omg LOVE IT, but a lot of the other stuff in comparison to the 1978-1988 years naw

Not really. The revolution were not like lennon-mccartney where two great songwriters were on the same level. No one in the revolution was even close to prince's level as a songwriter. They get too much credit because they appeared in "purple rain" and so some people start to think of them as equal coloborators or something. Prince was the reason why the output was so good, the revolutuion were a good backing band who co wrote a few good songs, none of them were anywhere near his calibre as songwriters and are put pn a pedestal by their fans.

The Gold experience and love symbol albums, to me, are among his very best work.

and trevor, please dont back down, show me where on sott did prince not credit the revolution members. He did credit them but ofcourse you are just making this stuff up.

hhhhdmt said:

OldFriends4Sale said:

lol collaboration during the 1980-1986 years was the reason the output was so huge,

ideas and stories, real life situations and fantasy ... stuff comes from many different people in his camp... lyrics, lyrical line, instrument parts and melodies, Prince was the sun and the band/proteges were planets reflecting off him

And I don't think your going to win an arguement that some of his best work came after the 1986 years. Please don't count SOTT album or Eye No, or Joy in Repetition or most of the good music from GB cause all that came prior to 1987

Prince has written some good stuff like I Hate U, and the Rainbow Children album omg LOVE IT, but a lot of the other stuff in comparison to the 1978-1988 years naw

Not really. The revolution were not like lennon-mccartney where two great songwriters were on the same level. No one in the revolution was even close to prince's level as a songwriter. They get too much credit because they appeared in "purple rain" and so some people start to think of them as equal coloborators or something. Prince was the reason why the output was so good, the revolutuion were a good backing band who co wrote a few good songs, none of them were anywhere near his calibre as songwriters and are put pn a pedestal by their fans.

The Gold experience and love symbol albums, to me, are among his very best work.

George Harrison wasn't a songwriter at all when he joined the Beatles. At first, Lennon and McCartney gave him songs to sing. Then he started writing songs of his own, with a little help from Lennon. By the last album, one of his songs ("Something") was chosen as the A-side of the single and is generally regarded as one of the greatest love songs ever written, covered by Sinatra and many others. When the Beatles broke up, it was George who produced the first masterpiece, "All Things Must Pass." As the years passed after the breakup, his output became spotty again, but so did the work of the other former Beatles.

Why did George become a great songwriter when he started out as just a guitar player? Because he was in a group with two of the greatest songwriters of all time, and he wanted to rise to their level, and he did.

So my question is, suppose that the Revolution had stayed together through the end of the 1980s. Isn't it possible that Wendy and Lisa, and maybe some of the others, could have blossomed as songwriters in that environment as George did in the Beatles?