JorisE73 said:

EmmaMcG said:

JorisE73 said:

That;'s not he point I was trying to make.
The Civil War storyline as a movie plan wasn't even a thing yet (and both Feige and teh Russo's have gone on record about that and they know better than you) until BvS was anounced (and Kevin Feige and Geoff Johns have been close enough for them to know and share there plans, again this is all on record from Feige/Johns and the Russos)
Captain America 3 would have been a completely different movie and story if it wasn't for BvS.
And that is what made me scratch my head because me too thought this was planned years ago, but back in 2015/2016 when news came about BvS and in reaction Marvel abandonning Captain America 3 for Civil War is what surpised me. This not an attack I'm just saying what they have been saying on record for years (even well after both movies were released and now again with teh release of the Snyder Cut) Feige and Johns both said neither wanted to copy each other simply because Marvel and DC are completely different entities but then Feige backtracked on that when BvS was (internally) announced right after teh release of Man of Steel in 2013 (and probably Disney forcing him) and WB forced Johns who then backstabbed and scratched Snyder's/Lee's plans for a pay day.

I'm only going by what was said in one of the Making Of documentaries on Disney Plus. I really don't care enough to do any further research because I don't much care one way or the other. But even if it's as you say and they somehow conceived a way of making Civil War and tying it into the wider MCU so effortlessly in just over 2 years (which would mean I vastly underestimated how good they were) then that doesn't really counter my original point which was that Marvel Studios have done a much better job on planning out their entire movie universe than Warner has. Changing the story of one or two movies out of over 20 along the way doesn't change the fact that they had the core idea of where their cinematic universe was going from the very beginning. Zack Snyder knew where he wanted to go but WB wouldn't let him finish it and have completely ruined their own cinematic universe through indecision, bad movies and no coherent plan. WB have fucked things up so much that even I, a lifelong fan of Batman and Superman movies/animated shows, have lost all interest in anything they're doing.

IMO Civil War felt and looked like a rushed release and i much rather have the original Captain America 3 they had planned even tho I don;'t know what the originla plan was for that.
Even that Spiderman cameo was "inspired", as they claimed, by Wonder Woman's cameo in BvS.
Feige and Johns were meeting a lot during that time (according to several Geoff Johns interviews from then) and it's pretty clear why.

Civil War to me was a big step backwards and they should have waited making that movie for some years.
I remember when teh Civil War comic series was released in 2006 or 2007 or so there was a huge backlash with Marvel being blamed of ripping off The Dark Knight Returns and Watchmen from 2 decades earlier (kind of sad since Marvel and DC have been ripping each other off in comics for decades and nobody cared back then) so i think it's ironic that Marvel again let themselves be 'inspired' for a Civil War by a movie that was based in parts on The Dark Knight Returns.
I also would have loved to see what World's Finest (the more direct Man of Steel sequel) would have been if BvS wasn't pushed on Snyder.

EmmaMcG said:

JorisE73 said:

Has James Gunn ever made a movie that was good? His movies are below passable imo.
This looks as awful like his Guardians of the Galaxy movies.
And Godzilla vs Kong, are people really anticipating that or even going to see that movie after that really bad Skull Island movie and that embarrasingly bad King of Mosters movie??

This looks worse than Guardians of the Galaxy in my opinion. The attempt at being "edgy" by having unnecessary swearing and stupidly over-the-top violence in place of a good story just screams lazy filmmaking. Plus, I'm so bored of Harley Quinn now. Her solo movie was one of the worst movies I've ever seen and this looks like it's cut from the same cloth. In fact, it may be the point where I'm officially calling it quits with regards DC movies. Looking at their proposed release schedule there's nothing there that looks even remotely interesting.

Since we're not getting an 'Ayer Cut' of Suicide Squad, I don;t see why I should waste my time on more WB garbage. The only DC movie I'll be watching (by pirating it) is the Flash movie, the rest can die a slow death unless Snyder gets to do his Justice League 2 and 3 and teh Ayer Cut gets released.

JorisE73 said:

EmmaMcG said:

A proper Man of Steel sequel seems like an impossibility now doesn't it? It's a shame. Christopher Reeve will always be "my" Superman but Henry Cavill's version was different enough that you can't really compare the two. So both could co-exist as the "definitive" version of the character due to them essentially playing two different versions of Superman. I kind of feel the same about Ben Affleck's Batman too. Michael Keaton is my favourite Batman but his take on the character is very different to pretty much every other version I've ever seen. He's never depicted as a tough as nails hand-to-hand combat expert and so instead relies on theatricality to scare the bad guys and almost win the fight before it starts. He's also crazy as fuck and it's believable that someone like him would dress as a bat to beat the shit out of Gotham's criminals. Affleck's Batman was more in line with the animated series or the Arkham videogames. He absolutely is a tough as nails hand-to-hand combat expert and he will use those skills to violently take out his enemies. That one fight scene in Batman Vs Superman was enough to get me excited for a solo Batfleck movie. And whereas Keaton would likely still be my favourite take on the character I think Affleck is different enough to set him apart and so there's be no need to compare the two.

To me, Keaton's Batman is a darker version from the 60's, Bale's is what Batman would be in the real(our) world, and Affleck is the closest to Frank Miller's Dark Knight Returns (it's like he was lifted straight from that graphic novel). I owe Affleck an apology (same as Keaton)....he nailed that shit. Those are my top 3 Batmans. We'll what Pattinson does in the role.

The DCEU is fucked, so don't get any hopes for Man of Steel 2. The time to do it was before BvS. It's a shame, because I like the darkness of the DC films over the silly one-liners from Marvel (even though I was bigger fan of Marvel comics growing up).

JorisE73 said:

uPtoWnNY said:

Exactly. The only human G-Fans cared about was Dr. Serizawa from the 1954 original (still the best and most serious Godzilla film).

Godzilla vs. Kong next week and Mortal Kombat in April.

I really hope Mortal Kombat is good, but judging from the trailer with bad acting and the corny delivery of teh 'Get over here' line this is probably just as bad as the 'no-gore-Mortal Kombat-in-name-only' PG-13 version from the 90's but with a lot of gore and fatalities.
If they throw in some 'Babalities' and 'Friendships' in the movie then you know they already 'jumped the shark'/'nuked the fridge'.

We're talking about a movie based on a videogame. I'm not expecting "The Godfather", but already this looks wayyyy better than the 90s MK films. The first one was ok for its time, but Annihilation was a hot mess.

uPtoWnNY said:

EmmaMcG said:

And Tim Burton's Batman movies are, to my mind, the definitive Batman movies.

Batman '89 is one of the best Batman films, I'll give you that (even though it had its share of cringe moments - an armoured Batplane taken down by a pea-shooter???? that's stretching it). Batman Returns was a mess - I could have done without Danny DeVito's overacting. A Batman/Catwoman film would have been great.

I love the Nolan trilogy, but for me, the definitive Batman movie would have been Affleck's. His Dark Knight is the closest to Frank Miller's, which I consider THE Batman.

uPtoWnNY said:

Ava DuVernay's 'New Gods,' James Wan's 'The Trench' DC Movies Not Moving Forward at Warner Bros.
April 1, 2021 The Hollywood Reporter

Warner Bros. and DC Films' upcoming slate is moving forward without Ava DuVernay's New Gods and James Wan's Aquaman spinoff, The Trench.

"As part of our DC slate, some legacy development titles including New Gods and The Trench will not be moving forward," Warner Bros. and DC said in a statement. "We thank our partners Ava DuVernay, Tom King, James Wan and Peter Safran for their time and collaboration during this process and look forward to our continued partnership with them on other DC stories. The projects will remain in their skillful hands if they were to move forward in the future."

New Gods, which DuVernay has been developing as a directing vehicle with acclaimed comic book writer Tom King since 2018, would have brought to the screen the comic book characters created by the late and legendary artist Jack Kirby. DuVernay, however, remains in the DC fold and is currently working on the DC series Naomi for The CW.

The Trench, meanwhile, was to have been a horror-tinged project spinning out of Aquaman and focused on the group of the deadly amphibious creatures seen in the $1 billion-grossing 2018 film. Noah Gardner and Aidan Fitzgerald had written the script, which Wan was developing as a producer with collaborator Peter Safran. Wan, too, remains in the DC fold as he is prepping to shoot Aquaman 2 for the studio later this year.

The projects are being shelved but like many comic characters, could come to life down the road. DC Films, led by president Walter Hamada, is leaving the door open to revisit these properties in the future, but insiders note that when it became clear the upcoming DC slate did not have a natural spot for New Gods or The Trench over the next few years, execs believed it was best not to leave the filmmakers hanging in development without a clear end in sight.

DC is currently building an interconnected slate in which projects will feed in and out of the big screen and the small, with films such as James Gunn's The Suicide Squad (Aug. 6) spinning off into the John Cena-led HBO Max series Peacemaker, and Matt Reeves' The Batman (March 4, 2022) spawning its own Gotham police department focused show.

"Tom, I loved writing NEW GODS with you," DuVernay wrote on Twitter, along with a photo of herself with King. "I’m upset that the saga of Barda, Scott, Granny, Highfather and The Furies ends this way. Diving into Kirby’s Fourth World was the adventure of a lifetime. That can’t be taken away. Thank you for your friendship. And remember... #DarkseidIs"

With The Trench, sources say that the upcoming Aquaman sequel was considered enough, but Warners could come back to it down the line if there is thirst for more adventures set in the Atlantean kingdoms. It was also considered a possibility for streaming, but it is more of a standalone story rather than having a strong tying into Aquaman or the rest of the DC universe.

New Gods, which would have been a sprawling tale, was complicated by the fact that its villain, Darkseid, just appeared as a major foil in Zack Snyder's Justice League and there was a desire to have space between the latter and any new appearances.

Except for The Batman, which is set on an alternate Earth known to geeks as Earth-2, DC is plotting its films and shows to share the same universe. Key to setting up its new status quo will be The Flash (Nov. 4, 2022), which will tackle the multiverse and is said to also lend clarity to the future of the Justice League with multiple Batmen, as well as Supergirl, appearing.

Other projects on the slate due out in 2022-23 include Warners' and New Line's Black Adam (July 29, 2022) and Shazam! Fury Of The Gods (June 2, 2023), as well as Warners' Blue Beetle, Batgirl, Supergirl, Green Lantern Corps and Static Shock.

Zatanna and a third Wonder Woman are also in development, while an upcoming Superman, from producer J.J. Abrams and screenwriter Ta-Nehisi Coates, is too early in development to say if it will be connected to the larger DC Universe or if, like The Batman, will stand on its own.

MickyDolenz said:

onlyforaminute said:

EmmaMcG said:

onlyforaminute said:

EmmaMcG said:

Not surprised these have been cancelled. Neither sounded particularly interesting.

Like I said, the DCEU is a clusterfuck. No direction at all.

EmmaMcG said:

MickyDolenz said:

Ava DuVernay's 'New Gods,' James Wan's 'The Trench' DC Movies Not Moving Forward at Warner Bros.
April 1, 2021 The Hollywood Reporter

Warner Bros. and DC Films' upcoming slate is moving forward without Ava DuVernay's New Gods and James Wan's Aquaman spinoff, The Trench.

"As part of our DC slate, some legacy development titles including New Gods and The Trench will not be moving forward," Warner Bros. and DC said in a statement. "We thank our partners Ava DuVernay, Tom King, James Wan and Peter Safran for their time and collaboration during this process and look forward to our continued partnership with them on other DC stories. The projects will remain in their skillful hands if they were to move forward in the future."

New Gods, which DuVernay has been developing as a directing vehicle with acclaimed comic book writer Tom King since 2018, would have brought to the screen the comic book characters created by the late and legendary artist Jack Kirby. DuVernay, however, remains in the DC fold and is currently working on the DC series Naomi for The CW.

The Trench, meanwhile, was to have been a horror-tinged project spinning out of Aquaman and focused on the group of the deadly amphibious creatures seen in the $1 billion-grossing 2018 film. Noah Gardner and Aidan Fitzgerald had written the script, which Wan was developing as a producer with collaborator Peter Safran. Wan, too, remains in the DC fold as he is prepping to shoot Aquaman 2 for the studio later this year.

The projects are being shelved but like many comic characters, could come to life down the road. DC Films, led by president Walter Hamada, is leaving the door open to revisit these properties in the future, but insiders note that when it became clear the upcoming DC slate did not have a natural spot for New Gods or The Trench over the next few years, execs believed it was best not to leave the filmmakers hanging in development without a clear end in sight.

DC is currently building an interconnected slate in which projects will feed in and out of the big screen and the small, with films such as James Gunn's The Suicide Squad (Aug. 6) spinning off into the John Cena-led HBO Max series Peacemaker, and Matt Reeves' The Batman (March 4, 2022) spawning its own Gotham police department focused show.

"Tom, I loved writing NEW GODS with you," DuVernay wrote on Twitter, along with a photo of herself with King. "I’m upset that the saga of Barda, Scott, Granny, Highfather and The Furies ends this way. Diving into Kirby’s Fourth World was the adventure of a lifetime. That can’t be taken away. Thank you for your friendship. And remember... #DarkseidIs"

With The Trench, sources say that the upcoming Aquaman sequel was considered enough, but Warners could come back to it down the line if there is thirst for more adventures set in the Atlantean kingdoms. It was also considered a possibility for streaming, but it is more of a standalone story rather than having a strong tying into Aquaman or the rest of the DC universe.

New Gods, which would have been a sprawling tale, was complicated by the fact that its villain, Darkseid, just appeared as a major foil in Zack Snyder's Justice League and there was a desire to have space between the latter and any new appearances.

Except for The Batman, which is set on an alternate Earth known to geeks as Earth-2, DC is plotting its films and shows to share the same universe. Key to setting up its new status quo will be The Flash (Nov. 4, 2022), which will tackle the multiverse and is said to also lend clarity to the future of the Justice League with multiple Batmen, as well as Supergirl, appearing.

Other projects on the slate due out in 2022-23 include Warners' and New Line's Black Adam (July 29, 2022) and Shazam! Fury Of The Gods (June 2, 2023), as well as Warners' Blue Beetle, Batgirl, Supergirl, Green Lantern Corps and Static Shock.

Zatanna and a third Wonder Woman are also in development, while an upcoming Superman, from producer J.J. Abrams and screenwriter Ta-Nehisi Coates, is too early in development to say if it will be connected to the larger DC Universe or if, like The Batman, will stand on its own.

Not surprised these have been cancelled. Neither sounded particularly interesting.

Given all the HP Lovecraft easter eggs in Aquaman I was kind of curious to see a horror movie in that universe. That Ava Duvernay movie could have been great if they used another director (Snyder). After seeing her latest projects i think her documentary (13th) was a fluke because everythig she's done since then has been crap.

I think I read some days ago that two Man of Steel sequels will be shot back to back with Henry Cavill and with Mr. Mxyzptlk as the main baddie. Could have been a April fools joke tho but I think it was posted march 30th.

JorisE73 said:

EmmaMcG said:

JorisE73 said:

Given all the HP Lovecraft easter eggs in Aquaman I was kind of curious to see a horror movie in that universe. That Ava Duvernay movie could have been great if they used another director (Snyder). After seeing her latest projects i think her documentary (13th) was a fluke because everythig she's done since then has been crap.

I think I read some days ago that two Man of Steel sequels will be shot back to back with Henry Cavill and with Mr. Mxyzptlk as the main baddie. Could have been a April fools joke tho but I think it was posted march 30th.

I read that too about the Man of Steel sequels. The writer of the article sited "April Fools News" as his source so I think it's safe to assume it was just an April Fools "joke".

Ah ok. Nasty joke lol

JorisE73 said:

EmmaMcG said:

JorisE73 said: I read that too about the Man of Steel sequels. The writer of the article sited "April Fools News" as his source so I think it's safe to assume it was just an April Fools "joke".

Ah ok. Nasty joke lol

Actually that would be typical of WB to go with the lame-ass Mr. Mxyzptlk instead of Superman's real badass villians (Brainiac, Mongol, Parasite, Metallo). If there is a MoS 2, it HAS to be Brainiac. He's one of Supes classic bad guys - please, enough with Luthor.

Dwayne Johnson Reportedly...Of Steel 2

uPtoWnNY said:

EmmaMcG said:

J.J Abrams is rebooting Superman for Warner Bros, seemingly putting an end to any hopes that we'd get a sequel to Man of Steel. Word around the campfire suggests that not only are they recasting the lead role but they're looking to cast a black actor as Superman. I'm all for more black (and female, for that matter) superhero movies but fuck me, this just sounds like an awful idea. It kind of reminds me of the time some idiot at a movie studio thought it would be a good idea to make an all-female Ghostbusters movie. And we seen how that turned out. Now, this "black Superman" movie probably won't be as bad as that, and may even turn out to be a good movie, but it won't be Superman. Not to me. Rather than making traditionally white heroes black would it not be better to make movies of already black heroes? Just a thought.

.

TWO WORDS: Sunshine Superman!

.

Look THAT^ up whenever you get an opportunity.

[Edited 4/14/21 11:10am]

kpowers said:

J.J Abrams ruined Star Trek and now will fuck up Superman as well.

.

I knew you were going to say that!

TonyVanDam said:

It's been reported that Michael Keaton is officially back as Batman in The Flash movie. It had been rumored before now.

MickyDolenz said:

It's been reported that Michael Keaton is officially back as Batman in The Flash movie. It had been rumored before now.

MickyDolenz said:

It's been reported that Michael Keaton is officially back as Batman in The Flash movie. It had been rumored before now.

Keaton has a 10 picture movie deal as Batman with WB. They are options not guarantees. They might end up with a TV series on HBO MAX. Focusing on the older Batman.

onlyforaminute said:

MickyDolenz said:

It's been reported that Michael Keaton is officially back as Batman in The Flash movie. It had been rumored before now.

I'd rather have Ben Affleck