aardvark15 said:

Gunsnhalen said:

Errrr let me ask. Does this have something to do with race? cause i'm getting that vibe

It was because he's white then why didn't Nebraska do very well?

Nebraska is a pretty dark album, as is The River.

They do have the upbeat songs... but Nebraska especially is very somber. Born & a lot of his albums are about the working class people, the people underpaid & trying to rise up.

Where Nebraska ia about criminals, thiefs & people doing bad thing's to make ends meet. i don't think America was jumping on that

chocolate1 said:

Here in NJ, it is a REQUIREMENT to like Bruce.

I took a class in high school (in the 80s) called "Folk Literature", in which we studied song lyrics as part of the curriculum.

I didn't know a lot about Bruce before then, other than not liking his music.

His early lyrics read like poetry; they are pretty deep. Plus they related mostly to working class people who lived in NJ.

When "Born in the USA" came out, it had more mass pop appeal than the earlier albums did.

My

Wish i had a folk literature class in school

TonyVanDam said:

For most people that never bother to listen to the lyrics of the title track, Born In The USA was taken as 100% pure patriotism.

that always cracks me up

it was the first time i realised that a song can reach number one, with millions of people

listening to it, singing it and broadcasting it whilst half of them don't even know what the

lyrics are.

even in a native english speaking country

IstenSzek said:

TonyVanDam said:

For most people that never bother to listen to the lyrics of the title track, Born In The USA was taken as 100% pure patriotism.

that always cracks me up

it was the first time i realised that a song can reach number one, with millions of people

listening to it, singing it and broadcasting it whilst half of them don't even know what the

lyrics are.

even in a native english speaking country

Make a good "hook"......................and they will come.

Gunsnhalen said:

I had to busrt anyones bubble.... but who was the biggest artist of 1984? i believe we are on his site , who just made what was at the time the biggest video of all time? You guys know his name.

Who just had huge hits & infamous videos that dealt with stalking a blind girl, doing it all night long & stuck in people

Who just had a huge comeback? TINA....

Stevie Wonder had that cheesy song about calling people go to number 1 & Chaka had a few classic hits as well.

My point being if you are trying to say racism... boo boo better give me recipts. Cause the biggest artists of 1984 a good majority where African American.

Also Bruce & The E Street Band all have a very different mixed race of people as well...

Clarence Clemons is African American, Steven Van Zandt is italian, Max Weinberg is half latino.

I want recipts

I never heard 1984 music described in such a...unique way before.

Empress said:

smoothcriminal12 said:

Real reason, please?

Oh come on! Don't be so naive. This is the Prince site and America, so those that talk about the "real reason" are taking about racism.

I think we all know that is what the conspiracy theorists are implying, but there were many other comparable white artists at the time that weren't as popular. What makes this album so huge compared to, say, Tom Petty's Southern Accents or John Mellencamp's Uh-Huh?

Gunsnhalen said:

I had to busrt anyones bubble.... but who was the biggest artist of 1984? i believe we are on his site

Well Michael had the most successful album that year though.....And released the Thriller video so.....

sexton said:

Empress said:

Oh come on! Don't be so naive. This is the Prince site and America, so those that talk about the "real reason" are taking about racism.

I think we all know that is what the conspiracy theorists are implying, but there were many other comparable white artists at the time that weren't as popular. What makes this album so huge compared to, say, Tom Petty's Southern Accents or John Mellencamp's Uh-Huh?

wow, are you even asking this? = the SONGS man, the SONGS

seriously, songs like Glory Days, Dancing in the Dark, the title-track, Cover Me, etc are natural winners...

Born in the USA was basically his mid-career Diamonds and Pearls (Born to Run his 1999/PR and The River his SOTT), but with better album-tracks/singles overall; with BitUSA Bruce basically conquered the "meat and potatoes" american audience, hungry for catchy melodies and "feel good" lyrics (despite some dark numbers like Downbound Train, Im Going Down or My Hometown)

Petty was always too alternative to reach this level of mainstream success

and Mellencamp never wrote a truly catchy hit as far as I'm concerned, if he achieved some kind of success that's because sticky Heartland-Arena Rock was the rage during the early-to-mid 80s...

JoeTyler said:

sexton said:

I think we all know that is what the conspiracy theorists are implying, but there were many other comparable white artists at the time that weren't as popular. What makes this album so huge compared to, say, Tom Petty's Southern Accents or John Mellencamp's Uh-Huh?

wow, are you even asking this? = the SONGS man, the SONGS

seriously, songs like Glory Days, Dancing in the Dark, the title-track, Cover Me, etc are natural winners...

Born in the USA was basically his mid-career Diamonds and Pearls (Born to Run his 1999/PR and The River his SOTT), but with better album-tracks/singles overall; with BitUSA Bruce basically conquered the "meat and potatoes" american audience, hungry for catchy melodies and "feel good" lyrics (despite some dark numbers like Downbound Train, Im Going Down or My Hometown)

Of course most of us know this is the REAL answer. Yet conspiracy theorists are saying it's not the songs, but something else.

I think because the songs were a lot more ''pop'' songs. really 80's sounding and very catchy and feel good up tempo songs (like Glory Days, Dancing in the Dark). even Born In The USA sounds like a feel good song, but in fact really it isn't.... it's because of the beat.... very catchy.

I think that's the only reason, a lot of songs were good single material because they were catchy and very 80's pop sounding. also because of the video's on MTV.... he got exposure to a bigger audience. i think

He has better album than this. Like for example; Born To Run, Darkness on the edge of town. etc

sexton said:

JoeTyler said:

wow, are you even asking this? = the SONGS man, the SONGS

seriously, songs like Glory Days, Dancing in the Dark, the title-track, Cover Me, etc are natural winners...

Born in the USA was basically his mid-career Diamonds and Pearls (Born to Run his 1999/PR and The River his SOTT), but with better album-tracks/singles overall; with BitUSA Bruce basically conquered the "meat and potatoes" american audience, hungry for catchy melodies and "feel good" lyrics (despite some dark numbers like Downbound Train, Im Going Down or My Hometown)

Of course most of us know this is the REAL answer. Yet conspiracy theorists are saying it's not the songs, but something else.

oh, ok, it was a rhetorical question, I even didn't read the whole thread when I wrote that, lol yeah, there are paranoids everywhere, even in unsuspected corners...

[Edited 10/9/12 16:21pm]

xLiberiangirl said:

I think because the songs were a lot more ''pop'' songs. really 80's sounding and very catchy and feel good up tempo songs (like Glory Days, Dancing in the Dark). even Born In The USA sounds like a feel good song, but in fact really it isn't.... it's because of the beat.... very catchy.

I think that's the only reason, a lot of songs were good single material because they were catchy and very 80's pop sounding. also because of the video's on MTV.... he got exposure to a bigger audience. i think

He has better album than this. Like for example; Born To Run, Darkness on the edge of town. etc

probably Born to Run and River are better albums, not so sure about Darkness or Nebraska, USA at least sports some hope underneath the cynicism, while those two albums are just about defeat and the ugly side of life; USA is a more balanced album: the Vietnam veteran of Born in the USA may have been "ten years burning down to road with no place to go" but at least he's defiant about it, even proud

[Edited 10/9/12 16:28pm]

Empress said:

smoothcriminal12 said:

Real reason, please?

Oh come on! Don't be so naive. This is the Prince site and America, so those that talk about the "real reason" are taking about racism.

I wanna hear it from his mouth...or fingers. Or keyboard.

aardvark15 said:

Gunsnhalen said:

I had to busrt anyones bubble.... but who was the biggest artist of 1984? i believe we are on his site

Well Michael had the most successful album that year though.....And released the Thriller video so.....

Thriller always gettin in the way

Gunsnhalen said:

aardvark15 said:

Well Michael had the most successful album that year though.....And released the Thriller video so.....

Thriller always gettin in the way

It was a strong album.

Video was king.

Patriotism (even misunderstood patriotism) was at an alltime high.

Someone please make a thread about, "What Do You Think Made The Joshua Tree" So Big?"

I was obsessed with that album.

CynicKill said:

It was a strong album.

Video was king.

Patriotism (even misunderstood patriotism) was at an alltime high.

Someone please make a thread about, "What Do You Think Made The Joshua Tree" So Big?"

I was obsessed with that album.

Another classic political album that got insane success....

Hmmm... well U2 had been building up for awhile.... maybe it was live Aid? maybe it was right place right time?

Also could be 86 & 87 they where ready for more political songs... hell you had sign o the times by P, Man In The Mirror by MJ, Shout & Everybody Wants To Rule The World where huge in 85 & 85. Beds Are burning was also a huge hit!

So idk.. just seems from 85-87 political songs where becoming more & more popular.

Good songs, the cover, the controversy of the title track, etc.

That's probably what generated. Also his profile had been raised for quite some time.

I don't know about the rest of the nation but I remember why a lot of folks in The South loved it. Look at the pop music scene in the early 1980s.....a second British Invasion, wild punk rock hair, men in glam makeup, etc. Things that a lot of white Southerners hate..."foreigners, freaks, and queers". In other words, anything different than they are or what they consider "normal".

Bruce Springsteen and John Cougar Mellencamp was loved down here because they were the "normal" bluecollar looking artists they could relate to. Personally, that normal bluecollar image turned me off but hey, what can I say, I'm an outcast down here my damn self.

.

.

.

[Edited 10/10/12 6:46am]

vainandy said:

I don't know about the rest of the nation but I remember why a lot of folks in The South loved it. Look at the pop music scene in the early 1980s.....a second British Invasion, wild punk rock hair, men in glam makeup, etc. Things that a lot of white Southerners hate..."foreigners, freaks, and queers". In other words, anything different than they are or what they consider "normal".

Bruce Springsteen and John Cougar Mellencamp was loved down here because they were the "normal" bluecollar looking artists they could relate to. Personally, that normal bluecollar image turned me off but hey, what can I say, I'm an outcast down here my damn self.

.

.

.

[Edited 10/10/12 6:46am]

Both were popular as hell up here too. Springsteen in fact hits here EVERY time he tours. Except for Dave Matthews I can't say that for anyone else!

JoeTyler said:

sexton said:

I think we all know that is what the conspiracy theorists are implying, but there were many other comparable white artists at the time that weren't as popular. What makes this album so huge compared to, say, Tom Petty's Southern Accents or John Mellencamp's Uh-Huh?

wow, are you even asking this? = the SONGS man, the SONGS

seriously, songs like Glory Days, Dancing in the Dark, the title-track, Cover Me, etc are natural winners...

Born in the USA was basically his mid-career Diamonds and Pearls (Born to Run his 1999/PR and The River his SOTT), but with better album-tracks/singles overall; with BitUSA Bruce basically conquered the "meat and potatoes" american audience, hungry for catchy melodies and "feel good" lyrics (despite some dark numbers like Downbound Train, Im Going Down or My Hometown)

Petty was always too alternative to reach this level of mainstream success

and Mellencamp never wrote a truly catchy hit as far as I'm concerned, if he achieved some kind of success that's because sticky Heartland-Arena Rock was the rage during the early-to-mid 80s...

smoothcriminal12 said:

Empress said:

Oh come on! Don't be so naive. This is the Prince site and America, so those that talk about the "real reason" are taking about racism.

I wanna hear it from his mouth...or fingers. Or keyboard.

These guys are now silent because they know it's nonsense.

Gunsnhalen said:

Bruce was an independent artists for years & had a huge cult following.... and finally got a top 10 with Hungry heart... and 3 years later with the Born singles.

Actually, he was never an independent artist. All of his records have been released on Columbia, which was an imprint of CBS (which became "Sony", which became "Sony BMG").

Although he'd never scored a Top 10 single prior to Hungry Heart, Born to Run went to #3 (and put him on the covers of TIME and Newsweek in the same week) and Darkness on the Edge of Town, #5.

The album is not as dark as The River or Nebraska.. or as Powerhouse Born To Run.

Take another listen - lyrically, BUSA is very bleak (which makes sense, since most of the material was written at the same time as the Nebraska songs). ...Not that "dark" is usually a selling point for records, though. Not as "powerhouse" as Born to Run? I guess it depends on what you mean by "powerhouse". Personally, I don't care for the melodrama of much of BTR. And BUSA's more conventional song lengths and structures made it much more radio-friendly.

But what is it that made Born so big?

Bruce had steadily built up a very devoted following with his legendary live show and then Born to Run, Darkness and The River. This following was large enough to send an album of folk songs, recorded on cassette in his bedroom (Nebraska) to #3!

Enter Born in the U.S.A., less than two years later, with the now-buff Boss' derriere on the cover, against the American flag. Potent imagery, to be sure. The first single (Dancing in the Dark) is engineered for dancefloor play (and remixed as such), as well as the radio, and his first real video is all tight-jeans and rippling muscles. He's a mainstream sex symbol now.

He goes on a SRO tour, where he continues to pwn nightly (including, for the first time, in Australia and Japan). More hook-heavy, radio-friendly singles follow: Cover Me (originally written for Donna Summer), Born in the USA, I'm on Fire, I'm Goin' Down, Glory Days and My Hometown. USA, I'm on Fire, Glory Days and My Hometown are all accompanied by videos that go into heavy rotation on MTV and elsewhere. Now he's into stadia.

Short answer:

- Chock-a-block with very strong singles

- Bruce's new, buff image, just in time for the music video explosion

- Accompanying, highly-acclaimed tour, where he played a ton of shows to a ton of people

novabrkr said:

I'm not a huge fan myself and I don't think he ever was nearly as popular in Europe

Actually, his popularity there rivaled his popularity in North America, beginning with USA. And he's now more popular in Europe than anywhere else.

NDRU said:

Graycap23 said:

The preceived theme...................

I think so too. It makes me wonder, do you think he intended to pull one over on America?

No. As a matter of fact, he took great pains to talk about the meaning of the song and to distance himself from Reagan and his ilk.

Gunsnhalen said:

lastdecember said:

Alot of big questions there and there are alot of different answers, first i think the age thing really didnt matter cause it was the 80's that would matter now not then, AGE-ISM wasnt born yet.

As for why, well when the album hit, mainly "Dancing In The Dark" it was billed as the first BRUCE video ever, though there was a few concert ones, those were just taken from shows not really Made videos. You had Friday Night Videos then that played it all, this was before the cosby kids and fresh prince cast hosted every other week and the show played about 8 videos instead of the 20-30 it would play normally when it first started. VIDEO pushed this record, Bruce was a rock radio guy but this got him on POP radio too, though Born was critical of america, YOU WERE FREE to do that then, now you get Dixie Chicked for speaking up, funny how times havent gone forward but BACK. This album had some classic videos, GLory Days, shit who couldnt identify with that one, Im On Fire, shoot having a crush on this woman you always see, BRUCE hit on every possible vibe on this record, but also crossed over like he didnt before.

AND it also came from an era of BIG ALBUMS with BIG SINGLES, that dont happen anymore, now you can have Katy Perry launch 7 top 10's and barely sell a million, and most of the public not even own the album, to me, nothing against Katy or any of these other big singles artists, they do not translate to great albums or even come close.

True, Adele is the only one that has done the big albums with big singles thing as of recent.

Bruce did hit a lot of chords & the songs dealt with many different thing's people from all walks of life could identify with!

But i still find it strange that singles like I'm On Fire & Going Down become so big!, i could for sure never seeing songs like those going big today at all.

Chicks really dig I'm on Fire (the sex thing) and - although it's an incredibly hooky record - IGD did benefit from the momentum of what had, by then, become the Boss juggernaut.

NDRU said:

I loved the story Prince told of being backstage at a springsteen show. He said something like "I'm not a huge fan of his music, but I was watching him, and the band started losing focus for a second, and Bruce turned around and shot them the nastiest look, and you know they got back in line after that!"

Never said "I'm not a huge fan of his music". He's a big Bruce fan. And I remember the quote you're referring to. Never said "nastiest". Said they started to go off somewhere, Bruce turned around and shot them a look and they straightened up right-quick.

Ace said:

NDRU said:

I loved the story Prince told of being backstage at a springsteen show. He said something like "I'm not a huge fan of his music, but I was watching him, and the band started losing focus for a second, and Bruce turned around and shot them the nastiest look, and you know they got back in line after that!"

Never said "I'm not a huge fan of his music". He's a big Bruce fan. And I remember the quote you're referring to. Never said "nastiest". Said they started to go off somewhere, Bruce turned around and shot them a look and they straightened up right-quick.

eh, I think I got the gist of the quote..but for you completists out there this is the quote:

"I'm not real into Bruce Springsteen's music," he says, "but I have a lot of respect for his talent."

Prince and Springsteen occasionally exchange notes; in recalling a Springsteen concert he saw from backstage a few years back, Prince displays the respect of a general reviewing another man's army. "I admire the way he holds his audience -- there's one man whose fans I could never take away," he says with a laugh. And how does he compare their stage tactics? "I'm not sure," says Prince. "But at one point, his band started going off somewhere. Springsteen turned around and shot the band one terrifying look. You know they got right back on it!"

[Edited 10/10/12 12:19pm]

JoeTyler said:

not so sure about Darkness or Nebraska, USA at least sports some hope underneath the cynicism, while those two albums are just about defeat and the ugly side of life

Actually, Joe, while Darkness is pretty...well...uh...dark (), ultimately, it's about overcoming setbacks and demons and pushing on with renewed vigor.

Nebraska, on the other hand (with the exception of Open All Night and - arguably - Mansion on the Hill) is pretty much darkness on the edge of town and everywhere else. The rising music at the end could be interpreted as hopeful, but - lyrically and musically - that is a bleak album.