dreamfirstborn said:

why are they using pictures of Prince that didn't exist at that time?

Which pictures did they use?

paisleyparkgirl said:

dreamfirstborn said:

why are they using pictures of Prince that didn't exist at that time?

Which pictures did they use?

They had some obvious re-enactments showing them shuffling pictures around to place everybody's solos in the proper order, and they used a Prince pic from Lovesexy.

Cgolemb said:

I'm all for keeping Prince's name out there, but if I see one more article about this pertaining to Prince's non-involvement 😡. It's funny that that is all they seem to focus on rather than the other musicians or cause.

Well, even on a Prince fan website there are people who keep on wanting to hold this against Prince.

All as if Prince did not do what he actually did to support the cause and that they think he should have not been true to himself and just allowed MJ and Quincy to play their silly games.

[Edited 2/1/24 22:25pm]

IanRG said:

RODSERLING said:

IanRG said:

Well, even on a Prince fan website there are people who keep on wanting to hold this against Prince.

All as if Prince did not do what he actually did to support the cause and that they think he should have not been true to himself and just allowed MJ and Quincy to play their silly games.

[Edited 2/1/24 22:25pm]

Lol, that's insane 40 years old after. I bet MJ was relieved not seeing Prince at that fest. When I began to read about MJ as a child, it was often said that his huge popularity began to decline with We Are The World. He was accused of dragging too much the light on him ( it was unofficially marketed as his project, and clearly Lionel Richie never personified this project as much as MJ). This is also the reason why there was a lot of defiance after 9/11, when MJ wanted to launch What More Can I give. I read at the time that MJ was the only one personnality not wanted on the Global Telethon tv special event ( stars answering phone call for donations), because everybody thought it would do the WATW controversy again. When I began to read about Prince in the early 2000's, it was often said his popularity in the US began to decline because he acted as an asshole refusing the WATW project. I m sure that if Prince did WATW, there would have been tons of negativity against him too. So, how can you get of that situation for both of them? [Edited 2/2/24 6:07am] [Edited 2/2/24 6:08am]

At the end of it all, We are the World was done because of Band Aid clearly. It looked bad that these English musicians led by Bob Geldof an Irish Man who was driven to do something about Africa, I mean it had to be a kick in the ass to RB artists and other American Artists, I mean for MJ Lionel Quincey and others not to be at the forefront of this prior to Geldof this was Quincy's ego and he wanted to better "him" in that respect. Geldof has since said he is responsible for the two worst songs in history obviously citing Band Aid and USA for Africa. I do think Quincy also employed some of the same tactics in getting people on the record and I do feel Prince not being on it and also being one of the biggest music stars at the time was a shot to him. I do think that was why Prince did what he did at the Annivarsary also, though it made him look worse and kept the whole thing alive. I also think the Geldof song was way superior in quality and they had less time with it, plus Midge Ure was behind that production that kept it a yearly thing, We are the World the song is basically forgotten. It is hilarious they still talk about Prince not being there lol! I mean when LIVE AID happened I can recall many on the USA front not there.

RODSERLING said:

Lol, that's insane 40 years old after. I bet MJ was relieved not seeing Prince at that fest.

Yet there's zero evidence of that. In fact, just the opposite.

SolaceAHA said:

At the end of it all, We are the World was done because of Band Aid clearly. It looked bad that these English musicians led by Bob Geldof an Irish Man who was driven to do something about Africa....

No one was worried about "looking bad." Did y'all ever consider that they did it because it needed to be done? And that these people have clout and power and realized they could actually do something about it?

TrivialPursuit said:

TrivialPursuit said:

SolaceAHA said:

At the end of it all, We are the World was done because of Band Aid clearly. It looked bad that these English musicians led by Bob Geldof an Irish Man who was driven to do something about Africa....

No one was worried about "looking bad." Did y'all ever consider that they did it because it needed to be done? And that these people have clout and power and realized they could actually do something about it?

I think you are missing the point

"Looking bad" can be simply seen as Harry Belefonte being inspired by what Bob Geldof and Mitch Ure achieved and it would look bad if other musicians were not similarly inspired to act. After all something needed to be done before Band Aid did it and the crisis still needs to be addressed long after WATW became just an anniversary song sung at a domestic (non-charity) industry awards event.

This does not mean that either or both songs were the only way, or even the best way to address the crisis.

It does not mean that those who sang in it had clout or power. It is not about clout and power, it was about raising awareness and inspiring people, politicians, businesses etc to get involved, not an exercise in power by the organisers.

It does not mean that people like Harry Belfonte and Prince did not have a long history of political and social activism - or that people need to obsess about which nearly 40 year old charity events another person participted in or how they did participate in it.

[Edited 2/2/24 17:08pm]

RODSERLING said:

TrivialPursuit said:

Yet there's zero evidence of that. In fact, just the opposite.

What proof ?

Go watch the documentary. I can lead a horse to water but I can't make it do math.

This reminds me of a sign i once saw at a motel outside the spa area:

"WELCOME TO THE OOL" (notice there is no "P" in it, let's keep it that way)

[Edited 2/3/24 13:18pm]

TrivialPursuit said:

RODSERLING said:

TrivialPursuit said: What proof ?

Go watch the documentary. I can lead a horse to water but I can't make it do math.

Such a Bart response!

If MJ was the opposite of relieved that Prince was not there, then he had a clear and easy path to have Prince there - Take Prince up on his offer and let him play guitar.

[Edited 2/3/24 12:35pm]

IanRG said:

Such a Bart response!

If MJ was the opposite of relieved that Prince was not there, then he had a clear and easy path to have Prince there - Take Prince up on his offer and let him play guitar.

It's not, and I'm not going tete-e-tete with Bart Jr over there. He could've talked anyone out of having Prince there. MJ was just as big as Prince by January 1985. But he still arguably had a tad more influence, at least in this case. No one can tell me he couldn't have done or said anything to try and keep Prince out.

But I also believe MJ respected Prince as much as we know Prince always held MJ in high regard. It's just childish to think two 28 year old men couldn't be in the same room, with 40 other people, and sing on a song. It's easy for some to think of these people as petty children, when we know damn well they were very much adult and in control of their own faculties.

Prince was the only one who had to put on his big boy pants that night. Well, and Waylon.

TrivialPursuit said:

IanRG said:

Such a Bart response!

If MJ was the opposite of relieved that Prince was not there, then he had a clear and easy path to have Prince there - Take Prince up on his offer and let him play guitar.

It's not, and I'm not going tete-e-tete with Bart Jr over there. He could've talked anyone out of having Prince there. MJ was just as big as Prince by January 1985. But he still arguably had a tad more influence, at least in this case. No one can tell me he couldn't have done or said anything to try and keep Prince out.

But I also believe MJ respected Prince as much as we know Prince always held MJ in high regard. It's just childish to think two 28 year old men couldn't be in the same room, with 40 other people, and sing on a song. It's easy for some to think of these people as petty children, when we know damn well they were very much adult and in control of their own faculties.

Prince was the only one who had to put on his big boy pants that night. Well, and Waylon.

There is nothing more Bart than saying look it up (specifically watch it) rather than answering the question.

There were around 50 other people other than Prince and Waylon who were potential contributors that were never on the track. All we can do is speculate how much of this was due to unavailability, contractual problems, personal opinions of the organisers about those artists, or demands by those artists. Waylon is the one standout because he made his reasons for walking out well known - And his publicly racist stance was ultimately irrelevant because the Swahili section was not used - on the basis that it was not just people who spoke this language that were dying.

You don't know what MJ or Quincy said to Prince any more than we know what Prince said to them that meant Prince's contribution was through Sheila E and 4 The Tears In Your Eyes rather than singing the Huey Lewis parts or playing guitar. It is, however, beyond well documented that Prince, MJ and Quincy were not the adults in the room when it came to their petty rivalries - even if they respected each other.

It always amazes me how so many Prince.org contributors virtually only ever see Prince as solely at fault.

It's logical deduction. To say MJ was "relieved" that Prince didn't show up is just absurd. That's the long and short of it.

MusicRadar:

Vocal arranger Tom Bahler said, "but I think if anything, [Prince] was afraid of Michael. This is pure conjecture on my part. Michael was not afraid of him. Michael wasn't afraid of anybody. He loved everybody."

So even if Prince wasn't afraid of MJ, MJ sweatin' Prince just wasn't a thing.

TrivialPursuit said:

MusicRadar:

Vocal arranger Tom Bahler said, "but I think if anything, [Prince] was afraid of Michael. This is pure conjecture on my part. Michael was not afraid of him. Michael wasn't afraid of anybody. He loved everybody."

So even if Prince wasn't afraid of MJ, MJ sweatin' Prince just wasn't a thing.

See - No logical deduction, just self confessed pure conjecture from a person who worked for MJ!!

The long and the short of it is that so much of what is written comes from people like this.

And it is lapped up by the people on Prince.org who always want to find fault with Prince and never MJ or Quincy. Even to the point of ignoring the part in the article linked to above where Sheila E is quoted as saying:

"Lionel [Richie] and Quincy kept saying, ‘Why don’t you call Prince,'” she says. “Everyone took turns trying to get me to call him back and have him come down... I just thought, wow, they were all my friends. That’s cold-blooded.”

All MJ needed to do was let Prince play guitar and he would have been there, no sweat.

However, you only need to look at how MJ felt about his skills on musical instruments vs Prince's to find the sweatin'

[Edited 2/4/24 10:55am]

This doc triggered a memory of SNL parodying the Prince controversy (pun intended). The documentary doesn't mention the fact his bodyguards were in an altercation that night, which SNL seized upon in the sketch with Billy Crystal playing Prince and Mr T and Hulk Hogan. Mary Gross and Julia Louis Dreyfus played Wendy and Lisa.

I found the sketch on Dailymotion.

source

The new documentary about the making of the 1985 charity single “We Are the World,” The Greatest Night In Pop, premieres January 19 at the Sundance Film Festival before hitting Netflix on January 29. Speaking to The Hollywood Reporter, Lionel Richie, who co-wrote the song, talks about one of the doc’s revelations: Prince bailed, so Huey Lewis had to sing his parts.

“We Are the World” was recorded the night of the 1985 American Music Awards, when all the stars were in LA. Everyone from Stevie Wonder and Michael Jackson to Billy Joel and Bruce Springsteen showed up, but Prince didn’t. Lionel tells THR he still doesn’t know why, but he has some ideas.

“At that time, he wasn’t a group person. He was Prince,” explains Lionel. “The next thing is his rival, Michael [Jackson]. Do you want to stop the rivalry and join a group of people singing a song, standing next to his rival? No. I mean, from a strictly egotistical point of view, I could see it.”

crutnacker said:

This doc triggered a memory of SNL parodying the Prince controversy (pun intended). The documentary doesn't mention the fact his bodyguards were in an altercation that night, which SNL seized upon in the sketch with Billy Crystal playing Prince and Mr T and Hulk Hogan. Mary Gross and Julia Louis Dreyfus played Wendy and Lisa.

I found the sketch on Dailymotion.

HA it's pretty funny, actually. It just comes with the territory.

IanRG said:

Cgolemb said:

I'm all for keeping Prince's name out there, but if I see one more article about this pertaining to Prince's non-involvement 😡. It's funny that that is all they seem to focus on rather than the other musicians or cause.

Well, even on a Prince fan website there are people who keep on wanting to hold this against Prince.
All as if Prince did not do what he actually did to support the cause and that they think he should have not been true to himself and just allowed MJ and Quincy to play their silly games.

It has nothing to do with Prince supporting the cause on his terms.

I personally think it wasn't (really) the time and place to stay true to himself.

It was not (only) about him in 1994 (in that show).

It was also about the 'cause', a 10 year celebration.

Both celebrations happend to be at the same time in the same show.

He could've simply sang with the 10 year celebration of WATW, or, just not standing in the center of the stage if he didn't wanted to sing, in my humble opinion of course.

By the way, neither MJ or Quincy played silly games.

Prince sometimes just was an asshole, even a public one.

That's how I like to look at it.

Do I love him less? nope...

But I also agree with IanRG saying that there's too much (media) attention on Prince's non-involvement in the recording of that song.

It was as much about the other musicians and most important the cause.

Vannormal said:

IanRG said:

Well, even on a Prince fan website there are people who keep on wanting to hold this against Prince.
All as if Prince did not do what he actually did to support the cause and that they think he should have not been true to himself and just allowed MJ and Quincy to play their silly games.

It has nothing to do with Prince supporting the cause on his terms.

I personally think it wasn't (really) the time and place to stay true to himself.

It was not (only) about him in 1994 (in that show).

It was also about the 'cause', a 10 year celebration.

Both celebrations happend to be at the same time in the same show.

He could've simply sang with the 10 year celebration of WATW, or, just not standing in the center of the stage if he didn't wanted to sing, in my humble opinion of course.

By the way, neither MJ or Quincy played silly games.

Prince sometimes just was an asshole, even a public one.

That's how I like to look at it.

Do I love him less? nope...

But I also agree with IanRG saying that there's too much (media) attention on Prince's non-involvement in the recording of that song.

It was as much about the other musicians and most important the cause.

There were rumors around that time that that cause was only to launder the cocaine money in that business, maybe Prince agreed with that rumor. Probably not because he offered to play guitar on it.
And 10 years later maybe he was just laughing in himself about how much that whole ridicullous bad song did for Africa (not much I can tell you)

[Edited 2/5/24 4:03am]

JorisE73 said:

Vannormal said:

It has nothing to do with Prince supporting the cause on his terms.

I personally think it wasn't (really) the time and place to stay true to himself.

It was not (only) about him in 1994 (in that show).

It was also about the 'cause', a 10 year celebration.

Both celebrations happend to be at the same time in the same show.

He could've simply sang with the 10 year celebration of WATW, or, just not standing in the center of the stage if he didn't wanted to sing, in my humble opinion of course.

By the way, neither MJ or Quincy played silly games.

Prince sometimes just was an asshole, even a public one.

That's how I like to look at it.

Do I love him less? nope...

But I also agree with IanRG saying that there's too much (media) attention on Prince's non-involvement in the recording of that song.

It was as much about the other musicians and most important the cause.

There were rumors around that time that that cause was only to launder the cocaine money in that business, maybe Prince agreed with that rumor. Probably not because he offered to play guitar on it.
And 10 years later maybe he was just laughing in himself about how much that whole ridicullous bad song did for Africa (not much I can tell you)

[Edited 2/5/24 4:03am]

Goddamn, thàt would be the best joke of all time! LOL ))))))

I wish he played a backwards guitar part over it from beginning to end, and a few deep voiced backwards message on top of that - Prince style! To fuck up that song!

His guitarsound back then squeaked so unbelievably great.

-

I read they made 80 million, wasn't that much back then?

Vannormal said:

IanRG said:

Well, even on a Prince fan website there are people who keep on wanting to hold this against Prince.
All as if Prince did not do what he actually did to support the cause and that they think he should have not been true to himself and just allowed MJ and Quincy to play their silly games.

It has nothing to do with Prince supporting the cause on his terms.

I personally think it wasn't (really) the time and place to stay true to himself.

It was not (only) about him in 1994 (in that show).

It was also about the 'cause', a 10 year celebration.

Both celebrations happend to be at the same time in the same show.

He could've simply sang with the 10 year celebration of WATW, or, just not standing in the center of the stage if he didn't wanted to sing, in my humble opinion of course.

By the way, neither MJ or Quincy played silly games.

Prince sometimes just was an asshole, even a public one.

That's how I like to look at it.

Do I love him less? nope...

But I also agree with IanRG saying that there's too much (media) attention on Prince's non-involvement in the recording of that song.

It was as much about the other musicians and most important the cause.

Prince's non-involvment in the recording of the song was a direct result of MJ and Quincy's silly games. Without their silly games Prince would have lbeen there. Because Prince was concerned about the cause, he did not just walk away from the cause, just MJs and Quincy's games. This is demostrated by the fact that he contributed a song to the album. It is well known that Lionel Ritchie needed to work with the conflicting demands, requests and suggestions of many different artists - it was not just Prince who tried to influence how he contributed to the song and cause. Without MJs and Quincy's silly games, Prince could have been there on guitar.

The singing of the 1985 song 10 years later at a 1995 (Not 1994) domestic non-charity industry award ceremony was NOT part of the cause. It was only a rememberance of the time people in that industry came together to sing the song. Yet Quincy still could not stop his silly games.

The reason that the media cannot report abut WATW without raising how the rivalry between Prince, MJ and Quincy affected Prince's involvement is because of the silly games that MJ and Quincy constantly played - So many of the articles and docos over the decades quote people that worked for MJ when ever they report on why Prince was not in the song. It has never been Prince's or his people being assholes by constantly seeking to take the focus off those who sang or the cause.

Follow the money - Who benefits from all the quotes that kept on coming from MJ's side in media reports about the event?

IanRG said:

Prince's non-involvment in the recording of the song was a direct result of MJ and Quincy's silly games.

Just like "Bad" a while after