fortuneandserendipity said:

Is it just me or does the spirit of laura live on , like a little too close for comfort?

No, this spirit is too nice.

fortuneandserendipity said:

PeteSilas said:

what i've been saying is that that kind of fame creates an arrested developement of sorts, the things most of us learn he didn't have to, you or i have to sometimes change our issues to deal with life, he could switch his life to fit his issues. It stunted his growth, that's why you have a 57 years old with the same silly issues he had at 20. As Ali once said "a man who thinks the same way at 50 that he did at 20 has wasted 30 years of his life".

I thought it was Miles Davis who said that, but since you're the org's resident anecdote-teller Pete, I'll take your word for it.

Never take anybody's word on anything. C'mon. That's 101 stuff. BEHAVE.

ladygirl99 said:

fortuneandserendipity said:

Interesting. So it was the Wendy and Lisa acrimony with P over songwriting that led to him refusing to play with them for a while? Or was it the JW's attitude to lesbianism, tying P's hands? I can see why Laura took P's side. I can also see why Laura hated Susannah Melvoin, simply because she was one of P's girlfriends.

In 1998 Wendy said she and Lisa wrote Purple Rain in one of those indie musician magazines. Prince made a shade at them on his website and called them Lendy. The W/L vs Prince fans were battle out for weeks on here and on Google Groups and Housequake too. I sided with W/L because Prince had history of credit people in a funny way and plus women often get cheated out of credits in the music industry.

And also I think their estrangement went back farther than JW and his issues of them being lesbians. Wendy said in the interview around Girl Bros that Prince didn't send any condolences when her brother died. Wendy seemed very pissed and dark around that period because she lost her brother and her family were mad at Smashing Pumpkins as they blamed them for her brother's death-Her brother also played for that band too. Wendy's mood fit with the 90s grunge scene even as it was starting to fading off. To this day the Melvoins don't fuck with the Smashing Pumpkins.

Yeah this is the Google Group that talked about Purple Rain credit

subject:

https://groups.google.com/forum/#!topic/alt.music.prince/nYrdwMjRbYA

https://groups.google.com/forum/#!topic/alt.music.prince/RIW496D3YXk

This how the outrage started:

Wendy: Prince always wanted money and control, period. Lisa and I wrote "Purple Rain." We came to rehearsal with the melody and the idea, and then over the next two days everyone worked on it and fleshed it out. But for "Computer Blue," we just contributed a keyboard line. That's writing? You just never knew what [credit] he would give you. He just wanted absolute power in every way, and we were too much for him. That's why he fired us.

This is the best I can do since the full article is no longer on the web. I missed that user and her name is Katrina Allisan or something like that. I bet she got a copy of that article she was a diehard Wendy and Lisa fan and she had a website dedicated to them at one point.

In 1998 Prince wasn't totally into JW yet so I don't believe their beef all started with JW.

In 2004, Wendy backtracked on that Purple Rain claimed they helped in that 20th year PurpleRain anniversary video.

I am trying avoid going off the subject here. But I hope it answers your questions.

[Edited 6/16/18 14:31pm]

Prince was VERY into JW by 1998. Look at the Sinbad show again. Listen to some of the music he was making at that time.

*

Wendy has said on more than one occasion that she was mis-quoted in that original article. She also stated that Prince called her after it was published, and she explained to him that she had been misquoted. I also think, based on more detailed information that has come out since the mid 90's, that the song Purple Rain is considered to be more of a "group" effort than just a solo effort by Prince. Also, there have been many prior band members, going all the way back to Andre Cymone, who have talked about their contributions being used by Prince. I think it's very common knowledge by now that Prince wanted and needed complete control of his music, regardless of whether it was a collaborative effort.

fortuneandserendipity said:

TrevorAyer said:

Hey guess what? Did you know that people do not perform for 3-4 hours and then hop to a 2 hour aftershow that starts at 2 am ... or record on the studio non stop for days ... without being on drugs ... period ... It’s just not possible and it happened often with prince ... there is your starting point of all of this that nobody wants to believe

Makes you wonder how he could go 48-72 hours without sleep at various points in the 80s eh? After all so-called genetic super sleepers can't do anything close to that.

Except for the fact that most of his friends/associates that go back to his teenage years have stated that he rarely slept, or he slept for a few hours during the day. Jimmy Jam said, "Prince would rehearse/record with The Time, then go rehearse with The Revolution, and the next day come back with a full song recorded. He asked Prince when he wrote and recorded the song, and Prince told him after his band practice. Jimmy said, "that's great, but when do you sleep?"

*

Many of his Engineers and employees have stated he would typically go home from 10-2 if he was up all night recording or performing, and then arrive back at PP.

violetcrush said:

fortuneandserendipity said:

Makes you wonder how he could go 48-72 hours without sleep at various points in the 80s eh? After all so-called genetic super sleepers can't do anything close to that.

Except for the fact that most of his friends/associates that go back to his teenage years have stated that he rarely slept, or he slept for a few hours during the day. Jimmy Jam said, "Prince would rehearse/record with The Time, then go rehearse with The Revolution, and the next day come back with a full song recorded. He asked Prince when he wrote and recorded the song, and Prince told him after his band practice. Jimmy said, "that's great, but when do you sleep?"

*

Many of his Engineers and employees have stated he would typically go home from 10-2 if he was up all night recording or performing, and then arrive back at PP.

Also, Susannah has stated that his bedroom in the Kiowa Trail house was in the basement with no windows, because he slept at odd hours - usually during the day....

violetcrush said:

ladygirl99 said:

In 1998 Wendy said she and Lisa wrote Purple Rain in one of those indie musician magazines. Prince made a shade at them on his website and called them Lendy. The W/L vs Prince fans were battle out for weeks on here and on Google Groups and Housequake too. I sided with W/L because Prince had history of credit people in a funny way and plus women often get cheated out of credits in the music industry.

And also I think their estrangement went back farther than JW and his issues of them being lesbians. Wendy said in the interview around Girl Bros that Prince didn't send any condolences when her brother died. Wendy seemed very pissed and dark around that period because she lost her brother and her family were mad at Smashing Pumpkins as they blamed them for her brother's death-Her brother also played for that band too. Wendy's mood fit with the 90s grunge scene even as it was starting to fading off. To this day the Melvoins don't fuck with the Smashing Pumpkins.

Yeah this is the Google Group that talked about Purple Rain credit

subject:

https://groups.google.com/forum/#!topic/alt.music.prince/nYrdwMjRbYA

https://groups.google.com/forum/#!topic/alt.music.prince/RIW496D3YXk

This how the outrage started:

Wendy: Prince always wanted money and control, period. Lisa and I wrote "Purple Rain." We came to rehearsal with the melody and the idea, and then over the next two days everyone worked on it and fleshed it out. But for "Computer Blue," we just contributed a keyboard line. That's writing? You just never knew what [credit] he would give you. He just wanted absolute power in every way, and we were too much for him. That's why he fired us.

This is the best I can do since the full article is no longer on the web. I missed that user and her name is Katrina Allisan or something like that. I bet she got a copy of that article she was a diehard Wendy and Lisa fan and she had a website dedicated to them at one point.

In 1998 Prince wasn't totally into JW yet so I don't believe their beef all started with JW.

In 2004, Wendy backtracked on that Purple Rain claimed they helped in that 20th year PurpleRain anniversary video.

I am trying avoid going off the subject here. But I hope it answers your questions.

[Edited 6/16/18 14:31pm]

Prince was VERY into JW by 1998. Look at the Sinbad show again. Listen to some of the music he was making at that time.

*

Wendy has said on more than one occasion that she was mis-quoted in that original article. She also stated that Prince called her after it was published, and she explained to him that she had been misquoted. I also think, based on more detailed information that has come out since the mid 90's, that the song Purple Rain is considered to be more of a "group" effort than just a solo effort by Prince. Also, there have been many prior band members, going all the way back to Andre Cymone, who have talked about their contributions being used by Prince. I think it's very common knowledge by now that Prince wanted and needed complete control of his music, regardless of whether it was a collaborative effort.

Regarding Jonathon Melvoin's death - Prince wrote The Love We Make for/about him. Obviously, Wendy would have been grieving during that time, and yes, they had animosity toward the other band members, because they knew what was going on. They knew the drummer had a major drug problem. They wanted to keep touring.

LilaLiebe said:

violetcrush said:

Right - there are various reasons people turn to religion. I just think, based on the timing of Prince's push toward the JW group, it was tied to the immense grief over losing his child.

I agree.

Same. I brought it up before. I think the loss of his parents within such a short time span contributed as well

Krystalkisses said:

PeteSilas said:

ya i heard that. Sometimes i wonder how that guy would have dealt with how us everyday joes are treated.

Interesting. But was he always like that? Like as a teenager was he that hypersensitive about people just talking about you? You can't control everything??? I wonder if fame made him like that or if he was always that way.

Defense mechanism. I think he was always like that (controlling, independent, skeptical, distrusting, isolated).

And, man, for as much distaste as Pete Silas has for drug users...that's how I feel about dogmatic, aggressive religous types. I find them insufferable, arrogant and actually rude in thier way. I've been friends with plenty of drug users and, sure, somtimes it got out of hand and they needed cutting off, but not usually. My Grandmother was a JW and one of her friends lives on my street. I've asked this woman REPEATEDLY and very politely not to witness to me or ESPECIALLY to my child. I've explained I am an atheist and that my son's spiritual education is my business.

She does it anyway and wonders why I don't keep in contact. These people always believing they are right and have all the answers really grinds my gears. It bugged me during The Rainbow Children period as a mater of fact, but not enough to turn me off to the music. I am supposed to respect thier beliefs but they do not respect mine. I'll raise my son myself, thank you very much, and think for myself if you don't mind.

I still can't understand how people watch TV and buy "holy miracle tap water" or pack stadiums to watch Benny Hinn "heal" people and shit. It's astonishing to me. Fucking Jim Bakker is on the comeback trail now selling Armageddon Pancake mix. CONVICTED FELON, Jim Bakker. Swaggart does his dance too. People believe this shit.

TrevorAyer said:

Nobody? I absolutely believe he used cocaine and other drugs for his marathon shows and recording sessions.

TrevorAyer said:

Hey guess what? Did you know that people do not perform for 3-4 hours and then hop to a 2 hour aftershow that starts at 2 am ... or record on the studio non stop for days ... without being on drugs ... period ... It’s just not possible and it happened often with prince ... there is your starting point of all of this that nobody wants to believe

This is complete bullshit. As much BS as the people who say that Prince couldn't have been using drugs and pulled it off.

Krystalkisses said:

TrevorAyer said:

Hey guess what? Did you know that people do not perform for 3-4 hours and then hop to a 2 hour aftershow that starts at 2 am ... or record on the studio non stop for days ... without being on drugs ... period ... It’s just not possible and it happened often with prince ... there is your starting point of all of this that nobody wants to believe

Nobody? I absolutely believe he used cocaine and other drugs for his marathon shows and recording sessions.

Nah...the crashes and come downs from that shit are too harsh. There's never a NET GAIN with using coke or speed...meth...just a sort of "postponing sleep" thing.

It only buys you time in the short term and Prince was WAY to prolific for WAY too long be relying on that. I speak from experience, BTW. You can bump your way through some overnight cramming sessions during finals week or meth your way though a triple shift at the IHOP, but the bill always comes due and you'll be out on your ass when the crash happens.

It also would have taken a visible toll on his appearance and, until the last year or so of his life, most people commented on how young and unweatherd Prince always looked. I suppose there may have been something going on around the Symbol Album because dude looked gaunt, pale and...off...but that didn't last long.

Why do we assume it was mindgames? maybe they left before he got a chance to call them up. Maybe he didn't think they would want to be there without time to prepare?. Maybe he would have called up each individual but didn't want a nostalgia moment that overshadowed the other bands? Maybe there was a miscommunication between Prince and his handlers where the Revolution were concerned. Who the hell knows? NOt every weird behavior of prince's should be attributed to mind games. We don't know what was in his head--who knows how things went down behind the scenes. Wendy only knows how the night made her feel and that PRince could be confusing man.

violetcrush said:

Krystalkisses said:

violetcrush said: Wow. I never thought of it that way before. He probably did feel like the sisters ' love and closeness did disrupt how he wanted things to go. I think Big Tall Wall said it all. I did see Wendy play with him during 07/07/07. It was awesome!

Oh wow, you were at that show?? That is great! How did the vibe seem to you? Wondering if Lisa and Susannah went to see her play too. I think that may have been the last time they played together. Wendy has told the story of when The Revolution were invited to a smaller club in LA in 2004, and initially they were told that only Bobby didn't have to buy a ticket for the show. When they got there they were all able to get in without paying, but they had to stand in the back. Prince was calling all of his past associates/band members and other musicians on stage to play with him, but not The Revolution. Wendy said they said goodbye to Manuela and walked out. Then Wendy got a call a few minutes later from his guitar tech to invite her to his house because he wanted her to perform with him on Tavis Smiley. Go figure!! Such mind games with him

[Edited 6/16/18 17:24pm]

Or maybe he was just buying into the JW rhetoric back in the day or thought he had to be overly zealous--like Questlove talked about (the 7 year period of overzealousness that many new converts go through) and maybe he was just indecisive as fuck when it came to doing reunion tours etc??

PeteSilas said:

Prince supposedly loved fucking with Wendy and Lisa with their hopes of working with him again, apparently he told them he would work with them if they renounced their sexuality, and strung them along at a few points, people don't change in many ways and he was actually a punk sometimes even in the later years. But as far as i know, i never heard the claim they wrote purple rain, they are shown in the 20 year anniversy dvd saying they didn't write it but they added some of the chords that made it better.

fortuneandserendipity said:

Interesting. So it was the Wendy and Lisa acrimony with P over songwriting that led to him refusing to play with them for a while? Or was it the JW's attitude to lesbianism, tying P's hands? I can see why Laura took P's side. I can also see why Laura hated Susannah Melvoin, simply because she was one of P's girlfriends.

herb4 said:

Krystalkisses said:

TrevorAyer said: Nobody? I absolutely believe he used cocaine and other drugs for his marathon shows and recording sessions.

Nah...the crashes and come downs from that shit are too harsh. There's never a NET GAIN with using coke or speed...meth...just a sort of "postponing sleep" thing.

It only buys you time in the short term and Prince was WAY to prolific for WAY too long be relying on that. I speak from experience, BTW. You can bump your way through some overnight cramming sessions during finals week or meth your way though a triple shift at the IHOP, but the bill always comes due and you'll be out on your ass when the crash happens.

It also would have taken a visible toll on his appearance and, until the last year or so of his life, most people commented on how young and unweatherd Prince always looked

violetcrush said:

Yes Violetcrush. It was one of the most fun days of my life! I will never forget it. Waiting for the First Ave tickets during the day for 8 hours in the humid , sweltering heat was hard but oh so worth it!!! The First Ave show was probably the best concert I've ever been to in my life.!! Oh and when My friend and I were walking to find the end of the line to wait for tickets Pepe Willie walks by me stops and says "Sheila E!" And we laughed about that. He was such a friendly guy! Downtown just had this incredible energy that day. You could just feel the excitement in the air knowing Prince was going to take the stage. Nothing like a Prince concert!!!

As for Wendy and Prince onstage and the vibe that night I didn't particularly remember them interacting together that much but ofcourse the crowd loved her there especially onstage with him again at First Ave. I didn't notice any tension between them.

And yes thanks for the story about the Musicology concert. I've heard a few people say he was a pretty unstable man and quiet exhausting to deal with sometimes. Mind games...but he could also be wonderful too.
[Edited 6/16/18 17:19pm]

violetcrush said:

ladygirl99 said:

In 1998 Wendy said she and Lisa wrote Purple Rain in one of those indie musician magazines. Prince made a shade at them on his website and called them Lendy. The W/L vs Prince fans were battle out for weeks on here and on Google Groups and Housequake too. I sided with W/L because Prince had history of credit people in a funny way and plus women often get cheated out of credits in the music industry.

And also I think their estrangement went back farther than JW and his issues of them being lesbians. Wendy said in the interview around Girl Bros that Prince didn't send any condolences when her brother died. Wendy seemed very pissed and dark around that period because she lost her brother and her family were mad at Smashing Pumpkins as they blamed them for her brother's death-Her brother also played for that band too. Wendy's mood fit with the 90s grunge scene even as it was starting to fading off. To this day the Melvoins don't fuck with the Smashing Pumpkins.

Yeah this is the Google Group that talked about Purple Rain credit

subject:

https://groups.google.com/forum/#!topic/alt.music.prince/nYrdwMjRbYA

https://groups.google.com/forum/#!topic/alt.music.prince/RIW496D3YXk

This how the outrage started:

Wendy: Prince always wanted money and control, period. Lisa and I wrote "Purple Rain." We came to rehearsal with the melody and the idea, and then over the next two days everyone worked on it and fleshed it out. But for "Computer Blue," we just contributed a keyboard line. That's writing? You just never knew what [credit] he would give you. He just wanted absolute power in every way, and we were too much for him. That's why he fired us.

This is the best I can do since the full article is no longer on the web. I missed that user and her name is Katrina Allisan or something like that. I bet she got a copy of that article she was a diehard Wendy and Lisa fan and she had a website dedicated to them at one point.

In 1998 Prince wasn't totally into JW yet so I don't believe their beef all started with JW.

In 2004, Wendy backtracked on that Purple Rain claimed they helped in that 20th year PurpleRain anniversary video.

I am trying avoid going off the subject here. But I hope it answers your questions.

[Edited 6/16/18 14:31pm]

Prince was VERY into JW by 1998. Look at the Sinbad show again. Listen to some of the music he was making at that time.

*

Wendy has said on more than one occasion that she was mis-quoted in that original article. She also stated that Prince called her after it was published, and she explained to him that she had been misquoted. I also think, based on more detailed information that has come out since the mid 90's, that the song Purple Rain is considered to be more of a "group" effort than just a solo effort by Prince. Also, there have been many prior band members, going all the way back to Andre Cymone, who have talked about their contributions being used by Prince. I think it's very common knowledge by now that Prince wanted and needed complete control of his music, regardless of whether it was a collaborative effort.

People who worked for Prince stated he was discussing of being JW and its teachings with Larry Graham and George Benson and even Mark Brown (Brownmark) who also remains JW but he remained indecisive in the late 90s. So I am going to stick by official reports he was converted in 2001 and was willing to take JW more seriously and he even announced this.

And also I guess I am going to take your word about Wendy being misquoting as there are a lot of articles about some of those Girl Bros interviews no longer exist on the web. So far I never came across an interview where she backtracked that original article.

You ever notice that wendy and lisa's interactions with Prince on stage were often pretty subtle. He interacted more with Sheila, his later band mates like Shelby J, Mayte, Jerome, and even Cat. I don't doubt they had a bond but it wasn't exactly super noticable on stage. It was probably more apparent in rehearsals or recording sessions. Maybe, I haven't seen enough of these ladies but both always seemed kind of mysterious on stage and not all that demonstrativ when with Prince. "America" and Kiss video are most charismatic I have seen Wendy. "Head" and the 1999 video are the most charismatic I have seen Lisa. i haven't seen the revolution reunion tours. I imagine they are a bit more demonstrative due to their ages and years of experience.

As for the musicology tour story that violetcrush described, what are you talking about? Do you mean the first avenue performance between she and P.

Krystalkisses said:

violetcrush said:

Oh wow, you were at that show?? That is great! How did the vibe seem to you? Wondering if Lisa and Susannah went to see her play too. I think that may have been the last time they played together. Wendy has told the story of when The Revolution were invited to a smaller club in LA in 2004, and initially they were told that only Bobby didn't have to buy a ticket for the show. When they got there they were all able to get in without paying, but they had to stand in the back. Prince was calling all of his past associates/band members and other musicians on stage to play with him, but not The Revolution. Wendy said they said goodbye to Manuela and walked out. Then Wendy got a call a few minutes later from his guitar tech to invite her to his house because he wanted her to perform with him on Tavis Smiley. Go figure!! Such mind games with him

Yes Violetcrush. It was one of the most fun days of my life! I will never forget it. Waiting for the First Ave tickets during the day for 8 hours in the humid , sweltering heat was hard but oh so worth it!!! The First Ave show was probably the best concert I've ever been to in my life.!! Oh and when My friend and I were walking to find the end of the line to wait for tickets Pepe Willie walks by me stops and says "Sheila E!" And we laughed about that. He was such a friendly guy! Downtown just had this incredible energy that day. You could just feel the excitement in the air knowing Prince was going to take the stage. Nothing like a Prince concert!!! As for Wendy and Prince onstage and the vibe that night I didn't particularly remember them interacting together that much but ofcourse the crowd loved her there especially onstage with him again at First Ave. I didn't notice any tension between them. And yes thanks for the story about the Musicology concert. I've heard a few people say he was a pretty unstable man and quiet exhausting to deal with sometimes. Mind games...but he could also be wonderful too. [Edited 6/16/18 17:19pm]

[Edited 6/16/18 17:34pm]

[Edited 6/16/18 17:37pm]

purplerabbithole said:

Whoops I didn't mean Musicology show I meant 2004 show violetcrush mentioned. I think I just mentally associated 2004 with Musicology

purplerabbithole said:

Or maybe he was just buying into the JW rhetoric back in the day or thought he had to be overly zealous--like Questlove talked about (the 7 year period of overzealousness that many new converts go through) and maybe he was just indecisive as fuck when it came to doing reunion tours etc??

PeteSilas said:

Prince supposedly loved fucking with Wendy and Lisa with their hopes of working with him again, apparently he told them he would work with them if they renounced their sexuality, and strung them along at a few points, people don't change in many ways and he was actually a punk sometimes even in the later years. But as far as i know, i never heard the claim they wrote purple rain, they are shown in the 20 year anniversy dvd saying they didn't write it but they added some of the chords that made it better.

the new convert thing is true, You take muhammad ali in the 60's when he first became a muslim, he had to pretend to hate white people, which he never really did, he had to beat on opponents who wouldn't respect his name change, he had to ruin his career by not joining the military, all for a group of jackasses really who ostracized him during his exile when he couldn't give them money and prestige and came right back to him as soon as he could fight again. Human beings are group animals, that need in us causes something that can be exploited by the vile amongst us.

pricetag said:

fortuneandserendipity said:

I thought it was Miles Davis who said that, but since you're the org's resident anecdote-teller Pete, I'll take your word for it.

Never take anybody's word on anything. C'mon. That's 101 stuff. BEHAVE.

here is the actual quote

“The man who views the world at 50 the same as he did at 20 has wasted 30 years of his life.”

ali said it, maybe Davis said something similar, i wouldn't be surprised, it's true.

Bodhitheblackdog said:

TrevorAyer said:

Hey guess what? Did you know that people do not perform for 3-4 hours and then hop to a 2 hour aftershow that starts at 2 am ... or record on the studio non stop for days ... without being on drugs ... period ... It’s just not possible and it happened often with prince ... there is your starting point of all of this that nobody wants to believe

I believe it. Co-Sign!!! ...it started with coke...

Right on people! Total agreement. Why did he need to inflate himself so?

religion is a drug too, as marx said "the opiate of the masses", it's just another drug. telling them not to talk about it isn't going to do any good, they won't listen. One good thing about Judaism is that they are taught not to proselytize, the christians and muslims are encouraged to recruit new fish and it's a real pain in the ass. I believe that if you're really a good, spiritual person, you don't have to tell anyone, they can see it for themselves, i also believe when you have to make a big show of how righteous you are, there is usually something you are hiding or covering up. Your example should be the only thing that people might want to allow to steer them along your way. This society of ours though is fucked, it's all built on manipulation and exploitation and that's not something done without some kind of force.

herb4 said:

Krystalkisses said:

PeteSilas said: Interesting. But was he always like that? Like as a teenager was he that hypersensitive about people just talking about you? You can't control everything??? I wonder if fame made him like that or if he was always that way.

Defense mechanism. I think he was always like that (controlling, independent, skeptical, distrusting, isolated).

And, man, for as much distaste as Pete Silas has for drug users...that's how I feel about dogmatic, aggressive religous types. I find them insufferable, arrogant and actually rude in thier way. I've been friends with plenty of drug users and, sure, somtimes it got out of hand and they needed cutting off, but not usually. My Grandmother was a JW and one of her friends lives on my street. I've asked this woman REPEATEDLY and very politely not to witness to me or ESPECIALLY to my child. I've explained I am an atheist and that my son's spiritual education is my business.

She does it anyway and wonders why I don't keep in contact. These people always believing they are right and have all the answers really grinds my gears. It bugged me during The Rainbow Children period as a mater of fact, but not enough to turn me off to the music. I am supposed to respect thier beliefs but they do not respect mine. I'll raise my son myself, thank you very much, and think for myself if you don't mind.

I still can't understand how people watch TV and buy "holy miracle tap water" or pack stadiums to watch Benny Hinn "heal" people and shit. It's astonishing to me. Fucking Jim Bakker is on the comeback trail now selling Armageddon Pancake mix. CONVICTED FELON, Jim Bakker. Swaggart does his dance too. People believe this shit.

peggyon said:

Bodhitheblackdog said:

I believe it. Co-Sign!!! ...it started with coke...

Right on people! Total agreement. Why did he need to inflate himself so?

naw, i think he could have worked like he said he did without the drugs, some people can, donald trump is known for only sleeping 4 hours, malcolm x was known to sleep a maximum of 4 hours and "many times didn't get that" according to his brother. Is it a genetic thing? or is it a inspiration thing? I don't know but I tend to believe susan rogers and the leeds brothers who said he was clean in the 80's, his most productive years. I've also said since the beginning, that if he was that into drugs all along, he wouldn't have lasted as long as he did.

peggyon said:

Bodhitheblackdog said:

I believe it. Co-Sign!!! ...it started with coke...

Right on people! Total agreement. Why did he need to inflate himself so?

Also, pretty uncool to take speed/coke etc. and expect your band to play straight at the risk of being fired.

purplerabbithole said:

Why do we assume it was mindgames? maybe they left before he got a chance to call them up. Maybe he didn't think they would want to be there without time to prepare?. Maybe he would have called up each individual but didn't want a nostalgia moment that overshadowed the other bands? Maybe there was a miscommunication between Prince and his handlers where the Revolution were concerned. Who the hell knows? NOt every weird behavior of prince's should be attributed to mind games. We don't know what was in his head--who knows how things went down behind the scenes. Wendy only knows how the night made her feel and that PRince could be confusing man.

violetcrush said:

Oh wow, you were at that show?? That is great! How did the vibe seem to you? Wondering if Lisa and Susannah went to see her play too. I think that may have been the last time they played together. Wendy has told the story of when The Revolution were invited to a smaller club in LA in 2004, and initially they were told that only Bobby didn't have to buy a ticket for the show. When they got there they were all able to get in without paying, but they had to stand in the back. Prince was calling all of his past associates/band members and other musicians on stage to play with him, but not The Revolution. Wendy said they said goodbye to Manuela and walked out. Then Wendy got a call a few minutes later from his guitar tech to invite her to his house because he wanted her to perform with him on Tavis Smiley. Go figure!! Such mind games with him

[Edited 6/16/18 17:24pm]

Purple - come on, really?

*

1. Advising they can come to the show, but only Bobby Z can attend for free

2. Having them escorted to a back room

3. Not acknnowledging their presence at throughout most of the show

4. Having his tech call them not long after they left the show

*

Prince did this type of thing all the time. Wendy and Lisa are not unreasonable people. Clearly, they would know when they were being ignored.

herb4 said:

Krystalkisses said:

TrevorAyer said: Nobody? I absolutely believe he used cocaine and other drugs for his marathon shows and recording sessions.

Nah...the crashes and come downs from that shit are too harsh. There's never a NET GAIN with using coke or speed...meth...just a sort of "postponing sleep" thing.

It only buys you time in the short term and Prince was WAY to prolific for WAY too long be relying on that. I speak from experience, BTW. You can bump your way through some overnight cramming sessions during finals week or meth your way though a triple shift at the IHOP, but the bill always comes due and you'll be out on your ass when the crash happens.

It also would have taken a visible toll on his appearance and, until the last year or so of his life, most people commented on how young and unweatherd Prince always looked. I suppose there may have been something going on around the Symbol Album because dude looked gaunt, pale and...off...but that didn't last long.

when i was in my 20's, i met an older musician to whom i complained that I couldn't get enough done because sleep got in the way. this guy really keyed in on how I felt, he schooled me in less than five minutes, he mentioned the axiom "music is a jealous mistress" and he told me that he felt that way, so he used drugs to stay up for days working on music but said there was a price to pay for that with the crashes. He also asked if i felt guilty if I weren't practicing, I said i did, he said he felt that way.

I used to try the Prince thing, I could do it but I was always tired, cranky alot, on edge. It can be done but it didn't make me very nice when i did it, and even today, i just hate being around people when i'm working hard because no one understands how much it takes out of you and they get their feelings hurt when you ignore, tell them to go away or whatever.

Krystalkisses said:

violetcrush said:

Oh wow, you were at that show?? That is great! How did the vibe seem to you? Wondering if Lisa and Susannah went to see her play too. I think that may have been the last time they played together. Wendy has told the story of when The Revolution were invited to a smaller club in LA in 2004, and initially they were told that only Bobby didn't have to buy a ticket for the show. When they got there they were all able to get in without paying, but they had to stand in the back. Prince was calling all of his past associates/band members and other musicians on stage to play with him, but not The Revolution. Wendy said they said goodbye to Manuela and walked out. Then Wendy got a call a few minutes later from his guitar tech to invite her to his house because he wanted her to perform with him on Tavis Smiley. Go figure!! Such mind games with him

Yes Violetcrush. It was one of the most fun days of my life! I will never forget it. Waiting for the First Ave tickets during the day for 8 hours in the humid , sweltering heat was hard but oh so worth it!!! The First Ave show was probably the best concert I've ever been to in my life.!! Oh and when My friend and I were walking to find the end of the line to wait for tickets Pepe Willie walks by me stops and says "Sheila E!" And we laughed about that. He was such a friendly guy! Downtown just had this incredible energy that day. You could just feel the excitement in the air knowing Prince was going to take the stage. Nothing like a Prince concert!!! As for Wendy and Prince onstage and the vibe that night I didn't particularly remember them interacting together that much but ofcourse the crowd loved her there especially onstage with him again at First Ave. I didn't notice any tension between them. And yes thanks for the story about the Musicology concert. I've heard a few people say he was a pretty unstable man and quiet exhausting to deal with sometimes. Mind games...but he could also be wonderful too. [Edited 6/16/18 17:19pm]

Fantastic! What a great experience. Pepe Willie - too funny! I enjoyed his interviews in a documentary from the 90's. Seems like a funny guy, and another one who really helped Prince in the early days. You know, I really think that, in addition to personal/emotional issues with The Revolution, Prince may have felt that it would have been impossible to recapture the magic of that Purple Rain tour. It was such a specific moment in time - as Dez D has said - it was the perfect storm. I think in some ways he just wanted to leave it alone. However, it is sad for those fans who were there, and remember that chemistry.

PeteSilas said:

peggyon said:

Right on people! Total agreement. Why did he need to inflate himself so?

naw, i think he could have worked like he said he did without the drugs, some people can, donald trump is known for only sleeping 4 hours, malcolm x was known to sleep a maximum of 4 hours and "many times didn't get that" according to his brother. Is it a genetic thing? or is it a inspiration thing? I don't know but I tend to believe susan rogers and the leeds brothers who said he was clean in the 80's, his most productive years. I've also said since the beginning, that if he was that into drugs all along, he wouldn't have lasted as long as he did.

But didn't he do drugs with Vanity? (not to the extent she did). I don't sense Susan Rogers knew about drugs as she seemed really

nerdy to me, not certain if she knew what drugs were and their manifestation. The Leeds bros??? I think Prince was around drugs alot more than we think.

ladygirl99 said:

violetcrush said:

Prince was VERY into JW by 1998. Look at the Sinbad show again. Listen to some of the music he was making at that time.

*

Wendy has said on more than one occasion that she was mis-quoted in that original article. She also stated that Prince called her after it was published, and she explained to him that she had been misquoted. I also think, based on more detailed information that has come out since the mid 90's, that the song Purple Rain is considered to be more of a "group" effort than just a solo effort by Prince. Also, there have been many prior band members, going all the way back to Andre Cymone, who have talked about their contributions being used by Prince. I think it's very common knowledge by now that Prince wanted and needed complete control of his music, regardless of whether it was a collaborative effort.

People who worked for Prince stated he was discussing of being JW and its teachings with Larry Graham and George Benson and even Mark Brown (Brownmark) who also remains JW but he remained indecisive in the late 90s. So I am going to stick by official reports he was converted in 2001 and was willing to take JW more seriously and he even announced this.

And also I guess I am going to take your word about Wendy being misquoting as there are a lot of articles about some of those Girl Bros interviews no longer exist on the web. So far I never came across an interview where she backtracked that original article.

Prince was baptized in 2000 or 2001; however, he was "studying" (as he used to say), and began publicly speaking about the JW faith and his beliefs as early as 1997-1998. I believe the issue with Wendy and Lisa being gay came in the early 2000's when there was talk of a 20 yr reunion. I believe I read that Bobby Z went to PP to speak with Prince, and he was told to pass that message to Wendy and Lisa. Wendy stated when she heard that she knew it was bad and she had to kind of "mourn" him, because there would be nothing to say at that point. Of course, we know that didn't last long, because Prince asked her to play with him on Tavis Smiley. So again, Prince was all over the place with his feelings, and brought people in and out of his life depending on his mindset.

peggyon said:

PeteSilas said:

naw, i think he could have worked like he said he did without the drugs, some people can, donald trump is known for only sleeping 4 hours, malcolm x was known to sleep a maximum of 4 hours and "many times didn't get that" according to his brother. Is it a genetic thing? or is it a inspiration thing? I don't know but I tend to believe susan rogers and the leeds brothers who said he was clean in the 80's, his most productive years. I've also said since the beginning, that if he was that into drugs all along, he wouldn't have lasted as long as he did.

But didn't he do drugs with Vanity? (not to the extent she did). I don't sense Susan Rogers knew about drugs as she seemed really

nerdy to me, not certain if she knew what drugs were and their manifestation. The Leeds bros??? I think Prince was around drugs alot more than we think.

did vanity say that? there were rumors, there are still rumors, one said he od'd on coke during the 1999 era, some people here remember the day at school and kids wearing prince shirts to memorialize him, i never heard nothing about that at the time is all i can say. Susan rogers may have been around that guy more than anyone in those years so I think she'd know a little something even if it was just looking back at it, she had to do all the staying up with him you know. Susan also clearly knew when Prince was on something during the infamous lovesexy period when he called her to paisley after she left and asked her to come back. She wasn't no dummy, i think she said she's some sort of doctor now. Too many people have said he was clean in those years and the dr. d story is simply not a reliable one from a reliable source(tabloid, no name).