NouveauDance said:

Mutiny91 said:

There we have it! been waiting for someone to mentione that perticular moment. It wasn't good at all

Prince performed on stage with James Brown and MJ??? When was that?!?!?!

You must be kidding.

Mya said:

Letting go Wendy & Lisa

Releasing If I Was Your Girlfriend as the 2nd single from SOTTs and not touring SOTTs in the states.

Early 90s fake hip hop...it dimmed otherwise decent output from that time.

The name change (EVERYone thought he went completely bat-poop crazy, including this guy right here)

As much as its helped him spiritually, becoming a JW has put limits on his creativity imo.

Mya said:

Letting go Wendy & Lisa

Yeah, because SOTT and Lovesexy were just awful.

udo said:

Hmmm.

Right after the first song of his Cologne, Germany performance.

Hahahaa....you and orger Oezlem Ucucu and myself are STILL bitching about that concert.

I was sooo bad that it was almost good, wasn´t it? In hindsight, it was a historic moment.

OK, I know this isn't a true 'low point', but I do think it

is a significant missed opportunity....but....

His treatment of the Internet as a form of advertisement and sales.

His website(s) have been members (pay sites), which is a turnoff for anyone but fans.

His treatment of youtube has hurt him more than it helped him.

And his harassment of the org (and actions leading to the shut down of dozens

of fanssites) also diminished his Internet presence.

I work part-time as a quiz master at a local Irish pub here in Bangkok (Asia),

that is frequented by both Thais and a mix of European and Americans (80%).

Part of my quiz is to play 10 snippets of songs to and the listeners have to

guess who the singer/performer is.

I played Raspberry Berret, and I swear to God, only 20% of the contestants

recognized the song, and of those, only half knew it was Prince or who he was.

And this is with a mostly western audience!

There's validity to every response so far... I wonder how many of these low points were unintentional, which were bad strategy and which were half-baked ideas?

For instance:

The JW Infuence: Unintentional

Holding back The Gold Experience: Bad Strategy

Crystal Ball Website: Half Baked Idea

Skipping the Midwest on his W2A Tour.

imago said:

OK, I know this isn't a true 'low point', but I do think it

is a significant missed opportunity....but....

His treatment of the Internet as a form of advertisement and sales.

His website(s) have been members (pay sites), which is a turnoff for anyone but fans.

His treatment of youtube has hurt him more than it helped him.

And his harassment of the org (and actions leading to the shut down of dozens

of fanssites) also diminished his Internet presence.

I work part-time as a quiz master at a local Irish pub here in Bangkok (Asia),

that is frequented by both Thais and a mix of European and Americans (80%).

Part of my quiz is to play 10 snippets of songs to and the listeners have to

guess who the singer/performer is.

I played Raspberry Berret, and I swear to God, only 20% of the contestants

recognized the song, and of those, only half knew it was Prince or who he was.

And this is with a mostly western audience!

It´s sad and unbelievable but....more and more people have no idea that Prince is still around, have no idea of how great he used to be, or, if they´re younger, have never heard of him. But most folks do know Mick Jagger, Elton John, Freddie Mercury, Hendrix, etc. etc.

In my opinion, Prince is just as relevant or iconic as those I mentioned were or still are. But I totally agree with you regarding the internet presence and the other things you´ve mentioned.

Those online videos never hurt his business,and true fans would always prefer a legit, pristine sound quality release over a bootleg or Youtube video anyway.

And he released a bunch of stuff that is very cryptic and difficult to get into to still be considered good pop music. The raw elements and the talent are still there but some of the lyrics just ruin otherwise good song ideas.( which reminds me of the Planet Earth thread you made)

rdhull said:

Mya said:

Letting go Wendy & Lisa

Yeah, because SOTT and Lovesexy were just awful.

OldFriends4Sale said:

rdhull said:

Yeah, because SOTT and Lovesexy were just awful.

Even Prince realized it was a mistake And SOTT (hidden as a Prince album) at the time we didn't know most of this music was recorded with and during the Revolution era soo.....

WRONG

KoolEaze said:

imago said:

OK, I know this isn't a true 'low point', but I do think it

is a significant missed opportunity....but....

His treatment of the Internet as a form of advertisement and sales.

His website(s) have been members (pay sites), which is a turnoff for anyone but fans.

His treatment of youtube has hurt him more than it helped him.

And his harassment of the org (and actions leading to the shut down of dozens

of fanssites) also diminished his Internet presence.

I work part-time as a quiz master at a local Irish pub here in Bangkok (Asia),

that is frequented by both Thais and a mix of European and Americans (80%).

Part of my quiz is to play 10 snippets of songs to and the listeners have to

guess who the singer/performer is.

I played Raspberry Berret, and I swear to God, only 20% of the contestants

recognized the song, and of those, only half knew it was Prince or who he was.

And this is with a mostly western audience!

It´s sad and unbelievable but....more and more people have no idea that Prince is still around, have no idea of how great he used to be, or, if they´re younger, have never heard of him. But most folks do know Mick Jagger, Elton John, Freddie Mercury, Hendrix, etc. etc.

In my opinion, Prince is just as relevant or iconic as those I mentioned were or still are. But I totally agree with you regarding the internet presence and the other things you´ve mentioned.

Those online videos never hurt his business,and true fans would always prefer a legit, pristine sound quality release over a bootleg or Youtube video anyway.

And he released a bunch of stuff that is very cryptic and difficult to get into to still be considered good pop music. The raw elements and the talent are still there but some of the lyrics just ruin otherwise good song ideas.( which reminds me of the Planet Earth thread you made)

True.

And he always does something to fuck things up after a success.

I remember when he scored big time with Musicology and 3121, and I was thinking, "what's he going to do to fuck things up now?"

Then came the Prince Fans United ordeals, the suing mothers on youtube ordeal, and the strange homophobic type remarks (he refutes, but without a tape recording, he was asking for it).

It just seems whenever he's on top, he finds some P&R disaster to dampen things.

rdhull said:

OldFriends4Sale said:

Even Prince realized it was a mistake And SOTT (hidden as a Prince album) at the time we didn't know most of this music was recorded with and during the Revolution era soo.....

WRONG

do your research boo boo

OldFriends4Sale said:

rdhull said:

WRONG

do your research boo boo

I have doo doo.

SOTT material was wriotten by him first before they got their mits on them. Eaves Dropping In Intimate Moments etc ..

NouveauDance said:

Mutiny91 said:

There we have it! been waiting for someone to mentione that perticular moment. It wasn't good at all

Prince performed on stage with James Brown and MJ??? When was that?!?!?!

He didn't perform on stage with James Brown & Michael, that's a bit of a exaggeration

At a James Brown's concert at the Beverley Theatre in '83 Michael was called on stage, sung 'I love you' repeatedly for a bit & suggested to James to call Prince up ~ I'm sure James had no idea who he was Once Prince got on stage via catching a ride on Big Chicks back, Michael was nowhere to be found

OldFriends4Sale said:

Mya said:

By not giving Vanity the pay-rise she asked for & for not putting up with her bullshit untill AFTER Purple Rain had been filmed & the second Vanity 6 album had been released

Seriously though, I know she wanted an independent career but damn, he could of found a way to make her stay if he really wanted to

She was putting up with his bullshit mostly

She would have stayed with Prince but Prince played sexual mind games

And did the same with Morris but not not the (sexual aspect) but control mind games yes

Well yes, as they say ~ it takes two to tango I mean, we can't forget his disdain for her drug habit either.

FunkiestOne said:

his performance onstage with James Brown and MJ

[Edited 4/17/12 0:27am]

I keep hearing about this. I think it's a myth.

Poplife88 said:

As much as its helped him spiritually, becoming a JW has put limits on his creativity imo.

mzsadii said:

Skipping the Midwest on his W2A Tour.

YEAH!

Mya said:

OldFriends4Sale said:

She was putting up with his bullshit mostly

She would have stayed with Prince but Prince played sexual mind games

And did the same with Morris but not not the (sexual aspect) but control mind games yes

Well yes, as they say ~ it takes two to tango I mean, we can't forget his disdain for her drug habit either.

or her disdain for him sleeping with other women.

In no particular order:

• Saying "this is the last time I'm playing the hits" every year since 1978
• Allowing Kirky to do any drum programming
• Wasting time with a lot of piss-awful proteges
• Becoming a JW
• Not making more albums with the New Power Trio
• The whole lotusflower.com shit
• Making a lot of terrible promo vids
• Failing to release one good live album or DVD (Sacrifice of Victor is the best attempt but he has ridiculous sideburns)

rdhull said:

OldFriends4Sale said:

do your research boo boo

I have doo doo.

SOTT material was wriotten by him first before they got their mits on them. Eaves Dropping In Intimate Moments etc ..

Well let's look at It's Gonna Be A Beautiful Night music co-written by Dr. Fink & Eric Leeds. (this was a lot of the Flesh sessions music)

Slow Love co-written by Carol Davis

Strange Relationships as a skeleton of a song that Wendy & Lisa pulled up and worked with Prince on

Starfish & Coffee co-written by Susannah Melvoin

and this was similar with a lot of the music, because most of the songs were to be on the Prince & the Revolution album the Dream Factory & the Camille Project.

Mya said:

Poplife88 said:

As much as its helped him spiritually, becoming a JW has put limits on his creativity imo.

Why is it that everyone thinks his being Christian (or at least believing in God) inspired him and made him creative, but that being a JW stifled him?

Is it because he no longer sings dirty lyrics?

I just don't see how this stifles his creativity anymore than his religious views before. Prince has always been religious/spiritual. The only thing that's changed is he's now not cursing and occasionally homophobic and/or racist. But again--these things don't stifle his creativity to me.

uuhson said:

releasing that recent picture

Aww...I'm sorry Princey. Still ya though

imago said:

Mya said:

Why is it that everyone thinks his being Christian (or at least believing in God) inspired him and made him creative, but that being a JW stifled him?

Is it because he no longer sings dirty lyrics?

I just don't see how this stifles his creativity anymore than his religious views before. Prince has always been religious/spiritual. The only thing that's changed is he's now not cursing and occasionally homophobic and/or racist. But again--these things don't stifle his creativity to me.

It's not about being Christian or being religous...he has written fabulous songs with spiritual overtones. The Cross, Elephants and Flowers, I Wish U Heaven, and The Holy River are all top songs from the guy. However being a JW means he CAN'T write or perform certain songs because they are about fucking (Head/Darling Nikki/Erotic City) OR because it goes against JW teachings (changing The Cross to The Christ). I am happy he's found something that helps him fulfill his spritual cravings. However, anytime you say the word CAN'T do something in art imo limits creativity.

rdhull said:

Mya said:

Letting go Wendy & Lisa

Yeah, because SOTT and Lovesexy were just awful.

Far from it. But I always felt the three of them together were something fierce. His music was never the same after they left. Power Fantastic alone makes me miss W&L.

Poplife88 said:

imago said:

Why is it that everyone thinks his being Christian (or at least believing in God) inspired him and made him creative, but that being a JW stifled him?

Is it because he no longer sings dirty lyrics?

I just don't see how this stifles his creativity anymore than his religious views before. Prince has always been religious/spiritual. The only thing that's changed is he's now not cursing and occasionally homophobic and/or racist. But again--these things don't stifle his creativity to me.

It's not about being Christian or being religous...he has written fabulous songs with spiritual overtones. The Cross, Elephants and Flowers, I Wish U Heaven, and The Holy River are all top songs from the guy. However being a JW means he CAN'T write or perform certain songs because they are about fucking (Head/Darling Nikki/Erotic City) OR because it goes against JW teachings (changing The Cross to The Christ). I am happy he's found something that helps him fulfill his spritual cravings. However, anytime you say the word CAN'T do something in art imo limits creativity.

gotcha

muirdo said:

dreaminaboutu said:

Let me just get it out of the way and say I think it is when he started hanging out with Larry Graham and doing interviews like that one he did on the Sinbad show. I was like has he been completely brainwashed ?

Absolutely!!!

Larry is our Yoko.

Good point. The fact is, it was Lennon's choice to leave the Beatles, as it was Prince's to befriend Larry.

Regardless of how you think P's music has changed - and I'm only going on what I see - but Larry seems to be a true friend who appreciates Prince for whom he is, not for his fame or fortune.

Don't we all deserve that?

--That fucked up thing he calls an afro on his head now.

--Letting Larry Graham talk him into becoming a JW.

--Not doing "Bad" as a duet with Michael Jackson. Yeah, I'm still stewing. That album needed some purple funk on it.

--Doing anything with Larry Graham. I see them onstage and cringe. Looks like Prince dancing with his father.

--The braids around 99-00

--That interview where he had Mayte speak answers for him.

kenkamken said:

He's famous for making questionable career decisions, the whole name change completely baffled everyone, including many of his strongest supporters. I remember it was really hard to justify to people, they just couldn't get with an unpronounceable name thing. It's interesting he's made so many of these "career destroyer" moves, but still rebuilds with his sheer force of creativity. Most superstars try to cling to the image they created, even as it crumbles before them, but Prince actively tore down his old persona and liberated himself from its confines. A true iconoclast.

And then went back to being Prince with added doses of JW dogma for good measure. Yeah, a real iconoclast is Prince.