PatrickS77 said:

It doesn't matter anymore, but in a way this makes me sad:



Sony Buys Michael Jackson Stake in Music Venture for $750 Million

Sony Corp. has reached an agreement with the estate of Michael Jackson to acquire the late music star’s interest in their joint music business for $750 million.


Terms of the deal call for Sony to pay $733 million for Jackson’s 50% stake in Sony/ATV Music Publishing, as well as previously announced distributions, with payments totaling $750 million.


Sony/ATV Music Publishing, established in 1995 as a joint venture between Sony and Jackson, touts itself as the world’s leading music publisher. Together with EMI Music Publishing, Sony/ATV owns or administers more than 3 million copyrights; it also controls “New York, New York,” “All You Need Is Love,” “You’ve Got a Friend,” “Moon River,” “Jailhouse Rock,” “The Mission Impossible Theme,” “Ain’t No Mountain High Enough,” “Over the Rainbow,” “Stand by Me” and “I Heard It Through the Grapevine.”


“The entertainment businesses have long been a core part of Sony and are a key driver of our future growth,” said Kazuo Hirai, Sony president and CEO. “This agreement further demonstrates Sony’s commitment to the entertainment businesses and our firm belief that these businesses will continue to contribute to our success for years to come.”


The companies said in a joint release Monday that the sale is the culmination of a process that began in September when Sony exercised its right to purchase the other partner’s interest — a right that has existed since the joint venture was formed by Jackson and Sony in 1995.


The parties expect to reach a definitive agreement by March 31, and the closing is subject to certain conditions, including regulatory approvals.


Sony said the transaction will have no material impact on its consolidated results forecast for the fiscal year ending March 31. It also said the impact on Sony’s results for the fiscal year ending March 31, 2017, is currently being evaluated.


The estate said the transaction will not affect its continuing interests in other music assets, including all of Jackson’s master recordings as well as Mijac Music, the publishing company that owns all of the songs written by Jackson as well as songs by some of his favorite songwriters and artists that were acquired during his life. The estate will also retain its ownership interest in EMI Music Publishing.


“This transaction further allows us to continue our efforts of maximizing the value of Michael’s Estate for the benefit of his children,” said co-executors John Branca and John McClain. “It also further validates Michael’s foresight and genius in investing in music publishing. His ATV catalog, purchased in 1985 for a net acquisition cost of $41.5 million, was the cornerstone of the joint venture and, as evidenced by the value of this transaction, is considered one of the smartest investments in music history.”


Sony/ATV Music represents the copyrights of the Beatles, Leonard Cohen, Bob Dylan, Marvin Gaye, Michael Jackson, Carole King, Kraftwerk, Joni Mitchell, Willie Nelson, Roy Orbison, Queen, the Rolling Stones, Richie Sambora, Sting, the Supremes, Wyclef Jean, Hank Williams and Stevie Wonder. Current artists include Akon, Alicia Keys, Lady Gaga, P!nk, Shakira, Ed Sheeran, Sam Smith, Taylor Swift, Kanye West and Pharrell Williams.


“When Sony first partnered with Michael Jackson 21 years ago to create Sony/ATV Music Publishing, we knew that this company had the ability to reach great heights,” said Michael Lynton, CEO of Sony Entertainment Inc. “This acquisition will enable Sony to more quickly adapt to changes in the music publishing business, while at the same time continuing to be an unparalleled leader in the industry and a treasured home for artists and writers.”


http://variety.com/2016/d...201729859/

[Edited 3/14/16 18:26pm]

this was in the making years in advance.......this shows that Michael Jackson's name will forever be controlled by those who are not entriched in the experience of his career............

and one of these days, when fans are ready to really sit down and listen, they'll start realizing what that 02 concert show was really all about..........

IT'S ALL OVER....IT'S A WRAP.....

at least I can say I saw MJ at his absolute very best, and I"ll hold on to that memory

^Unfornately Scorp, some of your conspiracy rhetoric turned out to be true. I agree with everything you stated above.

mjscarousal said:

^Unfornately Scorp, some of your conspiracy rhetoric turned out to be true. I agree with everything you stated above.

that's the thing MJCarousel,

this was not conspiracy talk.

I wish to the Creator himself that none of this would have ever happened over the years

this was painful to watch as a human being

there never was any enemy....ever........

and one day, everyone is going to listen to what really happen to Michael Jackson

and we can begin the process of taken the necessary steps to make sure nothing like this ever happens again

[Edited 3/14/16 19:10pm]

Michael will always be the greatest but the MJ executors ain't worth shit and do not have MJ or childrens best interest at heart. The decision to sell MJs half of the SONY catalog is not only a stupid business decision but a spiteful and vicious thing to do especially when MJ expressed he did not want to sell it. Those exectors can not be trusted. I have have NO respect for them and I don't believe a word they say on anything.

Even if the deal was already made years ago before MJ passed away?

Even though I feel that catalog is potentially worth more than 750million.

But sadly Mj can't contest it..

The deal was not made years ago. The executors get a cut in this deal. Not sure why they would sell away half a catalog that is worth a billion dollars. Its clear they do not have MJs best interest at heart and are only thinking about themselves. Such a ridiculously dumb business decision

I guess Sony finally got what they wanted! From the moment MJ bought ATV in 1995. Sony has wanted FULL ownership of it. But Mj wouldn't budge. I've NEVER TRUSTED Sony. Which is the reason I will NEVER buy ANYTHING involving Mj after his death.

^ Agree and those MJ executors running Michaels Estate can not be trusted. There decision to sell Michaels half of SONY is blantant disrespect to MJ and his children especially since they know MJ would have never done that. FUQ them all!

This disturbs me on sooooo many levels.....Just saw this article on Bloomberg Business:

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http://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2016-03-14/sony-buys-michael-jackson-s-stake-in-music-unit-for-750-million

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Michael Jackson's Estate Reaps $750 Million in Sony Venture Exit

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Sony Corp., betting on the growth of music streaming, agreed to pay about $750 million to buy out late pop star Michael Jackson’s stake in a jointly owned catalog of songs by artists from the Beatles to Taylor Swift.

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The deal gives Sony control over the rights to almost 4 million songs amid the shift by listeners from individual album purchases to subscription services offered by Apple Inc., YouTube and Spotify Ltd. Sony has said the growth of streaming services will help bolster revenues in the music business to as much as $5.2 billion in fiscal 2017.

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“The value of music assets is increasing with the growth of streaming,” said Damian Thong, an analyst at Macquarie Group Ltd. in Tokyo. “Sony is actually paying less than the stake is worth.”

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The terms of the deal call for Sony to make a lump sum payment to the Jackson estate of $733 million for a 50 percent stake in Sony/ATV Music Publishing, as well as future distributions, according to a statement. The estate of Jackson, who died in 2009 at age 50, still owns the rights to his master recordings and a stake in EMI Music Publishing.

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Talks on a deal began in September, when Sony exercised its right under their joint venture to buy out Jackson’s estate.

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Sony expects paid subscribers to account for 60 percent of the market next year, outpacing downloads with 22 percent and digital radio with 5 percent. Its shares closed 0.2 percent lower at 2,794 yen in Tokyo, while the Nikkei 225 Stock Average declined 0.7 percent. The stock is down 6.9 percent this year.

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Leaked Documents

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Documents leaked by hackers who broke into Sony Entertainment’s computers in 2014 revealed that executives at the company were weighing the future of the joint venture.

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“The entertainment businesses have long been a core part of Sony and are a key driver of our future growth,” said Kazuo Hirai, Sony’s chief executive officer, in the statement. “This agreement further demonstrates Sony’s commitment to the entertainment businesses and our firm belief that these businesses will continue to contribute to our success for years to come.”

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Jackson purchased the ATV catalog, which was the foundation for the eventual joint venture with Sony, for $41.5 million in 1985. The deal announced Monday “further validates Michael’s foresight and genius in investing in music publishing,” said John Branca and John McClain, co-executors of the estate, in the statement. “This transaction further allows us to continue our efforts of maximizing the value of Michael’s estate for the benefit of his children.”

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[Edited 3/15/16 9:36am]

“This transaction further allows us to continue our efforts of maximizing the value of Michael’s estate for the benefit of his children.”

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How the hell are you going to "maximize" the value of Michael's estate if you sell it for 750 million? That just doesn't make sense. I'm sure there are plenty intricate details that's not disclosed yet but dammn!

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Eveyone knows the basis of economics is supply and demand. Buy low, sell high, but this shi* ain't high enough to me. I don't think his 50% stake should ever be sold really. If their projections are correct with estimating 5.2 billions in revenue by the end of their fiscal year next year, why sell? I mean, it's not like the estate/kids were hurting for money or anything. Michael was probably debt free within the first year or so of his death, so where's the incentive to sell now?

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apparently, they couldn't buy sony out, which is understandable. although sony is bleeding money, they're still bigger than mj's estate. i don't think that mj's estate is debt free quite yet, musicslave, because probate hasn't closed. (i would assume it can be closed now!) as i posted on another board, the seeds for this takeover were laid 20 years ago when sony came to him in the first place. mj had too many eggs in one basket with both his contract and his catalog in one place. too many people literally knowing all of your business and in a position to use their knowledge to undermine you. mj was notoriously naive and trusting; i think a lot of people would have been more skeptical about this "deal" in the first place. there's always been a "buy out" clause and sony entered this deal with the thought of one day using it. it's funny because before mj died, branca gave an interview in which he said he told mj 'whatever you do, do NOT to sell this catalog'. another man, ron burkle (very wealthy, good friends with bill clinton) said he told mj the same thing when mj offered to sell his share to him when he felt his back was against the wall. he said he told mj, 'this is your kids' future'. so mj held onto it no matter what. in the end, branca did exactly what he told mj not to do.

kibbles said:

he said he told mj, 'this is your kids' future'. so mj held onto it no matter what. in the end, branca did exactly what he told mj not to do.

Well. Michael is gone (he is the only one that should have profited from his investment) and his kids future is secure, plenty times over. It's just the symbolic that saddens me.

PatrickS77 said:

kibbles said:

he said he told mj, 'this is your kids' future'. so mj held onto it no matter what. in the end, branca did exactly what he told mj not to do.

Well. Michael is gone (he is the only one that should have profited from his investment) and his kids future is secure, plenty times over. It's just the symbolic that saddens me.

totes agree.

[Edited 3/15/16 12:08pm]

STATEMENT FROM THE ESTATE OF MICHAEL JACKSON:

As you may recall, last October Sony triggered the “buy-sell” clause in the partnership agreement which provides for one partner to buy out the share of the other at the highest possible price. As has now been announced, the Estate and Sony have signed a memorandum of understanding for Sony to purchase the Estate’s interest in Sony/ATV. A copy of the official press release is also being sent to you. In the intervening months, we explored several options that would have positioned the Estate as the buyer, rather than Sony, and we had substantial interest from potential partners to work with us in doing so. Ultimately, however, Sony’s offer was in the best interest of Michael’s children and we made the difficult decision to accept that offer. The arrangements will further secure the financial future of Michael’s heirs. The amount that Sony is paying, $750 million, is a substantial premium on the Estate’s interest in the company after taking into account the debt of the company, the Purchase Option and other adjustments required under the partnership agreement. It is also a huge testament to Michael’s business acumen that his original investment appreciated so substantially over the last 30 years.

There are several reasons that led to our decision. We will use a portion of the proceeds to repay the loan balance on monies borrowed by Michael and secured by his interest in Sony/ATV which means that after starting with more than $500 million in debt seven years ago, the Estate is now completely debt free with substantial assets in cash and other property. The balance of the proceeds from this sale, after taxes, fees and expenses, will be held by the Estate and ultimately will be transferred to a trust for the benefit of Michael’s beneficiaries. Furthermore, the transaction allows the Estate to diversify assets which, to date, have been highly concentrated in music intellectual property.

We would like to underline that the sale has no effect whatsoever on the 100% ownership of the publishing on all of the songs that Michael wrote, which all remain part of Mijac Music, as well as those songs written by many of Michael’s favorite songwriters, that he acquired outside of Sony/ATV. These songs include "After Midnight”, "Love Train", "I Got A Woman", “When A Man Loves A Woman”, "People Get Ready", "Great Balls of Fire", "Runaround Sue", the entire Sly and the Family Stone catalog and other songs. The Estate also continues to own its 100% interest in all of Michael’s solo master recordings and short films. There is no intention of selling any of these wholly-owned assets.

While the sale of Michael’s interest in Sony/ATV is bittersweet for all of us – especially for those of us involved in helping Michael create this company back in 1995, the fact that we are even in this position in the first place further validates Michael’s foresight and genius in investing in music publishing. As we noted in the official press release, Michael’s ATV catalogue, purchased in 1985 for a net acquisition cost of $41.5 million was the cornerstone in the 1995 formation of Sony/ATV and, as evidenced by the value of this transaction, is still considered one of the smartest investments in music history.

We are aware that some fans were hoping that the Estate would be the buyer of Sony’s share in Sony/ATV, rather than the reverse. That was our goal as well when we started on this path last year, but ultimately, Sony’s offer made more sense for the reasons outlined above. We are dedicated to protecting and growing Michael’s legacy, and maximizing the value of his Estate for the benefit of his children. This sale allows us to protect the assets most dear to Michael (his own songs and those he acquired and retained outside of Sony/ATV), close out his debts, and continue to grow his legacy for future generations.

thetimefan said:

Sony got a bargain of a century here, now they have total control of the catalogue they will monetise it to the nth degree. Usage of songs in TV adverts, movies, online, the list goes on. I'm sure the acquisition alone will keep them afloat for a long time to come. The estate had that as their last piece of real leverage as it was such a valuable asset. Now their only hope is to monetise what they do have. Buy Neverland and set it up ala Graceland and put out tons of merchandise like Elvis estate does. $750m is a huge sum but it's chump change to what it could potentially generate. Mike should have put his affairs in order and tried to have kept 100% control of the catalogue but excessive debts forced his hand and set him on the path to the This is It concerts which were really in place to clear his debt. As a life long fan of Michaels this news sucks because they meaning Sony are taking his children's rightful inheritence. Regardless if it's $750m or $750 that's their entitlement. Sony must have made millions from their cash ins since MJs passing so I'd imagine he was close to debt free if not clear of debt already. To me this is a huge power play on Sony s behalf a checkmating if you will. They didn't need to get 100% control unless his estate is losing more money and further in debt. Even then they have gone for the jugular here and it's wrong in all senses of the word. The music business is especially cold if you have to essentially rob a man's family of their inheritance. I mean they've lost their father already now they've lost out on something which could have kept their family financially secure for a century or more. That's the real value of the Sony ATV catalogue if the world continues for another 1000 years they'll still be listening to the Beatles et AL and Sony will be reaping the rewards not MJs family and future heirs. [Edited 3/15/16 13:05pm]

Who cares what Sony does with the fucking music? It's not ours, it's not Michael's, it's nothing Michael created, it's just business with music he bought. Nobody fucking cares. It's really just the symbolic, that Michael has been eradicated out of the company.

Apparantly the clause that Sony could buy out Michael was in the contract from the very get go (or 2006 depending on what you read), so really, would Michael still be alive, they probably would/could have bought his half of the company years ago.

750 mio. dollars just fell into the lap of the children teenagers for doing nothing. Boy, those poor kids. They will end up in the poorhouse soon. Dude, get real. They are set for centuries.

I.B. BAD BREAKS DOWN THE BUY/SELL ON SONY/ATV (UPDATE)
On Monday (3/14), Sony Corp. exercised the buy/sell on Marty Bandier’s Sony/ATV, acquiring full ownership of the world’s largest music publisher for $750m. Sony/ATV was set up as a joint venture, with Sony and the Michael Jackson Estate each owning 50%. Estate attorney Joel Katz and co-executor John Branca were believed to have amassed a sizable war chest with the aim of buying Sony/ATV themselves, but Sony has come out on top, while the Estate is getting an enormous consolation prize.

The Estate retains its stake in EMI Music Publishing, which was acquired in 2012 by a consortium comprising Sony, the Estate, Mubadala Development Co., Jynwel Capital Ltd., the Blackstone Group’s GSO Capital Partners LP and David Geffen. The price tag was $2.2b, or just under eight times EMP’s net publisher share (NPS), which was then in the $300m range. The Sony/Jackson Estate’s piece of EMP is about 40%, with Sony owning three-quarters of that total. Sony/ATV had an approximate valuation of $1.5b in 2015, and its stake in EMI Music Publishing was valued at $860m at the time of the acquisition. But the acquisition impacts only Sony/ATV proper, not ithe ownership of EMP.

Sony/ATV has annual revenues north of $600m a year. Although mechanical royalties have been hit hard by the decline in sales, it’s hoped that the advent of mass-market streaming will offset this revenue loss.

Jackson was days away from filing for bankruptcy in 2006 when Sony chief Howard Stringer and CFO Robert Wiesenthal bailed him out. In return, Sony took greater operational control of Sony/ATV and received an option to buy half of Jackson’s share. The loan, estimated at $280 million, was connected to the Sony/ATV catalog and secured by Barclays. The interest rate was negotiated down to 2.9% from 5.8% shortly after the Jackson’s death in July 2009. At that point, he was roughly half a billion dollars in debt.

That 10-year-old loan impactied the current buy/sell situation in that its terms provided Sony with a discount of around $150m on the purchase price.

In November 2012, a representative of the Jackson Estate confirmed to Forbes that the estate had just paying off a loan connected to MiJac Music. That payment meant that the estate had eliminated the last of Jackson’s outstanding personal debts, thanks to Jackson’s considerable posthumous earning power resulting from This Is It, the highest-grossing concert film in history; a $250 million record deal with Sony, the largest ever; and the Michael Jackson Immortal World Tour—a joint venture with Cirque du Soleil.

In 2014, for what it’s worth (and it’s worth a great deal in this case), the Jackson Estate was valued at $1.18 billion. The second most valuable estate is that of Elvis Presley, which has a reported net worth of $300m.

http://hitsdailydouble.co...;id=300204

kibbles said:

PatrickS77 said:

Well. Michael is gone (he is the only one that should have profited from his investment) and his kids future is secure, plenty times over. It's just the symbolic that saddens me.

totes agree.

[Edited 3/15/16 12:08pm]

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I hear you both. The kids are alright. They should be financially set, and their grandchildren should be financially set. I think what disturbs me the most is I thought the catalog and his estate should never give up something with an intrinsic value that's potentially endless. In other words, you don't ever hear about Conrad Hilton's little hotel chain eventually being sold to one of his competitors.

Hey, I care! I don't know if you realise what the symbolism of this all actually entails. Michael's estate, I assume, still own the songwriting copyrights to his own music, but do Sony now own the publishing rights to his songs?, if they do, then they can do what they see fit with his music, which is a major cause of concern as you might see "Man in the Mirror" used to shill Gillette razors, or "Beat it" shilling anti-spot cream, "Black or White" shilling a brand of coffee or something. Which totally devalues and makes a mockery the music and Sony with their quest to massive profits and returns will not care less about the artistic integrity of the music, they just want to make as much return on their investment as possible.

I could be wrong, but I remember reading MJ absorbed his own music publishing along with the songs he purchased back in the 80s, unless he kept his music seperate. As for the 750 mil, again what the catalogue could potentially earn them, plus the $500m debt, how much of the $750m will go towards paying off the debt?. So at the end of the day, say it clears the debt totally, that might leave $250-$400m left. Considering they are the Jackson family with all that entails & the hangers on, that's not going to last them centuries is it?, especially if the estate spends it on vanity projects that don't pay off say they make a movie that stiffs at the box office for example. So when you consider all the variables it doesn't really leave a lot to be desired. I still think Sony have got the deal of the century here, the Beatles songs alone must generate millions each year, so they've really got the jewel in the crown they've wanted for 20+ years.

The Sony/ATV catalogue was probably more valuable than you & I can comprehend, not just now but with foresight it's value could go up & up, where if the family still owed in they'd reap the benefits. That's the big issue here, MJ bought it then co-owned, and whilst yea, they are not all his songs, he bought it I'm sure as a future investment and once which guarantees financial security. When he was in that major debt, what bailed him out?, the Sony/ATV catalogue so what now if the estate goes into debt, who and what will bail them out. Yea they have almost a billion dollars to throw around but how much will actually go into a trust fund and will it be used it wisely?, that's another major question. I'm not saying the family will be destitute but it's a case where they have to not penny pinch but be wise with their money. Sounds kinda ironic right considering the amount of money in question, but who knows where it'll go and whether some will go on project(s) that don't get off the ground, on promotion/marketing for campaigns that don't go anywhere etc. That will burn up a lot of the money. So when you consider all this again, the amount Sony paid is a fraction of what they could have potentially generated. Mechancial royalties are down sure, but if streaming is ever truly monopolized they are sitting on a potential fortune (well Sony will be).

Just my 2 cents and you are welcome to your opinion but say 10 years down the line and the money has magically vanished, mismanaged or whatever, because when you have an estate that size it can easily be mis-managed and not monopolized correctly then things like that can happen, then who knows where it'll leave the family?. Plus considering MJ was $500m in debt at one point, who knows whether the estate will fall into debt again too?, then who and what will bail it out?. 1000% of that never happening, but who really knows. When you think about it in detail, Sony have taken the one thing that will always draw money for the Jackson family and without that, they only have Michael's music and if they managed to turn Neverland into a Graceland type place, but the amount would be considerably less to what the grand worth of the Sony/ATV catalogue is and will continue to be worth. Say 50 years, 100 years down the line the catalogue might be worth $50Bn, maybe $200Bn, even like a $1 Trillion dollars and the estate would have owned like 40%/50% of that, so going by the $1 trillion example, they'd have $400Bn (40%) or $500Bn (50%) that's potentially the amount they could have earned and that's the point I'm making here. Could be totally wrong and reading too much into things, but they know the real worth and potential worth which is why despite revenue going down across the board for them they snapped the deal up. Again, deal of the century here and I think in 50, 100 even 100+ years time, unless music is made free for all in the public domain or whatever, this deal with be looked at again in hindsight where the Jackson estate sold for $750m yet Sony has generated billions in comparison. But I guess that's just the music biz and business in general where at the end of the day it's just profit that counts.

No. They don't. Michael's music is totally seperate and is still worth 200 to 300 mio $. As for the debt. They paid off Michael's personal debt by 2012 and the debt on Sony/ATV is paid off now too. If this goes through, the estate is debt free. Annual income for the estate from Sony/ATV was 17 mio. They got 750 mio now. You do the math. Many of the Beatles songs will revert back to Lennon/McCartney from 2018 on (in the US). Nobody knows hwo much income there will be in the coming years. And really, Michael agreed to these terms in 2006. They could have taken his stake in 2008 or 2009 already.

Michael's kids are the only ones benefitting, not the family. Katherine, most likely, won't be an issue all that long anymore.

Again, from the business standpoint I don't care and in a way it makes sense. It's just the symbolics I mind.

thetimefan said:

Who cares what Sony does with the fucking music? It's not ours, it's not Michael's, it's nothing Michael created, it's just business with music he bought. Nobody fucking cares. It's really just the symbolic, that Michael has been eradicated out of the company.

Apparantly the clause that Sony could buy out Michael was in the contract from the very get go (or 2006 depending on what you read), so really, would Michael still be alive, they probably would/could have bought his half of the company years ago.

750 mio. dollars just fell into the lap of the children teenagers for doing nothing. Boy, those poor kids. They will end up in the poorhouse soon. Dude, get real. They are set for centuries.

Hey, I care! I don't know if you realise what the symbolism of this all actually entails. Michael's estate, I assume, still own the songwriting copyrights to his own music, but do Sony now own the publishing rights to his songs?, if they do, then they can do what they see fit with his music, which is a major cause of concern as you might see "Man in the Mirror" used to shill Gillette razors, or "Beat it" shilling anti-spot cream, "Black or White" shilling a brand of coffee or something. Which totally devalues and makes a mockery the music and Sony with their quest to massive profits and returns will not care less about the artistic integrity of the music, they just want to make as much return on their investment as possible.

I could be wrong, but I remember reading MJ absorbed his own music publishing along with the songs he purchased back in the 80s, unless he kept his music seperate. As for the 750 mil, again what the catalogue could potentially earn them, plus the $500m debt, how much of the $750m will go towards paying off the debt?. So at the end of the day, say it clears the debt totally, that might leave $250-$400m left. Considering they are the Jackson family with all that entails & the hangers on, that's not going to last them centuries is it?, especially if the estate spends it on vanity projects that don't pay off say they make a movie that stiffs at the box office for example. So when you consider all the variables it doesn't really leave a lot to be desired. I still think Sony have got the deal of the century here, the Beatles songs alone must generate millions each year, so they've really got the jewel in the crown they've wanted for 20+ years.

The Sony/ATV catalogue was probably more valuable than you & I can comprehend, not just now but with foresight it's value could go up & up, where if the family still owed in they'd reap the benefits. That's the big issue here, MJ bought it then co-owned, and whilst yea, they are not all his songs, he bought it I'm sure as a future investment and once which guarantees financial security. When he was in that major debt, what bailed him out?, the Sony/ATV catalogue so what now if the estate goes into debt, who and what will bail them out. Yea they have almost a billion dollars to throw around but how much will actually go into a trust fund and will it be used it wisely?, that's another major question. I'm not saying the family will be destitute but it's a case where they have to not penny pinch but be wise with their money. Sounds kinda ironic right considering the amount of money in question, but who knows where it'll go and whether some will go on project(s) that don't get off the ground, on promotion/marketing for campaigns that don't go anywhere etc. That will burn up a lot of the money. So when you consider all this again, the amount Sony paid is a fraction of what they could have potentially generated. Mechancial royalties are down sure, but if streaming is ever truly monopolized they are sitting on a potential fortune (well Sony will be).

Just my 2 cents and you are welcome to your opinion but say 10 years down the line and the money has magically vanished, mismanaged or whatever, because when you have an estate that size it can easily be mis-managed and not monopolized correctly then things like that can happen, then who knows where it'll leave the family?. Plus considering MJ was $500m in debt at one point, who knows whether the estate will fall into debt again too?, then who and what will bail it out?. 1000% of that never happening, but who really knows. When you think about it in detail, Sony have taken the one thing that will always draw money for the Jackson family and without that, they only have Michael's music and if they managed to turn Neverland into a Graceland type place, but the amount would be considerably less to what the grand worth of the Sony/ATV catalogue is and will continue to be worth. Say 50 years, 100 years down the line the catalogue might be worth $50Bn, maybe $200Bn, even like a $1 Trillion dollars and the estate would have owned like 40%/50% of that, so going by the $1 trillion example, they'd have $400Bn (40%) or $500Bn (50%) that's potentially the amount they could have earned and that's the point I'm making here. Could be totally wrong and reading too much into things, but they know the real worth and potential worth which is why despite revenue going down across the board for them they snapped the deal up. Again, deal of the century here and I think in 50, 100 even 100+ years time, unless music is made free for all in the public domain or whatever, this deal with be looked at again in hindsight where the Jackson estate sold for $750m yet Sony has generated billions in comparison. But I guess that's just the music biz and business in general where at the end of the day it's just profit that counts.

Michael Jackson's music pubishing has always been held separately from Sony/AtV. Mijac Publishing is still owned by the Estate and is not a part of this SONY/ATv deal.

PatrickS77 said:

No. They don't. Michael's music is totally seperate and is still worth 200 to 300 mio $. As for the debt. They paid off Michael's personal debt by 2012 and the debt on Sony/ATV is paid off now too. If this goes through, the estate is debt free. Annual income for the estate from Sony/ATV was 17 mio. They got 750 mio now. You do the math. Many of the Beatles songs will revert back to Lennon/McCartney from 2018 on (in the US). Nobody knows hwo much income there will be in the coming years. And really, Michael agreed to these terms in 2006. They could have taken his stake in 2008 or 2009 already.

Michael's kids are the only ones benefitting, not the family. Katherine, most likely, won't be an issue all that long anymore.

Again, from the business standpoint I don't care and in a way it makes sense. It's just the symbolics I mind.

PatrickS77 said:

No. They don't. Michael's music is totally seperate and is still worth 200 to 300 mio $. As for the debt. They paid off Michael's personal debt by 2012 and the debt on Sony/ATV is paid off now too. If this goes through, the estate is debt free. Annual income for the estate from Sony/ATV was 17 mio. They got 750 mio now. You do the math. Many of the Beatles songs will revert back to Lennon/McCartney from 2018 on (in the US). Nobody knows hwo much income there will be in the coming years. And really, Michael agreed to these terms in 2006. They could have taken his stake in 2008 or 2009 already.

Michael's kids are the only ones benefitting, not the family. Katherine, most likely, won't be an issue all that long anymore.

Again, from the business standpoint I don't care and in a way it makes sense. It's just the symbolics I mind.

what kind of comment is that

"most likely, won't be AN ISSUE all that long anymore"

AN ISSUE? AN ISSUE.........

one of the most awful comments I've ever read to date........

but that's alright though, the tide will turn in time

[Edited 3/15/16 17:55pm]

Geez. The woman is old. Very old. Fans accuse here of funneling money to the family (apparently against Michael's wishes, unless he had the foresight to know that she might do that and counted on her to do that). Once she's gone, that will stop and Prince, Paris and Blanket will be the sole beneficiaries of the estate. Do I need to make you a drawing?

[Edited 3/15/16 18:30pm]

PatrickS77 said:

Geez. The woman is old. Very old. Fans accuse here of funneling money to the family. Once she's gone, that will stop and Prince, Paris and Blanket will be the sole beneficiaries of the estate. Do I need to make you a drawing?

god awful.......I'm not buying that hate for one second.....

you gone be old one day too

this dude just said "once she's gone"....it's like you can't wait for her to die....

that ain't even about being a fan, it's about something else altogether different

that's about as callous a comment about someone who's never done one thing to you I've ever seen........but I'm sure there's more to come

but one day, one day, the tide is going to turn

^^I realize you're a bit slow and dense and always make up your own stories, but for the record, I do not hate that woman. I stated the facts. That's all. Old people die. The older you get, the bigger the odds you die. Especially when you're 88. And the odds are, she won't be around that many years. That's just a fact of life. Deal with it.

PatrickS77 said:

^^I realize you're a bit slow and dense and always make up your own stories, but for the record, I do not hate that woman. I stated the facts. That's all. Old people die. The older you get, the bigger the odds you die. Especially when you're 88. And the odds are, she won't be around that many years. That's just a fact of life. Deal with it.

I'm not buying that.......

that was as bogus a comment as I've ever read......

you said AN ISSUE, that has nothing to do with age

she could be in her 60s and u would still see her around as AN ISSUE........

ain't no way of even sugar coating that....

but as I said, the tide is going to turn one day....no doubt about it

and as I said a thousand times, personal attacks dont' affect me at all.......

I don't have to resort to that because I see a bigger picture and this tide is gonna turn one day......

[Edited 3/15/16 18:38pm]