LittleBLUECorvette said:

Timmy84 said:

Yeah a photo.

One of the Flames, Baby Lloyd has a photo.

http://chronicle.augusta....0576.shtml

This link says he joined Gospel Starlighters in 1953.

Hmm, I don't know why I don't believe it. He had careers in sports. I mean, he was a boxer at one point. Quit because he didn't want any permanent damage. Then he tried what they called a semi-professional career in baseball and a hamstring led to him quitting that. I'm sure there were some good years there. I read he joined a gospel group prior to the Starlighters but they failed to get a deal so he didn't sing again for another two years. He also married and had his first child, Terry, by then. Another child would be born before James was said to have joined the Flames, or the Starlighters.

This one is when he recorded Live at the Royal in 1963.

I think the Jewels were a singing group unlike the Brownies

Damn, what a Show. JB, Jackie, Al Green (pre 70s Tired of Being Alone Al), Impressions, Chi-Lites

Ike Tina Turner Revue

LittleBLUECorvette said:

I think this is his first press photo.

It says with his Famous Flames at the bottom but know Flames to be found.

Wow, I almost thought that was Hank Ballard for a minute. I don't know, something about his look seems more... homely. They did say after he got famous with the live album, he hired some California dentist to fix his gap and that led to him smiling more. Here, his hair ain't even in the pompadour style he would be known for. In fact, it looks like he wore it in this style because he couldn't afford much conk then. Only later was he able to get the same 'do Little Richard got. Looks 1960-ish.

LittleBLUECorvette said:

This one is when he recorded Live at the Royal in 1963.

I think the Jewels were a singing group unlike the Brownies

Damn, what a Show. JB, Jackie, Al Green (pre 70s Tired of Being Alone Al), Impressions, Chi-Lites

Ike Tina Turner Revue

See, Ike & Tina never forgot the Ikettes' pictures.

Timmy84 said:

LittleBLUECorvette said:

I think this is his first press photo.

It says with his Famous Flames at the bottom but know Flames to be found.

Wow, I almost thought that was Hank Ballard for a minute. I don't know, something about his look seems more... homely. They did say after he got famous with the live album, he hired some California dentist to fix his gap and that led to him smiling more. Here, his hair ain't even in the pompadour style he would be known for. In fact, it looks like he wore it in this style because he couldn't afford much conk then. Only later was he able to get the same 'do Little Richard got. Looks 1960-ish.

This looks like the first time he actually was infront of a camera posing for an actual pic.

This one looks early too.

This is interesting:

Jimmy Nolen played with James for a long time. He first worked with him just as James was creating "Papa's Got a Brand New Bag".

Anyway, Jimmy Nolen probably needs to be in the Rock & Roll Hall of Fame as a session musician because he played on virtually all of James' legacy-enshrined hits from "Papa's Got a Brand New Bag" on through "Mother Popcorn" before walking out on James (along with Fred, Maceo and 'em) in 1970.

When the original J.B.'s split up and another guitarist was told to leave, Jimmy came back in 1972. That's Jimmy you hear with the guitar on "Blind Man Can See It" and he's also on "Payback" and other songs. So he definitely played a big role as James' rhythm guitarist. Because of the style he used on James' records sometime after 1967 (he basically helped to popularize the "chicken scratch guitar riffs"), he was nicknamed "Chank".

Anyway, Jimmy worked with James until his death in 1983. Apparently by the time Jimmy died, James was still working him on his schedule and apparently of a heart attack while in Atlanta. After his death, Jimmy's widow sent a letter to James (or telegram) saying "the next person you hire to work with you, hope you treat him better than how you treated us."

OUCH!

[Edited 7/13/12 0:01am]

LittleBLUECorvette said:

Timmy84 said:

Wow, I almost thought that was Hank Ballard for a minute. I don't know, something about his look seems more... homely. They did say after he got famous with the live album, he hired some California dentist to fix his gap and that led to him smiling more. Here, his hair ain't even in the pompadour style he would be known for. In fact, it looks like he wore it in this style because he couldn't afford much conk then. Only later was he able to get the same 'do Little Richard got. Looks 1960-ish.

This looks like the first time he actually was infront of a camera posing for an actual pic.

This one looks early too.

Oh wow... Chitlin' circuit days I reckoned. I'm guessing James had always done splits then. Any telling what year this picture was though? '59? '60? It's hard to tell because there's hardly only a couple of pictures of James during the real early Flames years.

Timmy84 said:

LittleBLUECorvette said:

This looks like the first time he actually was infront of a camera posing for an actual pic.

This one looks early too.

Oh wow... Chitlin' circuit days I reckoned. I'm guessing James had always done splits then. Any telling what year this picture was though? '59? '60? It's hard to tell because there's hardly only a couple of pictures of James during the real early Flames years.

That has to be early. That place looks small literally only a few feet taller than those performing. And those 2 Flames (I'm assuming) don't look like Byrd, Bennett or Lloyd?

LittleBLUECorvette said:

Timmy84 said:

Oh wow... Chitlin' circuit days I reckoned. I'm guessing James had always done splits then. Any telling what year this picture was though? '59? '60? It's hard to tell because there's hardly only a couple of pictures of James during the real early Flames years.

That has to be early. That place looks small literally only a few feet taller than those performing. And those 2 Flames (I'm assuming) don't look like Byrd, Bennett or Lloyd?

Hmm... then maybe it's the "replacement" Flames of 1957-1958. I was surprised he was doing splits in such a tiny space but then again so did Jackie Wilson and Michael so I shouldn't be surprised then.

Any timeline into when he started doing his acrobatic dancing? Did he learn how to split as a child? Because I'm sure that's what helped in them giving him money in Augusta lol He did say he was influenced by vaudeville shows that used to feature dancers. I'm sure Jackie Wilson also influenced him too though or did his love of boxing (just like it had done for Jackie) was really the inspiration to dance. He always seem like he was on a heavyweight championship bout whenever he danced like he was ready to knock you out if need be (and sometimes he literally did - HIT MEH!). I also wonder when he started to fall on his knees during "Please, Please, Please" and have the towel/cape drop on him, was it '57, '58, '59? I heard it was '59.

And I ain't got the book but apparently, it took James a LONG time before he perfected that tip-the-mic-drop-to-a-split-then-bounce-back-catch-the-mic trick. Saying the first times he tried it, he nearly busted his entire face doing it. So apparently he got it from somebody but who? Joe Tex? Jackie Wilson? Who did that move first if it wasn't James Brown? I wanna say Joe Tex because apparently Joe had been doing the move for a long time and the trick helped him win Amateur Night at the Apollo and he was doing it during his chitlin' circuit days and they were coming up together. So maybe Joe was another person he watched from the wings and said "I gotta steal that". I wonder when he finally perfected it. Also in that picture when he's doing the splits, it looks like he's cramping and the other Flames are like "what is he doing? "

Timmy84 said:

LittleBLUECorvette said:

Timmy84 said:

This is interesting:

Jimmy Nolen played with James for a long time. He first worked with him just as James was creating "Papa's Got a Brand New Bag".

Anyway, Jimmy Nolen probably needs to be in the Rock & Roll Hall of Fame as a session musician because he played on virtually all of James' legacy-enshrined hits from "Papa's Got a Brand New Bag" on through "Mother Popcorn" before walking out on James (along with Fred, Maceo and 'em) in 1970.

When the original J.B.'s split up and another guitarist was told to leave, Jimmy came back in 1972. That's Jimmy you hear with the guitar on "Blind Man Can See It" and he's also on "Payback" and other songs. So he definitely played a big role as James' rhythm guitarist. Because of the style he used on James' records sometime after 1967 (he basically helped to popularize the "chicken scratch guitar riffs"), he was nicknamed "Chank".

Anyway, Jimmy worked with James until his death in 1983. Apparently by the time Jimmy died, James was still working him on his schedule and apparently of a heart attack while in Atlanta. After his death, Jimmy's widow sent a letter to James (or telegram) saying "the next person you hire to work with you, hope you treat him better than how you treated us."

jI

OUCH!

[Edited 7/13/12 0:01am]

Jimmy's first credited role is on Papas Goa a Brand New Bag. He came right around the time the Parker bros and Nat Jones came along.

Yeah it seemed like he hired those guys at the RIGHT time it seems. Melvin & Maceo joined him on the road in '64 when he couldn't record due to issues with King over releasing songs on Smash, I think Maceo is in this picture with James and the (known) Flames:

Timmy84 said:

Timmy84 said:

LittleBLUECorvette said:

Timmy84 said:

Any timeline into when he started doing his acrobatic dancing? Did he learn how to split as a child? Because I'm sure that's what helped in them giving him money in Augusta lol He did say he was influenced by vaudeville shows that used to feature dancers. I'm sure Jackie Wilson also influenced him too though or did his love of boxing (just like it had done for Jackie) was really the inspiration to dance. He always seem like he was on a heavyweight championship bout whenever he danced like he was ready to knock you out if need be (and sometimes he literally did - HIT MEH!). I also wonder when he started to fall on his knees during "Please, Please, Please" and have the towel/cape drop on him, was it '57, '58, '59? I heard it was '59.

He said he was "buck" dancing as a child, id say he been doin it since then. Byrd describes the first time he seen him do a spit. He said they wereperforming and he was on the piano and JB just start wilding out doin spits of the piano and the balcony. Byrd kicked over the piano stool. I'm. Not sure about the "Please" performance maybe around the time he got a valet "Baby Lloyd" and or roadie Bennett which was in 58 sometime after the original Flames had left.

OK, so I'm going with '58. Bobby was like a comedian for the show anyway so they (he and James) probably came up with that concept of dropping the towel on him. After Gorgeous George, Little Richard and the arrival of Danny Ray (I think he joined in '65 or '66?), that's when he adapted the capes.

LittleBLUECorvette said:

Timmy84 said:

And I ain't got the book but apparently, it took James a LONG time before he perfected that tip-the-mic-drop-to-a-split-then-bounce-back-catch-the-mic trick. Saying the first times he tried it, he nearly busted his entire face doing it. So apparently he got it from somebody but who? Joe Tex? Jackie Wilson? Who did that move first if it wasn't James Brown? I wanna say Joe Tex because apparently Joe had been doing the move for a long time and the trick helped him win Amateur Night at the Apollo and he was doing it during his chitlin' circuit days and they were coming up together. So maybe Joe was another person he watched from the wings and said "I gotta steal that". I wonder when he finally perfected it. Also in that picture when he's doing the splits, it looks like he's cramping and the other Flames are like "what is he doing? "

It was Joe and Tommy Hunt from the Flamingos I believe. But some of those vaudville acts might have been doin those ting too, since the 30s and 40s. Joe Tex was actually signed to King before JB a whole year before actually and Joe was on the big label King and JB on the sub Federal. I read a story about the first time they met each other in 56 I gotta find it tomorrow.

I think the vaudeville acts did splits, that's probably how James started doing it (or buck dancing as you said). But yeah, I figured Joe Tex started it. He later claimed James stole his entire act.

LittleBLUECorvette said:

Timmy84 said:

Any timeline into when he started doing his acrobatic dancing? Did he learn how to split as a child? Because I'm sure that's what helped in them giving him money in Augusta lol He did say he was influenced by vaudeville shows that used to feature dancers. I'm sure Jackie Wilson also influenced him too though or did his love of boxing (just like it had done for Jackie) was really the inspiration to dance. He always seem like he was on a heavyweight championship bout whenever he danced like he was ready to knock you out if need be (and sometimes he literally did - HIT MEH!). I also wonder when he started to fall on his knees during "Please, Please, Please" and have the towel/cape drop on him, was it '57, '58, '59? I heard it was '59.

He said he was "buck" dancing as a child, id say he been doin it since then. Byrd describes the first time he seen him do a spit. He said they wereperforming and he was on the piano and JB just start wilding out doin spits of the piano and the balcony. Byrd kicked over the piano stool. I'm. Not sure about the "Please" performance maybe around the time he got a valet "Baby Lloyd" and or roadie Bennett which was in 58 sometime after the original Flames had left.

LOL I did see him talk about it on some documentary (Headliners and Legends) if my memory banks recall correctly. That's crazy when you think about someone dropping from the piano to do a split or do a split right on a piano. The audience must've thought James was nuts then especially in those days. But this is why people loved him and go "did he really just do that?! "

Timmy84 said:

LittleBLUECorvette said:

Timmy84 said: He said he was "buck" dancing as a child, id say he been doin it since then. Byrd describes the first time he seen him do a spit. He said they wereperforming and he was on the piano and JB just start wilding out doin spits of the piano and the balcony. Byrd kicked over the piano stool. I'm. Not sure about the "Please" performance maybe around the time he got a valet "Baby Lloyd" and or roadie Bennett which was in 58 sometime after the original Flames had left.

LOL I did see him talk about it on some documentary (Headliners and Legends) if my memory banks recall correctly. That's crazy when you think about someone dropping from the piano to do a split or do a split right on a piano.The audience must've thought James was nuts then especially in those days. But this is why people loved him and go "did he really just do that?! "

Didn't someone else start doing that also?

HuMpThAnG said:

Timmy84 said:

LOL I did see him talk about it on some documentary (Headliners and Legends) if my memory banks recall correctly. That's crazy when you think about someone dropping from the piano to do a split or do a split right on a piano.The audience must've thought James was nuts then especially in those days. But this is why people loved him and go "did he really just do that?! "

Didn't someone else start doing that also?

Probably. I keep thinking Jackie Wilson would do some shit like this. I don't think Louis Jordan did splits lol

Timmy84 said:

HuMpThAnG said:

Didn't someone else start doing that also?

Probably. I keep thinking Jackie Wilson would do some shit like this. I don't think Louis Jordan did splits lol

Was referring to the lil purple dude

HuMpThAnG said:

Timmy84 said:

Probably. I keep thinking Jackie Wilson would do some shit like this. I don't think Louis Jordan did splits lol

Was referring to the lil purple dude

Ohhh...

Timmy84 said:

LittleBLUECorvette said:

Timmy84 said: It was Joe and Tommy Hunt from the Flamingos I believe. But some of those vaudville acts might have been doin those ting too, since the 30s and 40s. Joe Tex was actually signed to King before JB a whole year before actually and Joe was on the big label King and JB on the sub Federal. I read a story about the first time they met each other in 56 I gotta find it tomorrow.

I think the vaudeville acts did splits, that's probably how James started doing it (or buck dancing as you said). But yeah, I figured Joe Tex started it. He later claimed James stole his entire act.

Johnnie & Bill (Johnny Terry and Bill Hollings) former Flames were part of the Revue also. They released a few sides in 62-63.

LittleBLUECorvette said:

Timmy84 said:

I think the vaudeville acts did splits, that's probably how James started doing it (or buck dancing as you said). But yeah, I figured Joe Tex started it. He later claimed James stole his entire act.

Johnnie & Bill (Johnny Terry and Bill Hollings) former Flames were part of the Revue also. They released a few sides in 62-63.

So Bill Hollings still remained in James' Revue, huh? Interesting about Johnny Terry. He never rejoined the Flames, just was a member of the Revue right?

[Edited 7/13/12 18:03pm]

Timmy84 said:

LittleBLUECorvette said:

Timmy84 said: It was Joe and Tommy Hunt from the Flamingos I believe. But some of those vaudville acts might have been doin those ting too, since the 30s and 40s. Joe Tex was actually signed to King before JB a whole year before actually and Joe was on the big label King and JB on the sub Federal. I read a story about the first time they met each other in 56 I gotta find it tomorrow.

I think the vaudeville acts did splits, that's probably how James started doing it (or buck dancing as you said). But yeah, I figured Joe Tex started it. He later claimed James stole his entire act.

Dmn, I wish I could still find that article ...

LittleBLUECorvette said:

Timmy84 said:

I think the vaudeville acts did splits, that's probably how James started doing it (or buck dancing as you said). But yeah, I figured Joe Tex started it. He later claimed James stole his entire act.

Dmn, I wish I could still find that article ...

lol you couldn't find it?

Timmy84 said:

LittleBLUECorvette said:

Dmn, I wish I could still find that article ...

lol you couldn't find it?

It was something about there first meeting in 1856 and how they had a sing off.

LittleBLUECorvette said:

Timmy84 said:

lol you couldn't find it?

It was something about there first meeting in 1856 and how they had a sing off.

1956 at a sing-off lol I can believe it. They always seem like they were in competition with each other. In fact I can kinda believe James swagger jacked Joe just a smudge. Even their vocal styles were similar to some degree!

dang!!! the ticket prices back then

HuMpThAnG said:

dang!!! the ticket prices back then

Makes you realize we've done come a LONG way...