Timmy84 said:

Marrk said:

She's Katherine Jackson. Kind of has a history of shoving children into the limelight.

This is the same woman who alongside her husband told one of their daughters that Jack Gordon was a nice man that will look after her career not checking the man's history. The same woman who convinced Michael to do the Victory tour because Katherine was the only member of his family Michael put 100% trust in, the same woman who tried (but failed) to get Michael on that thing with the Moonies. The same woman who refused to divorce her abusive, philandering husband because of what it might do to the careers of her children (hell Joseph told Michael not to tell Katherine what he was doing behind her back but she found out eventually and still stayed with him despite two divorce proceedings).

And now she's interview whoring. Quite disappointing.

MuchLove said:

Omfg you guys are doing the absolute most, I swear! Jesus!!!!! Saying they need to be taken away from their family that they LOVE because you feel that saying 7 sentences on some inteview is exploiting them and robbing them of their childhood. STFU! I mean, should they be doing interviews, no...I don't think MIchael woul have too much cared for it. But really, the world is not going to end. These kids have family, they go to museam, amusment parks, beaches, resorts, the play all the time with their cousins. But no, none of that matters because of the one day the may take to do an interview. And they are old enough to not particpate if they don't want to. Taking them away from their own family, cha! Like really? They are FINE.

I don't recall anyone saying they should be taken away from their family at all. But if they're going to be exposed to stun-guns and exploited on TV on a regular basis by their 'guardians', well even the hardcore, old-school MJ fans are gonna be looking with the side eye.

Timmy84 said:

Marrk said:

She's Katherine Jackson. Kind of has a history of shoving children into the limelight.

This is the same woman who alongside her husband told one of their daughters that Jack Gordon was a nice man that will look after her career not checking the man's history. The same woman who convinced Michael to do the Victory tour because Katherine was the only member of his family Michael put 100% trust in, the same woman who tried (but failed) to get Michael on that thing with the Moonies. The same woman who refused to divorce her abusive, philandering husband because of what it might do to the careers of her children (hell Joseph told Michael not to tell Katherine what he was doing behind her back but she found out eventually and still stayed with him despite two divorce proceedings).

Yup.

A perfect JW.

a few years after MJ fucked that shit off, i'm fucking amazed Prince got roped in but each to their own eh?

Marrk said:

MuchLove said:

Omfg you guys are doing the absolute most, I swear! Jesus!!!!! Saying they need to be taken away from their family that they LOVE because you feel that saying 7 sentences on some inteview is exploiting them and robbing them of their childhood. STFU! I mean, should they be doing interviews, no...I don't think MIchael woul have too much cared for it. But really, the world is not going to end. These kids have family, they go to museam, amusment parks, beaches, resorts, the play all the time with their cousins. But no, none of that matters because of the one day the may take to do an interview. And they are old enough to not particpate if they don't want to. Taking them away from their own family, cha! Like really? They are FINE.

I don't recall anyone saying they should be taken away from their family at all. But if they're going to be exposed to stun-guns and exploited on TV on a regular basis by their 'guardians', well even the hardcore, old-school MJ fans are gonna be looking with the side eye.

Exactly!

smoothcriminal12 said:

Prince has a deep voice.

Well there's a good reason for that which i won't go in to.

I got a question:

It is fact that MJ fired Mr. Branca. Yet, MJ never altered his will to reflect the changes? Doesn't that seem like a massive oversight? I mean...to create the will in the first place and then to just let it be even though he was letting go of his administration. I mean his own finances are one thing, but his family's well being was on the line. If he couldn't have been bothered to change the will accordingly that's some terrible procrastination on his part, especially since how many years ago it was signed?!

or

Ok, so let's just say that he did actually change his will to reflect those changes. Where did that will go? Where is it? Where did they find this one? Did he hide it and it still hasn't been found? Was he so paranoid that he disclosed the actual location of it to no one? He would have, at least, told one of his kids or a confidant? Don't Lisa Marie Presley and LaToya kinda know who he felt was targeting him? Wouldn't he have tried to, at least, confide in one of them? Somebody?

While the last decade or so may have been a whirlwind of a mess or so, I would assume that when it came it to the future of his children he would have had his own head on a little tighter. I mean, I can understand him leaving his kids in the hands of his mom, I mean she is his mother even if he shielded himself from seeing the kind of asshole she truly was. But, not to have a proper will in place when you have children seems super ridiculous to me. At some point he would have had to consider it. He seemed to have made some questionable decisions in his own life, but for the sake of his kids, especially since he suspected he was being targeted for murder? Seems so weird...

As for the Sony/ATV thing, Gaz just posted a letter he, apparently, got from John Branca that distinctly claimed that they are not giving that catalog to Sony and that it's going to go to his children. Even if people make mistakes, I would think after spending about $47 million+ on such an investment you would try your damndest not to fuck that up. In life he could have sold it and made an absolute killing off it and been scott free. If he didn't, then he, apparently, had some kind of forsight into the future no? Even for all his financial issues I don't think MJ would be the kind of person to fuck up such a huge investment seeing how he was pretty hush hush about his finances. Even when Neverland was seeing some dark days he still managed to get an investor to go half with him to save it. He seemed like a shrewd businessman more than some seem to be giving him credit for, despite the fact that he ended up surrounding himself with some very questionable characters.

I could be wrong though. I don't know.

[Edited 2/24/11 15:48pm]

Marrk said:

smoothcriminal12 said:

Prince has a deep voice.

Well there's a good reason for that which i won't go in to.

Wait, his father has this high sissy voice and now he's going around close to sounding like Barry White. I mean, damn.

smoothcriminal12 said:

Marrk said:

Well there's a good reason for that which i won't go in to.

Wait, his father has this high sissy voice and now he's going around close to sounding like Barry White. I mean, damn.

Have you ever heard his grandfather's voice? It's more high than Michael's. I swear why did the Jacksons talk like that? Michael had a deep voice too when he used it.

smoothcriminal12 said:

Marrk said:

Well there's a good reason for that which i won't go in to.

Wait, his father has this high sissy voice and now he's going around close to sounding like Barry White. I mean, damn.

Still not going there!

I wish those kids all the best, i really do. ESPECIALLY Blanket for some reason.

Unholyalliance said:

I got a question:

It is fact that MJ fired Mr. Branca. Yet, MJ never altered his will to reflect the changes? Doesn't that seem like a massive oversight? I mean...to create the will in the first place and then to just let it be even though he was letting go of his administration. I mean his own finances are one thing, but his family's well being was on the line. If he couldn't have been bothered to change the will accordingly that's some terrible procrastination on his part, especially since how many years ago it was signed?!

or

Ok, so let's just say that he did actually change his will to reflect those changes. Where did that will go? Where is it? Where did they find this one? Did he hide it and it still hasn't been found? Was he so paranoid that he disclosed the actual location of it to no one? He would have, at least, told one of his kids or a confidant? Don't Lisa Marie Presley and LaToya kinda know who he felt was targeting him? Wouldn't he have tried to, at least, confide in one of them? Somebody?

While the last decade or so may have been a whirlwind of a mess or so, I would assume that when it came it to the future of his children he would have had his own head on a little tighter. I mean, I can understand him leaving his kids in the hands of his mom, I mean she is his mother even if he shielded himself from seeing the kind of asshole she truly was. But, not to have a proper will in place when you have children seems super ridiculous to me. At some point he would have had to consider it. He seemed to have made some questionable decisions in his own life, but for the sake of his kids, especially since he suspected he was being targeted for murder? Seems so weird...

As for the Sony/ATV thing, Gaz just posted a letter he, apparently, got from John Branca that distinctly claimed that they are not giving that catalog to Sony and that it's going to go to his children. Even if people make mistakes, I would think after spending about $47 million+ on such an investment you would try your damndest not to fuck that up. In life he could have sold it and made an absolute killing off it and been scott free. If he didn't, then he, apparently, had some kind of forsight into the future no? Even for all his financial issues I don't think MJ would be the kind of person to fuck up such a huge investment seeing how he was pretty hush hush about his finances. Even when Neverland was seeing some dark days he still managed to get an investor to go half with him to save it. He seemed like a shrewed businessman more than some seem to be giving him credit for, despite the fact that he ended up surrounding himself with some very questionable characters.

I could be wrong though. I don't know.

Yes Branca was let go by Michael once upon a time but the two remained friends and Branca acted in and on and off again capacity for Michael in the years following his dismissal. Michael had reinstated Branca as a member of the team.

Obviously MJ updating the will to include Blanket would have been perfect opportunity for him to change other matters - he chose not to.

And I have never felt that MJ would sell ATV. What people fail to mention in most discussions isn't that Sony owns half of ATV but that MJ owns half of Sony's publishing - so ATV isn't the only source of income from publishing he received. Leveraging the ATV catalogue to get a greater share of Sony publishing (one of the largest in the world) was a smart move.

The estate will endeavour to do right by Michael and protect his holding in Sony/ATV for years to come.

Marrk said:

smoothcriminal12 said:

Wait, his father has this high sissy voice and now he's going around close to sounding like Barry White. I mean, damn.

Still not going there!

I wish those kids all the best, i really do. ESPECIALLY Blanket for some reason.

My heart definitely go out to him. I think Prince and Paris do know what's up though...

Timmy84 said:

smoothcriminal12 said:

Wait, his father has this high sissy voice and now he's going around close to sounding like Barry White. I mean, damn.

Have you ever heard his grandfather's voice? It's more high than Michael's. I swear why did the Jacksons talk like that? Michael had a deep voice too when he used it.

I gave my take on the whole "MJ persona" V MJ the man a few pages back - to me I think he "put on" a show when he as Michael Jackson, and relaxed into his own more when he was Mike.

Swa said:

Timmy84 said:

Have you ever heard his grandfather's voice? It's more high than Michael's. I swear why did the Jacksons talk like that? Michael had a deep voice too when he used it.

I gave my take on the whole "MJ persona" V MJ the man a few pages back - to me I think he "put on" a show when he as Michael Jackson, and relaxed into his own more when he was Mike.

Of course.

Hollywood tonight I think will end up being a storylead video with a break down dance scene.

Based on the snippet we've seen I think the vid will climax with a "flash mob" style dance but only after we follow the story of the lead girl through her arrival in Hollywood and getting ready for her time.

Of course, I could be way off - but time will tell.

Timmy84 said:

smoothcriminal12 said:

Wait, his father has this high sissy voice and now he's going around close to sounding like Barry White. I mean, damn.

Have you ever heard his grandfather's voice? It's more high than Michael's. I swear why did the Jacksons talk like that? Michael had a deep voice too when he used it.

Their grandfather's voice is higher than Michael's? LOL. Now that, I have to see.

And Marrk, what is it? Now you've got me thinkng...

Timmy84 said:

smoothcriminal12 said:

Wait, his father has this high sissy voice and now he's going around close to sounding like Barry White. I mean, damn.

Have you ever heard his grandfather's voice? It's more high than Michael's. I swear why did the Jacksons talk like that? Michael had a deep voice too when he used it.

Why? i know why. Little Michael was so cute and got all the attention when he was little with his unbroken voice. The rest of the Jacksons took mental notes and went along with that. You can bet little Michael retained that info too into adulthood.

It's not that hard. I can switch from Darth vader to Mickey Mouse in an instant.

Marrk said:

Timmy84 said:

Have you ever heard his grandfather's voice? It's more high than Michael's. I swear why did the Jacksons talk like that? Michael had a deep voice too when he used it.

Why? i know why. Little Michael was so cute and got all the attention when he was little with his unbroken voice. The rest of the Jacksons took mental notes and went along with that. You can bet little Michael retained that info too into adulthood.

It's not that hard. I can switch from Darth vader to Mickey Mouse in an instant.

Well of course. I was just saying. My voice changes sometimes but to what I don't know, sometimes it's high, sometimes it's low, or mid-range. It changes in weird times.

Timmy84 said:

Marrk said:

Still not going there!

I wish those kids all the best, i really do. ESPECIALLY Blanket for some reason.

My heart definitely go out to him. I think Prince and Paris do know what's up though...

Uh-huh. I would hope so. Young intelligent adults they're becoming. Aint no shame there Timmy. The quicker they're away from certain people's control though, the better. Surviving the Jacksons is no easy task.

Marrk said:

Timmy84 said:

My heart definitely go out to him. I think Prince and Paris do know what's up though...

Uh-huh. I would hope so. Young intelligent adults they're becoming. Aint no shame there Timmy. The quicker they're away from certain people's control though, the better. Surviving the Jacksons is no easy task.

You can say that again!

Timmy84 said:

NMuzakNSoul said:

Just for the record we dunno how long the innerview will be till tomorrow right?

Which interview? Katherine and the MJ3's or Diana Ross'? You know she has an interview tomorrow but we don't know if Michael would be mentioned at all in Diana's.

i would think miss ross would be more respectful of michael than his own blood has been... she said a few things regarding the memorial which i thought were respectful, in respect to her not being there. they've had their ups and downs (major ones), but i really do think she loved him. he was like a son to her, and a friend.

this is actually one of my favourite images of them together:

i just love how you see the miles of experiences between them, in their older age. it's as if they definitely shared a bond michael did not have with a lot of others. it's understandable to me that he'd see value in her being the guardian of his children. she practically raised him, by default, when his own mother was not there. she was not the partying type, and she meant business, even if mothering was sort of thrown at her at the time. she taught him a lot about the business.

and you could always see the love he had for her in his eyes. again, even though they've had major battles over the years (i mean, you got two major figures here, and egos are gonna cross), i truly think the respect they had for each other was tremendous.

i always imagined, when they were both older- he in his late 50s and she in her 70s- they'd be reminiscing about things, cackling and cuttin' a rug. that always put a smile on my face.

he was always in love with her though... it's so sad to see... unrequited love is so devestating.

Marrk said:

MJJstudent said:

i saw one or two of these notes which surfaced (there's videos of them) and it's not his handwriting at all. there's another theory going around that he had a twin, and one of the twins died so there's still one of them floating around.

the thing is, michael used to go around saying janet was his twin, so perhaps the theorists mis-interpreted the 'twin' thing for that? i cannot say. but the 'twin' argument uses everything from different ears to the missing mole on his face. the mole has always been there. a lot of times it's covered with makeup or photoshopped.

Student, I think you'll find that was a chicken pox scar on his left cheek, not a mole.

thanks for the correction marrk... i always thought it was a mole. at what age did he contact the chicken pox? it's no fun to get it, i'll say that much. i got it twice. and the measles once. grrrrrrrr...

Timmy84 said:

Marrk said:

She's Katherine Jackson. Kind of has a history of shoving children into the limelight.

This is the same woman who alongside her husband told one of their daughters that Jack Gordon was a nice man that will look after her career not checking the man's history. The same woman who convinced Michael to do the Victory tour because Katherine was the only member of his family Michael put 100% trust in, the same woman who tried (but failed) to get Michael on that thing with the Moonies. The same woman who refused to divorce her abusive, philandering husband because of what it might do to the careers of her children (hell Joseph told Michael not to tell Katherine what he was doing behind her back but she found out eventually and still stayed with him despite two divorce proceedings).

THANK YOU!!! thaaaaaaaaaank you!!!

Marrk said:

smoothcriminal12 said:

Wait, his father has this high sissy voice and now he's going around close to sounding like Barry White. I mean, damn.

Still not going there!

I wish those kids all the best, i really do. ESPECIALLY Blanket for some reason.

yes indeed... yes indeed. blanket seems to be hurting the most. my heart does go to all of them though. ALL of the jackson children, being subjected to all this madness.

but yeah, michael's voice was quite deep. you saw aspects of that throughout his career. i thought the high pitch act was pretty compelling though. one of the most clever things he ever did, in terms of marketing. how he kept it up for all those years... should i thank seth riggs? i mean, i did the high pitch voice for TWO WEEKS and my throat was killing me! to do it for over 25 years, at LEAST? (W)OW!

he fooled people so much that when he did the super bowl performance, the (i believe) munich show of the HIStory tour, and the 'this is it' announcement, people either thought it was an impersonator (with the 'this is it' speech) or that he was faking the OTHER times! and i'm thinking that even THOSE times was not his real voice. come on, y'all...

Swa said:

Timmy84 said:

Have you ever heard his grandfather's voice? It's more high than Michael's. I swear why did the Jacksons talk like that? Michael had a deep voice too when he used it.

I gave my take on the whole "MJ persona" V MJ the man a few pages back - to me I think he "put on" a show when he as Michael Jackson, and relaxed into his own more when he was Mike.

yup. we all put on a show up to a point. so why wouldn't he?

Timmy84 said:

Marrk said:

Why? i know why. Little Michael was so cute and got all the attention when he was little with his unbroken voice. The rest of the Jacksons took mental notes and went along with that. You can bet little Michael retained that info too into adulthood.

It's not that hard. I can switch from Darth vader to Mickey Mouse in an instant.

Well of course. I was just saying. My voice changes sometimes but to what I don't know, sometimes it's high, sometimes it's low, or mid-range. It changes in weird times.

we all change tones, according to situations which occur. it's a bit of psychology. our voices get deeper when we want to exert some kind of authority. our voices get lower when scared, and higher when playful. i think there are variations in that, obviously. but this is the general voice psychology thing they tell you.

Unholyalliance said:

I got a question:

It is fact that MJ fired Mr. Branca. Yet, MJ never altered his will to reflect the changes? Doesn't that seem like a massive oversight? I mean...to create the will in the first place and then to just let it be even though he was letting go of his administration. I mean his own finances are one thing, but his family's well being was on the line. If he couldn't have been bothered to change the will accordingly that's some terrible procrastination on his part, especially since how many years ago it was signed?!

or

Ok, so let's just say that he did actually change his will to reflect those changes. Where did that will go? Where is it? Where did they find this one? Did he hide it and it still hasn't been found? Was he so paranoid that he disclosed the actual location of it to no one? He would have, at least, told one of his kids or a confidant? Don't Lisa Marie Presley and LaToya kinda know who he felt was targeting him? Wouldn't he have tried to, at least, confide in one of them? Somebody?

While the last decade or so may have been a whirlwind of a mess or so, I would assume that when it came it to the future of his children he would have had his own head on a little tighter. I mean, I can understand him leaving his kids in the hands of his mom, I mean she is his mother even if he shielded himself from seeing the kind of asshole she truly was. But, not to have a proper will in place when you have children seems super ridiculous to me. At some point he would have had to consider it. He seemed to have made some questionable decisions in his own life, but for the sake of his kids, especially since he suspected he was being targeted for murder? Seems so weird...

As for the Sony/ATV thing, Gaz just posted a letter he, apparently, got from John Branca that distinctly claimed that they are not giving that catalog to Sony and that it's going to go to his children. Even if people make mistakes, I would think after spending about $47 million+ on such an investment you would try your damndest not to fuck that up. In life he could have sold it and made an absolute killing off it and been scott free. If he didn't, then he, apparently, had some kind of forsight into the future no? Even for all his financial issues I don't think MJ would be the kind of person to fuck up such a huge investment seeing how he was pretty hush hush about his finances. Even when Neverland was seeing some dark days he still managed to get an investor to go half with him to save it. He seemed like a shrewd businessman more than some seem to be giving him credit for, despite the fact that he ended up surrounding himself with some very questionable characters.

I could be wrong though. I don't know.

[Edited 2/24/11 15:48pm]

there is no evidence, only speculation, that mj didn't want branca as the executor of his estate. as i mentioned before, why change the will when you're happy with it? wills don't need to be updated unless there is a *need*. if mj was happy with branca, there was no need to change his will every year. that line of b.s. was spouted by latoya and mj fans picked it up and ran with it for some crazy reason. my god, of all the people to believe, why latoya?

as swa points out, they may have had their ups and downs, but branca had nothing but good things to say about mj in an interview about a year before mj's death, where he also talked about his concern for some of the people mj had let into his life.

you're contradicting yourself; if you believe his will put his children in his mom's hands, how can you turn around and argue that he didn't have a 'proper will'? in fact, the will and trust definitely states who gets what and under what circumstances.

gaz' letter was about mijac, not atv. with regard to atv, in recent court docs the execs say they've renegotiated more favorable terms for the loans and have paid $159m toward the debt. so no, they're not thinking of selling atv any more than mj was.

a lot of people assume that mj just 'pissed' away his fortune. is it possible that he made some investments that didn't pan out, like the company with that saudi prince in '95? is it possible that he was overleveraged due to his sony contract which as i understand was meant to be a 'partnership'. is it possible that that that profit participation meant he also had to cover certain of his own expenses, like touring? i'm just saying. we don't know that mj's debt had to do with profligate spending, it could have been investments and contractual obligations that didn't pan out. i've read before that branca had advised mj not to sign the sony contract bert fields negotiated, but he took a chance and signed it anyway.

[Edited 2/24/11 16:56pm]

kibbles said:

Unholyalliance said:

I got a question:

It is fact that MJ fired Mr. Branca. Yet, MJ never altered his will to reflect the changes? Doesn't that seem like a massive oversight? I mean...to create the will in the first place and then to just let it be even though he was letting go of his administration. I mean his own finances are one thing, but his family's well being was on the line. If he couldn't have been bothered to change the will accordingly that's some terrible procrastination on his part, especially since how many years ago it was signed?!

or

Ok, so let's just say that he did actually change his will to reflect those changes. Where did that will go? Where is it? Where did they find this one? Did he hide it and it still hasn't been found? Was he so paranoid that he disclosed the actual location of it to no one? He would have, at least, told one of his kids or a confidant? Don't Lisa Marie Presley and LaToya kinda know who he felt was targeting him? Wouldn't he have tried to, at least, confide in one of them? Somebody?

While the last decade or so may have been a whirlwind of a mess or so, I would assume that when it came it to the future of his children he would have had his own head on a little tighter. I mean, I can understand him leaving his kids in the hands of his mom, I mean she is his mother even if he shielded himself from seeing the kind of asshole she truly was. But, not to have a proper will in place when you have children seems super ridiculous to me. At some point he would have had to consider it. He seemed to have made some questionable decisions in his own life, but for the sake of his kids, especially since he suspected he was being targeted for murder? Seems so weird...

As for the Sony/ATV thing, Gaz just posted a letter he, apparently, got from John Branca that distinctly claimed that they are not giving that catalog to Sony and that it's going to go to his children. Even if people make mistakes, I would think after spending about $47 million+ on such an investment you would try your damndest not to fuck that up. In life he could have sold it and made an absolute killing off it and been scott free. If he didn't, then he, apparently, had some kind of forsight into the future no? Even for all his financial issues I don't think MJ would be the kind of person to fuck up such a huge investment seeing how he was pretty hush hush about his finances. Even when Neverland was seeing some dark days he still managed to get an investor to go half with him to save it. He seemed like a shrewd businessman more than some seem to be giving him credit for, despite the fact that he ended up surrounding himself with some very questionable characters.

I could be wrong though. I don't know.

[Edited 2/24/11 15:48pm]

there is no evidence, only speculation, that mj didn't want branca as the executor of his estate. as i mentioned before, why change the will when you're happy with it? wills don't need to be updated unless there is a *need*. if mj was happy with branca, there was no need to change his will every year. that line of b.s. was spouted by latoya and mj fans picked it up and ran with it for some crazy reason. my god, of all the people to believe, why latoya?

as swa points out, they may have had their ups and downs, but branca had nothing but good things to say about mj in an interview about a year before mj's death, where he also talked about his concern for some of the people mj had let into his life.

you're contradicting yourself; if you believe his will put his children in his mom's hands, how can you turn around and argue that he didn't have a 'proper will'? in fact, the will and trust definitely states who gets what and under what circumstances.

gaz' letter was about mijac, not atv. with regard to atv, in recent court docs the execs say they've renegotiated more favorable terms for the loans and have paid $159m toward the debt. so no, they're not thinking of selling atv any more than mj was.

a lot of people assume that mj just 'pissed' away his fortune. is it possible that he made some investments that didn't pan out, like the company with that saudi prince in '95? is it possible that he was overleveraged due to his sony contract which as i understand was meant to be a 'partnership'. is it possible that that that profit participation meant he also had to cover certain of his own expenses, like touring? i'm just saying. we don't know that mj's debt had to do with profligate spending, it could have been investments and contractual obligations that didn't pan out. i've read before that branca had advised mj not to sign the sony contract bert fields negotiated, but he took a chance and signed it anyway.

[Edited 2/24/11 16:56pm]

"is it possible that that that profit participation meant he also had to cover certain of his own expenses, like touring?"

as i read some of these contracts (like the AEG one), that's EXACTLY what that meant.

as i also stated before, i happen to think michael made some terrible deals (the one with sony being one of them). also, the l.a. gear one, the kingdom one, the situation with schaffel, etc. etc. so in a funny way (if not literally), he actually DID piss away his money, by playing checkers instead of playing chess. he backed himself into a corner and could not get out.

A LOT of people had good things to say about michael in public. i don't even give that credence anymore. i mean, john landis had good stuff to say too, then sued him. people have good things to say, he has good things to say, then there's a huge lawsuit. people put on the public face,. then the affidavits come out.

and yes, at this point we have speculation; but it is also speculation that he wanted him back. the one thing i point to is branca's firing. i see no physical evidence of branca's return, i'm still questioning the situation.

branca, like a lot of people who are vampires were 'worried about the people in michael's life.' i don't give what they say about that credence either. people say this, and they proceed to perpetuate the behavior they were supposedly 'worried' about.

i have no idea what la toya's been saying. i was not aware she said anything about branca. i am just going by, again, the firing (and then lawsuit), which involved branca. branca was fired on a conflict of interest account; michael tried to get him on funneling money but there wasn't really evidence.

again, michael was notorious for not liking conflict so if branca was still there (and michael didn't want him there) i would call michael out for that.

i don't think the will was proper either. the question is, who else could he give his children to, if it had to be a relative? perhaps he felt he was yet again in a corner. in the state of california, is it legal to off the top, give your children to a non-relative? if there's no proof of abuse then i don't know. i'm sure there's a lot of red tape involved. did michael check the legalities of that? who knows.

if michael fired branca, how was he happy with him? i would think if he were fired that all names in the will would have immediately been changed following his termination. which again makes me wonder if there was another will. there is something very fishy about the whole thing.

"in recent court docs the execs say they've renegotiated more favorable terms for the loans and have paid $159m toward the debt. so no, they're not thinking of selling atv any more than mj was."

for that, i gotta say i'll believe it when i see it. i still anticipate some manipulation of mijac at least. and yes, ATV at the very most.

so again, we're on different ends of the spectrum with this one. i am coming in peace here.

MJJstudent said:

bboy87 said:

I agree. They've done very well and are doing what they can to get the debt paid off

although when it comes to handling the releases of Michael's music and videos....I have different thoughts

i responded to the main thing... i think the estate would have done much better if they capitalized off of michael's 'free agent' status. they could have learned from prince, david bowie, etc. but they just enslaved michael again to a gangster organization. how exactly is this beneficial?

the music and videos are only a portion of the full picture. this is a man we are talking about, with feelings. he's not an automaton. and to me, this man has been disrespected by what the estate is advocating, in terms of what is being done with his legacy.

just because they are doing well does not mean they have any sort of positive moral standards. they are bleeding him dry. this is where i stand on the folks of sony, the estate, AEG, cirque du soleil, the video game organizations, mr. mann, as well as his blood relatives. there's not one person publicly representing his legacy in a way i feel is benefisial to this universe. and i do not count his kids here, as i feel they are being forced to be public about their father.

i know i stand alone on this (as i do with pretty much everything else on this thread). but you know, people keep telling me to stay on and share my views. so here they are.

When it comes to major labels, there's Sony or Universal. Warner is all but gone, same for EMI and I'm not sure about the status of BMG these days.

I wouldn't say "disrespected" by the estate, I would say they haven't seen the big picture and haven't capitalized on his full potential. There's a lot they could do they haven't done and honestly, haven't thought of. For example, it seems they didn't know how high in demand the Bad Tour was.

In my opinion, the Sony deal was a smart one. Sony had ownership until 2013 and they extended it to 2017, which will all revert back to the estate afterwards.

the video game was originally Michael's idea, the estate simply finalized the deal. I think this was a great idea because the game reaches the more people. Games like Rock Band and Guitar Hero introduced people to many performers. My only issue is the selection of songs on Nintendo DS

The Cirque Du Soleil deal i not really my cup of tea but I see the reason why they did it

Republishing Moonwalk was a wonderful idea too, as many of the books that were coming out were BS. If you go to a Barnes and Noble, you won't see those books now. You see Moonwalk, Bruce Swedien's book and probably Douglas Kirkland's book

The people who I feel are pissing on his legacy are the people surrounding the family. I really saw that when Oprah did that special a couple of weeks ago. You see all leeches and snakes that were around them

smoothcriminal12 said:

Marrk said:

Well there's a good reason for that which i won't go in to.

Wait, his father has this high sissy voice and now he's going around close to sounding like Barry White. I mean, damn.

Michael's voice wasn't really high It was his stage voice. If you listen to him speaking during the Superbowl, you'll hear his real tone

Marrk said:

smoothcriminal12 said:

Wait, his father has this high sissy voice and now he's going around close to sounding like Barry White. I mean, damn.

Still not going there!

I wish those kids all the best, i really do. ESPECIALLY Blanket for some reason.

[img:$uid]http://ants.planet.ee/trap/fry%20i%20see%20what%20you%20did%20there.jpg[/img:$uid]

I see what you did there....