Reel said:

He had known Michael since they were 19 and being someone who you've been somewhat associated with for most of your career, it had to be hard. Same with Madonna. They're the Big 3 of popular music and they've always seemed....immortal in a sense
[Edited 5/27/10 2:22am]

alphastreet said:

How is it possible to respect a woman who lets her 5 years old son be exploited to the core, be abused verbally, emotionally and physically by her husband? This is a woman who let her husband go after/hunt/hound mercilessly her most famous son until the day of his death. A woman who lets her jobless, sex addict, lazy, penniless, deadbeat, exploitative and abusive kids and husband live off of her most famous son. This is a woman who manipulated/pressured Michael for Joe's and the siblings' benefit. A woman who let her sex addict husband fuck every hot woman he saw and, yet, refused to let her child Michael have any exposure to the "full of sin" world. A woman who took part in Joe's games.

Katherine loved Michael. But she loved Joe more.

bboy87 said:

Michael Jackson has always been in my life. He was already a star before I was born. Which is why his death was so traumatic for me. You would have thought that I knew the man personally. I was on a cruise when they showed the memorial of his death, and I stayed in my room and cried as I watched the Memorial.
I felt that I was robbed of a stationary figure of my childhood when Michael died.

Prince's stardom became magnified when I was like 8 (I think that song "Sexy Dancer") came out in like 78 or something. And I remember as a kid nodding my head to it. I had my first "puppy love" experience when the song "When Doves Cry" was released and I could really identify with those lyrics at like 13 years of age. "How could you just leave me standing...alone in a world so cold".

Now Madonna, I remember with full consciousness when she came on the scenes with her first release being played in NY - "Boarderline" as well as critiquing her artistic ability. I was like in the 6th grade. Funny thing is that I never thought Madonna was a really great artists, but I did think that she had some really catchy songs that either she wrote or was written for her. I have developmental milestone / landmark songs with all of the above artists. With Madonna specifically, I remember the video Premier of "Like a Virgin" was released the night before I had to take the Co-Op exams for High School, and yet I was up late at night watching that video on NY Hot Tracks. I remember that when the song Material Girl came out, I had just learned that my father had Cancer. And so on..and so on. I remember almost everything when it is paired with music. From small conversations to big time life events. Thanks for allowing me to take this trip down memory lane.

MOL said:

It all happened and we can't change it, and it made me go WTF too cause no one in this day and age would stay with someone like him.

alphastreet said:

Exactly. But she stayed with him because of her religion. So, Kate loved Joe and her religion more than she loved Michael.
[Edited 5/27/10 3:14am]

MOL said:

bboy87 said:

Have I lied?

MOL said:

I feel differently on some issues so that's why I simply posted the emoticon

http://hypebeast.com/blog...-inspired/

bboy87 said:

Everything I stated are facts. There's nothing subjective about them. So, unless you want to play the "bury our heads in the sand" game, I fail to see where, exactly, can one feel diferently. Unless, obviously, we have different values and morals. I, for instance, condone every second of a person like Joe's life. But it's just me. You can dismiss me as a hater if you want. I prefer to call myself realistic.

MOL said:

Did I say that? no. I simply said I feel differently on some issues so instead of putting words in my mouth or being defensive, just agree to disagree

Did I call you a hater for your comments? no. Now I could have when you called Michael an idiot but I didn't because I know everyone has different opinions

and please don't assume I'm playing some kind of denial game just because I have a different opinion than you
[Edited 5/27/10 3:40am]

religion makes people do things that raise your eyebrows sometimes don't they?

MOL, I could never tell by your posts if you're a fan or not, a former fan or what, cause you seem to know so much about the Jacksons for someone who claimed to not grow up on Michael yet defending him yet calling him an idiot. I am so confused.

MOL said:

many threads ago, i posted that these kids were going to be in no better position than their father, that a form of 'generational welfare' was going to continue. everyone will have their hands out to them, just like they had them out to mj, and they won't be able to escape it anymore than he was. the guilt brought to bear on them will be tremendous. this participation in this 'museum scheme' is just the beginning of their exploitation, mark my words. i'm also sad that the executors agreed to allow the family to merchandise mj's name or likeness at all. they're going to rue the day they made that decision, i think.
[Edited 5/27/10 3:50am]

alphastreet said:

I'm one of MJ's biggest fans. In my opinion, he is the greatest entertainer ever and a pure heart.

I simply despise his family.

kibbles said:

EXACTLY.

MOL said:

yeah I saw some of those posts and figured you are a fan, but I also sensed confusion towards him in some of them that's why I wondered. I've gone through feelings like that too a lot of times and wondering if all the crap we have to read about was worth it. I used to get mad at him too so many times but it was out of love and caring and for selfish reasons, like for being too goddamn nice and all LOL though that's one of the main reasons I love him

people can say that mol throws shade at joe, but here's why:

http://www.tmz.com/2010/0...te-belted/
Michael Jackson Estate -- MJ Belts Are Bogus!
Originally posted May 27th 2010 1:00 AM PDT by TMZ Staff
An extremely fancy belt commemorating Michael Jackson -- and allegedly "sanctioned" by Joe Jackson and Katherine Jackson -- can be yours for the bargain basement price of $1,500 -- problem is ... the whole thing may be illegal.
*snip*
So of course we called MJ estate lawyer Howard Weitzman, who said the belts were news to him and that the executors never authorized the sale. Weitzman says, "The Trustees of the Estate of Michael Jackson did not authorize the making or the sale of the Michael Jackson Tribute Belts." Weitzman continues, "We would never condone the use of Michael's children's signatures to promote the sale of merchandise."

*****
and there's a picture at the site of joe and katherine signing the belts.

i want someone, anyone, dare to defend this. these people are unconscienable (sp?) this is the same reason katherine and joe are sitting there with a multi-million dollar judgment against them now, and why her stipend from the estate has been attached. sick, sick, sick.
[Edited 5/27/10 4:02am]

alphastreet said:

That's exactly why I once called him an idiot. He was too nice to too many people. Arrrgggghhhhh!!!

MJ was an incredibly good person but that has drawbacks as well (he let himself be leeched).

Again, he had a pure heart and I love him. I love his sweet nature, his kind heart, his full-of-love-to-give persona. I just think he shouldn't have been so nice to some people (The Arvizos, for example).
[Edited 5/27/10 4:11am]

yeah I took jabs at him too myself but I didn't mean them, I saw it as being mad at a family member or friend, not out of hate at all, and that's what other fans didn't understand at times I let the allegations pain get to me so much cause it hurt seeing what they did to him though I was also mad he made it easy for them to accuse him. MJ is like the only one who turns me into such an emotional sap at times. Speaking of the arvizzo's, it's so unfair that Gavin still lives

I love him too much too that it's too depressing to think about, cause of what happened to him in the hands of murray, that part of this ordeal is still not sinking in at all, it feels traumatizing and I'm still crying.
[Edited 5/27/10 4:19am]

We all know that Joe is a cold ass, an asshole.


Now



.....
who's that singing human nature, I'm hearing him while typing this post....OMG A mess, A real Mess
[Edited 5/27/10 4:38am]

Ok I know that this won't be a popular opinion, but Katherine was also a victim of all of Joe's antics also. I mean she had / has polio extreme low self esteem. As a woman with like 6-8 kids where was she going to go? How would she have gotten by without "Joe's leadership" trust me, she was thinking that in her mind. That's what all dependent women do. Joe was such a force to be reconned with even Michael as an adult had phobias about Joseph. He said he became nauseaus at the Jacksons 25th anniversary reunion show or some show like that.

Folks must rememember the mindset and the time that these women were coming up. She herself allowed herself to be victimized by Joe's affairs and reported kids out of wedlock. She had the self esteem of a rock, a sunken rock with an anchor tied to it in murkey marshy water. Her esteem was worst than Tina Turner. People like Joe Jackson know how to pick their victims and Katherine was the perfect victim to keep barefoot and pregnant while he explored his own fantasies of musical stardom.

Joe Jackson is trying to use "senescence" as a defense of "not remembering ever hitting Michael". He's just plan Dirty, and I'm surprised that all of the kids dont hate his guts. Remember Jermaine in an interview saying "Michael left my mother money, and if my mother has money, my father has money". She's still a damned victim. She probably feels that since he was the motivating force behind the group he still deserves his due. Damned shame but thats the nature of dependants.

Theres a part of me that want's to quote New Jack City and say "Joe Jackson, your soul is required in hell". But that wouldn't be right, and I have no heaven nor hell to put Joe Jackson in so I won't.

yeah it was a totally different time from right now

Reel said:

Interesting analysis.

^ Word.

kibbles said:

I went to that TMZ site and saw the pictures. It is absolutely sickening. However....Michael Jackson's biological parents hardly need permission from some lawyer executor of his estate to exploit their dead son, and hock goods with false signatures of his kids. Damn shame yes.....illegal, I doubt it.

I had a strange/cool dream last night. Michael was singing "Man In The Mirror" in front of thousands of people (I'm thinking it was Bad Tour), and my mom and I were sitting backstage watching. We were literally sitting on the floor, just hanging out. Michael comes backstage during the middle of the song, and offers his hand so I can stand up. I hugged him and told him I loved him, he smiled that beautiful smile, and then he went back to singing. Later on, my mom and I, and a bunch of other fans (a lot of children) got pulled on stage for something, but I can't remember what for...

Last night I attended Alicia Keys' London concert. Before she came on they played a Prince / MJ mash of 'They Don't Really Care About Us' and 'Sign o the Times' - it sounded INCREDIBLE!

Has anyone heard or got it..???

Reel said:

Yall leave Michael Jackson's elderly parents alone! Those kids should be with their mother not a 79 and 80 year old grandparents. It's Michael Jackson fault that those kids are there, so give it a rest!!![b]
[b][Edited 5/27/10 11:27am]

MOL said:

Being nice to people doesn't make you an idiot. When you see someone like MJ being exploited for his kindness, it's because he sadly didn't see the harm in bringing people too close to him (like the Arvisos and the Chandlers). That's someone who lacks a second eye in which to analyse people and analyse situations, which makes him/her vulnerable. I would say that Michael Jackson didn't fully understand how his kindness and generosity could be misconstrued by the public (i.e opening Neverland to the public, allowing children to sleep over and use the facilities, etc). He comes from a generation when things like this were permissable and not considered to be unnatural or eccentric. I, personally, wouldn't go as far as to call him an idiot. Just saying my opinion and I mean no disrespect. However, I understand where you're coming from with your statment.