LoveGalore said:

lurker316 said:

A sex addict is simply a person with more opportunities and less will power.

I respect you and all, but this is not true and it's a dangerous misconception. I know from personal experience that the flippant comments here about it ain't accurate or even sensitive to the issue. Which it is one.

who knew all this time your username was your psychological profile confessional

We believe you believe it is real, though. It's like fibromyalgia for dudes.

[Edited 2/17/23 22:14pm]

RJOrion said:

LoveGalore said:

Lord don't give Susan Moonsie anymore idea that she should sing or dance again in her life.

To be honest, not many of Prince's female "artists/associates/jumpoffs" could sing and/or dance...the ones that could sing, had little to no vocal talent...the ones that could sing a little, couldnt/wouldnt dance Vanity couldnt sing or dance Jill Jones couldnt dance Apollonia (bless her heart) couldnt sing or dance Carmen Electra couldnt do anything Susan Moonsie couldnt sing or dance Wendy & Lisa couldnt sing or dance Robin Power couldnt rap or sing or dance Cat Glover couldnt rap or sing Sheila E couldnt sing or dance Mayte couldnt sing or rap (and her dancing is overrated) Suzannah Melvoin couldnt sing or dance Ingrid Chavez couldnt do anything but poetry Rosie Gaines wouldnt dance (although i wouldve love to have seen her dressed like Cat Glover while doing Cat Glover dances)

Exactly.

You're underselling Ingrid, though. It was more than poetry. Madonna jacked that $tyle straight to the bank and built maybe her final two bonafide classic albums around that spoken beat poetry vibe. Technically maybe your Anne Clark's what have you did it first, but Ingrid+Prince's concept of lacing it over some phat beats was most definitely influential and straight jacket to chart-topping success.

[Edited 2/17/23 22:14pm]

90% of Prince's female proteges all sound like Prince singing in his girly voice, too. This isn't mentioned enough. It's actually quite incredible. He had to go to deep lengths in the production booth to get all these different women to sound identical like that, particularly noting that no other female singers in history had a style like these before or since. Lisa, Sheila, Jill, Wendy, Apollonia, etc, etc. Sure, some screamed a little louder, some were a little more off-key than the others, but timbre-wise could be the exact same person as far as the record is concerned...

Maniiiii.

WhisperingDandelions said:

LoveGalore said:

lurker316 said:

A sex addict is simply a person with more opportunities and less will power.

I respect you and all, but this is not true and it's a dangerous misconception. I know from personal experience that the flippant comments here about it ain't accurate or even sensitive to the issue. Which it is one.

I wasn't being facetious. I genuniely believe that most men have the desire to have sex with as many women as possible.

Note that I just said they have the desire. I didn't say they act on it. There are two things that prevent them from acting on it:

First, unless the man is rich, famous or excessive handsome, most of the women he meets will not be interested in having sex with him. Some will, but most won't. Which means it's a lack of opportunity preventing him from having sex with a high number of partners, not a lack of desire.

Second, even if the mean enounters plenty of woman willing to have sex, he might refrain due to guilt or fear. He'd feel guilty if he or the woman are attached to someone else. If the woman is a co-worker, he'd fear getting in trouble and losing his jobs. Etc. Which means it's willpower preventing him from having sex with a high number of partners, not a lack of desire.

And it's normal to want to bang lots of people. The one thing religion and science agree upon is the biological imperative: procreation of the species. Millions of years of evolution have programmed us through our DNA to crave sex. The more the better to increase odds of viable offspring. Spreeding your seed, so to speak.

As with anything in psychology, a high volume of sexual partners is only a problem if it's a problem. Meaning, if you bang tons of people and there are no ill consequences, then there's nothing wrong with it. But if you bang lots of people are it starts harming your life or the lives of those your banging (e.g. you wreck your marraige, wreck her marraige, lose your job, break someone's heart, catch a disease, etc.), that's when you need to stop.

Caveat 1: This is admittledly a generalization. I'm suggesting this is true for most men. I'm not claiming it's true for all men. Of course they may exist some guys who don't fantasize about banging every woman they meet, but they're in the minority.

Caveat 2: You'll notice that I've been referring to men and not mentioned women. I'm well aware that women can be super horny too, but I think they're horniess usually manifests and plays out somewhat differently than men's.

TrivialPursuit said:

lurker316 said:

What is AMP? I've seen it mentioned a few times in this thread. Forgive my ignorance. I didn't become active in the online fan community until he passed. So I've only really been active in the Org. I'm a aware of Housequake and know it shut down its forum, but don't know that backstory.

alt.music.prince

It was a newsgroup where people posted a lot. It was a shit show part of the time. Bart was in full bitch effect there, too.
There was a newsgroup for binary files - alt.music.binaries.prince where people could upload boots, etc.
Many ISP stopped carrying their own access to newsgroups because of Napster and copyright. One usually used an app like Newsbin to grab the binary files, and just a mail app to do the posting on the regular AMP group.

I almost feel like Reddit is what newsgroup people migrated toward once newsgroups lost their popularity.

If you go on Google Groups or whatever, you can still find it. It's all porn spam at this point, but if you dig back to the late 90s and early aughts, there's plenty there.

Thanks for the explanation. I dabbled in newsgroups a bit back in the day, but wasn't a heavy user. I have a vague memory of discussing Prince on a newsgroup. It may have been AMP.

lurker316 said:

LoveGalore said:

ex addiction isn't an addiction to having sex. Sex addiction shares the same antecedents as any other addiction, with sex, cheating, porn, and other instruments as their drug of choice. I am fully aware most folks don't understand this distinction because they read the tin and think that's what it is. It isn't. Research things like SLAA, SA, and S-ANON. Hell, research WebMD.

How 'bout "no", Scott?

lurker316 said:

First, unless the man is rich, famous or excessive handsome, most of the women he meets will not be interested in having sex with him. Some will, but most won't. Which means it's a lack of opportunity preventing him from having sex with a high number of partners, not a lack of desire.

Exactly. Chris Rock's "men are only as faithful as their options" bit.

Beat homie with an ugly stick, take away his ability to spin yarns to delusional dames and suddenly addiction cured. How magical. How divine. Bringing in pr0n into the equation, c'mon, gtfo, every male goes through a pr0n binge every now and then, it doesn't make you Nick Drake.

LoveGalore said:

lurker316 said:

I wasn't being facetious. I genuniely believe that most men have the desire to have sex with as many women as possible.

Note that I just said they have the desire. I didn't say they act on it. There are two things that prevent them from acting on it:

First, unless the man is rich, famous or excessive handsome, most of the women he meets will not be interested in having sex with him. Some will, but most won't. Which means it's a lack of opportunity preventing him from having sex with a high number of partners, not a lack of desire.

Second, even if the mean enounters plenty of woman willing to have sex, he might refrain due to guilt or fear. He'd feel guilty if he or the woman are attached to someone else. If the woman is a co-worker, he'd fear getting in trouble and losing his jobs. Etc. Which means it's willpower preventing him from having sex with a high number of partners, not a lack of desire.

And it's normal to want to bang lots of people. The one thing religion and science agree upon is the biological imperative: procreation of the species. Millions of years of evolution have programmed us through our DNA to crave sex. The more the better to increase odds of viable offspring. Spreeding your seed, so to speak.

As with anything in psychology, a high volume of sexual partners is only a problem if it's a problem. Meaning, if you bang tons of people and there are no ill consequences, then there's nothing wrong with it. But if you bang lots of people are it starts harming your life or the lives of those your banging (e.g. you wreck your marraige, wreck her marraige, lose your job, break someone's heart, catch a disease, etc.), that's when you need to stop.

Caveat 1: This is admittledly a generalization. I'm suggesting this is true for most men. I'm not claiming it's true for all men. Of course they may exist some guys who don't fantasize about banging every woman they meet, but they're in the minority.

Caveat 2: You'll notice that I've been referring to men and not mentioned women. I'm well aware that women can be super horny too, but I think they're horniess usually manifests and plays out somewhat differently than men's.

Sex addiction isn't an addiction to having sex. Sex addiction shares the same antecedents as any other addiction, with sex, cheating, porn, and other instruments as their drug of choice. I am fully aware most folks don't understand this distinction because they read the tin and think that's what it is. It isn't. Research things like SLAA, SA, and S-ANON. Hell, research WebMD.

It's an interesting conversation.

What are your opinions on Prince ? he cheated on all of his women in the 80's and 90's.

paisleyparkgirl said:

PJMcGee said:

PJMcGee said:

He told Oprah he had multiple personalities, at least one of which was female.

Chris Rock tried to get him to say it was all an act, but he said it was just who he was, and broke Chris's macho heart right on camera.

Prince had courage.

He's got 2 sides, and they both friends.

PJMcGee said:

He told Oprah he had multiple personalities, at least one of which was female. Chris Rock tried to get him to say it was all an act, but he said it was just who he was, and broke Chris's macho heart right on camera. Prince had courage.

Didn't seem to bother Chris too much, he still wears his symbol necklace proudly til this day.

LoveGalore said:

PJMcGee said:

He told Oprah he had multiple personalities, at least one of which was female. Chris Rock tried to get him to say it was all an act, but he said it was just who he was, and broke Chris's macho heart right on camera. Prince had courage.

Indeed, I alluded to his lightly leaning into it before. He wasn't all macho. But he was definitely grappling with his manhood in a way that made him uncomfortable at the thought of gay men. And that usually means latent homophobia and/or misogyny. In this context, it would be an inner turmoil over how gay or unmanly it would make him seem (in large part to his black peers).

If this were the case then he would have flat out told Chris Rock that it was an act which I believe it was to a certain extent.

Being small, lightskinned with doe eyes, he knew there was no way he could compete especially when the standard in the black community for men is to be tall, dark and buff, so he had to turn what he had into assets hence the whole androgynous persona.

That's my take on it.

paisleyparkgirl said:

LoveGalore said:

paisleyparkgirl said:

If this were the case then he would have flat out told Chris Rock that it was an act which I believe it was to a certain extent.

Being small, lightskinned with doe eyes, he knew there was no way he could compete especially when the standard in the black community for men is to be tall, dark and buff, so he had to turn what he had into assets hence the whole androgynous persona.

That's my take on it.

Prince has rarely "flat out" stated anything much less his understanding of complex gender concepts. The kid barely graduated HS.

It doesn't mean he wasn't self-aware or intelligent. He strikes me as very well read.

[Edited 2/19/23 12:03pm]

paisleyparkgirl said:

LoveGalore said:

Yeah, being well spoken doesn't mean well read. And if he was so well read, I'm terrified of what microchip neck books he was reading.

I'd be more terrified of how he got them back then, because employees are voluntarily putting chips in their wrists or arms.

I will never have something put in me like that. I don't know what it could do later, kill me, cause a heart attack - on purpose? What if someone hacks it? Etc etc.

Prince was onto something. I mean, - the 411 was out there, but no one was paying attention.

Of course, Prince could also hear one thing and fucking run with it for six months or a year, then suddenly act like he never heard it at all. But he always did have this technology vs. humanity slant to his speech etc starting in the 90s. Hell, the whole idea of time being a construct, and some of what he said in the "One Song" speech started to make sense to me later.

TrivialPursuit said:

LoveGalore said:

TrivialPursuit said:

I'd be more terrified of how he got them back then, because employees are voluntarily putting chips in their wrists or arms.

I will never have something put in me like that. I don't know what it could do later, kill me, cause a heart attack - on purpose? What if someone hacks it? Etc etc.

Prince was onto something. I mean, - the 411 was out there, but no one was paying attention.

Of course, Prince could also hear one thing and fucking run with it for six months or a year, then suddenly act like he never heard it at all. But he always did have this technology vs. humanity slant to his speech etc starting in the 90s. Hell, the whole idea of time being a construct, and some of what he said in the "One Song" speech started to make sense to me later.

Prince also said chemtrails were subduing the neighborhood in the 60s and 70s, so...

He was a conspiracy theorist.

paisleyparkgirl said:

TrivialPursuit said:

LoveGalore said:

Yeah, being well spoken doesn't mean well read. And if he was so well read, I'm terrified of what microchip neck books he was reading.

Of course, Prince could also hear one thing and fucking run with it for six months or a year, then suddenly act like he never heard it at all. But he always did have this technology vs. humanity slant to his speech etc starting in the 90s. Hell, the whole idea of time being a construct, and some of what he said in the "One Song" speech started to make sense to me later.

oooh, I know that's right!

LoveGalore said:

Prince also said chemtrails were subduing the neighborhood in the 60s and 70s, so...

That was as cringey as stauros.

He acted like they were crop dusting the north side. That shit in the air had little to zero chance of falling straight down and landing on his ass.

TrivialPursuit said:

LoveGalore said:

Prince also said chemtrails were subduing the neighborhood in the 60s and 70s, so...

That was as cringey as stauros.

He acted like they were crop dusting the north side. That shit in the air had little to zero chance of falling straight down and landing on his ass.

After stauros, I don't think I sort of became immune to the cringe and just enjoyed his quirky shit.

But yeah, stauros was just... oh boy.

Prince seemed to appear at least even to Mayte to commit to her during his marriage at least until he cheated on her with Mani, when they were already having huge problems in the marriage. Wouldn't that argue against "sex addiction" if he was able to magically keep it under control for a couple years?

Every flaw in man doesn't have to be some grandiose DSM diagnosis. Sometimes maybe you just kinda suck in certain areas of life where you could be better. More often than not a person's concept of fidelity much like aggression is rooted in what examples/models they had in their upbringing.

[Edited 2/20/23 18:44pm]

WhisperingDandelions said:

paisleyparkgirl said:

LoveGalore said:

WhisperingDandelions said:

Prince seemed to appear at least even to Mayte to commit to her during his marriage at least until he cheated on her with Mani, when they were already having huge problems in the marriage. Wouldn't that argue against "sex addiction" if he was able to magically keep it under control for a couple years?

Every flaw in man doesn't have to be some grandiose DSM diagnosis. Sometimes maybe you just kinda suck in certain areas of life where you could be better. More often than not a person's concept of fidelity much like aggression is rooted in what examples/models they had in their upbringing.

[Edited 2/20/23 18:44pm]

Well you're right, it doesn't have to be a thing but somebody asked me and I gave an honest answer. I have no dog in the race so idc but it does seem striking. As for what happened during his marriage, well, like most addicts you will probably relapse. Prince relapsed into a rebound marriage that was destined to fail. Not just because rebounds are often doomed, but also because he seemed pretty far off from the sort who spent time healing these sorts of wounds.

whoah with the earnest sentiment, no "thing" in a bad way or castigation of said honesty, just a difference in takes. Your perspective is good to have and much appreciated in these type of discussions.

It's absolutely something interesting to me in the context of Prince. Because you know, discuss all we may technically yeah we don't "know" the guy know the guy obviously, but I always prefer to emphasize the fact that we do know the art... The art will tell you everything, and not even talking lyrics or words, just human emotion and sentiment. Even he said "my music speaks for me" or whatever, probably butchering the quote.

Like I'm an R. Kelly fan, and that stuff oozes more than a tinge of depraved debauchery at many times without need of lyric book or Netflix documentary. Woody Allen fan as well, he's always ultimately questioning the concept of a lack of mediator or judge in a Godless universe, whether you personally atone for any cosmic sins or are sins just figments of our own creation that if you get away with you get away with no sweat...

Anyway point is, so many Prince songs in the Emancipation era exude such, like.. If commitment could be transcribed to music notes. If devotion had an album. If fidelity wrote/produced/arranged/recorded. Like beyond simple romance ballads, love songs, whatever, it just oozes a feeling and sentiment that I've honestly never had the pleasure of witnessing so earnest in a Prince album before or since.

Like he always had his "Do Me, Baby"s, "Shhh"s, "International Lover"s etc. every album right on cue--that stuff never exuded anything more than he was trying to get in some draweyrz, "My Drawers" I think as he once so aptly put it, don't care what the lyrics said, barely even noticed. Even "Adore", probably the closest he came to hitting that kind of energy pre-Emancipation but even then not quite a ceegar in the Emancipation ballpark feeling or sentiment even if it is obviously of course a better song than anything on Emancipation.

Maybe I'm a delusional stan buying into him merely honing his loverman abilities, but I dunno. I believe in the art, and the art of Emancipation shows something in him his stuff never had before or since. And reading Mayte's book she seems to imply the same of their personal life in that moment until the birth of their son. She also flexes on the songs he wrote for her in this era for similar reasons I'm trying to articulate why they're so fantastic and unique in his catalogue.

Loong story short maybe you're right he would have relapsed, then again maybe he wouldn't.

[Edited 2/21/23 20:31pm]