AaronReturn2005 said:

I actually heard infomation about Sony buying Prince's WB catalogue in 2021, excluding Batman (his only "proper" soundtrack) for obv. reasons.

.

Hmmm.

They could redo the PR emaster thingie...

But they should employ Bernie Grundman for that and the Lovesexy deluxe kit.

udo said:

AaronReturn2005 said:

I actually heard infomation about Sony buying Prince's WB catalogue in 2021, excluding Batman (his only "proper" soundtrack) for obv. reasons.

.

Hmmm.

They could redo the PR emaster thingie...

But they should employ Bernie Grundman for that and the Lovesexy deluxe kit.

Doing some research.

"35-album deal"

23 1995-2010 albums have been issued through streaming services by Sony in 2018

The remaining 12 are presuambly all Warner-era "Prince" albums (1978-1996) excluding the four "soundtracks"

However, stuff like HitNRun, ArtOfficialAge and Plectrumelectrum are excluded from the number, and both 2014 albums were issued through Warners and HitNRun should stay on Spotify like it is.

Could that mean it's actually a "40-album deal"?

[Edited 12/7/19 15:25pm]

If there's money to be made, yes. Make no mistake -- it's all about money with the estate, not art.

FUNKNROLL said:

nayroo2002 said:

At least the 12" of "Lovesexy" should be released.

Thanks

Is there a 12" version?

Not seeing anything mentioned at PrinceVault.

.

There was a TV show in the UK in '88 called 'Behind The Beat' that had some footage of Producer Rick Neigher and Engineer Femi Jiya at the desk in Paisley working on a remix of Lovesexy.

.

They were working from a yellow legal pad containing Prince's handwritten instructions for the mix which they showed a partial shot of.

.

I do remember Lovesexy appearing on 'forthcoming' lists (in Record Collector) at the time, but that obviously never happened.

.

.

.

.

.

so hopefully Howe will look for this remix

The videos should include the Omnibus Documentary uncut.
This thing has lasted for eight minutes for far too long.
I want it all.

bonatoc said:

I want it all.

.

Would an official 'Paard van Troje' soundboard be acceptable for this set?

(i.e.: not a b00tleg remaster)

OK..

Hmm.
If the Estate does not like the amount of discs, then a DVD-ROM with FLACs can be OK as well.

I think a deluxe set will struggle for stellar out-take material - the ones I've heard like cross the line etc are fairly weak. If aiming for mass market appeal & good sales I personally would package as follows:

CD 1 - Remastered original album [obviously!]

CD 2 - Singles & 12" mixes & B-Sides

CD 3 - Any of the legenday afreshows

DVD - Remastered TV broadcast gig

The liner notes & photos from this era should in theory be stunning too.

The biggest USP I suspect for us will be hearing seeing the stunning aftershows. If I am not mistaken one of the Washington aftershows is frankly off the bloody scale ! - it's out there on bootleg of course BUT a mass audience will only need to hear one stellar show. So the only realistic way to get the volume out is via online NPG style subscription.

PURPLEIZED3121 said:

Let us not forget that almost all the album exists in alternate takes.

Even Escape has an "Alternate Version" (seems like what ended on the B side was en edit of it) that is better than what was released.

"Eye NO"’s first minimalist incarnation (not referring to "The Ball") is totally worth it, it's funky as hell.
"Positivity" is circulating in several mixes (although I'm not a fan of the Cindy C. rap portion being pasted over it), including a rough one that fits better its purpose and intent, more "violent", in-your-face than the album version.

"Anna Stesia" early incarnation, while not my cup of tea, is interesting if only for the glance it offers into Prince's creative process. It's phenomenal to realize that such a pivotal song could have gone in a different direction.

Oh, and it's about time we get instrumentals.
Although I doubt the Estate would allow them, for fear of savage sampling from hoards of musicians all over the world. But Prince as an arranger is so fascinating, and instrumental versions would emphasize his brillance and inventivity. There's so much going on.

As for the aftershows, of course!
1988 is the apex of Prince as an experimental guitarist.
What I mean by that is that you won't find another era with so much inventivity and risk-taking.
With time, his virtuosity became unstoppable (SNL’s "3121" is another apex), but after Lovesexy he seemed to return to... just being brilliant.

But the Blue Angel solos in "Anna Stesia", "I Wish U Heaven Pt. II", or "The Cross" and "Purple Rain" in Dortmund, or, of course, the Trojan Horse’s "Just My Imagination", "Still Would Stand All Time" and "Rave 2 The Joy Fantastic" have this incomprehensible quality, they shy away from standard harmony rules, they're incredibly expressive, emotive and riveting, and they're more trueful to Jazz than all the Montreux in the world.

[Edited 12/8/19 5:12am]

At http://princevault.com/in...1980)#1988 I see 11 gigs that could count as `aftershows` and such.

I see over 75 concerts at http://princevault.com/in...esexy_Tour

Hmm.

What will they choose?

Will they ever see a market for CD's of all live shows?

.

.

.

.

[Edited 12/8/19 22:21pm]

bonatoc said:

Let us not forget that almost all the album exists in alternate takes.

Even Escape has an "Alternate Version" (seems like what ended on the B side was en edit of it) that is better than what was released.

"Eye NO"’s first minimalist incarnation (not referring to "The Ball") is totally worth it, it's funky as hell.
"Positivity" is circulating in several mixes (although I'm not a fan of the Cindy C. rap portion being pasted over it), including a rough one that fits better its purpose and intent, more "violent", in-your-face than the album version.

"Anna Stesia" early incarnation, while not my cup of tea, is interesting if only for the glance it offers into Prince's creative process. It's phenomenal to realize that such a pivotal song could have gone in a different direction.

Oh, and it's about time we get instrumentals.
Although I doubt the Estate would allow them, for fear of savage sampling from hoards of musicians all over the world. But Prince as an arranger is so fascinating, and instrumental versions would emphasize his brillance and inventivity. There's so much going on.

As for the aftershows, of course!
1988 is the apex of Prince as an experimental guitarist.
What I mean by that is that you won't find another era with so much inventivity and risk-taking.
With time, his virtuosity became unstoppable (SNL’s "3121" is another apex), but after Lovesexy he seemed to return to... just being brilliant.

But the Blue Angel solos in "Anna Stesia", "I Wish U Heaven Pt. II", or "The Cross" and "Purple Rain" in Dortmund, or, of course, the Trojan Horse’s "Just My Imagination", "Still Would Stand All Time" and "Rave 2 The Joy Fantastic" have this incomprehensible quality, they shy away from standard harmony rules, they're incredibly expressive, emotive and riveting, and they're more trueful to Jazz than all the Montreux in the world.

[Edited 12/8/19 5:12am]

I've never heard of this alternate AnnaStesia

Check it out here: https://www.youtube.com/w...FR7PjPfH5M

It's really nice, IMO!

ufoclub said:

bonatoc said:

Let us not forget that almost all the album exists in alternate takes.

Even Escape has an "Alternate Version" (seems like what ended on the B side was en edit of it) that is better than what was released.

"Eye NO"’s first minimalist incarnation (not referring to "The Ball") is totally worth it, it's funky as hell.
"Positivity" is circulating in several mixes (although I'm not a fan of the Cindy C. rap portion being pasted over it), including a rough one that fits better its purpose and intent, more "violent", in-your-face than the album version.

"Anna Stesia" early incarnation, while not my cup of tea, is interesting if only for the glance it offers into Prince's creative process. It's phenomenal to realize that such a pivotal song could have gone in a different direction.

Oh, and it's about time we get instrumentals.
Although I doubt the Estate would allow them, for fear of savage sampling from hoards of musicians all over the world. But Prince as an arranger is so fascinating, and instrumental versions would emphasize his brillance and inventivity. There's so much going on.

As for the aftershows, of course!
1988 is the apex of Prince as an experimental guitarist.
What I mean by that is that you won't find another era with so much inventivity and risk-taking.
With time, his virtuosity became unstoppable (SNL’s "3121" is another apex), but after Lovesexy he seemed to return to... just being brilliant.

But the Blue Angel solos in "Anna Stesia", "I Wish U Heaven Pt. II", or "The Cross" and "Purple Rain" in Dortmund, or, of course, the Trojan Horse’s "Just My Imagination", "Still Would Stand All Time" and "Rave 2 The Joy Fantastic" have this incomprehensible quality, they shy away from standard harmony rules, they're incredibly expressive, emotive and riveting, and they're more trueful to Jazz than all the Montreux in the world.

[Edited 12/8/19 5:12am]

I've never heard of this alternate AnnaStesia

Moonbeam said:

Check it out here: https://www.youtube.com/w...FR7PjPfH5M

It's really nice, IMO!

ufoclub said:

I've never heard of this alternate AnnaStesia

oh... ha... it has come to that point in life where you are old anough and have hundreds upon hundreds of outtakes that you forget... yes, I have this somewhere. From last years leaks. I have heard the adiditonal lyrics and everything.

It is very cool.

Would love to see them try.

LoveSexy was the first Prince album mastered digitially I believe. (rather than analogue first then converted). I believe the sound suffered for it.

The multiple layers of vocals and instrument choices probably didnt help.

THis and Batman sound pretty bad in retrospect. D&P and onwards the sound got a little more organic but never really felt quite as real as the pre-88 albums.

i am afraad it Will be a clipping galore on lthe song ovesexy.

Will come with a dress-your-prince cardboard where you actually can put Him Some clothes on.

dualboot said:

Does it really need one? I have always been happy with the audio on that album. Plus, every remaster has been botched in one way or another so far. Lovesexy specifically would be a very touchy album to remaster correctly, I doubt highly anyone would get it right.

I will just accept Lovesexy and most other albums as is, the sound is representative of how Prince layed it all out at that specific time, and much like the music, the mix itself can be appreciated in its historical context as well.

emesem said:

Would love to see them try.

LoveSexy was the first Prince album mastered digitially I believe. (rather than analogue first then converted). I believe the sound suffered for it.

The multiple layers of vocals and instrument choices probably didnt help.

THis and Batman sound pretty bad in retrospect. D&P and onwards the sound got a little more organic but never really felt quite as real as the pre-88 albums.

It always boils down to the shitty digital conversion that flattened everything on the CD's.

I have fond memories of Lovesexy and Batman on analog supports.
Prince's music in the eighties was made for analog mastering, and I think Bernie Grundman nailed what Prince was all about, pushing the needles in the red.

But there's some truth about Lovesexy. Even if you get your hands an .flac files from analog sources, you need to pump out the bass an unusual amount to bring back the warmth.

But stay away from the CD's. They're a massacre.

bonatoc said:

emesem said:

Would love to see them try.

LoveSexy was the first Prince album mastered digitially I believe. (rather than analogue first then converted). I believe the sound suffered for it.

The multiple layers of vocals and instrument choices probably didnt help.

THis and Batman sound pretty bad in retrospect. D&P and onwards the sound got a little more organic but never really felt quite as real as the pre-88 albums.

It always boils down to the shitty digital conversion that flattened everything on the CD's.

I have fond memories of Lovesexy and Batman on analog supports.
Prince's music in the eighties was made for analog mastering, and I think Bernie Grundman nailed what Prince was all about, pushing the needles in the red.

But there's some truth about Lovesexy. Even if you get your hands an .flac files from analog sources, you need to pump out the bass an unusual amount to bring back the warmth.

But stay away from the CD's. They're a massacre.

Thanks for sharing this. I've struggled to explain how the quality of sound recording, not just the music, affected my enjoyment. Prince aside, it seems like the mid to late seventies was a sweet spot for studio recordings. Most have a depth, warmth, and separation of instruments that inspires me to imagine being in the room with the band. I'm clearly not a sound engineer but that all seems to have gone away in the 80s.

They remaster everything at some point if people are buying them, but I think once you get to Lovesexy, it's less about the mix and more about the Deluxe box and extra releases. Lovesexy was recorded at Paisley Park (I think the first full album recorded there?) and Prince had good equipment with no restrictions taking all the time he wanted mixing it. Unless he left behind marked up notes of things that bothered him, or someone knows he would have wanted the benefits of digital technology, or had issues with the mastering process, it gets into an ethical issue. Didn't Prince regard it as a masterpiece? I don't know, it's not my favorite of his, but it still seems wrong. Have at it with Batman or Grafiti Bridge though.

AaronReturn2005 said:

LoveGalore said:

AaronReturn2005 said: Uhhhh, it is listed on PR Deluxe as 7" b side edit. Lol.

I was simply saying that the Erotic City 7" mix should've been listed as "Erotic City (Make Love Not War Make Erotic City Come Alive) (7" B-Side Edit)" cause it was mentioned as such on the original LGC 7", but then the 12" version counts as either a regular "Extended Version" or have the same subtitle as the A-side...

If we are getting picky, the full copyrighted title of '17 Days' is '17 Days (the rain will come down, then U will have 2 choose. If U believe look 2 the dawn and U shall never lose)', but they missed it off some of the printing too.

people willl be dead by then

jfenster said:

people willl be dead by then

Positivity, ?

lavendardrummachine said:

They remaster everything at some point if people are buying them, but I think once you get to Lovesexy, it's less about the mix and more about the Deluxe box and extra releases. Lovesexy was recorded at Paisley Park (I think the first full album recorded there?) and Prince had good equipment with no restrictions taking all the time he wanted mixing it. Unless he left behind marked up notes of things that bothered him, or someone knows he would have wanted the benefits of digital technology, or had issues with the mastering process, it gets into an ethical issue. Didn't Prince regard it as a masterpiece? I don't know, it's not my favorite of his, but it still seems wrong. Have at it with Batman or Grafiti Bridge though.

I assume you know how Prince worked on a daily basis?
Restrictions, we know they were self-imposed,
even when the song was incredible.

Oh, set the mix on the Studio A SSL,
I would play with it for hours (hint, Estate, hint).
Leave just the horns and bass, solo the "BKG VCS",
we could play for days.

Lovesexy took a month,
Prince was handling business,
just launched the complex officially,
managed the protégés (hum),
wrote B-sides,
outtakes,
extendeds,
envisioned the Tour,
the clothes,
started organising The Vault (hum),
Paisley Park as a video facility shooting for The Muppets, I have Muppets in here?,
Got over a breakdown,
Got over Sheila,
Took (and pissing off) WB, the media and all the fans by surprise (who remembers the reviews published? The Black Album was announced and reviewed in selected magazines),
Got some (natural? Divine?) high from the whole anaesthetic experience,
a home in Paris,
Anna Fantastic
and All That Funk.


I don't think Prince took his time.
More like he grabbed it by the throat in 1988.
Seems like you need a tour on the BBC Omnibus.


Ethical Schmetical.
Lovesexy needs a remix à la AOA. Some digital pump.
A remix AND a remaster.

The problem since Lovesexy, is that Prince mixed like everyone had Genelecs at home.
Albums became "headphones only" albums.
Anyone who listened to Prince with a decent late eighties walkman knows what I mean.
Or with the proper headphones and amp, or a bitchy hi-fi system, in the living room.


Really listening to Prince is expensive, and LOVESEXY is, for the hear to concentrate on all the incredible overdubs, dubs, hip-hop cuts, beat-breaks, tempo changes, cold new wave sounds, warm fat bass rolls (push it up) happening all the time.
Jumping atcha.

Under perfect listening conditions, pick an instrument
and try to focus on just that one all through "Alphabet St.".
You can't. Progressing through the album it gets more expensive,
Prince gets emotional on top of it all.

"Anna Stesia" may be one complex arrangement ecstasy after the other,
they don't beat The Naked Man crying on top of his lungs,
no chorus nor reverb, cords and heart both breaking.

The 3 "Maybe" descent, it lasts a second, but it's all in there.
But it's also in everything happening around (the Blue Angel is a big deal here).

And it's the song which brings the darkness in,
another "YES" song and the album's gonna end sounding
like one naive epiphany after the other.

It's the first song where Prince shouts a blatant "Eye don't NO",
and boy as a fan you would think Prince was many beings,
but not someone going through life with uncertainties,
or without wearing the cocky self-assurance patch since Purple Rain.

A desperate "I don't know" on a joyful album that started
barely twenty minutes ago with "I know".


It takes balls to lay your own distress on tape like this.
The Seduction of Darkness,
the Redeeming of Love/Light,
and all that Blue Angel.

But also the lyrics.
And that firecamp end refrain.
And what's going on underneath that firecamp refrain.

Ten seconds of Leeds and Bliss over congas,
with a fuzzed guitar that mimicks steel drums,
is enough to make Lovesexy a masterpiece.
Every musical idea is exquisite.
It would be a blast to have all the instrumentals
in the Deluxe box. This is not music, this is a trip.
I love Prince's voice. This is the album when he's in full posession of all of his powas.
But I also want to feel the jazz of the whole thing.

So many layers, and meticulous constructions, which, paradoxically, happened live with himself.
You would think all of this gets written on a 16 bar sheets, and yes, in the end, it was so transcribed for the musicians so they could rehearse.

But no musician gets it easy thinking Prince got that fine an arranger by playing live takes only.
Lovesexy sounds so carefully arranged, every arranger imagines himself taking days to refine a riff.
But for Prince, it happens live. It may take more than one take, but it's just there in his head, he's going to approximate it, maybe nail something else, but he's not gonna seat at a piano and try shit. He's done for years that by 1988.


Really listening to Prince is a luck affair, and Lovesexy is, for the kids of the eighties whose parents buyed brand new seventies hi-fi systems in the best decade for high fidelity sound throughout the whole audio chain, from the console to your living-room speakers.

Because parents bought it, but never touched it, they were mostly in pristine state.
Generation X usually had Prince in 3D at home.
And then in the nineties, some intern butcher appears outta nowhere,
and The Mangler flattens poor Prince and his first decade albums,
taking all the juice out of it. Getting Prince some "meh" reaction whenever
you try to convince someone with a Prince's CD.

Prince got so pissed, he pushed the Loudness Wars to 11.
The Gold Experience and Exodus, the whole Dawn project,
is screaming "that's not how I sound!".

But I digress.



"Graffiti Bridge" had an incredible sound. It has aged.
But in context, when it came out, it was still one of the more
interesting, punchy, riveting sounds around.
Prince never lost his sonic edge. It changed radically,
that's why it's hard to be a consistent fan.
You have to accept the metamorphoses.

But New Jack has aged badly.


But I digress.

[Edited 1/4/20 12:42pm]