stillwaiting said:

databank said:

Yeah no sure of course I dig P's guitar, it's really not at all about that and I still fancy lots of things in the original, but overall the remake makes much more sense to me, and sort of ruined the original for me at the same time

I can't remember coming across anyone that liked the remake better, but I took much of the last 3 years off of this site, and my memory is not what it once was...Prince's death took a lot out of me. But I always promised to be honest with my opinions. I do like the remake though, and can't understand anyone that doesn't at least like both to a point, but hay, some like Jughead.

I like Jughead Def not on my Top 100 list of Prince songs but I like it

Regarding Xtra I'm definitely in a very small minority. WHich usually means that you're totally right or totally wrong

Now of course there's no right or wrong when it comes to enjoying a piece of art, but I believe the remake (particularly in its original 2011 form) to be a vastly superior achievement than the original, if only becauyse the original always seemed to me releatively anecdotic by comparison to the released 1982 material (1999, WTII, V6). But that doesn't mean by any way that I don't like the original, I still trip on it every once in a while and I'd certainly be very happy to have it with pristine sound (maybe even that'd allow me to rediscover it and revise my judgement), it's just that the song took a whole different meaning for me in 2011.

databank said:

stillwaiting said:

I can't remember coming across anyone that liked the remake better, but I took much of the last 3 years off of this site, and my memory is not what it once was...Prince's death took a lot out of me. But I always promised to be honest with my opinions. I do like the remake though, and can't understand anyone that doesn't at least like both to a point, but hay, some like Jughead.

I like Jughead Def not on my Top 100 list of Prince songs but I like it

Regarding Xtra I'm definitely in a very small minority. WHich usually means that you're totally right or totally wrong

Now of course there's no right or wrong when it comes to enjoying a piece of art, but I believe the remake (particularly in its original 2011 form) to be a vastly superior achievement than the original, if only becauyse the original always seemed to me releatively anecdotic by comparison to the released 1982 material (1999, WTII, V6). But that doesn't mean by any way that I don't like the original, I still trip on it every once in a while and I'd certainly be very happy to have it with pristine sound (maybe even that'd allow me to rediscover it and revise my judgement), it's just that the song took a whole different meaning for me in 2011.

Just for kicks, what version of "In A Large Room With No Light" do you like better? Of course, with

art, no wrong answer. And the music in Jughead is not bad, the mere fact Tony M exists, and the over the top cringe worthy "Mr Money Minder" speech ruins it for me.

stillwaiting said:

databank said:

I like Jughead Def not on my Top 100 list of Prince songs but I like it

Regarding Xtra I'm definitely in a very small minority. WHich usually means that you're totally right or totally wrong

Now of course there's no right or wrong when it comes to enjoying a piece of art, but I believe the remake (particularly in its original 2011 form) to be a vastly superior achievement than the original, if only becauyse the original always seemed to me releatively anecdotic by comparison to the released 1982 material (1999, WTII, V6). But that doesn't mean by any way that I don't like the original, I still trip on it every once in a while and I'd certainly be very happy to have it with pristine sound (maybe even that'd allow me to rediscover it and revise my judgement), it's just that the song took a whole different meaning for me in 2011.

Just for kicks, what version of "In A Large Room With No Light" do you like better?

The 2009 version, by far I mean John, Rhonda, Renato, that's my favorite Prince line-up of all times anyway, that version kicks ass.

Now the bootleg we have really sounds like shit. I may revise my judgement if we get it with pristine sound quality. It certainly was one of the most intriguing and original songs in the original batches of outtakes circa 88-91

databank said:

stillwaiting said:

Just for kicks, what version of "In A Large Room With No Light" do you like better?

The 2009 version, by far I mean John, Rhonda, Renato, that's my favorite Prince line-up of all times anyway, that version kicks ass.

Now the bootleg we have really sounds like shit. I may revise my judgement if we get it with pristine sound quality. It certainly was one of the most intriguing and original songs in the original batches of outtakes circa 88-91

.
I have a feeling you'd revise your judgement if you'd hear the original in pristine quality. (I don't have it either, sorry, I just imagine how it would sound.) I much prefer the original, the 2009 version is just a bit too polished and "smooth" for my tastes.

Kares said:

databank said:

The 2009 version, by far I mean John, Rhonda, Renato, that's my favorite Prince line-up of all times anyway, that version kicks ass.

Now the bootleg we have really sounds like shit. I may revise my judgement if we get it with pristine sound quality. It certainly was one of the most intriguing and original songs in the original batches of outtakes circa 88-91

.
I have a feeling you'd revise your judgement if you'd hear the original in pristine quality. (I don't have it either, sorry, I just imagine how it would sound.) I much prefer the original, the 2009 version is just a bit too polished and "smooth" for my tastes.

Although I don't agree with just about anything you said about the short cds, I agree with you here, the original was one of the most striking examples of the old experimental Prince coming with unique sounds nobody else in Pop music could. The remake sucks the life out of the song, but just like Xtraloveable, I like the new version, but highly prefer the old one.

stillwaiting said:

Kares said:

.
I have a feeling you'd revise your judgement if you'd hear the original in pristine quality. (I don't have it either, sorry, I just imagine how it would sound.) I much prefer the original, the 2009 version is just a bit too polished and "smooth" for my tastes.

Although I don't agree with just about anything you said about the short cds, I agree with you here, the original was one of the most striking examples of the old experimental Prince coming with unique sounds nobody else in Pop music could. The remake sucks the life out of the song, but just like Xtraloveable, I like the new version, but highly prefer the old one.

.

"Although"?
Sounds like it's a strange concept for you to accept that we can agree on certain things while disagree on others. (And we didn't even disagree on the other matter either, you just chose to see it that way only because I've introduced new considerations to your narrow-sighted argument.)

Kares said:

stillwaiting said:

Although I don't agree with just about anything you said about the short cds, I agree with you here, the original was one of the most striking examples of the old experimental Prince coming with unique sounds nobody else in Pop music could. The remake sucks the life out of the song, but just like Xtraloveable, I like the new version, but highly prefer the old one.

.

"Although"?
Sounds like it's a strange concept for you to accept that we can agree on certain things while disagree on others. (And we didn't even disagree on the other matter either, you just chose to see it that way only because I've introduced new considerations to your narrow-sighted argument.)

I can see even trying to be diplomatic with you is like trying to talk to Bart Van Halen, so just forget about it. Yes I'm narrow-sighted, and probably a buffoon too. May your enlightened soul never stoop so low to engage in any interactions with me again.

stillwaiting said:

Kares said:

.

"Although"?
Sounds like it's a strange concept for you to accept that we can agree on certain things while disagree on others. (And we didn't even disagree on the other matter either, you just chose to see it that way only because I've introduced new considerations to your narrow-sighted argument.)

I can see even trying to be diplomatic with you is like trying to talk to Bart Van Halen, so just forget about it. Yes I'm narrow-sighted, and probably a buffoon too. May your enlightened soul never stoop so low to engage in any interactions with me again.

.

Jeez, man, at least try to understand the text you're reading. And making jokes with names? Really?
If you look a bit closer you'll see I've labelled your argument (on the other thread) "narrow-sighted", not you. That is a significant difference.

i love extraloveable... up until that line.

i sing along and bounce... up until that line.

i feel joyous and happy... up until that line.

as a woman i have to do a lot of mental gymnastics to listen to that line. we all know that he specifically took that out when he did release it. i don't think it would hurt, and would probably only help, if it was taken out now. i believe he'd be crucified in today's climate, and i don't think it would be wrong.

That is wonderful news.....I wonder if they are going in reverse before they move forward. I guess we will know the answer to that if we get a Controversy Deluxe in a year or so.

us: the rape lines in extraloveable are kinda tasteless and don’t really add anything to the song (in fact they might detract from it)

some of y’all:

databank said:

PurpleSullivan said:

us: the rape lines in extraloveable are kinda tasteless and don’t really add anything to the song (in fact they might detract from it)

some of y’all:

databank said:

Oh... So you don't play them Bob George either because you don't want your friends to believe you support men shooting their wifes? And I guess you won't go watch Joker with them because, oh, wait, it's a movie about a psycopathic serial killer and you don't want to be associated with this?

Honestly all this fuss about the rape line is ridiculous. It's like the controversy recently provoked by Dire Straight's Money For Nothing, a song that features a total dummy talking nonsense in a first person narrative, and some people wanna censor the word "faggot" because in this day and age even dumb characters are now not allowed to be portrayed and speak the sort of trash they speak in real life.

Are we now gonna go back and delete anything that's not politically correct from works of art? Maybe we should start by editing all those Greek philosophers books because, hey, some of them believed slavery was a normal thing to do! And all the nazi/racist/antisemitic lines from Nazi characters in WWII movies? IDK, we don't approve of slavery, genocide, racism and all those things, so those things should never be mentioned again should they?

I really feel sad to see that after centuries of struggle by artists and intellectual for their creative and intellectual freedom, after we finallly got more or less free from religious and political oppression and censorship, we see the core of Prince fans -of all people! those same fans who cried where was their dirty Prince when he turned into a conservative JW, those same fans who made fun of the "filthy fifteen" songs list and calls for censorship in the 80's!- asking for the Estate posthumously censoring a line because it doesn't fit their views and they can't make the difference between statements and fiction anymore.

You people have no shame. You're breaking my heart

[Edited 4/28/19 2:51am]

Lust U Always has a rape line in it too, and all these songs should be released in their unedited form regardless of lyric, Prince put those words in there for a reason at that specific time, and that is what all these songs are, a snapshot in time, if we edit, erase, or hide away songs with so called trigger words, we are dishonoring the historical value of the music as well as Prince's vision at that time. If the word rape in a song leads people to believe Prince is a rapist, then they need to check themselves into a mental institution. These people also have the choice to simply not listen to the song. We also all have the choice to simply not let words effect us. It is beyond arrogance for anyone to want to have someones art edited for EVERYONE merely because they cannot personally handle a word or lyric.

Just leave it as it is, it wasn't part of his "vision" for who he was in the world or he would have released it. It's an outtake, it should be presented as such. Decent compromise would be to put a trigger warning on the cover , that's basically what Parental Advisory stickers were.

[Edited 5/2/19 9:08am]

leadline said:

I know and completely agree with that sentiment - if these songs are to be released, it should be in their full, unedited, uncensored glory. But my point is that empathy goes a long way and maybe trying to understand why someone would be uncomfortable hearing those lines (especially in the year 2019) and would rather them just gone is a far better alternative to writing back-to-back, several paragraphs long, Trump-esque rants about how these people are bigoted art terrorits lmfaoo.

Prince was a songwriter, much as the same way Stephen King writes novels.

If Prince mentions rape in a song, and causes people to think he is a rapist, does that mean that Stephen King is a mass murderer just because he writes horror novels?

I understand that Prince mostly writes in the first person, but many books have been written that way too. Doesn't mean the author does what he/she has written. It's fiction.

i feel this is really vultures picking at the carrion now. we know for sure he wouldn't want it out that way, especially with all of his female empowerment in recent years. i understand that leads to the argument that he may not want any of it out, but this is tasteless. what does the suggestion of rape give to the casual fan that may buy this? does it really enhance the song?

if it hurts people, especially sexual assault survivors, and it's an easy discard, discard it. also, who's clamoring for the rape line? what does that say about you?

i'm telling you, that's all the headlines will be - "PRINCE GLORIFIES RAPE". we don't need that dirt on his name now.

starkitty said:

i feel this is really vultures picking at the carrion now. we know for sure he wouldn't want it out that way, especially with all of his female empowerment in recent years. i understand that leads to the argument that he may not want any of it out, but this is tasteless. what does the suggestion of rape give to the casual fan that may buy this? does it really enhance the song?

if it hurts people, especially sexual assault survivors, and it's an easy discard, discard it. also, who's clamoring for the rape line? what does that say about you?

i'm telling you, that's all the headlines will be - "PRINCE GLORIFIES RAPE". we don't need that dirt on his name now.

Luckily, each listener can choose for themselves whether they would want to skip those tracks or not, it is not for any of us to dictate the listening experience of others right?

That headline will never happen, and if it ever did, so what, we all know the truth. What others think, especially those you don't even know, or those whom agendas you don't know, should have zero effect on you personally.

just droppin' in to see if we're still on the rape thing.

*exits*

IstenSzek said:

PurpleSullivan said:

us: the rape lines in extraloveable are kinda tasteless and don’t really add anything to the song (in fact they might detract from it)

some of y’all:

databank said:

Oh... So you don't play them Bob George either because you don't want your friends to believe you support men shooting their wifes? And I guess you won't go watch Joker with them because, oh, wait, it's a movie about a psycopathic serial killer and you don't want to be associated with this?

Honestly all this fuss about the rape line is ridiculous. It's like the controversy recently provoked by Dire Straight's Money For Nothing, a song that features a total dummy talking nonsense in a first person narrative, and some people wanna censor the word "faggot" because in this day and age even dumb characters are now not allowed to be portrayed and speak the sort of trash they speak in real life.

Are we now gonna go back and delete anything that's not politically correct from works of art? Maybe we should start by editing all those Greek philosophers books because, hey, some of them believed slavery was a normal thing to do! And all the nazi/racist/antisemitic lines from Nazi characters in WWII movies? IDK, we don't approve of slavery, genocide, racism and all those things, so those things should never be mentioned again should they?

I really feel sad to see that after centuries of struggle by artists and intellectual for their creative and intellectual freedom, after we finallly got more or less free from religious and political oppression and censorship, we see the core of Prince fans -of all people! those same fans who cried where was their dirty Prince when he turned into a conservative JW, those same fans who made fun of the "filthy fifteen" songs list and calls for censorship in the 80's!- asking for the Estate posthumously censoring a line because it doesn't fit their views and they can't make the difference between statements and fiction anymore.

You people have no shame. You're breaking my heart

[Edited 4/28/19 2:51am]

Don't forget the whole rant about people being 'bigots' for wanting to censor a line about rape purely out of respect and empathy for Prince fans who might not want to hear about rape in a fucking dance-pop song phew, some of these old-school fans certainly show the climate they grew up in.

It's so bizarre how the woke left has morphed into behaving how the religious right use to behave.

They say empathy and respect. What they mean is control and silence.

Strive said:

It's so bizarre how the woke left has morphed into behaving how the religious right use to behave.

They say empathy and respect. What they mean is control and silence.

love2thenines2003 said:

Nothing has been confirmed about this supposed release later this year during the Celebration at Paisley Park...so we can suspect an error or a news based on rumour with this Start Tribune article?

Yeah I am skeptical too... Some of it may hinge on how Originals and even Rave sales...(i have not ordered RAVE I have Rave remixes are not interesting to me and I have the poorly made DVD)

There are 7 'releases' lised in the story... 2 docs, the book, Rave, the 3 reissues, Orginals, and 1999...

So far 6 of them have been confirmed... just not 1999... so it is a question to be sure.

Yeah, this could be wishful thinking. There have been several reports from apparently decent sources that the tracklist for 1999 Deluxe had already been decided, which suggests that the project has at least been considered by the estate. However, this release has been teased for awhile now with no hard evidence of a forthcoming release, so I also am a bit skeptical of this scoop.

I'd love nothing more than a proper 1999 Deluxe release, as it is my favorite Prince era.

Strive said:

Strive said:

It's so bizarre how the woke left has morphed into behaving how the religious right use to behave.

They say empathy and respect. What they mean is control and silence.

Newsflash: the religious right never stopped acting that way and they sure as hell put it to use more frequently than the left

starkitty said:

i feel this is really vultures picking at the carrion now. we know for sure he wouldn't want it out that way, especially with all of his female empowerment in recent years. i understand that leads to the argument that he may not want any of it out, but this is tasteless. what does the suggestion of rape give to the casual fan that may buy this? does it really enhance the song?

if it hurts people, especially sexual assault survivors, and it's an easy discard, discard it. also, who's clamoring for the rape line? what does that say about you?

i'm telling you, that's all the headlines will be - "PRINCE GLORIFIES RAPE". we don't need that dirt on his name now.

What does it say about me?

I'm a survivor so I guess I have a say, too? Anyway survivors usually don't ask such silly censorship, one thing people who have had to rebuild themselves know is that the world is not all black or whit, you learn to deal with the shades of grey. PC bigots sometimes like to use us to get what they want but they often haven't thru the shit themselves. I don't like other people who don't know shit (not you, in general) speaking in our name, appropriating our traumas, our pain . It's upsetting .

What does it say about me? That I have respect for our artistic heritage?

That I know the difference between fiction and pamphlet?

It will have to be released one day anyway, not as a commercial object but as a historical document. What if it's released in a century? Will that be OK ? A 140 year old recording... How many centuries do we need to stop whining and look at it for what it is, a silly song not a statement?

Anyway while I'd love to see everything released, I know it's hardly possible in my lifetime and I already have that song, so I can live with it staying in the vault. What I can't accept is it being mutilated by bigots then released.

[Edited 5/4/19 10:07am]

[Edited 5/4/19 10:13am]