Do you know these people personally? After reading the report, it sounds to me like some looked the other way more than others until it got out of hand. I dont think it was as simple as "fvck that dude. Let him DIE as long as I get paid". Also, that dinner during which they mentioned him needing a rest sounded like a subtle form of intervention (sort of like slowly approaching a skittish animal.) Prince WAS music. The drugs may have enabled him to continue playing music (physically, psychologically, whatever), people relied on him, he relied on music like the air he breathed, it wasn't a simple situation. That being said, yes, enabling was happening, but that doesnt mean people wouldn't have tried to make excuses to hang around to keep an eye on him that night. The chef did talk about Kirk and Meron discussing shifts to stay with Prince. For some reason, it didn't happen. Either Prince convinced them that he was taking the rehab seriously and he would be careful. Or he fired them that night. Or he locked them out. But at one point, supposedly they were going to stay.
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Bodhitheblackdog said:
I agree totally but I think it's too much to accept for a lot of us that he was zombied-out towards the end...so we keep trying to come up with a narrative thread that comforts, explains and gives us 'closure'...whatever that will look like a few years from now. Actually, none of the people he spoke with on the phone and communicated with online that whole week mentioned anything about him being "effected". If you are talking about after taking the drugs, yes, I agree, he wouldn't have been in his right mind. | |
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I believe he is referring to PRince being paranoid about his dry cleaning having bar code labels sewn into it. He told maya that he thought people were basically trying to spy on him because they didn't just use tags. It was a bit looney. The odd part is that she told the story kind of casually. I am starting to think that oddball PRince behavior was kind of standard practice and people sometimes didn't know whether he was just being his eccentric self or if something more serious was afoot.
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SkipperLove said: Do you know these people personally? After reading the report, it sounds to me like some looked the other way more than others until it got out of hand. I dont think it was as simple as "fvck that dude. Let him DIE as long as I get paid". Also, that dinner during which they mentioned him needing a rest sounded like a subtle form of intervention (sort of like slowly approaching a skittish animal.) Prince WAS music. The drugs may have enabled him to continue playing music (physically, psychologically, whatever), people relied on him, he relied on music like the air he breathed, it wasn't a simple situation. That being said, yes, enabling was happening, but that doesnt mean people wouldn't have tried to make excuses to hang around to keep an eye on him that night. The chef did talk about Kirk and Meron discussing shifts to stay with Prince. For some reason, it didn't happen. Either Prince convinced them that he was taking the rehab seriously and he would be careful. Or he fired them that night. Or he locked them out. But at one point, supposedly they were going to stay.
If I knew any of these people personally, I'd be asking them a lot of questions. But since I don't, I'm just looking at their own words and actions. You're so right about this not being a simple situation, but, because of the result, I can't help but think it was not handled well, and that it was a train wreck waiting to happen...just my opinion. | |
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I'm confused! What does the dry cleaning barcode scenario have anything to do with JJ being concerned with the potheads Prince was keeping company at DM's memorial?Did I miss something? I am aware of both happenings, but where is the connection to what Pete is referring to? Nevermind..
[Edited 7/23/18 17:57pm] | |
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no, obviously, the story of prince saying he thought the cleaners were sewing things into his clothes for some crazy reason. | |
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I wrote about both in one of my earlier posts. ... Here is what I wrote (all clumped together), I was trying to imply that P might have at one time considered firing Meron due to not trusting her..(but it was unfortunately tied to a paranoid episode of his having nothing to do with her possible drug enabling.)
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I hear ya. I do understand. My emotions are all over the place about these people. I am going to say something controversial. I don't think anyone wanted him dead. But I do think that maybe Prince himself in some ways was a train wreck waiting to happen. I don't think he had the control over his own emotions that he thought he had, needed some therapy, was way too good at being cryptic, detached/controlling of people's access to him when he needed real help, was secretive to the point of unhealthiness, too hardworking, and relied too much on star status/eccentricity/mystery/weird charm/religion to combat any conflict.. He was a hard man to help. I was surprised he died at first due to his little-engine-that-could work ethic and quiet public persona. Now, I am starting to feel surprised that he lasted as long as he did. I feel for him and to some extent everyone around him who were confounded about him. I suspect he was just as confounded. Its hard to help a skittish man in denial or who is too scared to admit that he doesn't have control.
[Edited 7/23/18 18:26pm] | |
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With as skinny as Prince was, he was probably cold all the time.
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Goddamnit my laptop crashed now I have to type this all over again So, here we go: I think those who didn't want him dead weren't around him anymore. I think that's the sad truth here, like, I look at it this way: If one of my friends or a family member was in the same situation like Prince I wouldn't enable their addiction. I would try my best to help them and if I noticed that they don't want my help, I'd leave. Because if you stay and the only thing you do is enable the whole thing (even if you don't buy anything, just acting like nothing's wrong even if you know that the person is addicted) you are to blame too. And Kirk, Meron and Phaedra all did either buy stuff or ignore the problem as long as they got payed.
People who really care don't play the game, both my uncles are alcoholics, one of them visited us a couple days ago and he said: "Can you bring me a beer?" He doesn't drink anymore (at leadt I hope) and maybe he was joking but I was kind of mad and I said no. I would NEVER do that. He's addicted to cannabis now and that's were all his money goes. I'd never give him money because I know how he's using it.
I also hate it when some say: "Well it's hard to say no when someone struggles." Why? Why is it hard? You know exactly that giving them the drug is worse than to say no. I don't get it, you claim you care about them but you'de give them the drugs? Then you don't care, sorry but that's how I see it.
I would've left Paisley Park this would've been the right thing to do. Maybe everyone should've left to show Prince how serious it is. Maybe, if they would've left him he would've noticed that he really needs help or else no one will be there anymore. I don't know, it's too late to think about what ifs. I also think he knew that they enabled him and that's the reason they were there, he wanted it that way and when he realized that there's problem it was already too late.
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wow, some tough love here...co-sign and thanks for saying it... | |
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I think somebody ate something. There's a crumb or dot of something on the table, a reddish brown crumb directly in front of the plastic container on the right. It's shows in the video of the little kitchen. You can see it clearer on the video in the investigative files than the video on YouTube. In a previous posting, I mentioned that it might have been a cookie as a dessert, but after talking with friend who is familiar with the take-outs, I was reminded that it is usually a brownie, a small very moist brownie, about two inches square, usually in a small round container. [Edited 7/23/18 19:34pm] | |
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ThatWhiteDude said: Goddamnit my laptop crashed now I have to type this all over again So, here we go: I think those who didn't want him dead weren't around him anymore. I think that's the sad truth here, like, I look at it this way: If one of my friends or a family member was in the same situation like Prince I wouldn't enable their addiction. I would try my best to help them and if I noticed that they don't want my help, I'd leave. Because if you stay and the only thing you do is enable the whole thing (even if you don't buy anything, just acting like nothing's wrong even if you know that the person is addicted) you are to blame too. And Kirk, Meron and Phaedra all did either buy stuff or ignore the problem as long as they got payed.
People who really care don't play the game, both my uncles are alcoholics, one of them visited us a couple days ago and he said: "Can you bring me a beer?" He doesn't drink anymore (at leadt I hope) and maybe he was joking but I was kind of mad and I said no. I would NEVER do that. He's addicted to cannabis now and that's were all his money goes. I'd never give him money because I know how he's using it.
I also hate it when some say: "Well it's hard to say no when someone struggles." Why? Why is it hard? You know exactly that giving them the drug is worse than to say no. I don't get it, you claim you care about them but you'de give them the drugs? Then you don't care, sorry but that's how I see it.
I would've left Paisley Park this would've been the right thing to do. Maybe everyone should've left to show Prince how serious it is. Maybe, if they would've left him he would've noticed that he really needs help or else no one will be there anymore. I don't know, it's too late to think about what ifs. I also think he knew that they enabled him and that's the reason they were there, he wanted it that way and when he realized that there's problem it was already too late.
Can't disagree with anything either of you said. [Edited 7/24/18 7:44am] | |
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Bodhitheblackdog said:
ISLIJAG: based on your long professional experience, why do you think KJ was initially characterized as an offender??? [Edited 7/23/18 8:49am] Could it be racial that KJ was so quickly given the role of offender On the document? | |
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precioux said:
Ha, if that's the case, why not include Meron and Phaedra? | |
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[Edited 7/23/18 20:58pm] | |
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Camileyun said: precioux said:
Ha, if that's the case, why not include Meron and Phaedra? Black male has always been a convenient “go to” more so than female. He was there the doc is dated 4/21... idk just a thought. Lock the case up Quickly??? Crazy perhaps but Don’t act like it is completely unheard of. | |
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Perhaps a hair of thought might be given that direction as to why the case was Investigated so poorly. We keep questioning why the case was handled so shoddly. Just saying. | |
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A hair of thought is exactly what you need. Are you seriously playing the fucking race card here? And insinuating this investigation by Barney Fife was inept because ALL parties involved were black? Get a phucking grip already | |
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IMO, it wasn't bc Prince was black...even if his drug use was NOT known to LE...picture the scene: the deceased is emaciated, known to be secretive and eccentric, no immediately apparent signs of terminal illness (i.e. the presence of legit meds, his staff volunteering that he was under a doctors' care) the cloud of Moline, PILLS ALL AROUND...LE took it all in and it became an open and shut case...drug user OD's... [Edited 7/24/18 7:38am] | |
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So, three people wished Prince was dead. WOW, that's a bit harsh. I get how enabling is not a good way to love or care for someone. But enabling, i believe, is more of a weakness/cowardness than it is an intentional wish for harm. They may not have loved him enough or even liked/known him enough to stand up to him; but I doubt they wanted him dead. I think their feelings are more complex than that. Do you think Whitney HOuston's family (which enabled the hell out of her) actually wanted her dead. I doubt it. Family members, employees etc often convince themselves that everything will be fine or pass the buck until its too late. They love badly, but its usually not because they wish they would die. Sometimes, people get wrapped up in the celebrity of that person as well, forgetting that they are human and falliable. Everyone now talks now about Prince being so scrawny before his deathetc, but Morris Day said an interesting thing recently. He talked to Prince 3 months before he died. He said P looked pretty skinny but he said Prince was "always fragile" physically so it didn't totally occur to him until after he died. Jill Jones also saw him thin and looking find of loopy. She was concerned but she didn't run over to PP or call the police. Many people thought something was up and were probably worried/concerned but did any of them think that his time on earth was that limited. I doubt it. I think they thought his people had more time to figure it out. Morris Hayes talked about folks in Prince's inner camp calling him two days before his death concerned with a lot of the weird stuff going on where Prince's behavior was concerned. He told them that if it was that weird, its probably a bigger problem than they thought. He told them "they need to get a handle on it". He did not come back to PP though probably due to a sense of helplessness/lack of influence due to being out of P's loop.. After Prince died, he stated that he felt extremely guilty for not making the trip. I believe that people like MOrris Hayes really didn't figure that Prince would die so quickly after the issues started resurfacing. I think everyone thought they had more time to figure this stuff out and get him back on his feet or at least functional. . It turns out they were wrong.
[Edited 7/23/18 22:13pm] | |
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Don't get me wrong. I adore Prince, warts and all. He seemed like a funny, curious, brilliant, warm man in many of the descriptions of him..and I believe them. But he also was an enigma in many ways and probably hard to reach..PLus, his status and obsessive need for privacy probably would have made him a bit intimidating. I would have wanted to help him but I am not sure I would have known how to do so. Plus, his quality of life would have also been a concern, not just the length of his life..if that makes sense. Anyone seen the movie Leaving Las Vegas? Thought provoking movie .
[Edited 7/23/18 22:15pm] [Edited 7/23/18 22:34pm] | |
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Precioux: That statement came across as harsh and kind of insulting. Though I am not African-American, I do live in Oakland and what Purplefam99 states has some truth ( from my living in the milieu.) I personally do not believe it impacted the investigtion, but I can see how those with different life experiences could have a different "take". [Edited 7/23/18 22:21pm] [Edited 7/23/18 22:23pm] | |
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"Time is space spent with U" | |
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There seems to be a big thing made of the heater being left on. Would the room have been overheated if he hadn't died? Is there any possibiillty the heaters would have been switched off at some point? RIP | |
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No. | |
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Remember what Lenny Kravitz said - was it April 21 or the day after - he said in a radio interview that he thought he knew what happened. If Prince committed suicide, I don't think Lenny knew that would happen, but I believe he knew Prince was addicted, and he supposed it was a drug overdose. So it wasn't just the people in Prince's employ who knew. | |
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