Mumio said:

I see the elders selling out asap. Tyka and Omarr are younger and may not see things the same way as the elders. I have a lot of confidence in Tyka but I can not pinpoint a specific reason why. Time will tell.

Yes the older ones just want the $$ if they don't stop messing around they won't see the $$ at their age.

PennyPurple said:

Mumio said:

I see the elders selling out asap. Tyka and Omarr are younger and may not see things the same way as the elders. I have a lot of confidence in Tyka but I can not pinpoint a specific reason why. Time will tell.

Yes the older ones just want the $$ if they don't stop messing around they won't see the $$ at their age.

Yes, exactly why so much fuss over everything. Right, theEquilizer??? Chop chop!!!!

rogifan said:

On one of the Prince fan Facebook pages I saw this: I wonder if the Estate can go after something like this? There’s no selling on Facebook as the group doesn’t allow so everything is done via PM/DM (I’m guessing using PayPal or something like that). I find it sad that no one in the comments section even questioned whether it was right to make and sell these, people were just like hey how do I get one. I’ve seen people selling purple bracelets that say Purple Army or Love 4 One Another On them but as far as I know neither of those phrases were copyrighted or trademarked by Prince. Not the case with Love Symbol.

you can report this Comerica as the have Mark Monitor taking care of this stuff.

Bodhitheblackdog said:

rogifan said:

PennyPurple said: Did Prince preach as much reverence for the vault as fans & others have? Maybe he didn’t care as much about this as others do. We’ve been told he was working on making PP a museum and he left detailed instructions on how he wanted things, I have yet to hear anyone from the Estate or Iron Mountain say he left detailed instructions for vault material.

Exactly...he didn't care to preserve it even for historical purposes. So to allow his fans to believe it contained inportant things of artistic merit, as Susan Rogers attested, was rather sly of him. Would love to know what Susan Rogers thinks of the deterioration of all that work product.

Do you honestly think they carted out 20,000.00 pieces of material that was all detoriated?

He said he was not going to handle it and someone else would. What is happening someone else is handling it.

He never bragged on his vault or even brought it up in a interview. The fans made the vault out to be more then what it is. A store house for his musical ideas which most of which was never going to be releashed.

morningsong said:

rogifan said:

morningsong said:

Too much of everything else is too vague. Sounds like everything is still being assessed and is up in the air. Yes, Tyka said she's going to open a school but she didn't say PP would be a part of that goal, we are just naturally assuming it because that's the fantasy of the fans myself included. I'm sure the museum itself will stay afloat but not remain under the ownership of the heirs.


We will see which is all we can do.

This is where I disagree. If the heirs don’t own PP that means they couldn’t make a go of it. Graceland hasn’t done anything questionable and I doubt Comerica wants it. My concerns are all with the music. I can’t see how the siblings will agree on who should oversee that project. Tyka says she wants it all out there but how do we know it’s all woerthy of relese? And at this point we don’t even know who would distribute it. What a mess.

Personally..I wouldnt care if the entire Vault remained VAULTED, with the possible exception of any

unseen videos, and Live recordings of shows he has stashed away..

God Know Prince left more than enough Music for the Average person to digest in a lifetime....

But that Vault you know...

The treasure Chest within the Castle..

....Everybody wants to pick at Princes Bones too.....

Lovejunky said:

Every artist has work product which s/he never will share with the public. Prince was no different. I have live bootlegs, but I wish we could buy DVDs or Blu-Rays of his concerts. If the estate would assemble an anthology of shows, starting with the 70s and working into the Piano and A Microphone tour ... well, that would be worth every cent and then some.

rogifan said:

PennyPurple said:

Correct Bodhi, and he allowed his fans to believe several things that weren't true.

Do we know how much is damaged and how much is damaged beyond repair? I didn’t read through all the documents in detail but from what I scanned I don’t remember Comerica or Iron Mountain saying. Obviously enough was salvageable for Comerica to bring on Iron Mountain and for them to ship stuff to California.

Details about what percentage of the assets were damaged haven't been forthcoming but I can tell you that those assets that were identified as having degraded or suffered mold and water damage have been segregated from the other assets in order to protect the integrity of the remaining assets in the archive. However, since the Estate plans to primarily archive and digitize audio and video content on an as-needed basis, unfortunately, that might mean that the damaged material might sit there degrading further unless they decide to release it. A least, under the new climate-controlled conditions designed for the optimal preservation of said assets, further deterioration might be slowed down some. If I was in control, all of the segregated damaged assets would immediately be restored and digitized first and foremost because they're basically on life support (e.g. tape baking, film restoration, etc...), the other assets that are in decent shape, I would restore chronologically, or as needed after examination.

TheVaultKeeper said:

Details about what percentage of the assets were damaged haven't been forthcoming but I can tell you that those assets that were identified as having degraded or suffered mold and water damage have been segregated from the other assets in order to protect the integrity of the remaining assets in the archive. However, since the Estate plans to primarily archive and digitize audio and video content on an as-needed basis, unfortunately, that might mean that the damaged material might sit there degrading further unless they decide to release it. A least, under the new climate-controlled conditions designed for the optimal preservation of said assets, further deterioration might be slowed down some. If I was in control, all of the segregated damaged assets would immediately be restored and digitized first and foremost because they're basically on life support (e.g. tape baking, film restoration, etc...), the other assets that are in decent shape, I would restore chronologically, or as needed after examination.

Maybe right now the money can't be utilized for that purpose? We know about the huge tax bill issue, but I'd imagine there's a lot more that needs to be taken care of than just that. No idea if there's a "profit" happening yet so to speak. Hopefully at some point things will change enough that they can invest in restoration of these items.

[Edited 11/20/17 7:25am]

From sporadic reading of SNJ and McMillian's filings, the Estate will be insolvent before it is ever closed. SNJ pushed for Comerica and now they want them removed.

At first, I was in Bremer's corner, but I believe Comerica is making moves and handling the estate much better than Bremer. I am getting the impression McMillian is using SNJ as leverage to get him a foothold in the estate. If so, that is unethical and selfish.

We as fans might not like (in general) the Vault material being moved, but things are not like what they once were. The music is no longer being produced, and all we have now is what was created. I personally, think Comerica moving the items was a smart and necessary move.

I can understand the older heirs wanting to cash out. I do not think there is anything wrong with it. It is their option and right. I am not criticizing them.

I am concerned with the recent filings for the estate. It has deteriorated and I get the vibe it is because of Londell. I can be wrong.

Comerica has a handle or a vision on the tax bill and assets/future of the estate. That is my opinion from the responses and filings.

PP and the Prince legacy will all be a memory of the past and the Vault content may wind up to the highest bidder if the bickering and in fighting does not stop. Once the money runs out from the ridiculous lawyer fees, everything will be in shambles.

Surely, the heirs, can at least see that?

nelcp777 said:

From sporadic reading of SNJ and McMillian's filings, the Estate will be insolvent before it is ever closed. SNJ pushed for Comerica and now they want them removed.

At first, I was in Bremer's corner, but I believe Comerica is making moves and handling the estate much better than Bremer. I am getting the impression McMillian is using SNJ as leverage to get him a foothold in the estate. If so, that is unethical and selfish.

We as fans might not like (in general) the Vault material being moved, but things are not like what they once were. The music is no longer being produced, and all we have now is what was created. I personally, think Comerica moving the items was a smart and necessary move.

I can understand the older heirs wanting to cash out. I do not think there is anything wrong with it. It is their option and right. I am not criticizing them.

I am concerned with the recent filings for the estate. It has deteriorated and I get the vibe it is because of Londell. I can be wrong.

Comerica has a handle or a vision on the tax bill and assets/future of the estate. That is my opinion from the responses and filings.

PP and the Prince legacy will all be a memory of the past and the Vault content may wind up to the highest bidder if the bickering and in fighting does not stop. Once the money runs out from the ridiculous lawyer fees, everything will be in shambles.

Surely, the heirs, can at least see that?

Agree with most everything you say here.

The elders will have to do something before too long because they are all in their 70's and let's face it...the clock is ticking down for them. Londell is most definitely manipulating them, it's unfortunate that they don't see that. Consistently fighting with the estate administrator and the younger sibs whittles down the money aspect and wastes more time. Nothing to be done about it but watch from the sidelines.


Prince sure is making them work for every penny though

The one line that stood out for me this morning was in Sharon's declaration: they aren't getting any interim disbursements. That is what this is all about: they want money, and they want it now.

rogifan said:

morningsong said:

Too much of everything else is too vague. Sounds like everything is still being assessed and is up in the air. Yes, Tyka said she's going to open a school but she didn't say PP would be a part of that goal, we are just naturally assuming it because that's the fantasy of the fans myself included. I'm sure the museum itself will stay afloat but not remain under the ownership of the heirs.


We will see which is all we can do.

This is where I disagree. If the heirs don’t own PP that means they couldn’t make a go of it. Graceland hasn’t done anything questionable and I doubt Comerica wants it. My concerns are all with the music. I can’t see how the siblings will agree on who should oversee that project. Tyka says she wants it all out there but how do we know it’s all woerthy of relese? And at this point we don’t even know who would distribute it. What a mess.

Or they prefer to let it go and let someone else deal with the daily issues of running it. I never said Graceland wasn't handling things. As far as the music goes, right now Comerica and the courts have the final say so the heirs not agreeing with one another really isn't an issue in getting the music out there, it's getting it organized and finding out what's there and who else gets a cut of what. A lot of people have been on that payroll and they all want their due.

SNJ's Reply Memorandum is all about Lonnie. This is the first document of many filed. today

They admit they asked for Comerica to become involved but they wanted Lonnie to be a co-Representative and the Court denied that request.

Comerica has been "aggressive" with Lonnie.

"Blatantly ignoring McMillan's advice, the person with the most Prince experience...."
Ugh

"It is foolish for Comerica to turn a deaf ear to his advice.."

"..It has failed to compensate them for their valuable time and services..."

Huh?

Lonnie just go away FFS! You have cost the Estate $$$ in attorney fees in more ways than one, lawsuits and mismanagement of deals.

[Edited 11/20/17 12:33pm]

1Sasha said:

The one line that stood out for me this morning was in Sharon's declaration: they aren't getting any interim disbursements. That is what this is all about: they want money, and they want it now.

WOW, such an important observation. Can you imagine how pissed, frustrated, anxious they're getting waiting to spend Prince's money? Watching the lawyers and Graceland getting paid must sting...wonder why they can't get advances on their inheritance? Pot boiling...

PS I origionally accidentally wrote 'Graveland'...talk about a Freudian slip...

[Edited 11/20/17 10:09am]

[Edited 11/20/17 10:11am]

Bodhi, I am surprised they didn't ransack PP and start selling memorabilia ...

ISaidLifeIsJustAGame said:

SNJ's Reply Memorandum is all about Lonnie. This is the first document of many filed. today

They admit they asked for Comerica to become involved but they wanted Lonnie to be a co-Representative and the Court denied that request.

Comerica has been "aggressive" with Lonnie.

"Blatanly ignoring McMillan's advice, the person with the most Prince experience...."
Ugh

"It is foolish for Comerica to turn a deaf ear to his advice.."

"..It has failed to compensate them for their valuable time and services..."

Huh?

Lonnie just go away FFS! You have cost the Estate $$$ in attorney fees in more ways than one, lawsuits and mismanagement of deals.

But does Londell say he does not represent them as a laywer, only as a business advisor?

Maybe I read that wrong. But if he is not acting as a lawyer, what does he need access to the estate for? Would his role as a business advisor be after the estate is closed?

He is going to cause the estate to become insolvent.

On a side note, Dixon is backed into a corner.

1Sasha said:

Bodhi, I am surprised they didn't ransack PP and start selling memorabilia ...

Could be the very reason The Vault was moved 2,000 miles away.

morningsong said:

twinnies said:

WOW! Audio and video assets were transferred from Paisley Park to Iron Mountain in August and September and the process is still ongoing with the move to be completed by the end of November? Just HOW MUCH material did Prince leave? I sure would love to hear all of this unreleased music and see all of these unreleased videos some day. Prince was a genius and had so much to give. Obviously, he wanted it to be seen and heard.

The last I read, there were over 20,000 audio and video recordings. You have to remember that this would be EVERY concert (once he started earning real money and could afford the employees), every take of every song, every half-finished song, every finished song that didn't land on an album or release.

"The vault" had overflowed years ago. That's why things were in boxes in the office and in those four warehouse buildings he owned.

Prince kept everything. Stage sets, equipment, lighting, old cables. Everything.

morningsong said:

So everything wasn't inside a locked vault and now all these people all over PP.

The only people who have access to those areas are the archivists.

rogifan said:

On one of the Prince fan Facebook pages I saw this: I wonder if the Estate can go after something like this? There’s no selling on Facebook as the group doesn’t allow so everything is done via PM/DM (I’m guessing using PayPal or something like that). I find it sad that no one in the comments section even questioned whether it was right to make and sell these, people were just like hey how do I get one. I’ve seen people selling purple bracelets that say Purple Army or Love 4 One Another On them but as far as I know neither of those phrases were copyrighted or trademarked by Prince. Not the case with Love Symbol.

I'm tired of being the "mean person" who points out the trademark and copyright violations. So I just send them to Comerica and UMG./

Sorry, this isn't "crafters". This is Chinese garbage posing as such.

ISaidLifeIsJustAGame said:

1Sasha said:

Bodhi, I am surprised they didn't ransack PP and start selling memorabilia ...

Could be the very reason The Vault was moved 2,000 miles away.

Ditto.

1Sasha said:

ISaidLifeIsJustAGame said:

Could be the very reason The Vault was moved 2,000 miles away.

Ditto.

ISaidLifeIsJustAGame said:

SNJ's Reply Memorandum is all about Lonnie. This is the first document of many filed. today

They admit they asked for Comerica to become involved but they wanted Lonnie to be a co-Representative and the Court denied that request.

Comerica has been "aggressive" with Lonnie.

"Blatanly ignoring McMillan's advice, the person with the most Prince experience...."
Ugh

"It is foolish for Comerica to turn a deaf ear to his advice.."

"..It has failed to compensate them for their valuable time and services..."

Huh?

Lonnie just go away FFS! You have cost the Estate $$$ in attorney fees in more ways than one, lawsuits and mismanagement of deals.

It's true!

1Sasha said:

1Sasha said:

Bodhi, I am surprised they didn't ransack PP and start selling memorabilia ...

1Sasha, After one of the older sisters put out the recording of P's father and used the PP studio to do so, many people commented. I thought ok.... the facility is there, maybe/probably no big deal.

.

I know they said the vault storage wasn't proper, mold and dampness ..... but after all this time you would think an a/c and dehumidifier would the least they could have done.

.

But when they announced the 20K recordings being moved, it made me wonder if the sibs were eyeing the vault contents and there were whispers of them releasing stuff on thier own ... which may consequently have lead the SA to move contents to iron mt.

.

Anyway the timing made me take notice. Why wait all this time? Of course I don't really know.

.

~~DD55

1Sasha said:

The one line that stood out for me this morning was in Sharon's declaration: they aren't getting any interim disbursements. That is what this is all about: they want money, and they want it now.

Maybe one of the reasons he heirs aren't receiving any interim disbursements is because SNJ keep fighting Comerica at every turn. Sometimes, people need to get out of their own way.