I agree that it seems unlikely that Prince ODed on legit percocet on the plane. My guess is that he ODed on the counterfeit stuff.

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The only info we have about the plane OD from witnesses cited in the warrant, and those are hardly consistent. Only one warrant mentions percocet specifically, and that was in the context of what Kirk allegedly told Moline doctors, not the detectives: "The Doctor who treated Prince documented Prince as suffereing from an opiate overdose, however, Prince refused treatment at the hospital. Johnson told hospital staff Prince may have taken Percocet."

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None of the warrants cite anyone telling detectives directly that Prince took percocet, only that Prince admitted to taking 1-2 “pain pills"" or that the plane "had to make an emergency landing because of health concerns."

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The gist for me is that none of these witnesses were necessarily providing complete and accurate info about the nature of his first OD, either because they honestly didn't know what he took or because they were being intentionally vague (and that might include Prince himself).

precioux said:

moonsister said:

precioux said: A week earlier he had od'd on Kirk's scrip, that might have put him off those particular pills.

yeah, but here's the thing...in order to OD on legit pain pills (and nothing else), you have to take an a$$load of them (especially if your body has gained tolerance...yes, LR, I know you hate that word)...being there were pills leftover at PP presumeably from the KJ script, I highly doubt it.

[Edited 7/17/17 14:45pm]

moonsister said:

purplefam99 said:

disch said:

I found the Percocet quote in the warrant; it's quoting what Kirk supposedly told the Moline doctors, not what he told detectives:

"The Doctor who treated Prince documented Prince as suffereing from an opiate overdose, however, Prince refused treatment at the hospital. Johnson told hospital staff Prince may have taken Percocet."

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As for why he did what he did (including fatally ODing), I don't know, but one reason for the plane OD might be because he was addicted to opioids and he liked the typical effect of his illicit drugs. Who knows, one theory I've put out there before is that Kirk was trying to help him get off the illicit stuff by getting him some legit Percocet but Prince wasn't really on board with that idea. I'm sure we can all speculate and but if you start with the idea that he was physically addicted certain behaviors make a little more sense.

moonsister said:

disch said:

I agree that it seems unlikely that Prince ODed on legit percocet on the plane.

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The only info we have about that OD from witnesses cited in the warrant, and those are hardly consistent. One warrant says only that "according to one of the witnesses interviewed, Prince admitted to taking 1-2 “pain pills."" Another warrant says only that the plane "had to make an emergency landing because of health concerns." I'm pretty sure that somewhere in the warrant Kirk is quoted as speculating that Prince took Percocet but I can't find that exact quote.

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The gist for me is that none of these witnesses were necessarily provide complete and accurate info about the nature of his first OD, either because they honestly didn't know what he took or because they were being intentionally vague (and that might include Prince himself).

So you think Kirk got Percocet for Prince on the day of Prince's first overdose, Kirk answered "probably Percocet" when he was asked what Prince took, but Prince took illicit Vicodin on the plane? If he had the Vicodin with him on this trip why did he need Kirk to get him Percocet?

disch said:

Superconductor said:

moonsister said:

precioux said:

Yes, you are making sense-but according to the warrant (and I'm assuming the date on the bottle itself) that KJ was seen and the pills were dispensed (as per bottle) on 4/7/16,no?

I know you're not asking me directly but. . . On 4/7 Dr S prescribed Kirk vitamin D and ondansetron, an anti nausea drug.

Ondansteron is a drug given to HIV/AIDS and cancer patients to help control nausea... Prince obviously had a very serious pre-existing condition...which corroborates the Chef's stories about P not being able to keep food down, and MAYBE even the stories that P may have had AIDS and was getting HIV/AIDS meds at the Walgreens...

RJOrion said:

And just to be superclear: what was written on the KJ prescription bottles didn't necessarily match the drugs that were found in those bottles. The warrant says one KJ bottle was for vitamin D2 and did contain Vitamin D pills (the green "194" ones) along with 8 "orange pills"; the other bottle said ondansetron but it contained pills inscribed A-349 (i.e., Percocet -- real or counterfeit, don't know) along with 1 "orange pill" inscribed "#8" -- which is in line with ondansetron.

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So it's unclear exactly what was in those bottles whenever Prince got hold of them.

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Edit to add: it looks like ondansetron is also used to treat opioid withdrawal symptoms. From this 2009 article:http://news.stanford.edu/...21809.html

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"Scientists at the School of Medicine have discovered that a commonly available non-addictive drug can prevent symptoms of withdrawal from opioids with little likelihood of serious side effects. The drug, ondansetron, which is already approved to treat nausea and vomiting, appears to avoid some of the problems that accompany existing treatments for addiction to these powerful painkillers, the scientists said."

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Lots of other info came up on google re: ondansetron as an opioid withdrawal treatment, such as:

https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih....MC4107861/ http://www.jpain.org/arti...5/abstract

precioux said:

"Some pills that were analyzed contained fentanyl,lidocaine and U-4770-a synthetic drug that is eight times more powerful than morphine. Authorities also found a prescription bottle in someone else's name (KJ) that contained 10 oxycodone pills. The official said Prince had many of these pills with him on April 15th when the airplane he was on made an emergency stop in Moline, Ill. Prince was given two does of Narcan....Dr.Schulenberg saw Prince on April 7 and again on April 20. The autopsy report also shows Prince had diazepam, lidocaine and hydrocone acids in his body...lidocaine is a local anesthetic. *Note: Prince was seen 4/7 and 4/20. You can not "call in" a script for opioids-you HAVE to be seen by a physician-it's the law. The warrant states as much in post #535 Also-read above-lidocaine was found IN HIS BODY (ingested)-it was not used as indicated, as I stated, it is not prescribed for oral consumption Edit to add findings ^^^^ IIRC, the ME report only listed a fatal overdose of fentanyl, the illicit pills were made up of Fentanyl,U4770 and Lidocaine. The other substances found were "hydrocodone acids" (which is neither fentanyl,nor oxycodone) as well as benzodiazepines (could be Xanax,Valuim)..going from memory here. I will try to find the link. Superconductor said:

Where did it say in the ME report the lidocaine was in the fatal pill? Wasn't it found in his system together with other drugs plus the fentanyl laced pill?

[Edited 7/17/17 15:33pm]

[Edited 7/17/17 16:12pm]

disch said:

But what if eradicating pain wasn't the main priority, but stopping opioid withdrawal symptoms was?

precioux said:

Agreed: " one of the pill bottles, a vitamin D bottle, was found to contain the controlled substance Ondanselron Hydrochloride, A second prescription bottle, said to contain Ondasetron, was found to contain the controlled substance Acetaminophen/oxycodone hydrochloride. THE DATE THOSE MEDICATIONS WERE PRESCRIBED TO JOHNSON *ACCORDING TO THE PILL BOTTLES*, was 4/7/16. The medications were prescribed by Dr. Schulenberg. It's crazy that the meds were switched from original bottles, but also let's be clear that the oxycodone prescribed were present. Again, if Prince was not aware that there were illicit pills,why grab the less potent one if eradicating pain was the main priority?? It's not computing disch said:

And just to be superclear: what was written on the KJ prescription bottles didn't necessarily match the drugs that were found in those bottles. The warrant says one KJ bottle was for vitamin D2 and did contain Vitamin D pills (the green "194" ones) along with 8 "orange pills"; the other bottle said onadestron but it contained pills inscribed A-349 (i.e., Percocet -- real or counterfeit, don't know) along with 1 "orange pill" inscribed "#8."

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So it's unclear exactly what was in those bottles whenever Prince got hold of them.

The warrant states they checked the Minnesota Prescription Registry and Kirk was given a script for oxy on April 14, 2016.

This was the only prescription that found under Kirk's name for the prior 12 months.

precioux said:

Agreed: " one of the pill bottles, a vitamin D bottle, was found to contain the controlled substance Ondanselron Hydrochloride, A second prescription bottle, said to contain Ondasetron, was found to contain the controlled substance Acetaminophen/oxycodone hydrochloride. THE DATE THOSE MEDICATIONS WERE PRESCRIBED TO JOHNSON *ACCORDING TO THE PILL BOTTLES*, was 4/7/16. The medications were prescribed by Dr. Schulenberg. It's crazy that the meds were switched from original bottles, but also let's be clear that the oxycodone prescribed were present. Again, if Prince was not aware that there were illicit pills,why grab the less potent one if eradicating pain was the main priority?? It's not computing disch said:

And just to be superclear: what was written on the KJ prescription bottles didn't necessarily match the drugs that were found in those bottles. The warrant says one KJ bottle was for vitamin D2 and did contain Vitamin D pills (the green "194" ones) along with 8 "orange pills"; the other bottle said onadestron but it contained pills inscribed A-349 (i.e., Percocet -- real or counterfeit, don't know) along with 1 "orange pill" inscribed "#8."

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So it's unclear exactly what was in those bottles whenever Prince got hold of them.

.

Again, if Prince was not aware that there were illicit pills,why grab the less potent one if eradicating pain was the main priority?? It's not computing.

.

To the bolded: Perhaps he wanted to take the less-potent drug so as to not take too much or overdose.

.

edit, typo

[Edited 7/17/17 16:22pm]

Was that the only script or the only controlled-substance script, do you know (I can't find the reference in the warrants)?

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What I'm thinking now is that the medication Prince was picking up at Walgreens on April 20 was the Ondansetron, prescribed under Kirk's name (which is why Kirk was the one in the store getting it). The warrant IDs Kirk's Vitamin D bottle as from CVS but doesn't mention a store label on the other bottle. Perhaps Dr S prescribed Ondansetron for withdrawal symptoms when he saw Prince that day. I don't think Ondansetron is controlled but i'm not sure its status.

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Unless it says somewhere that there's a different date on the Ondansetron bottle?

ISaidLifeIsJustAGame said:

The warrant states they checked the Minnesota Prescription Registry and Kirk was given a script for oxy on April 14, 2016.

This was the only prescription that found under Kirk's name for the prior 12 months.

[Edited 7/17/17 16:34pm]

We don't know, how many pills were prescribed in that script that KJ obtained.

Deep gratitude to everyone on this thread working so hard to get as close as possible to the truth of why we lost Prince too soon. The love expressed in all these efforts is palpable, powerful and ultimately will provide the balm for our collective grief. Blessings.

disch said:

Was that the only script or the only controlled-substance script, do you know (I can't find the reference in the warrants)?

-

What I'm thinking now is that the medication Prince was picking up at Walgreens on April 20 was the Ondansetron, prescribed under Kirk's name (which is why Kirk was the one in the store getting it). The warrant IDs Kirk's Vitamin D bottle as from CVS but doesn't mention a store label on the other bottle. Perhaps Dr S prescribed Ondansetron for withdrawal symptoms when he saw Prince that day. I don't think Ondansetron is controlled but i'm not sure its status.

-

Unless it says somewhere that there's a different date on the Ondansetron bottle?

ISaidLifeIsJustAGame said:

The warrant states they checked the Minnesota Prescription Registry and Kirk was given a script for oxy on April 14, 2016.

This was the only prescription that found under Kirk's name for the prior 12 months.

[Edited 7/17/17 16:34pm]

I am assuming it is the only controlled script under Kirk's name.

Disch, the second bottle was also from CVS.

Ah you're right, ISaid -- the warrant says both bottles were from CVS.

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The walgreens pickup remains a mystery...

ISaidLifeIsJustAGame said:

disch said:

Was that the only script or the only controlled-substance script, do you know (I can't find the reference in the warrants)?

-

What I'm thinking now is that the medication Prince was picking up at Walgreens on April 20 was the Ondansetron, prescribed under Kirk's name (which is why Kirk was the one in the store getting it). The warrant IDs Kirk's Vitamin D bottle as from CVS but doesn't mention a store label on the other bottle. Perhaps Dr S prescribed Ondansetron for withdrawal symptoms when he saw Prince that day. I don't think Ondansetron is controlled but i'm not sure its status.

-

Unless it says somewhere that there's a different date on the Ondansetron bottle?

[Edited 7/17/17 16:34pm]

I am assuming it is the only controlled script under Kirk's name.

Disch, the second bottle was also from CVS.

Dibblekins said:

precioux said:

I came across this interview with Dr. Drew. It's from last year, so some of his information is not accurate; however, he does provide some very good insight on what may have happened to Prince.

.

He explains that Opiates only makes pain worse. The key is for these doctor's to wean their patients off them as quickly as possible.

.

He also states that he believes Prince was "severely dependent", and not an addict.

.

He also says that usually when someone dies of a Fentanyl overdose; they take the pills, then go to bed and die in their sleep. The fact that Prince was found unresponsive in the elevator is still perplexing to many.

.

Anyways, around the 5:00 mark is when Dr. Drew starts talking about Prince. It starts breaking-up towards the end, but you will get the gist of it.

.

http://wgnradio.com/2016/...-our-time/

disch said:

tishal said:

Lidocaine can be swished/gargled in the mouth to numb the throat and mouth. Prince's chef said he had throat pain. It makes total sense that he gargled with it. Even I've swallowed some when I've gargled. It's harmless like that, but still absorbed in your tissue.

That's true. And maybe that was the script from Walgreen's.

I've mentioned this before, maybe it could be throat or stomach cancer. ?? And the reason I say this is because my Dad, was having heartburn, and thought nothing of it, then he started having trouble eating, and swallowing, he went to the dr, had the scope done he had stomach cancer and less then 2 weeks later, died. He couldn't eat, he couldn't drink, it hurt to swallow. All of the symptoms the chefs said that Prince had, my dad had the same symptoms.

disch said:

ISaidLifeIsJustAGame said:

tishal said:

ISaidLifeIsJustAGame said:

precioux said:

disch said: