laurarichardson said:

prizefight said:

just one scar on one hip. i think his other hip went out

I thought he had one scar down his right leg and another going down his left and a scar from his knee down to his ankle. I will have to go back and check. It just seemed pretty extensive too me.

In addtion, Scott Baldwin his engineer said Prince was in a lot of pain during the Musicology tour. Kind of takes me back to him being dependent on these meds while eveyone just skips over his medical problems.

I can so believe that....During Musicology is when he started to look "Different"

I thougt that then and now when I see Pictures from that that time, around Mani , I see it very clearly.

He was needing pain meds at that time for sure...I bet Manuella knows that too

Lovejunky said:

Pic from Minn lynx game in the Oct of 2015. How long would a withdrawal take place and how would one get all the way to Australia without vomiting the whole flight. How would one stay on the stage to perform without running off. Why would someone going thur withdrawals add extra shows and stay longer than planned.

1Sasha said:

I wasn't on the org then, but I recall seeing this photo elsewhere. Maybe it's just me today, but this is all a miserable state of affairs. I am fighting for his truth, but will it ever come out? I think it is important that it does, but I just don't know if it will.

Laura, one thing you've shown in your literally thousands of posts on this topic: Your knowledge opioid/drug use or abuse, depenedence, addiction, withdrawal, etc. is incredibly limited. You've made it clear you have no interest in learning anything about these topics, and you've dismissed (usually in a flurry of obscenities) those who share personal experiences or info they've found elsewhere.

-

These topics have been discussed so many times here and at this point (and I know you've seen these discussions, as I doubt you spend more than an hour at a time away from this site). There's no need for you keep posting the same things over and over again.

-

And just to reempt you: We don't know what his state of withdrawal or drug usage was at any of the dates you specify. We don't know what he was feeling or experiencing at any given day. You've been the first to claim he was suffering untreatably extreme physical pain (along with various other possibly terminal diseases) in the final months of his life, so by your "logic" it seems just as (or more) unlikely he could make it through these various activities with those struggles as with an opioid dependency.

laurarichardson said:

Pic from Minn lynx game in the Oct of 2015. How long would a withdrawal take place and how would one get all the way to Australia without vomiting the whole flight. How would one stay on the stage to perform without running off. Why would someone going thur withdrawals add extra shows and stay longer than planned.

1Sasha said:

I wasn't on the org then, but I recall seeing this photo elsewhere. Maybe it's just me today, but this is all a miserable state of affairs. I am fighting for his truth, but will it ever come out? I think it is important that it does, but I just don't know if it will.

1Sasha said:

I wasn't on the org then, but I recall seeing this photo elsewhere. Maybe it's just me today, but this is all a miserable state of affairs. I am fighting for his truth, but will it ever come out? I think it is important that it does, but I just don't know if it will.

There may be forces that dont want to reveal the truth about Prince and his death but I cant see what anyone has to gain by concealing anything. The only person I can see stopping this investigation from going forward is the person responsible for giving Prince pills cos theres no way he/she wants to give themself away. In any case as Ive stated before I think Prince was ready to go and he left on his terms by his decision,no matter what CCSO think about their homocide investigation. Lets say CCSO find the person,then what,lets say they give the person the maximum penalty,then what.

........................................................

RIP P

I know. I hear you.

I have read plenty about opiod use. It is your arrogance that makes you think you are an authority on this subject. Once again someone projecting and acting as if information is not obtainable but anywhere else then on the Org.

I am asking questions and I was not actually expecting answer from you at all. I have never claimed to know his state of withdrawal and that is the reason I am asking the question. I do know what the facts are. 1) It is in the search warrants that he was seeing Dr. S for withdrawals and that this was recent. 2) My question is when did it start doing the tour or back in the fall.

3) The chefs said he was fine until January when he started to complain about stomach pain and thoart problems yet these problems had no effect on his albilty to sing and perform until April.

4) There is a long laundry list of things that do not make sense.

My questions are devired from facts that we know about the stituation. Many things to do not add up to simple drug addiction. I have never claimed to have all the answeres but I know what does not make sense and certain facts back up what I am saying. You are so stuck on one narrative and one narrative only you just will not entertain anything else and that is your choice.

disch said:

Laura, one thing you've shown in your literally thousands of posts on this topic: Your knowledge opioid/drug use or abuse, depenedence, addiction, withdrawal, etc. is incredibly limited. You've made it clear you have no interest in learning anything about these topics, and you've dismissed (usually in a flurry of obscenities) those who share personal experiences or info they've found elsewhere.

-

These topics have been discussed so many times here and at this point (and I know you've seen these discussions, as I doubt you spend more than an hour at a time away from this site). There's no need for you keep posting the same things over and over again.

-

And just to reempt you: We don't know what his state of withdrawal or drug usage was at any of the dates you specify. We don't know what he was feeling or experiencing at any given day. You've been the first to claim he was suffering untreatably extreme physical pain (along with various other possibly terminal diseases) in the final months of his life, so by your "logic" it seems just as (or more) unlikely he could make it through these various activities with those struggles as with an opioid dependency.

laurarichardson said:

Pic from Minn lynx game in the Oct of 2015. How long would a withdrawal take place and how would one get all the way to Australia without vomiting the whole flight. How would one stay on the stage to perform without running off. Why would someone going thur withdrawals add extra shows and stay longer than planned.

Actually, I believe the search warrant states Dr. S said he was treating P for hip pain and not withdrawal.

I believe it was Kirk and Meron who said P had recently been going through withdrawal.

ISaidLifeIsJustAGame said:

Actually, I believe the search warrant states Dr. S said he was treating P for hip pain and not withdrawal.

I believe it was Kirk and Meron who said P had recently been going through withdrawal.

So this withdrawal story came from Kirk and Meron. That is interesting.

He had a withdrawal in 2010 after surgery. He wrote a song about it. Because he was on meds for so long the withdrawal was gradual paranoia etc. Prince being more extra Prince. Its when he started riding his bike everywhere. Behaviour like that. Withdrawal doesn't always look the same for people who use until the the body starts reacting (vomiting shakes pain etc) thats usually a normal course. Endorphins have been overtaxed so then the nervous system takes a dip and your whole system goes nuts. He wasn't going through withdrawals in my opinion he was overdosing and had no idea. I'm sure he nor those around him told the doctors exactly what he was on because the either didnt know the pills were mislabelled or they knew. I'm not sure. Definitely don't trust anyone.

laurarichardson said:

Pic from Minn lynx game in the Oct of 2015. How long would a withdrawal take place and how would one get all the way to Australia without vomiting the whole flight. How would one stay on the stage to perform without running off. Why would someone going thur withdrawals add extra shows and stay longer than planned.

1Sasha said:

I wasn't on the org then, but I recall seeing this photo elsewhere. Maybe it's just me today, but this is all a miserable state of affairs. I am fighting for his truth, but will it ever come out? I think it is important that it does, but I just don't know if it will.

What does riding a bike have to do with withdrawals or being paranoid? Plus there are people who saw him driving his car around after 2010. Been asking this question for a year how was he operating a vehicle and knocking back the wine he loved so much popping pills for years?

prizefight said:

He had a withdrawal in 2010 after surgery. He wrote a song about it. Because he was on meds for so long the withdrawal was gradual paranoia etc. Prince being more extra Prince. Its when he started riding his bike everywhere. Behaviour like that. Withdrawal doesn't always look the same for people who use until the the body starts reacting (vomiting shakes pain etc) thats usually a normal course. Endorphins have been overtaxed so then the nervous system takes a dip and your whole system goes nuts. He wasn't going through withdrawals in my opinion he was overdosing and had no idea. I'm sure he nor those around him told the doctors exactly what he was on because the either didnt know the pills were mislabelled or they knew. I'm not sure. Definitely don't trust anyone.

laurarichardson said:

Pic from Minn lynx game in the Oct of 2015. How long would a withdrawal take place and how would one get all the way to Australia without vomiting the whole flight. How would one stay on the stage to perform without running off. Why would someone going thur withdrawals add extra shows and stay longer than planned.

laurarichardson said:

ISaidLifeIsJustAGame said:

Actually, I believe the search warrant states Dr. S said he was treating P for hip pain and not withdrawal.

I believe it was Kirk and Meron who said P had recently been going through withdrawal.

So this withdrawal story came from Kirk and Meron. That is interesting.

Didn't Judith Hill say in The New York Times that she discussed Prince getting help for (fill in the blank) and he agreed to it?

laurarichardson said:

What does riding a bike have to do with withdrawals or being paranoid? Plus there are people who saw him driving his car around after 2010. Been asking this question for a year how was he operating a vehicle and knocking back the wine he loved so much popping pills for years?

prizefight said:

He had a withdrawal in 2010 after surgery. He wrote a song about it. Because he was on meds for so long the withdrawal was gradual paranoia etc. Prince being more extra Prince. Its when he started riding his bike everywhere. Behaviour like that. Withdrawal doesn't always look the same for people who use until the the body starts reacting (vomiting shakes pain etc) thats usually a normal course. Endorphins have been overtaxed so then the nervous system takes a dip and your whole system goes nuts. He wasn't going through withdrawals in my opinion he was overdosing and had no idea. I'm sure he nor those around him told the doctors exactly what he was on because the either didnt know the pills were mislabelled or they knew. I'm not sure. Definitely don't trust anyone.

It has to do with a change in his personality. Also, if he was driving he was probably not popped up. He partook when in pain or after performing and in pain. He didn't feel as much pain when he peformed. Endorphins.

I very much doubt she said that to him. She would definitely not be working with him. The probability is nil.

1Sasha said:

laurarichardson said:

So this withdrawal story came from Kirk and Meron. That is interesting.

Didn't Judith Hill say in The New York Times that she discussed Prince getting help for (fill in the blank) and he agreed to it?

laurarichardson said:

What does riding a bike have to do with withdrawals or being paranoid? Plus there are people who saw him driving his car around after 2010. Been asking this question for a year how was he operating a vehicle and knocking back the wine he loved so much popping pills for years?

prizefight said:

He had a withdrawal in 2010 after surgery. He wrote a song about it. Because he was on meds for so long the withdrawal was gradual paranoia etc. Prince being more extra Prince. Its when he started riding his bike everywhere. Behaviour like that. Withdrawal doesn't always look the same for people who use until the the body starts reacting (vomiting shakes pain etc) thats usually a normal course. Endorphins have been overtaxed so then the nervous system takes a dip and your whole system goes nuts. He wasn't going through withdrawals in my opinion he was overdosing and had no idea. I'm sure he nor those around him told the doctors exactly what he was on because the either didnt know the pills were mislabelled or they knew. I'm not sure. Definitely don't trust anyone.

Also from 2010-2013 he was probably okay. Surgery was late 2009. Problems arose (other hip?) probably around 2013 on.

prizefight said:

laurarichardson said:

What does riding a bike have to do with withdrawals or being paranoid? Plus there are people who saw him driving his car around after 2010. Been asking this question for a year how was he operating a vehicle and knocking back the wine he loved so much popping pills for years?

Also from 2010-2013 he was probably okay. Surgery was late 2009. Problems arose (other hip?) probably around 2013 on.

How do you know this?

prizefight said:

laurarichardson said:

What does riding a bike have to do with withdrawals or being paranoid? Plus there are people who saw him driving his car around after 2010. Been asking this question for a year how was he operating a vehicle and knocking back the wine he loved so much popping pills for years?

Also from 2010-2013 he was probably okay. Surgery was late 2009. Problems arose (other hip?) probably around 2013 on.

Who assisted Prince after the surgery? Are you saying that his pain increased after 2013, leading to his addictions to opiates and no other illness?

prizefight said:

laurarichardson said:

What does riding a bike have to do with withdrawals or being paranoid? Plus there are people who saw him driving his car around after 2010. Been asking this question for a year how was he operating a vehicle and knocking back the wine he loved so much popping pills for years?

It has to do with a change in his personality. Also, if he was driving he was probably not popped up. He partook when in pain or after performing and in pain. He didn't feel as much pain when he peformed. Endorphins.

To The bolded: I've been saying this for a while now, and that this is the reason why he never appeared high- I suspected he never took pills during a performance. Several musicians have stated that the "high of being on stage will wipe out the pain of just about any ailment"...hence the "come down"/pain after a performance, and the need to medicate afterwards. Thanks for verifying

nelcp777 said:

prizefight said:

Also from 2010-2013 he was probably okay. Surgery was late 2009. Problems arose (other hip?) probably around 2013 on.

Who assisted Prince after the surgery? Are you saying that his pain increased after 2013, leading to his addictions to opiates and no other illness?

Just from looking at pictures I would guestimate other issues (either same hip or the other one) started manifesting as of 2012/13 on. Someone I know assisted him after surgery. Then other people came in and did not take care of him or monitor him. As far as I know, he passed away due to enablers, accidental drug purchase or on purpose? and non-care. There was obviously no one there to tell him to rest and eat. He kept going, probably because he felt scared. There was something wrong at least a year prior. If he was taking fentanyl and no percocet which he was used to, then that started a different host of problems. If you look at him 2010-12, he's in good form. Pay attention to his skin and under eyes and cane usage. After 2012 you can see changes and not just from ageing.

precioux said:

prizefight said:

It has to do with a change in his personality. Also, if he was driving he was probably not popped up. He partook when in pain or after performing and in pain. He didn't feel as much pain when he peformed. Endorphins.

To The bolded: I've been saying this for a while now, and that this is the reason why he never appeared high- I suspected he never took pills during a performance. Several musicians have stated that the "high of being on stage will wipe out the pain of just about any ailment"...hence the "come down"/pain after a performance, and the need to medicate afterwards. Thanks for verifying

Precioux: Bravo for stating this so clearly and concisely.

laurarichardson said:

I have read plenty about opiod use. It is your arrogance that makes you think you are an authority on this subject. Once again someone projecting and acting as if information is not obtainable but anywhere else then on the Org.

Read some more. Also, LOL at that first paragraph. Remind you of anyone?

prizefight said:

nelcp777 said:

Who assisted Prince after the surgery? Are you saying that his pain increased after 2013, leading to his addictions to opiates and no other illness?

Just from looking at pictures I would guestimate other issues (either same hip or the other one) started manifesting as of 2012/13 on. Someone I know assisted him after surgery. Then other people came in and did not take care of him or monitor him. As far as I know, he passed away due to enablers, accidental drug purchase or on purpose? and non-care. There was obviously no one there to tell him to rest and eat. He kept going, probably because he felt scared. There was something wrong at least a year prior. If he was taking fentanyl and no percocet which he was used to, then that started a different host of problems. If you look at him 2010-12, he's in good form. Pay attention to his skin and under eyes and cane usage. After 2012 you can see changes and not just from ageing.

As shocked as we all were at the ME's report of the cause of death, this is more horrific. Prince, this genius, this wealthy, powerful, much-loved international icon died of NEGLECT. This was no oops-wrong-pill death; this was an in-your-face death spiral and those who were in his space averted their eyes. A sickening realization: at the end of this precious life suffused with love and sex, and Lovesexy, and bodies galore and more love and what passes for love...there was no one left, no one there who loved him enought to fight a down and dirty battle for his life. He died alone...and I'm not talking about the elevator.

Bodhitheblackdog said:

prizefight said:

Just from looking at pictures I would guestimate other issues (either same hip or the other one) started manifesting as of 2012/13 on. Someone I know assisted him after surgery. Then other people came in and did not take care of him or monitor him. As far as I know, he passed away due to enablers, accidental drug purchase or on purpose? and non-care. There was obviously no one there to tell him to rest and eat. He kept going, probably because he felt scared. There was something wrong at least a year prior. If he was taking fentanyl and no percocet which he was used to, then that started a different host of problems. If you look at him 2010-12, he's in good form. Pay attention to his skin and under eyes and cane usage. After 2012 you can see changes and not just from ageing.

As shocked as we all were at the ME's report of the cause of death, this is more horrific. Prince, this genius, this wealthy, powerful, much-loved international icon died of NEGLECT. This was no oops-wrong-pill death; this was an in-your-face death spiral and those who were in his space averted their eyes. A sickening realization: at the end of this precious life suffused with love and sex, and Lovesexy, and bodies galore and more love and what passes for love...there was no one left, no one there who loved him enought to fight a down and dirty battle for his life. He died alone...and I'm not talking about the elevator.

Succintly put. The cause of death was NEGLECT. He couldn't nor wouldn't get those items on his own. Didn't know how.

[Snip - luv4u]

It sounds like his inner inner circle has got a lot of explaining to... Meron, Kirk Johnson, and Judith HIll. (and Dr. S as well). This is so sad. I want to believe that other musicians/casual friends he worked with weren't quite as clued into the problem. After all, Prince's "princeness" was probably often played off as eccentricity and deliberate distance.

Kiran Sharma, his old assistant (who I think was mostly working for him out of England and Turks and Caicos until 2014) was tweeting about Judith being full of shit and romanticizing what happened the night of the drug overdose on the plane. Judith probably wasn't giving him pills but I imagine she knew what was up and either turned a blind eye or was in some kind of personal denial. Kiran probably knew as well (which is probably why she wasn't working for him anymore.)

I wonder who finally stepped up to get a pain treatment doctor for Prince. Its like they realized that maybe their 'neglect' would actually kill him. I really hope no one deliberately poisoned Prince. I know he could a pain, but good grief, that's harsh..and kind of random in a way (after all those years.)

prizefight said:

nelcp777 said:

Who assisted Prince after the surgery? Are you saying that his pain increased after 2013, leading to his addictions to opiates and no other illness?

Just from looking at pictures I would guestimate other issues (either same hip or the other one) started manifesting as of 2012/13 on. Someone I know assisted him after surgery. Then other people came in and did not take care of him or monitor him. As far as I know, he passed away due to enablers, accidental drug purchase or on purpose? and non-care. There was obviously no one there to tell him to rest and eat. He kept going, probably because he felt scared. There was something wrong at least a year prior. If he was taking fentanyl and no percocet which he was used to, then that started a different host of problems. If you look at him 2010-12, he's in good form. Pay attention to his skin and under eyes and cane usage. After 2012 you can see changes and not just from ageing.

[Edited 6/27/17 11:24am]

purplerabbithole said:

It sounds like his inner inner circle has got a lot of explaining to... Meron, Kirk Johnson, and Judith HIll. (and Dr. S as well). This is so sad. I want to believe that other musicians/casual friends he worked with weren't quite as clued into the problem. After all, Prince's "princeness" was probably often played off as eccentricity and deliberate distance.

Kiran Sharma, his old assistant (who I think was mostly working for him out of England and Turks and Caicos until 2014) was tweeting about Judith being full of shit and romanticizing what happened the night of the drug overdose on the plane. Judith probably wasn't giving him pills but I imagine she knew what was up and either turned a blind eye or was in some kind of personal denial. Kiran probably knew as well (which is probably why she wasn't working for him anymore.)

I wonder who finally stepped up to get a pain treatment doctor for Prince. Its like they realized that maybe their 'neglect' would actually kill him. I really hope no one deliberately poisoned Prince. I know he could a pain, but good grief, that's harsh..and kind of random in a way (after all those years.)

prizefight said:

Just from looking at pictures I would guestimate other issues (either same hip or the other one) started manifesting as of 2012/13 on. Someone I know assisted him after surgery. Then other people came in and did not take care of him or monitor him. As far as I know, he passed away due to enablers, accidental drug purchase or on purpose? and non-care. There was obviously no one there to tell him to rest and eat. He kept going, probably because he felt scared. There was something wrong at least a year prior. If he was taking fentanyl and no percocet which he was used to, then that started a different host of problems. If you look at him 2010-12, he's in good form. Pay attention to his skin and under eyes and cane usage. After 2012 you can see changes and not just from ageing.

[Edited 6/27/17 11:24am]

Well I feel comfortable concluding that at least one person had the knowledge of his addiction and the leverage/credibility to go public and ensure that even though she was on to her next that he might have been saved. If she ever really loved him she would have. I think it went something like this: Mani: you're an addict and you need to get help or you'll die. Prince: how much do you want to just go away and keep quiet? Mani: $$$$$$?!? See ya. Prince knew that everyone (in his circle) had their price so his much reported sadness at the demise of this marriage wasn't because it ended, IMO, but that she chose money over him. She didn't stick around to fight the lonely battle with him...she took his money to spend with EB. She didn't fight to save him. She sold him out.

I know its cool to hate on MT but I dont buy it. Her financial demands would have been much bigger than they were if she had his drug addiction to hang over his head. Did you read the divorce papers, he fought her on stuff. I think he was popping pills to deal with pain issues from his tour but he probably was functioning relatively well.. so it didn't appear to be out of hand but was still disconcerting. But I imagine he was keeping secrets from her and I imagine she was keeping secrets from him and I imagine he was working too hard (like usual) and there were suspicions on both sides of cheating. When he suspected she was cheating, he starting cutting her off financially and pushing her away (maybe testing her at that point. "Will she stick around even if I cut her off of the credit cards?" When she didn't and then she filed for divorce, he probably just felt it confirmed her greed. She might have thought he was just being mean with the money stuff so tried to stick to him a bit in the divorce. But even if her greed is somewhat apparent, its not exactly Paul McCarthney's ex-wife asking for nearly half his estate (a hidden out of hand percocet addiction would have been a lot leverage to get a lot more money than she got). Her divorce settlement was actually milder than many (not compared to Mayte's, but certainly compared to many celebrity divorces.)

Bodhitheblackdog said:

purplerabbithole said:

It sounds like his inner inner circle has got a lot of explaining to... Meron, Kirk Johnson, and Judith HIll. (and Dr. S as well). This is so sad. I want to believe that other musicians/casual friends he worked with weren't quite as clued into the problem. After all, Prince's "princeness" was probably often played off as eccentricity and deliberate distance.

Kiran Sharma, his old assistant (who I think was mostly working for him out of England and Turks and Caicos until 2014) was tweeting about Judith being full of shit and romanticizing what happened the night of the drug overdose on the plane. Judith probably wasn't giving him pills but I imagine she knew what was up and either turned a blind eye or was in some kind of personal denial. Kiran probably knew as well (which is probably why she wasn't working for him anymore.)

I wonder who finally stepped up to get a pain treatment doctor for Prince. Its like they realized that maybe their 'neglect' would actually kill him. I really hope no one deliberately poisoned Prince. I know he could a pain, but good grief, that's harsh..and kind of random in a way (after all those years.)

[Edited 6/27/17 11:24am]

Well I feel comfortable concluding that at least one person had the knowledge of his addiction and the leverage/credibility to go public and ensure that even though she was on to her next that he might have been saved. If she ever really loved him she would have. I think it went something like this: Mani: you're an addict and you need to get help or you'll die. Prince: how much do you want to just go away and keep quiet? Mani: $$$$$$?!? See ya. Prince knew that everyone (in his circle) had their price so his much reported sadness at the demise of this marriage wasn't because it ended, IMO, but that she chose money over him. She didn't stick around to fight the lonely battle with him...she took his money to spend with EB. She didn't fight to save him. She sold him out.

[Edited 6/27/17 12:01pm]

[Edited 6/27/17 12:10pm]

I agree with the comments here about the people around him. They knew. If not all of them, then many of them. And they let the paycheck, or the house payment, or the car installment, rule what they did for him. He was their cash register, plain and simple.

so no affection or sympathy for him whatsoever from any of those people he spent hours rehearsing with or doing after shows with??? All those humorous stories about ping pong and practical jokes--just made up or not really funny at the time but they used them anyway as fodder or something to talk about in interviews.)

Maybe, its a little more complicated than that. Maybe they suspected but couldn't confirm. Maybe they knew but didn't know how to go about approaching him or didn't know the severity of it. . Maybe when they did attempt to say anything or hint at it, he fired them or decided to go a different direction musically. He was a compartmentalized man. If we are to believe Mayte, he kept secrets even from her and she never actually saw the drug taking behavior. Enabling is probably more complicated than just...he pays my check--I don't care if he dies. If he dies, who pays the checks BTW???

Money is a factor, don't get me wrong. But I give the people in his outer circle a bit of a break. His inner circle (who helped facilitate or knew exactly what he was doing and said nothing) they can go fvck themselves.

1Sasha said:

I agree with the comments here about the people around him. They knew. If not all of them, then many of them. And they let the paycheck, or the house payment, or the car installment, rule what they did for him. He was their cash register, plain and simple.

[Edited 6/27/17 12:36pm]

prizefight said: