inovio said:

Unless you're a musican you may not understand how to music industry works.

No, at the end of the day P was a simple person. When things got too ardous, then the answer to the question was "no." Nothing personal, this is just business.

The Time performed yesterday at the Minneapolis Zoo:

http://www.startribune.com/morris-day-and-the-time-perform-with-purple-pride-at-the-minnesota-zoo/385161471/

i suspect that prince was experiencing a personal difficulty, perhaps a mysterious health issue, that he was trying to determine the root of. so this was just one of his experiments to regain control of something he initiated, to find out if that is what would cure his condition.

FUNKYNESS said:

inovio said:

inovio said:

Unless you're a musican you may not understand how to music industry works.

No, at the end of the day P was a simple person. When things got too ardous, then the answer to the question was "no." Nothing personal, this is just business.

love Prince, and he was definately not a simple person lol
especially with the Time it was more than just business.

Even with the Family (probably more directed at St Paul)

I just wish that Prince would have continued to work with the Time after GB. But the WB fight ended all that. Prince focus went elsewhere.

OldFriends4Sale said:

databank said:

There's a STRONG contrast between how anyone associated with Prince speaks of him and how fans speak of him. It has to mean something.

ASSOCIATES: This is how it happened. Prince did wonderful things for me and a few bad things as well. He could be mean sometimes but he could also be extraordinarily generous and kind. I love him and I'm grateful for all the things we shared.

FANS: Prince was a horrible bastard, a monster who treated everyone like shit all the time.

That isn't faire databank. Most fans talk about Prince the same way you posted about the Associates. There are many of us who see things in a balanced way. Yes there are people who have that 100% negative mindset. But what about the fans that literally see no wrong with Prince. Everything he does is a masterpiece, Prince was perfect etc, I even ran into a woman that loved Prince so much she was literally angry at Morris Day for what 'what he did to Prince' in Purple Rain.

But people do have differing percentages of how they view things. From Prince business, relations & music.

Read the thread about Extralovable. And I understand what many are saying. I abhor rape, but when Prince does what he does in that song, I see art. People are not tearing Prince up for that piece in the song.

That would be me !

So who was really behind the "Madhouse" project? Warner Bros., or Paisley Park Records/Prince? Lot of deception for those poor band members. Some of whom didn't even exist.

paisleyparkgirl said:

OldFriends4Sale said:

That isn't faire databank. Most fans talk about Prince the same way you posted about the Associates. There are many of us who see things in a balanced way. Yes there are people who have that 100% negative mindset. But what about the fans that literally see no wrong with Prince. Everything he does is a masterpiece, Prince was perfect etc, I even ran into a woman that loved Prince so much she was literally angry at Morris Day for what 'what he did to Prince' in Purple Rain.

But people do have differing percentages of how they view things. From Prince business, relations & music.

Read the thread about Extralovable. And I understand what many are saying. I abhor rape, but when Prince does what he does in that song, I see art. People are not tearing Prince up for that piece in the song.

That would be me !

LOL poor Morris

Menes said:

So who was really behind the "Madhouse" project? Warner Bros., or Paisley Park Records/Prince? Lot of deception for those poor band members. Some of whom didn't even exist.

Produced and written by Madhouse, label: Paisley Park/Warner Bros., released: 1987

Prince should have just backed and promoted Madhouse like he did Sheila E

I think because it was taking on a 'jazz' element, he might have been scared of reactions from the jazz community. Jazz will always be judged aat a high level.

But again. I think the problem was that he was fronting another band, playing almost everything, while saying and having people lie and say it wasn't him.

I think more of his proteges would have had higher success and more longevity if he had the band members actually playing on the albums and creating songs. Even if 1/3 was all Prince to set the tone/sound/vibe for the album 1/3 Prince but with the band 1/3 the band

The Time would have lasted, Sheila E's band probably wouldn't have split after the 2, Madhouse would have had a fresh air about it. The Family would have continued-st Paul probably would have not left so soon, having more an investment in it. etc

There are even some Prince sons that was all him that would have sounded better if he had more or all live musicians on it.

OldFriends4Sale said:

Menes said:

So who was really behind the "Madhouse" project? Warner Bros., or Paisley Park Records/Prince? Lot of deception for those poor band members. Some of whom didn't even exist.

Produced and written by Madhouse, label: Paisley Park/Warner Bros., released: 1987

Prince should have just backed and promoted Madhouse like he did Sheila E

I think because it was taking on a 'jazz' element, he might have been scared of reactions from the jazz community. Jazz will always be judged aat a high level.

But again. I think the problem was that he was fronting another band, playing almost everything, while saying and having people lie and say it wasn't him.

I think more of his proteges would have had higher success and more longevity if he had the band members actually playing on the albums and creating songs. Even if 1/3 was all Prince to set the tone/sound/vibe for the album 1/3 Prince but with the band 1/3 the band

The Time would have lasted, Sheila E's band probably wouldn't have split after the 2, Madhouse would have had a fresh air about it. The Family would have continued-st Paul probably would have not left so soon, having more an investment in it. etc

There are even some Prince sons that was all him that would have sounded better if he had more or all live musicians on it.

Yes, I think what you write here has been confirmed. I was reading this article(see below) and it pretty much sums up what you wrote. Good analysis, Old.

Prince and Eric Leeds tea...s Madhouse

Of all the protege albums (with the possible exception of the 3 NPG albums) the 2 by Madhouse are the ones that should really be classified as Prince albums. I know some of you will argue but they are Prince albums if NEWS & Xpectation are Prince albums. In my not-so-humble opinion, of course...

sad, Prince seemed so bitter...

Susannah: My last contact with him was about the name of our band. He stopped talking to me. Completely. We’ve always talked throughout the years. But when it came to that it was the reason he’ll never talk to me again?

Rocker: Did Prince force you to chance the name of the band from The Family to F-Deluxe because he owns the name The Family?

Susannah: He doesn’t own the name. He owns the brand. The brand is something that we can’t play with. We could have the name and we could use it. But we couldn’t go out and tour as what they consider the brand of “The Family.” It just became a litigation nightmare. We didn’t want to play it. It wasn’t worth it to us. We were proud of the new music and feel that is holds up perfectly fine.

Paul: We couldn’t afford to fight him in court. My wife says she likes her house and wants to keep it. I have pay my mortgage before I have to pay an attorney. But the fact is he does not own “The Family.” We didn’t want be miserable. We were putting out a record we were funding by ourselves. Sure, we paid a price by not calling it “The Family.” But our core fans knew where we were . In fact, it turned out to be a blessing because if you Google “The Family” you’re not going to get us. You’ll get family planning or something else. In the internet age, it was a smart choice to go back to the old name. I have no regrets.

Rocker: Why does he feel the need to control the band?

Susannah: He said, “You can’t have the Jackson 5 without Michael Jackson.” That was his philosophy. I asked, “Well what are you saying? Do you want to be in it? Do you want to produce us? Prince said, “No. I want nothing to do with it.” I said, “I don’t know what to tell you. It’s not just your history it’s our history too. I’m not trying to take anything away from you but we’re all trying to make a living too. We’re proud of this new record and I know you would be as well.” He said, “I don’t want to hear it. I don’t care what you’re doing.” I told him I would go over and play the record for him but he said, “You can’t play any of that for me because it’s not mine. Those are my children.”

Rocker: But children grow up.

Susannah: We all tried to tell them that. The last time we spoke he heard my kids in the background, and my youngest one was little at the time, he said, “Is this a bad time?” I said, “No. I’m about to put my kids to sleep.” He had never actually heard that part of my world. It wasn’t a bad time. I said, “They are my concern but you have my time right now. “ He didn’t like that. He told Paul I was belligerent and that was enough for him. That’s 25 years of a friendship of sorts. I wouldn’t call it a real friendship. Prince said, “I’m done. I’m not going to speak to her. I’m only going to speak with you Paul,” And he had never spoken to Paul in any of the years. Ever.

Paul said, “You don’t own the band. This is not a copyright issue.” Prince told Paul he would do whatever you want for this band if you don’t use the name. Paul agreed and tried to keep Prince to his promise. Didn’t happen. Prince called and said, “You can’t perform any of the old songs live. I will have my guys get out there. If somebody bootlegs it I’m going to come after you.” How do you stop bootlegging in a time of camera phones and YouTube?

Rocker: He had been over the top about pulling clips off in recent years.

Susannah: He pulled everything off from the Carnegie Hall tribute to Prince show. You pulled all those amazing artist off? Elvis Costello? Everybody performed. You pull all that down. He did. He was supposed to come to Carnegie Hall. Wendy and I were like, “He’s not going to show. Get ready. He’s not coming.” And he didn’t.

Rocker: For someone who is so controlling of his past, he also hasn’t done anything to preserve that legacy. None of the Paisley Park released, aside from Prince albums, are on CD.

Susannah: The only way he would participate is unless it was his idea. And it would never happen because he would never ask anybody to be a part of something he was doing. He just wouldn’t.

https://www.rockerzine.com/2013/05/f-deluxe-the-family-reunion/

OldFriends4Sale said:

sad, Prince seemed so bitter...

Susannah: My last contact with him was about the name of our band. He stopped talking to me. Completely. We’ve always talked throughout the years. But when it came to that it was the reason he’ll never talk to me again?

Rocker: Did Prince force you to chance the name of the band from The Family to F-Deluxe because he owns the name The Family?

Susannah: He doesn’t own the name. He owns the brand. The brand is something that we can’t play with. We could have the name and we could use it. But we couldn’t go out and tour as what they consider the brand of “The Family.” It just became a litigation nightmare. We didn’t want to play it. It wasn’t worth it to us. We were proud of the new music and feel that is holds up perfectly fine.

Paul: We couldn’t afford to fight him in court. My wife says she likes her house and wants to keep it. I have pay my mortgage before I have to pay an attorney. But the fact is he does not own “The Family.” We didn’t want be miserable. We were putting out a record we were funding by ourselves. Sure, we paid a price by not calling it “The Family.” But our core fans knew where we were . In fact, it turned out to be a blessing because if you Google “The Family” you’re not going to get us. You’ll get family planning or something else. In the internet age, it was a smart choice to go back to the old name. I have no regrets.

Rocker: Why does he feel the need to control the band?

Susannah: He said, “You can’t have the Jackson 5 without Michael Jackson.” That was his philosophy. I asked, “Well what are you saying? Do you want to be in it? Do you want to produce us? Prince said, “No. I want nothing to do with it.” I said, “I don’t know what to tell you. It’s not just your history it’s our history too. I’m not trying to take anything away from you but we’re all trying to make a living too. We’re proud of this new record and I know you would be as well.” He said, “I don’t want to hear it. I don’t care what you’re doing.” I told him I would go over and play the record for him but he said, “You can’t play any of that for me because it’s not mine. Those are my children.”

Rocker: But children grow up.

Susannah: We all tried to tell them that. The last time we spoke he heard my kids in the background, and my youngest one was little at the time, he said, “Is this a bad time?” I said, “No. I’m about to put my kids to sleep.” He had never actually heard that part of my world. It wasn’t a bad time. I said, “They are my concern but you have my time right now. “ He didn’t like that. He told Paul I was belligerent and that was enough for him. That’s 25 years of a friendship of sorts. I wouldn’t call it a real friendship. Prince said, “I’m done. I’m not going to speak to her. I’m only going to speak with you Paul,” And he had never spoken to Paul in any of the years. Ever.

Paul said, “You don’t own the band. This is not a copyright issue.” Prince told Paul he would do whatever you want for this band if you don’t use the name. Paul agreed and tried to keep Prince to his promise. Didn’t happen. Prince called and said, “You can’t perform any of the old songs live. I will have my guys get out there. If somebody bootlegs it I’m going to come after you.” How do you stop bootlegging in a time of camera phones and YouTube?

Rocker: He had been over the top about pulling clips off in recent years.

Susannah: He pulled everything off from the Carnegie Hall tribute to Prince show. You pulled all those amazing artist off? Elvis Costello? Everybody performed. You pull all that down. He did. He was supposed to come to Carnegie Hall. Wendy and I were like, “He’s not going to show. Get ready. He’s not coming.” And he didn’t.

Rocker: For someone who is so controlling of his past, he also hasn’t done anything to preserve that legacy. None of the Paisley Park released, aside from Prince albums, are on CD.

Susannah: The only way he would participate is unless it was his idea. And it would never happen because he would never ask anybody to be a part of something he was doing. He just wouldn’t.

https://www.rockerzine.com/2013/05/f-deluxe-the-family-reunion/

The Jackson 5 without MJ line was just cold indeed. Things have changed now and everyone is being more relective with their tributes. I wonder when the estate is finally sorted out if The Family will be able to use the name etc again in years to come? I hope so.

Prince was so like the record companies he resented. Worse, actually, in the sense that he did it to friends who had little money or success.

He sounds like an unhappy person.

[Edited 7/23/16 4:29am]

OldFriends4Sale said:

sad, Prince seemed so bitter...

Susannah: My last contact with him was about the name of our band. He stopped talking to me. Completely. We’ve always talked throughout the years. But when it came to that it was the reason he’ll never talk to me again?

Rocker: Did Prince force you to chance the name of the band from The Family to F-Deluxe because he owns the name The Family?

Susannah: He doesn’t own the name. He owns the brand. The brand is something that we can’t play with. We could have the name and we could use it. But we couldn’t go out and tour as what they consider the brand of “The Family.” It just became a litigation nightmare. We didn’t want to play it. It wasn’t worth it to us. We were proud of the new music and feel that is holds up perfectly fine.

Paul: We couldn’t afford to fight him in court. My wife says she likes her house and wants to keep it. I have pay my mortgage before I have to pay an attorney. But the fact is he does not own “The Family.” We didn’t want be miserable. We were putting out a record we were funding by ourselves. Sure, we paid a price by not calling it “The Family.” But our core fans knew where we were . In fact, it turned out to be a blessing because if you Google “The Family” you’re not going to get us. You’ll get family planning or something else. In the internet age, it was a smart choice to go back to the old name. I have no regrets.

Rocker: Why does he feel the need to control the band?

Susannah: He said, “You can’t have the Jackson 5 without Michael Jackson.” That was his philosophy. I asked, “Well what are you saying? Do you want to be in it? Do you want to produce us? Prince said, “No. I want nothing to do with it.” I said, “I don’t know what to tell you. It’s not just your history it’s our history too. I’m not trying to take anything away from you but we’re all trying to make a living too. We’re proud of this new record and I know you would be as well.” He said, “I don’t want to hear it. I don’t care what you’re doing.” I told him I would go over and play the record for him but he said, “You can’t play any of that for me because it’s not mine. Those are my children.”

Rocker: But children grow up.

Susannah: We all tried to tell them that. The last time we spoke he heard my kids in the background, and my youngest one was little at the time, he said, “Is this a bad time?” I said, “No. I’m about to put my kids to sleep.” He had never actually heard that part of my world. It wasn’t a bad time. I said, “They are my concern but you have my time right now. “ He didn’t like that. He told Paul I was belligerent and that was enough for him. That’s 25 years of a friendship of sorts. I wouldn’t call it a real friendship. Prince said, “I’m done. I’m not going to speak to her. I’m only going to speak with you Paul,” And he had never spoken to Paul in any of the years. Ever.

Paul said, “You don’t own the band. This is not a copyright issue.” Prince told Paul he would do whatever you want for this band if you don’t use the name. Paul agreed and tried to keep Prince to his promise. Didn’t happen. Prince called and said, “You can’t perform any of the old songs live. I will have my guys get out there. If somebody bootlegs it I’m going to come after you.” How do you stop bootlegging in a time of camera phones and YouTube?

Rocker: He had been over the top about pulling clips off in recent years.

Susannah: He pulled everything off from the Carnegie Hall tribute to Prince show. You pulled all those amazing artist off? Elvis Costello? Everybody performed. You pull all that down. He did. He was supposed to come to Carnegie Hall. Wendy and I were like, “He’s not going to show. Get ready. He’s not coming.” And he didn’t.

Rocker: For someone who is so controlling of his past, he also hasn’t done anything to preserve that legacy. None of the Paisley Park released, aside from Prince albums, are on CD.

Susannah: The only way he would participate is unless it was his idea. And it would never happen because he would never ask anybody to be a part of something he was doing. He just wouldn’t.

https://www.rockerzine.com/2013/05/f-deluxe-the-family-reunion/

It's clear that Prince had a lot of egotistic and trusting issues and didn't like competition/rivalry. There are no excuse to treating people unfairly but I think a lot of it has to do with how he himself was treated as a child. As much as I love Prince, reading these recounts always makes me feel bad for his old friends or associates. Yet Morris was all praise about him at the London Tribute last month, he didn't seem to have any grudge whatsoever and he still shows a lot of love for him on FB. Perhaps there is some recent info out there (or interviews) showing that Prince would have made amends towards some if not all of the people he had treated unfairly in the past? I didn't think it was very nice of him to throw my card back into the crowd just after I had given it to him, and yes perhaps he was just being playful, though his sudden reaction could have also been an indication that he got offended easily. Yet he made up for it some days later by inviting me onstage and being extremely kind on that night. What I mean is that this outer proud and harsh attitude towards others was probably there to protect a soft heart that had very likely been equally hurt in the past and perhaps he still felt regret sometimes and wanted to change? That's not to excuse anything bad he did of course, but it would help understanding the problem a little. Personnally, I would be inclined to say he was the one suffering the most and was probably tormented by huge insecurities hence his initial desire to become "the best".

[Edited 7/23/16 4:36am]

muleFunk said:

Jam and Lewis were hella producers but who remembers producers?

Leon Sylvers had more hits than they did but people don't know who he is.

Music fans remember.

CherryMoon57 said:

OldFriends4Sale said:

sad, Prince seemed so bitter...

Susannah: My last contact with him was about the name of our band. He stopped talking to me. Completely. We’ve always talked throughout the years. But when it came to that it was the reason he’ll never talk to me again?

Rocker: Did Prince force you to chance the name of the band from The Family to F-Deluxe because he owns the name The Family?

Susannah: He doesn’t own the name. He owns the brand. The brand is something that we can’t play with. We could have the name and we could use it. But we couldn’t go out and tour as what they consider the brand of “The Family.” It just became a litigation nightmare. We didn’t want to play it. It wasn’t worth it to us. We were proud of the new music and feel that is holds up perfectly fine.

Paul: We couldn’t afford to fight him in court. My wife says she likes her house and wants to keep it. I have pay my mortgage before I have to pay an attorney. But the fact is he does not own “The Family.” We didn’t want be miserable. We were putting out a record we were funding by ourselves. Sure, we paid a price by not calling it “The Family.” But our core fans knew where we were . In fact, it turned out to be a blessing because if you Google “The Family” you’re not going to get us. You’ll get family planning or something else. In the internet age, it was a smart choice to go back to the old name. I have no regrets.

Rocker: Why does he feel the need to control the band?

Susannah: He said, “You can’t have the Jackson 5 without Michael Jackson.” That was his philosophy. I asked, “Well what are you saying? Do you want to be in it? Do you want to produce us? Prince said, “No. I want nothing to do with it.” I said, “I don’t know what to tell you. It’s not just your history it’s our history too. I’m not trying to take anything away from you but we’re all trying to make a living too. We’re proud of this new record and I know you would be as well.” He said, “I don’t want to hear it. I don’t care what you’re doing.” I told him I would go over and play the record for him but he said, “You can’t play any of that for me because it’s not mine. Those are my children.”

Rocker: But children grow up.

Susannah: We all tried to tell them that. The last time we spoke he heard my kids in the background, and my youngest one was little at the time, he said, “Is this a bad time?” I said, “No. I’m about to put my kids to sleep.” He had never actually heard that part of my world. It wasn’t a bad time. I said, “They are my concern but you have my time right now. “ He didn’t like that. He told Paul I was belligerent and that was enough for him. That’s 25 years of a friendship of sorts. I wouldn’t call it a real friendship. Prince said, “I’m done. I’m not going to speak to her. I’m only going to speak with you Paul,” And he had never spoken to Paul in any of the years. Ever.

Paul said, “You don’t own the band. This is not a copyright issue.” Prince told Paul he would do whatever you want for this band if you don’t use the name. Paul agreed and tried to keep Prince to his promise. Didn’t happen. Prince called and said, “You can’t perform any of the old songs live. I will have my guys get out there. If somebody bootlegs it I’m going to come after you.” How do you stop bootlegging in a time of camera phones and YouTube?

Rocker: He had been over the top about pulling clips off in recent years.

Susannah: He pulled everything off from the Carnegie Hall tribute to Prince show. You pulled all those amazing artist off? Elvis Costello? Everybody performed. You pull all that down. He did. He was supposed to come to Carnegie Hall. Wendy and I were like, “He’s not going to show. Get ready. He’s not coming.” And he didn’t.

Rocker: For someone who is so controlling of his past, he also hasn’t done anything to preserve that legacy. None of the Paisley Park released, aside from Prince albums, are on CD.

Susannah: The only way he would participate is unless it was his idea. And it would never happen because he would never ask anybody to be a part of something he was doing. He just wouldn’t.

https://www.rockerzine.com/2013/05/f-deluxe-the-family-reunion/

It's clear that Prince had a lot of egotistic and trusting issues and didn't like competition/rivalry. There are no excuse to treating people unfairly but I think a lot of it has to do with how he himself was treated as a child. As much as I love Prince, reading these recounts always makes me feel bad for his old friends or associates. Yet Morris was all praise about him at the London Tribute last month, he didn't seem to have any grudge whatsoever and he still shows a lot of love for him on FB. Perhaps there is some recent info out there (or interviews) showing that Prince would have made amends towards some if not all of the people he had treated unfairly in the past? I didn't think it was very nice of him to throw my card back into the crowd just after I had given it to him, and yes perhaps he was just being playful, though his sudden reaction could have also been an indication that he got offended easily. Yet he made up for it some days later by inviting me onstage and being extremely kind on that night. What I mean is that this outer proud and harsh attitude towards others was probably there to protect a soft heart that had very likely been equally hurt in the past and perhaps he still felt regret sometimes and wanted to change? That's not to excuse anything bad he did of course, but it would help understanding the problem a little. Personnally, I would be inclined to say he was the one suffering the most and was probably tormented by huge insecurities hence his initial desire to become "the best".

[Edited 7/23/16 4:36am]

I'm not trying to condemn Prince at all, for sure.
I too believe a lot of it starts/started at home(or lack of home)
I know a lot of people who were hurt and still hurting from family life, and they can be very abusive to new people in their lives that have a genuine love/care for them, but can be very trusting with people that don't. They leave a lot of broken hearts and bloody souls in their path.

Like I said when I read this it felt like a lot of bitterness that was still there.

He said something a bit disrespectful toward Morris about 2 years ago, I think he kinda said something about Morris' son too and whether it was people putting the mirror back up to Prince or Prince just feeling bad about what he said, a bit later he made some good comments about Morris as a drummer. P

Basically, Prince had a lot of control and trust issues when he was younger possibly stemming from childhood experiences. As he matured, his views on everything matured also. He learned from his past mistakes, tried to make amends for them, and in the process, became a much better person overall. That's all you can ask of anyone.

endiadj said:

Basically, Prince had a lot of control and trust issues when he was younger possibly stemming from childhood experiences. As he matured, his views on everything matured also. He learned from his past mistakes, tried to make amends for them, and in the process, became a much better person overall. That's all you can ask of anyone.

doesn't seem that way...

OldFriends4Sale said:

endiadj said:

Basically, Prince had a lot of control and trust issues when he was younger possibly stemming from childhood experiences. As he matured, his views on everything matured also. He learned from his past mistakes, tried to make amends for them, and in the process, became a much better person overall. That's all you can ask of anyone.

doesn't seem that way...

seemed that way to me. seemed to reach out to old friends, bandmates over the years, performing with them, talking with them over the phone, etc. seemed to become more mature also. he's gone now, and most of the old gang and new have shown him nothing but love, so must not be any hard feelings anymore.

OldFriends4Sale said:

sad, Prince seemed so bitter...

Susannah: My last contact with him was about the name of our band. He stopped talking to me. Completely. We’ve always talked throughout the years. But when it came to that it was the reason he’ll never talk to me again?

Rocker: Did Prince force you to chance the name of the band from The Family to F-Deluxe because he owns the name The Family?

Susannah: He doesn’t own the name. He owns the brand. The brand is something that we can’t play with. We could have the name and we could use it. But we couldn’t go out and tour as what they consider the brand of “The Family.” It just became a litigation nightmare. We didn’t want to play it. It wasn’t worth it to us. We were proud of the new music and feel that is holds up perfectly fine.

Paul: We couldn’t afford to fight him in court. My wife says she likes her house and wants to keep it. I have pay my mortgage before I have to pay an attorney. But the fact is he does not own “The Family.” We didn’t want be miserable. We were putting out a record we were funding by ourselves. Sure, we paid a price by not calling it “The Family.” But our core fans knew where we were . In fact, it turned out to be a blessing because if you Google “The Family” you’re not going to get us. You’ll get family planning or something else. In the internet age, it was a smart choice to go back to the old name. I have no regrets.

Rocker: Why does he feel the need to control the band?

Susannah: He said, “You can’t have the Jackson 5 without Michael Jackson.” That was his philosophy. I asked, “Well what are you saying? Do you want to be in it? Do you want to produce us? Prince said, “No. I want nothing to do with it.” I said, “I don’t know what to tell you. It’s not just your history it’s our history too. I’m not trying to take anything away from you but we’re all trying to make a living too. We’re proud of this new record and I know you would be as well.” He said, “I don’t want to hear it. I don’t care what you’re doing.” I told him I would go over and play the record for him but he said, “You can’t play any of that for me because it’s not mine. Those are my children.”

Rocker: But children grow up.

Susannah: We all tried to tell them that. The last time we spoke he heard my kids in the background, and my youngest one was little at the time, he said, “Is this a bad time?” I said, “No. I’m about to put my kids to sleep.” He had never actually heard that part of my world. It wasn’t a bad time. I said, “They are my concern but you have my time right now. “ He didn’t like that. He told Paul I was belligerent and that was enough for him. That’s 25 years of a friendship of sorts. I wouldn’t call it a real friendship. Prince said, “I’m done. I’m not going to speak to her. I’m only going to speak with you Paul,” And he had never spoken to Paul in any of the years. Ever.

Paul said, “You don’t own the band. This is not a copyright issue.” Prince told Paul he would do whatever you want for this band if you don’t use the name. Paul agreed and tried to keep Prince to his promise. Didn’t happen. Prince called and said, “You can’t perform any of the old songs live. I will have my guys get out there. If somebody bootlegs it I’m going to come after you.” How do you stop bootlegging in a time of camera phones and YouTube?

Rocker: He had been over the top about pulling clips off in recent years.

Susannah: He pulled everything off from the Carnegie Hall tribute to Prince show. You pulled all those amazing artist off? Elvis Costello? Everybody performed. You pull all that down. He did. He was supposed to come to Carnegie Hall. Wendy and I were like, “He’s not going to show. Get ready. He’s not coming.” And he didn’t.

Rocker: For someone who is so controlling of his past, he also hasn’t done anything to preserve that legacy. None of the Paisley Park released, aside from Prince albums, are on CD.

Susannah: The only way he would participate is unless it was his idea. And it would never happen because he would never ask anybody to be a part of something he was doing. He just wouldn’t.

https://www.rockerzine.com/2013/05/f-deluxe-the-family-reunion/

I've never seen this before. Thanks for sharing OldFriends!!

MattyJam said:

In the past, even when I didn't necessarily agree with some of Prince's decisions (such as his stance on YouTube), I could at least understand where he was coming from. But his treatment of the original bandmates in The Time and The Family, refusing to let them reform under the names that made them famous and forcing them to reform under The Original 7ven and fDeluxe respectively was just plain cold and indefensible. What was Prince's reason for doing this? [Edited 6/17/16 2:42am]

How was he able to regulate the use of the names The Time and The Family. Did Prince copyright the names? How did he have say-so over the names like that?

--

Did Morris Day & The Time just start using the name The Time since Prince died? For example: http://theboombox.com/morris-day-the-time-perform-prince-tribute-baltimore/

[Edited 7/23/16 13:59pm]

PeteSilas said:

I didn't like it when I heard it and thought that "he never will change". I'm glad that we're hearing how giving he was to many people after he died because I used to hate hearing those kinds of stories about my hero, and I'd been reading about them for 30 years. As I've gotten older I notice a real pattern with human beings, they do to others exactly what was done to them. They may rail against the oppressor but they've also internalized so much of how the oppressor operates that they often aren't even conscious of imitating them. Prince had to give up his name for a good 5 years in an often futile attempt to beat his record company, he fought tooth and nail and then he turns around and makes things as hard as possible for people who were there with him at the start. His death can't make me forget the stories I've heard about him over the years. So, did he have a right to do what he did? Yes, should he have done it? I don't think so.

Fantastic analysis. Prince was a complicated human being, for sure.

OldFriends4Sale said:

sad, Prince seemed so bitter...

Susannah: My last contact with him was about the name of our band. He stopped talking to me. Completely. We’ve always talked throughout the years. But when it came to that it was the reason he’ll never talk to me again?

Rocker: Did Prince force you to chance the name of the band from The Family to F-Deluxe because he owns the name The Family?

Susannah: He doesn’t own the name. He owns the brand. The brand is something that we can’t play with. We could have the name and we could use it. But we couldn’t go out and tour as what they consider the brand of “The Family.” It just became a litigation nightmare. We didn’t want to play it. It wasn’t worth it to us. We were proud of the new music and feel that is holds up perfectly fine.

Paul: We couldn’t afford to fight him in court. My wife says she likes her house and wants to keep it. I have pay my mortgage before I have to pay an attorney. But the fact is he does not own “The Family.” We didn’t want be miserable. We were putting out a record we were funding by ourselves. Sure, we paid a price by not calling it “The Family.” But our core fans knew where we were . In fact, it turned out to be a blessing because if you Google “The Family” you’re not going to get us. You’ll get family planning or something else. In the internet age, it was a smart choice to go back to the old name. I have no regrets.

Rocker: Why does he feel the need to control the band?

Susannah: He said, “You can’t have the Jackson 5 without Michael Jackson.” That was his philosophy. I asked, “Well what are you saying? Do you want to be in it? Do you want to produce us? Prince said, “No. I want nothing to do with it.” I said, “I don’t know what to tell you. It’s not just your history it’s our history too. I’m not trying to take anything away from you but we’re all trying to make a living too. We’re proud of this new record and I know you would be as well.” He said, “I don’t want to hear it. I don’t care what you’re doing.” I told him I would go over and play the record for him but he said, “You can’t play any of that for me because it’s not mine. Those are my children.”

Rocker: But children grow up.

Susannah: We all tried to tell them that. The last time we spoke he heard my kids in the background, and my youngest one was little at the time, he said, “Is this a bad time?” I said, “No. I’m about to put my kids to sleep.” He had never actually heard that part of my world. It wasn’t a bad time. I said, “They are my concern but you have my time right now. “ He didn’t like that. He told Paul I was belligerent and that was enough for him. That’s 25 years of a friendship of sorts. I wouldn’t call it a real friendship. Prince said, “I’m done. I’m not going to speak to her. I’m only going to speak with you Paul,” And he had never spoken to Paul in any of the years. Ever.

Paul said, “You don’t own the band. This is not a copyright issue.” Prince told Paul he would do whatever you want for this band if you don’t use the name. Paul agreed and tried to keep Prince to his promise. Didn’t happen. Prince called and said, “You can’t perform any of the old songs live. I will have my guys get out there. If somebody bootlegs it I’m going to come after you.” How do you stop bootlegging in a time of camera phones and YouTube?

Rocker: He had been over the top about pulling clips off in recent years.

Susannah: He pulled everything off from the Carnegie Hall tribute to Prince show. You pulled all those amazing artist off? Elvis Costello? Everybody performed. You pull all that down. He did. He was supposed to come to Carnegie Hall. Wendy and I were like, “He’s not going to show. Get ready. He’s not coming.” And he didn’t.

Rocker: For someone who is so controlling of his past, he also hasn’t done anything to preserve that legacy. None of the Paisley Park released, aside from Prince albums, are on CD.

Susannah: The only way he would participate is unless it was his idea. And it would never happen because he would never ask anybody to be a part of something he was doing. He just wouldn’t.

https://www.rockerzine.com/2013/05/f-deluxe-the-family-reunion/

Wow that interview is interesting

NouveauDance said:

muleFunk said:

Jam and Lewis were hella producers but who remembers producers?

Leon Sylvers had more hits than they did but people don't know who he is.

Music fans remember.

Real music fans remember producers.For example,who could ever forget Gamble and Huff? It's impossible to think of the Philly sound of the 70s without their names being mentioned.

OldFriends4Sale said:

https://www.rockerzine.com/2013/05/f-deluxe-the-family-reunion/

Thanks for sharing that, excellent info. Glad they were open about what happened.

MattyJam said:

PeteSilas said: