I wish my career would take the same kind of "nosedive" that Prince's has!

Lianachan said:

Holy shit - is remaster denial actually a thing now?

.

http://prince.org/msg/7/406898

Neither do I bart....I just wanted to get up to speed on the matter.

When do we think that Warner's might take action on this apparent breach of the agreement? The PR 30th, anniversary has come and gone, right?

BartVanHemelen said:

SchlomoThaHomo said:

.

http://www.mynewsdesk.com...hip-986847

.

April 18, 2014 - Prince and Warner Bros. Records today announced a new agreement that will see the release of long-awaited, previously unheard material, while giving the artist ownership of the master recordings of his classic, global hits. At the same time, the deal extends Prince's relationship with Warner Bros. Records, through an exclusive global licensing partnership that covers every album released from 1978 into the nineties. The financial terms of the agreement were not disclosed.

For Prince fans worldwide, the new partnership will open a veritable gold mine. The surprise announcement comes just in time for this summer's 30th Anniversary celebrations of the artist's breakthrough album and film, Purple Rain, which were released in 1984. For the first time, Prince will be releasing a digitally re-mastered, deluxe version of this classic album. Other planned projects will follow.

Prince said, "A brand-new studio album is on the way and both Warner Bros Records and Eye are quite pleased with the results of the negotiations and look forward to a fruitful working relationship."

"Everyone at Warner Bros Records is delighted to be working with Prince once again: he is one of the world's biggest stars and a truly unique talent" said Cameron Strang, Chairman & CEO, Warner Bros. Records. "We are also very excited about the release of new and re-mastered music from one of his greatest masterpieces."

.

I don't see why WBR would promise these things in a press release if they weren't part of the negotiations.

BartVanHemelen said:

Lianachan said:

Holy shit - is remaster denial actually a thing now?

.

http://prince.org/msg/7/406898

Oh my damn...thanks for that link,

That thread runs the gamut from creationism to predictions that we're all gonna be dead before remasters are released. It ends with a dialog on digital comic books....


Here's the last update that I could find on that thread from a member called databank....was there ever any further annoucement after this information was posted?

Another question. If a release date was given and it has passed can't WBR issue the remasters per the agreement and risk incurring Prince's wrath? That's what I'd do.

Pentacle said:

terrig said:

maybe just maybe Prince gives not one flying fck about record sales....he's smart enough to get paid upfront. you get an advance. make product. deliver product. move on to the next. easy peasy.

I think that the people who put up the money upfront do care about sales...

No sales, no promotion, no outtakes just to piss WB and us off... no more money upfront

Its up to them to do the promotion, its pretty easy to see when they spend on promotion, and when they don't. That's not Princes part of the deal, so when they spend on promotion we see Prince out and about or we see billboards in times square....

and to date he's getting paid, upfront, and in no danger of not continuing in this manner. Also HNR did hit a number 1 position on the rnb chart i believe, which isnt 'failing' - and whoever invested got what they paid for.

there's no failure happening here, none.

babynoz said:

Lianachan said:

babynoz said:

What denial? I asked a question FFS...

Like I told schlomo...if Prince signed an agreement to that effect then he should honor it, period.

Anyhoo, thanks for providing a link. I had not seen this blog before.

I wasn't specifically replying to you, and my post was basically just a way to use the phrase "remaster denial" for comedic effect. Sorry if you took it personally.

No worries!

BartVanHemelen said:

Lianachan said:

Holy shit - is remaster denial actually a thing now?

.

http://prince.org/msg/7/406898

that link omg... very nice...

Pretty lame it did not happened...... its an open wound to me..

terrig said:

Its up to them to do the promotion, its pretty easy to see when they spend on promotion, and when they don't. That's not Princes part of the deal, so when they spend on promotion we see Prince out and about or we see billboards in times square....

and to date he's getting paid, upfront, and in no danger of not continuing in this manner. Also HNR did hit a number 1 position on the rnb chart i believe, which isnt 'failing' - and whoever invested got what they paid for.

there's no failure happening here, none.

Let's talk in a year's time.

SoulAlive said:

Noodled24 said:

The only possible vector I can see as a sign of "desperation" on Prince's part is the fact he now seems ready to put out a PR remaster. But given so many fans aren't prepared to move on from 1984... it has to happen.

"Desperation"? No,desperation would be Prince doing a song with Jay Z.,or Prince doing a song with Beyonce.Remastering one of his classic albums (and adding bonus material)is NOT a sign of him being "desperate".That album is part of his legacy....what's the harm in celebrating it?

Yeah, working with one of the more talented rappers would be terrible.

There is no harm in celebrating Purple Rain. You own the album, you own the DVD. You can celebrate them every night of your life if you so choose.

Prince doesn't want to celebrate the album. He's happy to play some of the songs on live. I don't see what more is needed. The album doesn't sound terrible. There aren't an awful lot of A-list Purple Rain outtakes.

It's just fans have already convinced themselves that a remaster will be full access to Prince's vaults, followed by a Revolution reunion tour where everything is played exactly as it was in 1984. Not only is it's tragic, and borderline sycophantic, it's never going to happen.

For the past 10 years every time Prince has put out a new album, fans have trumpeted that they'd rather have a PR Resmaster. If, as was suggested on twitter, he has prepared the Remaster and it's in the hands of WB. It seems like a desperate attempt to appease the fans who are still looking for the purple banana, while also potentially kickstarting his career by finally re-claiming some of the Purple Rain fame.

I'll say it again....The most delusional fan site around....What a miserable fucking place...lol

murph said:

I'll say it again....The most delusional fan site around....What a miserable fucking place...lol

Easy now...... & calm down Murph.

True this place isn't HQ back in the days.....

But the one who is sounding "miserable" well that is you.. imho.... isn't it?


Of course it's ok to discuss the career, how Prince is doing, good or bad - of course we all love him and wishing him good luck.. he is a liveing legend, of course he is and always will be...

But he isn't doing exactly "great" - these years is he, and why don't some of you want to discuss that... why do some of you only want to discuss the socalled positive aspects?

Maybe he is reading and maybe he is getting some ideas, well ok maybe he is NOT reading, actually I think he doesn't care at all about his career, as long as he is paid, hmmm.

Or maybe Prince is becoming tired of the good old "treadmill" (the music industry), if thats the case I don't blame him then...

murph said:

I'll say it again....The most delusional fan site around....What a miserable fucking place...lol

Noodled24 said:

Prince doesn't want to celebrate the album. He's happy to play some of the songs on live. I don't see what more is needed. The album doesn't sound terrible. There aren't an awful lot of A-list Purple Rain outtakes.

It's just fans have already convinced themselves that a remaster will be full access to Prince's vaults, followed by a Revolution reunion tour where everything is played exactly as it was in 1984. Not only is it's tragic, and borderline sycophantic, it's never going to happen.

For the past 10 years every time Prince has put out a new album, fans have trumpeted that they'd rather have a PR Resmaster. If, as was suggested on twitter, he has prepared the Remaster and it's in the hands of WB. It seems like a desperate attempt to appease the fans who are still looking for the purple banana, while also potentially kickstarting his career by finally re-claiming some of the Purple Rain fame.

People who choose Prince's new 'music' over remasters and vault tracks probably have some purple banana in their ears.

And no I don't need a Revolution reunion, although a one-off concert would sure be nice.

We should all wear Purple Rain Bootleg Remaster T-shirts to the coming piano shows.

babynoz said:

funksterr said:

Only thing that happend in 2004 was that Prince actually toured and acted like a professional for a while anyway. It didn't take long though before he was twice sued, evicted from his home, behind on taxes... I mean sheesh! Musicology flopped, even after he forced it's purchase on ticketbuyers coming to see him play a greatest hits tour. He ended up with ZERO hits even he was omnipresent in the media like never before. WHAT HAPPENED IN 2004 BESIDES A PROFESSIONALLY PLANNED AND EXECUTED TOUR?????

Absolutely none of what you claim happened in 2004 and Prince was never evicted from his home.

Yes he was..... Google it.

funksterr said:

babynoz said:

Absolutely none of what you claim happened in 2004 and Prince was never evicted from his home.

Yes he was..... Google it.

The thing I found in 2004 was a fan suing Prince after his bodyguard allegedly roughed him up for a taking his pic at an airport. I dont see what that has to do with his career. that could be anybody with a bodyguard.

You said twice. what was the other incident? and where is the link that he was evicted?

Aerogram said:

funksterr said:

He is a popstar. He is an artist. An argument could be made about how much of a musician Prince actually is.

Easily one of the most ridiculously pretentious post written on the Org in the last few days.

Next you'll pompously debate how much of a sculptor Michelangelo really was.

Someone said 'petty bitching' as though Prince, as a musician was sooo much above that ... My point it that Prince is mostly a popstar. He is a master of rock/funk level instrumental skills which make him a badass musician from a pop music perspective, but that is not all there is in music. There are more advanced musical skills and concepts that are clearly above his head.

BTW, I KNEW when I said, some of you would crap your pants with indignation, but what I said is true. Prince can play a few instruments well, in rock and funk styles, but that does not make him MusicalJesus or anything. There is a lot he cannot do.

wonder505 said:

funksterr said:

Yes he was..... Google it.

The thing I found in 2004 was a fan suing Prince after his bodyguard allegedly roughed him up for a taking his pic at an airport. I dont see what that has to do with his career. that could be anybody with a bodyguard.

You said twice. what was the other incident? and where is the link that he was evicted?

I didn't say it happened in 2004. I said soon after. How can you forget that Prince was evicted? It was a major news story at the time?

funksterr said:

wonder505 said:

The thing I found in 2004 was a fan suing Prince after his bodyguard allegedly roughed him up for a taking his pic at an airport. I dont see what that has to do with his career. that could be anybody with a bodyguard.

You said twice. what was the other incident? and where is the link that he was evicted?

I didn't say it happened in 2004. I said soon after. How can you forget that Prince was evicted? It was a major news story at the time?

post links to back up your story. otherwise you're just creating fairytales AS USUAL. Give me a link. Thats all I'm asking and then I'm good.

wonder505 said:

funksterr said:

I didn't say it happened in 2004. I said soon after. How can you forget that Prince was evicted? It was a major news story at the time?

post links to back up your story. otherwise you're just creating fairytales AS USUAL. Give me a link. Thats all I'm asking and then I'm good.

Stop trying to make everything about you. If you are really so interested: GOOGLE it.

funksterr said:

wonder505 said:

post links to back up your story. otherwise you're just creating fairytales AS USUAL. Give me a link. Thats all I'm asking and then I'm good.

Stop trying to make everything about you. If you are really so interested: GOOGLE it.

Come on....cut the bullshit and chill with the trolling....

bonatoc said:

Aerogram said:

People always mention Dylan, Bowie and Sprinsteen.

Question: when was the last time people cared if they released a video or not, or if they charted or not?

White artists with long careers have classic rock to maintain their legendary status, black artists are easily considered retro unless they still attract a younger audience, because even after all these years, their classics are valued as examples of fun music back in the day, not treated the same as an opus from the Mighty Rock Era.

Aretha and Stevie are venerated in the same way, but only for their older records. In Jazz, things are different, but the pop world is not exactly free of old attitudes.

Before having this kinda useless and evergoing debate, we need to assert what is at stake here, what mattters the most : public recognition, or artistic legacy ?

While not releasing the best of the crop, aforementioned artists release work that sounds a bit freed from the heavy aura their past career carries, a bit liberated from the "responsability" of being Dylan, Springsteen, etc. ...

Skipper looks like he always has to state that he is Prince,
therefore you get the usual sound gimmicks,
the "signature" synth riffs, that goddamn Linn again.
We all know that he is more talented than this. TRC proves it. 3121 and AOA too.


TRC was a real hope to see the beginning of a new and exciting career as a Jazz club performer.
Most of his compositions could stand intellectual treatments, sophisticated arrangements.
OK, he does small clubs. But not with a purpose.
It feels like he still needs to show off to be happy. A real egomaniac.

The "Slowed down" LRC version that surfaced ca. Montreux is alright,
but you've got to admit that once the surprise has passed,
it just sounds like he overdoes it.
I mean this new arrangement isn't great to the point where one feels entitled
to make the crowd chant "slow down!" for 4 or 5 minutes.
It's not Jeff Buckley singing Hallelujah.
The exchange with the public would have been perfect for one minute.
When you listen to these looong ad-lib minutes again,
it's embarassing, both for Prince and the crowd.
It's just a layered synth pad over 3 basic chords,
there's no reason for Skipper to sound so affected.
It sounds like a pose.
And that's the whole problem with this self-referencing habit he's grown accustomed to.
One just cringes.


That's an ego problem, or fear of ageing,
I don't know what's wrong.
But going to The Vault, and coming back with "If I Could Get Your Attention"...
Something does not compute.
Trust me, I'm very far of being a naysayer when it comes to this song.
This one I find myself periodically humming to myself for the last 20 years, so...

What is absurd, is that a chord structure so simple (C, F, C, F, etc.) is just perfect
for the raw enthusiasm of the 3rd Eye Girl Band.
We've been waiting almost 30 years for the killer Guitar Solo
the Taja version was trying to aim.
But no, we get 2001 Daft Punk autotuned vocoder, and since Skipper
does not listen to records but his own, Josh' photocopied production idea
sounds as an innovation to his untrained ears (if Vocoder was something new, that is).
Get back to your Joni and Kate records, Skipper, you need a brainwash.

Utlimately I think, but it has been stated many times before,
that someone who based, willingly or unwillingly, most of his work on provocation,
social disruption if you will, needs friction to give his best.

That is why the WB Wars era is so interesting.
It put him in the same situation of Dirty Mind, where there was a radical urge
to be anti-establishement, be it in the songs or in the attitude
(and Skipper seldom makes a distinction).


But hey, we had yawning periods before.
There's no indication that he won't quit that self-referencing, self-quoting habit.

If he really manages to stick to the improvisation plan,
if it's not a lie and he does not have the band enter after a short acoustic medley,
if he really gets into an hour of just him and an acoustic instrument,
show after show, then I think it's going to do him good.

It's going to get him back to his roots.

It's a disservice you do to the man by praising him no matter what.
That's the problem with fame. Even if the forthcoming acoustic sets turn out to be mediocre,
You'll always have the zealots applauding like crazy,
and dumb Ol' Skipper will think he's doing great,
and as a result we'll get no invention, no risk taking.

An artist NEEDS a kick in the nuts.
Especially when he is a natural.

I think you're just a rabble-rouser. (Along with BartVanHemelen)

I'm not sure any of your rant is based in anything other than well-worn cliches and personal preference. "He always has to state he's Prince. He could have had a new and exciting career as a jazz club performer. He's an egomaniac. He has a fear of aging."

Please send me a link to your music. I'd love to hear it. What have you done for 40 years that is internationally known or recognized? You want to kick someone else in the nuts because his music doesn't meet your aristocratic standards? Please. You seem to be the one with the ego problem.

You're just another bully trying to tell people what they shouldn't like. All those words and you've only convinced me that you think too highly of your own opinion. What a blowhard!

joyinrepetition said:

tab32792 said:

Nobody is really selling records anymore let alone an almost 60 year old rockstar with 30+ years under his belt.

This!

So very true not many artist are selling records these days...and "Hit And Run" is still in the top 10 of the R&B Charts that says hes about average considering most of the others have videos and singles played daily on radio....i noticed in my local record shop not very many copie of Hit & Run was left so if he only pressed 100 thousand copies and sold the for 5 bucks hes still on top...just an example tho

[Edited 11/10/15 16:33pm]

funksterr said:

wonder505 said:

post links to back up your story. otherwise you're just creating fairytales AS USUAL. Give me a link. Thats all I'm asking and then I'm good.

Stop trying to make everything about you. If you are really so interested: GOOGLE it.

It's your responsibility to support your allegations with credible sources not somebody else's.

Every thread where you are asked to support your fabrications you fail to do so. It's pretty pathetic to be so invested in bashing someone you don't know from a can of paint that you have to make things up as you go.

bonatoc said:

Aerogram said:

People always mention Dylan, Bowie and Sprinsteen.

Question: when was the last time people cared if they released a video or not, or if they charted or not?

White artists with long careers have classic rock to maintain their legendary status, black artists are easily considered retro unless they still attract a younger audience, because even after all these years, their classics are valued as examples of fun music back in the day, not treated the same as an opus from the Mighty Rock Era.

Aretha and Stevie are venerated in the same way, but only for their older records. In Jazz, things are different, but the pop world is not exactly free of old attitudes.

Before having this kinda useless and evergoing debate, we need to assert what is at stake here, what mattters the most : public recognition, or artistic legacy ?

While not releasing the best of the crop, aforementioned artists release work that sounds a bit freed from the heavy aura their past career carries, a bit liberated from the "responsability" of being Dylan, Springsteen, etc. ...

Skipper looks like he always has to state that he is Prince,
therefore you get the usual sound gimmicks,
the "signature" synth riffs, that goddamn Linn again.
We all know that he is more talented than this. TRC proves it. 3121 and AOA too.


TRC was a real hope to see the beginning of a new and exciting career as a Jazz club performer.
Most of his compositions could stand intellectual treatments, sophisticated arrangements.
OK, he does small clubs. But not with a purpose.
It feels like he still needs to show off to be happy. A real egomaniac.

The "Slowed down" LRC version that surfaced ca. Montreux is alright,
but you've got to admit that once the surprise has passed,
it just sounds like he overdoes it.
I mean this new arrangement isn't great to the point where one feels entitled
to make the crowd chant "slow down!" for 4 or 5 minutes.
It's not Jeff Buckley singing Hallelujah.
The exchange with the public would have been perfect for one minute.
When you listen to these looong ad-lib minutes again,
it's embarassing, both for Prince and the crowd.
It's just a layered synth pad over 3 basic chords,
there's no reason for Skipper to sound so affected.
It sounds like a pose.
And that's the whole problem with this self-referencing habit he's grown accustomed to.
One just cringes.


That's an ego problem, or fear of ageing,
I don't know what's wrong.
But going to The Vault, and coming back with "If I Could Get Your Attention"...
Something does not compute.
Trust me, I'm very far of being a naysayer when it comes to this song.
This one I find myself periodically humming to myself for the last 20 years, so...

What is absurd, is that a chord structure so simple (C, F, C, F, etc.) is just perfect
for the raw enthusiasm of the 3rd Eye Girl Band.
We've been waiting almost 30 years for the killer Guitar Solo
the Taja version was trying to aim.
But no, we get 2001 Daft Punk autotuned vocoder, and since Skipper
does not listen to records but his own, Josh' photocopied production idea
sounds as an innovation to his untrained ears (if Vocoder was something new, that is).
Get back to your Joni and Kate records, Skipper, you need a brainwash.

Utlimately I think, but it has been stated many times before,
that someone who based, willingly or unwillingly, most of his work on provocation,
social disruption if you will, needs friction to give his best.

That is why the WB Wars era is so interesting.
It put him in the same situation of Dirty Mind, where there was a radical urge
to be anti-establishement, be it in the songs or in the attitude
(and Skipper seldom makes a distinction).


But hey, we had yawning periods before.
There's no indication that he won't quit that self-referencing, self-quoting habit.

If he really manages to stick to the improvisation plan,
if it's not a lie and he does not have the band enter after a short acoustic medley,
if he really gets into an hour of just him and an acoustic instrument,
show after show, then I think it's going to do him good.

It's going to get him back to his roots.

It's a disservice you do to the man by praising him no matter what.
That's the problem with fame. Even if the forthcoming acoustic sets turn out to be mediocre,
You'll always have the zealots applauding like crazy,
and dumb Ol' Skipper will think he's doing great,
and as a result we'll get no invention, no risk taking.

An artist NEEDS a kick in the nuts.
Especially when he is a natural.

Magnificent response, I get that you have exquisite taste, but I argue that the whole concept of taste is shaped by class and race and that extends to the way we view Bowie as cool and Prince has not so cool.

There are so many forces that condition this, only some of them are purely musical. If you look at the pantheon of greatest artists, those that regularly make up the top 100 albums/singles of all time, it's a largely white world. Sure, everyone acknowledges Jimi, JB, MJ, Sly, Marvin, Stevie, Otis, Aretha, Etta. etc.but history and privilege has meant that our construct of what is tasteful and important is a good 80% from people from European ancestry.

The aesthetic we built around taste means that people like David Bowie, Lou Reed, Bob Dylan, The Beatles, the Rolling Stones, the Beach Boys, Joni Mitchell, Neil Young, Willy Nelson, Johnny Cash and others have set most of the standard by which we judge tasteful artistry.

The afro-american tradition of music making for the masses was different. When Gaye tackled social issues in What's Going On, it was after years of (wonderful) but far less ambitious lyrics -- it did not negate his previous catalog but I often think about THE CONDITIONS under which this music was made.

Prince can do Tighten Up, he can do Superstition, Sex Machine, Flashlight, some Zapp and Rogers, then he can switch and sound like the Stones, Jimi, Santana... Then right next he can reference Joni and even evoke the Velvet Underground, but he still wants to make music that make you dance more than it makes you think.

And that, my friend, is the reason why Prince is under appreciated.

bonatoc said:

lezama said:

How empty does a person have to be to get so worked up over the life of a celebrity?

Worked up? Who's worked up?

— No, wrong question, sorry —

Who's a celebrity?

When people write page long posts on the org about how Prince doesn't live up to their expectations of how he should conform to their wishes, I'm pretty certain its because they're either mentally unstable, seriously worked up about something, or they're one of his ex's having a breakdown.

funksterr said:

lezama said:

bonatoc said:

Worked up? Who's worked up?

— No, wrong question, sorry —

Who's a celebrity?

When people write page long posts on the org about how Prince doesn't live up to their expectations of how he should conform to their wishes, I'm pretty certain its because they're either mentally unstable, seriously worked up about something, or they're one of his ex's having a breakdown.

Pentacle said:

terrig said:

maybe just maybe Prince gives not one flying fck about record sales....he's smart enough to get paid upfront. you get an advance. make product. deliver product. move on to the next. easy peasy.

I think that the people who put up the money upfront do care about sales...

No sales, no promotion, no outtakes just to piss WB and us off... no more money upfront

Actually TIDAL doesn't care about sales, they care about subscriptions, and in the time since the Prince deal they gained about 300,000 subs (jumping from around 700,000 to 1 million). There's no way for us to know how much of that was due directly or indirectly to Prince or the awareness and publicity for the service their partnership created, but TIDAL has trended in a positive direction regardless.